0:15

hebron walking back to hell and high water part

0:17

two of our specialty products sold with barclays

0:19

bitching tim miller, both authors

0:21

of york times best sellers of recent

0:24

just out in the the couple months kim's book

0:26

we did it marks book thank for your service

0:29

both of them about the

0:31

trump era, through the eyes of

0:33

people who enabled donald trump,

0:36

rather than donald we spent

0:38

part 1 of the podcast with if haven't heard already got

0:40

to go back stop now, pippa's, go back

0:42

was in the part one we talked about some

0:44

news of the day mike pence last

0:47

week feeling to really go after donald trump

0:49

even though trump wanted to see me killed about

0:51

trump coddling the saudis and casting

0:53

doubt about whether really know what happened on 9/11

0:55

little bit about merrick garland and then we into

0:57

these two books in their socio-cultural houses

1:00

of culture of republicanism

1:03

in washington and that is

1:05

where we're to pick the moment really in

1:07

2016, when it became

1:09

clear that donald trump was going to be the nominee

1:11

and at that moment, our

1:13

friend, tim miller, made the turn from

1:16

have standard brand republican establishment

1:18

operatives on the rise on the make

1:21

whatever jeb bush think it he was on his way the white

1:23

house to suddenly being one of the earliest conscripts

1:25

in the never trump movements was

1:27

given to the second part of our talk with that with

1:29

it

1:39

the him and i did you back to march of twenty

1:41

sixteen and in one of your first ever

1:43

television appearances as never

1:45

trump or this is a little bit of you hear on msnbc

1:48

my god i know what as clever as

1:50

a here's a setup similar to christian sick

1:52

on msnbc i remain a lot arguments

1:54

about why trump could be beaten and

1:56

should be beaten but sure with pure was

1:58

once the element which was

2:00

there was no way

2:02

from could ever beat oakland no way

2:04

but here's here's how far it goes let's play that

2:07

for going to talk about how he is completely

2:09

out of like the ball around zero like suit

2:11

against hillary clinton hillary clinton

2:13

said get indicted by the f b i

2:15

go to jail she would still when forty eight

2:17

out of fifty states against donald trump you getting

2:19

crushed by her and all the polls trump

2:21

was talking about the polls well

2:24

once he starts getting starts getting general election you'll notice

2:27

his stuff me to have a lot less to do

2:29

to do with the polls

2:30

donald trump is the nominee and november who

2:33

is

2:33

for torture ,

2:35

no more more

2:37

on the i'm not going to i would never vote for donald

2:39

some the i'm just sick of zones

2:42

are brazil factor brazil lot of people who commit

2:44

murder when his allies and of course

2:46

i would not vote for hillary clinton or bernie sanders

2:49

there was a few things about that first of all tim used

2:51

made a big way my time he ira like omelet with of

2:53

your diaper jeb bush rouse a political proulx

2:56

at the pluto pro mckenna said prof

2:58

he said you were a country lawyer the as simple

3:01

as us i don't really understand how huge you're

3:03

trying to make a point the would make the claim that

3:05

elude when forty and fifty states specially

3:08

after getting indicted by the f b i going to jail number

3:10

one number two if that were true

3:12

the idea that you wouldn't vote for her in those circumstances

3:14

divinities i don't troubled a menace seems

3:17

a little strange and and then of course it is also

3:19

because you didn't have overlooked oneself and nice

3:21

some get up how file well empresa

3:23

de as an old athletic eisner joe paterno

3:25

pounder and matt roads have been supply me with all this

3:27

information i believe that sir alex

3:30

letters to as the to burn and so question one man

3:32

i've gotten better on tv message after our

3:34

society and music you are you seem surprised

3:37

like you see ticket a backwards yes you he would vote

3:39

for your like school much at tip tim miller com

3:41

and a homie armor nominate yeah that's like i face

3:43

on that ah as a young country

3:45

lawyer then saucer this thirty things happening

3:47

one i did and a voting for hillary clinton and i did set

3:50

up publicly once as journalists and i believe you so

3:52

that was from march so the primary

3:54

still on right and so again that

3:57

to excuse myself like the reason why i was doing

3:59

that is because

3:59

the point was still trying

4:02

to convince republican voters to

4:04

vote for crews

4:06

are marco of ever was last to that point

4:09

and sell being a spokesperson to say that

4:11

era hillary clinton studios not

4:13

gonna be the best thing so anyway

4:15

now the explanation for why i did that but in

4:17

retrospect and this also then happens

4:20

throughout twenty sixteen and would have a huge mistake

4:22

that which was not me i and of coming around on

4:24

nesbit almost all of the never

4:27

trump or slow

4:28

the end up voting for like evan mcmullan interval

4:30

theory the case in this is i think based on the flawed

4:33

assumptions which was real that the like this is our real

4:35

mistake you're kind of pick on me for a strategic

4:37

move of now thanks on the primary

4:39

that are real mistake was seriously miss

4:41

underestimating and to use a technical term

4:44

right now is are real mistake and because i think

4:46

that had we really thought now

4:48

we being the good ones right now another

4:50

important factor about that little pack i was speaking

4:52

for all those asshole except for me ended

4:54

up supporting donald trump in the general election so

4:56

those guys like going to vote for hillary but the remaining

4:58

never trump or as i think we i made

5:01

a tactical mistake and assuming is gonna lose

5:03

and that is what brings out the david friends

5:05

broom let the an avid mcmullan boneless

5:08

rather just be and like suck at we just

5:10

have to suck it up as well for hillary and that did

5:12

and of being attacked the mistake even though that's why i landed

5:14

sits on be clear the reason i actually

5:16

played the club other the just to kind of a little bit of i'm

5:18

with you is that that is the case right pretty

5:20

much everybody in the republican party didn't

5:23

go to that extreme of claiming she could

5:25

win if she wasn't i didn't put in jail and then she went for a

5:27

fifty but i would say almost everybody

5:29

that mark among your sources how many republicans

5:31

do you think once you won the nomination in professional politics

5:33

you thought donald trump could be hillary

5:36

not a lot although you know there were people

5:38

who are in trump's bubble who

5:40

even like reporters people who do not

5:42

who were not working for him who said this

5:45

just feels different are these like law streets

5:48

full of people are they being counted here because

5:50

this just feels different so you

5:52

know you did sort of have to pay attention to that after

5:54

awhile i think that's obviously true there are people

5:56

who did get it but it would say the people

5:59

in kim's world

5:59

the people who were get who were two degrees or for

6:02

marco rubio work for chris christie york project

6:04

a second work for any of those i people people who are like

6:06

in that class answer when the lobbyists class

6:08

a d c that are they wanted to stop trump

6:10

of they wanted to stop trump they want to stop and not because

6:12

they actually cared about trump bigger threat

6:14

to the contrary they won the central rather officers he

6:16

would lose the hillary clinton

6:18

right although i do want to say i can i guess is as

6:20

a pet peeve of mine so you know christians

6:22

and asks tim tim is a republican

6:24

operative living to to live in california

6:26

then railway of see lived a d c so

6:29

still isn't a carry disease that in miller's

6:31

vote doesn't really matter when where the us i

6:33

mean obviously it does bringing him yes but

6:35

everyone has i know how far the how can

6:38

buy a canada throw times now doesn't matter i

6:40

am now ten years from now and how and uses

6:42

this club to go back in may for something as on the

6:44

club i said it before you senate's i

6:46

gave you like crowd out my on hillary

6:48

and for thanks you for your support i will say

6:50

though that don't bother me

6:52

when i'm always does the two seater like

6:54

susan collins as collins wrote in paul ryan

6:57

mallett writing paul ryan of jeb bush's

6:59

mean nothing against coroner jeb bush but

7:01

i hate one of the very few republicans

7:04

are actually says it's they will not vote for

7:06

donald trump and they will vote for they

7:08

would biden amount of she actually use the were

7:10

by lot less cheney said i will do everything accounts

7:12

to make sure he never gets near the white house

7:14

again for which is actually a strong

7:17

statement coming from a reaper

7:19

void should be happy because the truth is

7:21

if you believe

7:22

that the man is an existential threat to

7:24

american democracy i don't you have your piss

7:26

in your vote away by voted for somebody else all you do is

7:29

helping trump i voted for someone who's not the democratic

7:31

alternative and so you actually of undermining

7:33

the seriousness of your own critique and it sounds

7:35

so stupid when bread rations

7:37

burger is being interviewed on msnbc

7:40

after same in this person is terrible

7:42

and off or any and rusty what's as and

7:44

bowers from yes arizona and said they otherwise

7:47

it's he kind of one eighty done this a little

7:49

bit but you know you sound like an idiot

7:51

you've gone as testified if

7:53

you're really gonna vote for him after this explain

7:55

yourself then just really good friends that have a book for

7:58

one second okay because it is interesting

7:59

interviewing all these for people and

8:02

i'll ethanol i'll saw agenda voting twenty sixteenth

8:04

and sixteenth had some of these consultant types who

8:06

said that they voted for trump because they com is gonna lists

8:09

and they just want to damoclean republican resume

8:11

like their like don't tell my wife or whenever

8:13

it whenever it had that on on bucks and then

8:15

alyssa thera viper of morale and

8:17

yellow janitors to those the thing we vote has

8:19

made fun of she wrote sir paul ryan doesn't tell anybody

8:22

to going to vote with her dad who the huge trump person

8:24

who votes for trump joe pharaohs like a conspiracy

8:27

than brides and paul ryan doesn't tell anybody

8:29

a bit of the incentives for all these

8:31

people i will we assume he's gonna lose

8:33

and we're gonna keep going along and doing the same

8:36

old shit that we ever did back in the dust and their own

8:38

alyssa same issue that i think he's a madman

8:40

he's an insane person but i'm still

8:42

working for jim jordan whoever she's waiting for the time

8:44

mark meadows putting up press releases talking about how

8:46

hillary should be in jail and

8:48

then i'm gonna write in paul ryan and this was

8:51

a slow corruption of everybody

8:53

in twenty sixteen the first step of the corruption

8:55

was i assume is that going on inside his go longer exists

8:57

all the games and then he wins in it's like

9:00

move well now he's in there so

9:02

dizzy they need a person like me to get in

9:04

there to help of right this was the baby steps

9:06

into the pool frame for how people

9:08

who hated amd went along with them than you

9:10

saw just like a hint of it and me there

9:12

so let's dive deep into these books right now

9:15

they are as i said before

9:17

really telling the same story from two

9:19

different sides of the looking glass the really about

9:22

donald trump's enablers his accomplices

9:25

the germans who refused to do anything

9:27

to stop trump's rise and then

9:29

a many cases not only didn't

9:31

try to stop it but willingly happily eagerly

9:34

gleefully participated in it so i think

9:36

that you guys both go pretty deep on

9:38

the psychology the various

9:40

motives that people have and how they got

9:43

sucked into this world and try no

9:45

way it allowed him as we were time at this town before

9:47

a lot of ways markets like all

9:50

things that we seen in washington before but

9:52

now like on steroids and speed

9:54

can simultaneously right so it's a distorted

9:56

space a story except for tunis

9:59

the

9:59

the penalties and inclinations that

10:02

we'd seen before and weaknesses that we seen

10:04

before in washington and i think the place

10:06

those that changes is when we get to

10:08

the thing about stakes again because many

10:10

people can say for a lot of us you know

10:12

watching trump disregard norms laws

10:15

make a mockery of of the presidency be

10:17

obvious you unfit for office for four years this are

10:19

all things to raise the stakes but then you

10:21

know it's like it's think we'll all would agree would have no january

10:24

six as six as order of magnitude and yes

10:26

and yes right the fact

10:28

that they're still will be seen happened since

10:31

then and you guys both you know grapple

10:33

with this in the be your be your books inflated for

10:35

ways that none

10:37

of it broke the spell for almost anyone that

10:39

they're all still there that's

10:42

like an order of magnitude different

10:44

as different as problem as a political

10:46

problem as a spiritual problem whatever

10:48

so i'd like you to just try to take

10:51

your skype theory of the case

10:54

of what it was that made trump

10:56

able to do what he did that that is at the heart

10:58

of the enabling impulse in

11:00

how that it can be that powerful

11:03

that it is survived even a

11:05

clear in equivocal

11:08

demonstration the fact that the man rent

11:10

is due to poop in america marked

11:12

as your theory explain

11:14

that about like rob the totality the

11:16

book how would you explain it to a martian

11:18

who came that is that okay they write this book but the

11:21

soil it down to be sought after it us on

11:23

the started mean i would say resources weakness

11:25

i mean it doesn't have to be the swearing kevin mccarthy

11:28

doesn't have to be kevin mccarthy lindsey graham

11:30

the left be lindsey graham they could do

11:32

something they absolutely to do

11:34

something as such as to for me so

11:37

much more chilling than what happened on january

11:40

six is what's happened since that

11:42

is so cylinder emphatic about

11:45

what we have a son of us it's not just like

11:48

yeah dad day on january six it's

11:50

all of twenty twenty four that is in front

11:52

of us if he wins take one

11:55

kind of corrupt thing he does take on partner

11:57

sites in

11:59

any they do whatever they want basically

12:02

his cabinet still justice department

12:05

who , a lot of sars is gonna sound like

12:07

off point but he spent the last like two

12:09

three four weeks of his administration's

12:11

just going down pardon list came in

12:13

they were all donors they were all family members and

12:16

we're all fresh or or of them were actually

12:18

the capital by the way i mean that you know that

12:20

either connections to have a part

12:22

right right let let them get rounded up

12:24

rounded an alum it's all right

12:26

in front of us still i mean crystal clear

12:29

and again ,

12:32

this might be naive but i think republicans

12:35

have to stop him they get the first

12:37

crack at him and you

12:39

know put him in a general election against joe biden

12:41

it's sort of a jump bought this

12:43

for the gym here's where i want to go with

12:45

you basically you play to roles role

12:47

in this book one is kind of as a sociologist

12:50

and a reporter and you're talking to people like

12:52

you and other as is kind of memoirist

12:55

and you're really talking about yourself and yourself and get

12:57

to some of the reporting you did that the friends

12:59

of yours you went back and interviewed about how

13:01

they went from being what you thought

13:03

of as your kind of people to being trump bests

13:06

but i want focus right now just on you one of the great

13:08

british to the book is your willingness

13:10

to be honest and candid and reveal some things

13:12

bout yourself and your own kind of weakness

13:15

and flirtation with the dark side

13:17

i had no idea about some

13:19

other things in the book including the work

13:21

that you did after spending a

13:23

lot of twenty sixteen talking about the dangers

13:26

of trump becoming president almost immediately

13:28

the be gateway seventeenth you fall

13:30

prey to the impulses that would lead a lot of people

13:32

to become seven able to start working on

13:34

me as of scott pruitt to

13:37

become the had a dps i had no

13:39

idea that even took place i somehow missed that

13:41

memo so i wrote years just hear you talk

13:43

about that and about when you went through

13:45

the self examination and confronted

13:48

your own motivations and your own slippery slope

13:50

slide into enabler ism what

13:52

did you learn about it that helps eliminate the actions

13:54

of others why that those were equally

13:57

important parts to while and right well yeah for the

13:59

first i was a tome and self assessment and in the

14:01

second part was understanding which is the cordier question

14:03

and i was like like you understand why these guys

14:05

it it unless i really examine my

14:07

own brain solipsism you know i know your own brain

14:09

for sure and so it's like why did i work

14:12

around without to talk about that already had it i just

14:14

buy that like environmentalist i just put an a little

14:16

box that we i rationalize i told myself

14:18

these stories or comforting which is our the

14:20

democrats aren't perfect on this either i just need to

14:22

do this to advance one more job etc scott

14:25

pruitt back huddle i'd rationalize that was

14:27

like i'm , political

14:29

hack that's my career i'm

14:31

a mid level level

14:34

mid maybe if you want to be nice political

14:36

comes for sense what am i gonna do

14:38

if not for this guy depressed

14:40

my careers in shambles right now none

14:43

of these people are gonna hire me i've been on t v

14:45

so now i can idiots as you pointed out a

14:47

way it earlier right i've been crashing

14:50

this guy's the president now what am i going to do one

14:52

of his camera guys knew me because we worked from

14:54

this thing together he said i need help to npr

14:57

will just keep it under the table you know okay

14:59

i get you know inertia right inertia the

15:01

to title that chapter i doubt as the explanation

15:04

and as think that there are there gradients of

15:06

rationalization obviously inertia doesn't

15:08

take you all the way to becoming the secretary

15:10

of state or what of state height but there are a

15:12

lot of mid level people in washington for

15:14

who inertia was he answered they are republicans

15:17

they want to republican bars they had republican

15:20

careers they had college funds to

15:22

pay for the or paid for by republican campaigns

15:24

maybe some of their kids were named reagan

15:26

you know they made their dog jack kemp like

15:29

to that you know a year in this culture

15:31

and so you know for a lot of them when i asked

15:33

him to explain it to them it was similar to bad

15:35

justification i gave for working for scott pruitt

15:37

which was what the fuck else my supposed to do

15:40

and is gonna do this so that's

15:42

how to defend so much as you know kind of

15:44

a comment on the banality of evil element

15:46

to the us i don't think it really quite gets to

15:48

your sit january sixth quest to yeah but it

15:50

certainly gets to help people got to

15:52

the brink of january set right and and

15:55

market or you say this thing at the end of the book

15:57

talk about how about the kind of

15:59

those future the fall in the context of we've gone

16:01

through january six now these are at level below about

16:04

have a very dulcet literally tens mark libertarian

16:06

for you say i'm sober man's overwhelmingly

16:08

the master arsonist of this and during a burn it

16:10

all down worldview and approach but the main

16:12

reason trump will remain in control of the gps that

16:14

the same dynamic that has kept him atop a job

16:17

he'd for this long republicans quaking

16:19

before him humor in him and fetishizing him has

16:21

remained unchanged and you end the book by

16:24

saying the following which i thought showing

16:26

a guy who's very funny writer a slinky

16:28

was not the well on into a one of them for a joke

16:30

at the end but there was a wee gets a former

16:32

republican congressmen told me recently the party's only real

16:34

plan for dealing with trump and twenty twenty four involved

16:37

a darkly divine intervention quote

16:39

we're just waiting for him to die he

16:42

said that was it that

16:44

was the plan he was one hundred percent serious

16:46

ah and you say well now

16:49

this is going to run again and and these

16:51

go died and said so i'm i

16:54

mean that assessment a

16:56

very dark assessment of where we're headed

16:58

right now it is because it's it's

17:00

just passive right it's like someone else

17:02

will take care of this problem which has been the

17:04

ammo for the republican party for

17:06

seven years it cites or bystanders

17:08

here we just with you know and

17:11

we have no agency and

17:14

it's depressing army i will

17:16

say that entendre said this to me or

17:18

ehrenberg towards the at it it's that of this

17:20

is in the book but he was saying you

17:22

, you walk around his office

17:24

buildings as congressional office buildings and bloody

17:27

sort of republican staffers who walk

17:29

up to me and you know they'll say great

17:31

job i wish i worked for someone like you and

17:34

they can't obviously do this publicly cause

17:37

they actually might work for jim jordan

17:39

for jim ghosts are actually and

17:41

some real out there members of congress

17:44

and up attorney the job again

17:46

so on one hand with timbers assignment as

17:48

they need a job but on the other hand is

17:51

waiting around for they just you

17:53

know we'll just you know hopefully

17:55

the states won't be that high by the

17:57

time comes for us to pick a horse

17:59

the next time i mean it's really depressing

18:02

i wish i could be more uplifting

18:04

yeah i wish you could be more uplifting to

18:06

mark but you know that i feel the same way anyway

18:08

we as a quick right here in excels at

18:11

six that's more

18:13

rebounds milk

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now a word from our sponsor better

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help you work in too much not taken

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enough time for yourself do you ever

18:30

feel burned out i mean all

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, questions every single one of them my answer

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is yes yes yes we

18:36

all know that life can be overwhelming and that a lot of people

18:38

are in fact burned out and they don't even know it the

18:41

symptoms or lack of motivation irritability

18:44

fatigue and while we all have

18:46

an associate burnout with workaholism

18:49

something workaholism know well that's not the only

18:51

cause any of the things that we're doing our lives

18:53

from being a student or being a parent can lead

18:55

us to feel burned out that's the nature of burnout

18:57

things that are important to us are also the things

18:59

that fry us better help online

19:02

therapy wants to remind you that it is

19:04

incredibly important even though it sometimes

19:06

seems maybe sometimes seems selfish to prioritize

19:09

yourself and talking

19:11

with someone can help you figure out what's

19:13

causing the stress in your life i

19:15

have to say a lot of people they think of therapy

19:18

as either weird or foreign or kind

19:20

of self indulgent and i

19:23

was like that for a long time and then

19:25

i found myself actually doing therapy as

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20:43

welcome back the helena we've

20:45

been talking to you goes to books excellent

20:47

why we did it by tim miller and the fantastic

20:50

thank you for your surgeon by mark leibovich and

20:52

they're basically as be said about what happened

20:55

to republicans with donald trump as president

20:57

and the implications of that going forward team

20:59

you have team whole

21:00

economy of a neighbor's which will get you in

21:02

the second button you know when i think about

21:05

the kind of ne plus ultra

21:07

enabler is the people who are most famous

21:10

for having been spears

21:12

relentless unyielding trump

21:14

critics who is susie got

21:16

nervous turned into trump toadies

21:19

slavishly devoted to him would do anything

21:21

for him sucked up to him to

21:23

the point where he worried a little bit about

21:26

whether they're going to have some fat one failure

21:28

because they're a second so hard on the donald trump

21:30

tits if you think about people like that

21:32

more the kevin mccarthy more

21:35

than you mack jace more

21:37

than anybody the person that we all

21:39

think about and the person who people of most questions

21:41

about his south carolina

21:43

senator lindsey graham knowing

21:45

criticised miss forcefully and no one is sucked

21:47

up harder to him after he became president

21:49

and to this day so i want to

21:51

play a little flip

21:53

flop sound of lindsey graham people

21:56

have seen these various supercuts that have been done this is

21:58

a very good one done by the washington post it was then

22:00

and twenty eighteen you always see or

22:02

throughout it pretty obviously places

22:04

where there's lindsay before from

22:06

the campaign processing trial the movie

22:08

after once trump against president and he

22:10

couldn't find any point to ever say than

22:12

critical about his new boyfriend so

22:15

let's play that tape and will talk about lindsey graham on the

22:17

other side

22:18

you know how you make america great again

22:20

till donald trump to go to have donald trump

22:22

is most old unelectable republican

22:25

athena my life dot he's not fit the

22:27

been frozen the monster republican party

22:29

has been kind here bring the not the worst

22:31

in us discouraged women opportunistic

22:34

religious figure three race baiting xenophobia

22:36

is a jackass no i don't think is is a

22:38

perfect race baiting religious for him as president

22:41

you don't have to run for president and be the world's

22:43

biggest jackass as he said poof

22:45

having his crazy you know what concerns me

22:47

about the american for us is this endless

22:50

endless an attempt to

22:52

label the guys some connor cook

22:55

not set to be press and honorably republican

22:58

his policies are really bad for the country's

23:00

gonna country's to hell far from donald trump

23:03

they're successful as possible because

23:06

number one i agree with and mostly out like

23:08

the president's the president's to help him a whole

23:10

be successful trump's foreign policy is

23:12

a complete disaster i think this strike

23:14

was a game changer there's a new sheriff in

23:16

town for president trump is done is is stored

23:19

deserves the nobel peace prize and then

23:21

some

23:22

that's like a minute of that club one minute of that

23:24

clip which goes a little bit before and after yeah i figure

23:26

if you listen to as you can tell which most of what's what blizzard

23:28

was a candidate vs when from because presidents

23:31

and and so i target the ball over to

23:33

to you have a law hand off just you

23:35

mark because you read a lot about lindsay

23:38

you know wednesday wealth and you spend a fella

23:40

time of the book like tried to us on because it's

23:42

us it is one of the most

23:44

ask questions in the about washington

23:47

among washingtonians and others like what

23:49

the fuck happened was a gram and what explains

23:51

this you about a pretty elaborate discussion

23:54

over to the book i want is hear you lay

23:56

out your theory of the case the spell automata

23:59

guy yeah i'm able to small

24:01

lindsay his ,

24:03

grail it's relevance rise minutes the

24:05

words he uses over and over again what has

24:07

relevance me mean at least to me it sounds

24:09

kind of passive word like okay

24:11

you're you're here you are relevant rights

24:14

lindsay gets incredible spiritual

24:16

sustenance from being

24:18

in the us set of is so but

24:21

in a full stop right i missed one

24:23

of his colleagues have to have

24:25

centrist democrats on this goes as and

24:27

there is no one in this body who needs

24:29

this job who needs the us senate more

24:31

than lindsey graham does and yeah

24:33

obviously without donald trump is supporting

24:35

you and having your back and satellites

24:38

to probably not going to be elected to the uss in south

24:40

carolina he also just loves

24:42

to used lindsey's term being at the dice stable

24:45

the dice stable is being in

24:47

the room being as tim put

24:49

it in the mix rights are being

24:52

it out on the golf course with donald trump

24:54

i mean that's what's politically very

24:56

helpful to him but it's also left the

24:58

guy's left thrill seeker he is a political

25:00

thrill seeker john mccain also

25:03

political thrill seeker yeah you could sort of hang

25:05

around with john mccain with donald trump and you're

25:07

going to be in the friend and it's lindsey

25:09

graham it's mean that is graham drug is that

25:12

hell of a drugs he actually talked about

25:14

it and sometimes it's some points in

25:16

the language of addicts he said you know being at the dice

25:18

table as an addiction as an energy around

25:20

it's and i need that so

25:22

yeah his own words i mean that sort of where where

25:24

he's coming from but yeah

25:26

i'm it's quite a thing to sit and listen to him

25:28

talking over the years sir tim

25:31

there's sir lindsey graham for small but

25:33

taxonomy and like ask you explain

25:35

all of these but they're good name's okay messiahs

25:37

into these messiahs demonize earth

25:39

l okay while nothing matters republicans tribal

25:41

us trawls strivers little

25:44

mixes that's the category that that wins

25:46

he falls into a peter principle disprove or nerd

25:48

adventures the inner team players the compartmentalizes

25:50

in the cartel catchers some of those are pretty suggestive

25:53

of what they mean some are easy to read the book which

25:55

is good reason why she by the spot why

25:57

we did it by tim miller explain the little

25:59

mixes how degree marxist alluded to the second

26:01

and and how you categorize wins in also

26:04

there's , great story of lindsay showing up

26:06

as we getting shit faced with you

26:09

and , and and bush a one points and highlight

26:11

just starting to hit the beginning of his of his

26:13

most anti trump period of like your

26:16

front of fire on the country and mobilize people to stop

26:18

him in the early part of twenty sixteen which good

26:20

story to tell yeah

26:22

i know if for the little mix categories first i use

26:24

rights is the main character mailbox rights free

26:27

bus and and lindsay of the upper as a

26:29

as kind of almost her as a spy right

26:31

it's gonna hurt right the ceilings even more more of an upscale

26:33

example of this than one hundred percent he

26:36

is even more in the mix and ryan says but

26:38

dance it's just and so the drug that

26:40

mark talks about i say and like that like every

26:43

striver city has these sort of drugs

26:45

right in hollywood it's his fame an addiction to fame

26:48

and fame and york it's money and d c

26:50

i'd people say it's power and

26:52

for somebody wants power but really it's more

26:54

like access to power it's downmarket

26:57

from power people like the and in the room where it happens

26:59

you'll have a hammer saying like being around

27:01

same the i go into golf cart with israel

27:03

i know yeah we're trending items that this is

27:05

the seats are people like to go

27:07

home and talk about you know how they are in the green

27:09

room who they took this is why this town like landed

27:12

right and so you get addicted

27:14

and us right i need to be in the mix and

27:16

need to feel important and that's lindsay and

27:18

that i guess planes as turn i think the

27:20

story is so late

27:22

in the campaign lindsay comes try to give jabba jokes

27:25

he dropped out we were already on our

27:27

death march and lindsay endorsed job

27:30

because i i do you think at that point it was genuine he think

27:32

he thought you would have been the best candidates maybe

27:34

that was mr sentencing but as you genuinely

27:37

believe that's and so we'd keep him around

27:39

all the time for the month because he's

27:41

geezer you and well as he's a hoot right

27:43

and so when you're on a losing campaign you're driving

27:45

around the hampshire like i'd i once

27:47

had eric cantor and the car with us for one hour

27:49

and i called down the headquarters and i'm i get eric

27:52

cantor the fuck out of us thought right existent

27:54

our i keep down

27:56

you know ah talking about being negative

27:59

that's not me the i going to make jokes about midgets

28:02

in lindsey vonn been a light sleeper that lists

28:04

and the com okay so anyway so

28:06

lindsey's around a lot for the last month and

28:08

one of these nights were window your

28:10

a good own tv interviews and relax

28:13

hotel and for fan lindsay

28:15

endeavored as on one like they're dancing in scotland

28:17

is i can shard may unlike they're out

28:20

there outpacing me by quite a bedside i

28:22

get you know right a press release or something in the mornings

28:24

and lindsay just won't go to bed as

28:26

he keeps me up all night job sneaks out league as

28:28

the bathroom live music example i target comes

28:31

a big it's he's a racist we gotta stop

28:33

i'm gonna ruin the country and or and all that shit

28:35

you heard i'd he he said even worst

28:37

of about trump them and then he'd call me then for

28:39

like weeks every night to stagger

28:41

what do we knew to south term how do we need cap on

28:43

how can we fuck him up his horribly raises he's

28:46

a big it said this was not perform and right

28:48

it's like lindsay as a performer so

28:50

you could see how maybe you saying that during the primary

28:52

because it was some sort of political performance that wasn't

28:54

true like the cameras are far off he was

28:56

to go about bottles of chardonnay in the bag

28:58

and like this was his genuine view of donald

29:00

trump moon that he that he flipped on

29:02

because he liked spin in the mix up at right

29:05

as things as i mean i don't know i don't mean

29:07

to be to like

29:08

you know

29:09

earnest about this way about but like i

29:12

get i mean what i'm a mother lives

29:15

i get the that although intoxicating

29:17

qualities of proximity to power and all that

29:19

stuff and how much that so a commodity in washington

29:21

and it's always has been it's true and other worlds

29:23

to split amazing to me because i

29:25

had to i think that you would seem that story was not

29:28

to me i didn't find us read

29:30

or on credible which is to say i think that would

29:32

lindsay as is not like someone is a believe anything and

29:34

he actually believed all the stuff he said about trump's

29:36

and then in the end it was like okay

29:39

if it's either totally abandoned my

29:41

actual beliefs in be able to

29:43

have that bugs that indoors kitchen their proximity

29:45

to power or sticker middle east

29:48

and be walked out of four years without trump he's

29:50

like but that out obama please i decided

29:52

that i need the proximity more than i did get

29:54

any conviction that's what i can

29:56

forgive the super proposed our but in diapers

29:58

you can make against human being let me don't

30:00

i also don't underestimate the power of

30:02

fear of boredom and

30:05

, you grow up in like tiny town

30:07

south carolina rentals north carolina

30:09

or south carolina you

30:12

know is it's a it's a kind of a quiet

30:14

life usually cook in march

30:16

spoke the thing from marks like that was the saddest

30:18

thing for me about the hall any

30:20

of any of my interviews i think there was

30:23

this quote from lindsay about

30:25

how him in john mccain used

30:28

to get on their high horse too much with i

30:30

thought that was the most revealing thing in that like in some

30:32

ways he did change right in some ways he

30:34

made a tactical moves to be tempted

30:37

stay in the mix been other ways it seemed

30:39

like he had convinced himself that like that's

30:41

the good stuff he used to do like be on the high

30:43

horse was when they were doing good stuff and they're advocating

30:46

for we care about this issue so much

30:48

that we're gonna get on our high horse and advocate

30:50

for whatever it was you know immigrants on navy sometimes

30:53

in in foreign policy wasn't it great stuff

30:55

but it was use weights i care about climate

30:57

you know we need to be nicer to immigrants like that so

30:59

he'd come to believe the not actually

31:02

was bad that when him in mccain

31:04

got that you got to to

31:06

earnest to genuine i

31:08

use that was really depressing revealing

31:11

quote from marks book for me because

31:13

it was like man either it was bad

31:15

or it was a burden like it's

31:17

just it's a real pain in the ass to be on high

31:19

horse right it's just it it's kind of liberating

31:21

to be off dot or since since

31:24

him this question about how all of this

31:26

persisted even after the insurrection

31:28

the now than at that's how many thought maybe

31:30

they advertise rationalizations for sticking

31:32

with trump for a long time but after this the poor

31:35

still turn on him and him and didn't you

31:37

have one story i think that speaks to this

31:39

in the most vivid way imaginable

31:41

and a lot of ways lindsey graham is one of the most

31:43

exquisitely drawing characters in webos

31:46

bucks and i would say like the most memorable

31:48

characters i'd from yourself and your but is

31:50

this friend of yours name's caroline could

31:53

you introduce the beauty the buck and a prologue

31:55

i thank and then you don't get to earth until

31:57

the end of the book where you really spend two chapters

32:00

her impact on a drunken interviews

32:02

with are you trying to get about this woman who was

32:05

a are really genuine close personal

32:07

friend of yours works with you on huntsman was

32:09

not the kind of person you thought whatever work for trump did

32:12

and what and and didn't work for trump but

32:14

like became fully enmeshed in trump

32:16

world and it was still a mess and trump

32:18

world after january sixth and

32:20

you go and try to like grapple with her she

32:23

now campus character which is to have emblematic

32:25

of the larger thing act against

32:27

two chapters is it's zealand ain't all the

32:30

reservations of all the other characters that when

32:32

that when is that that's exactly right and you think

32:34

and and so what what's your as you i'm he

32:36

write about us in the book having spent hours with

32:38

her having lodgings getting like

32:40

yelp as they say getting naked been added mean that literally

32:43

with her about her feelings about all this against

32:45

heavy an emotional what's your take away like

32:47

we like your that that again discovered that

32:49

for a more son who's college this is

32:51

this is the culminating thing of the book

32:55

how does this her name's on the on

32:57

the pyramids for the junior six houses

32:59

such as they are anti helps to organize

33:02

and , know kind of just sees herself as one

33:05

part of his big ecosystem still after all

33:07

this time to decide i see my

33:09

has one little mid level person

33:11

is part of this game you know the mid level oil man

33:13

nike you know twisted like not before

33:15

the spell right and and and

33:18

that may and and i saw it at

33:20

you know when there's deaths right when when

33:22

their own trump of home voters are dying

33:24

and going to jail over this that's how i tried

33:26

to break through door and certosa you realize

33:29

that realize you are it's

33:31

not your fault really big your complicit

33:33

in this like you're in a willingness and it's donald

33:35

trump's fault and and people need to stand

33:37

up to him and people died because of this

33:39

and his own supporters died and

33:42

it was then where i got i felt like i got the closest

33:44

to breaking her and

33:47

and i just he knows as doing the

33:49

good will hunting you know like it's okay

33:51

it's not your fault thing trying to time that

33:53

strategy i just didn't work didn't couldn't breaker

33:56

and man like we have we have teary by the skin breaker

33:58

and and when it comes down for me

34:00

is is truth to have her is true

34:02

of i write more comedic li that chris christie

34:05

you know who is a good example the so literally

34:07

almost got killed by down to your own secret

34:09

life or death like down trump's i mean kind of not

34:12

reckless homicide or know you call it

34:14

but i you know he'd have knew he had covered

34:16

he gave it to chris christie who has some com morbidity

34:19

them pretty far as ah didn't

34:21

sell chris christie said that he

34:23

had cove it when it when in us coast

34:25

schools in space within christie almost dies

34:27

trump call them and of and just as can be

34:29

going to blame it on him centrist he goes back

34:31

up campaigns form again i

34:33

so how does this happen like in the face of

34:35

these deaths on the mall and case cause physios

34:38

dying and liking answered i come to is just

34:40

that all of these self as rationalizations

34:43

like these stories we tell ourselves or just like much

34:45

stronger than i realized right as

34:47

a you get it for people who are sociopath

34:49

soon as i i just want power fab and you

34:51

know ah and that i care about but all

34:54

these other i cannot she's

34:56

or been all things like the hatred of

34:58

the left the desire to be in the mix

35:00

the desire to feel important all

35:03

that stuff ended up being much more

35:05

powerful than i realized and

35:08

and and i think that you would it really

35:10

came down to is on the sex is that all

35:12

of the rationalizations that got them up to that

35:14

terrible moments like we're still operative

35:16

when the sun came up came next i write like some

35:18

people died bit of you a justified

35:20

going on top because you either money or

35:23

because you have been in the mix or because you just hate

35:25

the last in the works gold so much like

35:27

you still hate the left analog school did the still

35:29

want to be in the makes me so what money the next morning

35:31

i just get somebody died doesn't change

35:33

that that was and my

35:36

as hell i'd explain and tail and says make

35:38

you feel good about human nature but i thought that

35:40

was my observations are i were going to one

35:42

were quick outbreak and and will be right back for the final

35:44

part of the second part of our to

35:46

bars special interview with mercury bitch

35:48

and tim miller fear on helena

36:03

welcome back to helena wondered so

36:05

guys i don't see much on television

36:07

that cheers me up with our it comes

36:09

republicans are gives me god forbid sense

36:12

of hope about the stand the nation's future

36:14

of the country the future the party is of the the job

36:16

he but last week i did there

36:18

was a little piece of a viral video

36:20

than life of a common ground that at least i

36:22

mean at least he cheered me up and maybe i've

36:24

been my most optimistic moment i'm topic

36:26

and if people start to see this kind

36:28

of behavior which is like breaking from

36:31

lockstep conformist america

36:34

see no evil hear no evil speak no evil

36:36

about other republicans the age of trump maybe they

36:38

start to see this that this is an effective

36:40

communication strategies kind of barbed

36:43

critical plainspoken

36:45

truth telling and just brutal

36:48

brutal power of we're about to listen

36:50

to hear maybe that also to change things a little bit

36:52

south the context here is mike pence we

36:54

talked about this already he gave the speech we

36:57

criticize it at the top of part one of the podcasts

37:00

use maybe the only place and was the three of us share

37:02

some common ground with one of the great trump enabler

37:04

small time that would be matt gates who

37:06

also decided that mike pence didn't

37:09

do very good job in that speech the

37:11

other day and so matt gates on

37:13

loaded on mike pence and

37:15

when he did cnn

37:18

that night with arab or net was

37:20

former vice president pence his former

37:22

chief of staff more short and he was able to

37:25

respond to match gates sluts

37:27

listen to that your first your mac is talking

37:29

about mike pence and then you'll hear march short talking

37:32

about nuggets

37:33

or america is probably

37:36

also imagine not some low

37:38

energy roadside renault safari

37:44

no let me to say what everybody

37:46

here knows

37:48

my parents will never be president

37:53

a way

37:56

the

37:57

wow i don't have my concern

37:59

for present

37:59

the time for but i don't think

38:02

my case i have an impact on that fact

38:04

i'd be surprised if he was still voting is more

38:06

likely to be in prison for child

38:08

sex trafficking by twenty twenty four and

38:10

i'm actually surprised of for the law enforcement

38:12

so lousy speak to see news conferences

38:15

like that so i'm not to worry about mack

38:17

a thanks

38:18

nine one one nine one one i'd like to report a homicide

38:20

you know more churches blighted did something we'd ever seems

38:22

more short before i in my knowledge i

38:24

guess it's just like just turned around

38:26

with a with a switchblade and plunged it

38:29

right the middle of have a mac it's his forehead

38:31

on national television and agrees that gives me

38:33

hope should be obvious you

38:35

know which is like that's the kind of

38:37

thing we never heard anybody from within

38:39

the tenth do for not

38:41

just for years but really five and a half years

38:43

all up from twenty seventeen to

38:46

that night like we haven't heard

38:48

very much about what people leave the tents they

38:50

do that but more switched on the tax

38:52

rate is like still a close to my pens and pencils

38:55

very much trying to like the underscoring professor

38:57

with donald trump's votes see the least maybe

39:00

like some of the ice is cracking a little bit or am

39:02

i am i delusional are we

39:05

one of the ruins your but i've met

39:07

, is an easy target to be one thing to say

39:09

about my gates i'm in his trunk himself

39:11

were sort of taken down ten notches by

39:13

a mark sorts in that moment of

39:15

be a lot more satisfying and and i'm always

39:17

amazed and and we've all talked about this

39:20

at at how little ammunition

39:22

is actually hurled at trump the price you can

39:25

you can take him down so many ways

39:27

now and any such a loser you

39:29

done so badly for the republican party

39:32

you know they you know so many offices

39:35

but now maybe people are like

39:37

sort of not afraid to speak up more

39:39

but again i mean that they do said

39:41

of leave the big target and

39:43

you know on attacked city and i know

39:46

i know that i guess i the guards you say this on tv

39:48

last week that your view

39:50

was if only people just how what we've i

39:52

just said which is like of own way people

39:54

would take that same kind of that they take that seems

39:56

a switchblade out in pledges for into trump's

39:58

forehead metaphorically that would

40:00

be a real sign of progress i guess my question

40:03

is isn't that a mean while

40:05

i don't want to and i won't ever be naive about a

40:07

things i'm not trying to say like the whole world is a taste

40:09

of march short me this one com about my gates by the that

40:12

not culprit providing an instruction manual

40:14

for what is gonna be necessary

40:17

yes some people in the party

40:19

who are you know former

40:22

mega people wanna try to stop donald trump

40:24

is kind like this is what it needs a look like guys

40:26

yeah rain cloud alert or the i'm not there before

40:29

yeah john i'm happy that you're helpful

40:31

but down i i just going back to my armchair

40:33

psychology of the book is like mark

40:36

sure it's rationalizations have changed

40:38

since january says right i mean like matt would

40:40

have i don't know much on an interview i'm sort of know if he's a little

40:43

max or what he has but you know like you would

40:45

ever where the rational visit the gotten him to being

40:47

a t the staff for downtime size president's

40:49

you know are not operative anymore because

40:51

mike pence has been cut out right and so he

40:54

and anon you know he does have a little bit of freedoms

40:56

tactically speaking i love seeing that

40:59

ah but you know

41:01

it wind it wind that

41:03

get turned towards trump it's just

41:06

it's hard to kind of imagine what

41:08

that looks like right and i and i i

41:10

don't know and it's kind of unknown unknown

41:12

right which is you know that

41:14

to beat donald trump you're gonna have to kill all right

41:17

but does but does santas have

41:20

the skills to kill them you

41:22

know maybe we don't know i get his apostle around

41:24

hint of goes out and starts haymaker in trump

41:26

and all son he looks like a never trump or else

41:29

i just it's it they're all that is tv de

41:32

vita yes sir alan cohen

41:34

maggots pedophiles as i guess with stuff in the right

41:36

right well as i'm max or and i'll take that

41:38

i got over the alternative maybe i didn't regret

41:40

maybe i didn't actually maybe i should in excess his

41:42

house for hoping i started abusing maybe that's wrong

41:44

about how there is a great line i have one

41:47

last he says and applied just directly your point at

41:49

him which is i do want to like just very quickly

41:51

have you guys answer the question that when twenty four

41:53

and what you think of this potential the

41:56

conflict between trump and and dissenters and here was run

41:58

as an issue last

42:00

week as you've you've alluded to tim of

42:02

by one of most aggressively homophobic anti

42:04

trans or partitions probably the most

42:06

aggressively i am up again he trans

42:09

or partition america right now sort of any consequence

42:11

of a governor of florida are he went out

42:13

last week he does have something every week

42:15

that as clear presidential ah motivations

42:18

aspirations and intense and last week

42:20

for the basically said they were to reject the federal guidelines

42:22

on gender identity instruction ah

42:25

and and he was asked about it a press conference as what

42:27

he said

42:28

this will be for elementary school kids were there

42:30

instructed the talent well you may

42:32

have been born a boy that may have been what you said

42:34

but maybe you're really a girl that's

42:36

wrong that has no place in school

42:38

so that is happening in our country any

42:40

one that tells you it's not happening is

42:43

lying to you so i think what we did in

42:45

florida was very important

42:47

to lay down a marker to make sure

42:49

that that's not something that the gained a foothold

42:51

here in the state of florida and

42:53

that again or kids are able to be kids

42:56

the like him off rather see you you ask

42:58

the question now you can answer why do

43:00

people say run as as as the smarter trump does

43:02

he have you think as one of his what you seen

43:04

and all of your ear years as of a hatchet

43:06

wielding republican operative amazon

43:09

anti trump card commentator arms and

43:11

up with now out memoir as i'm

43:13

when you watch run the scientists you think

43:15

that guy could take on trump head

43:17

to head or do you think trump or just roll right the fuck over

43:20

i think of tbd and the and the lifespan

43:22

under the klieg lights are they got it i think

43:24

that he's he's good at one thing that

43:27

trump is good at which is using the

43:29

conservative media ah to

43:31

his to his personal brand advantage and

43:33

and dot dissenters has that down like you're

43:35

saying like every week it's was almost to run

43:37

the sanders is there's like one that appeals to jab

43:40

down there in florida it's like actually doing real

43:42

legislating which is another different from trump

43:44

he does actual legislative and then there's

43:46

like fox rhonda santas which the almost

43:48

not a whole different person but beds another side

43:50

of his personality he's good at that's he's

43:52

good at waging culture war stuff okay

43:55

what happens the first time donald trump

43:58

you know calls and tub iran

43:59

you know and like i

44:03

i ok i wouldn't know what ever they

44:05

sort of observatory sat i think she either as

44:07

either say the one from has gone to so far

44:09

as much as i would ever want to help some

44:11

better on that good that the nicknames but you know and i mean

44:13

one album that was the one that starts

44:16

i don't now and end and you know you that you

44:18

that a thing which i suffered through any

44:21

at some tears the as or anyway as a conference

44:23

on this weekend but

44:25

you've got to

44:26

right i gave a underperformance side

44:29

of things on the stage in our so

44:31

as and and i also once

44:33

you become here once you decide

44:35

you're gonna run against trump you become anti trump

44:37

right so then how does that affect his brand

44:40

i think that's also tbd ray that

44:42

the at your neck know the do the ted cruz thing which

44:44

is like i love mister trump so much

44:46

but i just you know might be time for and to move on

44:48

like that's not gonna work so i

44:50

think there's a lot of unknown but i think

44:52

that he skilled for sure and of

44:54

trump disappeared that heart attack

44:56

or whenever i see would i'm certainly be the favorite

44:59

of favorite wide margin to margin got

45:01

by george w bush to ninety to

45:03

ninety favorite not like it i am twenty six

45:06

times i wholly agree with that hour

45:08

mark i you look like just thought looky here

45:10

as your as revitalize facial expressions are you think

45:12

like if

45:14

you put those schwab had had the trumpet when crushed

45:16

to santa i i can play with a certain

45:18

area i think eric trump would absolutely

45:20

destroy him as a trump it

45:23

makes absolute sport of people

45:26

who are not comfortable in their own skin

45:28

people who are not entertaining people

45:31

who are , sent

45:33

us to be perfectly there was

45:35

perfectly there it's just elsa

45:38

look i'm in from several people

45:40

who know rather sad to somebody isn't is not a lovable

45:42

guy nadu trump just

45:45

strikes me as me as really bad

45:47

matchup for understand as but yeah so

45:49

as you get you in in the waiting around here from

45:52

runs a judge said truck trump runs again or

45:54

not marks sure one him

45:58

yeah for course yeah what at welford

45:59

the edu both think if he runs us nomination

46:03

def the other nomination as limit the right thing about

46:05

an eye as always i caught seventy thirty

46:07

dollars oughta unknowns out there but people could

46:09

risk and of get sick of i'm like you never

46:11

know i just around his could be better than we

46:13

think i just think seventy thirty and in a maybe

46:15

eighty twenty and he's a clear favorite but not

46:18

i wouldn't say hundreds if you think god

46:20

you think plants and josh how he has national

46:22

future have read the racing for the capital

46:25

and his site without without one way idea of

46:27

yesterday the picture of josh holly and the really

46:29

tight shirt get in the why our

46:31

top top rak somebody

46:33

to the goes around the level of just how this

46:35

this is that where amtrak the josh holloway a man

46:37

of the people thing is now and guys you guys

46:40

you think that i'm with i'd i'd marquees

46:42

expired runs again are now man

46:47

the i think he probably will i i

46:49

kind of think he probably shouldn't

46:51

but yeah my own he didn't ask me

46:53

to me i'm worried

46:55

is going to cause i think he just seems stubborn and

46:57

and i think if trump runs he feels like he's the only

47:00

guy that could beat em which i don't know that's

47:02

true by that said he would thank him enough good

47:04

reason the think it based on happened so ah

47:06

but i don't know that he'd get a clear

47:09

clear primary i think there's a chance someone

47:11

from outside the beltway would say we need

47:14

we need to have a real maybe

47:16

that's nice but it has been amusing watching

47:18

our devotees him to get into up a fight

47:20

with the broader santas from california i'm

47:22

which is outstanding credible army

47:24

of i don't think gavin as about the after

47:26

a fire in a primary have a someone outside

47:28

of it established a fine doesn't run

47:30

marker you think if there were but the democrats favorite is this

47:32

only one right answer this and if you get it wrong on every

47:34

bit as okay

47:36

so i assume yeah timer com ela i

47:39

would say i also

47:41

bad news or was all objects i onset

47:43

are minimal

47:44

that fetterman klobuchar

47:47

, would say

47:50

tim ryan

47:51

you know is that know i say i

47:54

just get online com was the other how he

47:56

can hang out yet you can't eat out with an impact

47:58

nomination without without the majority black voters

48:00

and and whatever by voters are arb

48:03

above first the first blacks

48:05

are female vice president or she's going to walk

48:07

in the door with a lot of oil supplements is

48:09

it possible sega lose their body but it's possible

48:12

but old bill ill take a lot still think a lotta

48:14

to dislodge the from her in the way that it would

48:16

have liked to have tried to was likely from job i

48:18

know it's like this again not guaranteed

48:20

but she's galleries or front runner sitting there with

48:22

five hundred or smith as vice president with that

48:24

kind of connection that's

48:26

right endorser but yeah i admit

48:28

you probably i guess or i guys

48:31

are that is basically that was that he was

48:33

at you didn't you have anything you want to say makes

48:35

your the rate you'll be bone to pick with lipo batteries book

48:38

though some you think she got the rides previous story right

48:40

we found a bone i think that i know i

48:43

think that responded with rights i think that rights

48:45

is a liar and so i guy just it's

48:47

funny i got a book does overlap and and

48:49

a couple of cases with spicer and lindsay

48:51

and rights and and there is a conflict

48:54

in the story of how rights got fired and how

48:56

humiliating it was and i

48:58

think that my version with slightly more humiliating

49:00

for seats was it's possible that was

49:03

with casting or possibility lied to leave

49:05

though or i don't outlaw rice

49:07

is not exactly known for his tanned earth

49:09

he i look bottom line

49:12

inspired by tweet left

49:14

on the tarmac it was raining these

49:16

are the essentials com isis

49:19

is on the other key the i added one other

49:21

key factors as he had been on the phone with trump

49:23

planning a golf dates oh and twelve

49:25

twelve had not mentioned in hand with and let's

49:27

say about mans into him that the tweet was coming

49:30

as another key factor absolutely answered

49:32

yet when they're something i ask what i think tim

49:35

said i was too nice to christie and

49:37

maybe not me that these when i didn't either think

49:39

is i have been remarried and zinner your way

49:41

to nice crispy wage you think

49:43

your to know when nice

49:45

right away to college degrees next book next

49:47

mark was like march disease like i gotta have some

49:49

targets for of for robbed or this town

49:51

three a young something that will know what i was

49:54

told i was still talk to me he had to as far

49:56

as i'm you guys have been

49:58

an utter delays and the

50:00

and the as your books these two bucks thank you very

50:02

servitude by mark leibovich and

50:04

why we did it by tim miller in

50:07

, been law books about down trump written in the trump

50:09

presidency but you guys decided to do

50:11

something different which was to really kind

50:13

of focus on the accomplices

50:15

the enablers and the and a culture

50:17

that allowed this to to take hold which

50:20

answers i think a fundamental question for a lot of people which

50:22

is i think we are water is circle discussion

50:24

about the degree to which that a good that you have he was

50:26

already ideologically bankrupting corrupt

50:28

when down from came along by

50:30

the sir it's certainly the case of this question ever

50:32

his mind he did we go from mitt romney

50:35

as a non new the party to know trump as

50:37

the president the next nominee in france has as the

50:39

like why we greatest or to a holiday questions that we

50:41

are to got with you guys both provide nervous i can say

50:43

to me a different perspective of of

50:46

, sex just sit

50:48

around and ah yes sir

50:50

yes sir present arms helena

50:53

water is water podcast from the rehouse thanks again

50:55

to mark leibovich and tim miller for being with

50:57

us remember to pick up marks new book thank

50:59

you for your servitude south from washington and

51:01

the price of submissions and also pick

51:03

up thames do but why we did

51:05

it a travelogue from for homework and rosa

51:07

health if you like upset with described high

51:10

water insurance and rate isn't with us on whatever

51:12

adding haven't used to best in the splendor

51:14

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51:18

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