0:15

Welcome to Gender Reveal, a podcast

0:17

where we hopefully get a little bit closer

0:19

to understanding what the hell gender is.

0:22

I'm your host and resident gender

0:24

detective, Tuck Woodstock. Hey

0:33

everyone, hope you've all been hanging in there.

0:37

I'd love to have something eloquent

0:39

or encouraging to say, but

0:41

it's just

0:44

been a really heavy, shitty week, huh? Well,

0:47

a little backstory about today's short

0:49

episode. Ozzy and I had

0:51

originally prepared a normal full-length

0:53

episode for this week that included a

0:55

full guest interview alongside an extended This

0:57

Week in Gender segment about Cecilia. But

1:00

on Saturday night, Ozzy and I received some news that

1:02

ultimately meant we were going to have to remake

1:05

a bunch of the interview portion of the

1:07

podcast. And we both decided

1:09

that ultimately we were too, too sad

1:11

and tired to tackle that at the last

1:13

minute on a Sunday. So we

1:16

are holding that interview for now. Hopefully we'll air it

1:18

later this season. But we still

1:20

do want to share our tribute that we put together

1:22

for Cecilia Gentile. Had

1:25

I known that the segment was going to be the entire episode, maybe

1:28

I would have tried to build it out a little more, but it

1:30

is what it is. And I'm

1:32

really, really trying to remember that

1:34

the solution to grief is not to

1:36

do more work and little projects about

1:39

it, which is really hard,

1:41

by the way, because like, what's the alternative?

1:43

Be sad, feel my feelings.

1:47

I guess. Anyway,

1:50

thank you for being here to slow down

1:52

and feel some feelings with me. It

1:54

means a lot. Please

1:57

take care of yourselves, take care of

1:59

each other. Maybe text someone that you

2:01

love them right now. Are

2:03

you doing it? You did it? Okay.

2:07

Well, it's time for this week in

2:10

Gender. As

2:17

you know, we end every episode of

2:19

Gender Reveal with the same question. In

2:22

your ideal world, what would the future of

2:25

gender look like? I

2:28

never got to ask Cecilia Gentile what her ideal

2:30

trans future was and I want to say that

2:32

it's because I thought there would be more time.

2:35

And I did think that. Even though

2:37

I am always thinking about death, even

2:39

though my last several therapy sessions have

2:41

been about how everyone just keeps dying,

2:43

I still thought there would

2:45

be more time because I have

2:48

never in my life seen anyone

2:50

more alive than Cecilia Gentile. Jess

2:53

Peppermint wrote on Instagram, Cecilia

2:55

was one of those women that I foolishly assumed

2:58

and perhaps optimistically hoped that she'd sort

3:00

of always be around. So

3:04

I did think there would be more time,

3:06

but honestly, I also felt like I didn't

3:08

deserve to ask for her time. She

3:11

had accomplished so much and I'll talk about

3:13

that more in a few minutes, but it

3:15

was more than that. It

3:18

was that she loved so many

3:20

of my friends and community members

3:22

so, so, so much. She

3:25

was a mother or the mother of half

3:27

the trans girls of New York. She

3:29

was by all accounts one of the

3:31

most generous and supportive people that any of

3:34

us had ever met. Chiquitita,

3:38

who you know from the show, was

3:41

one of Cecilia's cherished daughters.

3:44

And after she passed, Chiqui wrote,

3:46

Cecilia Gentile is the first woman in

3:49

my life to embrace every inch of

3:51

me unconditionally. I need to

3:53

say this, I have never in my life felt

3:55

this way. People keep telling

3:57

me how much she loves me and how highly she spoke

3:59

of me. I still can't believe it's

4:01

true. Even alive, I couldn't

4:03

believe that." And

4:06

Franterato, who you also know from the show, wrote,

4:09

quote, There isn't much

4:11

I can really write to help you understand what

4:13

this world will mean now without Cecilia Gentiling. The

4:16

times I've tried to describe my relationship to Cecilia,

4:19

beyond that of a co-organizer, a creative collaborator, a

4:21

colleague at a few non-profits, a sister of mutual

4:23

aid, a mentor, a trusted advisor, a muse for

4:25

a short film we were producing, a figurehead for

4:28

a small party we'd not do every year. I

4:32

would say, that's my mother. That's

4:34

mom. Saying that now

4:36

feels wrong somehow, like I'm not worthy enough to claim it,

4:38

but it was true. Still is true. More

4:41

than anything, she saw me and loved me and made

4:43

sure that I felt that love. For

4:45

countless girls, not just me. She was my mother.

4:48

We were all her kids. I'm

4:54

not going to speculate where this seemingly

4:56

common feeling of unworthiness or disbelief

4:58

is coming from in others. I'm

5:01

not going to unpack why I felt unworthy of

5:03

even asking her for an hour of her time,

5:06

but unfortunately, regrettably, I did. And honestly,

5:08

I still feel like someone more worthy

5:10

should really be writing this, which is

5:13

why you're hearing me quote other people

5:15

so much. But I

5:17

have to remember that this is just one

5:19

of thousands of tributes to Cecilia

5:21

that do exist and will exist. So this is

5:23

my pronoun. As

5:27

I was saying, I never asked

5:30

Cecilia her ideal future of gender,

5:32

but luckily Raquel Willis did for

5:34

her podcast, Afterlives, the Leylin

5:36

Polanco story. And

5:38

what is the trans future you dream of? I

5:43

dream of the future

5:45

of trans people being things.

5:49

I dream of future where trans people will

5:51

not be fully understood. And

5:54

that is fine. I want people

5:56

to say, like, I don't understand your trans

5:59

name. I respect

6:01

it and I encourage you to leave

6:03

it to the fullest and to live

6:06

happily. I cannot

6:08

lose faith in

6:10

humanity because otherwise there

6:12

would be nothing for me to live for.

6:17

I live in one of the most conservative

6:19

parts of Brooklyn. I'm too

6:21

close on the water. It's just

6:23

beautiful but it's very conservative, right?

6:25

So I

6:28

know that it's people who are

6:30

transphobic in my blog and

6:32

I always think of like I

6:36

go to a supermarket and I touch my throat

6:38

and I smell my throat and things like that

6:40

and I'm like I'm gonna leave

6:42

this little girl here and I

6:45

just wish that

6:47

someone who is transphobic comes

6:49

and pick it and make

6:51

it nice water moly so they

6:54

could see the wish

6:56

and avocado experience and

6:59

then nothing happened to them.

7:02

And the me touching the avocado

7:04

didn't make it worse or

7:07

better. It

7:10

kept it a fucking avocado.

7:13

So with that what I'm trying

7:15

to symbolize always is that my

7:17

existence really doesn't

7:20

affect anybody. I

7:23

love it and now I want an avocado. Oh

7:26

god. I

7:29

realize that at this point we're several

7:31

minutes in and I have yet to

7:33

explain who Cecilia Gentile is and that's

7:35

because I assume you already know and also because

7:37

I don't know how to do it. You don't

7:40

know how to adequately sum her up.

7:44

She was an asylum seeker from Argentina

7:46

who spent her life advocating for sex

7:48

workers and documented immigrants and queer and

7:51

trans people. She was instrumental in

7:53

getting the Walking While Trans ban repealed in

7:55

New York. She co-created

7:57

a free healthcare program for sex workers at

7:59

Caltech. Ellen Lord, aka The Gay Hospital. The

8:01

program is named after her. And

8:04

for many New York trans people, she was

8:06

the first and most significant support person for

8:08

their medical transition. Cecilia

8:12

wrote a memoir called Faltes, published by our

8:15

friends Kat and Casey at Little Puss Press.

8:18

She played Ms. Orlando on Pose, that's

8:20

fun. She consistently, passionately

8:23

spoke up for Palestine in

8:25

her last few months and was brave

8:28

enough to be arrested at a JVP

8:30

action in October despite all of her

8:32

previous fucked up experiences with the police.

8:35

I remember watching the videos of her arrest

8:37

and she managed to be like so joyful

8:40

and triumphant, even while being arrested. So

8:43

incredible and inspiring. She

8:46

had a one woman off Broadway show called

8:48

Red Ink. I had bought a truly unhinged

8:51

amount of tickets to see it in April

8:53

because no matter who my friends are, what

8:55

their interests are, the one thing that everyone

8:57

had in common is they all wanted to

9:00

see Cecilia perform. There's

9:02

so much more, but I

9:04

don't feel like listing her accomplishments fully captures

9:06

it. So instead I wanted to read this

9:08

description shared on Instagram by one of her

9:11

closest friends and children, Sid Nova.

9:14

Sid writes, quote, "'Funny

9:16

as hell, generous to a fault.

9:18

"'Loyal, principled, interesting, ferociously loving, "'gorgeous,

9:21

committed, experienced, crazily smart, "'just a

9:23

little bit crazy, "'grilliantly creative, sexy

9:25

and horny as hell, "'an amazing

9:28

cook, a good time out and

9:30

about, "'a homemaker and sharer, a

9:33

community creator, "'a princess, a tidy

9:35

ass bitch, a visionary, "'a gangster,

9:37

a forest nymph, a worldly woman.'

9:40

And I forgot the biggest horror in the

9:43

entire world. That

9:45

was originally a text that Sid sent to

9:47

Cecilia on her 52nd birthday last month. Although

9:49

Cecilia would definitely tell you that it was

9:51

her 25th birthday actually. Cecilia

9:54

responded to Sid's text with, "'Who

9:56

That? "'Please introduce me with them. "'They sound

9:58

amazing.'" And. If

10:00

you are listening to this and thinking through

10:03

that, they've been amazing. I

10:05

encourage you to read felt as if

10:07

you haven't I encourage you to listen

10:09

to the Latino Usa episodes affiliate until

10:11

his revolutionary asked and also to recalled

10:13

podcast after which includes the bonus episode

10:15

fill It of the Sicilian Stories. You

10:17

can also listen to any O'brien's almost

10:19

three hour long oral history with Cecilia,

10:21

which was recorded in Twenty Seventeen for

10:24

the and Y C Trans Oral History

10:26

Project is of a full transcript online

10:28

and will link to all of these

10:30

in the Journal when. I.

10:32

Have also been collecting tribute photos

10:34

and videos as the silly and

10:37

and instagram story clicks and buzzers.

10:39

A silly place degree of fat

10:41

of rat and I really do

10:43

encourage you to watch as many

10:45

videos as possible. Each one is

10:47

such a gift, she's just fucking

10:50

funny and also some strong and

10:52

smart and brave and kind and

10:54

good and high and. Nobody.

10:57

Knows what to do without her. The.

11:01

Last time I saw Sicilia was four days

11:04

before she died. She was at the front

11:06

row of She Keys Olympics of Drag Show

11:08

and their videos online of the part of

11:10

the Beginning of the South where Cheeky pulled

11:12

Sicilia up on stage to celebrate her and

11:15

decent silly little bits together. But.

11:17

I would lead to the show and I didn't see that part.

11:19

And I also didn't see the part of the

11:21

So where people in the front row apparently had

11:23

to throw baloney in the queen's broz. But.

11:26

My friend Connor with their and after

11:28

Sicilia died he texted me. Cannot.

11:30

Remember if see through the bologna and abroad or

11:33

is just near the people who dead. I

11:35

would like to think that she dead. And

11:37

ever since then I keep making this little job to

11:40

myself which says. Just as we

11:42

must imagine, sister. Says happy. We

11:44

must imagine Cecilia throwing the baloney

11:46

into the broads at the Olympics

11:48

of Drag. But you

11:50

know what? I. Do. I

11:52

do imagine that and I believe that it

11:55

happened and. It. Brings me a lot

11:57

of peace for some reason. and

11:59

speaking of And anything has brought me more

12:01

peace than a snippet of conversation that I

12:03

heard between Raquel and Cecilia. It

12:05

was also recorded as part of the Afterlife

12:08

podcast and reshared after Cecilia's death. And

12:10

hearing it was the first moment that made me

12:12

feel like, okay, somehow

12:14

all together, we're gonna

12:16

make it through this. So

12:20

I would like to leave you with this clip for now.

12:23

And how do young trans people inspire

12:26

you? I

12:28

live for them. I live for them. I'm

12:31

an elder, I'm an equal. 16

12:35

intentional efforts to look and

12:37

feel young and relevant. I

12:40

am an elder, but you

12:43

may see me dressing like

12:45

a BTS, right? In an

12:47

effort to kind of like

12:49

feel relevant and cool. I

12:53

got to. But

12:55

it is because trans

12:57

kids are so amazing. My

13:00

children are all beautiful. Gogo

13:03

Gras, Gia Love, Rio.

13:08

Those are my kids and they're doing amazing

13:10

things and they're always meeting me. They

13:13

keep me young because they're always pushing

13:15

the envelope. And that's how it's been, right?

13:17

And in the first place, I've

13:20

been getting lately a

13:22

peaceful sense of like, I

13:24

can retire, you know? They're great.

13:27

They got this. They

13:29

should be able to do it. They don't need me.

13:31

So I'm inspired by you,

13:33

I'm inspired by all of them. I

13:36

love it, I love it. This

13:39

has been This Week in

13:42

Gender. That's

13:54

gonna do it for this week's show. We

13:56

will be back next week with another full

13:58

episode. In the meantime. We are

14:01

on Instagram at gender reveal where we have

14:03

a story collection going of different clips and

14:05

photos and tributes to Cecilia. If you are

14:07

familiar with Cecilia and her work, I really

14:09

encourage you to watch those videos and any

14:11

others that you can find, and also to

14:13

check out the many, many, many other interviews

14:15

and stories and books and videos linked in

14:17

the show notes. This

14:20

episode was produced and edited by Azilinas

14:22

Goodman and by me, TechWistar. Special

14:25

thanks to Raquel Willis and Dylan Hoyer

14:27

at Afterlife Podcast for being so, so,

14:29

helpful in letting us choose that table

14:31

of Cecilia. Thank you also to Chiki

14:34

and Sid and Fran and Peppermint and

14:36

everyone else for sharing those beautiful tributes

14:38

to Cecilia publicly. Our

14:40

logo is by IraMly. Our theme

14:42

song is by Breakmaster Cylinder. There's

14:45

additional music this week by our friends at

14:47

Blue Dot Special. We'll be back

14:49

next week with more feelings about

14:51

gender. Free Palestine. Thank

15:03

you.