0:00

This is a Triple J Podcast. Carnivore

0:02

diets, collagen, oat

0:05

milk. We get into some

0:07

of the buzziest topics with dietician Professor

0:09

Claire Collins in this week's science episode.

0:11

Hi, my name's Lucy Smith. This is

0:13

Science with Dr. Karl. Let's jump in.

0:18

Now, Dr. Karl, you and I are very lucky

0:20

this week to be joined by our mate and

0:22

friend of the show, Professor Claire Collins. For the

0:24

first time in 2024, Claire,

0:27

welcome back. Yeah, thanks. The year's really up

0:29

and racing already. I know. Oh, yeah, gosh,

0:31

we're already in February. And you have already

0:33

kind of been back to it in a

0:35

big way. What have you been working on

0:37

to kick start the year? Yeah, well, the

0:39

really exciting thing is we're looking at results

0:41

from a study we finished on metabolites

0:43

that show up in your urine

0:46

and your blood, whether you eat healthy or

0:49

unhealthy. And we've narrowed in on a

0:51

unique bunch of metabolites. And we're on

0:53

our way to working out, is

0:56

there a way we're going to be able to

0:58

predict whether you respond to

1:00

healthy eating or not? What

1:02

are metabolites? So most

1:05

people have heard about vitamins and

1:07

minerals. Well, there's a whole bunch

1:09

of bioactive chemicals that are in

1:12

food that affect your immune function.

1:14

They affect your brain. They affect your

1:17

risk of things like heart disease. And

1:20

we're muscling in on how

1:22

to identify the most potent of those. And

1:25

we're also starting to look at

1:27

genetics of those. So

1:29

whether you might have a higher

1:31

requirement for those and somebody

1:33

else has a low requirement. And

1:36

whether if you eat them, you need

1:38

more than your next door neighbor or

1:40

you need less. So it's a whole new

1:42

frontier of precision and personalized nutrition. And I'm

1:44

really excited to say that we're right there

1:46

on the edge of it. So everything we

1:49

discover is new and exciting. Wow. So you've

1:51

got the study and you're just kind of

1:53

sifting through it at this point? Finish the

1:55

first study where we brought people in the

1:57

lab and fed them healthy

1:59

food. or unhealthy food two weeks

2:01

each and then we swap them over

2:04

so we can compare how their own

2:06

bodies respond differently. Because there

2:08

are these huge differences in people

2:11

and how you respond to things. So

2:13

in my case if I go to

2:15

a restaurant and have a salty meal

2:17

which normally they have lots of salt

2:19

thrown in, I'll find myself in the

2:21

situation of drinking water and drinking and

2:23

drinking, no desire to urinate. And the

2:25

way Claire explained it, my body's really

2:27

good at hanging on to sodium and

2:30

so I'm just going to hang on to

2:32

the water to dilute it and she suggested

2:34

I measure my blood pressure the next time

2:36

I go and have a really salty meal

2:38

to see what happens. But as an example

2:40

of individual differences, 90% of

2:42

people can take codeine

2:45

and get a benefit because

2:47

they have the enzyme to turn it

2:49

into morphine. But 10% of people they

2:52

take codeine, they get nothing and

2:54

there are all of these differences in people

2:57

that Claire's work is trying

2:59

to tease out so that further down the

3:01

line will say if you've got blood pressure this

3:03

medication will be better for you than that and

3:05

one-third of people around the world have

3:07

been diagnosed with it and then

3:09

the almost that much and then

3:12

the other thing is your diet. You

3:14

know you should have more vegetables. So

3:16

we're getting the personalized medicine coming through. Wow. Yeah

3:18

it really is the way forward. So like

3:21

watch this space and I think what's exciting

3:23

is that you know in the

3:25

not too distant future these results will be able to

3:27

apply. It'll make a difference. You'll go and get your

3:29

blood test and say oh that's your

3:31

cholesterol but did you know that you're a responder so

3:34

you come to the top of the queue and we're

3:36

gonna we're gonna get you that advice because you're

3:38

gonna respond straight away whereas equally I might say you

3:41

know the bad news is you're not a

3:43

responder to diet so it's really important that

3:45

you get on to the medications to and

3:48

keep your arteries nice and clean. Wow that's

3:50

incredible. Okay well what's the space and of

3:52

course you can always check out what Claire

3:54

is up to via the conversation. Plenty of

3:56

articles there and we're gonna get into some

3:58

questions now. Let's go. Let's

4:01

do it. We've got Elijah from Aubrey who's

4:03

going to kick us off. Elijah, what's your

4:05

question? Hey guys, how you going?

4:07

Good. Great. I've just got a quick question about

4:09

the carnivore diet. Me and my friends the Rat

4:12

Packer Thinking of starting to do it and just

4:14

wanted to hear your thoughts on it. Don't

4:16

do it. That's

4:19

my thought. The main reason is like your bowels

4:21

aren't going to be very happy and that's not

4:23

going to make you happy because if

4:25

you only eat meat then you miss

4:27

out on dietary fiber and dietary

4:30

fiber it's not just that it fills you

4:32

up and it's in all the yummy foods

4:34

like all the vegetables and fruit. When the

4:36

fibers get to your colon, all

4:38

the organisms that live there, they

4:40

become happy when they see fiber. They

4:43

ferment it away. They produce chemicals

4:45

that cross into your blood and

4:47

affect your immune function. Some

4:49

of them even affect your brain and your

4:51

level of happiness. They affect how much serotonin

4:53

you make in your brain. So

4:55

if you only go carnivore you might go

4:57

yeah meat, but

5:00

it's not really good for your health and

5:02

the other side effect to be aware

5:04

of no fiber means you'll get constipated

5:06

but the other side effect is you will

5:08

then have a massively high intake of

5:11

sulfur containing amino acids and some

5:14

of those will end up in your colon and some

5:17

of the bugs in your colon are going to

5:19

be really happy because they'll be able to make

5:21

lots of hydrogen sulfide and you know what happens

5:23

to hydrogen sulfide when you produce a lot of

5:25

gas with hydrogen sulfide? You will

5:28

clear the room when you do a fart

5:30

because that's called rotten egg gas and

5:32

for the reason that your

5:35

farts don't smell like rotten egg gas. But you might

5:37

want to warn all your friends you're about to start

5:39

on the carnivore diet. A larger in the rat pack

5:41

are going to be thinking

5:43

it up. We'll be thinking

5:45

up the 40-clap, that's for sure. And there's

5:47

another factor, a true carnivore has a

5:50

really short gut and so they can eat

5:53

rotting meat and then get the nutrition out of

5:55

it and then get out the other end and

5:57

not get food poisoning. You and

5:59

I do not know. have a shortcut. We

6:01

don't have a 2 meter gut. We have

6:03

a 10 meter gut. We have evolved over

6:05

several hundred thousand years to be able to

6:07

eat meat and the vegetables and

6:09

in fact they're essential. What is

6:11

it about the carnivore diet that draws people

6:14

to it? What's the discourse around it? I

6:17

think it's that it's a lot of meat and so

6:19

if you're a meat lover that sounds really amazing

6:21

but one of the interesting things not just

6:24

for the carnivore diet but any diet where

6:26

you restrict the variety of foods you

6:28

eat, after a little while

6:30

you start to get bored and you don't just

6:33

eat 2 kilos of steak a day and

6:35

what happens then is you lose weight because

6:37

you just can't face

6:39

another meaty meal and

6:42

there's been diets like this for cabbage

6:45

soup or the apple

6:48

Israeli army diet which is two days

6:50

of only apples. So there's something about

6:52

we eat more when we have more

6:54

variety so that is another way that

6:56

the carnivore diet works. And the other

6:59

thing any diet once you start losing

7:01

weight it inhibits your appetite. So

7:03

if you're trying to lose weight as well and you drop weight

7:06

then it starts to reinforce itself. We've

7:08

got Zach in Maitland here. Dr. Zach what's

7:11

your question? Hey guys. My

7:13

question, if a different sperm

7:15

won the race would the baby look

7:17

different? I

7:20

get my advice here from a movie called About Time

7:22

where Bill Nye was

7:24

able to go into a room and concentrate and

7:26

then go back in time. Do you remember that

7:29

one? Yeah. What was it called About Time? I

7:31

think so. Yeah and so the trouble was you

7:33

can't go too far back in time because you

7:35

then alter things and

7:38

somebody goes back in time and they

7:40

do so before two people meet and

7:42

their child is different. So you

7:44

got all of these hundreds of well

7:46

I think 60 million

7:48

sperm typically and yes if a different sperm

7:51

comes up you get a different looking person.

7:53

Okay. Do you agree with that Claire? Yeah.

7:56

I don't want to go back in time.

7:58

There's too much to do. Definitely

8:01

watch that movie. Is it called About

8:03

Time? Yes, About Time. Zach, have you

8:05

seen that movie? I haven't. Okay,

8:07

there will be a bit where he goes around to

8:09

visit them and the kids are different and then suddenly

8:11

you'll get the answer to your question and really enjoy

8:13

the movie as well. We've

8:17

got Juliette from Nardwaring. Now Juliette,

8:19

what's your question? Something to do

8:21

with your son and food intolerances.

8:25

Yes, right. Hi. My son suffered

8:27

from terrible food intolerances from about

8:29

age 6 to 13 and when

8:32

he hit a certain part of his purely,

8:34

the teenage hormones kicked in and

8:36

it pretty much vanished overnight. So

8:39

my question is, what role do those

8:41

teenage hormones play in the gut and

8:43

why don't we treat these kids with

8:46

hormones? It

8:48

did change at around a certain time in

8:50

his life and the hormones are coming out

8:52

but there are so many other things going

8:54

on. Your immune system, intolerant system is

8:57

not something that is fixed. It

8:59

is dynamic. It is continually changing and it's

9:01

not just simply a case of saying, well,

9:03

it's a bit of testosterone, a bit of

9:06

estrogen, that's all you need to do. It's

9:08

more complicated. Yes. It's really

9:10

interesting about how some things change at

9:12

life stage. So in pregnancy for women

9:14

with their immune system which is the

9:17

same system you're talking about, sometimes

9:19

it can improve but in general,

9:21

women's immune system is suppressed which

9:24

is why they're more susceptible to

9:26

things like the flu. But for

9:28

some women with a condition called

9:30

rheumatoid arthritis, that switch in immune

9:32

function, it sometimes improves in pregnancy.

9:35

So there's a lot we

9:37

don't know about these hormonal

9:39

changes. And with regard

9:41

to women being pregnant, early on we

9:45

take a pap smear or cervical smear

9:47

because in some cases,

9:50

the immune system is severely depressed so

9:52

the baby can survive and if the

9:56

woman happens to have a

9:59

tiny cervical cancer growing in

10:01

a very small percentage of cases. It can

10:03

grow so fast that it's a race of

10:07

whether she will live long enough to have the

10:09

baby. So that's why it's important to have that

10:11

test of the cervix for any cancers

10:14

before you enter the pregnancy thing or

10:16

immediately as soon as you know. So

10:18

it's really very important again. Okay. Thanks

10:21

Juliette. Thank you. And we've

10:23

got Peter from Greensboro on the line. Peter,

10:25

you got a question about collagen. What's going

10:27

on? Sure do. Good morning Dr.

10:29

Carl, sounds clear. Collagen

10:32

is very popular

10:34

at the moment and just looking online

10:36

there's a lot of conflicting information about

10:40

whether it actually works, whether it's absorbed

10:42

in the body. There's different types of

10:44

collagen I believe, maybe up to 28.

10:48

And I'm just wondering if you could shed any

10:50

light perhaps on the myth, tablets

10:53

better than powders,

10:56

injectables the best,

10:58

anything at all that you've got. Yeah, I've actually

11:00

written an article on this for the conversations if

11:02

you want to Google that. And

11:05

the key thing about collagen is it's

11:07

promoted by a lot of celebrities. I

11:09

dived in and looked at the quality of all the

11:12

research and most of the trials

11:14

are actually sponsored by companies

11:16

who are making the products and

11:19

they're mostly low quality. They did

11:22

across the studies seem to

11:24

be some evidence for improvement

11:26

in like water retention and

11:28

elasticity but it's not consistent

11:30

across those studies. So

11:33

my conclusion was that better value

11:35

to the 37% of

11:37

Australians who are spending about 20 bucks

11:39

a month on cosmetics including things like

11:42

collagen supplements would be to actually ensure

11:44

you have adequate protein in your diet.

11:46

So one of the things with the

11:48

digestion of collagen, when you

11:50

eat collagen you can buy it cheaply,

11:52

gelatin is also collagen, is

11:55

that your body digests at first and then

11:57

makes collagen in your body. So there's no

11:59

evidence that eating collagen makes your

12:01

body make more collagen and

12:03

I personally I would look really carefully where

12:06

the collagen has come from because it can

12:08

be made from animal hide, it can

12:10

be made from fish scales, it can be

12:13

made from hooves. So it tends to be

12:15

made from some of the components of animal

12:17

protein, animals

12:19

that aren't used that can't be like

12:21

sold for meat. So check

12:24

where your collagen is coming from in

12:26

your supplements and you know

12:28

take a look at all of the

12:30

other things you're eating. Now Clek I've run

12:32

this past you, collagen is the one

12:34

most common protein in the body about 30% of all a protein

12:36

in your body. It's made up

12:39

of about a thousand amino acids so

12:41

you bite, you put it in your

12:43

mouth, it goes into your gut but

12:46

the biggest lump of amino acids that

12:48

can cross your gut wall is maybe

12:50

one or two amino acids. So what

12:52

they're asking us to believe is that

12:54

you take in this chemical that's got

12:56

a thousand amino acids, it can then

12:58

gets broken down into maybe 500 pairs

13:00

which then magically know they've got to

13:02

go to the wrinkle under your left

13:05

eye and then reassemble themselves over there.

13:07

Yeah but you know I

13:09

think we should give the collagen molecule a

13:11

little bit of love though because I remember

13:13

when I studied biochemistry we were asking now

13:15

mid semester and end of semesters describe the

13:17

molecular structure so I've never forgotten it and

13:20

it's actually a triple helix. Now DNA, every

13:22

cell in your body your DNA your genetic

13:24

code is only a double helix. So

13:27

collagen is a triple helix makes sense

13:29

because collagen is what gets filled up

13:31

in scars and wounds, your earlobes, your

13:33

nose, got to be stretchy but strong.

13:36

So what joins the

13:38

triple helix is these things

13:40

called a disulfide bridge leveraging

13:42

off those sulfur containing amino acids in

13:45

each strand but you know what catalyzes

13:47

you know what the cable tie of

13:49

those collagen strands vitamin C. So

13:53

that's how they figured out that vitamin

13:55

C was needed by all those sailors

13:57

back in the day because when you're...

13:59

short of vitamin C and you get

14:01

scurvy, the cable ties come undone from

14:03

the collagen so the wounds

14:06

break down, you get infected. And that's

14:08

what I mean about it isn't just

14:10

eating collagen, it's having the protein there

14:12

but then also having vegetables

14:15

and fruits rich in vitamin C to

14:17

keep your collagen, your skin,

14:19

the collagen in your skin, your nose

14:21

and ears all stuck to your body,

14:23

nice and healthy looking. So connected. Okay,

14:25

thanks Peter. We've got Jessica from Gulway here

14:27

now. Jessica, you have a kind of a

14:29

regular craving. What is it? Probably

14:33

twice a month, I just get this massive hankering

14:35

for Vegemite and I'll eat it for a couple

14:37

of days like every meal and then I completely

14:39

go off of it. And I'm wondering if I'm

14:42

seeking it for a particular vitamin,

14:44

mineral. That's

14:46

possible. You know what? I want to

14:48

go with you because I want to disclose that

14:50

I'm the Vegemite lover as well. And

14:53

so much so that my colleagues and

14:55

I, we actually did research on Vegemite

14:57

and how much salt does it contribute because

14:59

I do want to feel guilty if I'm

15:02

really eating too much salt by eating Vegemite.

15:04

Well the good news is first of all, there

15:06

is a low sodium Vegemite that you can buy

15:09

but we found that yes, while

15:11

it did contribute to sodium intake

15:13

for high consumers of Vegemite, that

15:16

it importantly contributed to B

15:18

vitamin intake. So riboflavin, niacin,

15:20

folate. And if you buy

15:22

the salt reduced, it also

15:24

has vitamin B12 which is

15:26

very important for vegans. And

15:29

so if you're craving it, I want to

15:31

think that maybe you do need a little boost

15:33

to your B vitamin intake but just make

15:35

sure you don't use any extra salt on

15:37

that day. And as

15:39

a cultural reference, in the second last episode of

15:41

The Simpsons, do you know they're still going? Yeah.

15:44

And Lisa Simpson solves a mystery

15:47

with Vegemite. How so? I've

15:50

been warned about spoilers. Oh yeah, no spoilers, that's

15:52

true. There you are. Second episode

15:54

of The Simpsons. Okay, getting a little tip

15:56

off there. We've got Aaron from Terry Hills.

15:58

Now Aaron... What's your question?

16:00

This is something that I can. Do that regularly.

16:03

A guide It is a bit of advice you

16:05

were morning doctors one x and I had had

16:07

a bit of a dispute that if you will

16:10

go down to the local supermarket and get price

16:12

Gadsden by Cooked York. Is

16:14

it okay? Once take it home you take a bit off

16:16

is like had to put it straight in the fridge when

16:18

it's hot? Or is it best to let it cool down

16:20

First put it straight the fridge. I would

16:22

put it right. What I would put it

16:24

straightened. This: the fridge. send the raisins. Had

16:26

that is that Take that the bags had

16:29

the he can dissipate says a danger zone.

16:31

Is between four degrees and

16:33

seventy degrees Four degrees. Is

16:35

he fridge seventy? Degrees is steam

16:37

Rising says is nice. same rising

16:39

from you took. chances are it's

16:41

entered the danger zone. See one

16:43

of cool it down as fast

16:45

as as he can. Ah,

16:47

the there going to have any effect on

16:50

the food? It's already in the fridge? No

16:52

no not like. Likely modern phrases

16:54

as are trying to get that

16:56

temperature back down straight away so

16:58

a possibly would if you freeze.

17:00

We stand like how on Christmas

17:02

Day in how they said it.

17:05

So easy. phrases an overstuffed

17:07

than a wide have. You

17:09

could get to dissipate more by as he got

17:11

to sit a kitchen scissors and and cut it

17:14

down the breastbone so that it opens up in

17:16

the inside cool to swell or you could get

17:18

at sharp. Knife Removal the Brits made and

17:20

put that on a plate and put

17:23

his and as his hands a hint

17:25

is have to ask is is is

17:27

put a dizzying streisand. The fridge you

17:29

will about him is like hera cracks

17:31

as a glass plate broke Someone who's

17:33

you put on the thermal insulator like

17:35

customers saying put the hunt saying that

17:37

those sites and and rejoice magazine you

17:39

will bump up the temperature little bit

17:41

but you know that mustn't yours. There

17:43

have been have a coast us to

17:45

act as a similar size is a

17:48

hot. The disease is sitting

17:50

in front of the price is not

17:52

touching the cold glass says a thing

17:54

called a hazard control. Points so ensued

17:57

gets transported you know, like from the

17:59

sack treatments? Get into the supermarket that

18:01

to ill informed to say how long it's

18:03

been in the danger zone because it can't

18:05

be more than two hours if. It goes

18:08

over two hours. Then you really are

18:10

increasing. The. Riskiness of like nasty

18:12

bugs growing so at the sunni get a

18:14

time. Is he afraid that lacey gonna have

18:16

to worry about potentially thing in the day

18:19

design would bugs can grow the what what

18:21

they do is they did the United maybe

18:23

though is really bad traffic or something happened

18:25

on the road lights or minutes in a

18:28

refrigerated truck. That's okay okay I it's once

18:30

he gets loaded on the dock. And

18:32

then until it gets into the courtroom. And

18:35

then from the current the refrigerator, shelf sizes

18:37

all hands on deck and easily visible things

18:39

had happened. Our food supply the yeah, I

18:41

don't know that that we don't know and

18:43

was refrigerated Trucks is something wrong with Shillings

18:46

Plastic coated. Hit New York. They

18:48

were for joy to trucks full of dead bodies

18:50

on Coney Island for two. Ways

18:53

is only so many good books that New

18:55

York had So many people die. From.

18:58

Covered as I couldn't process them all and

19:00

somebody is buried and in the heads of

19:02

to be used in mass graves and had

19:04

to put Americans who were get through the

19:06

worse. If you're lucky you got when you

19:09

did your put into a fridge right a

19:11

truck and the refrigerated trucks with the on

19:13

Coney Island for two years as I went

19:15

through the backlog of bodies civilized million people

19:17

live in New York and adjust his really

19:20

hard to those in the early days before

19:22

he does walk and stuff so a refrigerated

19:24

truck will work. With

19:27

Jordan here from see late Jordan, what

19:29

is your question? You got a question

19:31

about. Fasting. Or.

19:33

I doctors on long time. Have

19:36

club. And. You, I got a

19:38

question of fasting issue or the age of

19:40

forty six hours a day is actually more

19:43

beneficial than eating old I and then as

19:45

well. if you don't, eight for twenty four

19:47

hour period. Does that actually resettle the enzymes

19:49

that everything in the stomach. Farsi,

19:52

is such as it's a mixed

19:54

bag of tots of approaches send

19:56

you describe a whole bunch of

19:58

them said this intermittent saw where

20:00

you try and eat just a small amount, less than

20:02

500 calories, 2000 kilojoules

20:04

in a day. There's time restricted

20:06

feeding where you only eat in

20:08

maybe a six hour window and

20:11

fast for 16 hours a

20:13

day and then there's the

20:15

two five. You do two days

20:17

of restricted and then

20:19

five days of normal eating. But what seems

20:21

to be the thing about the fasting approaches

20:24

is that they do seem

20:27

to help with appetite regulation.

20:29

So my main advice would be not

20:32

doing all of them on the one day. So

20:34

from what you described it sounded like you're

20:36

going to do a fast and a time

20:38

restricted all on the one day. The evidence,

20:41

do they work in helping you lose weight?

20:44

It kind of shows that like namely

20:46

poison which every type

20:48

of fasting diet or just regular

20:51

reducing your total energy intake after one

20:53

to two years, they all lead to

20:55

about the same results. So it's take

20:58

the approach that works for you,

21:01

always go and get a medical checkup, find out

21:03

what your blood pressure is, what your cholesterol

21:05

is, all those invisible risk factors.

21:08

And I've written

21:10

lots about fasting diets on the

21:12

conversation actually if you want a bit more information

21:14

there. And Christy Varady was one of

21:17

the early people. I've done a podcast with her

21:19

on shirt loads of science and

21:21

read her book as well. V-A-R-A-D-Y,

21:23

Christy K-R-I-S-T-Y. I think the book

21:25

is called fasting or something like

21:28

that. We've got Will in Ballarat

21:30

here. Will, what's your question? I was

21:32

just wondering does apple cider vinegar

21:35

like what benefits it has for

21:37

your intergestion and gut

21:39

health? Yeah, apple cider vinegar

21:42

is one of those things that keeps

21:44

popping up again and again. And there's

21:46

some short term studies that suggest that

21:49

it helps with appetite regulation

21:51

and so lead to weight loss. But when

21:53

you look at the longer term results, there

21:55

Didn't seem to be any particular benefits.

21:57

I Think some of the most interesting.

22:00

The research around apple cider vinegar

22:02

relates to glycemic index. So glycemic

22:04

index of seeds is when you

22:06

ate them. How quickly does that

22:08

raise your blood sugar and particular

22:11

have type two diabetes? A high

22:13

rise and a sustained rise in

22:15

your blood sugar is not good

22:17

for you. It's not good for

22:20

your health. The when they put

22:22

apple Cider vinegar. On food. It.

22:24

Actually lowers the glycemic index.

22:26

It does glycemic index. Her

22:28

blood sugars didn't go up

22:30

as high, so I think

22:32

Social studies. Give some indication

22:35

as to why like the Mediterranean.

22:37

Dot be particularly good see health

22:39

because typically the salad will has

22:41

vinegar have some taught to. There's

22:43

nothing extra special about apple cider

22:45

Vinegar, just that a lot of

22:47

studies have done that. But the

22:49

other thing about apple cider vinegar?

22:51

as they talk about this unique

22:53

combination of the protein strands and

22:55

a particular bugs that cried during

22:57

the sanitation and they call that

22:59

like the mother of the vinegar.

23:01

That's what a lot of these

23:03

health properties are attributed to, so

23:05

I think it's something that. If

23:07

you wanna try to see save it was

23:10

the you bugs in our issue. Not into.

23:12

using. A lot of vinegar. Then you can

23:14

get the same benefits in other ways and. Is

23:17

it episode of any go? Relatively cheap.

23:19

Yeah. Yeah, it's of a relatively cheap

23:21

think basically a take at Apple's at

23:24

a Bit of Sugar. And.

23:26

Adult, start submitting a way you'll see

23:28

it happening, bubbling on, you know, and

23:30

the kitchen bench. But there was a

23:32

recent caution about a D I Y

23:35

cementing as home. And the risk

23:37

of like growing the wrong bugs and thing so

23:39

you might want to go and. Find.

23:41

A youtube channel with somebody takes you

23:43

through His first of all sterilized the

23:45

jobs that even a d fermentation in

23:47

and bet that's it I made about

23:49

making so you don't introduce. The. Wrong

23:52

parts of bugs into the mix. couldn't

23:54

see it. The same thing for anyone.

23:56

Same making like a sourdough starter or

23:58

something like that. Well

24:00

with bread you then end up cooking

24:02

is all i can say he then

24:04

like kill. Any of those bugs? Yeah,

24:06

so it's. More of an issue

24:08

around anything. That you will

24:10

financing yourself. So I'd encourage

24:13

people to do all of

24:15

their homework, make sure they've

24:17

followed somebody he's hydrant unconscious

24:19

or go and buy a

24:21

proprietary.a kid. And against all

24:23

odds Instructions usually they start with had

24:25

a claim to Sterilise the Jaws Yeah,

24:27

yes. Straight off the bat we've gotten

24:29

that in nom here. Man is got

24:31

a question about dairy elegies. They're

24:33

good morning doctors and Professor

24:35

More was has course of

24:37

the intolerance or think it's

24:39

quite an allergy to dairy

24:41

Now Sources like Sources also

24:44

does area that one on

24:46

one. Summaries: if I. Asked.

24:49

What? Are the chances of that very

24:51

been passed on to my was

24:53

that he the ah boy as

24:56

orally saliva or even through same

24:58

and is that something that's a

25:00

possibility that seeking than react to

25:02

that. Mansour yeah you cut out there

25:04

for maybe to said that if he consumes

25:06

that products have had that potentially be passed

25:08

on. Yeah said the risk is actually oral.

25:11

So. If she has in an athletic

25:13

reaction and you've just had a milkshake, Chances.

25:16

Are and then you can't give Big

25:18

Kiss chances. I you could cause and

25:20

undeflected reaction to have been cases of

25:22

that for peanut allergy amongst teenagers not

25:25

realizing that you know your partner and

25:27

loved peanut butter and you you have

25:29

pin other anaphylaxis said just not eating

25:31

it in their presence isn't enough. He

25:33

would actually have to come clean your

25:35

teeth. I don't

25:38

know about the same and one but

25:40

I cannot imagine that dairy protein is

25:42

actually reappearing in seminal fluid so I

25:44

think is Sys there. But definitely

25:46

being passed or really it is

25:49

a risk. Wow we the chains

25:51

assessed on he'd same what's your

25:53

question. hello my question is

25:55

so why is that when

25:57

you have warm carbonated water

26:00

that the gas itself

26:02

is a lot hotter in

26:05

your mouth than what the water is. Wow,

26:08

there's a receptor in your mouth called, I'm

26:11

just going to look it

26:13

up here, T-R-V-P and

26:15

on one hand it picks

26:18

up heat so if you have the

26:20

energy of heat in hot tea on

26:22

your tongue it fires and

26:24

if you have the chilli ingredient capsaicin

26:27

if you have that it will also

26:29

fire but it's not just in your

26:31

tongue it's through your whole body. I'm

26:34

kind of running out of ideas here. Help

26:37

me, rescue me. I think it has

26:39

to be stimulating those heat receptors like Dr. Carl

26:41

was just telling you about but the other interesting

26:43

thing I mean I've heard of it tasting

26:46

like sour because there's cross-reactivity

26:48

between the carbonized bubbles and

26:50

stimulating your sour receptors but

26:53

so that would make sense

26:55

that it could also be

26:57

stimulating your heat receptors as

26:59

well. Because it always surprises me every

27:02

single time it happens like when I take

27:04

a sip of carbonate water which is not

27:07

quite cold like I've put it in the fridge but I'd take

27:09

it out like half an hour later, it hasn't really had time

27:11

to get cold but it always

27:13

sort of shocks me because the

27:15

water itself is a

27:17

little bit cool but then the

27:19

gas itself is just really hot and

27:22

that's a really really strange it's

27:24

got to be this cross over reactivity but the

27:26

other thing we know is that people

27:28

do have different amounts of like taste

27:30

buds and receptors in in their mouth

27:33

so this is clearly something that you

27:35

have more of in that particular location

27:37

so you know you're going to be

27:39

always the one saying can you just

27:41

get me some ice there's something wrong

27:43

here it's hot. I

27:45

did go looking on Google Scholar

27:48

saying CO2 bubbles feel

27:50

hot and there's several thousand references

27:52

we don't have the time but James go to Google

27:54

Scholar if you've got a few hours and we'll try

27:56

and do it ourselves if we have the time. That

27:58

might be a good one. we'll do some

28:00

research on that and get back to you. Yeah

28:02

get back to you. We've got Cameron in Sunbury

28:05

here. Cameron what do you want to know? So

28:07

a bit of a general question. I was

28:11

putting my son to sleep the other night and

28:14

I've realised that when I'm sitting there laying,

28:16

looking at my chest going

28:18

up and down that sometimes my chest

28:20

or my tummy will alternate going up

28:23

and down. Is

28:25

this sort of like a normal thing or

28:27

yeah I just wanted

28:29

to know if I'm sort of normal or a

28:31

bit out there. Not only are

28:33

you normal, you have reached an enlightened

28:35

state of enlightenment because you are now

28:37

doing diaphragm breathing like they

28:40

try to get you to do in

28:42

yoga. So just if you ask

28:44

any kid yeah under the age of 10 or something how

28:46

do you breathe they go with my lungs and you say do

28:48

it for me and they'll sort of lift

28:50

up their shoulders and expand their

28:52

rib cage and they think that

28:55

you get most of the air in there

28:57

of your lungs by expanding your rib

28:59

cage and you do get some.

29:01

But most of it 80% comes

29:03

from the diaphragm muscle. It's a

29:05

curved muscle it runs from

29:07

the front of your ribs to the back of your

29:09

ribs. Higher at the front lower

29:12

at the back and curved and

29:14

when you contract your diaphragm muscle

29:17

it goes straight and directly above it

29:19

are the lungs so the lungs get pulled down and

29:22

so your rib cage doesn't change at all.

29:24

So this is a so-called yogic

29:27

diaphragmatic breathing and that's about 80% of

29:29

your breathing. So by putting your son

29:32

to sleep you have achieved enlightenment. Wow

29:35

okay so I'm a bit of a yoga expert too.

29:37

Oh really yeah we'll send you the cardboard certificate in

29:39

the mail. It also means Cameron that you

29:41

could be pretty good at playing wind instruments because

29:43

when I play the flute you

29:45

have to breathe with your diaphragm and you

29:48

do an exercise where you put your hand

29:50

on your tummy and then the further it

29:52

went out the more air supply you had

29:54

and then when you tense those muscles it

29:56

means the tone in your instrument is

29:58

a lot better it's less shallow. What Does he

30:00

believe? He raises your lungs. you don't

30:03

have enough to take you through however many

30:05

bars you need to do see and needs

30:07

a breed with the diaphragm. Hold on to

30:09

it and then settled yes maybe supply the

30:11

Pluto the such to find camera. Here well

30:13

done and also the sorts of be

30:15

the mechanism behind getting winded are you

30:17

running along or he was bits of

30:20

his old and my dog when front

30:22

of me and phil from the ground

30:24

and i just could not breathe for

30:26

about twenty or thirty seconds of organ

30:29

a dos and what happens is it

30:31

a little signal good since with from

30:33

them falling down the years since through

30:35

the door from and rudolph him goes

30:38

into a spasm. And.

30:40

Then use words, hurt and comes back

30:42

you don't often getting winded. the really

30:44

do that again and yeah, Cause.

30:49

I been seen in my say it's

30:51

popped up recently the Wellness Galleys The

30:53

telling me that I shouldn't be drinking

30:55

out milk in my coffee. What's the

30:58

deal? Ah, do you

31:00

really like I've milked safely? Say I

31:02

love you. Go for it then because

31:04

the amount of I'd milk. Honestly, that

31:06

it haven't coffee wouldn't be that much, but. If

31:09

you think about roll dice cooked with

31:12

water that it tastes. Very slight delay

31:14

or as if you sit via a. Milk.

31:16

It probably does taste sweet, so turn

31:18

on it around the ingredient label of

31:21

the cotton and see where that sweetness

31:23

is coming from. It might be added

31:25

like white table sugar, it'll say. so.

31:30

If. We were in America. did say high

31:32

fructose corn syrup solids that's the main

31:34

sweetener. they might be some most toes

31:36

which is a less sweet tart has

31:38

carbohydrates maybe to give it more of

31:40

a mouthful of creaminess Been to get

31:42

it to be palatable enough is likely

31:44

to have a lot of added sugars

31:46

on case as long as you not

31:49

drinking at by the carton. Fallen.

31:51

yeah yeah having one coffee a day or night

31:53

milk it's neither here nor there you know it's

31:55

not like you'll be in a banished from the

31:58

kings and soda say they cause you drinking

32:00

oat milk, but if you really

32:02

love it, then go for it.

32:04

But it's not especially special either.

32:08

It's so interesting, because I see

32:10

these conversations happening and even saying

32:12

that potentially almond milk is better,

32:14

but environmentally, they use so much

32:16

water to make

32:18

almond milk. Yeah, that's right. Oat milk environmentally is

32:21

kind of the best option as far as production.

32:23

Yeah, or even like regular

32:26

milk gets squirted out of cows. And

32:28

that's relatively low production, especially now we

32:31

have all these happy farms where the

32:33

cows go and milk themselves, compared

32:35

to all of the processing and

32:37

packaging to get from an almond,

32:39

which tastes really nice, into a

32:41

milky tasting product. So

32:44

I think if you want to think

32:46

big picture about the environment, a little bit of old-fashioned

32:48

milk can be just as

32:50

good, well, actually better. And what were you

32:52

saying to me, what has your mind got

32:54

wrong, that you've got to make sure you

32:56

get enough calcium, atoms, enough calcium atoms in

32:58

your body by your early 20s? By

33:01

your mid 20s. And that's the maximum you can ever have. And

33:03

all you can do is either stay at that level or go

33:05

down. Can you just let me stress? Yeah, that's right. So

33:07

your skeleton is the bone bank, essentially.

33:10

It's like a giant vault. You can

33:12

make deposits into your

33:14

peak bone mass up until your mid 20s. So

33:17

it's really, really great. But once

33:20

you reach that peak bone mass, no more

33:22

deposits can be made, and you start just

33:25

withdrawing over your lifetime. So you

33:27

really have to your mid 20s

33:29

to do that. So with your oat milk,

33:31

line it up next time you go to

33:33

the supermarket to all the other plant milks

33:36

and a carton of regular cow's milk, and

33:38

see which one's got the most calcium. And

33:41

maybe experiment to find the one that you like

33:43

the taste of. You're willing to drink it regularly,

33:45

and you're getting enough calcium. Because once you've hit the

33:47

mid 20s, that's it. You can't add more. We've

33:50

got Michael in the southern highlands. Michael, you've got

33:52

a question about synthetic meat. Yeah,

33:54

do. Hi, doctors. I've

33:56

been hearing a bit about that there's some companies in

33:58

the US trying to get to make a

34:01

plant-based meat, essentially by using

34:03

a biopsy of an animal, whether it's

34:05

a chicken or a cow or whatever,

34:07

and reproducing that using other materials. I

34:12

was just curious, if that was to

34:15

be something that is able to be

34:17

done, would there be some sort of animal that would

34:19

be better to eat than cows or

34:21

chickens? And potentially, should we be eating gorillas

34:23

or leopards? Yes. So this is a

34:25

challenge, isn't it, of how we're going to feed the world. It's

34:29

not really fair to the rest of the world that we

34:31

go, no, you're not allowed to eat as much meat as

34:34

what we do. And so I think

34:36

people recognising the environment and

34:39

sustainability has fuelled the

34:41

increase in plant-based meat. But there's two

34:43

different categories of these broadly

34:45

called fake meat. So there is

34:47

the ones that are made from

34:49

plant products. So it's typically pea

34:51

or soy or even wheat protein.

34:53

And there, with a lot of

34:55

additives turned into a meat replacement

34:57

product. But this category you're talking

34:59

about, this is a cell culture.

35:01

So you're exactly right. They get

35:03

cells from the muscles of some

35:05

type of animal and then grow

35:07

enough of those cells to harvest

35:09

them and turn them into a

35:12

meat product. I think this is a category

35:14

that we're going to see really increased. There

35:16

are Australian producers of that type of meat

35:18

as well. So when you go

35:20

to the supermarket, have a look to see whether

35:23

is it being sold as a cellular

35:26

type of meat product or is it

35:28

a plant-based meat product? In

35:30

the conversation, there has been a review

35:32

of all the fake meats and

35:35

they're not all equal, a bit like the

35:37

milks. So you need to look at the

35:39

label and look for the ones that are the lowest

35:41

in salt, the lowest

35:43

in the saturated fats and just see

35:45

that you're happy to be consuming all

35:47

the ingredients listed on the label. I'd

35:49

be interested to know from a vegan

35:51

if it is made with cells, if

35:53

it's a cell production, if it would

35:55

still be considered vegan then because

35:57

they're still taking the cells from an animal. be

36:00

because they'll be animal cells. So then if

36:02

you're a vegan you really got to look

36:04

closely is this a plant-based? Yeah

36:06

we've got Jordan in Melbourne here Jordan

36:08

what's your question? Hi

36:11

doctors thank you so much for your time

36:13

just got a quick one. What do you

36:15

think is worse for you having a one

36:17

big night a week on the beers or every

36:20

night you know having one or two with dinner?

36:23

I'm gonna read you the Australian Alcohol consumption

36:25

guidelines. Oh the riot act here we

36:27

go. Yeah here's the riot act no

36:29

more than 10 standard drinks per week

36:32

and no more than four standard drinks on

36:34

any one so it's the one a night

36:36

is the short answer but the reason why

36:38

they say that is we used

36:40

to have all these different guidelines about

36:42

alcohol from one from the Cancer

36:44

Council one from the Road and Traffic Authority one

36:47

from the Heart Foundation they all got together and

36:49

they agreed on what I just read you and

36:51

the reason why it's four on one occasion is

36:54

to reduce the risk of alcohol related

36:56

harm you know so you don't

36:58

get run over because you've walked in

37:00

front of a car you don't run someone

37:02

over you don't say

37:05

the wrong thing and get beaten up you don't

37:07

beat someone up but if

37:09

you're a beer drinker you

37:12

are so so lucky because

37:14

the low and reduced alcohol

37:16

beers that taste really amazing

37:18

every week new amazing ones

37:20

so you can drink as much as you

37:22

like if you're going for those zero and

37:24

extremely low alcohol beers and just

37:26

keep persevering till you find one

37:29

that you really like good news is the works

37:31

underway in wine research some of

37:33

that's being done at the University of Newcastle

37:35

and the University of Adelaide but it's a

37:38

lot more complex to get retained a flavour

37:40

of wine and make

37:42

it zero alcohol. Thanks

37:46

so much for listening to this week's episode

37:48

of Science with Dr. Karl and thank you

37:50

again to Professor Claire Collins from the University

37:52

of Newcastle for coming through if

37:55

you want to keep up to date with our guest

37:57

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drops or or revisit one of your faves,

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take a scroll through the podcast feed, make

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38:06

the science for Dr. Carl's fam. My

38:08

name's Lucy Smith, this episode was produced

38:10

by Sarah Harvey and we'll catch you

38:12

next week, bye. Dave Marchese here

38:14

from the Triple J Hack Team. Hey,

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