0:00

I'll oftentimes just instead of just saying, oh,

0:02

no, you're doing great. I'll try and give

0:04

them a really concrete example of how

0:06

we all feel that way. And

0:09

it always passes. And if

0:11

someone says, well, I could try this and I could

0:13

fail, I'm like, you could and you probably will some

0:15

of the time. That's part of the deal. Hey,

0:20

everyone, before we get started, we just

0:22

want to give you a heads up

0:25

about our next spring registration event for

0:27

our upcoming season of coaching groups. That's

0:29

happening tomorrow, Wednesday, February, 28th at 1

0:32

p.m. Pacific, 4 p.m. Eastern. If you

0:34

want to join us this spring, go

0:36

now to coaching rewired.com to start your

0:39

preregistration process. So join us for our

0:41

next registration event happening tomorrow, Wednesday, February

0:43

28th at 1 p.m. Pacific

0:46

for Eastern. When you join us for

0:48

our registration events, we'll be around to

0:50

answer some of your questions about our coaching

0:52

groups to help you get registered. Join

0:54

us in the spring. That all

0:56

has helped me be more comfortable

0:58

with who I am. I

1:00

realize in this group that my husband and I have 30

1:03

years had not talked about our

1:05

future or our plans. And we actually

1:07

sat down and did that. That's a

1:09

big deal. That's coaching rewired.com

1:11

to get started. More

1:13

at the break. And now on

1:15

the show. Welcome

1:22

back to another episode of

1:24

ADHD Rewired. Today's guest is

1:26

Justine Clay. Justine is

1:29

a speaker, writer, business coach

1:31

and ADHD coach for creative

1:33

entrepreneurs and freelancers. Using

1:36

her actionable, profitable by

1:38

design framework, Justine helps

1:40

established creative professionals and

1:42

business owners identify

1:45

and articulate their unique

1:47

value, position themselves to

1:49

high quality, well-paying clients and

1:51

build a fulfilling, efficient and

1:53

profitable creative business. Welcome

1:57

to the podcast, Justine. Thank you

1:59

for having me, Eric. I'm delighted to be here. So

2:02

you are a mom of a

2:05

kiddo who has ADHD, is that correct?

2:10

That's right. And you

2:12

are neurotypical yourself. I

2:14

am, and I know that makes me unusual for one

2:16

of your guests. So what

2:19

does a coach

2:21

who is neurotypical, who is a

2:23

mom, an ADHD kid,

2:26

what unique perspectives do you bring

2:29

to the table to

2:31

help those who are maybe entrepreneurs

2:34

or creatives? How

2:38

do you help people? So I've

2:40

worked with creatives for 20 plus

2:42

years, and I would say it

2:45

wasn't until I had a neurodivergent

2:47

child that I sort

2:50

of realized, oh, I've probably been working

2:52

with neurodivergent people all along and not

2:55

really known it. So when

2:58

you don't know specifically what you're

3:00

dealing with, you don't have strategies,

3:03

tools, even just ways

3:06

to kind of check yourself, right?

3:08

And say, am I assuming

3:11

anything here? And so

3:13

I would say that as a

3:15

person who supports creative people, I've

3:17

always had kind of a grab

3:19

bag of tools and I've realized

3:21

that's really necessary. I would say

3:23

that having my kid and sort

3:25

of, I'd say probably diagnosis onwards,

3:28

that really helps me realize, oh, there are

3:31

very distinct ways that people think,

3:33

there are very distinct ways that

3:35

people process, there are very

3:37

distinct ways that people take

3:40

action, and there's no one right

3:42

way and there's no wrong way. And one

3:44

of the things I realized, which is kind

3:46

of like one of the ugly truths, is

3:48

that neurotypicals often times think their way is

3:50

the right way. So

3:53

I would say that that's the sort

3:55

of unique blend that I would bring

3:57

to it is that I know. and

4:01

have a level of awareness around myself

4:03

that I didn't have before. And

4:05

as such, I can kind of partner with

4:07

the folks that I'm working with in a

4:10

much more, I suppose, aware

4:12

way. So

4:15

when you're working with me, everyone with ADHD is a

4:17

little bit different. So how do you

4:19

help entrepreneurs to

4:22

navigate what they're trying to do in their business

4:25

and how their ADHD sort of

4:27

intersects with their business? How do

4:29

you sort of identify what

4:31

those challenges are? I think

4:33

a lot of times, honestly, it's listening

4:36

and reading between the lines or hearing

4:38

between the lines, I think, because there

4:40

are a lot of folks that I

4:42

work with who definitely

4:44

identify as creatives. And

4:46

I don't know that they identify

4:49

as neurodivergent, but I'm hearing them

4:51

and I'm like, I

4:53

think this person may have ADHD. And

4:56

of course, I would never say that, but

4:59

I think a lot of it is just my own sort

5:02

of like listening for things. So for

5:04

example, there's a creative business

5:06

conference that's happening this summer in New

5:08

York City, and I spoke

5:10

to the person who's the founder of the conference.

5:13

And we jumped on a Zoom call just

5:15

like you and I did. And she started

5:18

the conversation right away with just jumping into

5:20

lots and lots of different thoughts about AI

5:22

and this and that, and nothing

5:24

to do with what we were supposed to be talking about.

5:26

And I was just listening and listening and listening. And

5:29

as we were talking, he said, well, let me check out

5:31

your website. And he goes and he checks it

5:33

out and he says, oh, you're an ADHD coach.

5:35

And he says, I wonder if I

5:37

have ADHD. I wonder if maybe

5:39

I should hire you as a coach, not just

5:41

a speaker. So, you know, so

5:45

often it's really like things that they are bringing

5:47

to the table and saying, hey, this is where

5:49

I know I struggle, or a

5:52

lot of it is me just listening for things and

5:54

saying, oh, that maybe seems like a bit

5:56

of an outlier to what they said they wanted. And

5:59

so it looks like I'm just. making a lot of mental notes

6:01

and physical

6:18

notes. So

6:20

it's a lot of it's very sort of

6:22

like listening and then asking questions. You say you

6:24

want to do this and then you also say you

6:27

want to do that. Exactly, exactly.

6:30

So how do you help people sort

6:32

of articulate what it

6:34

is that they want? You know, it's really

6:37

interesting. I think this is all of us coaches

6:40

or people that go into this industry. I think we all

6:42

bring something very sort of unique to the

6:44

partnerships and the collaborations

6:46

we have with our clients. And I think that

6:49

one of mine is an ability to kind of co-create not just

6:51

ideas, but

6:54

the articulation of those ideas with

6:56

my people in real time. So they're

6:58

talking and I'm synthesizing and a lot

7:00

of times I'm writing down the things

7:02

as well. And I'm speaking it back

7:04

to them and we kind of like

7:06

wizard it up together. So a

7:09

lot of times I'll say to a client and this again kind

7:11

of goes into that sort of bit more awareness about different

7:13

people's different processing and acting, you know,

7:15

action styles. So for example if I

7:17

know I've got someone who's a verbal processor and they're never

7:19

going to take a note in their life

7:21

and I know they're never going to go back and look at

7:23

the transcript and it's like they

7:25

don't even know where this thing lives

7:27

on their Google Drive, then I might

7:30

say to them, hey, you talk, I'll type.

7:33

And then we'll kind of go back and forth together and

7:35

then I'll literally write it and we'll craft it together and

7:37

then I'll just pop it in their folder or email

7:39

it to them or whatever it is. So

7:43

I feel like it's

7:45

just synthesizing co-creative collaborative experience.

7:47

It really depends on the person, how that

7:49

rolls out. You know,

7:51

in my coaching process, one of the things

7:54

that I always tell people in my groups

7:56

is to do that when you come into

7:59

the team. the group sometimes people have

8:01

a certain idea of what they want to

8:03

do and then as we start kind of

8:05

getting into it the layers of the onion

8:07

start peeling back and then a realization

8:09

of oh this

8:12

is actually what I need to be working on. What

8:15

would you say people come in to work with

8:17

you? What do they

8:20

think they need? And then what

8:22

is what do you find they is there

8:24

like a a you know it's a generalization

8:26

but is there like a what you find

8:28

they actually need? Yes and that's such

8:30

a great question because I'm sure that you have

8:32

this experience too with your clients. What

8:35

everyone thinks they need is they think they

8:37

need to be better at marketing, they

8:39

think they need a new website, they

8:43

think they need to get better at sales when

8:46

actually what they need is they need a

8:49

solid positioning and they

8:51

need systems and infrastructure.

8:55

They need to understand the fundamentals of

8:57

the business and how those components piece

9:00

together but for the most part

9:02

I would say it's positioning. They need to know who

9:04

they are, what they do

9:06

and why that's different, why it matters. They

9:08

need to know who their ideal clients are, what

9:11

they need and what keeps them up at

9:13

night and they need to know how do

9:15

they service them and that's everything from how

9:18

they're messaging to them but also how do

9:20

I deliver this thing? What does it look

9:22

like? What does it cost?

9:24

What's my capacity? You know all of those

9:26

things so people think they need

9:28

marketing and sales help and really what they need is

9:30

positioning help. What are the

9:32

kind of questions that you will ask someone

9:35

to help them identify? What

9:37

is that you know unique value proposition that

9:39

position? I

9:42

usually well and actually it's funny it's you

9:44

know like like most coaches I have a

9:46

process and a way of working but

9:49

it's always going to be tailored to the person so

9:51

depending on who the person is I'll either start

9:53

with who they are or who their client is.

9:55

Sometimes we need to see the person we want to

9:57

serve reflected back to us. And

10:00

sometimes we need to say, no, this is what's really important to

10:02

me. And then I'll find the people who

10:04

need that. So if we

10:06

were starting with, which is where we usually

10:09

start, which is the person themselves, one

10:11

of the big questions I will ask is, what

10:14

would you do all day for free? What

10:17

comes so easily to you that you

10:19

can't believe everybody else can't do it?

10:22

Because those two things are usually the things

10:25

that they should be charging handsomely

10:27

for, and that they practically

10:29

give away because they think it's so easy. I

10:33

mean, it's a great question and framework.

10:35

I think that for so many people,

10:38

they don't realize that when something, if other

10:41

people reflect back to

10:43

you what you're like, that what you're doing

10:46

is really, you know, extraordinary. And

10:49

if your initial reaction

10:51

to that reflection is sort

10:54

of this like deflection of like, nah, it's

10:56

not an idea, like, you're on

10:59

your gift. Like that's, that's where your

11:01

gifts are. It's like when something is

11:03

wow to others, and it's like a

11:05

no biggie, you video, like you're

11:07

in your zone of genius. Right?

11:10

And I think that's just a, an

11:13

important thing for people to recognize for

11:15

listeners to really, really think like, where

11:17

have you gotten this feedback in your

11:19

life that you've wowed people and

11:21

you think it's a no big deal? Like slow

11:23

down there. Like take a little

11:26

more stock there and see how, how can

11:28

we really accentuate what you're doing if it

11:30

is a thing that you would, you would

11:32

choose to do for free

11:34

or another framework I've heard kind of

11:36

similar to that is what do you

11:38

do when you're procrastinating? Oh,

11:40

that's a great one. Right? Because

11:43

it's like, what if that's something

11:45

that can help out you make some money? Yes.

11:48

Yes. And it's interesting that you

11:50

use the zone of genius because I use that a lot when I

11:52

talk to people. I mean, I don't know where

11:54

you got yours from, but I got it from the Gay Hendricks Big

11:56

Leap book. That's right. And I

11:58

love it because entrepreneurs, I

12:00

don't care who you are, we make things

12:02

so much more complicated than they need to

12:04

be. We're like, let me find the hardest

12:06

most complicated route where I'm gonna have to

12:09

take a thousand courses and invest tons and

12:11

tons of money where I can feel like

12:13

I have some expertise. Meanwhile, like you say,

12:15

the thing that's like falling off a log

12:17

to you is you just

12:19

have not packaged it. You have

12:21

not turned it into something that people can say,

12:23

yes, I would like that. That is a solution

12:25

to a challenge I have. How

12:29

often do you see clients just

12:31

kind of collecting different certifications and

12:34

going through the program? I'm

12:37

not ready yet. I need any of these letters after my

12:39

name or I need this other certification, then I'll be ready.

12:42

And you know, by the way, I do

12:44

that too. I think that

12:46

like imposter syndrome is something that

12:48

is so common and I

12:51

think it's one of those things that women

12:53

feel it a lot and I think that

12:55

neurodivergent folks are going to feel it a

12:57

lot because neither of those two groups

13:00

are traditionally in the top of the

13:02

heap where it's like you can just

13:04

get by with no confidence and

13:06

good looks. From

13:11

your work, what have

13:14

you seen to be sort of

13:16

unique about the ADHD entrepreneur versus

13:18

the neurotypical entrepreneur? I think

13:21

a lot of the things that make sense for

13:23

an ADHD entrepreneur kind of

13:25

run counter to the typical

13:27

advice that gets given to

13:29

entrepreneurs. I like what? So

13:31

for example, I have one client, she has a

13:34

beautiful textile design, she's an artist and

13:36

before she got her diagnosis,

13:39

she was at some kind of a fine

13:42

art class or something and she just couldn't

13:44

get started for whatever reason. And so the

13:46

teacher said to her, which I think was

13:48

kind of genius and I wish I thought

13:51

of that, she said start on three

13:53

things and she started on

13:55

three things and that got her out of the

13:57

gate. And so she knows that actually to have

13:59

a few different things going at once

14:02

is actually really good for them. Is

14:04

that a good name? Yeah,

14:06

a little bit of the extra stimulation and sort

14:08

of like that, that there's

14:10

like this performance inverse U curve

14:13

of like, if you don't have

14:15

enough pressure, it's hard to do

14:17

anything. But also if you have too much

14:19

pressure, it's also hard to do anything. So

14:21

it's like trying to find that like,

14:24

the just like that, like the Goldilocks,

14:26

right, a lot of pressure, just right

14:28

amount. And maybe for someone's

14:30

ADHD, it looks like a little bit

14:32

more than, you know, someone

14:34

who maybe thinks more linearly and has, all

14:37

right, I'm going to do this one thing.

14:39

And I know steps A to Z, like,

14:41

yes, because I don't think any ADHD entrepreneurs

14:43

ever said that. No, no, exactly.

14:46

I would say I'm a linear thinker that

14:48

speaks nonlinear thinking, you know, but, you know,

14:50

I will certainly gravitate when I choose coaches,

14:52

I will certainly gravitate to the ones that

14:54

it is linear, and it's almost like Tetris,

14:56

right. And so when I read their books,

14:58

it makes perfect sense to me, you start

15:00

with a goal, and then you chunk it

15:02

down to a project, and then you put

15:04

it in the calendar, and then you work

15:06

on the steps, and you just keep working

15:08

through the steps until you get to the

15:10

end. That works fine for me.

15:12

But I know full well, I'll

15:15

now be reading one of those books and thinking,

15:17

oh, gosh, this would never work for my clients.

15:19

Like, they'll want it to work, but

15:22

it won't. And so how

15:24

do we give enough structure so it's not

15:26

just a free for all, but have enough

15:28

flexibility and options in there? Because I think,

15:30

you know, there's also that there's a pressure

15:33

piece that you're talking about, but there's also

15:35

the novelty piece, right, which is no one

15:37

wants to do the grunt work, the messy

15:39

middle of a project, no one, I don't

15:41

care where you are on the neurotypical

15:44

and neurodivergent scale, like none of

15:46

us like the messy middle, right? But

15:48

if you've got something that's still at

15:50

that kind of sexy ideas, I'm just

15:52

riffing stage, then it may just loosen

15:54

up the actual thing that you're

15:57

trying to get done. Or maybe it'll take you in

15:59

a different direction. and that was really the

16:01

thing. So that's one thing and actually this same

16:03

client, this is kind of a funny story, but

16:05

she was having a sale for her items and

16:07

it was an in-person sale. We

16:10

got on a call for one of our sessions and maybe it was

16:12

like Thursday or something and she said, oh I'm

16:14

so terrible, I didn't do that budgeting worksheet that you

16:16

gave me and I should have been doing it this

16:18

morning and I didn't and she was really just like

16:20

beaten up on herself. And so I said, well, well

16:23

first of all don't worry about it. Second, what were

16:25

you doing this morning? And she said, well, you

16:27

know, I was taking pictures, photos of my products,

16:29

and I was coming up with an email campaign

16:31

and I was writing a newsletter because I got

16:33

the sale, I got it on Saturday

16:36

and I said, screw my budget worksheet, you

16:38

focused on the thing that you should have

16:40

been focusing. That was exactly the right thing

16:42

to do in the moment. You

16:44

can come back to it, maybe we'll do it together, maybe

16:47

we'll find another way to talk about the money

16:49

and the budgeting piece, but there's a level of

16:51

wisdom in there too if

16:53

we can trust our instincts. One

16:56

of the things that I find and

16:59

I talk about a lot in my

17:01

coaching groups is people with ADHD, we

17:03

tend to like our natural

17:05

inclination is to be a firefighter.

17:08

However, most of the stuff that we are

17:10

dealing with is not an actual fire or

17:13

if it is a fire, it's not our fire

17:15

and sometimes certain fires need to be just let

17:17

to burn, right? Yeah. People

17:19

like don't check your email

17:21

first thing in the morning because that

17:23

client emergency that their emergency or is

17:25

that your emergency? Because

17:28

the tendency, the idea of just

17:30

understanding tendencies is so important because

17:33

if we understand that we can

17:35

have a pause if we

17:37

know that our certain tendency isn't

17:39

as helpful for us versus ones that are.

17:43

For me, it used to

17:45

be that my tendency was as a

17:47

firefighter and I realized

17:49

how often I was doing this and I was not

17:51

getting to my own personal goals. And

17:53

so I kind of flipped the script and I just

17:55

like put the approach that I'm going to get it

17:58

wrong sometimes. But

18:00

I'm getting it wrong a lot right now, right?

18:02

Yeah. So by this

18:04

idea of earning the right to

18:06

work on something that is not

18:09

important, but not urgent, like

18:11

you got to do that the important but

18:13

not urgent stuff first before addressing

18:15

the fires, because so

18:17

many fires are just bright shining objects and

18:19

don't actually need our attention right now. Absolutely.

18:23

And you know, it's a bit like, you know,

18:25

if you don't run your finances, someone else will run

18:27

them for you. If you don't run your own attention,

18:29

someone else will run it for you, right? Like it's

18:31

I love that I can't remember where I heard

18:33

it was a woman on a podcast. It was a

18:36

10% happier podcast. But

18:38

she talked about focus like a flashlight and you know,

18:40

if you're walking home in the dark and you've got

18:42

your flashlight trained on the pavement in

18:44

front of you and you hear a branch

18:46

snap behind you, you're going to turn around and take

18:48

the flashlight with you. And you

18:50

know, so your attention kind of follows

18:52

where you look and I love that

18:54

idea of you can bring it back,

18:56

but it will go wherever the branch cracking,

18:59

you know, aka someone about to hit

19:01

you over the head, right is. And

19:04

so I love the idea of knowing

19:06

that your attention will wander,

19:09

our focus will wander. It will get

19:11

drawn to the thing that's kind of most

19:13

dramatic at that moment or seizing our attention.

19:16

But we get to say it's still my flashlight

19:18

and I'm still going to just put it back

19:20

on the thing as soon as I can. Hmm.

19:24

Well speaking of things that are timely and

19:26

urgent, we didn't need to take a quick

19:28

break. But when we come

19:30

back, we will continue this conversation. So

19:32

we will be right back with Justine

19:34

Clay. Support

19:40

for ADHD Rewired comes from our award-winning

19:42

intensive coaching and accountability groups. Learn more

19:44

and get your name added to our

19:46

spring interest list. So you can join

19:48

us for our upcoming registration event tomorrow,

19:51

February 28. At 1

19:53

p.m. Pacific 4 p.m. Eastern.

19:55

How? I'm going to coachingrewired.com.

20:00

one area in your life right now that

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20:43

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20:46

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21:01

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time. That's coachingrewired.com All

21:22

right, and we are back.

21:25

So, Justin, we were talking a

21:27

little bit about helping people

21:30

identify whether area of focus is

21:32

kind of thinking about prioritization

21:36

and not just following

21:38

the thing that's on fire or

21:40

the shiny object or the breaking

21:42

branch behind you. It's like what

21:45

is the pre determines, which

21:47

is hard for a lot of

21:49

us because we like to, we're responders. It's

21:51

why we see so much ADHD in emergency

21:55

response professions. Having

21:57

a goal that requires you

22:00

know, the sticking with it, right?

22:03

When there are going to be periods

22:05

when you're pursuing a big goal that

22:08

are boring or hard or you get

22:10

stuck and like, you know, getting stuck

22:12

sucks, right? It's like when you want

22:14

to be making forward motion, but you're

22:16

not sure what to do. So

22:19

how do you help people kind of navigate

22:21

that? And the goal isn't the immediate response

22:23

to something, but something that might

22:25

take months to build out or

22:27

even longer. Yeah. Well, I

22:30

think that's where, you know, longer term

22:33

coaching relationships are really

22:35

helpful, right? And my

22:39

program starts at six

22:42

months and people can finish there or

22:44

come back later or they can continue for a

22:47

little bit longer or as long as they want

22:49

to in fact, for that reason, right? Because sometimes

22:51

people start to see me kind of like a

22:53

business partner that they can outsource to by that

22:55

point. At the beginning, they came to me as

22:57

a coach to help them figure out what are

22:59

the fundamentals of my business? Who am I? Who

23:02

am I for? How do I serve them? And

23:04

once they've got that there, they realize, oh, I

23:06

can meet with her every two weeks and

23:08

we can reorient to what we're

23:11

working on. We can deal with

23:13

and address those things that are

23:15

going to come in. Like you can say, oh,

23:17

I've got three priorities for this quarter and then

23:19

an opportunity lands on your lap and it's like,

23:21

no, we actually should jump on

23:23

that. That's something that's worth seizing because

23:26

that could open up something else. So

23:28

to have someone or a group of people,

23:30

it doesn't have to only be a coach,

23:33

right? It could be, I know you do,

23:35

you know, your group programs. I know you

23:37

have the body doubling. I don't know if

23:39

you call it that, but you know. Yeah,

23:41

exactly. And so for folks who maybe

23:45

aren't in a position to invest in

23:47

coaching, there are so many options to

23:49

just build your own accountability group.

23:52

I had an accountability group from when I

23:54

first started my business and it was just

23:56

four other people or three

23:58

other people who were... also doing their own

24:00

thing. And we would meet every week or

24:03

sometimes just once a month. And we would just talk

24:05

about what do you have going on? What do you

24:07

need help with? And my first one,

24:09

in my first business in 2006, I started

24:11

it, we would meet in person at some

24:13

like funny little diner in New York City.

24:15

And one of the guys was like a

24:17

musician who also was really great with spreadsheets.

24:19

And he helped me come up with my

24:21

first like CRM in

24:24

like Excel. He just built it out

24:26

for me. So I think

24:29

that for me, the advice would always

24:31

be, be in community with

24:34

other people who are doing

24:36

what you're doing. And as

24:38

diverse as those communities can be, the

24:40

better. You don't necessarily need a bunch

24:42

of photographers because they're all going to

24:45

be kind of talking about the same

24:47

things and probably rehashing the same bad

24:49

solutions. Right? I'm

24:51

glad that you said that too. One

24:53

of the things that I've seen over the

24:55

years with my coaching and accountability program,

24:58

as we try to create these

25:00

really strong sort of accountability teams

25:03

within the groups, we

25:05

created these rubrics and tried to

25:07

figure out like, what combination of

25:09

like, sort of, it was personality

25:11

types or like a stage in

25:13

life or, and what we

25:15

found is that none of that really

25:18

matters. The most important

25:20

thing we find is that they meet together and

25:22

then they can meet at the same time. And

25:24

so when we shifted to that, we're like, we're

25:26

just going with on schedules. We

25:28

put these teams together. I'm like, I'm not sure if

25:30

this team's going to work. We have someone who's just

25:33

finishing college and this person is like just like starting

25:35

retirement and they're trying to figure out like, and what

25:37

we find is the more diversity of life that

25:40

we have within a team, the more

25:42

productive these teams tend to be. Yes,

25:44

absolutely. 1000%. Because

25:46

it also, I think for all of us, especially

25:48

if you're working on your own, which a lot

25:50

of us are, or we're working in very small

25:53

teams, you don't have that diversity

25:55

of thought and input and feedback. So

25:57

we tend to circle around. problem

26:00

in slightly varying ways.

26:03

But when you have someone come in

26:05

with a completely different experience and even

26:07

ideologies, where they live geographically, all of

26:09

these things, they're going to say something

26:12

that just kind of unlocks that stuckness

26:14

in your head and also just adds

26:16

real value. There's so much value in

26:18

a room full of people trying to

26:20

get something done. Let's

26:24

shift gears a little bit to talk about mindset. Yeah.

26:28

What do you see as some of the kind of

26:31

common sort of mindset

26:33

hurdles that show up

26:36

before entrepreneurs with ADHD? I

26:38

think a lot of it is

26:41

those very deep grooves of, I'm

26:43

a flake, I never follow through

26:46

on things, I'm so disorganized. I

26:48

think a lot of it is

26:50

really a lot of negative self-talk

26:52

about their ability to get things

26:54

down. That's something where

26:57

entrepreneurship is hard enough without

26:59

beating up on ourselves before

27:02

the day is even started. And

27:05

then the other big one, which it's

27:07

not even anything to do with folks with

27:10

ADHD, this is just across the board with

27:12

creative entrepreneurs and freelancers. They

27:14

all think they're bad at business. They

27:17

all think they're bad with money. And

27:21

they all think creativity and business

27:23

and money are just like, never

27:25

the twain shall meet. And in

27:27

both of those examples, this

27:29

was just messaging we

27:31

all received if we were in

27:34

any way that way inclined and

27:36

it wasn't really supported for the most part.

27:39

And so we've all been kind of

27:41

swimming upstream, figuring it

27:44

out, cobbling together, whatever we can

27:46

as we go along. And

27:48

so a lot of times just like the

27:51

confidence and the sort of self-assuredness that you

27:54

kind of know what you're doing, it's okay, you've got

27:56

it. That's a lot of times not

27:58

consistent with what I'm actually seeing. Which

28:00

is like, oh my god, you're doing

28:02

such amazing things. Like, look at this thing that

28:04

you've done. You know what I mean? So

28:07

let me ask you this then, when in that

28:09

kind of conversation with someone, how often

28:12

do you get then that sort of

28:14

response from the client, like, yeah,

28:16

okay, so I've done that, but I'm sure

28:18

I'm gonna screw it up to something like,

28:20

soon, like something is gonna happen. Like that

28:23

perpetual feeling, like the house of cards is

28:25

gonna fall down. Yes, yes. I

28:28

know that there's a lot of coach training

28:30

that will say you shouldn't talk about yourself,

28:32

you shouldn't share opinions. I would

28:34

say I'm definitely a cross between a coach

28:36

and a consultant in that I will share an

28:38

opinion and a thought, but I'm also a human

28:41

being. And so when someone says that to me,

28:43

I'm just like, can I have your

28:45

permission to share a quick story? And I'll

28:47

tell them, if something comes up, I don't

28:49

always have a story, but often I do, of

28:51

just when I felt like that, or when I

28:53

overcame something like that, or when a client, and

28:56

of course, I'll never use a client's name or

28:58

anything like that, but I'll oftentimes

29:00

just, instead of just saying, oh no, you're

29:02

doing great, I'll try and give them a

29:04

really concrete example of how we all

29:06

feel that way, and it always

29:09

passes. And if someone says,

29:11

well, I could try this and I could

29:13

fail, I'm like, you could, and you probably will some of

29:16

the time. That's part of the

29:18

deal. You know, we can't get to

29:20

choose certain parts of entrepreneurship

29:22

and not take the other parts.

29:25

That comes with the territory. I

29:28

think it's that sort of perpetual feeling of like,

29:30

oh, what's gonna be the next thing I screw

29:33

up, or, you know,

29:35

I've been doing online business now for, this

29:38

is my 10th year with ADHD Rewired, and

29:41

while I have a good track

29:43

record of, you know, building stuff

29:45

and growing the business, and that

29:47

sort of little voice in the back of my mind, and it

29:49

goes, all right, what are you gonna forget to do that's gonna

29:51

make this whole thing that I've built

29:53

over the last decade just crumble down, and

29:55

it's like. Overnourished. Oh, I mean,

29:58

and I noticed that, I'm just like. Wow,

30:00

like that really like it's

30:02

a sneaky one, right? It's

30:04

it's sneaky. So

30:07

it's like not so much of how do we

30:09

not have those thoughts. It's how do we just

30:11

notice the thoughts and just take it for what

30:13

it is. And it's just like the noise in

30:16

our brain and from the the

30:18

stories and the messages we've gotten growing

30:21

up that like it's almost

30:23

that idea of like with like

30:25

teachers. We tell teachers when

30:27

you have a kid with ADHD in your

30:29

classroom, don't tell them like the kid

30:31

when I've done something well, see, I knew you could

30:33

do it. Yeah, it seems very counterintuitive

30:36

because it's like, well, isn't that giving them the

30:38

positive? It's like, well, not only of ADHD, but

30:40

ADHD. We

30:42

don't always know when our brains going to be cooperating

30:44

with us. So we don't always know when we can

30:46

do it. So it's it's

30:49

really getting more specific and see what

30:51

works. I think that's a really

30:53

good point. And as you were talking, that was

30:55

what was coming up in my head. I think

30:57

there's a there's a one to kind of punch

30:59

to this. Right. Where let's say there's a like

31:02

waiting for the other shoe to drop. Like when

31:04

will I blah, blah, blah.

31:06

And that's like that sort of very

31:08

practiced story that we have about ourselves.

31:10

Right. And I say to that

31:13

and I'll reference Gay Hendricks again. I've never referenced him

31:15

so much in my life in one hour. But there

31:17

you go. She says, put a drop

31:19

of love on it. It sounds like

31:21

so kind of like hokey and like you

31:23

should embroider that on a pillow somewhere. But I

31:25

like the idea of it where it's just like,

31:27

just put a drop of love on it. Like

31:29

there's a little bit of pain there. Put a

31:31

drop of love. And then and this is like

31:33

the sort of I'm a Pisces with

31:35

a book arising. So there's a very sort of

31:37

dreamy and a very practical component to me. And

31:39

so the practical component would be would be like,

31:42

what are you actually afraid

31:44

could happen? What's the worst that could happen? Let's

31:46

say you're doing a launch for whatever and you're

31:49

just like, I'm going to screw it all up.

31:51

Well, what could actually go wrong? Let

31:54

me just write down all of these things that could go

31:56

wrong. And then a lot of times it's just like it's

31:58

the equivalent of the boogie mine under the bed. right?

32:00

Like you've listed all of the things and

32:03

then literally we could look at them and

32:05

say what's within our power to

32:08

mitigate that going

32:10

wrong? Right? So I think a lot

32:12

of times it's really just like put the drop

32:14

of love on it but that's not enough on

32:16

its own that just kind of takes the edge

32:18

off that sort of negative feeling towards ourselves and

32:21

that compassion but then just the actionable component which

32:23

is what really is the worst that

32:25

can happen? You know there's that I read a really

32:27

great article in the New York Times years ago about

32:29

the value of negative thinking. We all

32:31

get told the value of positive thinking but actually

32:34

asking what's the worst that could

32:36

happen and then saying

32:38

what would I do in that scenario? It's

32:41

very helpful. It's taking that

32:43

worry thought and actually I

32:46

think so many people just like they have that oh well

32:48

I'm afraid this is gonna happen. Okay like

32:50

keep thinking through that. Yeah. And

32:52

if that did happen what

32:55

could you do? Yeah. Could you deal with that? I'm not

32:57

saying you would like it but could you deal with it?

32:59

And yeah. For almost every scenario we're gonna be

33:01

in the answer is yes. We

33:03

could deal with it. Yes. And here's

33:06

another thing. We've all got

33:08

to this ripe old age that we are and we're

33:10

still here so that means we survived 100% of things that

33:12

happen to us.

33:15

Why when we are this age, this

33:17

experience, this resource, this supported why would

33:19

it suddenly go wrong now? Brains

33:23

are funny and they're trying to protect

33:25

us in ways that are not actually

33:27

helping us and I think that's going

33:30

back to tendencies. I have a tendency to worry about

33:32

this, that,

33:35

or the other thing. Okay. What

33:37

does my track record show though? Yes.

33:41

And that's when we said to coach ourselves.

33:43

When was a time when

33:45

everything went to hell in the handbasket

33:47

and I prevailed? When is

33:50

the time that that happened? Just our

33:52

little sort of like our lap, our

33:54

what's it called? A

33:56

victory lap. You know those things we can

33:58

coach ourselves in those moments. Do

34:01

you find that an office is more of

34:03

an entrepreneur thing or an ADHD thing? One

34:07

of the, say, what's your

34:09

superpower? For me, I

34:12

view it as being a lemonade maker.

34:14

I'm really good at taking lemons and

34:17

turning them into lemonade. Here's

34:19

a shitty thing that I didn't want to have happen

34:21

or didn't expect to have happen. Okay,

34:24

how can I actually make this thing that I was

34:27

not anticipating, that I was hoping wouldn't

34:29

happen, happen? And how can I actually shift

34:32

that and change that into something

34:34

positive? Do you find

34:36

that more so or differently

34:38

in entrepreneurs with ADHD versus

34:40

those without? If I

34:42

were to guess, which

34:45

is all I could do, I would say

34:47

probably a little bit more. Because,

34:50

as you know, folks who have

34:52

ADHD have had to figure out

34:54

workarounds their whole life. So

34:57

they are naturally much better

35:00

at getting themselves

35:02

through very, very challenging experiences where

35:04

there isn't a whole lot of

35:06

support or people are

35:08

saying things that aren't true about their potential

35:10

or their ability or their intelligence or all

35:13

of these things. So I

35:15

do think that as awful as that is

35:17

to experience, especially as a child, it

35:19

does give you a certain level of, like, I'll show you.

35:23

And a certain level of resilience where it's just like,

35:25

well, I guess I'm going to have to just figure

35:27

this out because that's

35:29

what I have to do. And the more

35:31

times, going back to what we were just talking

35:33

about, the more times we figure something difficult out,

35:36

the more evidence we have that, like,

35:39

bring it on. I don't want

35:41

to deal with the bad stuff, but if you do,

35:43

it's okay. I'll figure it out. Many

35:46

years ago, I was my

35:48

ex-wife's cousin who helped

35:50

me organize my office

35:52

at my home office.

35:56

And I had these nice little notes

35:58

from clients and different things. Random

36:00

piles and I like I don't know

36:02

what to do with this stuff. Look I don't want to get

36:04

rid of it It's nice. Like I it feels good to look

36:06

at it. So she's like well, what if we just create a

36:09

folder? That's called you are awesome Yeah, it

36:11

was just you know She was 17 years

36:13

old at the time her cousin and had this

36:16

idea and I was like that's actually

36:18

really powerful because it's I

36:21

Find for myself, you know I think so

36:23

many people say that she can relate to

36:25

this the years and years and years of

36:27

negative messaging Like it's still there. Yeah, right.

36:29

No matter how much work we've done on

36:31

ourselves It's still there So

36:34

I think having that place that we can

36:36

look at or those people who can just

36:38

ask For that like

36:40

tell me what you see that I'm doing Well,

36:42

like which is I think we're very we're taught

36:45

like you shouldn't ask questions like that to people

36:47

because that's like sounds weird

36:50

But I think that when we recognize okay The

36:53

way our lives have been folded because of

36:55

having a VHD we've had

36:57

a shit ton of make negative messaging

37:00

Yeah So if we find if we have

37:02

a little band of cheerleaders like and like

37:04

reflect back to us say hey like you're

37:07

doing this and it's Awesome and that helps you

37:10

it and don't apologize for wanting that Absolutely.

37:13

Absolutely. And you know, I think that we

37:15

that I think just as something that's just

37:17

so nice to Just as

37:19

a human being incorporate into your life Anyway, like I

37:21

text I was in a group text with some friends

37:23

of mine I've been friends of the members as I've

37:25

been in the States, which is like a thousand years

37:28

and one of them I said, what are you? You know, do you

37:30

have resolutions? What are you doing next year? And

37:33

one of them who he's in his late 50s now

37:35

and he said I'm gonna take care of health things

37:37

What's yours? And so I said what mine was and

37:39

I said well What kind of health is you gonna

37:41

take care of and that was

37:44

like an extra step? I didn't have to

37:46

ask it by the follow-up question and he

37:48

said well and he's got my eyes

37:50

checked I need to get my hearing checked and I

37:52

know that like I'm so embarrassed even say that because

37:54

you'll all say What about time because in our 30s

37:57

he'd be in the bar with his hand like cut

37:59

by his ear He's got terrible hearing. And I

38:01

said to him, it doesn't matter. Don't be embarrassed.

38:03

It's great that you're doing it. It doesn't matter

38:05

when you do it. It just matters that you

38:07

are doing it. And that was

38:09

just a moment of, it was

38:11

an opportunity that was so easy for

38:14

me to give something that would

38:16

have just relieved feelings of embarrassment

38:18

that may stop him from getting

38:21

health checks that would be valuable,

38:23

right? We

38:26

do need to take a quick break. When

38:28

we come back, I'm interested to know

38:30

if there are things that you have

38:33

seen as a pattern of

38:35

people with ADHD who

38:37

are entrepreneurs. Are there things that

38:39

you see that people put off more often

38:41

than others? And

38:44

how do we help with that kind of issue? So

38:46

let's take a quick break and then we'll get to

38:48

that after the break. We will be

38:50

right back. All

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little reminders, gentle nudges to

41:12

eat, sleep, and maybe even

41:15

socialize. Because what's life without

41:17

a little balance and chaos?

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41:38

Whether it's our coaching groups,

41:41

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41:51

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41:53

for real support. And

41:56

now, back to the show. All

42:07

right, we are back. So

42:10

in the work that I've done, I think one

42:12

of the sort of most dreaded

42:14

things that I've seen people put off for

42:16

years is their taxes.

42:20

And I've had many people in our community who

42:22

said they hadn't filed their taxes in years.

42:26

Yes. Yeah. And I think that's why

42:28

I do see this and how do you help people sort

42:30

of get themselves caught up and sort of address us and

42:33

pull their head out of the sand? I

42:35

see it a lot. So

42:38

anyone that's in this group of

42:40

people, no shame, no blame. It

42:43

just is what it is. But we

42:45

have choices, right? So

42:48

if I could back up a little bit, one

42:50

of the significant components of

42:53

my work is helping people build

42:55

profitable creative businesses. Not just businesses

42:57

that make money, but they are

42:59

profitable, which means also that you're

43:02

working within capacity, right? Lots

43:04

of things that come into that. And

43:06

so of course, we have to address money.

43:10

We have to address pricing. We have

43:12

to address capacity,

43:15

boundaries. All

43:17

of these things kind of come in with money. And

43:21

I do find that creatives and

43:24

especially those who have ADHD,

43:27

the whole money piece of it is

43:31

just like a hot button issue

43:33

for them. I

43:35

definitely had my own money journey and

43:37

money story. So I come

43:40

to the whole topic

43:43

with a lot of compassion, with a lot

43:45

of experience, with a lot of those like

43:47

human stories where I can say, I know

43:50

exactly what you mean and let's talk about that. So

43:54

a lot of times I think where I always

43:56

start with folks is let's look At

43:58

where we are. I remember when

44:00

I i heard a piece of button is

44:02

going to my own money stuff the of

44:05

years and years ago and it was a

44:07

guy who was a finance coach. knew what

44:09

with business coaches signal light touch that thing

44:11

but in the kind of million dollar eight.

44:13

She. Was on some weapon are and he

44:15

said something that just blew my mind. He

44:18

said. When. I went with my clients.

44:20

I was sets them. I don't care what

44:22

the number says I don't care if is in the

44:24

red I don't care person the black I don't care

44:26

what the number is it says nothing about you. It

44:28

says nothing about we the ball is is not the

44:31

by your character is is nothing about you potential as

44:33

as nothing nothing nothing is just a number. I'm

44:35

less interested in how can we budget all

44:38

way to you Been on a black suit?

44:40

How can we figure out what's your services

44:42

and products off that we can sell that

44:44

are going to make you the money to

44:46

each make. And some me that

44:48

was such a refreshingly new way to look

44:50

at it as I doesn't matter what the

44:52

numbers as it doesn't mean it is literally

44:54

just a number on a computer somewhat, but

44:56

it's information. And

44:58

with out the information we can't do

45:01

anything. Because. It's a boogie man under

45:03

the bed. And. That's another reason why

45:05

I think. Being. In a relationship with

45:07

a coach who has expertise, experience in

45:09

this area is so helpful because it's

45:11

so scary and triggering some look at

45:13

that says the dishes in Paris you

45:15

don Webb thing is and some of

45:18

you just need someone who's gonna be

45:20

say i'm going to be in the

45:22

same session with you. And the gonna

45:24

find these things together. And maybe

45:26

within a find some up work for

45:28

tickets you censored in fresh books or

45:30

honey book or whatever. and a big

45:32

fan of having some kind of the

45:34

system and soon once it gets you,

45:36

sit up in that system. No quick

45:38

fixes, too complicated, there are so many

45:40

easy ones that you're not gonna hate

45:42

life. And. Also. Managed

45:44

a expectations the same. Some listen for us

45:47

to get out of this whole. Is

45:49

gonna be kind of gross as can be.

45:51

something you'd have to on your nails. North

45:53

can have any fun but I'm here with

45:56

you. but once we have it all good

45:58

and setup. How.

46:01

Could you put keep? It will take you ten minutes every

46:03

she picks. For. Thinking about

46:05

their the deepest whole that maybe someone to

46:07

he works with has been in. How

46:10

how long would you say it took

46:12

to. Get out about how.

46:15

I. Don't think of some Us disability benefits

46:17

myself. Okay, And

46:21

when I was just doesn't. This is not

46:23

the other business as disciplined as business. That

46:25

was knew it was not making that much money.

46:28

Then we moved. We bought a house I had

46:30

a kid to one we've been talking about. We.

46:33

Mr. Different states. So.

46:35

I changed the business and T. There.

46:37

Was a drop in my own com. There

46:39

was a hasn't got made redundant during that

46:41

time. I'm face and ahead of sad

46:43

tax bill of maybe ten thousand also said never

46:45

had before. I had all of this. Just

46:48

know system Also I'm also an automotive iris

46:50

notices it was so awful and I had

46:52

this account and they said sir her. You.

46:56

And I need to sit or out

46:58

a plan. To. Get me back in

47:00

good standing. And it's be on a payment

47:02

plan. and he to know what to do when

47:04

all these since comments as she didn't she said okay and

47:06

a sick of seeing. And you can hates

47:08

it. For. Epidemic I notice you

47:10

send it to me that you literally

47:12

just like take a picture, email it to

47:15

me. We're gonna come up with payment plan

47:17

for everything and you just gonna have to

47:19

dig out slowly. but I had it. Was

47:22

reading all these notices and confusion. I.

47:24

Don't tell me to call the I R S.

47:27

No one wants to do that. They're actually must

47:29

must nice are gonna be there are she quite

47:31

pleasant but yet no one can actually prefer Get

47:34

support for know what to do it. So I

47:36

would say it probably took me a year. To.

47:39

Get in good standing. Was a Psych. I'm

47:41

good. And I'll tell you what

47:43

after that experience of the I will

47:46

never again. Because it

47:48

was pain. Fall. And

47:50

it's hook. One of things I will say

47:52

my money weaponizes. A moment spent worrying

47:54

about money is a moment that is it.

47:56

Stolen from yourself when you could have been

47:59

wasn't really produce. Where you could have

48:01

been delivering that you're pretty has to someone who

48:03

could really benefit from it. The new

48:05

being compensated for that brilliance. So.

48:08

Anything we can do to

48:11

not let money worries rob

48:13

us. And rub the

48:15

people that we support. It's.

48:17

Worth doing so. There's no

48:20

silver bullet. There's no you. The only way out as

48:22

soon. As I would say, you

48:24

need. Proper support You need a

48:26

professional A You need someone is going to

48:28

say. This. Is what it looks like. This is

48:30

how we're going to do it together. This is your pie

48:32

and that. So. What

48:34

was Heard: What would you recommend that

48:37

says I'm I'm A D C. Hunts

48:39

for newer is. And

48:41

the just are getting overwhelmed

48:44

by the financial pieces of

48:46

other business. What

48:49

would you say will be helpful

48:51

for them when they're seeking maybe

48:53

a financial professional cause And in

48:56

in my experience I find that

48:58

working a permit financial professionals have

49:00

opted to name is your. For.

49:03

Lack of better words? down? Yes. Yes,

49:06

Yes, I agree And. I

49:08

think now at their off whole

49:10

bunch more per we have Financial

49:13

Professionals for Creatives for sea of

49:15

people who are ready tailored to

49:17

are kind of people and I

49:20

would guarantee oh I will bet

49:22

my hat that if you someone

49:24

give Googles Financial advisor for a

49:26

D H T creative you to

49:29

find someone I bet she any

49:31

money I'd say. Looks

49:33

to someone who will meet you where you

49:35

are because money is just like anything else.

49:38

right? late eighties it is it. If you're

49:40

looking for money coats I should be no

49:42

different from if you're looking for fitness coach

49:44

Rothys or two per like that. Are you

49:46

looking for a health care provider? You're gonna

49:49

say it. Does this person understand my knees?

49:51

Do they care about who I am today,

49:53

understand what I'm doing? Were dying. and

49:56

you know i think sentence than the

49:58

and looking for an advisor we

50:00

put them in the power position. We assume

50:02

that we're lucky that they're helping us and

50:04

we just give them all our money to

50:06

do it. Whereas like, you're interviewing them. Do

50:09

they get the job or not? And

50:12

we don't tend to do that in positions that we

50:14

put people in an authority position, even though they don't really

50:16

deserve to be in the authority position. They just do stuff that you

50:18

don't know how to do. And

50:20

one of the lines that I like to use

50:22

when talking to a financial

50:25

professional, because I've been through a

50:27

few and I tell them I

50:29

need stuff explained, Sesame Street simple.

50:31

Yes. Like if you're gonna

50:33

use an acronym, define it. If you're gonna

50:36

explain a concept, tell me a story, use

50:38

a metaphor to help me understand it. Because

50:40

I need to understand it deeply, so

50:43

I'm with you on this. Otherwise, like if

50:45

I start, if you start talking

50:47

about stuff I don't get, and I

50:49

feel like you're just flying through it, all

50:51

I'm hearing is whomp, whomp, whomp. And I'm

50:53

like, okay, well I have that meeting

50:55

and I have no idea what I'm doing

50:57

next now. Yeah, yeah. And if

50:59

that's how you're feeling, it's like a sense of

51:02

maybe finding another professional. Agreed, and what

51:04

I really like about what you just said, though, is

51:06

that you know what your needs are and that you

51:08

can articulate them at the same time. And I

51:10

think to take that maybe one step further

51:12

is, is that something

51:14

you legitimately can do?

51:18

And secondly, my takeaway has to be

51:20

three actionable steps no more, no less.

51:23

If there's something I have to take, I'm gonna need a

51:25

resource and I'm gonna need to link to that resource right

51:27

in the document. I want a one page

51:29

document at the end with steps that I

51:31

can check off and that's what I need. But you

51:33

can even say like, this is what I need as

51:35

a deliverable, right? I just, you

51:37

know, this is obviously not financial stuff, but I just

51:39

worked with an SEO person and it turns out she

51:42

had ADHD and we had a good old laugh about,

51:44

you know, how she was helping me with

51:46

my SEO and I was able to actually ask her

51:48

a bunch of questions as well, but how she delivered

51:50

the roadmap, SEO is one of those very complicated things

51:52

too that like no one really wants to do. But

51:55

she literally delivered a checklist, very

51:58

short and she didn't. video where

52:00

she explained what it was. And then we had

52:02

a Google, the check list was in Google so

52:04

we could go back and forth with questions. She

52:07

told me what my support would be, what that

52:09

looked like. It was so easy

52:12

and helpful. So that's something that we

52:14

can say to them, this is what

52:16

I need. Or

52:18

is that something you can deliver? And

52:21

even that feedback from someone, like that's

52:23

great client information

52:25

for these people, right? They

52:27

could say, Oh, that's a great idea.

52:30

That will be my deliverable from now on.

52:32

We're all collaborating. You mentioned

52:34

LÜT. And I don't think we've talked about this

52:36

on the podcast at all. I think it's a

52:38

great resource for

52:41

anyone else who's doing anything on the computer or they would like

52:43

to be able to hand it off to somebody else. It's

52:46

a simple video recording tool where you

52:48

just create a screencast of what you're

52:50

doing and talk while you're doing it.

52:52

And it creates a link and done. It's

52:55

amazing. I do it all. I use

52:57

it all the time. It's great for verbal processes. It's

53:00

great. Someone can go back and watch it again and

53:02

again. I think they even do it with transcripts now.

53:05

We were talking about systems just touched on it.

53:08

But that's something we all have systems in our

53:10

life and our business, whether they're intentional or not

53:12

is something else. But one of

53:14

the things that really stops ADHD entrepreneurs

53:16

from growing is the whole standard operating

53:18

procedures. No one wants to do it,

53:21

right? No one wants to train someone.

53:23

But if it was just like, okay,

53:25

when you're doing something that you would like

53:27

someone else to be doing instead of just

53:29

doing it while you're doing it, record

53:32

a loop. I did this and I do

53:34

this and I do this and you can put the link

53:36

to where the thing lives. And you've just created a central

53:38

operating procedure. You know what

53:40

I found that's also helpful for things like when

53:42

you have to do say like failure

53:45

quarterly taxes in your business, doing

53:47

something once every quarter, it's like

53:49

having to figure it out all

53:51

over again for the first time

53:53

every quarter, right? Like if

53:55

I could ask you every week, I could I could

53:57

figure it out. If it's every quarter, it's like, oh,

54:00

am I supposed to do this? I don't even remember. It's

54:05

a pretty loom to remember how to do that. That's

54:08

such a smart idea. I think I'm going to do the

54:10

same thing. Because I've got my taxes coming up too and

54:12

it's the same thing. I'm just

54:14

like, oh, I'm going to try to buy that where that thing is.

54:16

But even a template, we create a template

54:19

for putting in all of the expenses. Why

54:22

is that just not a template? Is that something we recreate every year? I

54:26

think that's something I've been wanting to

54:28

do. One of the fun things for

54:30

me about having my

54:32

own business is that we can

54:34

figure out ways to systemize stuff

54:37

to make things easier, to make

54:40

things potentially unnecessary to even do. I

54:44

think one of the challenges is something that I

54:46

used to... I would

54:48

say I used to be really awful at and

54:50

I've gotten significantly better is

54:53

the issue of communicating to somebody else what it

54:55

is that you want to do. Because

54:58

it's like, we have the ideas in our head. But

55:01

getting those out so people can

55:03

understand what that vision is, it's

55:06

not easy. How do you do it? I

55:14

think part of it is the experience of... After

55:18

so many times of having someone create

55:20

something, I was like, how did

55:22

they think that's what I wanted and feel frustrated and

55:24

then realizing that, oh, yeah, I

55:26

actually wasn't very clear on that. So

55:28

having that experience as

55:31

being motivated by pain

55:33

avoidance. I

55:38

think one of the things that actually helped me realize

55:40

that I'm actually not that bad at creating these things

55:44

is my current executive assistant who I've had now for about

55:46

two years. I think it's

55:48

the first employee that I've had that I thought,

55:50

I guess she did a decent job with training. Because

55:54

part of it is by the previous person I had,

55:56

the training process was, sit next to me

55:59

for the first month and we'll be there.

56:01

which is like, I mean, if

56:03

you're just starting out, that can work, but that

56:05

is not an efficient way to do it. It's

56:07

not osmosis. No, no. And

56:09

when I started getting into all the things that I was doing,

56:11

and then like slowing down

56:14

and doing the loom video, and

56:16

then like using the loom video

56:18

to then create the written documentation,

56:20

to kind of go through it myself, and then I

56:22

think, oh wait, I missed a step there. Or, and

56:25

I was finding that that one, it was kind of

56:27

fun in like a weird way, because

56:29

part of it was I was finding ways to

56:31

do these things in a more efficient

56:33

manner, and to me, if

56:35

I could find areas where I'm saving

56:37

time or saving money, I like that.

56:40

There's a nice little shot of dopamine right there. That's right,

56:42

that's right. I do the same thing.

56:44

I look at something, I'm like, how can I remove three

56:47

steps? And it's almost like a game. It's like,

56:49

you start to sort of gamify the process, and

56:51

then like you remove a step, and it works

56:53

so much better, and it's so much simpler, and

56:55

you're just like. You

56:58

mentioned the shot of dopamine too. I think the other thing that

57:00

gives you a big shot of dopamine is having

57:02

this idea of something that you really

57:05

wanna do, not being sure

57:07

if you have the ability to do it, but

57:09

going for it anyways, and

57:11

being able to go, holy shit, I did

57:13

that. That's right. Right,

57:15

and I often tell people when I, if

57:18

I had a crystal ball 10 years ago

57:20

that can look, see where I'm at right now, I

57:22

would say something is wrong with this crystal ball, because

57:25

there's no way that's actually real. That's

57:27

right. And so where I

57:29

wanna go, part of me

57:31

feels like, is that even possible? It's

57:34

hard to imagine, but I also

57:36

know that I felt that before, and it

57:38

created something that I wasn't sure

57:40

was possible. Tell me, where do

57:42

you wanna go? Where

57:45

do I wanna go? I

57:47

wanna continue to grow our coaching

57:49

offerings. I wanna be a

57:51

little bit more of an advisor within the

57:54

business as we bring in more coaches, and

57:58

create more media sort of channels. of

58:00

different podcasts and TikTok and whatnot.

58:03

And I wanna do more speaking. And that's

58:05

like, I, to me, I love speaking. I

58:07

love that energy of an

58:09

audience. When you see

58:11

things connecting when, like it

58:14

all just kind of comes together. Like to

58:16

me, that is, I don't know,

58:18

that's like, that's my high. It's

58:20

exciting. It's really exciting when you

58:22

give people those ideas, those frameworks, when you see

58:25

those light bulbs kind of going on. Yeah.

58:28

So that's kind of what's next.

58:30

And like also like energy management.

58:33

I'm coming up now on a decade of

58:35

ADHD Rewired. And I haven't

58:37

had too many breaks. And I

58:39

love what I do, but

58:41

needing real like brain breaks

58:44

is a real thing. And I think that's something that I'm

58:47

probably gonna be talking a lot more about over the

58:49

next year or so on the

58:51

podcast is just is burnout. Cause

58:54

you could still like feeling burnt

58:56

out. It doesn't mean you won't still love what you do. Right?

58:59

It's just like, we need rest. And,

59:02

you know, it's sort of like the

59:04

idea of like, I'm just gonna, you

59:06

know, burn the candle on both ends. Cause

59:08

I'll sleep when I'm dead. Which is such

59:10

a toxic way to think because It totally

59:12

is. Because that vision of sleeping when you're

59:14

dead is gonna come a lot sooner if

59:16

that's the way you're living. Right? And

59:18

the actual, like when you're not dead, it's gonna be a lot

59:20

less fulfilling as well. Because it's so terrible. I

59:23

don't know if you've ever read the book, Burnout

59:25

by Amelia and Emily Nagoski. Yes,

59:28

my therapist, a couple of years ago recommended

59:30

it. And it's, we've talked about

59:32

it too, how I'd be about completing

59:34

the stress cycle and like dealing with-

59:36

Emotion needs motion. Yes. And

59:38

it's not just about like, get rid of the

59:40

stress in life. Like that's actually not how you

59:42

deal with burnout. It's like, it's dealing with the

59:44

stress. So like how you, how you process

59:47

physical stress. Right? Yeah.

59:50

I love the way they gave sort of visuals to it.

59:52

Like thinking of it like a tunnel that you must come

59:54

out of the other side of

59:56

the tunnel, right? If you stay in, then it

59:58

becomes internalized. And it, I just- I just

1:00:00

loved it so much. I think they have such a

1:00:02

unique take on burnout and voice. Yeah,

1:00:05

and my therapist even told me too, she

1:00:07

was like, it's written towards women,

1:00:10

but anyone can get anything out of it.

1:00:12

And I definitely agree with that. It is

1:00:15

very powerful. Totally. Hey,

1:00:18

Eric, when we were in the break, you asked me if there was one

1:00:20

thing we wanted to talk about. There was one thing I just thought of.

1:00:23

All right. Can I just share that? You

1:00:25

bet. One of the things that I started

1:00:27

doing maybe like four, five years ago was

1:00:29

the morning pages, like a morning journaling practice.

1:00:32

And I don't know if it's because

1:00:34

I'm British or my generation, I don't know,

1:00:37

but I always just thought journaling was just

1:00:39

ridiculous navel gazing. I was just like, who wants to

1:00:41

hear me blah, blah, blaring about my day? But

1:00:44

I tried it after reading the artist's words. I

1:00:46

was like, oh, give it a shot. And I

1:00:48

sort of religiously have done it since then. And

1:00:52

I think that that is one

1:00:54

of the most underrated, underused tools

1:00:57

for processing our emotions,

1:00:59

processing our ideas, working through

1:01:02

an idea, figuring

1:01:04

out what the next step is. It's

1:01:06

knowing do we need another resource, do

1:01:08

we not? It's such an amazing sort

1:01:10

of like mirror that's

1:01:13

internal, right? And I think we so often don't

1:01:15

tap into the wisdom that is already in us.

1:01:18

And this is a great way to do it. And

1:01:21

so that's something that like, when the new year comes

1:01:23

around, we're recording this on January 2nd, I

1:01:26

don't have any big like, oh,

1:01:28

new year, new goals, because I'm

1:01:30

constantly going through that processing,

1:01:32

mapping practice that

1:01:34

I don't feel like I've got to suddenly like

1:01:36

map everything out for the next year. It's

1:01:39

a nice little kind of like boost, I suppose.

1:01:42

But that's just something that I think also

1:01:44

is really fantastic for folks who have ADHD

1:01:47

because they can really coach themselves that way. You

1:01:50

know, I

1:01:52

hate that advice and that suggestion. Ha

1:01:55

ha ha, but? Because

1:01:57

I have a... Very

1:02:00

love hate relationship with journaling. I

1:02:03

hate doing at. Noon. Tell me

1:02:06

more Why a while? We'll.

1:02:08

See as annoying to me about it

1:02:11

is that it's really helpful when I

1:02:13

do it as. Smart

1:02:15

as he was hit by a suicide. I

1:02:17

know you're right, but birds is heavier. Yes,

1:02:20

I you know, I don't know what. I

1:02:22

see part of it is an analyst

1:02:25

know who's different kinds of writing and

1:02:27

wounded journaling for your own. Express my

1:02:29

thoughts as it is a different style

1:02:32

of writing. I'm surprised I sing a

1:02:34

just As circles. It's frightening for so

1:02:36

long that I still have some limiting

1:02:39

beliefs or mbs. My writing I as.

1:02:41

He says something really important that oh, that

1:02:43

is. I. Don't even see as

1:02:45

writing I see as a brain dump and

1:02:47

it's sister and getting all the shit this

1:02:49

in my head swirling around at night. We'll

1:02:52

know it for fucks Ladies States does a

1:02:54

lot going on in that right? So even

1:02:56

just having a paisley to lay you know.

1:02:59

Get. It all out that with

1:03:01

no structure. No judgment.

1:03:04

Know anything. Even

1:03:06

if it's only job which is to get it

1:03:08

out a ahead for ten minutes. That

1:03:10

would be worth while. But.

1:03:13

I have a suggestion because of the the settler I

1:03:15

don't want to do and I get that. Is

1:03:17

so me I connected that than sit during

1:03:20

the morning pages. I do it first thing

1:03:22

in the morning when I get up. So

1:03:24

I get up the for my children I

1:03:26

do with my morning cup of coffee. So.

1:03:28

There are two. Things. That I

1:03:31

really want. Time. Alone before

1:03:33

the insanity of the mornings, thoughts

1:03:35

with my children and coffee which

1:03:37

I want a mainline immediately as

1:03:39

good songs that because it's so

1:03:42

those two things. Are always coupled

1:03:44

if you said to me. To. After

1:03:46

lunch or peloton up don't wanna. But

1:03:48

I'd sort of attach them to two things and

1:03:50

meaningful. And you can pry that cup of coffee

1:03:52

a my mornings I met my called that. This

1:03:56

dude dude type for hundred years.

1:03:59

I. Hand right, And I have feelings

1:04:01

about that because I think that. His.

1:04:03

Handwriting it and I have one is remarkable

1:04:06

tabs now, which I like, but I just

1:04:08

buy the cheapest notebooks, but I think it's

1:04:10

handwriting. It is prohibitive. People.

1:04:12

Should absolutely tighter if that's better for

1:04:14

them. Like do whatever lambda. And join us.

1:04:16

Eat, memos, whatever right? But I

1:04:18

do think that is something so

1:04:21

the way my brain works between

1:04:23

the brain, hand connection. This

1:04:25

something that some magic that happens and that

1:04:27

that doesn't happen in other ways. So sienna

1:04:29

of my handwriting cerebral I made some ways

1:04:32

that makes well aren't you worried some on

1:04:34

would look at and I'm I'm a it's

1:04:36

and or a the most boring read ever

1:04:38

be good luck trying. To read it

1:04:40

because even so yeah, so

1:04:42

well maybe maybe old resists

1:04:44

at the idea for. Journaling

1:04:47

and light meditation is one of those

1:04:49

things I'm on again, off again on

1:04:52

our by now and I felt. Say

1:04:54

about meditation. I find a very. Hard. Can

1:04:56

it during a myself it's really hard was

1:04:58

a i use as go to herbs or

1:05:00

as a citizen groups or went to the

1:05:02

my community and i went in and koba

1:05:05

disrupt about a man on just sites the

1:05:07

things are really. Paid. Dividends.

1:05:10

Tend to have some. Was a bit of

1:05:12

a a. Little more challenging

1:05:14

than onramp. And the i

1:05:16

think if we can recognize okay as the

1:05:18

easiest thing to do right now six and

1:05:21

appears many difference. He.

1:05:23

Owns a one Be careful about. Played in

1:05:25

this with a will power or I just

1:05:27

don't just try harder than this Is Not

1:05:29

that Now it's not that. The

1:05:31

Us as he was was really

1:05:33

helpful and was process itself is

1:05:36

having the not that soon as

1:05:38

the suited to do the journaling

1:05:40

but accused for the why. The

1:05:43

white man or my is why what might this

1:05:45

help by him and he could have easy done

1:05:47

it before you experience to help been you have

1:05:49

evidence of you know it helps. Young

1:05:52

lady makes you include something

1:05:54

about. The history of. Own.

1:05:56

Intimacy for this helps you do the star on

1:05:58

the other side. Yeah, So how did

1:06:01

you a a quick and then I know I

1:06:03

need to let she does a quick. Just example

1:06:05

of that. So I was writing that that in

1:06:07

a page isn't as easy as ghosts are pretty

1:06:09

early on and I'm writing to Psychotic. A really

1:06:11

busy day I full of a welder that had

1:06:13

like a baby as well. I'm an older cat

1:06:15

and and I'm secure and I just. Bitching.

1:06:17

Basically and I'm a second as we let her have

1:06:19

been today but I'm at that time as and I will

1:06:21

try to go. That's all I guess I could be

1:06:23

the don't have a run now I could right now

1:06:25

and it was a dog outside of like six person with

1:06:28

a camera on else unless she went upstairs to my

1:06:30

sneakers on. And went for a run.

1:06:32

It was like pitch black middle of the

1:06:34

winter. Six thirty the morning. And

1:06:36

it's a vote myself into my

1:06:38

running shoes essentially. So.

1:06:41

Some. Me: it's illicit. You got this.

1:06:43

A power of suggestion is where it

1:06:45

say. You. May just do what you

1:06:47

tell yourself to do or you may not.

1:06:50

To mites right? And even if that

1:06:52

happens, like once, I'm out one hundred

1:06:54

Nevada return on investment. Your

1:06:57

website is Justine Slade

1:06:59

J S T I

1:07:01

am Eve Clay C

1:07:03

O A wide.com. A

1:07:06

few thank you. So much so they

1:07:08

are a really lovely conversation Mayor secede

1:07:10

from the most. Thank you for having

1:07:12

the I was Lovely site with you.

1:07:15

And this my idiocy friends marks

1:07:18

end of this week's episode. Big

1:07:20

thing to the scene for taking

1:07:22

the time, the south and today's

1:07:24

get in touch with and find

1:07:26

all the resources. Mers City So

1:07:29

as on the website as A

1:07:31

D H D Rewired sat for

1:07:33

more A D Three rewired like

1:07:35

an uninterrupted. Listening spirit of is

1:07:38

so an older content from

1:07:40

has episode consider becoming of

1:07:42

his rinse and she's we

1:07:44

were.com/he three or five dollars

1:07:46

a month or more needed

1:07:48

by them funny hundred on

1:07:50

finishing last episode that prosecutor

1:07:52

putting off or to sneeze

1:07:54

and company says anonymous ready

1:07:56

tap into the join in

1:07:58

and for me. body doubling

1:08:01

and co-working community at adultstudyhall.com.

1:08:03

Not sure what you want

1:08:05

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1:08:07

find it all. Our coaching

1:08:10

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1:08:17

events and more at adhdrewired.com.

1:08:19

That's adhdrewired.com. Thank you again,

1:08:21

Justine, for joining me for

1:08:23

this episode and thank you

1:08:26

for making it to the

1:08:28

end. And if you love this episode, please share it.

1:08:31

And we'll see you back here.