0:00

You can live out your MasterChef dreams when

0:03

you find a professional on Angie to tackle

0:06

your dream kitchen remodel. Connect

0:08

with skilled professionals to get all your home projects

0:10

done well. Visit angie.com. You

0:13

can do this when you Angie that. Hey

0:20

everyone, I'm Andrea Canning and we are Talking

0:22

Dateline. Today I'm here with Keith Morrison. Hey

0:24

Keith. Hi Andrea. Good

0:27

to see you. This

0:29

episode is called The Secret in Black Rock

0:31

Canyon. If you haven't seen it, it's the

0:33

episode right below this one on your list

0:35

of podcasts. So go there and listen to

0:37

it or stream it on Peacock and then come back here. Today

0:40

Keith has an extra clip that he's going to

0:42

play for us that didn't make the show from

0:44

his interview with an expert on teen violence. Plus

0:47

we're going to be joined later by

0:49

Captain John Ganske, who led the investigation

0:51

of Cassie's murder. To recap,

0:53

in September 2006, 16 year old Cassie

0:55

Jo Stoddart was found stabbed to

0:58

death at her relative's home in

1:00

Pocatello, Idaho. Detectives passed

1:03

through various possible suspects, including

1:05

Cassie's boyfriend, but they finally

1:07

landed on two of her

1:09

classmates, Tori Adamchick and Brian

1:11

Draper. These two teenage

1:14

boys were so obsessed with violence and horror

1:16

movies, they wanted to make a real life

1:18

horror movie of their own and

1:20

chose Cassie as their first victim. This

1:23

is a disturbing story, Keith. Yes,

1:26

this was truly a disturbing story

1:28

where we hear about kids

1:31

turning on each other and doing terrible

1:33

things to each other, often sometimes killing

1:35

each other for reasons nobody, no adult

1:37

can understand. It's truly bizarre. The

1:39

thing about this one is that I wonder

1:41

often is if Captain Ganske, who

1:43

we'll be talking to in a bit, had not

1:45

made the discoveries he made, had he not gone

1:47

out to the desert, had he not

1:50

managed to persuade Brian to talk, had he not

1:52

found the tape in

1:54

which the boys are talking about what their intentions are and

1:56

then what they had already done, what

1:59

these two... have managed to escape justice

2:01

after all. If Brian,

2:03

the one who confessed, had

2:06

been more like Tori, the one

2:08

who was advised to say nothing and did say nothing, would

2:11

they have been able to solve the crime? Right, and

2:13

also Cassie's boyfriend Matt, at

2:15

the very end, says, oh, by the way, these

2:18

two guys were over. If he had

2:20

not said that, as you said in the piece, I

2:23

mean, would they have ever been

2:25

led to these two guys? Hard

2:28

to know. And Matt,

2:30

of course, initially looked like the right suspect.

2:33

He was the last one known to have seen

2:35

her. He was the boyfriend. He did some things

2:37

that seemed odd to the investigators

2:40

that night, so they were going in that direction

2:43

until they heard about these other fellas. You

2:45

always feel so bad for people like Matt, when

2:49

the finger's pointing at them and they

2:51

actually didn't do it. And they're saying

2:54

that he seemed flat, he didn't have

2:56

enough emotion. I mean, he's

2:58

a teenage boy whose girlfriend was

3:00

just murdered and he was with her

3:02

right before it happened. I

3:05

don't know, how does a teenage boy

3:07

react to something like that? I

3:09

would think it would- They all do it differently, I would think. Right,

3:12

right. And why did he

3:14

wait until after his polygraph to

3:16

mention Tori and Brian? Did

3:18

it just hit him later or was

3:20

he protecting them? What was that about?

3:24

Far as we know, he was not protecting them. As

3:27

far as we know, he thought they left and

3:29

wasn't aware that they had returned. Now they did

3:31

see him the day after the murder occurred. Oh,

3:33

they did? I guess just to make sure that

3:36

either, there was some people

3:38

who wondered if maybe they intended to complete the double

3:41

kill that they talked about, or

3:43

whether they just wanted to make sure that they wouldn't be given

3:45

away. Oh, that's really creepy

3:47

that they went, it's almost like returning

3:50

to the scene of the crime

3:52

in a way, I know that's not exactly what happened,

3:54

but it kind of feels like that. And

3:58

maybe trying to find out from... like,

4:01

what do you know? What are you, you know, does

4:03

he know it was us? There could

4:05

have been some of that going on. Sure,

4:07

yeah. And poor Matt being a target

4:10

of this and just happened to leave.

4:13

Right. Which was a terrible

4:16

thing, of course, that he was a target. But there

4:18

were more, supposedly the police

4:20

say there

4:23

was a kill list that there were

4:25

other names, other people. Do

4:28

the police think that they

4:31

were going to continue? Had they gotten away with

4:33

this first one? Well, what becomes apparent when you

4:35

listen to their tape and when you see what

4:37

they did with it, is

4:40

that they committed that kill. They

4:42

were like little hyenas

4:44

afterwards, celebrating and whooping it up.

4:47

But in the course of driving from

4:50

where they parked their car to

4:52

where they ended up putting the videotape, they

4:55

must have decided, oh, oh, wait a minute, reality

4:57

began to hit them. And

5:00

they decided the thing to do was bury

5:02

the evidence and burn it if you possibly can,

5:05

because they didn't want to be caught. I can

5:07

tell you that I, and

5:09

maybe some people would think I was naive, but

5:11

I questioned him pretty thoroughly when I talked to

5:13

Brian. Again,

5:15

years after this happened, he'd already been in prison

5:18

for years and he knows

5:20

he isn't going to get out no matter what he

5:22

says, whether he apologizes or not, whether he stresses remorse

5:24

or not, he's there. And he's

5:26

accepted that and he wouldn't want anything else. He

5:29

doesn't believe he deserves to be let out of

5:31

prison. He is now fully cognizant of

5:33

what he did. He's aware of how

5:36

terrible it was and about the pain and the heartache

5:38

that he brought to other people. The

5:41

other participant in this murder was also

5:43

convicted and sent off to prison for

5:45

life. The two at the beginning

5:47

blamed each other. And Tori

5:50

still blames Brian all these years later.

5:53

We're told, but he wouldn't

5:55

talk to us. Where Brian is, his

5:57

heart's out there on his sleeve and he's saying,

6:00

I recognized the terrible thing I did.

6:02

Not that it's gonna undo it, but

6:05

at least there was that. At least there's something, you know,

6:08

and maybe all that time in prison, someone

6:11

can change and think about, you know, what

6:13

they've done. Well, and that's, I think,

6:15

why he did the interview. Whenever I

6:17

see interviews with you and defendants, I

6:20

think to myself, does that

6:22

defendant or that killer say to themselves,

6:24

how did I get here where I'm now

6:27

in a room with Keith Morrison or

6:29

on the phone with Keith Morrison talking

6:32

about this heinous crime? I

6:34

mean, it's surreal. Well,

6:38

it's very strange for me too. But

6:42

one of my fictional idols is

6:45

Inspector Meg Gray of

6:49

the Parris Police Force, the

6:51

Semeno novels. And

6:54

his motto was, you

6:57

know, judge not,

6:59

but understand. So even

7:02

as a cop, he wasn't trying to judge people for the bad things

7:04

that they had done. He was trying to figure out why the heck

7:06

they did it. Just wanted

7:08

to understand. And then he

7:10

could look at somebody in the eye as another human

7:12

being and send them off to prison, not

7:15

as a devil, but as

7:17

a human who did a bad thing. And

7:19

that's kind of how I feel when I interview people.

7:22

And that is probably the same with you, Andrea. Yeah,

7:25

that's what I was just gonna bring up is

7:27

like probably 98% of the

7:29

interviews we do with convicted killers

7:32

or denials and lies. And

7:35

then that small percent, that 2% or whatever that

7:37

says they did it, I find

7:39

a lot of times I say, why? And

7:42

often they don't know. I mean, in

7:44

this case, he did give some glimpses

7:46

of his childhood and the way he

7:49

was treated. What was refreshing in this

7:51

case is that although he did say, yes, you

7:53

know, that this

7:55

problem and that problem as he was growing up, he

7:58

wasn't trying to use it as a case. as an excuse. He talked

8:01

about what the issues were, but he said,

8:03

I did it, you know, my responsibility.

8:06

Mostly he wanted to be able to get a

8:08

message to Cassie's

8:11

family about the

8:13

extent of his remorse and how

8:15

he feels. But some people

8:17

who commit terrible acts like that, even

8:19

if they seem like they're

8:22

the most evil people on the planet, can

8:24

actually feel remorse later on, can

8:27

recognize the terrible things that they have done. And

8:30

try to do whatever they can from wherever

8:32

they are, whatever prison cell they may be living

8:34

in, to make amends. Yeah.

8:37

Okay, after the break, we'll be back

8:39

with an extra clip from Keith's interview

8:41

with psychologist, Dr. James Garibino. You

8:48

can start your day off right. You can start your day off

8:51

right when you find

8:53

a professional on Angie to get your plumbing

8:55

right first. Connect

8:57

with skilled professionals to get all your

8:59

home projects done well. Visit angie.com. You

9:01

can do this when you Angie that.

9:04

Shopify is the global commerce platform that

9:06

helps you sell at every stage of

9:09

your business. With the internet's best converting

9:11

checkout, 36% better on average

9:13

compared to other leading commerce platforms,

9:15

Shopify helps you turn browsers

9:17

into buyers. In fact, Shopify powers

9:20

10% of all e-commerce in the US. Sign

9:23

up for a $1 per month trial period

9:25

at shopify.com podcast.

9:27

Free all lowercase

9:30

shopify.com/podcast free shopify.com

9:32

slash podcast free story was so chilling and

9:42

it actually reminded me of a movie from

9:44

a while back called murder by numbers with

9:46

Sandra Bullock and Ryan Gosling. Did you see

9:48

it Keith? I

9:50

confess, I don't think I did. You should watch it.

9:53

It's about two high school

9:55

students who had an

9:57

obsession in this movie with wanting to

9:59

kill someone. and get

10:01

away with it. And so they planned this

10:03

whole thing that they would murder another teenager

10:06

at the school, they would do it together.

10:08

And it reminded me so much of

10:10

this. And if you haven't

10:13

seen the movie, I urge anyone to watch it. It's

10:15

a very good, you know,

10:17

90s crime thriller, maybe early 2000s, but it's

10:19

a good movie and it's very, very similar.

10:22

In this case, these two guys seem

10:24

to be so obsessed with their horror

10:26

movies that they

10:28

want to make one of their own, but also

10:31

they saw reality

10:33

in a different way than most people do. They

10:36

saw everything they did as being for an audience somehow.

10:38

And when do you cross that line

10:41

of that you're into horror movies

10:43

and now you're gonna make a horror movie

10:46

that's real? And you

10:48

actually have sound from

10:51

an interview you did with Dr. James

10:53

Garbarino, a psychologist who specializes in teen

10:55

violence. And this is an exclusive clip

10:57

that didn't make it into the final

10:59

episode. Let's take a listen to what

11:01

Dr. Garbarino had to say about this

11:04

teen violence. The more I

11:06

interviewed kids who committed murders,

11:09

the more I got a sense that they

11:11

do have this idea that there's an audience

11:13

out there where negative

11:15

celebrity becomes is better than no

11:17

celebrity at all. The things that

11:20

these boys were watching, you

11:23

know, the horror movie genre, which

11:25

a lot of people like

11:27

and don't have. It

11:29

doesn't inspire them to dark thoughts, but

11:32

it did them. Have you

11:34

formed any opinion about these kinds of

11:36

influences? Well, I think that

11:39

they are a social toxin. This

11:42

is sort of corrupting for everybody,

11:46

but for some individuals, it's

11:49

really dangerous because it really

11:52

distorts their fundamental connection with

11:55

reality, their moral connection with

11:57

reality, their social connection. Most

11:59

of the time, of the kids you see are never gonna murder,

12:01

but it is enough to push them over the edge.

12:05

That's really chilling what he said about negative

12:08

celebrity is better or is

12:11

good enough, you know, even if it's- And

12:14

that's pretty common now, isn't it? And that's

12:17

becoming more common all the time. It doesn't

12:19

matter if you're a jerk. When kids see

12:21

that they're political leaders and others in society

12:23

acting like jerks for the effect it has,

12:27

it wouldn't be long before they start to do the same

12:29

thing. And some of

12:31

them who are troubled and don't get the fact that

12:33

this is all just good fun, do

12:37

things. Did the doctor say anything

12:39

about signs to recognize from your kids if

12:42

you feel like they're acting weird or they're

12:44

watching too many of these movies or getting

12:46

too obsessed with them? Well,

12:50

beyond the old fashioned

12:52

advice to always be

12:54

aware of what your kids are thinking or trying to as

12:57

much as you can, but it's not

12:59

always possible. And sometimes on

13:01

those very rare occasions when one

13:03

person who has troubles for secret

13:05

reasons connects with another person who

13:07

has also troubled for those

13:09

same secret reasons, that's when something happens. Yeah, and

13:11

they're not gonna be like, hey, mom and dad,

13:15

I'm obsessed with horror movies and wanna kill someone. You

13:17

know, this is not something your child is probably gonna

13:19

share with you. Two

13:21

of the most, well, really one of the most

13:24

powerful moments, but it involves two moments, was

13:27

in the beginning when you show the

13:29

video of Cassie and

13:31

she's at her locker and she kind of

13:33

smiles and says hi or whatever. And you

13:35

don't think too much of it. You're like,

13:37

okay, well, I'm seeing her. And

13:41

then that video, when you play it again,

13:43

this time with context of

13:46

the reason that they

13:48

were taking that video, I get chills just

13:50

thinking about it. Cause I thought, oh my

13:52

gosh, that seemingly innocent

13:55

video at the beginning of the show now

13:59

represents. the beginning of

14:02

their movie and her murder, which

14:04

is just wow. That's like, that's one

14:06

of the most jaw-dropping moments I've seen

14:09

in a Dateline, to be honest with

14:11

you. And what makes it even

14:13

more disturbing is that Cassie was one

14:15

of the few people in the high school who

14:18

was nice to Brian. Not that anyone

14:20

obviously deserves to be murdered ever, but

14:23

you'd almost think they would go for someone who was mean

14:25

to them, a bully, or someone that

14:27

had made their lives miserable. Nothing to do with that. Nothing

14:30

whatever to do with that. It was a target

14:32

of opportunity. They found out where she was

14:34

going to be. She and her boyfriend were going to be

14:36

alone. They thought they would do it to her, you see.

14:39

Yeah. Now we're going to

14:41

take a quick break and then we'll be

14:43

back with a special guest, former police captain,

14:45

John Gansky. You

14:50

can start your day off right You can start your day off

14:52

right when you find

14:54

a professional on Angie to get your plumbing

14:56

right first. Connect

14:59

with skilled professionals to get all your

15:01

home projects done well. Visit angie.com. You

15:03

can do this when you Angie that.

15:06

Shopify is the global commerce platform that

15:08

helps you sell at every stage of

15:10

your business. With the internet's best converting

15:12

checkout, 36% better on average

15:15

compared to other leading commerce platforms,

15:17

Shopify helps you turn browsers

15:19

into buyers. In fact, Shopify powers

15:22

10% of all e-commerce in the US. Sign

15:24

up for a $1 per month trial period

15:27

at shopify.com at shopify.com/podcast free, podcast.

15:29

Free all lowercase

15:31

shopify.com/podcast free shopify.com

15:34

slash podcast free We're

15:39

doing something a little different today. We

15:45

have a special guest that is joining us for

15:48

Talking Dateline. And

15:51

he was in your story, Captain Gansky.

15:53

Indeed. We're in conversation. Oh,

15:55

there he is. Hello. Hey,

15:57

how are you doing? Nice to see

15:59

you. Well, well, well, what's happened to you in the

16:01

years since? Are you still doing

16:03

the same thing? No, I retired a couple

16:05

of years ago. And so

16:08

I'm just living in Sun Valley, Idaho,

16:11

and just trying to enjoy the next part of my life.

16:15

Beautiful area. Yeah, it is. All

16:18

right, John. Keith, you

16:20

want to throw out the first question? Well, I

16:22

mean, we've been, I don't know whether you've

16:24

heard our conversation. We've been yammering on at

16:26

the edges of this thing. And, you know,

16:28

from the outside, it's

16:31

sometimes a little opaque, and you can't

16:33

quite figure out why people do certain

16:35

things. And from inside the investigation, do

16:37

you think you've got a clearer

16:40

picture of what was going on there

16:42

with those two kids? Yeah, no,

16:44

I think so. I think we got to see

16:47

kind of their, you know, their past, how

16:49

they come up, and kind of maybe what

16:51

brought them to that point in their lives.

16:54

We found kind of how they

16:56

were brought up, and, you know, how they

16:58

grew up, and kind of maybe, you know,

17:01

one or the other of them, you know, was a

17:03

little more destined, you know, to do that and how,

17:06

I think to me, the whole

17:08

dynamic of their two

17:10

personalities together, really, you

17:13

know, made this happen. Who do you

17:15

believe was leading this

17:18

horrible journey that they

17:20

were on? Well, I feel like

17:22

it was Adam Chek, you know, I

17:25

feel like that he had the personality,

17:27

he kind of hatched the idea, and

17:30

Draper was, he was more of a follower,

17:32

more of a type of a pleaser, and

17:35

he has been looking, you know, for somebody to

17:37

follow a bit, and

17:41

that's what brought out, I think, his

17:43

personality. Yeah. I

17:45

think Brian was a bit infatuated with

17:47

her. Yeah. He was actually, he liked

17:50

her, but he resented the fact that

17:52

she had a boyfriend, and so

17:54

it was this kind of love-hate type

17:57

deal going on with him, and so

17:59

that was, I think part of the trigger,

18:01

you know, perhaps with helping him over

18:03

the edge to actually

18:05

go forward. Yeah. When

18:08

you began investigating this, what

18:10

was the, that break you

18:12

got that led you to the trove

18:15

of evidence out in the country? Well,

18:17

you know, eventually we came

18:19

across a stash site where they

18:21

found a videotape, you know,

18:24

I think that's what made this whole case

18:26

so interesting to other, you know,

18:28

so much attention is the fact, oh my

18:30

gosh, they actually videotaped to

18:32

a certain extent their confession

18:35

and intent to commit a crime. They

18:38

tried to burn it. They did. And

18:40

how did they mess that up? Well, it

18:44

was a juvenile, you know, you

18:46

know, mistake. Basically they had stopped by the

18:48

store to buy an accelerant, you know, to

18:50

burn it. And they bought

18:52

hydrogen peroxide instead of alcohol. And of course,

18:55

as we know, you know, actually peroxide doesn't

18:57

burn too well. And I

18:59

think to the lay person, if you were to look

19:01

at this videotape, you know, in the condition

19:03

we found it in initially, they would

19:05

have said, oh, there's no way, you know, they're going to

19:07

get it. But we fortunately had a

19:09

few people able to get the tape cleaned

19:12

up and able to view it again, which

19:14

kind of a miracle in itself. Amazing. It

19:16

was, and it was surprisingly clear actually. It was.

19:19

Yeah. What did you think, John, when you

19:21

started playing it and you're seeing what you're

19:23

seeing? When we first sat down, we

19:25

didn't know what we were going to see. We were

19:27

kind of a little bit nervous because,

19:30

you know, we didn't want to see what, you

19:32

know, we didn't want to see anyway. And

19:35

yeah, so we were kind of preparing ourselves for, you

19:38

know, maybe the actual, you know,

19:40

murder take place here. Was the murder

19:42

on it? It was not,

19:44

it was, no, it wasn't. No, it was close, you

19:47

know, it was shortly after. And

19:49

it was a video themselves

19:52

shortly before. And then the only

19:54

missing part was the actual deed

19:56

itself. Isn't the irony of this? Didn't they

19:58

want to make a horror film? they don't

20:00

actually film the horror? Right,

20:03

right. Which I

20:05

think that became perhaps a

20:08

defense later. It

20:10

didn't match up with the facts.

20:13

So Tori wasn't as cooperative and

20:15

Brian basically gave

20:18

it away, right? Yeah, I think

20:20

early on neither one of them

20:22

were very cooperative, but the one

20:24

that kind of prevailed

20:26

to be a little bit more cooperative

20:28

was Brian. And it's in

20:31

my opinion, it was because of his mother. His

20:33

mother was there. She was a

20:35

driving factor between getting

20:37

him to, as

20:39

much as she hated it, she knew that the truth

20:42

needed to come out. I had to imagine what it'd

20:44

be like for a parent, isn't it? So hard, but

20:46

absolutely she did the right thing. She

20:49

did. And I think the dynamic

20:51

between the parents reaction to Adam

20:53

Chick was just 180 degrees different.

20:57

They went out of their way to protect him perhaps.

21:00

Watching the interrogation video, I

21:02

was waiting for the mom to have

21:05

more of a reaction and she's

21:07

just sitting there. And then finally she kind of does

21:09

something with her hands or whatever. But I'm thinking if

21:12

that was me and my kids in an

21:14

interrogation room for possibly committing a murder, I

21:18

would not be able to sit still. I'd be crying,

21:20

I'd be losing my mind. Like

21:24

her reaction to me was so bizarre. Yeah,

21:26

we really had a difficult time even trying to

21:28

get them there. We

21:31

wanted a chance just to sit down with them. And

21:33

reluctantly, at the end, they

21:36

decided to come in and have a

21:38

brief conversation. And we knew that

21:40

was a big chance for us. We're

21:43

gonna get anything, we've got to get it now.

21:45

Yeah, and something that Keith brought up in the

21:47

show that I thought of

21:50

as I was thinking about this

21:52

poor girl about Cassie was the

21:54

fear that, I

21:57

mean, you imagine you're house-sitting, you're

21:59

that young. you're alone, and

22:03

even if they're just there to scare you.

22:05

And that's it, we know this went obviously

22:07

so much further. And she probably had that

22:10

initial really scared, and then, oh, I know

22:12

them. She probably had

22:14

that moment where, oh my gosh, it's them.

22:16

And then it turns into what it turned

22:18

into. I mean, oh, that poor girl.

22:21

Yeah, I think that's the thing that haunts

22:23

me to this day, is just absolute torture.

22:26

Yes. Both of them,

22:28

even when Matt, her boyfriend was there, and

22:30

there were all these noises in the basement,

22:32

the dogs were alerting. If it would've been

22:35

me, it would've been that age, I'd have

22:37

been out of there. Yeah, and the power

22:39

goes out. He should have

22:41

insisted on her leaving with him. He

22:43

tried, and I think the mother best

22:46

said it later, she could hear, because this was

22:48

a conversation, was on a hard line at

22:50

the house, and she could hear

22:53

Cassie in the background, and Matt's trying

22:56

to say, come on, you can

22:58

go with us, and she's, no, I

23:01

committed to staying here for the weekend,

23:03

and I'm gonna finish what I started.

23:05

Well, as her mom said, it's Pocatello,

23:07

what happens in Pocatello, even

23:09

if you're hearing weird noises, you still probably

23:11

think you're fine. Sure. Exactly. But

23:14

it also tells you what kind of a

23:16

girl Cassie was. Strong? All

23:18

that much worse to hear. Have you ever

23:21

had anything like this before in your career?

23:24

No, nothing, young people, killing

23:26

young people, and

23:30

it was seeing triple homicides, children

23:32

killed, but it's like, oh, but this was

23:34

a bit different. And I

23:37

think part of it was just the

23:39

horror thinking about what she

23:41

might've gone through. I think that's the

23:43

thing that keeps coming back to me.

23:46

And her poor mom having to think about what

23:48

she went through. And

23:50

just sweet people, nice people, just

23:53

nice, decent people. And it's

23:55

unfortunate, right? Yeah. When

23:58

you think about the horror movie too, you

24:00

always scream at the TV or the screen,

24:02

you know, don't run in the house or

24:04

run away, or, you know, you're always thinking, right? Like

24:07

they're running in the wrong direction. And

24:09

that feels like Cassie, like run.

24:12

You know, you had these signs. Right,

24:14

yeah, because she was so nice and

24:17

inviting, she unfortunately became,

24:19

you know, their prime victim. Yeah.

24:22

Yeah, of course. All right, well, John,

24:24

thank you. Thank you so much for this. This has

24:26

been so interesting. Somebody who actually knows what he's

24:28

talking about and a very nice person to have on the

24:30

show for us. I

24:32

appreciate seeing you guys. Yeah. Yeah,

24:35

you too. And thank you for all your

24:37

insights into this case. That

24:40

is Talking Dateline for this week. Remember, if

24:42

you have any questions for us about stories

24:44

or about Dateline, you can reach

24:46

out to us on social media at Dateline NBC.

24:50

Dateline will be off this Friday during

24:52

NBC's coverage of the Olympic trials, but we'll

24:54

have a new episode of Talking Dateline for

24:56

you next Wednesday. If that's

24:58

not soon enough, check out our new

25:00

podcast, Dateline True Crime Weekly, which drops

25:02

every Thursday. This week, we'll

25:04

be digging into the trial of Karen Reed.

25:06

She's accused of murdering her police officer boyfriend

25:09

by running him over with her car,

25:11

something she denies. The

25:13

case has gone to the jury and we'll have the

25:15

verdict for you when it happens. That's

25:17

it for Talking Dateline this week. See you

25:19

next time. You

25:21

can host the best backyard

25:24

barbecue. When

25:27

you find a professional on

25:30

Angie to make

25:32

your backyard the best around. Connect with skilled

25:34

You can host the best backyard barbecue.

25:39

You can find a professional on Angie

25:41

to make your backyard the best

25:43

around. You can also find

25:46

a professional on Angie to make

25:48

your backyard the best around. Connect with with skilled professionals to get

25:50

all your home projects done well. Inside

25:53

to outside. Repairs to

25:55

renovations. Get started on

25:57

the Angie app or visit angie.com today.

26:00

You can do this when you angie that. You can do this when

26:02

you Angie that.