0:01

If you listen to the show, you're more than aware

0:03

that our psychiatric emergency systems

0:05

are struggling to assist those in dire

0:07

need of help. But the Kennedy Center

0:09

Center, for Mental Health Equity, a subsidiary

0:11

of the satcher health leadership. At Morehouse. School

0:13

of Medicine is partnering with

0:15

Beacon Health Options, to establish

0:18

critical guidelines for dismantling an equity

0:20

through its new research and policy initiative.

0:22

And you can join the movement

0:24

to buy attending their upcoming Summit. Go

0:26

to Kennedy, Sachar. Org.

0:28

register today thats kennedy s

0:30

a t c h e r dot

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1:09

start your free trial of lemon at of lemon on

1:11

apple podcasts today

1:19

even we're talking

1:21

about guns homicide and suicide

1:23

we've worked hard to ensure that our storytelling

1:25

as as safe as possible but we can't

1:28

address this issue by avoiding difficult details

1:30

that of warning who should and

1:32

shouldn't listen the for each episode we

1:34

want to encourage you to press pause s

1:37

and when you need to please

1:39

note this episode contains discussion

1:41

of domestic abuse and graphic descriptions

1:44

of violence

1:48

i see a lot of stuff i've seen

1:50

a lot of suicides have seen a lot of death

1:53

by see a lot of hurting people

1:57

that's gonna say mind she's a volunteer

1:59

e m t

2:00

pretenders free time helping people access

2:02

mental health services in montana can

2:05

it was one of the the people we talked to

2:08

before traveling to montana i

2:10

then we felt like we basically talk to every

2:12

mental health professional and the mountain west so

2:15

we didn't really need more sources but several

2:17

people mention them and we figured one more call

2:20

couldn't hurt

2:21

started off like all , pre interview

2:23

as we do with experts what do you do

2:26

why do you do what you do yada yada yada

2:29

and things took and unexpected

2:31

turn i'll be honest

2:34

with your eyes

2:36

this is just between us right now i guess i don't

2:38

wanna have dissolved are

2:40

enough bombay there

2:43

was one moment right over after

2:45

i got a lot worse might have my done in my mouth

2:47

in was faltered and

2:50

the anything critical emmy of i would

2:52

look at our that's it

2:55

we hold a we caught off

2:57

guard by dennis confessing this deeply

3:00

personal private thing with me and the

3:02

team and , could hear him as

3:04

he was saying it and and disbelief

3:07

that it was even coming out of his mouth we

3:09

all got off the call the team isn't

3:11

years and maybe like maybe

3:14

day later dennis fell it up and said he

3:16

wanted to share his story on the show

3:18

so we scheduled a formal interview

3:21

and dennis came prepared

3:24

they got all this stuff arabia

3:27

is just

3:29

, i have things and it's is bullet

3:31

points to so i have i don't lose

3:33

mice mice know my when

3:36

i am i know i can terry now i

3:38

am nervous and

3:40

, nervous i'm excited

3:43

and certainly nervous and for that way so

3:46

with every that happen i i

3:48

decided that it's

3:50

right thing to do my wife and me and my

3:52

fact this morning just talked about you

3:55

, she says you know do what you're hardly to do

3:57

and so i am gonna

3:59

do

4:00

what my hardly me do and i'm going to talk about sauce

4:03

that's where i'm at

4:04

okay

4:07

so let's start at the beginning

4:10

enough of a cop he was dealing with the

4:12

worst possible cases you can imagine

4:16

and , seen law and order special victims unit

4:19

i was essentially dennis his life fourteen

4:21

years holy for test

4:24

and child and sexual abuse cases

4:27

yeah he's seen a lot

4:30

of really traumatic service

4:32

and he was doing it without any

4:34

real mental health support in place

4:37

honestly i'd i did see what

4:39

it was doing to me inside be honest with you

4:42

i i , what i did

4:44

then as i just got a priest softer side saying

4:46

okay okay is go

4:48

there you're helping people you see

4:50

the worst of the worst the and

4:53

and it's just part it's how that

4:56

as part of career as as part of a it's part of the

4:58

job for joy for preference

5:01

along him and your preference ,

5:03

tells ya okay your your mind says okay

5:05

since you seem to seem quite

5:07

a bit now and it's real

5:11

the after pouring everything and us

5:13

career that had taken up so much space

5:15

in his heart and soul dennis

5:18

decided it was the for a change

5:21

talk my wife and

5:24

made the decision the decision in go on forces

5:26

mom been some time

5:28

to said figure out when

5:31

i wanna do the

5:33

within six month period of me leave and

5:35

and before and after that

5:38

, finally finally

5:40

i was certain to struggle

5:43

the new dennis was leaving law enforcement

5:45

for the sake of has mental health it

5:47

was was transition i

5:50

mean he was suddenly waking up with

5:52

so much time on his hands and know

5:55

somewhat idea what to do with it routine

5:58

even a sad and i live in one

6:01

is comforting losing that

6:03

can throw everything into question

6:06

then if eventually found himself at a breaking

6:08

point i

6:10

was

6:12

this really on a hard day i

6:15

can't even remember the details of the day

6:17

but i know i would

6:20

probably wasn't fun to be around

6:22

and i was so

6:25

angry at the world and

6:30

they got to the point where i said life

6:34

this is now worth anymore and

6:40

i decided i'm going back to the bedrooms warehouse

6:43

and

6:46

i'm gonna i'm gonna be done

6:51

that my gun

6:55

and know

6:57

, a forty caliber weapon it's it's

7:00

it's firearms a firearm

7:02

see don't get much chance you can take the

7:04

boards back right arm

7:07

and i made us as the

7:10

a decision this at one point don't

7:12

know why i

7:14

, but again in my mouth arms

7:17

my wife

7:19

and daughter must have heard something and

7:21

, came back into the back bedroom i

7:23

had i done in my mouth mouth

7:26

had my finger on the trigger which has

7:29

long for saucer near put your finger near put trigger i'm

7:31

ushered in a suit it though

7:35

i'm lucky i'm

7:37

, that didn't go off because it so

7:40

easily easily put a one off ah

7:43

i'm something happened where i

7:46

must have heard her my daughter's

7:48

the cry and or whatever and

7:50

i put the gun down

7:54

when we talked again as he kept mentioning

7:56

the impact that this experience had

7:59

on his wife and daughter

8:00

who walked in to find

8:02

ten with a time in his mouth when

8:06

i heard economic

8:08

he can't imagine it seems

8:10

he would have caused them that he died

8:13

that day a hand

8:15

it so easily the could have

8:17

gone that way

8:19

then he feels free fall and

8:21

conflicted and the whole

8:24

thing is still so complicated

8:27

even now he's not totally

8:29

sure how to frame the story

8:32

i would never say that was his who sent survivor i

8:36

sell our time think about that that

8:38

i truly believe i i guess i am

8:41

and here i am i'm a second guess myself

8:43

maybe to

8:46

to that is a processor you know your i

8:48

don't want to be either be either want i'm

8:51

not i don't want to be weak the oh

8:53

that's another thing is stigma is people

8:55

don't want to talk about suicide because

8:58

you're , then then people

9:01

that are known as known that

9:04

were live in and

9:06

night attention

9:08

to what was going on with yourself so

9:10

i think i learned that

9:13

, boy all

9:16

can fall into that trap and i fell

9:18

into a trap

9:20

over the last two seasons are big

9:22

question has been how do you make

9:25

it through a moment of crisis even

9:28

if specifically how in the world

9:30

do you make it through a moment of crisis when a gun

9:33

is involved like we heard

9:35

so many times before sire

9:37

the are defined to be as

9:39

a lethal as possible that's

9:41

the point usually don't get

9:44

a second chance when a gun is involved how

9:48

for this last episode of season three

9:51

going to hear from the survivors

9:54

of , lived there

9:59

he the

10:13

no human and i was watching

10:15

jon stewart shell

10:16

they were doing an episode on guns

10:20

worse , worse if it wasn't really really

10:22

situation that was warranted lose custody

10:24

of your gone for a month but

10:26

it's not a way to save some

10:29

how is that even in question

10:30

the argument you get a lot of signs

10:33

is it is star year with with

10:35

full and back sun rises here take this

10:37

guns away in these situations and you just come up with

10:39

another situation week heavens and then another

10:42

as the in a nail

10:43

the slippery slope it's not a slippery

10:45

slope were already at the bottom of the

10:47

hill that people

10:49

ross talking to john c

10:51

empower advocate cannot paulson went

10:54

on the show to talk about gun violence

10:56

and america and i was

10:58

totally blown hey i

11:00

both of them like dennis

11:03

these two women have survived terrifying

11:06

moment of crisis and ,

11:08

case the gun wasn't in their hands

11:10

it was in the hands of their abusers

11:13

abusers this is a big deal

11:16

and we haven't yet addressed the seasons

11:18

that nearly two thirds of intimate

11:20

partner homicides are with goons

11:23

domestic violence and is five times

11:26

more likely to be killed when

11:28

their abuser has ought to athens

11:30

and just in case you need one more her as

11:32

extent than in the us twenty

11:35

i'm more likely to be killed by

11:37

than than women and other high

11:40

income countries twenty one times

11:43

but it

11:43

you have relationship given as obvious

11:45

as it might seem even

11:48

when you're in the middle of one

11:51

hi fi you know now that everything's

11:53

and folded people always kind of they thought

11:55

that i would been someone who could

11:57

have quote unquote seen it coming

12:00

that's because april new more

12:03

than most she'd spent years

12:05

and law school helping survivors

12:07

a domestic violence secure protective

12:09

orders after graduating

12:11

she eventually landed a job as a prosecutor

12:15

around that same time i was still dating my

12:17

high school sweethearts and

12:19

shortly after me getting out of

12:21

law school we got engaged

12:23

and married our relationship

12:25

was always

12:28

a bit tumultuous nasa

12:31

the that i recognize as abuses

12:33

at the time but probably would have

12:35

called a little bit unhealthy mean

12:37

even toxic and at

12:39

the moment that he proposed to me i'll be

12:41

honest with you my my

12:43

instincts my and sauna we as and was

12:46

you know oh shit you know this know this really

12:48

works

12:50

i don't know if i really want to but

12:52

let you know you're kind of you

12:54

, trained in any kind of programmed

12:57

as a woman that that's what's yours useful

12:59

to strive to to married

13:02

having a family and ah settling

13:04

down and sell this was to me

13:06

my best shot in i didn't really

13:08

are probably the best self esteem if i'm being

13:10

honest and thought that i wouldn't

13:12

ruin find anyone else and even though

13:14

he didn't see the dance i also thought maybe the

13:17

mares to be a reset you know some of

13:19

the behavior that was harmful and hurtful

13:22

was are dating years things

13:25

didn't work out i gave us a lot

13:28

in fact marry my spot

13:30

on mauritius her husband became

13:32

increasingly manipulative controlling

13:35

and hurtful eventually april

13:38

had had enough so honey fourteen

13:40

they split up

13:42

that's operation ah led

13:44

me to feel like oh

13:47

this this this is not amir's i think

13:49

i'll take into abu of really sell free

13:51

and i can't breathe for the first time in

13:53

a long time and so on

13:56

the weather long after was i lost him that

13:58

i decided that i wanted to the prominent

14:00

in file for divorce i

14:02

believed that even

14:06

though he was is playing some alarming behaviors

14:09

ultimately that we were working out

14:12

what was gonna end up being an amicable divorce

14:15

we didn't have children out ah

14:17

the only property we aren't with the house which house

14:19

which agreed to give him and of and i'm in

14:21

the joint bank accounts ah my sister

14:24

was ready to give it all up i just wanted to be

14:26

free and to start mile

14:29

finally april and her husband came

14:31

to an agreement about the divorce them

14:34

into a bank i know the necessary paperwork

14:36

that it notarized and , as

14:38

they were walking back to their cars for

14:41

has been announced that he had a gift for her she

14:43

handed her handed paperback

14:46

what would inside was to toil plastic

14:49

water guns you know me

14:51

wanting told me that i'm it

14:53

, up to media you know make the first mover

14:55

since we pull the trigger on

14:58

and it was all for sharing of course

15:00

that he wanted you know you're telling me

15:03

and maybe and not so subtle way now looking

15:05

at it that he is that he for divorce

15:08

the that you know that

15:11

would be source the beginning

15:13

of the end the

15:15

time

15:16

april just shrugged it off it

15:18

didn't feel like a genuine threat

15:21

how p filed the divorce papers

15:23

as planned few days later

15:25

she was driving with a friend on a strange

15:27

beat up car pulled up

15:29

the didn't know at at the time there

15:32

was her husband armed and

15:34

ready to ambush the

15:37

time i recognize he was

15:39

even

15:40

the window of the car a me

15:42

talking about a split second

15:44

before the time i saw him to

15:46

the mama he was raised in advance and i'll tell

15:48

you probably the only reason i'm alive in the

15:50

always now was shot three times as because

15:53

the passenger my car ah

15:55

who someone i'd known for i had known for wow

15:58

hi antibody and blast and he that

16:00

six times

16:03

what i was shot in in the face in that

16:05

the bullet went through my jaw ah

16:08

and , was also sadness on right

16:10

forearm and then at the that kind

16:13

of slumped forward in in the third time

16:15

when when my back and hit me

16:17

in me in up

16:20

here my next which left

16:22

knee paralyzed from the chest down

16:27

a few hours later april's has been less and

16:30

he had died from a self inflicted gunshot

16:32

wounds

16:37

i don't think april ever could have imagined their

16:39

story ending this way even

16:42

with all the red flags it

16:44

didn't look away these relationships

16:46

are typically portrayed because

16:49

she wasn't sure if it was bad enough

16:52

she say and the tried

16:54

to make it work that even

16:56

though it didn't start with physical abuse

16:58

a home and eat at an unspeakable

17:01

finance saturday

17:04

she's working to redefine abuse

17:06

so that people can identify the signs and

17:08

get help earlier isn't

17:11

doing this work alone

17:14

after the break we meet janet a

17:16

woman is joining her in the fight

17:30

you might have heard of nine eight eight the new national

17:32

psychiatric crisis line that's launching in july

17:35

but our country psychiatric emergency systems

17:37

are already struggling to meet the needs of the most

17:40

vulnerable and historically marginalized communities

17:43

how can we make sure that nine they can reach

17:45

all americans to offer aid

17:47

that's right a kennedy satcher center for mental

17:50

health equity a subsidiary at the centre

17:52

half later

17:52

that more how school of medicine is partnering

17:55

with deacon health options to establish

17:57

the critical guidelines needed to dismantle

17:59

enough the threats newly created research

18:02

and policy initiatives

18:03

you can learn more about their upcoming policy

18:06

breeze embedding equity into nine

18:08

a date imagining a new normal for

18:10

crisis response and also about

18:12

the national rollout and nine eight eight itself

18:14

at a virtual half day leadership summit

18:17

on june twenty first join

18:19

the movement go to kennedy saturday

18:20

dot org to register today thats kennedy

18:23

s a t c h e r dot

18:27

nami the national alliance on mental illness

18:29

as the nations largest grassroots mental health

18:31

organization dedicated to building better lives

18:33

for the millions of americans affected by mental

18:35

illness their toll free phone helpline

18:38

serves as a nationwide peer support

18:40

system providing information resource

18:42

referrals and support to people living

18:44

with mental health conditions their family members

18:47

mental help providers and the public nami

18:49

also offers free virtual peer support

18:52

groups and facilitates widespread programming

18:54

and service of suicide prevention they

18:57

work in constant pursuit of their vision a

18:59

world that embraces and prioritizes mental

19:01

health and mental illness to learn more

19:03

find your local affiliate is at n a

19:05

m i dot org you can also

19:07

call their helpline at one eight hundred nine

19:09

five zero nami

19:11

and i am i from ten am to ten

19:13

pm eastern monday through friday

19:15

i

19:18

was married for fifteen years

19:21

and the last five

19:24

years and he

19:26

was kenneth spiralling out

19:28

of control

19:30

janet paulson she lives in acworth

19:32

georgia about an hour north of atlanta

19:35

she's a mom of two twin boys who

19:37

both play college baseball today during

19:40

, last five years of marriage her husband scott

19:42

started dealing with some significant mental

19:44

health and addiction issues he didn't

19:46

get help and help took a lot

19:48

of it out on jan

19:50

i wasn't physically abusive a sexual

19:53

abuse this emotional abuse

19:55

he was just flat out mean

19:57

and as his alcohol

20:00

consumption increase

20:03

it just got off the chain the

20:05

chain knew what is he gonna do next

20:07

to nothing

20:09

got behavior just got more

20:12

and more erratic

20:14

my boys they're twins they were thirteen

20:17

at the time and they came to me and they said no

20:20

he's drinking with us in the fact that the truck

20:22

that was like white

20:25

then he would pick them up from football practice

20:28

and even go and get spencer

20:30

beer anyone part in the graveyard

20:33

emma hundred

20:35

thirty years my children in the back of a far

20:38

the dark and

20:40

he threatened them and she go to your mom

20:42

or else and when

20:44

they came and told me the episode

20:47

i try to get a medical science they

20:49

try to get him into bs

20:51

he the us wanted and

20:55

i was willing to leave everything behind when

20:59

i went in and i said

21:01

the seen as a single

21:03

after single after time you're not happy i'm not happy

21:06

it's time for a city the covenant getting it worse

21:09

lean back in a shirt he looked at mean it is

21:12

why don't you go upstairs and train

21:14

take the boy he went out

21:16

and see it the

21:19

report right thing

21:21

that stops and the trinity

21:23

them from ubiquity joint custody in agrees

21:26

with scaring me

21:28

then i kept trying to be escalate

21:30

the situation because skirt

21:33

was getting desperate and she knew

21:35

she was armed he was

21:37

a gun enthusiast any had

21:40

there are firearms a

21:42

my home that it concern

21:44

me and i had actually

21:47

not down to his gun safes

21:49

when i and i taking pictures

21:52

of all the firearm sinensis

21:54

my

21:55

having time and change the company sends

21:57

they can get into it but i can figure at it

22:01

but anyway a he ended up leaving that

22:03

night and he told

22:05

my parents and he told my

22:07

father that if that if i was gonna

22:09

divorced him i had another

22:11

thing comments and he was gonna kill me

22:15

the i picked up

22:17

my children from school and

22:19

i called some of my girlfriends and

22:22

i said any to the meet me at the department

22:25

please or and

22:27

i'll never forget the police

22:29

officer that took my poor he said

22:32

well

22:35

it's report elements million and around

22:38

he , your dad can be here tomorrow crying

22:41

and you've made up and let

22:43

me a canada are

22:46

you don't understand i'm not going home

22:48

i'm going to a hotel we're

22:51

way past that point

22:55

god it and we wonder

22:57

why so much domestic violence goes

22:59

unreported in this country jan

23:02

it was in danger there was no

23:04

way that she would willingly go back

23:06

to where her husband and his many

23:08

guns could get to her

23:11

jan i went to a hotel and are two

23:13

boys want to stay with a friend i

23:16

now she had done everything and

23:18

her power to protect herself and

23:20

her family it found the right report

23:23

that the right legal counsel she looked at the kids'

23:25

teachers about what was going on and

23:28

even ask them to not let scott pick

23:30

them up from school the

23:32

all the while he continued to bombard

23:34

her were threatening phone calls

23:38

the my that the police department and

23:40

my attorney both me to get

23:43

the to order

23:45

your head a cheap yeah it's a temporary protective

23:47

order it says she is in an emergency

23:49

so i had to go in front of a family child's

23:52

play my case i had brought

23:55

all this picture is that as firearms

23:57

i gave him the location so than i

23:59

had all the please the report with me and

24:01

in this guy in it

24:04

the temporary protective order was just

24:06

that temporary the

24:08

gave her some semblance of safety

24:11

unfortunately that was shirt last

24:15

he violated the protective order the

24:17

very next day by putting the center surveillance

24:20

he activated tracking app on my phone

24:22

and my children some

24:25

the janet went your app again at the sheriff's

24:27

department to filed a felony tpl

24:29

violation the statically name's

24:32

scott violated the temporary protective order

24:34

so now he'd be placed in jail until

24:36

their court date the request

24:39

was ultimately denied the

24:41

judge said there was no way to prove scott

24:43

had set up the surveillance maybe

24:46

it was someone else using a sound cause

24:48

that's and ah the time once

24:52

again janet was left to fend

24:54

for herself and , all

24:56

of this was happening she was also doing

24:59

everything in her power to get scots guns

25:01

out of the house this was it

25:03

was project because he had seventy

25:06

size as them seventy

25:08

size she ,

25:10

to get seventy four locked away in a safe

25:12

until the sheriff's department some pick them up but

25:15

there was still one last

25:19

what about the leninist check because

25:21

, always carried in his vehicle an

25:24

honest person and she said well

25:26

said can't really get that line a gray

25:28

area man that

25:31

cpl the mindset property

25:34

that trick is sitting is sitting driveway in

25:37

my county which unlike those anything

25:40

towards her as a product for can be test

25:42

and the ppl the stipulates

25:44

a fair to confiscate all check

25:47

coming

25:49

she let

25:51

him leave it on his tracks any

25:54

shot me with a five days later

26:01

after the break janet walk us

26:03

through that horrific day

26:11

last day is brought to you by the can be defined proud

26:13

supporters of the trace as our

26:15

world grows more polarized it can feel

26:17

harder and harder to find vetted trustworthy

26:20

sources of information this is

26:22

especially true when it comes to the discourse

26:24

on gun violence fortunately

26:26

there is a news outlet that cuts through the noise

26:28

to deliver objective honest and thorough

26:30

reporting on the role of guns in american life

26:33

it's called the trace and it's the

26:35

only independent newsroom fully dedicated

26:37

to reporting on america's gun violence crisis

26:40

they use the power of journalism to improve

26:42

public understanding increase accountability

26:45

and identify solutions that can lead to safer

26:47

homes and communities for all sign

26:50

up for their weekly newsletter and decide for yourself

26:52

and a trace that org forward slash last

26:54

day

26:56

support for this podcast comes from the annie e

26:58

casey foundation a national philanthropy

27:00

thats developing solutions to build a brighter future

27:02

for children youth and families to

27:05

learn more about how the annie casey foundation

27:07

is helping neighborhoods thrive visit

27:09

a a c f dot org slash safer

27:11

communities again thats a

27:13

e c f dot org slash safer

27:15

communities

27:20

her name with janet paulson

27:24

october thirty yes twenty fifteen janet's

27:27

one her case for case temporary protect the

27:29

order against god and , sheriff's

27:31

office an issue that gpl has

27:33

just confiscated at the seventy four guns

27:36

in their home of let him drive

27:38

away in

27:43

then went back to my that the police apparent and

27:45

to say hey he violated a protective

27:47

order i don't know you guys know

27:50

the here's the deal and a police

27:52

officer said i hope

27:54

is his paper and any peace paper unemployment

27:57

like does he took his pen a

27:59

shabby

28:00

the paper was holding it any

28:02

, the paper

28:06

is your gps image and

28:08

and a boy you need arm

28:10

yourself the overly

28:12

worried about this day

28:16

it is for

28:18

, mean how many times

28:20

this system sailed chance

28:23

chance again they were putting the responsibility

28:26

back putting her follow

28:29

the author the dice an armed

28:33

hell

28:34

thursday nov fifty thousand and fifteen

28:37

i marched right back at the same

28:39

coils that about that tpl

28:42

i apply for concealed carry permit

28:47

immediately after leaving the courthouse that

28:49

day she stopped by the cost the door

28:52

and then headed back home

28:54

oh and by the way janet was

28:56

back at house which felt a little safer

28:58

now that the guns were gone

29:01

i think i pulled in around six forty five

29:04

am i pulled my car into the garage

29:06

i've been to hit the button for the girls to come

29:08

as soon as i mean i sat enix hit

29:10

up and , with it's weird

29:14

and so do the job for

29:16

at least in my says the mirror

29:18

and see is not in the

29:20

garage when i opened the door and he

29:22

was leaning against the garage wall

29:25

three feet for me and he was coaching that done

29:28

i was like

29:30

i don't get a get out of course your day

29:33

get up his branch the

29:36

i play my head down i

29:39

had that can reverse and i hit the gas

29:41

it's hard to say could and i thought

29:43

city the garage door because it was still in the

29:45

process coming back down behind me

29:49

i'm trying to get his straight and get away

29:51

back , i wasn't looking of so

29:53

scared us and ussr mean the head i

29:57

hit a tree or my neighbor's yard and it

29:59

blew out my that window and

30:03

i looked up in here in here walking

30:05

down the driveway and that gun

30:07

pointed at me and my about that good weekend

30:09

streak it's good to street or keynotes

30:12

is your death and so

30:14

essence just go for the little that for

30:16

the hit the gas to hurt so assists a circle

30:19

and south korean back over my driveway

30:22

and i smashed into a bunch trees and the

30:24

my house and kind

30:26

of on an incline

30:28

the in here he is couple feet

30:30

from my driver's side window at

30:33

that time is somehow i

30:35

doubt that pasture side door a

30:37

fan i tumbled out and i started

30:39

running through the woods screaming for help

30:42

her paw ha hi

30:46

and i thought singing in my abdomen

30:49

i knew i could say never like this

30:51

invoices sites true nature

30:54

he the is worth few you're

30:56

gonna die trying to the neighbor's house

30:59

they try to like ran back

31:01

at that embankment

31:04

the across my driveway to get to the neighbor says

31:06

ancient mean the leg

31:08

and i have no and and then he showed me again

31:11

over and the middle of my driveway

31:15

meanwhile what i didn't know is that oh my

31:17

neighbors well or and nine

31:19

one one and watching a from

31:21

their house

31:24

my my emergency i just heard

31:26

shots six years or so am i just shot

31:28

fired shots why filed

31:31

for divorce last you say house

31:33

is not allowed to for house not allowed

31:35

in the neighborhood he had to give us these guys we're

31:40

mainly for concerns and i thought santa shop

31:42

on in his car and you were born on your flag

31:44

a lot

32:00

the and i fell over in the driveway

32:03

i phone kinda the edge of the driveway

32:05

made a to see for me and i watched

32:08

him sit me two more times i'm

32:11

a long shot i knew hit my

32:14

spinal cord because i felt this jolt

32:16

of electricity go through my body

32:18

and mean i knew immediately as well as i just

32:21

kept talking to myself like having

32:24

, you can even within the surface

32:26

and big deal to sift through

32:28

which you have to do the survive

32:32

and he ever

32:34

khamenei sit over me my

32:38

hand up to block his phase because

32:41

i didn't want that to be the last thing i had to

32:43

see if his kind of sit me down and

32:46

i just said like don't sit many more i'm

32:48

dying any said

32:51

walk , stairs

32:53

path the guy he put into this had any

32:55

pulled the trigger that it clicks

32:57

because here it clicks the ammunition

33:00

and the cliff firing at me

33:03

oh did i know

33:05

he was going to reload time

33:09

and empathetic driveway how

33:11

i played by please you know i didn't come

33:14

back over here to me these you can

33:16

occur to me and

33:18

instead he went lay down sympathy

33:20

for me and i heard a gunshot a

33:23

huge often a chess

33:29

i didn't die right away

33:31

the paramedics finally arrived they

33:34

loaded janet and to one ambulance

33:36

and scott into another the replete

33:39

features

33:44

i just remember telling myself paramedic

33:48

he does everything the teeth in are you today

33:51

anyway he would eventually get

33:54

him and they both sides sand

33:56

or ten minutes south and i repeat of act the

34:00

mm general

34:03

time and

34:05

i can enter enter didn't ever

34:07

, about my children and reflect

34:10

know eighty so those not

34:12

happening

34:14

and i remember what happened after that

34:17

and ever

34:20

after an athlete player from a coma

34:23

he had shattered my right femur

34:26

shattered my left knee added

34:29

during during i say added

34:31

during during the afternoon he

34:34

took out a third of my right arm

34:37

and the last from the miles two

34:40

vertebrae sell have an incomplete

34:42

sign of forced entry

34:46

the spinal cord injury like april's

34:48

left her in a wheelchair for the rest

34:50

of her life that

34:53

died at the shortly after surgery

34:57

then i was there are recovering for six weeks

35:00

until she was transferred to the shepherd

35:02

rehabilitation center

35:04

and i took my air the paramedics

35:07

told that i made it and

35:11

every fighter i see them on

35:13

my floor shepherds and they were

35:15

like crying they were like oh my god

35:17

the cannot believe you are a

35:19

me up the baffin island will check to see

35:21

them or thought he suffered as

35:24

a road we thought he'd severe acute sense

35:27

in this happening either an extra

35:29

crying and they told me never

35:31

that fits within a sad if

35:33

you for taking that he is critical issue

35:36

at made it

35:38

we think of shooting are you listening to

35:40

fudge with you a secret

35:42

trauma surgeon to

35:45

santa between you read prankster

35:48

to get access to the heart the

35:50

claimed my order he shocked if it's

35:52

electrodes and then a mothers'

35:54

my horse and his hand and it started

35:57

back

36:04

now the trimesters and is my hero cydia

36:06

think someone for saving your life that

36:09

i saw him

36:11

and he was just so thrilled

36:13

employees like you

36:16

are mere fall he now i'm

36:18

a hundred times we try and say someone

36:21

doing that procedure the ever

36:23

went

36:27

that bad about a hundred people

36:29

standing in a circle holding hands

36:31

look in each other like to sit and update

36:34

and him at me

36:40

this is an incredibly

36:42

heartwarming story about

36:45

a patient and the doctor who saved

36:47

her life

36:49

that a miracle shouldn't your

36:51

best bet for survival

36:55

so many moments and janet in april story

36:58

where things could have ended differently

37:00

for them and their husbands their

37:03

to stories of domestic abuse he

37:05

was a series and simplify

37:08

so much of what we've covered the the

37:11

those of these men were dealing with untreated

37:14

mental illness janet has been

37:16

struggling with alcoholism both

37:18

are experiencing huge transitions

37:20

and relationship issues which are

37:22

, risk factor for suicide and neither

37:25

had any coping skills or access to mental

37:27

health resources and this terrible

37:29

combination of risk factors less

37:33

easy access to guns made these

37:35

men lethal to their partners and

37:37

themselves part of

37:39

what makes all of this truly unfair

37:42

is that these stories could have gone completely

37:44

different ways had janet in april

37:46

list in a different state because

37:49

that is how gun laws work

37:51

and america like georgia

37:54

is one of the few states that does not comply

37:57

with federal laws when it comes to domestic abuse

38:00

you can be charged with a domestic violence misdemeanor

38:02

or have an active protective

38:04

order against you and still

38:07

keep your guns in georgia janet

38:09

happens to live in a company that will remove firearms

38:12

if noted on your tpl that

38:14

you heard her story when you're in

38:16

a state that doesn't take doesn't take seriously

38:18

your local sheriff night not either

38:21

they might just let your abuser to live

38:23

off with man in his truck and that same

38:25

sheriff's office might try to solve

38:27

an existing gone problem with more

38:30

time

38:31

remember janet applied for a

38:33

concealed carry permit because a police

38:35

officer suggested that would be

38:38

the only way to keep her and her

38:40

family safe

38:42

that in healthcare for a man came

38:45

in the mail and mail was in was coma nine days

38:47

later fighting for my life

38:51

an air that how scared

38:53

i live

38:55

and i'm sorry i can

38:57

i access that's your

39:00

thoughts as saying safe in

39:02

honor of a shot you are

39:05

i'm trying to fight fire with fire

39:07

isn't just dangerous it's also

39:09

totally impractical there's

39:12

april again

39:13

i would you know not only half

39:15

and know and have some experience to

39:18

handling firearms but i have to be

39:20

ready to work on to almost military like

39:23

the problem with the amount of pressure

39:25

an end and precision you would need

39:27

to survive and sells his

39:29

to say that the answer is

39:32

you just need to arm yourself you're

39:34

not speaking i'm of ab fab

39:36

place a reality

39:38

i'm

39:41

hearing a lot of that

39:44

don't seem to be steeped in reality

39:46

the way to solve gun violence is

39:49

more guns ceo

39:51

of the and are and wayne lapierre famously

39:53

said one thing a violent rape

39:55

us deserve to face is face good woman with woman gun

39:58

which is a real the man

40:00

on the have good guy with a gun argument the

40:03

answer to domestic abuse arm

40:06

women the answer to school shooting

40:08

arm teachers and these ideas

40:10

are actually getting traction

40:13

that are being baked into legislation

40:15

republicans in ohio just gonna

40:17

build up a governor that would allow teachers

40:19

to carry a gun in the classroom

40:23

in a time where guns are now the leading

40:25

cause of for children that

40:29

is reality you

40:32

know we , the season

40:34

time and to figure out how we can

40:36

make people safer in a country with

40:39

so many guns

40:41

and after and year as pounding the pavement

40:44

with pavement string of particularly horrific

40:46

headlines over the past few weeks

40:49

past few it is possible for

40:52

janet her call to action

40:54

team from a hospital bed in the shepherd

40:57

rehabilitation center april

40:59

wheeled into her room one day in

41:02

reduced herself as a pure supported by sir

41:05

and , that first visit iced

41:07

is janet would join her and advocating

41:10

for domestic violence victims victims

41:12

didn't know exactly how they would do it

41:15

but she felt like they had to do

41:17

something

41:22

okay to see me

41:24

thank you wanna get on board with this

41:26

as such as i i away oh

41:30

it the

41:33

one that didn't make it

41:37

we all went to the ones who didn't make

41:40

the we also i went to every survivor

41:43

that includes

41:44

the net an april and dennis

41:47

beat the odds and last it

41:50

also includes all of the others

41:52

drivers we met the season the

41:54

parents who lost their children

41:56

to firearm suicides and homicide

41:59

who who are living with the trauma

42:01

the shot in time the

42:03

neighborhoods that have been hollowed out

42:06

and galveston that are rampant times

42:10

we only you all of them

42:13

yeah it's going to take

42:16

to take of time and uncomfortable

42:18

conversations and it's going

42:20

to take everyone gun

42:22

lovers and gun haters are like we

42:25

, have our reasons to come to the table

42:28

and we can bring all of our biases with

42:30

us as long as we're willing to

42:32

start from it's place as reality

42:35

and agree the defenseless

42:37

gang violence

42:47

last

42:49

day as a production anatomy it

42:52

ended our as or supervising producer producers

42:55

are in summer and juliet hannibal

42:58

machine and ariane and child or associate

43:00

producers use it as it as pounds

43:03

the producers or jessica could other famer

43:05

and me stephanie what else there's

43:08

a partner the heat and let the can be different if

43:10

any tv foundation of pretty the

43:14

right track and co and every time for gun

43:16

safety the person

43:18

you can find more mental health metal arms restrictions

43:21

resources along with info about

43:23

some other voices on the show in show

43:25

notes and at lemonade media dot

43:27

com slash show slash last

43:29

day if you want hear

43:31

more last day we have to whole

43:34

other seasons please go listening to them

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