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0:26

learning. Hi

0:43

there, welcome to Meet the Press Now. I'm Ryan

0:45

Nobles in Washington. As Democrats here and around

0:47

the country are trying to reckon

0:49

with a five-alarm fire after

0:52

a historically disastrous debate performance by

0:54

President Joe Biden last night, a

0:57

performance that seemed to validate months

0:59

of Republican attacks and

1:01

Democrats' worst fears. His

1:03

performance was raspy, halting, rambling, and

1:06

at times incoherent, and it has

1:08

reignited serious concerns about his age

1:10

and his fitness for office, leaving

1:13

his party in a panic that

1:15

has some raising the specter of

1:17

replacing him on the ticket. You're

1:20

looking right now at live pictures here of

1:22

former President Trump, who is speaking for the

1:24

first time since last night's debate. He's holding

1:26

a rally in Virginia. We'll keep a close

1:28

eye on his remarks. This

1:31

all comes as the Biden campaign

1:33

has pushed back forcefully against the

1:35

criticism of the president, dismissing his

1:37

performance as the result of a

1:39

cold, saying that he also has

1:41

no intention of dropping out. And

1:44

that, quote, it's all systems go

1:46

on September's second presidential debate. Speaking

1:49

at a rally in North Carolina this afternoon,

1:51

the president directly addressed his performance last night

1:53

while trying to reassure his base that he

1:55

can do the job. I

2:00

don't speak as smoothly as I used to. I

2:02

don't debate as well as I used to. But

2:05

I know what I do know. I

2:08

know how to tell the truth. Yeah! Yeah!

2:11

Yeah! Yeah! Yeah! Yeah!

2:15

Yeah! I know. Yeah! I

2:17

know. I know rights of wrong.

2:20

Yeah! Yeah! Yeah!

2:23

Yeah! I know how to do this job. Yeah!

2:25

Yeah! I know how to get things

2:27

done. Yeah! Yeah! I

2:30

know what committees of America know. When

2:32

you get knocked down, you get back home. Yeah!

2:35

Yeah! Folks,

2:39

I give you my words of Biden. I would not

2:41

be running again if I didn't believe. With all my

2:43

heart and soul, I can do this job. Yeah! It's

2:46

quite comfy. Yeah! Yeah! Yeah!

2:49

Yeah! A little different than the

2:52

guy we saw last night. He was reading

2:54

from a teleprompter, and the president did unleash

2:56

a barrage of attacks on his opponent. At

2:58

one point, sparking chants of

3:00

lock him up from the crowd.

3:03

The fiery attacks from Mr. Biden today

3:05

could not have been a starker contrast

3:07

to the Joe Biden who showed up

3:09

at last night's debate. We'd

3:11

be able to help make sure that

3:14

all those things we need to do,

3:16

childcare, elder care, making sure that we

3:18

continue to strengthen our healthcare system, making

3:20

sure that we're able to make every

3:22

single solitary person eligible

3:25

for what I've been able to do with

3:27

the COVID, I'm

3:29

sorry, with dealing with

3:32

everything we have to do with, look,

3:37

if we finally

3:39

beat Medicare, and I'm gonna continue

3:41

to move until we get the total ban on

3:44

the total initiative relative to

3:47

what we're gonna do with

3:49

more border patrol and more

3:51

asylum officers. President Trump? I

3:54

really don't know what he said at the end of this. I

3:56

don't think he knows what he said either. On

3:59

Capitol Hill today. It was hard to

4:01

mask the shock from Democrats about what

4:04

they saw on that debate stage Even

4:06

as most rank-and-file members did defend their

4:08

candidate the Democratic House leader Hakeem Jeffries

4:10

gave a terse No When he asked

4:13

if he thought the president should drop

4:15

out and after initially dodging reporters Speaker

4:17

emeritus Nancy Pelosi gave a more full-throated

4:20

defense of the president's record Great

4:30

president and done great things

4:32

for our country A good

4:35

man respects the Constitution, proved

4:37

the truth, had a bad

4:39

night You know sometimes people get over the prepare

4:42

One debate

4:46

There's not a can being made On

4:48

substance, there is absolutely nothing needs to

4:50

be able to keep doing What he's

4:52

doing? On

4:54

style, Joe Biden is

4:56

not a civilist But do you

4:58

think that the president had a good performance last

5:00

night? No, I'm just saying I thought he had

5:03

a good performance How many times

5:05

did he have to say that? Did Joe

5:07

Biden have a bad night in my opinion?

5:09

Yes, he absolutely did Do we have concerns

5:11

and do we wish that Joe Biden did

5:13

better yesterday? Yes, why? Because we put people

5:15

over politics and we know what's at stake

5:17

in this country And we know that this

5:19

would be devastating to the country and to

5:21

the world if there is another Donald Trump

5:23

president What do you mean? Look, he had a

5:25

bad night I've

5:28

been in this town for a long time

5:30

I've seen ups and I've seen downs I

5:32

am not part of the drama of this

5:34

town that immediately demands Because somebody had a

5:36

bad night, we're in a crisis Let's see

5:38

what happens I'm going home and talking to

5:40

the people in my district and hearing what

5:42

has But you're not worried? And

5:45

that was just the Democrats who spoke to our

5:47

cameras I was out there on the steps of

5:49

the Capitol today trying to get reaction from Democrats

5:52

There were a whole lot of them actively

5:54

avoiding our cameras And dodging me and my

5:57

fellow reporters Ultimately, it could

5:59

be weird before we know what kind of

6:01

lasting damage, if any, last night's debate did

6:04

to the president's campaign. But if you

6:06

ask voters now in their

6:08

immediate aftermath, almost no

6:10

one seems happy about the choice before

6:12

them in 2024. We're doomed.

6:17

This is the best we got. The

6:19

fact that they're pushing such old candidates

6:21

forward and saying this is the best

6:23

we have. I don't imagine

6:26

that if anybody's being honest, that

6:29

anybody is excited

6:31

or enthusiastic about either of these

6:33

candidates. It was nothing is Donald

6:35

Trump's fault. It's all the Democratic judges

6:37

that Biden

6:40

put into office. Nothing

6:42

is Joe Biden's fault either. It's all

6:44

I had to clean up

6:46

your mess. So figure it out, boys, because

6:49

you're both wrong. I don't want to be at

6:52

fault for having to vote for either one of them. I don't think anything

6:54

good is going to come out of either one. I

6:57

think it's time for new leadership. I think

7:00

it's time for younger leadership. And

7:03

joining me now from North Carolina, where

7:05

Biden held that rally earlier today is

7:07

NBC's Mike Memelie. Shaquille Brewster is in

7:09

Philadelphia, where he's been speaking to voters

7:12

and also joining me is NBC's chief

7:14

political analyst, Chuck Todd. So, Mike, let's

7:16

start with you. The campaign

7:18

is defiant today publicly, but what's been going

7:20

on behind the scenes, both in the campaign

7:22

and at the White House? Well,

7:26

one of the most interesting reactions I've

7:28

gotten today in all my conversations was

7:30

that for many of those who were

7:32

watching last night's debate, average voters, including

7:34

those who maybe haven't been paying much

7:36

attention to this race, it

7:38

was about as poor a performance from President

7:41

Biden as they expected. But that

7:43

for Democratic insiders and a lot of

7:45

those lawmakers you were talking to on

7:47

Capitol Hill, it was worse than they

7:49

feared. And the question this person posed

7:51

is, which is the bigger problem? Is

7:53

it that Biden needed to begin confounding

7:56

those expectations and moving those voters more firmly

7:58

into a camp and a race? where they

8:00

feel like all the other fundamentals are in

8:02

their direction? Or is it that the panic

8:04

that we're now seeing among the democratic establishment,

8:06

the growing calls for President Biden to maybe

8:09

even step aside, makes the problem actually worse

8:11

than it might really be? So as I

8:13

was at this rally today and speaking with

8:15

people close to the president and in the

8:17

room with him this morning, they said, listen,

8:19

he didn't need bad coverage of that debate

8:21

last night. He didn't need some of those

8:23

calls that are growing louder for him to

8:25

maybe consider stepping aside to know that he

8:28

had a bad debate. He knew it, he

8:30

understood it in real time. And so they looked

8:33

for that opportunity as quickly as they could

8:35

for the president to show some humility here.

8:37

We have seen this in debates past when

8:39

an incumbent president does have a little bit

8:41

of a reality check. This is a much

8:43

different situation though than in Denver with President

8:45

Obama in 2012. For a

8:48

lot of reasons, one of them that there's

8:50

no big immediate debate coming up next. The

8:52

next presidential debate is more than 70 days

8:54

away. We don't even have a vice presidential

8:56

debate like then Vice President Joe Biden was

8:59

able to help Barack Obama get out of

9:01

that. So we are seeing them rally the

9:03

forces including President Obama putting out a supportive

9:06

tweet, but there's no question that this is

9:08

gonna be a difficult weekend for

9:10

the Biden team and as they deal

9:12

with the incoming and consider what more they could

9:15

do to try to deal with this situation. Mike,

9:17

it's not uncommon for Democrats to worry. They often

9:19

worry, but is this type of panic that we're

9:21

seeing now typical or does it feel a little

9:23

different? Well,

9:26

I had an interesting comparison that somebody made

9:28

to me as well, which is this is

9:30

just like what happened when the Her Report

9:32

was released and there was a very real

9:34

panic about what that was

9:37

concluding about the president's state of mind. I think what's

9:39

different is people saw it this time with their own

9:41

eyes, right? The answer to

9:43

the Her Report was just to keep fighting and

9:46

to get the president out there more. I think

9:48

there's a much different situation now. The Biden team

9:50

though is going back to their safe

9:52

space which is to say Joe Biden is counted out

9:55

often and throughout his career and

9:57

he has often rebounded and fought back. even

10:00

harder and that's what they say will happen now but

10:03

the next few weeks are gonna be critical for this president

10:05

no doubt. And you were in the room there Mike and

10:07

I do want to ask you about this chant that we

10:09

heard breakout during Biden's North Carolina event let's take a listen.

10:13

Donald Trump is just a convicted fellow.

10:16

Donald Trump is a one-man crime waiter.

10:19

He's

10:23

got more trials. He's

10:26

got more trials coming up. Lock

10:29

him up. Lock him up.

10:32

Lock him up. Lock

10:37

him up. You can tell the president seems

10:39

a little uncomfortable that that's the way his

10:41

supporters are responded to that. Has the campaign

10:43

commented on this and does this

10:45

kind of reaction undermine the president's better than

10:48

the alternative message? No,

10:51

the campaign is not commenting on this just yet

10:53

Ryan but I did think the most interesting reaction

10:55

was what you referenced the president did put his

10:58

hands up you could see he was uncomfortable with

11:00

it in real time and I think that speaks

11:02

to the perhaps issues

11:04

he had in landing some of those blows yesterday

11:06

in the debates this was

11:09

probably the one that was most clearly telegraphed

11:11

for him he did have a good one-liner

11:13

today about President Trump being

11:15

a one-man crime wave but

11:17

this has been in addition to the comments about abortion

11:19

something that he has wrestled with it's not

11:22

necessarily as somebody who believes in rule of law

11:24

and the impartiality he must show as the president

11:27

a safe place for him and he doesn't want

11:29

to see the kind of reaction among Democrats that

11:31

we saw for Hillary Clinton among Trump supporters eight

11:34

years ago and so this is something to watch

11:36

but I think for Democratic supporters in that room

11:38

who wanted to be there for

11:40

Joe Biden and who certainly wanted

11:43

to feed off of his remarks that was an

11:45

interesting response to be sure. Okay Mike thanks for

11:47

that check let's go to you now and we

11:49

can talk to this to death but you actually spend

11:51

some time with people that matter and those are voters in

11:54

particular undecided black voters in Philadelphia

11:57

how did they react to last night's debate is this going to

11:59

move the eventually

14:00

said if I'm pressured to I'll go inside

14:02

with Biden. Okay, Shaquille, thank you for that.

14:04

Let's turn out to Chuck to try and

14:06

make sense of all of this for us.

14:08

Chuck, sorry to put you in that position,

14:10

but how did we get to

14:12

this point with Joe Biden to have that

14:14

kind of a performance on this on the

14:16

stage? His team wanted this debate. They set

14:18

the parameters. Is the result going to

14:20

be a long summer for the president on the

14:22

campaign trail? Well, I

14:25

think it's definitely going to be a long summer. I mean,

14:27

there's no doubt there, and they've been look

14:29

behind the scenes. They've had surrogates calling up

14:31

labor leaders and saying, hey, don't he's not

14:34

getting out. Don't try to do it. You'll

14:36

be out there on your own. I think

14:38

they are concerned about trying

14:40

to sort of stop any of this

14:44

movement sort of in the crib, if you

14:46

will. Right. You know, hurry up and stop

14:49

it now because they don't want to create

14:51

a sort of a drip, drip, drip. And

14:53

look, the good news for Biden, no

14:56

major elected Democrat has said he's

14:58

got to he's got to step

15:00

step aside. You've had some formers.

15:02

You've had some prominent, you know,

15:05

former strategists and stuff, but nobody

15:07

currently sort of in the elected

15:09

Democratic leadership.

15:13

If that changes, look, I I

15:15

have to tell you, Nancy Pelosi is somebody who's

15:17

very careful with her words. I found what she

15:19

said and what she didn't say to

15:22

be fascinating. I continue to believe she's

15:24

she's probably the one person here that

15:26

might have some influence. I don't even

15:28

think former President Obama does. You know,

15:30

the relationship between Obama and Biden is

15:33

is is odd, shall we say. And

15:35

I don't know if Obama would

15:38

would even feel comfortable,

15:41

you know, playing the so-called Barry

15:44

Goldwater role. When I say that, I

15:46

mean when when Senate Republicans back during

15:48

Watergate went to Nixon and said, hey,

15:50

buddy, you got to go. I can't

15:53

imagine him playing that role. I

15:55

could imagine former Speaker Pelosi playing

15:57

that role if she thought, well,

15:59

somebody's got to do this. And I'll tell you this,

16:01

I think people are going to go home for the weekend,

16:03

Ryan. I think they're going to be talking to

16:05

people with Debbie Dingle said talking to constituents. I

16:07

think people are going to look at their own

16:09

polling. Oh, this is a weird time to poll.

16:11

Biden's actually lucky that it's 4th of July week,

16:13

right? It's not a reliable time to poll. But,

16:17

you know, if on Sunday or Monday

16:20

you see somebody and then another and

16:22

then another that that is when I

16:24

think there's trouble. And all of these folks are going

16:26

to be going home for 4th of July picnics and

16:28

talking to their constituents. So I think the next week

16:30

is is a big deal for

16:33

team Biden. It's interesting that you bring up constituents.

16:35

I spent all day today trying to get Democrats

16:37

to get beyond the talking points on Capitol Hill

16:39

and didn't have much success. And one of the

16:41

things I was most struck by when I watched

16:43

the debate last night, obviously I heard from a

16:46

lot of operatives and lawmakers and things along those

16:48

lines. But I also heard from just a lot

16:50

of average everyday people, friends of mine, college friends,

16:52

neighborhood friends who seemed alarmed by

16:54

what they saw on television. Do you

16:56

think Democrats understand that this goes beyond

16:58

just the back and forth of what's

17:00

happening here inside the Beltway and that

17:03

this was something that average everyday Americans

17:05

were paying pretty close attention to? I

17:08

don't. I think many of them are trying

17:10

to comfort themselves in sort of, well, this

17:12

happens. It's the bedwethers. It's this or that.

17:16

I don't think they fully appreciate that. And

17:18

and you know, it's

17:20

interesting. We have a very it's a very narrow

17:22

window here. If Democrats did want to change, if

17:24

they could talk Biden into doing this, they really,

17:26

you know, even though the conventions in

17:28

mid August, you know, they've earlyed up the roll

17:31

call. He actually is going to get the nomination

17:33

potentially about two weeks earlier because the Democrats

17:35

did that in order to prevent, you know,

17:37

make sure they got on the Ohio ballot,

17:39

if you recall that little kerfuffle

17:42

a few weeks back. And

17:44

so you really only have a window of about four

17:46

weeks. You know, if major polling

17:48

doesn't really start showing up and it is an impact

17:51

and we don't see it, you know, all of a

17:53

sudden your windows narrowing and narrowing and narrowing here. So

17:55

I, you know,

17:58

I do think Biden. If he

18:00

can get out of survive the next

18:02

10 days without anybody major publicly coming

18:04

out, I don't know how

18:06

you stop him from becoming the nominee. Well, but

18:08

do you think that Democrats have really come to

18:10

grips with the idea that 40%, maybe

18:15

even 45 to 47% of this country is

18:17

comfortable voting for Donald Trump? Because what I

18:19

heard over and over again today on Capitol

18:22

Hill is that, well, the alternative is just so

18:24

much worse. And when voters actually get a chance

18:26

and have to choose between Joe Biden and Donald

18:28

Trump, they're never going to pick Donald Trump. But

18:31

sometimes I feel as though a lot of

18:33

these Democrats, particularly ones in safe districts and

18:35

blue states, don't really understand how much of

18:37

this country is willing to vote for Donald

18:40

Trump. Maybe, maybe even if they don't love

18:42

him. Well, and,

18:44

and Ryan, I'd add this. If

18:46

you really believe American democracy is on the line

18:49

here, right? We hear this

18:51

rhetoric a lot from Democrats. Are

18:55

you really going to sit silent while you

18:57

may be putting up somebody that may be

18:59

a little bit of a debate, maybe doesn't

19:01

have what it takes to run the

19:03

campaign it takes to win? And, you

19:05

know, I'm sorry, this is the rules of politics.

19:08

You got a campaign to win, right? You just

19:10

can't hope people, well, he's been a good president.

19:13

He's a bad debater, but a good president. You know,

19:15

that in the way this works. Politics ain't beanbag, et

19:17

cetera, et cetera. So, you know, and

19:20

I'll say this, if you're a Democrat who

19:22

has lectured Mitch McConnell for not, for not

19:24

having the guts to stand up to Trump

19:26

and vote the right way or do the

19:29

right thing, put the country over your party

19:33

and you sit silently now while you

19:35

watch this slow motion potential train wreck.

19:39

I don't think you have a lot of, I don't

19:41

think you have a lot of, lot to stand on.

19:44

If you're, if you're sitting silently here,

19:47

you know it's not working, but you're afraid

19:49

to speak up. Yeah. You have

19:51

to think about, and as you point out, Chuck, not

19:54

a lot of time to make serious decisions if they're

19:56

going to change course. Chuck Todd, thanks so much for

19:58

bringing us, bringing us your expertise.