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Drive Time on RTU Radio 1,

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sponsored by Zorik. It's your

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future. Let Zorik help you protect it.

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Talk to us today about life and serious

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illness cover. Drive Time

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on RTU Radio 1 with Sarah

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McInerney and Cormac O'Hara. You're

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welcome back. Dublin City Council is

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due to discuss the city's transport

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plan during its full meeting later.

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Changes to how cars can

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travel in the capital, including bus skates on

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the keys, are due to

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come into effect in August. But Minister

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of State with responsibility for business, employment

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and retail, Eamer Higgins, has

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concerns about the impact it could have

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on jobs and retail sales in the

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city. Dublin City Council have told

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Drive Time that the meeting was

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a positive engagement and fresh

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from that meeting is the Minister of

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State for Business, Employment and Retail, Eamer

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Higgins. Minister, Eamer Higgins, you're welcome to

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the programme. Thank you very much.

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How did the meeting go? Yeah,

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I think it was very positive. And

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I suppose just just to give you

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a listen to context, as Minister with

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responsibility for retail, I chair what's called

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the Retail Forum. I chaired my first

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Retail Forum meeting earlier. Well,

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last month, this stage, June. The

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number one issue of concern that was raised with

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me at that was the Dublin City Transport Plan.

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And I acted on those concerns by setting

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up a meeting with Dublin City Council. We

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had that first meeting last week, which which

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felt was a very productive meeting. And today

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we had a follow up meeting. And

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I suppose really that the main thing to

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say is that everybody wants to get this

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plan in place. And what's the outcome? Everybody

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wants to get it done right. So what's the

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outcome? Is the transport plan, will it be delayed?

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There is no outcome to this meeting because

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this meeting wasn't a decision making forum. The

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decision rests solely with the Dublin City Council. And

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just to be clear on that, and I

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fully respect their mandate in that regard. But

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what the meeting was about was about putting

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the very legitimate concerns of retailers on the

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table. And it was about. City Council

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hearing their worries, understanding their perspectives and

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understanding that they're coming from a position

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that is all about jobs. Which

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they heard twice at least because the Green

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Party leader was speaking over the weekend,

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Aiman Ryan, he was saying that they

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voted on this the local council and

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the councillors twice. They green lighted the

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plan twice and some councillors,

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Green Party councillors, are calling this a

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major overreach from you. Listen

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just to be clear I'm not being political here.

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What I'm doing is I'm prioritizing the protection of

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jobs. I want to see this implemented but I

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want us to get it right. I'm the Minister

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of Responsibility for Retail so when members of the

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Retail Forum come to me and

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express concerns to me about football in

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Dublin City Centre, about jobs in Dublin

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City Centre, I escalated that to Dublin

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City Council and I opened those lines

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of communication as is my job. As

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I said I want this to happen but the

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question that retailers are asking is

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is Dublin City ready? And what they're

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saying to me is would this be

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better time after Christmas? And I suppose

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I understand their concern because there's been

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so much uncertainty these last few years

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between COVID and energy prices and the

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reduction in football because of changed working

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patterns like hybrid working and working from

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home and they're worried about heading

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into their busy season with further uncertainty but

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others are very supportive

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of this and are saying that when

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this happens it should be happening on

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a trial basis. So should be monitored

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or assessed or adjusted as needed. Was this

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a solo run Eamer on

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your part or did you do this with

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the imprimatur and blessing of Finnegeil and your

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party leader? Well listen

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Finnegeil policy has always been about protecting

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jobs. I'm the Minister with Responsibility for

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Retail so when people came to me

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with very valid concerns that there could

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be an impact from a jobs perspective

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and said that they felt that their

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position and their concerns weren't being

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heard. I thought it was my duty to

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session the meeting with Dublin City Council. Did

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you discuss this meeting with DCC with

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Simon Harris? I discussed this

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meeting with business. they're the people I'm

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representing here. Businesses came to me with

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these concerns. I've heard that. Just

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in terms of your own political discussion,

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did you discuss it with the Tisha?

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No, I went ahead and set up a meeting

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between Dublin City Council and businesses. Okay.

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So politically this

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was a solo role. No, it's not.

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It's not a departure at all from

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policy. I mean, I'm in favour of this

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plan happening. I want to make sure this

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plan happens in a way that doesn't jeopardise

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jobs. I mean, that's government's

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position. Is it a departure from

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transport and climate or environmental policy?

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No, I mean, absolutely not. I mean, I

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fully respect the mandate of others here in

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terms of the Minister for Transport. But my

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job is to make sure that the impact

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on business is part of the consideration too,

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that it's part of the discussion. So

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I organised the meeting to take place so

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with that businesses were able to put their

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perspective on the table with the decision

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makers, that they could be heard, that they

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could be listened to, and

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that those concerns could be taken on board. That's

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my duty as Minister. That's my job. Yeah.

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Were they not heard previous to this when

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the Council greenlighted this twice? Well,

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retailers were telling me that they weren't. No.

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And I suppose we're operating in that changed

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landscape that we're talking about with reduced football.

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And as I was saying,

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some people feel that when this happens, it

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should happen on a trial basis, that it

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should be monitored, assessed, adjusted as needed. I

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would see that as a very sensible strategy. And

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I think really, everybody agrees on two things

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that firstly, we need to get better at

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engaging and talking to businesses, but also that

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we need to be data driven here. And

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right now, Dublin city traders are doing

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an economic impact assessment on this. And that

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needs to form part of the strategy.

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I think that's a reasonable ask. But

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wasn't there a public consultation? There

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was public. There was two public consultations.

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Absolutely. They

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did. But consultation doesn't begin and end on portals

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or emails. You know, I think face to face.

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There is

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still a very valid reason to have face-to-face

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engagement. That is what we have had this

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week and last week in terms of retailers

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represented on the retail forum engaging directly with

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Dublin City Council and the NTA. I

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think that has been really positive and productive. As

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Minister, that is my priority. It is

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to make sure that jobs and businesses

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are part of the decision-making landscape in

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Dublin City Council. I think having had

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those good discussions, we can see that

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they are being taken on board by Dublin

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City Council. You say this is about protecting jobs.

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What about protecting the environment? What

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about making Dublin City a better

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place for cyclists and pedestrians and

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making it a faster public transport system?

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What about that? Absolutely.

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That is exactly what we want. That is exactly

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the place we want to get to. We want

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to get there in a way that does not

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jeopardise jobs. We are all on the same page

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when it comes to wanting to reduce congestion in

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Dublin City. But we also

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want to get this right. Councillors

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were telling me that their perspectives and

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concerns weren't being heard. So I facilitated

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a meeting to tease out those concerns.

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It was productive. They were

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teased out already in the public

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consultation and in discussions with

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councillors in the Council. I don't know

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if you have ever made the submission to public

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consultation. Sometimes you write it

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out, you hit send and that

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is the end of it. It is not necessarily

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always an engaging process. Are you saying they weren't

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considered by the Council? No,

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I am not saying that. I am

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saying that it doesn't lend itself to two-way

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communication. That is what I wanted to deliver

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here. A two-way communication between businesses and Dublin

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City Council. That is why I got everybody

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around the same table to tease out those

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issues. I do

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think that is the right thing to do. That

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is the way to make sure that business is

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part of the decision-making process here. I understand. Can

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I ask you finally then, do you think

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or would you like to see the plan

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fundamentally change before it is implemented? My

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perspective on this is I would like to

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see a situation where... retailers concerns are

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late. To me it's about

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getting this plan happening, it's about getting it happening

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as quickly as possible and getting it right and

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that means protecting jobs. That's the perspective

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I've come from, making sure that we're

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protecting jobs here. Minister of

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State for Business, Employment and Retail, Emer Higgins of

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Finnegaill. Thank you very much.