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This is the Hidden Killers podcast

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with Tony Bruschi. This last

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week, I had the opportunity to sit down and have

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a in-depth conversation with private

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investigator Thomas Brennan. Tom

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is the private investigator that's been hired by

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the parents

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of Ellen Greenberg, Joshua

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and Sandy Greenberg, as they search

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for justice and answers in the death

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of their daughter. A death that

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was quite clearly a homicide, considering

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she was stabbed 20 times. Several

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of those stab wounds, fatal blows,

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which would make it a physical impossibility

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for her to continue stabbing herself

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up to 20 times.

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The problem with this is her death has

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been labeled a suicide by the Philadelphia

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Police Department,

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a department which refuses to investigate

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the death further and

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refuses to change the cause of death to

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homicide, which it rightfully

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should be. Why

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is that? Why is

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it so difficult? Why

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are so many refusing to

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speak the truth about

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the death of Ellen Greenberg? We

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discuss all of that and more in this five

1:25

part series, our

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conversation with Thomas Brennan,

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private investigator into the death

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of Ellen Greenberg. New

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episodes every day this week, Monday

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through Friday here on the podcast.

1:42

How often is a cause of death

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changed at the insistence of the

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police?

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It's never been for me. Sure,

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sure. I'm speaking,

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you know, in excess of the 800 homicides.

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And what I don't, this is the

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only case that I've ever heard. Yeah. And,

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and obviously one that, I mean, it just

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defies logic when you look at it. It's

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not even that questionable as to this was

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not a suicide. It was a homicide

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without a doubt. So to

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have that changed like that at the

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insistence of the police, I'm

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wondering what it would take and

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what is that pressure that

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they felt that they were under that they

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should do that at the insistence of the

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police, would there be some sort of backlash

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if they said, no, you're not a doctor,

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you're not a medical professional, this is what

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we believe is right. Uh, or

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I just, I don't know why one would even do

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that. Even if someone did suggest that.

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I don't know. And then, you know,

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and, uh, I know that, you

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know, the medical examiner's office.

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When the pathologist

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does an autopsy, the

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reports are on, you know, on

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a computer. Okay. So

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that they could go in and out and make changes. Sure.

3:10

Well, dr. Osborne called it a

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homicide. Okay. Dr.

3:15

Osborne issued a death certificate

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for Ellen saying it was a homicide. Okay.

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Why would you come back and change? Why? Why

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would you issue another death certificate? Say it's suicide.

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No, it doesn't make a lot of sense. I

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mean, I know that the parents are obviously very

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upset about all this because it doesn't make sense. It

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doesn't bring justice. What was

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the reaction of, of Samuel

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Goldberg as these sort of things

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are happening? One would think, I mean, I'm

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engaged right now. If, if something

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like this happened to my fiance, and I know I

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didn't do it, and there was this, this

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battle out there for the future.

5:38

the

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individual who is the Philadelphia District Attorney

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right now. Okay. Larry

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Krasner. When

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I first got involved in 2013, one

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of the things that I noticed that Larry

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Krasner said that when he

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picked up Ellen's

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laptops from the police, he

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gave them to an individual by the name

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of Cummings. That

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individual in turn, supposedly

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sent those and

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sent her laptop to a company in North Carolina

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to do a forensic

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analysis on it. Okay.

6:58

That forensic analysis, okay.

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First of all, when the Philadelphia

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police had it, they gave it to the FBI

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to do the forensic analysis. The FBI

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come back to the police saying there

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was nothing related to suicide on it.

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Well, when the thing, when it came back,

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the report came back from North Carolina,

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they, they, they addressed

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the shadow searches. Okay. Like

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if you went out and you looked up Zoloft,

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okay. You

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know, Zoloft says, okay, if there

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is a possibility of suicide with Zoloft

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and all this other stuff, you know, and

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all these other related things. Possibility of

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suicide, but not possibility of stabbing yourself 20

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times. Yes. Well, 20 times.

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Yeah. Yeah. Who are they trying to

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correct? Okay. But anyway, the

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first thing I did,

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you know, I said to Josh, I

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said to Sandy's or Alan's father, I said,

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will you please call?

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Mr. Krasner and tell him I'd

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like a copy of that report from North

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Carolina.

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They said okay. So he called

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them and he said to me, he said, well Larry Krasner

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said it's about, you know, he said it's like a like

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a phone book. He said it's about as thick as a phone book.

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I said I don't care what it is. I said you know I'd

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like a copy. Yeah.

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So he sent me that copy. Well

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guess what, guess who said

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that,

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you know, Larry

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Krasner had a copy and I had a copy.

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Okay, that was it.

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Larry Krasner's copy was in

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the Greensburg's personal file.

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Okay. Okay.

8:48

Well, when

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Larry Krasner said, you

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know, recused himself when he became

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gay, he recused himself

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from this case and sent

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the case on to the state attorney general's

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office.

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Mr. Josh Shapiro who is now a governor.

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Okay. And

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Josh Shapiro sat on it for four and a half

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years. Okay. Before

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we found the conflict of interest. Okay.

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Josh Shapiro, the attorney general, sends

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it back to Philly because he's

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now running for governor. He doesn't want anybody,

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he said, I don't, I don't want it even

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to appear like I have a conflict

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of interest.

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All this time

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I'm talking with supposedly

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the investigator in the case was their

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deputy, senior

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deputy attorney general, Christopher

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Phillips. Okay. Christopher

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Phillips

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is talking about well, we

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did another

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analysis with the FBI and

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we come up with all these shadowed

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surgeons. And

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okay, now he gives these

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shadowed documents, copies

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of these shadowed documents to

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Stephanie Farr, okay, in

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Philadelphia, the journalist

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who did the big article on

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the Greenberg case.

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Sure. And

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okay, so

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Stephanie calls me Jesus Tom, I'm

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gonna send you the documentation that he said. And

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I looked at it, I said, I

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told him, I still

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have the emails that I sent back to him.

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I said, Mr. Phillips,

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I said, don't tell me you had

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the FBI do another analysis because

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everything that I see

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now that you're saying is

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an indication of suicide. I

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said, I know

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where you got it.

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There were two individuals that have copies of that

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report,

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Larry Krasner and me.

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So I had,

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when he did that, I

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had Sandy and Josh Greenberg

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send Krasner to the Krasner

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correspondence asking for their personal

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file. And

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he said, I sent it to you. Well,

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the Greenbergs don't have it. Yeah.

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So you take a look at

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it, you're supposed to have a copy of this report,

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I'm supposed to have a copy of this report now, Chris

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Phillips from the AG's office. I

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think

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when Larry Krasner

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sent the case to the AG's office, he

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also sent the Greenbergs personal file.

12:01

Okay, you know, God

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bless him, you know, Josh and Sandy have been

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through so much on this, this

12:08

whole thing. It's the high

12:10

heaven.

12:11

It just thinks the high heaven. This is the Hidden

12:13

Killers podcast with Tony Brueske.

12:15

There's more to come in my conversation

12:18

with Thomas Brennan, private

12:21

investigator into

12:23

the murder of Ellen Greenberg.

12:26

New segments playing Monday through Friday

12:28

this week on the podcast. Be sure to press

12:30

subscribe so

12:32

you don't miss any

12:34

of this very intriguing story.

12:37

Stay with us.