0:00

There's nothing wrong with your brain or wrong with you.

0:02

Like, this is actually a natural outcome of how society

0:04

has taught you to think. Which is a relief. ["Girly

0:15

Rock"] Hi,

0:21

guys. Hi, guys. Welcome to another episode

0:23

of Girls Gotta Eat. Welcome

0:26

back. Welcome

0:28

back. I was like, what am I? Like,

0:32

even one word. I was like, unfucked. Happy

0:36

Memorial Day, little angels. Happy unofficial

0:38

start of summer. This is why

0:40

I wear these pants. I'm just kidding.

0:43

We shot some content earlier for a thing, and

0:45

I'm still in these. So we are. You want

0:47

to match your phone case? I do. I

0:51

stay on brand. I drove

0:53

in a heel. That is

0:55

a safety concern. The only time I

0:58

drive in a heel is like Pittsburgh.

1:00

It's the only place. When I go home to visit

1:02

my parents. You're always in a heel? Around your parents.

1:06

I like to look sexy for my dad. I

1:08

like to look sexy for your stepdad. I

1:11

know when I'm in Pittsburgh and I'm wearing my little

1:13

panties around, I ran a stepdad. I always wear a

1:15

heel. You guys actually wore the tiniest little pair of

1:17

pajama panties. I didn't mean to. I

1:19

walked downstairs, which I shouldn't have, not my house. It's your

1:21

parents' house. He was making a sandwich, and I was like,

1:24

I'm too sexy for this. She's like, can I help you

1:26

make a sandwich? Why are you

1:28

wearing heels in Pittsburgh? I'm just

1:30

trying to be like the only place I wear heels and then drive

1:32

a car. Because like when

1:34

Rana goes to the hometown bars, she'll try to

1:37

live her Hallmark movie. That's when she wears

1:39

it. Wear them to the toothpick and heel.

1:41

That's when she wears a stiletto. Well,

1:44

what other place should I be driving my own

1:46

car in a heel? Oh, in

1:48

LA where I live? It is

1:50

crazy though. But I'm like,

1:52

have I done this in my life? It's tricky.

1:54

I feel like it's going to slide. My leg starts

1:56

to spasm a little bit. It feels really weird. It

1:58

feels like it shouldn't be legal. Yeah, I

2:01

thought United as l a New York,

2:03

it's fewer speakers. More. Wear high heels

2:05

New cities on drugs. If I were a

2:07

heel to go out I'm going out out

2:09

in which case a my driving to current gone

2:11

up top that against him I go and

2:13

health soft and I got my skinny jeans

2:15

my heels and taken over anklebone. So

2:18

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Yeah. That was on my pussy this morning.

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As you were producing your kid, you were like, oh. You know

6:49

sometimes I say, stop, I'm like, she'll hear it later. What did

6:51

you say? I said, that was on my pussy this morning. While

6:53

you're rubbing it on your back. It

6:55

feels nice. Yeah, it's that pussy juice. We're

6:57

gonna shut up. Have

6:59

you? This

7:03

guy I've been talking to told me to shut up. I was

7:05

like, no one said that to

7:07

me so long. I feel like

7:09

shut up is so underused. Okay,

7:14

but in a funny, cute way. The shut up

7:16

can go two ways. I mean, there's a world

7:18

in which we're over, if you say it in

7:20

the wrong tone. No, no. It

7:22

was right off the middle. I was trying

7:24

to make it, he was like, shut up, you know that's what I did this for.

7:26

Like it really made me laugh and it's

7:29

a funny insult. Oh, I love

7:31

it. People want to tell me to shut up enough.

7:33

And I'm sure a lot of people want to tell

7:35

me to shut up. No, I think it's so funny.

7:37

I'll sometimes just comment that on Instagram. Shut up, Jessica.

7:39

Like this girl was trolling me, I was like, shut

7:41

up, Jessica. Like Britney Schmidt was like, can

7:43

we make shut up, Jessica Mark? So funny.

7:46

Like I think it's just so funny to

7:48

write, like if someone says like an insane

7:50

delusional comment. Like why do we stop saying

7:52

shut up? Well, so when I was a

7:54

kid though, we weren't really allowed to say

7:56

it. No, we had a few things. It

7:58

was a swear word. Jesus Christ. Oh Jesus

8:00

name and name was top. Oh, Jesus don't care about

8:03

that. I know but like we're like He's one of

8:05

us. So we weren't really supposed to say fart What?

8:09

But then they loosened up on that. Who told you that? They

8:11

loosened up on that. I don't know maybe they. Who say? My

8:13

parents. Oh, you know where I was raised? Your father? What'd you

8:15

think I was talking about? Your daddy? I was in

8:17

school. I thought I was teaching. Oh no not in

8:20

school. Oh shut up You weren't really supposed to say

8:22

in school, right? I would have gotten hit in the face So I

8:24

told my mom to shut up. I wouldn't

8:26

have like said to my parents But like I

8:28

just even think Matt we really weren't supposed to

8:30

say shut up But then once you start saying

8:32

it you're like god, it feels so good the

8:34

funniest insult like describing a man It's like he

8:36

looks like he tells his mom to shut up.

8:38

Well, that's Marcello's joke. Oh, is that it? Yeah,

8:40

Marcello Hernandez does a joke that he says I

8:43

look so white. I look like I tell my

8:45

mom to shut up. Okay Raina

8:48

would just rip off a joke and not know sometimes she said

8:51

my jokes and like We

8:53

spent so much time together. I'm like who's bringing

8:55

him up with this? Who's

8:57

cat is this but just Just

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and juicy peach is the flavor of the season So

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you guys are really given all those juicy peach blow

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jobs and we love to see it I feel like

9:17

people forget about Father's Day because like who cares about

9:20

men But like I feel like Mother's Day gets all

9:22

the attention like for Father's Day I don't know you

9:24

buy like dad like brunch buy him get him a

9:26

blowjob Yeah, I'm

9:28

cocking fuck him right fuck

9:30

that guy Fuck your dad.

9:33

Tell your dad to go fuck himself But I

9:35

think that you should get the sucking blow

9:37

gel for your mom if your

9:39

parents are still married Is that what you're saying? Suck

9:42

your dad off Are

9:46

you talking about your real dad? I'm

9:49

talking about like ladies getting up with their

9:51

husbands. You're you you're gonna buy your

9:54

mom who's sucking blow gel for Father's

9:56

Day So your dad can get blow

9:58

jobs That's what you're

10:00

saying to me. Why not? You're

10:03

buying your mom a gift for Father's Day so your

10:05

dad can get a blowjob. I

10:08

thought that's what you were saying. Shut

10:11

up, Marina. Great

10:14

callback. I'm gonna shut up. Okay, couple

10:16

things. We have a big

10:18

announcement next week. We really do. And I know

10:20

a lot of people tease that, but ours is actually big.

10:22

It's big. And things are changing. And

10:25

it's exciting, and you'll find out next week. Yeah. We're

10:28

adding a third co-host. Who

10:30

is it? It's a daddy. No,

10:34

that's not it. It's Jared. Jared's just

10:36

Jared. That's what I'm thinking. I'm

10:38

gonna wish it in Reyna's house. And so get ready, you

10:41

guys. It's gonna feel different next week. And that's all. I

10:43

don't really know what to say much more. And we have

10:45

a little gift for you. Just extra stuff. Yes. That's...

10:49

They're like, is it vibrators? Okay, we

10:51

just got back from New York. What a

10:53

week. Best week of my life. Reyna. What?

10:57

I'm serving this morning. You are

10:59

so horny. I'm so horny. But that's how I

11:01

was that big. No, that's how you got a

11:03

boyfriend. But what is it? I don't know what

11:05

you mean. What's it gonna be? It's gonna be

11:07

me. That

11:10

was so funny. It's spring

11:13

for me. I've been waiting. I mean, hot

11:15

take. Not to really bring

11:17

the mood down, but I've just been on a bit of a dry

11:19

spell. And then I had this thing with my ex

11:21

at the end of the year last year. And I put it to

11:23

bed. Put him to bed. Put

11:26

him to bed. And then

11:28

I was like, I'm gonna get out there in the New York field. He

11:30

killed him. I'm gonna

11:32

put him to bed, you guys. Yeah, he's six

11:34

feet under. Yeah. And then I was

11:36

like, I'm gonna hit dating. And I've just been on all these

11:38

dates and it's just been so brutal. And I was just like,

11:40

fuck this. I hate this. I cannot be bothered with this. And

11:44

then, I don't know, May came around. But

11:46

the UTI came around. It started

11:48

with the way it started strong. You

11:50

never think a UTI is gonna kick off a slutty month. But

11:53

here we are. No,

11:55

it really was like a shock to the system. It was

11:57

like, you're ready to go, sis. Yeah, I had toxic shock,

11:59

sis. It was recurring. Yeah, I had a second one.

12:05

I really feel like I'm living free with your boyfriend. Like

12:07

we were in the car and I was like, we got

12:09

to stop and get like UTI meds like at the airport.

12:11

Like I was like really, and you were like, how long

12:13

has it been going on? I was just feeling like I

12:15

was like, it's burning. Like really, it's

12:17

crazy to be so comfortable with somebody's boyfriend. You're

12:20

telling him about your UTI. We're

12:22

all three on a group chat and we're all

12:24

in the hotel where we stayed in New York.

12:26

He came to New York, I mentioned this before for

12:28

the second half of the week and we were

12:31

all in a group chat about something, plans or whatever.

12:33

And I said, he and I are sending these texts

12:35

from two different toilets. So he was

12:37

pooping in the lobby and I was pooping in the room.

12:39

And again, like I said before, I'm not trying to be

12:41

like a big poop couple, but I mean, we've gone there

12:43

a little bit. It's definitely more on the table. Like we're

12:45

not farting in front of each other, God forbid. But

12:49

you know, it is a little more comfortable. So I

12:51

sent a text and then I was like, if he

12:53

responds, it's going to be very funny because we're sending

12:55

this from two different toilets. Like I'm on the eighth

12:57

floor, he's in the basement, you know, and we're sending

12:59

this to you. And then you were

13:01

like, I pooped so much today. I'm like, we have all gone there.

13:03

I pooped so much. I feel like I can't believe I'm still alive.

13:05

And I was like, as a truffle, we are going there.

13:07

Okay. So that same day,

13:10

I had only, I

13:12

forget why we started talking about it, but I

13:14

was talking to Ryan about something, our video guy. And

13:17

I don't look at each other. I sent

13:19

him a screenshot, something he said to me and it said Ryan L

13:21

and he was like, do you not know my last name? And I

13:23

was like, no, you're saved as Ryan La Cour, but it's

13:25

abbreviates the last name. And he said, your name isn't abbreviated

13:27

on mine. It just says right now. And

13:30

so I was like, everybody in my phone is last name. I didn't

13:32

just add it, whatever. And he goes, I don't believe everybody's in your

13:34

phone's last name. So I screenshot my text

13:36

message screen, the whole thing and

13:38

sent it to him. And

13:40

on that list is the three of us, me, you

13:42

and your boyfriend and a text from the last text

13:45

from me that just says, I pooped

13:47

so much today. I can't

13:49

believe I'm alive. Oh

13:53

my God. And then I blamed it on you.

14:00

I'm calling him right now. I'm gonna

14:03

call him right now. I'm calling him

14:05

right now. This is really happening.

14:08

He goes, who is that? And I was like, I

14:10

don't know. He goes, Ashley? And I was like, we'll

14:13

go with that. We'll call him right

14:15

now. Hi,

14:30

Ryan. Hi,

14:33

how are you? You're live on Girls Gotta Eat.

14:35

We're recording. God dammit.

14:38

Hi, baby. Love you. Did

14:40

Raina... Did you see

14:42

Raina's text and in it it said

14:44

something about pooping and she didn't take

14:47

ownership of it? Yeah,

14:50

I gave her

14:52

the benefit of the doubt and I blamed you. Well,

14:57

we just wanted to call you and tell you live on air that it

14:59

was in fact her. She pooped so much she didn't know how she was

15:01

alive. And that was a text that she sent to me and sparkly eyes.

15:06

And I just want

15:08

to clear things up and set the record straight. I

15:12

am no longer jealous that I'm not in

15:14

a group chat between you and the other

15:16

one. We'll fire it back up. We'll fire

15:19

it back up if you want to be a part of the poop, the rupple. Alright,

15:23

well... I love you. Are you still attracted to

15:25

me? Oh my god. Alright,

15:27

Ryan, we'll talk to you later. We gotta finish this recording.

15:29

And just let someone hear us that video. We'll

15:33

talk after. Alright. Okay,

15:36

love you. Bye. I

15:39

can't keep sub-lapping because I pooped so much today

15:41

I'm not sure how I'm alive. So funny.

15:45

Same hotel was the

15:47

one where I resent

15:49

the voice note to my boyfriend that I originally sent

15:51

to you. It was just such a good rant. I

15:53

wanted him to hear it. And that was the one

15:56

same exact hotel where I was like, I have to

15:58

flush three times to get my poop down. because

16:00

it's one of those deep toilets. Like what is

16:02

going on? It's like the first, how early high

16:04

was that? Like three months into your relationship? It

16:06

was in the fall. So funny. And we like

16:09

started dating in May. But yeah, I mean, something about

16:11

it. Okay, so, anyway, so we had a great time.

16:14

New York, Jesus Christ, what a mind fuck. You

16:16

really go from I hate this

16:18

fucking city to best city in the world. And

16:21

it's not how I take, we lived there for

16:23

six years and I felt this when I lived

16:25

there too. Like the highs and lows are so

16:27

extreme, but I forget sometimes how high and low

16:29

they truly are. How you have these moments of

16:31

like, oh my God, I am just like waiting

16:33

in line for something or something just so annoying

16:35

or some huge crowd. It's just something that's like

16:37

so frustrating. And then like the next minute, you

16:39

know, I'm e-biking along the Hudson, just like wind

16:41

in my hair. Like there's no better city in

16:44

the world. It's just crazy. It is the best

16:46

city in the world. They have another place. There

16:48

isn't another place. It's a better city. It's the

16:50

best. I like it here. I like it here.

16:53

New York is the best city in the world.

16:55

I love it. It beats you down. It beats

16:57

you so far down. I am hanging on by

16:59

a thread, you guys. We spent a week there.

17:01

I went out every night. I've never drank so

17:04

much. I've never eaten so much. I walked seven

17:06

miles a day. We planned every night just like

17:08

comedy show and dinners and parties. And I like, I

17:10

ran into Jared, spent the day with him. Like I'm hanging on

17:12

by a thread. The whole time I was like, I love it

17:14

here so much I have to leave. You

17:17

were just really on one. I really was. Every

17:19

good or bad decision is just a seven

17:21

minute ride away. Like every night you

17:23

leave dinner and you're just like the world's just my oyster.

17:25

I could just walk somewhere in six minutes. I went out

17:27

to dinner with Melanie at like 8 p.m. on

17:30

Sunday night and rolled back in at 2 a.m. We went

17:32

to dinner. I was gonna go to bed at 10 and

17:34

I was like, let's go to a bunch of bars. I

17:36

know. Living free. All right, let's take

17:38

a quick break and then we'll pick this back

17:40

up. So if you are just living

17:42

a crazy life like one might in New York

17:44

or wherever, your sleep is so important. This is

17:46

another thing too. Like you can't just live that

17:48

way and be running around all day if you're

17:50

not getting your sleep. So whatever you need to

17:53

get your sleep hatch is really something that I

17:55

find is such an incredible thing because we all

17:57

have things that get in the way of our

17:59

sleep schedule. or what you do at night

18:01

when you should just be unwinding. And we all have

18:03

nighttime habits. We wish we could kick. I'm gonna talk

18:06

about one of mine after this actually. A little thing

18:08

that happened with me recently with my social media. But

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18:30

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19:59

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20:01

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20:03

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has this story been my whole life? And so

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20:36

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20:38

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That's storyworth.com/GGE to save $10 on

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your first purchase. So back

21:51

to New York. I just, I loved it

21:53

so much. Sometimes I just feel unattractive in

21:55

LA. And boy, let me tell you, I've

21:57

never felt hotter or gotten more attention in

21:59

my life. in New York. It was that

22:01

vacation energy too. You know, you're like, I'm just

22:03

gonna I fuck everybody here. I just, I loved

22:05

it. I remembered loving it again. Great weather. We

22:07

saw Francis Ellis and Jared, knew the great comedy

22:10

show. We recorded with Vinnie from Jersey Shore and

22:12

then he hopped on your show. But yeah, he

22:14

came to a lot of great recordings. So we

22:16

have his episode coming up, Serena Kerrigan's coming up.

22:18

Just really great. Yeah. And I mentioned this before,

22:21

but my boyfriend came in, we celebrated our one

22:23

year anniversary and kind of recreated our first official

22:25

date, which was actually in New York. It was

22:27

a few weeks after what the technical anniversary was,

22:29

but we just had a great time. Like

22:31

we saw Shaboozie, which I mean, I hope you

22:33

guys know Shaboozie, like I'd heard of him. And

22:35

then he had two tracks on the Beyonce cowboy

22:37

Carter album. I'm like, okay, this guy's going to

22:39

blow up. Obviously he's got the Beyonce seal of

22:41

approval. Again, he was an artist and had an

22:43

incredible catalog before that. But, and then the cover

22:45

of Tipsy, a bar song is just the song

22:47

of the summer. I've never loved a song this

22:49

much. And so I just was like, okay, I'm

22:51

going to go a little deeper on this guy

22:53

and his music and just could not love him

22:55

more. So we got to see him at Babies

22:58

All Right in Brooklyn, which is like a 300 person

23:00

venue to see someone. I just know he's

23:02

going to be so big. He already is

23:04

like, and to see them in

23:07

that intimate of a venue, it was incredible. I was

23:09

like, I don't know when anyone would ever get to

23:11

see this guy in a small

23:13

intimate venue like this. And he just couldn't

23:15

have been like more incredible. I loved it

23:17

so, so much. So I just want to hype Shaboozie.

23:20

And I think some of my favorite things about the weekend, like,

23:23

you know, I love the city bike. It's like, what? I'm thinking

23:27

about what you ate this weekend. You guys,

23:29

Ashley had this bag of

23:33

nuts. I've never seen you do anything like this.

23:35

We flew next to each other on planes. And I'm

23:37

sorry, you know, bag of nuts on the plane. And

23:39

then a couple days later, I went to her hotel

23:41

room and there was like no food in the room

23:43

except this bag of nuts right next to her bed.

23:45

Like she's really into these nuts. And I was trying

23:47

to have some. And you're like, that's my special bag

23:49

of nuts. I made this mix myself. And

23:52

you're like, I add macadamia nuts in there. They're

23:54

expensive. Like you can't afford macadamia nuts. Mac nuts

23:57

are so expensive. Like you don't have a huge

23:59

podcast. You're like, I can't afford those nuts. And

24:01

then we went down to WTF

24:03

Studios and you brought your bag

24:05

of nuts to a one hour

24:08

recording. Like it was

24:10

your emotional support nuts. You

24:13

just kept bringing them everywhere. When

24:15

you said it was your emotional support nuts, I

24:18

laughed so hard. I couldn't stop laughing. We were

24:20

recording with Serena and I just kept like giggling, bubbling

24:22

up inside of me. And then we got back to your

24:24

house Monday night in LA and I was like, I'm kind

24:26

of hungry. And you were like, can I interest you in

24:28

some nuts? Would

24:31

you send me another photo of them today? Here's

24:33

the thing. I love to have a healthy

24:35

snack around because it's hard to find a

24:37

healthy snack. And especially in New

24:39

York. So you're running around New York all

24:41

day. You're burning so many more calories, city

24:43

biking, walking, all those steps. And

24:45

then I'm like, what am I gonna eat? And I can't sit for a

24:47

meal. I know I'm going to dinner.

24:49

So I don't want to run into a bodega and get like

24:52

a giant sandwich that's gonna sit in my stomach and I'm gonna

24:54

fall before dinner. I like to roll

24:56

into dinner hungry. So like sometimes I'll just have a snack.

24:58

And I do get really hungry and

25:00

I don't feel good. Like I get hangry.

25:02

Yeah, me too. You were toting

25:04

around that bag of nuts everywhere. Like I said,

25:06

Teddy Bear is crazy. Well, I just like to

25:09

have a snack on hand. I don't do it

25:11

here. You don't. But in New York, you gotta

25:13

be prepared. Cause there isn't 19 stores on every

25:15

block. Rayna, not all nuts are created equal. And

25:17

I am in my Mac Nut era. And so

25:20

I love this trail mix from Whole Foods. And

25:22

then I put Mac nuts in it. And

25:24

I make like a special mix. I

25:26

know you make a special mix. And I like to

25:28

have it in the hotel room. So you have a

25:30

healthy snack. Totally. I've been bringing

25:33

nuts on the road. You have? You

25:35

do to Boston? I don't bring them to like, stay at

25:37

my boyfriend's house. But you just, you bring them

25:39

to New York. To hotels! You are not,

25:42

we're not. I went to West Side Market three times while we were

25:44

in New York. And I didn't have to waste my time doing that.

25:46

Cause I brought my own from home. Well, I walked seven miles a

25:48

day. I'm trying to get those steps in. Cause I wasn't having as

25:50

much sex as you were. Not no

25:52

sex, but less sex than

25:54

you. Yeah, so the walking, the biking, the sex.

25:57

I need those nuts to refuel. I need those

25:59

nuts. these nuts. Anyways,

26:01

I do rail geo, but I just want to talk about your not.

26:03

No, it was like very funny. No, we just had like such a

26:06

fun time. And I have to tell you like one thing we told

26:08

you this in the car together. But we you

26:10

know, we had our we had our year

26:12

and the night before like the year anniversary.

26:14

So I fell asleep. We were like watching the

26:17

Ashley Madison doc, which I loved, by the way, just

26:19

like watching in the hotel room and like, I just

26:21

kind of fell asleep on his shoulder and like, really

26:24

drooled on it like it

26:26

was a huge wet spot. And

26:28

he got up to go to the bathroom and he came back cute, just

26:30

like pointed to it. I was like, Oh, I went 364 days before

26:34

I literally drooled.

26:36

Have you ever drooled on your partner like that?

26:38

Because you drool a lot. I drool a lot.

26:41

Like the pillows are covered. Right. So I don't

26:43

know. I need like a splash guard in the

26:45

pillow. So they probably do that. But I don't

26:47

know about somebody's body. I'm saying

26:49

it's like it's different. Like funny. I was like,

26:52

Oh my god, you but it's funny you waited

26:54

one year. Like where are you going? Well, I

26:56

also just like I fell asleep hard, you know,

26:58

when you're watching something so tired from the day,

27:00

you know, and I think we're just laying on

27:02

him. I don't sleep all night laying on him.

27:05

You know, that's not like my comfort level. Like I

27:07

don't need to be all wrapped around him all like spoon here

27:09

and there. And then we kind of roll away from each other.

27:11

But I was like, Oh my god, I was like, wet.

27:16

It's just it's funny you waited a year because you're

27:18

just like, Where are you gonna go? You're not gonna

27:20

leave me. I didn't plan it like that. I would

27:22

have kept going your mouth did. Yeah. My mouth knew.

27:25

Okay, and the last thing I did want to mention was something

27:28

that happened a few days before we

27:30

left for New York. It was

27:32

May 11. To be exact. I

27:34

remember the date. I got

27:36

locked out of my Instagram account for

27:39

three days and some

27:41

change. And if I tried to

27:43

look at it from another account, it looked like

27:45

not gone, but like blocked almost like just, I don't

27:47

know disabled, like I don't know what happened to

27:49

it. This happened to me so many years ago with

27:51

my other account brosying basic. And so I was trying

27:54

not to panic because I panicked then I was

27:56

like, Oh my god, like all hands on deck. Like

27:58

I've lost my livelihood, you know. And

28:00

I was just like, this is an ideal. And

28:02

I like freaked out a little bit. I texted you. I

28:04

was like, I don't know what's going on. Like, do you

28:06

have any insight? But like, why would you have any more

28:08

insight than I would, whatever. But bottom line, I just like

28:10

couldn't get into it. And I texted some

28:12

friends and the group chat and they were like, well,

28:15

we have contacts there. So I just like didn't feel

28:17

worried. Like I was like, it's fine. But I was

28:19

a little casual about it. I had like an underlying

28:21

feeling of a little bit of panic. I mean, I

28:23

would hate if that was gone. You know, just, oh

28:25

yeah. Following I built, but just all my memories too,

28:27

you know? And so I was trying not to think

28:29

too deeply about it. And I was like, I'm really

28:32

just going to enjoy the break. I really have felt

28:34

like I've spent too much time on social media. I

28:36

don't ever look at my screen time or I don't

28:38

set limits. I just like don't want to know. I

28:40

just actively avoid it. And I was like, I just

28:43

want to see what this feels like. And

28:45

I could not have like loved it more.

28:47

And it was like three full days. And

28:49

then the next morning I finally was able

28:52

to get back into it. And I really

28:54

loved it. I feel like a three day

28:56

detox really did something for me personally. And

28:59

in that time I set up limits for it.

29:01

And so I have a 90 minute

29:04

max on Instagram and TikTok. I mean, that's my social

29:06

time limit. And I've adhered to it and like it

29:08

tells you, I really, I didn't, I had never done

29:10

this before. So it warned you when you're almost up

29:12

and then the icon on your phone goes dark and

29:14

it has a little hourglass next to it. That's like

29:17

your time limit has been reached. And when you try

29:19

to lock this, it's not a hot take if you

29:21

have these, but you try to lock in and it

29:23

tells you like your limits up. Do you want to

29:25

bypass it? And

29:27

I'll decide to or not. There's something

29:29

I need to do on it. I'll do it. But

29:32

I just feel differently. I feel like

29:34

a lot of the content obviously this is

29:36

not a hot take. It's just kind of

29:38

meant to inflame you and upset

29:40

you. Not to mention like the things people say, but

29:42

more so just like once you really take a little,

29:44

I'm not trying to sound so profound. I took three

29:47

days off, but when you go back in, you're kind

29:49

of like, God, like everything really does feel like it's

29:51

clickbait. It's meant to divide people and rile them up.

29:53

And of course I can really just mute

29:56

and unfollow and tailor

29:58

my feed, but I just think a lot of what

30:00

we. see on social media can be toxic. And

30:02

of course, I want to stay informed. And it's such

30:04

a luxury to have and all the things we

30:06

use it for, we need it for our job. Like,

30:08

I'm not shitting all over it. But I think

30:10

I just personally needed to be on it less. And

30:13

I was able to accomplish that in a

30:15

three day detox, I guess, not self imposed,

30:17

but I just kind of had to and

30:19

I decided to like enjoy it and

30:22

use it to my benefit instead of like spiraling about

30:24

it. And I've been on Girls Got Eat a little

30:26

bit in vibes only. But like for me personally, I

30:28

was just like, I want to change my habits

30:30

with this. You scroll a lot and

30:32

late at night too. Yeah, listen, I say this is somebody

30:34

who's just as addicted as anybody else. But like, you said

30:36

to me the other day, like you paid attention to this

30:39

documentary more than you ever normally would because you're like, usually

30:41

I'm just scrolling when I'm like doing stuff. You know me,

30:43

at least I do take a walk every day on my

30:45

phone and I put it down when I'm like at dinner,

30:47

like you won't hear from me. But like, I do think

30:50

that nobody loves to be in the loop and be informed

30:52

as much as you. Yeah. And so you are just like

30:54

always on to late at night you scroll until like to

30:56

set those timer as much feel really good. I mean, you

30:58

can still scroll at night and go to sleep. I can't

31:01

so like it's not good quality sleep. It sucks. You know

31:03

what I mean? Like it still affects me. I can't look at

31:05

my phone after 10. If I look at it like it's so

31:07

crazy. If I glance at it, I'll never go to sleep again.

31:09

Right. So if I just if I look at it at all,

31:11

so I've had to like put it away. But yeah, you will

31:13

scroll and you'll send me a list. I always wake up to

31:15

funny stuff. I did wake up to a cute thing from uni

31:17

deck. Yeah. So I miss it a little bit. But yeah, you

31:19

scroll a lot and late at night and like it's nice to

31:21

just take a little break, correct the behavior. And then just what

31:24

you're consuming. Again, it's good to stay informed. I'm

31:26

not trying to bury my head in the sand.

31:28

Like don't get a twisted guy. I want to

31:31

still be impactful and speak out about things and

31:33

whatnot. That's not it. But like, sometimes like I

31:35

didn't need to see that headline that doesn't really

31:37

impact me. And now in the comments section, just

31:39

for entertainment value, just kind of soaking all this

31:41

up, like for what you know, I'm really trying

31:43

to filter what goes in and out of my

31:45

brain, and just be more present too. And I

31:48

don't feel the need to look at my Instagram

31:50

at a stoplight or look at it during dinner.

31:52

And I just want to be more present. And

31:54

Again, like I Know people have different things that they

31:56

do like I Know some people just take the app

31:58

off their phone for extended. The time like

32:00

we still need use it for work. I'm not

32:03

really going to do that, but for me, at

32:05

least those three days and then now the time

32:07

limit has helped And so that's all I can

32:09

really offer. others a different. Thing. I

32:11

just I thought you were more present. Yeah you know

32:13

and I do. Zola I sat with me I'm from

32:15

him. Although is that

32:17

those three days nearly can you please fixes? I'm

32:20

like I'm trying but I'm kind of like I'm

32:22

not sure that heart you know that I can't

32:24

believe I'm and adroitness What has happened as you

32:26

may at night like right where we want to

32:28

sleep you said like a high kick it into

32:31

my instagram whatever and eyesight knew you couldn't get

32:33

an and and your last text me Owsley but

32:35

you said you'd had sort of like an argument

32:37

with the guy next door and he I woke

32:39

up and I read those two things I knew

32:42

you were like find it is, answer him down

32:44

and whatever I needed that you've had some. Arguments

32:46

like I before so it's like not

32:48

special my name on there. And

32:50

it's his fault. but it soon as I woke

32:52

up in the morning I got a text from

32:54

your boyfriend and fertilizers like see her from actually

32:56

did I and I was like now and he's

32:58

like her and surround sound and I was like

33:01

aura that sign that does not saying it's a

33:03

we know about this for or on it as

33:05

a family rawness and he is like I usually

33:07

hear from her by now and I'm like oh

33:09

my god old tech the Gotham rules like I

33:11

had a fight with his ma'am last night and

33:13

I'm like I'm sure it's fine and nicer to

33:15

have some sort of like spiraling a little back

33:17

as he's like I usually hear from her by

33:19

eight my was like your new around. Here and

33:21

as least the sleeve lot later and I was

33:23

just like spiraling like issue okay what happens had

33:25

to park has ah my salsa what's going to

33:27

have either of the i will drive over there

33:29

if I did not hear from her until tonight

33:31

as yours like cia with Saab you don't respond

33:33

of like i'm worried about you not say it

33:35

was nine forty seven I walked downstairs around mccarthyism

33:38

like I'm going over there and he's like I

33:40

just heard from her. Oh

33:42

My. God. I started really

33:44

scared. to death is like used

33:46

to me whole thing about your neighbor and i

33:48

was like auto now i know people do yeah

33:51

and so funny that he was like her instagram

33:53

sounds hearing from her and i didn't want it

33:55

i don't scare him and be like skills of

33:57

an altercation with another man let's not any I

34:00

know. And I've never talked to this with my

34:02

neighbor like this being corrected, but the neighbors

34:04

have like insane dogs. No, they're insane. No,

34:06

it's like, it's not. It's been I've

34:09

been as kind as possible and I've

34:11

not been reciprocated with kindness back. I've

34:13

been yelled at and it's been a

34:16

little unnerving and now my landlord's on top of it and

34:18

we're working through it and I've seen the life the end

34:20

of the tunnel and whatever. So I think what's fine. But

34:22

yeah, I woke up and I had so many texts from

34:24

you guys. And I usually see a little

34:26

later on the weekends. It was like a Sunday morning, but

34:28

I had got him get in my head. Like I haven't

34:30

known you so long. And I was like, she used to

34:32

sleep in later. He usually does hear

34:34

from me by like nine 30. So yes, I can

34:36

understand why 10 a.m. was the cutoff of like, I'm

34:38

going over. I was like, I'm going to go over there. Don't

34:40

worry. I don't want to get a key to

34:42

your house. I should get that. Oh

34:45

yeah. Everybody has a key to my

34:47

house. There's so many keys floating around. Yeah. You Tessa,

34:49

I literally everybody. But I'm okay. And

34:51

I feel good about it. And if

34:54

you feel like you are scrolling too much

34:56

and it's impacting your mental health in any

34:58

way, figure out how to take a break

35:00

or try those limits. And you know, it's

35:02

funny because I refuse to look at that

35:04

information. That's a little sick. Like I was

35:06

like, I never want to know how much

35:08

time I'm spending on it. Like, is

35:11

that kind of weird? Sick. You don't get that text

35:13

message on Sunday mornings that says what your screen? No,

35:15

I've never looked at it. I never ran it. Like

35:17

I feel like I have almost I didn't want to

35:20

know. And it's like a thing you don't want to look.

35:22

And now I've like seen the light and I'm like, I am

35:24

proud that I'm cutting myself off at 90 minutes a day. And

35:26

keep in mind, a lot of that is work stuff we got

35:28

to do. I mean, I think there's just so many people that

35:30

need to hear from us. Like I actually feel guilty when I

35:33

take an hour. Like I do. I take like an hour, I

35:35

take a walk, I just, or if I bring it, I'll listen

35:37

to my music and I'll just turn on do not disturb. Like

35:39

I do not respond. Nobody will hear from me if I go

35:41

to dinner or a date. Like you don't really hear from me,

35:43

but like I do feel kind of bags. Like people need to

35:46

hear from us. Yeah. Also, there's gossip in the world to know

35:48

about. Yeah, of course. We got to stay up to date on

35:50

stuff too. Like I don't want to be so removed.

35:52

And again, I don't want to like ignore the important

35:54

news things going on in the world, but I got

35:56

to filter better. Yeah. Like how would I know what

35:58

all the Vanderpump people are doing? Right, if it

36:01

was on Instagram. I know. Okay. We hope you

36:03

guys had a great Memorial Day weekend and we

36:05

are going to get into an amazing interview and

36:07

then big announcement next week, but we're just going

36:09

to thank some of our partners and then we'll

36:12

jump into it with Cara. Okay. I am telling

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that we sent you. Okay, let's get

39:46

into it. All right guys, we are

39:48

really excited to welcome our guest to

39:50

the show today. She is a master

39:53

certified life coach, founder of the School

39:55

of New Feminist Thought and host of the

39:57

top ranked podcast that we've been on. Unlock your

39:59

brain. feminist self-help for everyone with over

40:01

50 million downloads, her first book

40:04

Tape Back Your Brain, How a Sexist

40:06

Society Gets in Your Head, and How

40:08

to Get It Out is out now.

40:10

Please welcome to the show Cara Lowensile.

40:14

Cara Lowensile,

40:16

you're so

40:18

good. I'm here to solve this.

40:20

You were doing it right and you dated

40:23

yourself anyway. That is the

40:25

socialization right there. That was

40:28

it. I knew it. I knew it. I'm like

40:30

everyone's counting on you. We're all rooting for you.

40:33

That was like the exact thing I teach

40:35

and talk about. That women are doing things

40:37

right and they always think they're doing them

40:39

wrong. Well, I introduce every guest every week

40:41

for six and a half years. It's Cara

40:43

Lowensile. That's right. Like the Nile. Exactly. Thank

40:45

you for being here. Thank you for having me.

40:47

We're so excited to have you. We did your

40:50

podcast and it was just the best conversation. Thank

40:52

you. I really was like going into it like

40:54

we need to be on our game. Cara's

40:56

like really smart and legit. The good news for you

41:00

is I'm on Eastern Time, so I got like

41:02

five hours of sleep, so we can dumb it

41:04

down. Yeah. So this is the earliest we've ever recorded

41:06

with somebody nine in the morning. We're excited to

41:08

do that. I'm very honored. I feel ready to

41:10

do it. Are you a morning person? I didn't

41:13

used to be and my identity hasn't caught up

41:15

with my hormonal middle age reality, I feel like,

41:17

because now my body does like to wake up

41:19

at 6.30. Really? Think of myself

41:21

as somebody who wants to get up at 6.30.

41:23

Okay. So I guess yes, but I like can't embrace

41:26

it. I'm not one of the people like, yes, I've

41:28

run a 5K and then I meditate for an hour

41:30

and then I drink green tea. I know why I

41:32

feel like that's in LA. That seems like an LA

41:34

vibe. A little plunge. Yeah. But like, come on, you're

41:36

not going to take a cold shower. Not in New York. I

41:38

have to admit in the morning. Okay. I

41:41

mean, it's so good for you. It helps with like

41:43

dopamine regulation somehow. I can focus better during the day.

41:45

Yeah. I would never take a cold plunge. That seems

41:47

terrifying. I just take a hot shower and I put

41:49

on cold for a minute. Like this is not,

41:51

okay. Not a nice bath situation. Yeah. Attainable. And

41:53

so you live in New York. I

41:56

live in Brooklyn. Also adjusting to. Well,

41:58

let's like catch up on you because you, you in the

42:00

book talking about, I mean, you're incredibly accomplished and like

42:02

the self-talk you had and where you ended up today

42:04

and maybe we can just like catch up the audience

42:06

on who you are. Yeah, what am I

42:08

doing here? How did I get here? I just wandered in off

42:11

the street. It felt like that happens. So

42:13

I grew up on a very like traditional

42:15

academic career path. I think we talked about

42:17

I went to Yale, I went to Harvard

42:19

Law School, I clerked for a judge. I

42:21

was sort of just doing this very like mainstream prestigious

42:24

career path and being very invested

42:26

in that. I was like a big

42:28

part of my self-confidence, such as it was.

42:30

And my identity was like, you know,

42:32

not just being smart, but like having a

42:34

job that signaled like intellectual prestige to the

42:36

rest of the world. That was something I was

42:38

really raised to value. And

42:42

I then, you know, decided to quit and become a life

42:44

coach on the internet instead. And that was for real. That

42:46

took a lot of thought work. Well,

42:48

okay. But like, I like that

42:50

you opened it with like, hey, like Harvard, Yale,

42:52

because there's a blue right past that double Ivy

42:55

League. There's a lot of life coaches out there

42:57

that are just it's true. It's shocking news, but

42:59

we didn't all go to Harvard and Yale. That is true. But

43:02

some of them are just yoga teachers. I

43:05

don't want to be insulting, but that word gets thrown around.

43:07

So much hate mail from the yoga teachers. Like now, look

43:09

what we've got. The meanest people on the internet, I go

43:11

to their, they're like, you're fat and ugly. I go to

43:13

their profiles. The yoga loving life. Yeah, of course.

43:16

It's always loving life. Yeah. Anyways,

43:18

we love our yogis. We love all of them. Yeah,

43:20

I couldn't live without yoga. But some of you are

43:22

really mean. But

43:26

I, that work is thrown around.

43:28

I mean, is there an actual

43:30

certification? Like any newer industry

43:32

or field, it's not currently all that

43:34

regulated. I mean, I will say that

43:37

was also the case with psychology 100 or

43:39

120 years ago. Right. So

43:42

it's like, we sort of think that whatever time we're

43:44

existing in, anything that seems like mainstream

43:46

or credentialed, we're like, okay, that's like

43:48

a very objective, real science. But you

43:50

know, 100, 150 years ago, people who

43:52

were totally in psychology, people were like,

43:55

what are they talking about? Yeah, I mean, you're unconscious.

43:57

What a weird wacko thing to talk about. I'm

44:00

a certified master coach through the Life

44:02

Coach School, which is where I got

44:04

certified. There are many different, you know,

44:06

I really think of like coaching therapy, even

44:08

like spiritual leaders advice. It's like a big

44:10

Zen diagram, right? And it's sort of like

44:13

in all of these areas, there are people

44:15

who are really good at what they do

44:17

or really bad, you know, they're like great

44:19

coaches and great therapists and terrible coaches and

44:21

terrible therapists. And we have had

44:23

a lot of different roles for people in

44:25

society that were essentially the role of just

44:27

like trying to help humans, human better and

44:30

like make sense of the world. Okay. So

44:33

like religious leaders, shamans, villagers, coaches, therapists,

44:35

I feel like these people are all

44:37

part philosophers, part of the same tradition. And

44:39

also they're great yoga teachers. Yeah, we don't want to

44:41

don't come for us. We don't want to tell the

44:44

yoga from you. We don't want to tell the community.

44:47

I just can't show up to you. I just don't want to

44:49

show up to yoga and get like a stick on. Again,

44:51

it's a spectrum. There's certification programs, but it's not nationally

44:53

regulated by a board the way that there's a board

44:55

of psychology, which I learned a lot about when I was

44:58

researching sexual health. Yeah. Okay.

45:02

Okay. So you had like a crisis and

45:04

of like, what am I doing with my life? And you pivoted. Yeah,

45:06

I think it was my parents. I'm sure thought it was like some kind

45:09

of quarter life crisis. I think for me, it

45:11

was more that I had been, I don't call myself

45:13

a seeker because that always sounds like spiritual and woo

45:15

in a way I really wasn't. But like

45:17

when I was 16, I told my parents I wanted to go to therapy.

45:19

I was the first person in my family to go to therapy. I was

45:21

just like, I've always just, I think been like,

45:23

there's gotta be a better way to do

45:26

this, to be a human than most people

45:28

seem to know. Like most people seem pretty

45:31

reactive and unhappy and like, there's gotta

45:33

be a better way. So

45:35

I was like, went to therapy for a long time. I got into

45:37

yoga and all the things did meditate. I'm gonna take it. You go,

45:39

you know, listen, I'm out.

45:41

So I'm out for me. I'm out the

45:43

yoga game. No, I still, I still like

45:45

yoga, but I sort of did all those things. It's almost

45:48

sort of like the young mainstream women starter pack of

45:50

trying to find meaning or trying to fix yourself.

45:52

And I found coaching and the coaching style that

45:54

I learned from my teacher, which is the base of

45:56

my work. So it wasn't exactly a crisis, but

45:58

I think it just made such a big difference. in my life.

46:01

I had always felt about law that even though I was

46:04

pretty good at it, I wasn't bringing some

46:06

unique genius to that that nobody else would

46:08

bring. I was an academic, so in some way, yes, I

46:10

have different ideas than the next person would have who had

46:13

my position, but it just didn't feel like my unique kind

46:15

of zone of genius, even though I hate that word, because

46:17

that's such a... No, I love that. I actually love

46:19

that framing. But coaching did. I felt

46:21

like I saw this gap in coaching that

46:24

people were not talking about the influence

46:26

of society on women's brains, and I

46:28

was like, that is something

46:31

unique that I can offer the world that if I don't

46:33

do that, it doesn't seem like somebody else is doing

46:35

it. So I felt like that was more what pushed me

46:37

over the edge. And

46:39

something you wrote about in the intro of the book that

46:41

really resonated with me is you said, even in my coaching business,

46:43

I had all these women coming to me. They were successful

46:45

and beautiful and amazing, and they checked all these boxes, and they

46:47

hate themselves. And I couldn't really understand why,

46:49

and it sounded like you had some of that self-talk too,

46:52

of like, I went to Harvard Law.

46:54

I'm successful. I did all the things you're

46:56

supposed to do. I still don't like certain

46:58

things on myself. Why can't I just relax?

47:01

I also just like, and we'll talk about the

47:03

brain gap, but I think we all get in

47:05

this space where we're like,

47:07

I wish I could just unfuck my brain.

47:10

Just turn it off. Just turn it off.

47:12

I consider myself a pretty happy, stable,

47:14

healthy person. And day to day,

47:16

I'm just raw dog and no meds, living life.

47:18

And I still get in this place where I'm

47:20

like, I just... Why am

47:23

I doing this? Why

47:25

are these thoughts coming to my head? Like last night,

47:27

I was just packing, and you're like, your mind's working.

47:29

You're like, why is it bad things? What can

47:32

I do to think good things while I'm mindlessly doing

47:34

a thing? Why can't the vacuum in my mind be

47:36

filled with fun and thinking? Yeah. It's

47:38

not so interesting. I pack, and the whole time I go, that's not

47:40

going to fit you. That's not going to look good on you. That

47:42

used to fit better. And why can't I just be proud that I

47:44

can afford this trip to New York, and I'm both my best friend

47:46

and I have great stuff planned? I

47:48

was like, okay, I actually took a moment with bad

47:51

thoughts to hold and try to get some good points

47:53

in. I don't know what I was thinking about. Like

47:56

the sex I'm going to have this weekend. I'm like, I'm just

47:58

trying to put good stuff in. I'm literally

48:00

on the good list at least. You're gonna knock on all

48:02

the bad ones. Can you imagine? This is a negative. So

48:04

yeah, so what is the brain gap? Yeah, I

48:06

think what you're describing is super common and I

48:09

was at my San Francisco book tour party last

48:11

night and my friend who's a mindfulness influence therapist

48:13

was doing it with me and she said that

48:15

her teacher taught her this phrase that I now

48:17

love that was the mind is shameless, it will

48:19

think anything. It's like your

48:21

brain is not sort of

48:23

just delivering an important update about

48:25

reality to you which is sort of how

48:28

it feels. Your brain is just regurgitating like

48:30

a record that's been left on that no

48:32

one's attending. It's just sort of replaying just

48:34

stuff you've been taught to think and things

48:36

you heard your parents say and what do

48:38

you absorb from society and what does the

48:40

media say about what, it's all going in

48:42

there and then it's just playing on repeat

48:44

and so it's like your brain impores a

48:46

vacuum, you're just trying to pack and your

48:48

brain's like, but women get older

48:50

and then they lose their sex appeal. And also you're

48:52

probably stupider than you think. That's what's happening, right?

48:54

If there's this thing someone said to you on the

48:57

internet, here's something someone said to you when you were 13 and

48:59

I've been turning that over since and I was like

49:01

chat about it with you right now. That's what your

49:04

brain is like. And

49:06

because we don't know about our brains, we're like I guess that

49:08

is really important what that person said when I was 13 and

49:10

I should think about it. But actually your brain

49:13

is just sort of regurgitating all the time,

49:15

it's sort of like turning and spinning and it

49:17

doesn't really mean anything. And so the brain gap that

49:19

I talk about in the book is

49:21

this gap between exactly what we're describing, how we want

49:23

to think and feel, I want to

49:25

feel proud that I'm going to New York, that I made the

49:28

money to afford this trip and I'm going with my best friend,

49:30

that I'm gonna have good sex later, that all right, that's how

49:32

I want to feel. And then when I look at my life,

49:34

it seems like those thoughts should be natural. But

49:36

actually what my brain is saying is like, oh, I can't

49:38

believe you gained two pounds, now that skirt doesn't fit.

49:41

And what about that person who thought your thighs

49:43

were lumpy? Right, that's that gap.

49:45

And I think that women really haven't had a

49:47

way to close that because apparently because the way

49:49

we frame it I think is not helpful in

49:51

that we just naturally say, well, you

49:54

know, I want to think this, but I feel

49:56

this way. And when we talk about it as

49:58

a conflict between a thought and a... feeling, we

50:01

don't know how to solve that. What are you supposed to do about that? But

50:04

actually those are just two different thought patterns. One

50:06

thought pattern is like those tracks were laid

50:09

down and recorded in the studio very early

50:11

on. Since you are a baby you've

50:13

been absorbing what society values

50:15

about women. How does society talk about women? How

50:17

did you hear the women in your life talk about

50:19

themselves or their lives or their bodies? That

50:21

stuff gets absorbed so early and it really

50:23

imprints in your brain. And then

50:26

as you get older you start trying to like

50:28

layer on more positive thoughts like now.

50:31

But that original track is still in there and

50:33

so the gap between those things is why you're

50:35

like ping-ponging. And so what I really

50:37

try to teach in the book is the only way

50:39

to close that brain gap is to bring them together

50:41

by consciously rewiring

50:44

your brain to think the way you want to. But you

50:46

have to go step by step. You can't just be like

50:48

I don't like those old bad thoughts let me try to

50:50

get rid of them. Like what you're you know you're trying

50:52

to like just bring in the positive and ignore those. I will

50:55

not think them. Yeah that doesn't work.

50:57

You can't like tell your brain to

50:59

stop thinking something. What you have to

51:01

do is practice thinking something new and

51:03

generally we try to jump to something too positive and

51:05

then we don't believe it. Okay. So that's why

51:07

positive thinking and affirmations don't really work and that's

51:09

why this the technique of trying to just like

51:12

focus on the positive often doesn't

51:14

work. Okay. Because it's sort of not speaking

51:16

to those original thoughts. It's not like mollifying

51:18

those concerns kind of. So if your brain

51:20

thinks it's spotted a danger which for women

51:22

is like you look like you're aging someone

51:24

might not like how you look or even

51:26

someone might think you're stupid like our brains

51:28

associate that with danger being rejected not being

51:30

worthy not being valuable. Your brain's gonna keep

51:32

alerting you. It's like hey I'm found a

51:34

danger that we need to pay attention to.

51:36

So it doesn't work just be like don't worry

51:39

everything's fine because your brains like no something's gonna

51:41

eat us we're gonna die I'm not gonna just

51:43

ignore it. Yeah. You have to practice thinking something

51:45

that bridges that on purpose rather than just trying

51:47

to like focus on the positive. That makes sense

51:49

right? So for instance at this house it used to look

51:52

better. Okay. Yeah. You're gonna take that example. Like this outfit

51:54

used to look better. You know. Your

51:56

brain is telling you that because your brains been programmed

51:58

to believe that a woman's a peer. determines

52:00

her value. And so if

52:02

something has changed, quote unquote, negatively about

52:04

your appearance, because we've also been socialized to believe

52:07

a woman has to be as thin as possible, and that's how

52:09

she'll be beautiful, and that's how she'll have power and acceptance. So

52:12

your brain associates any kind of weight gain

52:14

or body change that would change your skirt

52:16

size or make it look different on you

52:18

with a danger. So your brain is not

52:20

to stop thinking about it, and you can't just tell it to stop. But

52:23

what you can do is try to practice a thought like, even

52:26

people who wear whatever size this is

52:28

can be attractive. Or it's possible

52:30

for me to still be attractive, even

52:33

though the skirt fits differently now. These

52:36

don't sound like inspiring thoughts. Like you wouldn't

52:38

put that on a Pinterest graphic. Like, it's

52:40

possible I can still be attractive when I'm

52:42

bloated. But they actually

52:44

work because you get a little bit of relief

52:46

when you think them in your body. And

52:48

that little bit of payoff, that emotional payoff, that's

52:51

what encourages your brain to keep doing this work.

52:54

And that's what will actually move you towards a new

52:56

thought pattern. Well, it feels like any resolution, right? We

52:58

can't start with these giant goals of, I guess we're

53:00

talking about weight. But I will lose weight. That feels

53:02

like that feels too big. I'm going to go in

53:04

this gym and deadlift 400 pounds. You've

53:07

got to start with, maybe I'm going to go to

53:09

the gym and lift five pounds and see what happens.

53:11

It's not measurable. It's not sustainable. So

53:13

to do these tiny little shifts, I think,

53:15

are really always very helpful. Yeah, and people

53:17

think that positive thinking didn't work for them.

53:20

And it's because your brain has no incentive

53:22

to try to keep practicing something it doesn't

53:24

believe. I mean, I can say anything in my brain

53:26

to myself. I can say the lizard people built the

53:28

pyramid. I can say that thought. I

53:31

have no emotional connection to it. It's not

53:33

doing anything. So my brain's not going to

53:35

keep thinking it. There's no intrinsic motivation

53:37

to keep practicing it. Whereas if you

53:39

think a thought and you feel a

53:41

little bit better, now your brain is

53:43

willing to keep doing that. And then you build from

53:46

there. That doesn't mean you have to stay forever at.

53:49

A lot of these thoughts, I think sometimes people feel

53:51

like some of these, I call them ladder thoughts in

53:53

the book. They can even sound like unfeminists, because it's

53:55

sort of like you're accepting that

53:57

it matters if you look a certain way

53:59

or that like. You're saying being bloated is bad

54:01

or whatever. But it's really just, we're just trying

54:03

to meet your brain where it is and help

54:05

it move a little bit, right? It really bothers

54:07

me. I've been talking about this, like, we're

54:10

gonna just stop pretending that this stuff doesn't matter.

54:12

It wasn't ingrained in us for decades. I'm just

54:14

supposed to wake up one day and have no

54:16

attachment to the way that I look. And

54:19

I don't tie every single piece of my

54:21

confidence and self-worth to how I look, but

54:23

I was trained my whole life to hate

54:25

how I look. So it takes work every

54:27

day. And I think the body positivity movement

54:29

is beautiful, but to completely erase

54:31

the idea that this matters to women

54:33

and has always, and it matters to

54:35

men. So I think it's

54:37

unfair to put that on women and say, well,

54:40

we're not supposed to care about this anymore, because

54:42

everybody deeply cares. And women enforce it on themselves.

54:44

I mean, part of the way we're socialized is to

54:46

always believe we're doing everything wrong. So I'll be coaching people and

54:48

they'll be like, well, I have this thought pattern. I'm

54:51

upset that I see a new wrinkle. But

54:53

then I also start criticizing myself that I

54:55

shouldn't be upset about that or I'm supposed to be a feminist.

54:57

I'm supposed to not care about this. I'm supposed to be more evolved about

54:59

this. So it just, I mean, anything can

55:01

become a thing that a woman will use to

55:03

police herself with if that's her

55:05

relationship with herself. And the only thing we can

55:07

do in the moment, I think

55:09

now, is obviously we want society to change,

55:11

but we have to start by changing our

55:13

relationship with ourselves so that we are not

55:16

constantly policing ourselves to check and make sure

55:18

that we know everything we're doing wrong all the

55:20

time. Yeah, I also, I don't know how much you kind

55:22

of use other people as

55:24

examples in the meeting your brain where it's that

55:26

kind of thing. Like you said, even people who

55:28

are this size are beautiful, like something like that.

55:30

Like sometimes I find those things help and we

55:32

say this a lot when it comes to dating.

55:35

It can come across as negative, but sometimes you

55:37

have to remind yourself that like even all these

55:39

couples who look so happy on Instagram have problems.

55:41

So it's not always how it seems. That sounds

55:43

almost negative, but it is kind of like the

55:45

reality. Because I think you can get

55:47

tripped up with like, we've talked about this before, like everybody's

55:49

in a relationship and everybody's so happy and everybody's doing so

55:51

great. And it's like, that's not true. One of

55:54

the best thoughts I ever used for my body image

55:56

work, which was for me very connected to dating,

55:58

was all being suffer. Like

56:00

I would just walk around New York and there would

56:02

be like a woman who looked like a probably was

56:04

a runway model crying on the street having a

56:06

fight with her boyfriend because it's New York and no one has any

56:09

privacy. And I would just be like all

56:11

beings suffer. And like I really had to retrain my brain

56:13

because I talk about this in a book in

56:15

the context of the four traps of romantic

56:17

socialization around love life stuff. But one of

56:19

them is magical thinking, which I'm gonna explain,

56:21

but it actually applies to any area of

56:23

your life that women are socialized around. You're

56:26

socialized to believe that if you can just

56:28

conform to a social standard or

56:30

expectation well enough, you

56:32

are going to reach this magical blessed land where

56:34

you then like never feel bad about yourself and

56:36

everyone loves you and approves of you all the

56:38

time. You don't ever feel rejected or lonely. And

56:41

like getting married is one of those. Having kids is one

56:43

of those. Looking a certain way is one of those. And

56:46

that's the magical thinking. So I think what you're

56:48

describing is actually I get why people think it

56:50

sounds negative, but it's not like, I

56:53

hope that couple's not happy. It's like, right. It's

56:55

like reality check. This is the

56:57

human experience. It's positive and negative no

57:00

matter what, whether there's another person in your bed or not,

57:02

whether there's a ring on your finger or not, you have

57:04

kids, you're a size two, you're a size 22 or 32.

57:08

That's the human experience. Some of it's gonna feel good. Some

57:10

of it's gonna feel bad. And you can't get out of

57:12

that by achieving some kind of

57:15

socially sanctioned milestone. Yeah.

57:17

We talked about on your podcast because I had talked openly

57:19

about how I was like struggling with turning 40 and

57:22

I had a friend recent. This was recent. I

57:25

was like, I'm not wearing that with her and she

57:27

was, she's coming up on it. And you know, it's

57:29

a newer friend and she was just like, oh my

57:31

God, no idea. You felt that way. And I'm like,

57:33

yeah. And I almost think it provided her a sense

57:35

of relief. Like, of course I wanted to be out

57:37

here. Like I can't wait. I'm so excited. 40s icon,

57:39

but like I struggled with it up until like 40

57:42

Eve, you know? So I think it was helpful

57:44

to hear that no one's out here just all

57:46

the time, the living life perfectly

57:49

and happily. I'm constantly talking

57:51

about how getting engaged was like one of

57:53

the worst experiences in my life. I mean, I was like, I,

57:55

we talked about this on the podcast. Yeah. Like, you know, I

57:57

dating was an area I did a lot of work on and.

58:00

I really tried. I think I made a lot of

58:02

progress on like, divesting from that belief that

58:04

I needed that for validation and social validation to

58:06

feel good about myself. And I probably,

58:08

I think I got 80% of the way there, but I

58:11

still had 20% of thinking like, I'm gonna

58:13

feel different when this happens. And like, here's all

58:15

that's different. I'm no longer preoccupied with trying to

58:17

find someone. I'm now preoccupied with all of my

58:19

thoughts about him. It's not, it's just I have

58:21

a human brain. I love this conversation so much.

58:23

How many people do we know that are so

58:25

beautiful and their bodies are incredible and they fucking

58:27

hate themselves and they think about it constantly? I

58:30

know so many people that are married and they

58:32

have tremendous infidelity issues, gambling problems,

58:34

drug addiction, alcohol addiction with their partner.

58:36

They don't feel prioritized the way their

58:38

partner talks to them like getting married

58:40

is not the golden ticket, achieving a

58:42

certain number on a scale is not

58:44

the golden ticket. And I like talking

58:46

about that and realizing like, no one

58:48

is like, I'm good now. You

58:51

can't hate yourself into a feeling you want. People

58:53

want to like hate dating and then love being

58:55

in a relationship. Like that's not how that works.

58:57

You can't fuel yourself to go to the gym with

59:00

self hatred and then expect that like, if you hit

59:02

a certain physical milestone, you're gonna look in the

59:04

mirror and be like, now I feel amazing about myself.

59:06

Your brain is not technically a muscle obviously, but you

59:08

can think about it as a muscle in the sense

59:10

of you've been practicing a certain way of talking to

59:13

yourself. Of like, you know, dating is the

59:15

worst and men are horrible and they don't blah, blah, blah.

59:17

And then you're like, I want to use that brain to

59:19

find a good relationship and feel good about the person in

59:22

it. Wow. Wow. I

59:24

mean, this kind of goes to an article we read

59:26

recently and we want to do a whole episode on

59:28

it of like, why does dating suck? Why

59:30

is it so negative? Why is it just the

59:33

landscape so bad and that's the way everybody speaks

59:35

about it? And you have to view it as

59:37

a journey. Like instead of dog

59:39

shit until the person comes along. You

59:41

have to think, okay, but if I

59:43

go on eight bad

59:45

dates, they led me to the ninth person,

59:48

which is a great person. What's a dating

59:50

is just meeting people. A lot of people

59:52

you won't like or you rank

59:54

it along with, or they'll be annoying or they'll

59:56

whatever. Like, I mean, if you had to go

59:58

on 10 friend dates. You also probably

1:00:00

wouldn't like nine of them. And you're

1:00:03

like, one of them would be flaky. Or one of them

1:00:05

would lie and steal your car. Like, I don't

1:00:07

know, whatever's happening. Well, that's what's happening here.

1:00:09

Did someone steal your car? No,

1:00:12

but I had to do a lot of work on liking dating

1:00:14

because I was very outcome focused. And people are like

1:00:16

this with their business. Like, I coach people who are

1:00:18

trying to, you know, I mean,

1:00:20

my coaching program is for everybody, but of

1:00:22

course I have some coaches in it, just like I

1:00:24

have whatever, architects, doctors, lawyers. And like, anybody who's trying

1:00:26

to start a business and like trying to make their first

1:00:28

couple of sales or whatever. If you

1:00:31

take every single time it doesn't

1:00:33

work as evidence that nobody

1:00:35

wants to buy them, everybody hates me. But that's

1:00:37

what people are doing with dating. And

1:00:39

I think there's like so much value to feminism

1:00:42

showing women the ways that society is stacked

1:00:44

against us. And that certainly that, you know,

1:00:46

men are socialized in a way, socialized in a

1:00:48

variety of ways based on their gender that some

1:00:51

are not so great for them or their emotional development either.

1:00:54

Some give them some social advantage. But the

1:00:56

sort of like men are all trash discourse.

1:00:58

I'm just like, if you want to date

1:01:00

men, it's going to be hard with that

1:01:02

thought. I mean, I love that you said it because it's

1:01:04

hard. I mean, I cover from it too, because we hear

1:01:06

so many bad stories, you know. And live them. Yeah, I

1:01:09

live them. All my dates are bad

1:01:11

in LA. You've had a rough run in LA. I've

1:01:13

had a really rough run. And it has worn me

1:01:15

down in a way that like I've never felt before

1:01:17

where I'm just like, I hate dating and I hate

1:01:19

men. And I don't hate men. I love men. But

1:01:21

like it is hard, like you said, to have eight

1:01:24

really bad dates, walk in on the ninth date and

1:01:26

be like, slight is clean. I'm not going to be

1:01:28

like, I get bitter is not fair. No, I think

1:01:30

that you, but like it's hard to not walk

1:01:32

in and be like, what's going to happen on

1:01:34

that one? You know, what makes it so terrible

1:01:36

is that people are motivated by this. And

1:01:39

I'm not saying you are just like when people are out there

1:01:41

dating. It's always going to feel horrible

1:01:43

if you feel like you don't have an option because the

1:01:45

way society has taught you, it's like it doesn't seem like

1:01:48

an option to not date or to not want a partner

1:01:50

because there's such deep socialization around having

1:01:53

a partner being married as being the

1:01:55

most important achievement for a woman or

1:01:57

at least the achievement without which any.

1:02:00

other achievement is sort of a little hollow or a

1:02:02

little sad. And yes, I totally believe

1:02:04

there is a natural human inclination for a

1:02:06

lot of us to want to have affectionate

1:02:08

bonds. I totally believe that that's

1:02:10

true, but I don't think we can separate the

1:02:13

way that society teaches women to

1:02:16

think about romantic partnership from

1:02:18

the way women feel about dating. Because if

1:02:21

what you basically have subconsciously is, I have

1:02:23

to do this, this

1:02:25

is how I'm ever gonna feel good about myself. I've

1:02:27

been sold this bill of lies, which is like, I

1:02:29

won't feel lonely anymore. I'll feel loved. I'm gonna feel

1:02:31

like I have a companion. Everything's gonna be better. So

1:02:33

I feel like I have to get this thing to

1:02:35

feel good. And

1:02:38

I also have this thought that it's

1:02:40

hard and men are trash or whatever else.

1:02:42

It's like when you don't have any way out kind of

1:02:44

mentally, everything will always feel, the stakes

1:02:46

feel so high. It will always feel so much worse.

1:02:49

And if you say to women like, okay, well like don't

1:02:52

date for a while, or you know, you don't have to

1:02:54

date. It feels so natural that we're like, no, but I

1:02:56

want that. But I just think we

1:02:58

have to really question like, what is

1:03:00

it you want? What is the feeling you're

1:03:02

trying to have? I don't really

1:03:04

believe that we have like a brain

1:03:07

receptor just for, you know, an

1:03:09

attachment bond with a person of the gender that we're

1:03:11

attracted to where we also touch each other's genitals. Like

1:03:13

that's not actually a specific, like

1:03:15

speaking of the brain. I love you. Well,

1:03:18

you wrote the book. Okay, so how can

1:03:20

we identify our real priorities so we don't

1:03:22

spend our lives unconsciously following rules that aren't

1:03:24

supporting what we really want in a life? So

1:03:27

how can we, I got a 30

1:03:29

second fix. Buy my supplement

1:03:31

and it just takes care

1:03:34

of it. It treats that little, it just clicks

1:03:36

right in. Oh, funny.

1:03:39

It's a 15% off. I want it to be the

1:03:41

grift you didn't see coming. Just out of left field. That is so

1:03:43

funny. You're like, I have this app and I have this. I

1:03:45

have a really simple personality test. It's three questions. And once I

1:03:48

know your type, you never have to feel lonely again. And then

1:03:50

you just have to pay 29.99. And you don't

1:03:52

have to have the human experience. Every car, backslash, GGE

1:03:54

10. Yeah. Just the exit

1:03:56

ramp right off. And I think by the way, you did start to

1:03:58

get into it where you said like, I'm identifying. that I don't

1:04:00

want to feel alone. Does that mean I have to

1:04:02

fill it with a romantic partner? Yeah. So I think

1:04:05

obviously deprogramming trying to get patriarchy and society

1:04:07

out of your brain is a big project.

1:04:09

And I don't think the goal is to

1:04:12

completely de-socialize yourself. Like women just turned into

1:04:14

another perfectionist like pursuit. But socialization

1:04:16

is also why like, we know how to sit here

1:04:18

nicely and like no one has peed on the floor

1:04:20

and we all put on clothes today and like, we

1:04:22

know what foods are safety, you know, and then we

1:04:25

know that this is a friend, not a threat, like

1:04:27

all of that socialization. So we're not trying to get

1:04:29

to some like state of zero. Yeah. It's

1:04:31

just a journey of getting to know yourself

1:04:33

better and becoming more curious and

1:04:35

more compassionate with yourself about that

1:04:38

socialization. So the point is not to be like, okay,

1:04:40

I'm not supposed to have these patriarchal thoughts and I

1:04:42

need to be a good feminist. I need to make

1:04:44

sure that I completely deprogram socialization about

1:04:46

romantic relationships out of my brain. Like, I, you know,

1:04:48

I chose to get engaged despite I think we talked

1:04:50

about this on the podcast, like having

1:04:53

mixed feelings and ambivalence about it, feeling

1:04:55

like there's still some social validation feeling

1:04:58

happening from making this choice.

1:05:01

But I felt like I had done enough work

1:05:03

at least to know, even though I was actively

1:05:05

feeling worse, I was choosing it, which was a

1:05:07

good sign to me that like, I'm not choosing

1:05:10

this to try to escape my feelings. I'm

1:05:12

actually moving towards discomfort, which is

1:05:14

one of my kind of operating principles

1:05:16

of life is like, I want to move

1:05:18

towards not discomfort for discomfort's sake, but like

1:05:20

towards evolution and growth, which often feels uncomfortable.

1:05:23

So I don't think we can totally get it

1:05:25

out of our brains. But the process really is

1:05:27

to using the work I teach in the

1:05:29

book, or I have my podcast is Unfit Your

1:05:31

Brain, there's a like 300 episodes of that to

1:05:33

become aware of what you're thinking and to

1:05:35

change those thoughts. But it really requires so

1:05:37

much like, self compassion

1:05:39

and curiosity. Because if

1:05:41

you're not willing to be curious, and you're not willing to be

1:05:44

nice to yourself, you're not going to tell yourself the truth. And

1:05:46

I think a lot of women get stuck there, even women who think that

1:05:48

they're very self aware, they've been to a lot of therapy, I was like

1:05:50

this too. I'm totally self aware, I can

1:05:52

give you a very long narrative explanation of all of my

1:05:55

neuroses. But I was like, not willing to have a feeling

1:05:57

if you paid me like I was just not. Okay.

1:06:00

I was in my brain in a jar. And

1:06:02

so I was always just cerebrally trying

1:06:04

to analyze myself into something

1:06:07

different, like into being different or feeling

1:06:09

different. And there's really no way

1:06:11

to do that. You have to be willing

1:06:13

to be present with yourself, which requires that

1:06:15

curiosity, that self-compassion. And then when it comes

1:06:17

to dating, I mean, I just, I can't stop thinking about what you

1:06:20

said of like, you have this men

1:06:23

are trash, dating is trash mentality, and you're

1:06:25

trying to use that same brain to find

1:06:27

love. Is some helpful self-talk, like just being

1:06:29

proud of yourself that you're out there? You

1:06:32

know, like, what is the bridging the gap

1:06:34

there? Yeah, I think it depends on like,

1:06:36

everybody's brains different, but a couple of different

1:06:38

like avenues that I think people find helpful.

1:06:40

One is when we get despairing, it's usually

1:06:42

actually not necessarily because of what we're experiencing

1:06:44

now. It's because we imagine

1:06:46

it will always be like that.

1:06:48

So this philosopher and psychologist, I

1:06:50

think it's both Martin Salomon, life

1:06:52

coach, a non-certified life coach,

1:06:54

yoga teacher. Yoga

1:06:58

teacher Martin Salomon. I'm going to get an email from

1:07:00

his people and I was just like, what the fuck?

1:07:02

We're going to get an email from a lot of

1:07:04

yoga teachers. I got it. Fun of

1:07:06

you, Ashley. Fun of you, Ashley. It's fine. We

1:07:09

love our yoga teachers. Martin Salomon. There

1:07:11

are some amazing, some nice things. He

1:07:13

does. He talks about the three P's he

1:07:15

calls them and that's, let's see if I can do it.

1:07:18

Uh oh. Persistence, pervasiveness, and personalization.

1:07:20

These are basically three kind of thought patterns

1:07:22

I would call them that like make everything

1:07:24

feel worse. Personalization

1:07:26

is like when we take it personally. So it's

1:07:28

like somebody does something and we're like, oh, you

1:07:30

did that because of what or who I am

1:07:32

or what you think of me. One

1:07:35

is persistence, which is like, and that's the one I was talking

1:07:37

about here. It's like, it's always going to be this way. And

1:07:39

one is pervasiveness, which is like, it's like

1:07:41

everywhere. So you can

1:07:43

almost always tell, like if you're catching that in

1:07:45

your brain, that is a beautiful shortcut to being

1:07:48

like, oh, that's a thought error that I probably

1:07:50

want to address. So if I told you you're

1:07:53

going to have to go on 20 of the fucking worst dates

1:07:55

of your life, but 21 is going to be

1:07:57

a winner. You'd be like, all

1:07:59

right. Let's go, it's 15, when's 16, right? It's

1:08:03

the thought of, oh no, it's all three. Women

1:08:05

are secretly thinking, maybe there's something wrong with me.

1:08:07

They don't wanna think that, but that's what society

1:08:09

taught them. So we're personalizing it of like, what's

1:08:11

wrong with me? Why is this happening to me?

1:08:13

Am I choosing wrong? Am I missing the red

1:08:16

flags? Am I, well, all that, it's pervasive. All

1:08:18

the men are like this, or all the women, whoever you're dating,

1:08:20

all the people are like this. Nobody wants to be in

1:08:23

a relationship every, right? And persistence, and

1:08:25

it'll always be like this. Humans

1:08:28

are very resilient, actually. I

1:08:30

think that we mostly do think we can get

1:08:33

through something if we think it is limited in

1:08:35

duration, or that the challenge will be

1:08:37

over. Yeah, if you have a date when something's gonna

1:08:39

end, a romantic date, or a date on a calendar,

1:08:41

then it's easier to get through anything. Of course, if

1:08:43

it was like on 21, it's gonna be great. But

1:08:46

you can think that way on purpose, right? The question I

1:08:48

like to ask myself that I've done my business, my relationship,

1:08:50

was like, how many bad dates am I willing to go

1:08:52

on? Assuming they don't all have to

1:08:54

be bad, but like really choosing that, as opposed

1:08:57

to thinking each time, like, okay,

1:08:59

this better be the one. Like this has to be right to

1:09:01

validate that there isn't anything wrong with me, and that all that

1:09:03

suffering wasn't in vain. And like, I'm willing to go on 100,

1:09:05

I'm willing to go on 200. Like,

1:09:09

I'm willing to keep going until I get there. First of all,

1:09:11

I love what you said. Just figuring out which

1:09:13

P is going on, or one, two, or all three,

1:09:15

and just being able to catch that and reframe

1:09:17

it. But also just like trying to find the

1:09:20

good in these things. I mean, yes, you may

1:09:22

go on 10 dates with 10 terrible narcissists, you

1:09:24

know, that like really personally offend you. But I

1:09:26

feel like what helped me was like going on

1:09:28

dates sometimes with like really nice, good guys that

1:09:30

took me out, and we had a fun night,

1:09:32

and they just weren't, it's the right person for

1:09:34

me. And those things helped being like, there's good

1:09:37

people out there. And not pathologizing also. I just

1:09:39

think it's sort of like, you can't go on

1:09:41

10 dates with narcissists. That's just not- Of course,

1:09:43

of course. That is like high extreme. Yeah, yeah.

1:09:46

But I think that that is like, it feels like there's like a branch

1:09:48

of online feminism that's basically just like diagnosing everybody

1:09:50

you meet with a personality disorder, which

1:09:52

is like- We've talked about that, yeah. Like that's

1:09:54

not what's happening. And the problem is your brain

1:09:56

looks for evidence of what it believes, right? So

1:09:59

if your thought is- is men

1:10:01

are only out to use you for sex, they don't want

1:10:03

commitment, or they're all manboys, or they're all whatever. You

1:10:06

will just see evidence of that, right? So one of the

1:10:08

thoughts I used a lot in dating was just like, this

1:10:10

is just a human being, like I'm a human being. They

1:10:12

may not, whatever, they may not be having the feelings or

1:10:14

thoughts I want, they may not be acting in the way

1:10:16

I want. Like I do think

1:10:18

even men are like doing the best they

1:10:20

can with

1:10:23

what they have. Now society does not socialize

1:10:25

us in ways that are helpful to us,

1:10:27

and men are socialized to basically think that

1:10:29

having any emotional intelligence is weak

1:10:32

and feminine. So we all

1:10:34

have a responsibility to look

1:10:36

at that socialization and try to become a

1:10:38

more evolved person, but it's like the more

1:10:40

you pathologize in other people, the

1:10:42

worse you feel. Yeah, and all

1:10:45

these lies you're talking about, I've told myself all

1:10:47

of them, there must be something wrong with me,

1:10:49

but if you reframe that and say like, is

1:10:51

everybody that I know that's in a relationship, are

1:10:53

they so perfect? Are they so great? Have they

1:10:55

chosen so well? Why choose what they choose? No,

1:10:57

necessarily. If you tell yourself every man

1:11:00

or whatever you want to date that are women

1:11:02

is so terrible, then you will believe it. But

1:11:04

if you zoom out, my dad is wonderful, my

1:11:06

brother's an amazing husband, Ashley's brother's an amazing husband,

1:11:08

I love Ashley's boyfriend. I have tons of examples

1:11:10

in the world of people not being trash and

1:11:12

horrible. I do think you have to remind yourself

1:11:15

of that. Totally, and then everybody's on a different

1:11:17

time. I mean, I always haven't seen my clients,

1:11:19

like listen, if truly all you want is to

1:11:21

be married, you could do that tomorrow.

1:11:24

Right. You could find someone to marry tomorrow. But

1:11:26

then they'll say, but that's not the person or the relationship I want.

1:11:29

That's what you're holding out for. And

1:11:31

you have to make that decision and own it. I'm 43, I met

1:11:34

my partner when I was 40. I

1:11:36

love it. And I'm still a little bit

1:11:38

like, well, I was having fun. Not

1:11:42

only is the destination not some magical promised land,

1:11:44

it's just, I mean, I don't know how crass

1:11:46

I can be, but I just feel like that's

1:11:48

impossible. Sometimes I just like to

1:11:50

coach by saying, it's just gonna be your life, but

1:11:52

there's someone with a penis in the house with you.

1:11:55

Which doesn't sound that great. Oh, I think it's

1:11:58

hate us how to crass. Oh

1:12:00

no, it's not that crass. You're right. I've been surrounded

1:12:02

by vibrators. Listen, I've been on so many... It's

1:12:04

like I've had to turn myself down to this podcast

1:12:06

before. But when you put it that way, that doesn't

1:12:08

sound good. Rain is nightmare. It's your dope life. Oh,

1:12:10

there's a man in the house all the time. It's

1:12:13

so funny. There's always a man in this house. It

1:12:15

is my life. There's never not a man in this

1:12:17

house. But my point is just like, I think it

1:12:19

is helpful with your brain sometimes to reduce things. So

1:12:21

like really, like, because your brain is like, you know,

1:12:23

it's a magical wonderland where you're a Disney princess and

1:12:25

then this and this. And it's like, no, it's

1:12:28

still like there's dishes in the sink and

1:12:30

now fucking someone's talking to me before I've had

1:12:32

coffee. Yeah. And like, this is what

1:12:35

I'm telling myself I have to have. And I'm glad I

1:12:37

made the decision to get partnered because for me, I

1:12:39

had done a lot of work and got really good at

1:12:41

being single and dating. And then this brought up a whole

1:12:43

new shit of work I had to do. But

1:12:45

it's the opposite of why people think you get partnered. People

1:12:48

think you get partnered. So you'd be like, oh good, I

1:12:50

did it. I arrived. I'm done. Now I feel good. And

1:12:52

I'm like, no, I got partnered. You'd be

1:12:54

like, oh Jesus, I hadn't even looked at that stuff. Okay,

1:12:56

here we go. This is a whole new level of work I

1:12:58

have to do now. I

1:13:00

wanna talk about the four chops or a math.

1:13:03

But I have one quick question for you. Did you feel like

1:13:05

when you, I'm probably projecting.

1:13:07

Do you feel like one of

1:13:09

the things you struggled with getting engaged was people

1:13:11

treating it like it was the biggest thing you'd ever

1:13:13

accomplished? Oh my God, I cannot talk about this. I'm on

1:13:15

a book tour and I'm going to my book tour and

1:13:17

people are like, I'm so excited, you're getting married. You're like,

1:13:19

I wrote a book. I really struggled with it. It wasn't really

1:13:21

that hard to get married. I mean, I had to do a

1:13:23

lot of work on myself to be in a good relationship, but

1:13:26

getting. Anyone can get married. I

1:13:28

mean, it's not just shame of people. Beautiful marriages are

1:13:30

really so special and more rare these days, but this

1:13:32

is the thing. I struggle with. But that's a good

1:13:34

marriage. Yeah, having a good relationship is an accomplishment. Just

1:13:36

being able to put a ring on your finger is.

1:13:38

I mean, I feel like I've done a lot of

1:13:41

work on myself. I feel accomplished that I achieved this

1:13:43

really healthy, nice relationship. I just don't know that it's

1:13:45

deserving of this is the greatest thing I've ever done.

1:13:47

I mean, Reina would say this the last time she

1:13:49

hard launched her boyfriend on Instagram. She was

1:13:52

like, more congratulations than like selling out

1:13:54

the Chicago theater. I mean, I

1:13:56

had three times the engagement on that post than I did when

1:13:58

we launched a second business. That we self. funded. Totally.

1:14:01

Isn't that crazy? And also people aren't congratulating you on the

1:14:03

relationship. If somebody came up to me and was like, listen,

1:14:05

I've been your friend for 20 years and I

1:14:07

really see how you've grown. Right.

1:14:09

Which friends do that. That I'm

1:14:11

like, yes. Of course I accept that

1:14:13

compliment. You're seeing the growth. You're complimenting

1:14:15

the work I've done to have

1:14:18

an authentic, honest, real relationship, which most people

1:14:20

don't. Yeah. Love that. Being like, oh

1:14:22

my God, you're getting married, which my friends know not to

1:14:24

do. But it is wild to me. And people are like,

1:14:26

are you worried about the wedding? And I'm like, man, I'm

1:14:28

trying to make the New York Times bestseller list. I'm not

1:14:30

worried about the fucking party. People

1:14:33

are, what's going to happen? There's food. There's a band.

1:14:35

It's fine. I guess people, I mean, everybody has a

1:14:37

touch point for romantic relationships. They don't have a touch

1:14:39

point for writing a book. So I think it's easier

1:14:41

to get behind. Like I, I know this, I understand

1:14:44

this. This is what everybody wants. But you're coming to

1:14:46

my book tour. Right. Now I know some of my podcast listeners

1:14:48

are gonna be like, I'm sorry. I said that I

1:14:53

congratulate you. It's totally fine.

1:14:55

And I accept your love for

1:14:57

me and the gentleman on consort. I do the shit too.

1:14:59

You know, there's nothing more cringe than

1:15:02

being like, let me see the ring. He did so

1:15:04

good. But I probably done it. I always do it.

1:15:06

I mean, again, I just want to say like, we're

1:15:08

all just, I'm always saying we're all complicit. Yeah.

1:15:10

But I think there's parts of it that

1:15:12

I'm like, don't, it's a little too congratulatory. Cause so

1:15:15

we've been socialized for thousands of years. I

1:15:17

think that's the woman's biggest accomplishment. Yes. That's

1:15:19

what I have. Yeah. Okay. So let's talk

1:15:21

about the four traps of romantic socialization. Yeah.

1:15:24

So this is just sort of my attempt to

1:15:27

take the enormous amount of romantic socialization women get.

1:15:29

And I really encourage like, we take nothing else

1:15:31

away from this podcast, the socialization

1:15:33

that women get about centering romantic

1:15:36

relationships, especially if they're heterosexual, but

1:15:38

not only because you get the socialization

1:15:40

before you're even probably aware of your sexual identity a lot

1:15:42

of the time. So even if you don't date men,

1:15:44

don't suck men, don't want to marry men, this

1:15:47

romantic socialization is still in your brain is

1:15:50

so deep. I just think like people, most

1:15:52

people are not even, if you think

1:15:54

it goes to depth level six, it goes to depth

1:15:56

level 60. Like it is so deep

1:15:58

in there. So. So the

1:16:00

four traps, the first one is insecurity,

1:16:02

which we've talked about, which is just,

1:16:05

if you teach someone that essentially their

1:16:07

social validation and belonging to the tribe

1:16:09

depends on being in a certain

1:16:11

kind of romantic relationship, and for straight women essentially

1:16:13

being like, chosen by a man, then

1:16:16

they are of course going to be obsessed with it,

1:16:18

because their brain associates that with danger,

1:16:20

like to not fit in with the tribe or

1:16:22

to not have the tribe's respect evolutionarily

1:16:25

dangerous, right? And so

1:16:27

the first trap is really just understanding why,

1:16:30

like part of a lot of this book is trying to help women

1:16:32

understand, this is why you feel so crazy about

1:16:34

this, especially when you intellectually don't think you

1:16:36

should, right? This is why I could be somebody

1:16:39

who went to Yale and Harvard and was

1:16:41

an active feminist and has been a professional

1:16:43

feminist my whole life, and didn't think

1:16:45

you should have to need a man and didn't

1:16:47

want a conventional marriage despite where I've ended up,

1:16:49

but nevertheless was like, did that dude from Tinder

1:16:52

who is probably not even named Brian, right? That

1:16:55

is the brain gap, that split brain experience, and

1:16:57

the section on security is really just helping you

1:17:00

understand like, there's nothing wrong with your brain or wrong with you,

1:17:02

like this is actually a natural outcome of how society has taught

1:17:04

you to think. Which is a relief, like that's helpful

1:17:06

to know, just like as a starting point. Yes,

1:17:08

that's why you feel that way, it's not, you

1:17:10

don't feel so terrible because there's actually something wrong

1:17:12

with you, or because like maybe named Brian

1:17:15

is actually a good judge of your worth and

1:17:17

value, right? Brian doesn't even have a passport. Like

1:17:19

why? We don't even have his name as Brian, he

1:17:21

might be a bot. We have no idea. He's gonna steal your car. He

1:17:23

could be a searchier on a basement or an 85 year old grandpa,

1:17:25

like we don't even know. So

1:17:27

that's the first trap, and that leads to the second

1:17:30

trap which are scarcity and settling, and those are scarcity is

1:17:32

the way that there's like not enough to go around, and.

1:17:37

Which, listen, let's run the numbers. But I think

1:17:39

that is a really big social myth also, because

1:17:41

society teaches women scarcity. Society is like, yeah, there's

1:17:43

more women than men. There's no good men, right?

1:17:45

Like that's, in a weird way, patriarchy runs on

1:17:47

the idea that both men are superior and that

1:17:50

there aren't enough good men to go around, right?

1:17:52

So then women have to be competitive over

1:17:55

this resource. And a lot

1:17:57

of women will have a specific thing. It's like,

1:17:59

okay, no I. do believe there's enough out there for

1:18:01

other people but not for me because of what

1:18:04

my body looks like or my religion or

1:18:06

my race or my you know trauma and

1:18:08

baggage or my standards or my whatever right

1:18:11

but any time you're going into it thinking

1:18:13

I'm trying to find something there isn't enough of you

1:18:15

are immediately triggering a like anxious survival

1:18:18

response in your body and that

1:18:20

is gonna make dating feel terrible. Yeah

1:18:23

I totally agree a scarcity mindset is

1:18:25

only gonna be harmful then there is

1:18:27

a point of like the stats are

1:18:29

saying that there are so much more

1:18:31

educated evolved women than men we talked

1:18:33

about with Dr. Marsha Einhorn about when

1:18:35

it comes to like women that want to have

1:18:37

children and men so there's there is a gap there

1:18:39

which I go back and forth because sometimes that's

1:18:41

helpful to know too because you're like oh this isn't

1:18:44

just me there is a reason why I know all

1:18:46

these amazing women and I

1:18:48

don't know like I do I go back

1:18:50

and forth on if

1:18:52

it's helpful or if it's not but I'm with

1:18:54

you and like like going into dating that way

1:18:56

isn't certainly not helpful but you talk about this

1:18:59

all the time Ashley does about sort

1:19:01

of reframing like I thought I wanted this

1:19:03

thing at a person but like I'm very

1:19:05

happy with this other thing I didn't even

1:19:07

imagine that that could make me so happy

1:19:09

and it's different than settling because like you

1:19:11

write in the book scarcity and settling like

1:19:14

I think that like you the plural you have

1:19:16

an idea of like the education level you want

1:19:18

and somebody the height you want in somebody the

1:19:20

body mass index you want in somebody and what

1:19:22

they do for a living and like so many

1:19:24

other things could make you happy if you just

1:19:26

open up yourself yeah I'm not trying to debate

1:19:28

you I'm just like I was something I went

1:19:30

to law school yeah

1:19:33

I just we talked about this a

1:19:41

lot of an actual imbalance but it needs to be

1:19:43

well but I always go back to his room there's

1:19:46

actually like I'm not trying to make you feel stupid she's like I'm

1:19:48

gonna make you feel so good I'll

1:19:54

make you feel that's cute bitch no what

1:19:56

no I think that's something especially self-help

1:20:00

you the women's world online so people feel like they

1:20:02

have to agree on everything. It's like, I do have

1:20:04

a podcast I don't agree with and I just like articulate that.

1:20:06

I totally hear what you're saying. I think for me,

1:20:08

this is partly why I always go back to in

1:20:11

the book I talk about this like a whole other episode

1:20:13

we would have to do of like the cycle in

1:20:15

which your thoughts create your feelings and your behavior, which

1:20:17

comes from cognitive behavioral psychology, but then a way

1:20:20

of seeing how that impacts outcomes in your

1:20:22

life. And I'm really pretty agnostic. It's like

1:20:24

I'm offering thoughts that I think are useful,

1:20:26

but everybody's got to run that thought through

1:20:28

the process for themselves and just look at

1:20:30

their life. For instance, if what somebody really

1:20:32

wants to do is like not date, but

1:20:34

they have all that socialization and

1:20:36

then this thought helps them like let go of that

1:20:38

a little bit and just be like, oh,

1:20:40

well, it's not just me. There aren't enough to go around

1:20:43

like whatever it is. If that thought is like working for

1:20:45

them, I'm all for it.

1:20:47

Yeah. You know, we talked to John Berger, like

1:20:49

his thing is like, yes, some of the odds are

1:20:51

stacked against you, but here's how to combat them. You

1:20:53

know, you can't just well around in the hole that

1:20:55

there's not to go around. Like that's accurate. Like you

1:20:58

can't enter into anything you want to achieve with a

1:21:00

scarcity mindset. So it's kind of just like combating

1:21:02

it. But that's why it's really about that connection. Like,

1:21:04

do I really want this and do I know my

1:21:06

reasons and like them? And if so, then I'm going

1:21:09

to have to use my brain on purpose to pick

1:21:11

the thoughts that are the most helpful, even if there

1:21:13

are some other true thoughts I could think. I mean,

1:21:15

my example I often give is like, we're all going

1:21:17

to die someday. That is a very true thought.

1:21:20

And some people when they think that it's like actually

1:21:22

very motivating for them. It's inspiring for them. They're like,

1:21:24

I want to make the best that I can of this time

1:21:27

of my life. And then like, great, that thought works great for

1:21:29

them. Some people become paralyzed by fear and anxiety and despair when

1:21:31

they think that it's not so helpful for

1:21:33

that person. It's not one size fits all. But

1:21:35

I do talk in the book about sort of

1:21:37

the personalization thing, right? Like the difference between a

1:21:40

statistic, a statistic on its own doesn't tend to

1:21:42

elicit like despair and hopelessness in my experience coaching.

1:21:44

What does is what you make that mean for

1:21:46

you. So I mean, I went through this dating

1:21:48

as a fat woman in New York, where all

1:21:50

the dating profiles just say like, you

1:21:52

know, no fatties are height weight proportionate only

1:21:55

fat phobia is alive and well in the

1:21:57

dating world, and especially New York, maybe probably

1:21:59

especially now. to. Yeah.

1:22:01

They're tough cities to date in. I mean, where

1:22:03

you're a lot of your worth derives from how

1:22:05

you look. Right. That's your currency. I wasn't like

1:22:07

trying to make my thoughts be, everybody loves women

1:22:10

of my size. Like that's not right.

1:22:12

My thought was some fat

1:22:14

women find love and partners who really love,

1:22:16

respect and desire them. And I have decided this

1:22:18

is important to me and I do like my reasons

1:22:21

and I want to do what it takes, which means I'm not

1:22:24

going to think about the night. It's like in selling. It's like

1:22:26

having a business. It's like pushing. It's like when people don't want

1:22:28

to like, they're like, but so many people don't want life coaches.

1:22:30

I'm like, yeah, those aren't your clients. Yeah.

1:22:32

Like, the men who don't like fat women are

1:22:34

not my clients. Like I, they're not, why

1:22:37

would I be trying to appeal to those people?

1:22:39

I just have to be committed to loving my

1:22:41

body enough for me to A, enjoy this

1:22:43

process. B, feel confident in it for the people

1:22:45

who do want it. Right. So if I try

1:22:48

to sell coaching being like, listen, a lot

1:22:50

of people think this is dumb and

1:22:52

a lot of them don't believe in it at all,

1:22:54

but it might help some of you. Do you want

1:22:56

to try it? Like, no, nobody wants that. Right. It's

1:22:58

an empowering thought. I mean, people have told us no

1:23:00

guy is going to want a girl who,

1:23:02

you know, talks about sex for a living, you

1:23:04

know, is on stage doing this and that. It's

1:23:06

like, we're like, great. Yeah. Great. Then we won't

1:23:08

even go down the road with those people. You

1:23:10

know, like it's a nice feeling when you realize

1:23:12

I'm not going to be for everybody. Well, what I

1:23:14

love about dating is really you need one or even

1:23:16

if you're poly at most four. Yeah. Like for coaching

1:23:18

clients, you need a lot of people dating. It's like,

1:23:21

all you need one for like, that's all you got

1:23:23

to get out of the whole, the whole world.

1:23:25

So like, always said all you need is one, but now it's

1:23:27

all you need is one more. I

1:23:29

don't want our non-monogamous people to feel left out.

1:23:31

All you need is one to

1:23:33

fourth. But that's like, when

1:23:36

you think about it, like, that's like, well, I don't have

1:23:38

to, not everybody has to like me. Not every date has

1:23:40

to. Right. Yeah. Not every person has to want someone

1:23:42

who, whatever it is, is my age, has a kid,

1:23:44

is in a different body. Is it like, I just

1:23:47

need one. That's why it all comes together. It's like, what

1:23:49

are my reasons? Have I done enough

1:23:51

work to know that I actually do care about this?

1:23:53

If I'm just trying to find a partner, because I

1:23:55

think that I'll finally feel good about myself, the

1:23:58

whole thing's gonna feel horrible the whole way. I

1:24:00

like the difference between like being open-minded and settling also

1:24:03

like you I mean you write settling But I think

1:24:05

that it's important to stay open-minded It is for me

1:24:07

because I think like yeah if I built a man

1:24:09

and we've done an episode about making a list I

1:24:11

think that's an important exercise, but if I built a

1:24:13

man he'd live in, California He'd be in a certain

1:24:16

income bracket. He'd be a certain height He'd have a

1:24:18

certain profession and like that's just not necessarily Realistic like

1:24:20

if you put a bunch of beans in the center And

1:24:23

I start taking them out for people that like look a

1:24:25

certain way make a certain amount of money or a certain

1:24:27

age One being also it's like why do

1:24:29

we want those things? I mean I this is from somebody who ended

1:24:31

up with someone who is like Not

1:24:33

Jewish was divorced had kids and when I met

1:24:35

him had to like work nine to five in

1:24:37

an office when I thought I was looking for

1:24:39

like a Probably Jewish guy

1:24:41

who is location independent and didn't want children We

1:24:44

were gonna travel the world like these all tie

1:24:46

together because when you are dating because of the

1:24:48

socialization When you are dating because you feel like

1:24:50

people don't think about this way But this is

1:24:53

really what it is that I

1:24:55

need the social status that comes from that right? We think

1:24:57

about that as like I'll feel good enough, but really what

1:24:59

that is is like a social validation That's

1:25:01

when you're like, but they have to be a certain quality That's

1:25:04

a certain kind or doesn't count it doesn't work

1:25:06

people won't look at me and be impressed people

1:25:08

won't look at me and say oh Okay,

1:25:11

like I guess she is good enough because she got

1:25:13

that kind of partner really So

1:25:16

like yeah, there's a scarcity if that's how you're doing it,

1:25:18

right? But if as if you are connecting to like what

1:25:20

is the purpose of this relationship? Why am I trying to

1:25:22

be in a relationship? What am I trying to experience how

1:25:24

am I trying to grow? What are the values that motivate

1:25:26

me here and who is a good match for that? It

1:25:28

ends up really having nothing to do with like, um,

1:25:31

or their height. God, that's like a whole nother

1:25:33

conversation We're gonna do these two remaining things before

1:25:35

but that's a huge part of you know For

1:25:37

an example the type of men women may

1:25:40

be seeking out based on socialization and for

1:25:42

it I know those women really want under

1:25:44

relationships just because they have Hampton's houses They're

1:25:46

finance guys and you're screaming at them like

1:25:49

you keep picking the same terrible guy But

1:25:51

they have had guys in the past that were

1:25:53

just nice to them and kind and work with

1:25:55

nice people that they just threw Away, like you have

1:25:58

to tell yourself why you're Because

1:26:00

women are socialized to believe that their social status derives

1:26:02

from their partner. Yeah, I like the way that you

1:26:04

put that. I mean, and we just don't think of

1:26:06

it that way, because it doesn't sound very good. Doesn't

1:26:08

sound nice. But that's truly it. And part of what

1:26:10

I talk about in the settling section, though, being less

1:26:12

popular is that I talk about patriarchy and how teachers

1:26:14

meant to commodify women, of course, and that is a

1:26:17

bigger problem. And in the dating market,

1:26:19

women also commodify men. Right? And you

1:26:21

look at look at the dating profiles, it's like, don't message me if

1:26:23

you're not six feet tall, you have to this kind of whatever. I'm

1:26:26

not blaming women for that women have been

1:26:28

socialized that way. But of course, you can't

1:26:30

find a good relationship when you're both commodifying

1:26:33

and objectifying each other. Like that's, you can't

1:26:35

have real intimacy or vulnerability that way. So

1:26:37

right, entity doesn't exist just like the 200

1:26:40

K or above per year level. I like

1:26:42

to emotionally connect to you, but you're 510.

1:26:44

And so I can't read it. My

1:26:48

emotion raise can't get to you. And I gotta

1:26:50

tell you, like, if you're trying to do something

1:26:52

to impress other people, it doesn't matter. People will

1:26:54

see through it eventually, you know, or you'll just

1:26:56

end up with someone who's also trying to impress

1:26:58

other people, right? You can get yourself that partner

1:27:00

and they'll be dating you because you're a size

1:27:02

two. And you have this kind of

1:27:04

breast and you know, and if your body changes,

1:27:06

then that's gonna be a problem. And if their

1:27:08

income changes, that's gonna be a problem. And you're

1:27:10

just very, you're just treating that. All right. Yeah,

1:27:13

sensation and rumination. We've already talked about the last

1:27:15

one, which is magical thinking. Fixation rumination is actually

1:27:17

a pretty quick one. It is again, one of those that's

1:27:19

partly just to be like, you're not crazy. This is why

1:27:21

your brain's like, if

1:27:24

you teach someone that they're

1:27:26

worth in value depend on this area of their life,

1:27:28

and that if they haven't achieved a certain milestone by

1:27:30

a certain point, there's something wrong with them. And

1:27:33

you teach them that they need to fix that fast.

1:27:35

And there's not enough good options to fix it. And

1:27:37

of course, your brain's gonna fixate and ruminate. Like,

1:27:40

how could it not? So just understanding that when

1:27:42

you're obsessing about some woman

1:27:44

dude or person of any gender who you

1:27:46

intellectually realize is like not a big deal in

1:27:48

the story of your life, but you cannot stop fixating on

1:27:51

your brain is in a weird way working

1:27:53

as designed is just maladaptive in this day

1:27:55

and age, like your brain absorbed

1:27:57

very early on women's romantic

1:27:59

status. determines their worth and value.

1:28:02

So your brain thinks we

1:28:04

have to do this. This is survival related.

1:28:06

Like if we don't do this, then people

1:28:08

are not going to think we're good enough.

1:28:10

Then people might reject us. Then they might leave us in the

1:28:13

jungle to die when the tribe moves camp and no one will

1:28:15

tell us. I mean, I'm simplifying, but that is the way your

1:28:17

brain is working. So I

1:28:19

think that often women feel even a lot of

1:28:22

shame about like how fixated they

1:28:24

are, especially in dating. I mean, I've seen people in

1:28:26

a lot of things and I used to do first,

1:28:28

I mean, one on one at first, then small group.

1:28:30

And I see fixation rumination

1:28:32

the most in dating in terms of just

1:28:34

like the most anxiety and kind of the

1:28:36

most need for like very frequent hand holding

1:28:38

sort of, and I don't mean hand holding

1:28:40

pejoratively, but it's just because it is like,

1:28:42

especially with cell phones and online dating now,

1:28:44

it just can be like a

1:28:46

part of every moment. And so there's like

1:28:48

so much opportunity to fixate and

1:28:51

so much opportunity to just

1:28:53

have that stuff triggered over and over again. And

1:28:55

so much opportunity to communicate and obsess about it.

1:28:58

And so that trap is really just like there's

1:29:00

a reason your brain is doing this. It

1:29:02

thinks that it is necessary for you to

1:29:04

be accepted and to survive. And so

1:29:06

the solution to all of it is that

1:29:08

reprogramming of your brain so that your

1:29:11

relationship with yourself matters more than your relationship

1:29:13

with anybody else. And so that you

1:29:15

are able to separate your worth and value

1:29:17

from that relationship status little

1:29:19

by little. And then magical thinking we've talked about

1:29:22

part of why I put magical thinking in there

1:29:24

is like, of course we want to believe that

1:29:26

if we just finally get the right person, we

1:29:28

will stop having all of those thoughts. And like

1:29:30

traps of one through three are exhausting. So

1:29:33

of course your brain wants to be like, okay, when

1:29:35

I just finally get the right relationship, I'm going to

1:29:37

finally get to stop thinking all this. But I

1:29:40

got bad news for you. That's not what happened.

1:29:42

Some people just keep the same thoughts. There's a New Yorker cartoon

1:29:44

I love of a woman being like, yeah, but did you marry

1:29:47

me or marry me as a friend? Right? Some

1:29:49

people will just keep the same thought pattern,

1:29:56

right? It'll be like, I'm just now fixated

1:29:58

on whether my partner's upset. with me or are

1:30:00

they happy or are they attracted to me? Or

1:30:03

like me, you actually have done enough work so you're not

1:30:05

fixated on that, but now there's just a whole bunch of

1:30:08

other shit you have to deal with of being

1:30:10

like truly intimate with someone else when you are

1:30:12

more self-actualized as its own whole list

1:30:15

of shit you have to deal with, of going from being independent

1:30:17

and doing what you want to all of a sudden having

1:30:19

this other person. And my feeling is way

1:30:21

over-accompetating of me. And still, I

1:30:23

mean, I basically do whatever I want. And I'm

1:30:25

still like, don't try to trap me. And he's

1:30:28

like, I don't tell you to do anything. You

1:30:31

do whatever you want and I just go along and

1:30:33

I'm like, well, but you're here. Can't

1:30:36

hold me down. He's like, we're married. I

1:30:38

put no restraints on your behavior at all. So

1:30:40

how exactly are you being held down? I've

1:30:43

never even asked you to do anything differently. Whereas

1:30:45

I of course have like 13 instructions a day for him.

1:30:48

I really actually do love your ring. Thank you.

1:30:50

I designed it very differently. He did

1:30:53

great and that I designed it. It's

1:30:55

very different. Well, it's actually my

1:30:57

great grandmother and then my grandmother's. Diamonds?

1:30:59

Yeah, so this is from my dad's grandmother, the tall

1:31:02

one. And then these three are from my mom and

1:31:04

the other. That's so special. My favorite part

1:31:06

though is that my partner says that he's the tall,

1:31:08

low quality one. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

1:31:10

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

1:31:12

ha ha ha ha ha ha He's bringing symbolic of parachase.

1:31:14

That's just easy. And then those are the two

1:31:16

kids, yeah. Oh my God, this is symbolism on

1:31:18

symbolism. Yeah, it's really, really so special. Well,

1:31:20

I really encourage people to buy your book. There

1:31:23

is a lot of exercises in it. There's a

1:31:25

lot of questions to ask yourself. I do like

1:31:27

the second part of your dating chapter, which is

1:31:29

sex. I encourage people to read it where you

1:31:31

just talk about why women are socialized to find

1:31:34

being desired, arousing, and how we can create feelings

1:31:36

of desirability and take back your sexual agency. So

1:31:38

I really encourage people to read that. The one

1:31:40

thing that is if you feel like you can't

1:31:42

feel sexy unless someone else is like actively

1:31:45

desiring you or making you feel

1:31:47

sexy, that's some bullshit. You actually

1:31:49

can change that. It's in the book. Love it. Yes,

1:31:52

we can't hear that home enough. So your book is

1:31:54

out now. Everybody ready to get the book, Instagram, everything.

1:31:57

So if you are listening to this right when it

1:31:59

comes out, have a few more days you can

1:32:01

get the pre-order bonuses that we were doing with orders

1:32:03

of the book are still available through the end

1:32:05

of the month there's like a 30-day guided take

1:32:08

back your brain journal there's a book club there's

1:32:10

an encyclopedia of new thoughts which is like love

1:32:12

more than 30 pages of just thoughts you can

1:32:14

borrow you have any I will send them to

1:32:17

you I'll put it to you guys for free

1:32:19

journals yes so exactly it's almost

1:32:21

like I was a nerd before

1:32:23

this like you

1:32:25

want to do a mug or a t-shirt I'm like more

1:32:27

work books we

1:32:31

don't have a drink out of teacups with our

1:32:33

pinky yeah so you go to take back your

1:32:35

brain book calm if you want those but if

1:32:38

you're listening to this after if it's June or

1:32:40

later wherever books are sold love it okay and

1:32:42

then you are on Instagram yes I am on

1:32:44

Instagram my last name is hard to spell carlo

1:32:46

on file carlo on file you can also if

1:32:48

you go to take back your brain book calm

1:32:51

which is kind of easy to remember everything okay

1:32:53

take back your brain book calm or you can find

1:32:55

my podcast wherever you listen of course yeah fuck your brain

1:32:57

and we've been on it we were on it towards the end of

1:32:59

2023 yeah you can

1:33:01

start there yeah and you guys know where

1:33:03

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1:33:05

the tour tickets we can't wait to see

1:33:07

you out on the tour this fall and

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share this episode with a friend get cars book

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and we'll see you next week have a good

1:33:22

week guys Oh