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before we get started we wanted to tell

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you

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about book exploder a

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really cool mini series from our friend

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richie case, here way you

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can find it over on the song exploder podcast

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on book exploder,

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she has teamed up with a plan they're

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susan orlean to interview, other authors

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about how they write each episode features of

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author diving deep into a from

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one of their books revealing what inspired

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the specific choices they made and

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the problems they have you're good unique

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insight and some of the most exciting voices

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the first episode is out now feature

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susan orlean yourself and conversations

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with wish to discuss her new york times

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you know he do because it is just a

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the first episode drops like september

2:43

seventh

2:44

it is a couple

2:46

, yes is getting close in the

2:48

meantime we want to give our listeners something the

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hotel to so we want

2:52

to sit of first episode of a parker

2:55

said just came out his call

2:57

my mother made me and is the latest

2:59

offering from radio told me radio present

3:01

it's a four part series by new york times

3:04

bestselling author and library of congress

3:06

is national ambassador for young people

3:08

solicitor jason reynolds

3:10

and for us it has kind of a cool back

3:13

three years back and twenty nine teenage

3:15

you and i were at the kennedy center

3:17

art summit in c and we

3:19

met jason rentals she was also they're giving

3:22

a talk right right so our lives are

3:24

just so happen while by bookstore month in

3:26

a bookstore and i mean i

3:28

guess and say to run a both cities like it was going

3:30

on so i went over to elicit a few

3:32

bought a gang over with the idea of giving

3:35

them to do be superior for

3:37

see ah nice to meet our executive

3:39

producer julius serious zhu

3:42

li who was found they snow in the

3:44

history of your hustle has now help

3:46

bring this new so into the world written

3:49

and hosted by jason rentals

3:51

early who knew that you can

3:53

see my that bookstore would be one of the seeds

3:55

that led to this new collaboration

3:57

the remain router it's very so

3:59

my mother made me talks about jason's

4:02

relationship with his mother but it's

4:04

also about the creative process and finding

4:06

one's own voice try

4:08

the important experiences and relationships

4:11

that make us who we are an episode

4:13

good see good since

4:16

death spirits you added the but

4:19

jason and his mother also have fun

4:22

the pushing a court to casco birthday

4:25

lunches and hidden the casinos together

4:28

doesn't add though i love when they over that

4:31

station is a great writer and storyteller

4:33

and mans does he have

4:35

a voice made for podcasting

4:37

indeed steve

4:40

out of the rural on earth is always is really is

4:42

really city a he can throw

4:45

these the microbiome month so

4:47

here is the first episode

4:49

of my mother may me by jason rentals

4:52

and radio toby or presents

4:55

here's the deal

4:57

the made many things

5:00

most people know me from making books primarily

5:03

for kids

5:04

the few people thankfully only a few

5:06

people know i used to make music

5:09

god knows i've made a lot of

5:11

mistakes but what i've never

5:14

i've ever ever thought about

5:17

the bad guess

5:18

that because i don't love them like everyone

5:20

else at do but because

5:23

i couldn't says i'm they could be anything

5:25

left to explore

5:27

i mean seriously what i case

5:29

don't exist

5:32

yeah doc and dramas we

5:34

are comedians working out there to it's we

5:36

got shows about the makings of

5:39

pretty much everything food

5:42

cause movies companies a

5:44

happy life shows on

5:46

family had a star on one or managed

5:49

to dysfunction have one in slugs shows

5:52

on writing and literature and music

5:54

and arts and acting

5:56

and architecture

5:59

i'd guess that just like

6:02

whisper t v

6:05

s m r u s de

6:07

a w n b a s

6:09

l c r o this probably

6:12

even probably podcast called elemental

6:14

p about the alphabet of

6:16

life for some like day

6:18

down and learn from some

6:20

the biggest stories and popular

6:22

coaches the biggest stories an unpopular

6:25

coaches kalma and narratives

6:27

about anarchy because apparently

6:29

the revolutions will have a seminal

6:31

attached to in it's it's

6:34

all know it's to evolution evolution

6:37

the war on us public

6:41

we also

6:43

got show was about evolution the

6:45

evolution of the human species the

6:47

evolution of our in syria lies

6:49

spiritual shows religious shows

6:52

and so was about the differences between

6:54

the two podcast that helped

6:56

you meditate in mediate the every

6:58

day miss have you every day the

7:01

i guess for children shout out to

7:03

the kids still some

7:06

even run by children set

7:08

out to those keys what is lox lox

7:12

podcast to help was declared our

7:14

lives and others to help us

7:16

learn to get every single thing

7:18

be thing podcast and

7:20

one scary as

7:22

in axles gary stories

7:24

and others to help with sleep with are they

7:26

intend with and that podcast

7:30

about politics which oftentimes tend

7:32

to be scary stories or to

7:35

help was sleeps with is a and

7:37

into or now to and of job but

7:40

podcasts sex and lungs

7:42

on crime true and otherwise and of course

7:45

there's no way to the

7:47

out know at least two million

7:50

enemies are

7:54

very soon

7:59

so

8:00

what will i

8:01

had to add to this overloaded treasure

8:04

trove

8:05

well

8:06

turns out that much

8:09

only doing this because

8:12

my mother made me

8:15

and my little brother made being

8:17

so

8:43

i guess i should begin the way most shows

8:46

i'm jason reynolds and this

8:49

my mother made me a podcast

8:51

from radio to be presents about

8:53

some other things my mom has taught me

8:56

about life very close

8:58

as a matter of fact she's my

9:00

best friend the confide in each

9:02

other and meets hang out all the time and

9:05

this gave me a chance to finally

9:07

it's interview her which

9:09

is funny because usually i'm the

9:11

one being interviewed but then

9:14

always seemed to papa

9:16

i was

9:19

raised by a fascinating woman

9:21

my mom was right back to farmers basically

9:23

a farmer in a farmer's wife is a when i around

9:25

it was caught like other do this boy everything

9:28

i'd die and i didn't have to

9:30

make sure that he grows up as a whole person's

9:32

i think about the things my mother taught us as

9:34

kids about even if it was an ancient belief

9:36

systems she no saying doesn't make sense

9:39

to we'll have to believe that no matter what else

9:41

going on he makes of it as close as ministers

9:43

x ray and that's , my

9:45

i got home and kathleen c

9:48

, u ah holloway

9:52

the she's definitely

9:54

a g and pretty much the star

9:57

his bike as new gonna hear from her

9:59

soon the first think

10:01

of me as her warm up act let tell

10:04

ya the story to get you the

10:06

isabel reynolds experience few

10:10

years ago i was on tour

10:12

promoting a book i'd written caught look both

10:14

ways which is a collection of short

10:16

stories exploring the moments young

10:19

people get to become more of themselves

10:21

without the watchful eye and wisdom

10:23

of adults i'd been

10:25

on tons of book tours trekking

10:27

across the country from the smallest towns

10:30

to the biggest cities in usually

10:32

when i showed up by be given a lovely

10:34

introductions then i'd basically stand

10:37

in the microphone and talk for forty

10:39

five minutes about the book the making

10:41

of it's maybe i'd even read a little for

10:43

me to crack some jokes sorta

10:45

like a strange routine a one

10:48

man show performance or

10:50

that ended with que un aids and an autograph

10:52

land with some of the most adorable

10:55

children into plans kids

10:58

who showed up ready to take pictures and tell

11:00

me or these thoughts about my stories

11:02

which usually into thoughts

11:04

about this it's

11:07

an incredible experience for

11:09

me but over the years it's

11:11

become difficult still listed

11:14

all by myself so

11:16

some time ago as my publicist if

11:18

i did do much or in conversations

11:21

which just means every stab someone

11:23

would interview me about my work

11:25

in front of an audience and

11:27

, though lacks somebody

11:30

that usually comes with man let's

11:32

call them performances if the

11:34

person sitting across from me is the person

11:37

in the experience can still be pretty entertaining

11:46

i yeah my wishlist the mean

11:48

i'd love to chat with gross

11:50

or don cheadle how know

11:52

patti labelle angela bassett

11:55

or somebody like jonathan mages i feel like

11:57

he'd be a good interview

11:59

the

11:59

maybe one of my uncles my

12:02

uncle bob who would only as

12:04

questions that would make me laugh and

12:06

we'd probably split a bottle of on

12:09

stage and make a mess of things maybe

12:12

j c like

12:14

i say that i got my wishlist but

12:17

, person who i was fortunate enough

12:19

to be interviewed by on the look both ways

12:21

to is to me more

12:24

legendary than everyone else

12:26

ads his name well except

12:28

for maybe uncle bob i mean

12:31

this person this a cultural cornerstone

12:33

the legends legend a generational

12:35

giant and on cyberwar that he

12:37

used iraq i mean who beery i'm

12:40

talking about the incomparable levar

12:42

burton yes that

12:45

levar burton from

12:47

reading rainbow and roots star

12:50

trek

12:52

in should have been jeopardy

12:54

but

12:54

we don't have talk about that

12:57

it was a beautiful day an alien when i

12:59

showed up at barnes and nobles at the grove

13:01

still var was waiting in the green room

13:04

which was actually the staff's break

13:06

room because bookstores don't be glamorous right

13:09

we deduce ourselves and chat briefly

13:11

for a few moments taking states

13:14

the first ten minutes of the interview we

13:17

ended up talking about our

13:19

mothers

13:21

spoke their names and waxed about how

13:23

grateful we offer them to have

13:25

come through them to have been of

13:28

them we even cried

13:30

a little net was the beginning of the

13:32

show then i wish i could

13:34

tell you that moment was the highlight

13:37

he was

13:39

the most memorable moment for me at least

13:42

came after we finished signing books

13:44

banning

13:47

was over our moms around our dear

13:51

, reached out to the vita ask him if he remembers

13:53

that conversation but as i recall

13:56

list of time and they also do

13:58

not as do not is yours you

13:59

right right

14:02

and you , engine

14:04

hard and nice nice

14:07

got a very a that

14:10

this was an issue for you and your likes

14:12

that this is something that you are struggling with and i

14:14

just to as someone who has someone

14:16

who in

14:19

, post painstakingly

14:22

learn and need a necessity

14:25

painstakingly prioritize my own

14:27

health and , soon as someone who

14:30

recognized chased and recognized

14:32

see brother i'm

14:34

going to be able to operate

14:37

as your see months

14:39

capacity nine men

14:42

are some issues or as his assistant

14:45

part of this and and and are got

14:47

sense for us disconcerting with

14:51

a separate the

14:53

beverly birds

14:57

now that your warmed up

14:59

let's talk about my mom

15:04

molson days or pulitzer my mother's house

15:06

with a coffee in the new york tat a

15:08

stop in the middle of the driveway to grab the washington

15:11

post see has delivered every week vince

15:13

the ring the doorbell i

15:16

got a key but i never use

15:18

it mainly because i love the of excitement

15:21

on his face when she opens the door

15:23

even though she's always expecting

15:27

i didn't holiday decor and on this

15:29

sunday mama the had broken out the browns

15:32

oranges and for the upcoming thanksgiving

15:34

dinner this house ain't changed

15:37

in years the green

15:39

carpet to the chats keys

15:41

and old knickknacks that pebble the coffee table

15:43

to the gallery of random arts

15:46

including arts framed washington post profile

15:48

on me from it's years and go

15:50

as mom's due to the strange

15:53

assortment of clock scattered around

15:55

the living room dining room and kids and all

15:57

of which are to different times

16:00

some ten minutes fast

16:02

at six minutes slow

16:05

the radio was always on in the

16:07

kitchen unless the is on

16:10

and on sundays is t v

16:13

which is strange because my mother don't never

16:15

sit in the kitchen on sunday she

16:17

sits in the office where there's

16:20

also a tv

16:24

a good person who is a socio

16:28

the , sugar

16:31

on sunday she makes would as

16:33

to be a half a liter of instant

16:35

coffee which is why i bring

16:37

my bring and hose up in her

16:39

office which used to be my older brother's room

16:41

and watches the news all the long

16:44

more our except

16:47

now our selsey from when i

16:49

can we please send me can sophie

16:52

our living is sophie funny really into

16:54

, a beautiful face face

16:58

now funny second celsius for

17:00

do i do is this dynamics

17:03

turn the around to face you so that it

17:05

that way though

17:08

i'd say at least at third of my role as son

17:10

is comprised be this six in my mother's

17:13

printer or teaching her to use

17:15

her latest piece of technology the

17:17

computer and new television

17:20

and of course and cellphone

17:23

he never went out with gray

17:30

but i really do

17:33

you defend

17:38

nice sundays are important

17:40

to me because in some ways they serve as as

17:44

someone who's not the most religious this

17:47

some kind of also for me to kneel that

17:49

and that also happens to be as

17:51

this home where was sitting right now

17:54

the home of the great isabel rentals

17:56

was also happens to be the home ads

17:58

weapon

17:59

i lost

18:02

my teeth grew new tease gets

18:04

where she taught me

18:06

the eat the world know

18:09

, know when when

18:11

were we in what way

18:14

furthermore is where i come the lay my

18:16

burdens down miss

18:19

a lot going on right every

18:22

now and then

18:24

hello tom from just like the know obama

18:29

every day every weekend sort of make

18:32

up such a weekend put everything where

18:34

it needs to be mind of us all things you to

18:36

do or that you , to do a

18:38

for all the work you have to deal with it

18:40

made know you know this you die your

18:42

life life then

18:44

sometimes we

18:47

just want to stream

18:55

but i don't scream at

18:57

least i try not to however

19:00

see a whatever the we have we have is

19:02

in my bad the been

19:05

thinking a lot lately about where

19:07

person puts that way i

19:09

mean life is a lot of things you know maybe

19:12

it's more accurate to just say slices

19:15

lat

19:17

i guess is this way for everyone but i

19:19

know which this way for me get

19:22

me wrong so much laughter is so

19:24

much joy so much but they

19:26

are just as many moments where i feel

19:29

so much pressure skin on my face

19:31

feels stretched from the attention of tears

19:34

almost at almost point of splitting some imaginary

19:36

seem that runs from widow's peak the goatee

19:39

days where one moment i'm basking in the weird

19:42

affirmations of my life that of

19:44

somehow something of it and i feel

19:46

so useful to the world and been shortly

19:49

after i still will

19:52

who used by the world

19:54

completely depleted after giving

19:56

whatever i have

19:58

the whoever needs you

20:01

know and i just as miles regrowth kind of

20:03

like you know the

20:06

you remember a time where in the ones

20:09

who need something from something there's

20:13

maybe , lot asks asks

20:16

i maybe a warning system the do the except

20:18

for it live for

20:22

the best at nasa from you

20:25

know what i want to last

20:27

me

20:30

they don't almighty want to hear that

20:33

no nobody went to hear me cry and about

20:35

house live in my dreams come

20:37

with some kind of instruction booklet or at

20:39

least a warning in the

20:41

only way to deal with it is to play prospective

20:44

games to force feed myself emotional

20:46

illusions but i wouldn't trade

20:48

it for the world or is better than what

20:50

i used to be doing north be grateful

20:53

satellite , isn't it the industry

20:56

in that site

21:00

mean and indices species

21:02

that person certain distance

21:04

that exists in athens like half

21:09

how much supposed to do all this and

21:12

maintain some sense in mental health get

21:14

rest take care bye to the truth

21:16

is i wouldn't trade my

21:18

life say anything and

21:21

it is better than when life used to do

21:24

and i am grateful

21:25

the

21:27

i'm also human you

21:29

have seen and done things my family

21:31

and many of my friends could have only jumped up but

21:34

i don't mean is that a heavy cost so

21:36

me what feels like the collective boot is

21:38

upon my back always asks

21:41

where exactly

21:44

mass supposed to put the way

21:48

and then

21:49

just in time

21:51

funny when i do

21:54

about slavery is that was half

21:56

of this of this you react with that

22:06

the way it will work itself out

22:08

always present and

22:12

, you take the time time was

22:14

was do

22:19

as so much less your mother in more ways

22:21

you realize you may reflect you death

22:27

that there's no choice but

22:31

to though watches

22:34

motivation of people are capable

22:36

of women are

22:38

basically way

22:42

the irony is not lost on me that

22:44

this is coming from a lady who struggles

22:46

it's a gazelle see that

22:54

i think it is kind of my maker fun

22:59

then i can feel like it's

23:01

for a man something , me

23:03

that pushes me because i can

23:05

do anything n bad

23:08

way i can do anything no

23:11

i know

23:12

the mom of it's only so

23:18

manufacture my mother made me tell myself

23:20

so every night as itself the

23:22

made me say it loud enough for her to zero

23:25

after our site it my nightly prayers

23:27

they , matter how tired i was a didn't

23:29

matter if i was over no

23:32

way to us if we weren't getting along or

23:34

even if i was sick sick

23:36

had to say it aloud every

23:38

single night in the same house

23:41

the tv playing house the kitchen loud enough for

23:43

me to he admits never loud enough to

23:45

distract me from those forwards

23:48

max non negotiable much

23:50

i can do

24:05

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we also be taking good care of ourselves i

24:20

mean our brains are kind of like

24:22

our car engines stick either something forward

24:25

and like your core metaphor which

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makes sense and how we care for

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25:07

the lefty back to mama let

25:10

me tell more about this amazing

25:13

if i had to sum up her personality

25:15

in a single word

25:16

well for the while wouldn't want to but if

25:19

i had to it would be

25:21

driven

25:22

she worked in insurance in our office

25:24

with an hour away from where we live

25:26

so she had to be out the house passed six am

25:28

to avoid chassis to started

25:31

working for this company was use was sixteen hero

25:33

clawing hero way up from the mail room

25:35

to the executive office the only

25:37

black woman the only period

25:41

in that position driven

25:43

she was driven as a mom

25:45

doing our best to make sure my brethren

25:47

i everything we needed food

25:50

on the table every night stand up the check

25:52

our homework it's taken to practices

25:54

and games even though she had to be of

25:56

herbs the take that long journey to the office

26:00

be driven to be the best family member wife

26:02

daughter sister and seats doing her

26:04

best to give everything see

26:07

and in a weekends most you see them in

26:09

reston c b micromanage in

26:11

our chores my mean

26:13

sure was to dust which let

26:16

me tell you was just because our

26:18

house was like was bizarre full

26:20

of things that seem like they were supposed

26:22

to be dusty

26:23

the

26:26

day she still at person then

26:30

i can do anything can a person at

26:32

least to me to ,

26:34

herself then try to be everything

26:36

to everybody only

26:38

difference is well bangor

26:41

does no more

26:43

paint abu

26:46

have been a hostilities right

26:48

, what would shoot in a whole though

26:50

it doesn't anywhere in this house oh

26:53

thing editing cover story every so that's

26:55

one thousand series and our results

26:57

with all of these bodies do for stories of

26:59

miami and i won't have one one

27:02

my mets matthew bitterness that so much my

27:04

life has been has what would

27:06

woke woke woke woke woke or

27:09

know if or lazy for

27:12

me right now to me you live

27:14

well my

27:17

lifestyle

27:19

the lifestyle dns but am

27:21

i live seeing my life is what i'm saying

27:23

i gotcha story as you

27:25

that way

27:27

the same makes you feel

27:31

, that's

27:33

what i'm trying to figure out

27:41

that makes me feel good

27:44

is the feel the need it

27:46

more needed

27:48

than one it

27:52

more needed than wanted

27:54

get there

27:56

a really really do like

27:59

us it is nothing better than the moments

28:02

as useful somewhere almost

28:05

makes me wonder if services

28:08

as a , that causes

28:10

some kind of strange indoors and rests

28:12

both service become a crutch i used

28:15

to prop up some insecurity

28:17

i'm unaware

28:19

or maybe is it's

28:21

that's a sexy way to had my work on this

28:24

they would have workaholism is genetic

28:27

i mean i know it's net a least our

28:30

think it is what

28:32

is giving

28:37

me a harness

28:41

the right way to do is take

28:43

and you alone time and i think that

28:45

this done great things for your life especially people

28:47

to live with the especially around you have benefited from it

28:49

but also it's caused you tremendous

28:52

grease grease

28:56

yeah

28:58

so many forms

28:59

like sleepless nights saw drink many

29:02

cancer

29:05

growing up i watched my mother's serve as

29:07

a pillar holding up far too much

29:09

a , immediate an extended

29:12

a company she worked for all

29:14

or friendships friendships become

29:16

more of a what

29:19

and

29:21

perhaps like a vending

29:23

machine and i know this sounds harsh

29:25

but it's true that we all just took

29:27

summer and we took from earth's and

29:29

took from her without ever depositing

29:32

anything it's just knocking against

29:34

him and taking whatever she had to offer

29:36

only to look on and off at her refusal

29:39

to break down

29:42

damien flown figure of

29:44

a message is a long time ago i just wouldn't do

29:46

it upper as

29:48

woman how to do is add to the say no

29:50

i didn't wanna say no

29:52

the family members were

29:54

expected me to do x y z and

29:57

i fell within my thermometer let them down

30:01

so i did and still do exactly

30:04

what i was too i do

30:06

anything if ,

30:08

wanna do it nothing tells i can

30:12

i've never done it done and free

30:14

but track and if i don't know

30:16

how i'm don't to learn the

30:18

sometimes the weight of anything ness

30:21

it's heavy because it's not always

30:23

about the it's i wanna do sometimes

30:26

it's about the things i don't it's or need

30:28

to do and i'm so used to doing it or

30:30

whatever it takes to snatch just make

30:32

my dreams come true but sustain

30:34

them while also figuring out how to grow

30:36

the nightmares of out kids and can possible

30:40

and me everything is

30:42

possible everything

30:46

but don't always feel that way

30:50

the were united so

30:55

, it out strategy

30:58

myself permission came

31:05

to everyone and

31:08

thing that has to be okay was sad you know that

31:11

seem to have right

31:13

now maybe that i've seen

31:15

, you know know that

31:17

you distill mullen disappoint

31:19

or bad year

31:22

and that's okay too

31:26

you don't know where life brings says

31:28

for half an ,

31:30

employed to live each day for

31:34

for let's actually

31:50

what makes me happy

31:52

learn and about the world and last

31:54

one with kids and eating a delicious meal

31:57

and of costs catching up with my mom

31:59

was sunday that always

32:01

sunday mornings because by the time evening

32:04

comes her as a heavy and that

32:06

all off his chair becomes a matches

32:08

his majesty's came in right angles

32:11

also , early so i can get added a

32:13

around noon now we i get the rest

32:15

of my day my sunday to

32:18

work

32:20

what can i say

32:21

my mother made me

32:28

this podcast was supposed to be

32:31

a tribute to my mom honoring

32:33

, she's taught me like like

32:36

remember where i'm where or

32:38

hadn't to a higher power or how

32:40

lice about service gyms

32:43

to get me to replace she'd never seen

32:47

then i realized and talking to her that now

32:49

that i'm here it's may be i have to take

32:51

those the commandments of isabel

32:53

reynolds and sweets and just

32:56

a little to sit who i am second

32:59

really lived his thing and

33:01

, maybe that's with this

33:03

podcast is really about was see

33:05

and i are teaching each teaching and

33:07

how perhaps we both could use some

33:09

lessons use some

33:12

to speak

33:15

so yeah

33:16

i can do anything

33:18

even start a podcast about my mother's

33:21

and or she's taught me but now it

33:23

seems like i'm that just because

33:25

i can do anything don't

33:28

, i always has to and

33:30

if you sign time sign know you're busy and i have

33:33

the right as suspicious schedule is so heavy

33:35

goods you goods as to integrate is serious

33:37

as soon as

33:41

go everywhere

33:45

and if all else fails i

33:47

just change this to an interview podcast

33:50

or podcast on new wonders of the world

33:53

or maybe technology or home improvement

33:55

or interior design or floral

33:57

arrangements floral self care healthcare

34:00

welfare a podcast on the changing

34:03

definitions of everyday words

34:05

or regional psni a

34:07

podcast in the history of fashion and

34:10

how loose his energies

34:12

the podcast on just the color race

34:15

or just wouldn't buttons or

34:17

which eyeglasses at best

34:35

my

34:45

mother made me is a production radio

34:47

to be a presents and is written

34:49

in narrated by me jason reynolds

34:51

with my mother isabel rent a

34:53

, is produced by mark began and

34:55

ended by julie shapiro with production

34:58

support from your it sorta sorta

35:00

shapiro and rg mart of his or executive

35:02

producers for with utopia with

35:05

special thanks to levar burton my

35:07

homeboy jason griffin for the cover arts

35:09

and some my brother christian reynolds fuck

35:11

still in the still song mixing

35:14

sound design and additional original music

35:16

is additional in costs this was

35:19

recorded at debbie you am you radio

35:22

topi presents debuts limited rents

35:24

artist own series from new and

35:26

original voices for more information

35:29

visit when utopia presents

35:39

offer episodes of my mother made

35:41

me are out now sign them by

35:44

searching for radio topi a presents wherever

35:46

you listen to podcasts if

35:48

you want to know more about the show check out radio

35:50

topi a presents dot sm

35:53

and while we recommend and other things to listen

35:55

to we wanted to mention to other shows

35:57

we've heard recently that we thought our list

35:59

my life

36:01

they both turn journalistic i

36:03

to prisons in different parts of the country

36:06

one is a series called motives from wbc

36:08

in chicago their latest season

36:10

examines is the justice and accountability

36:13

in the illinois prison system

36:15

the other car deliberate indifference

36:18

it takes a close at alabama state

36:20

prisons and how they became some of the most

36:22

dangerous in the country we have

36:24

links to both of these podcasts and or so

36:26

notes

36:27

and stay tuned here hustle

36:29

his back september seventh were so

36:31

excited to see

36:32

the new season with yeah we ,

36:34

in in the time

36:37

that's the time and and