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Hello! It's better cummings here. I'm

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Just search for Tortoise Investigates wherever

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you get your podcasts. Hello!

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It's toll money from Tortoise this

0:32

week. Wish our podcast from our

0:34

friends at Canada Land called Pretending

0:36

Ends. In. Each episode hosts

0:39

Robert J. go an angel

0:41

Ls dive into audacious stories

0:43

of indigenous identity fraud. From.

0:45

A silver screen at to the halls

0:47

of Governmental Power People have been falsely

0:50

claiming to be indigenous for a long

0:52

time. So. Why do these

0:54

so called pretend younes do it? How

0:57

do they pull it off? And what

0:59

happens when they're exposed? In the

1:01

first episode, the host take you behind the

1:03

psychology of pretend. He ends by speaking directly

1:05

to the leader of one of the biggest

1:08

pretending groups of all time. Grand.

1:10

Chief Gone call his a preview

1:12

of the episode. Hello and welcome

1:14

to pretend he owns. This is a show where

1:16

we talk about people who impersonate us natives and

1:19

explain why they're doing it and who it hurts.

1:21

Has just don't go. Angel Ellis

1:23

George, Get us hello, I'm Angel

1:25

Ellis. a writer and a citizen

1:27

of the Muskogee Creek Nation located

1:29

Oklahoma. A Read your anger. Yeah.

1:32

You gotta get all secret with the.

1:37

Is wild his a yoyo ravaging the squeak.

1:39

My name is Robert. Jego it. I'm a

1:41

writer for the qualifiers nation and looks like

1:43

Indian tribe the Pacific Northwest. So.

1:45

The show is all about pretending it's pretend.

1:47

The ambience. It's a pretty new term and

1:49

I know that even a lot of native

1:51

people don't know what it's like. One of

1:53

the social media think that's kind of taken

1:55

over and got into the press. So many

1:57

people pretend to be Indian. You.

2:00

Will not believe how many of these figures

2:02

are out there. We don't pretend the ins

2:04

and Hollywood. Pretend the ins and government

2:06

even. Pretend the ins and prison in

2:08

every episode will tell you a wild

2:10

story about who they host and what

2:12

they got away with. Rubber off

2:15

the top your mind for some the

2:17

person the and says you can think

2:19

this dinner Rachel Dollar bonus maybe away.

2:22

Some Zola as all the Naacp

2:24

chapter later accused of lying about

2:26

her race their i am Black

2:28

haven't had a dna test. Series

2:30

clearly a blood ladies but she told

2:32

everybody sues block and seen on a

2:35

spree turn and putting for know sunset.

2:37

Oh I do remember this before she

2:39

did that she was native. really have

2:41

issues never native but before she did

2:44

that seats to try to bring a

2:46

tangent first. Oh my carr head it's

2:48

Rachel. Used to call herself

2:50

Faith Eagle Nebula. What about

2:52

Elizabeth Warren? Yeah, she's like the daughter

2:55

of the Cherokee princess. Or something

2:57

like that. Focuses see: Have

2:59

regrets Tribal Our It is

3:01

what drives. I

3:04

am sorry. For harm I

3:06

have caused when I was

3:08

growing up so small family.

3:11

Stories some other famous ones recently

3:13

I mean posse say murray. Oh

3:19

gosh Buffy. Brook from a hard a little

3:21

bit a. Little bit. Yeah, that hurts. I

3:23

don't know how. Or when he started

3:25

to see her. story says she's

3:28

just raised in a cup season

3:30

family. I mean that's when that

3:32

I never would have guess. What?

3:37

What makes the mob crowd like? Go

3:39

with it I don't understand. And

3:41

wound. I mean, how many people

3:44

really listening to natives who we talk about?

3:46

anything? Else to. Pretend.

3:48

He's as a story or really important

3:51

Right now we're rebuilding our nation's and

3:53

making serious strides as people because with

3:55

that rising this opportunity and a seems

3:57

that like for every three opportunities. Then

4:00

you stick to them. So. I'm

4:02

definitely not a person dm But Robert, how

4:04

do I know? you're not. He.

4:06

Silicon my credit score. Hope

4:10

so It's. Just.

4:13

I've got arms at Secret. Laminated

4:16

card. I've got one from Senate in

4:18

one from the states because in Canada

4:20

I'm registered oh shoot, as a status

4:23

and inadequately first nation. And

4:25

in the States, I'm inroads with the

4:27

next second entrap. That's me. What about

4:29

you? How. Do you know that

4:32

I'm native? Well I have my Sacred

4:34

Laminate card. It's that enroll me as

4:36

a citizen. Of. The Muskogee nice and sport

4:38

the card right. Registered angel at a

4:40

minimum and I mean at a bare

4:43

minimum you would hope that people would

4:45

actually asked to see a secret Lamina

4:47

car before giving somebody a job or

4:49

another opportunity. This been set aside for

4:51

native person. These. Cards are

4:53

important when it comes to figuring out who

4:55

is legit and who is a pretender. Not.

4:57

Every truly indigenous person has one, but

5:00

these days only truly indigenous people can

5:02

get one. So. Matter the damage he

5:04

would do some a started printing a fake

5:06

Indian status carts. Today's episode is about a

5:08

man who did something a lot worse than

5:10

merely pretending to be indigenous. The

5:13

Skies. and simply a fake Indian. According

5:15

to many Mohawk leaders and others, he's

5:17

a fake Indian. Cease. And

5:19

a natural history to tens of thousands

5:21

of pretending as by sending them fates

5:23

Indian status cards that look almost like

5:25

the real thing. Angel,

5:27

We're not going to just talk about this

5:29

guy. I'm going to talk to him. But.

5:32

First, he needs know who he is. So

5:34

allow me to tell you all about his

5:36

Excellency. Grad. Sees a D Um

5:38

Carro V on parle de um Carro

5:41

His majesty Doom car would have recalls

5:43

himself, refers to himself as his Excellency.

5:45

Your car was claiming to be of

5:47

Dunklin at one time, another times claiming

5:49

to be a Huron source to as

5:51

what your language, what's your culture I

5:54

can tell him what mine is. The

5:56

people that don't believe them new they

5:58

can kiss my in Vienna. From.

6:00

Canada land. This is Battalions.

6:03

Oh yes some know the

6:05

name is so. I'm

6:08

that so long as

6:10

the so I. Saw.

6:19

It Happen. That.

6:27

Again, Ah,

6:37

The own car was born around nineteen

6:39

sixty. I found very little information up

6:42

there about his child or his upbringing.

6:44

The doesn't seem to be any need

6:46

of community to said anything about knowing

6:48

him or his family. We did traces

6:50

family tree though back to his great

6:52

grandparents promote we can find his family

6:54

are all French Canadians. Is great.

6:56

Grandparents were dairy farmers in a small

6:58

town north of Ottawa. One of his

7:00

grandfather's seem to have been fairly wealthy

7:02

and center the hospital so the grandfather

7:04

was a cop. We found a wedding

7:06

photo in an old newspaper. the shows

7:08

his parents guess Stone and Prs. They're

7:10

very like handsome couple very caucasian looks

7:12

like Shirley Temple and Norm Macdonald. Oh

7:14

my gosh discuss the place Shirley Temple

7:16

and normally not old got together once

7:19

he reaches adulthood. Game crowd join the

7:21

military where he served as a military

7:23

police officer. He tries this lucky as

7:25

a country music. Singer He said his computer

7:27

science and he models for department store hearings

7:29

will take a look at him. Very

7:32

much wearing. The.

7:34

Leather vast in the beat

7:36

is necklace he got. Like the

7:38

Ponytail breed closer as the number of technology

7:40

companies. It wasn't until he's in his forties

7:42

that he shows up in any public record

7:45

I can find presenting himself as a native

7:47

person. and when he goes for it, he

7:49

really goes for it. He runs for leadership

7:51

as the Native A Minds of Tobacco, a

7:54

group that represents native people who do not

7:56

live on reserves. I'm pretty familiar

7:58

with offers a race and needed. There are

8:00

a lot of programs in the Us

8:02

that intentionally took native. Off.

8:04

The reserves that's not pull any alarm

8:07

bells for me to remind us as

8:09

a legitimate group is working for display.

8:11

How does he like come from nowhere?

8:13

And win the support of natives

8:16

to become a leader in a

8:18

native organization. Well. He campaigns

8:20

on the strength of his education

8:22

keep says he has a Phd,

8:24

he boasts of as many university

8:26

degrees and his business background, and

8:28

he wins. What's. Up with the

8:30

degrees? These degrees or from a school called

8:33

Ask For The University is one of those

8:35

online universities. He says that he did a

8:37

ba in there may and appeared steed. Computer

8:39

Science. Over. A period of three

8:41

years. When a reporter from the

8:44

press question Carl about them, he said

8:46

that he didn't need to attend classes,

8:48

but that he did publish a thesis

8:50

and unfortunately is no longer possible to

8:52

access it. Ah, Three.

8:54

Years later, he is engulfed in controversy.

8:56

He's under audit by his own organization

8:58

for mismanaging their money, is accused of

9:00

awarded contracts to his own company, And.

9:03

Not telling the whole truth about those university

9:05

degrees. According to press reports, he gets driven

9:07

out of the Alliance. and two thousand and

9:09

five the guy who replaces Carl cause him

9:12

a wannabe who can prove it's made of

9:14

heritage. Now this is the first summer record,

9:16

the summers accuse the Carl of being an

9:18

imposter and I'm awfully the last. So

9:23

offers kicked out of the native land's

9:25

expect karma support a start their own

9:27

group and call it the Confederation of

9:29

Aboriginal People. This one is not recognized

9:31

by the government of Canada or any

9:34

for station. This new group has no

9:36

a license. Cross supporters december title his

9:38

excellency grants sheath and it's tell him

9:40

for life. Carl says

9:42

that is going to be sees us all the

9:44

Na status Indians out there, all the indigenous people

9:47

who don't live on reserves and who don't have

9:49

any of status cards from the government of Canada.

9:52

His idea of what it takes to me and

9:54

dismiss is that all you need is the native

9:56

team. He says any amount of Dna makes you

9:58

a native say a twitter. They didn't have

10:00

one hundred percent of precision. that yet

10:03

results are not even some debate a

10:05

many as the Indian Jean and Am

10:07

Pt Indian team okay already okay. He

10:09

estimates that they're over five hundred thousand

10:11

indigenous people in Canada could join his

10:14

group. Start paying him face he says

10:16

pulling theatrical stats he writes and horseback

10:18

to downtown Ottawa with five in a

10:20

protesters to the mess and of the

10:22

Governor General if you don't know who

10:25

that is Angel that's the official representative

10:27

of the Queen. Isn't when

10:29

you get an audience with. Governor

10:31

General Johnson or the Queen directly Either

10:34

clean directly, know what is your request.

10:36

We need our land back. The ninety

10:38

five percent of cows us. We're not

10:40

gonna leave until we ever that it

10:42

doesn't happen. but he does get an

10:44

extraordinary amount of media attention. Does

10:46

he get like good press? At

10:49

first yes, but it's not all

10:51

posts and in light of some

10:53

negative stories, he decides to sue

10:55

the media for an absurd nine

10:57

hundred and thirty million dollars for

11:00

allegedly disarming him. And he argues

11:02

that he's being persecuted in the

11:04

same way that Martin Luther King

11:06

Jr, Nelson Mandela and the Jewish

11:08

victims the Holocaust were persecuted. The.

11:11

Just wasn't the case. It doesn't

11:13

stop with though. He starts his own

11:15

brand new first nascent. He causes the

11:17

mechanic tribes as as anyone with even

11:19

one percent native dna can be a

11:21

mental. Note:

11:24

This group is totally unrecognized and members don't

11:26

get any the rights or benefits the status

11:28

in the answer entitled to such as hunting

11:30

and fishing rights are are different. Tax benefits

11:33

To get that stuff you need to be

11:35

from a real recognized for space and the

11:37

half an actual legitimate government issued status card.

11:40

And most of it's members can get those.

11:42

so he starts issuing his own set of

11:44

skirts. Six that a skirts according to Cbc

11:46

News. Here's. What an actual government issued

11:49

status card looks like. Those with

11:51

status can be entitled to a

11:53

range of benefits including tax exemptions.

11:55

Now this is the car being

11:57

passed off to unsuspecting. Shopkeepers,

11:59

That. It all because they're

12:01

pretty well done. The Cbc This is

12:03

incredible undercover investigation he said. I guess

12:06

the reporter a very white lady go

12:08

city Curls group posing as someone who

12:10

wants to join it. See stars. Two

12:12

hundred fifty dollars for a Dna test

12:14

that's administered by Curls owned by Cease.

12:17

To get into the tribe you have to

12:19

pay and you have to do a dna

12:21

test. You. Don't have to

12:23

like prove matrilineal descent from that

12:26

tribe or anything like that. That

12:28

is this episode. Yes, and about that

12:30

Dna test. Okay first all

12:32

of this is caught on hidden camera. And

12:36

the vice chief tells reporter not

12:38

to worry everybody gets since the

12:40

group everybody's test comes back positive

12:42

for native. You ever have people

12:44

take the dna test and they just come

12:46

back. Not. Need us I never side

12:48

so far. Once that happens you pay

12:51

eighty dollars murphy a cart and according

12:53

to curl over fifty thousand people have

12:55

done this sub fool insane. A disgruntled

12:57

former member of Cross Group sees the

13:00

something's wrong with the tests and so

13:02

he decides to swab his so our

13:04

he sense in his to while was

13:06

dna to the same company the Game

13:09

Crow used for the membership of the

13:11

Confederation and guess what is. His daughter

13:13

red dog. His dog is

13:15

twenty percent rest. Tuck it

13:17

comes back twenty percent in

13:20

business, Eight percent Abernathy. And

13:22

twelve percent Mohawk. More. Media

13:24

investigations are done into Carlin as

13:26

organization this time into an investment

13:28

scheme the police investigate and fraud

13:30

charges are laid against his excellency

13:32

grants if the on car. And

13:35

then it gets even worse. Forum and twenty

13:37

nineteen km crowd is charged with three sex

13:39

crimes. Oh. For. an

13:41

incident that took place decades earlier with a twelve

13:44

year old boy. And. He's

13:46

convicted. And and that's

13:48

it. That's for the record ants there are

13:50

no new stories about what became of the

13:53

fraud charges against him, and no record of

13:55

him going to jail or being sentenced for

13:57

sex. Perhaps nobody seems to have spoken to

13:59

him in a few years with Indo is

14:01

why I was so surprised when he actually

14:04

responded to my email and said he'd give

14:06

me an interview. My. God like

14:08

I'm so curious. What are you

14:10

going to ask him about? Where

14:13

do you start? With. What would you ask

14:15

them about? The. First thing I knew really

14:17

need to know is how is the guy walking around?

14:19

It's. Financial. Fraud. Identity

14:22

Fraud and. Sexual.

14:24

Misconduct with a minor? That's

14:26

insane. I think that's why I want to end up. But.

14:29

First, I want to sell in the

14:31

gaps about his background. Angel: This is

14:33

an incredibly tough person interview. There are

14:35

so many court cases I've been buried

14:37

reading what this guy for ever and

14:39

I can't get to the bottom of

14:41

anything with him. but I don't know

14:43

where he's from. I don't know what

14:45

his childhood was. I I don't know

14:47

when he decided to become an Indian.

14:50

It's been years since he sat down

14:52

for a proper interview and that happened

14:54

before all of the stuff with the

14:56

sexual charges in the fraud or wanna

14:58

use. This. Time to like have

15:00

him stance here after everything seems to

15:03

have fallen apart and explained to me

15:05

how he got himself in this position.

15:08

He's. Obviously someone who. Can manipulate

15:10

press, but maybe he'll want

15:12

to explain his. Story Now that

15:14

it's all kind of unraveled, maybe he's ready to

15:16

go on record in still at all.