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to join the over 28 million

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drivers who trust progressive. I'm

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Caitlin Bristow, your session is now starting. Hey

0:47

everybody, welcome to Off the Vine. I'm your host,

0:49

Caitlin Bristow. And today, I don't, I

0:52

actually don't have words. I usually

0:54

would record an intro and I'm

0:56

actually just like speechless because Oz

0:59

Perlman, who is a mentalist was in here. He

1:01

read my mind. He blew my mind. You'll see

1:03

it in my reactions. And we talk all about

1:05

his journey of how he was 13 on a

1:08

cruise with his family. He

1:10

saw a magic show and he

1:12

pursued magic and mentalism every day.

1:14

And it shows it's, I,

1:16

I'm still shaking a bit. I seriously am. It

1:18

was insane. You guys are going to be blown away

1:21

by this episode. Like people know I'm,

1:23

I'm really into magic. Did you bring

1:25

wine? I thought you had like your own wine too. I never

1:27

know if it's like too early for someone.

1:29

I'm not going to drink, but the more you drink,

1:31

the better my show gets. Like you

1:34

can maybe be like, can our audience drink?

1:36

I'm like, please drink. Oh, that's so

1:38

funny. I, well, I have two more podcasts after

1:40

this. And then I have like a dinner tonight.

1:42

So I thought maybe not get drunk at 11

1:44

AM, but I also am coming off a weekend

1:46

on Broadway, which I was telling you about earlier.

1:48

I don't ever go out on Broadway. I just,

1:50

it's too crazy for me. Like in my twenties,

1:53

that would have been, I would have just been

1:55

thriving all the time, but I'm 38 and I'm

1:57

tired. And trust me,

1:59

I was hungover on. Saturday morning off

2:01

to like glass of tequila. And

2:03

it was on an empty stomach. And I went to a friend's house

2:05

cause I was in the same building doing a show and

2:08

it was like three fingers of tequila, very good tequila, but like,

2:10

oh, am I going to suffer for this in the morning? And

2:12

my kids don't care at six a.m. They're like jumping in

2:14

my stomach. I'm like, oh, headache, this is so stupid. That's

2:17

my girlfriend who I was with at a hockey

2:19

game the other night. She was like, if I

2:21

go out, I have a babysitter. And then I

2:23

have the babysitter be up with them at six

2:25

in the morning because- Good luck with that. Yeah,

2:27

that's, I can't even imagine. When my dogs bark

2:30

to go out at eight a.m. And

2:32

I don't really get hung over, which is so bizarre. Drink

2:34

a lot of water. I don't. You should.

2:37

Oh, but I don't get hung over. I literally wake

2:39

up and I'll be like, I'm a little off, but I'm just

2:41

tired. And so my, I don't

2:43

even want to get up and let my dogs out

2:45

at eight a.m. I'm like, no. So I can't imagine

2:47

having kids jumping on you at

2:49

six a.m. That's a hard no for me. Yup. Oh,

2:52

Lord. Okay, so obviously I'm going to be very curious

2:54

about your journey to get to where you have gotten

2:56

to, because I know kind of like you were on

2:59

a cruise with your family around the age of 13

3:01

and you kind of fell in love with magic. I saw a

3:04

magician for the first time ever on that cruise. You

3:06

know, when you're on those boats, they have the entertainment

3:08

each night. Yes. One night is, you know,

3:11

this guy and one night as a comedian. And when they

3:13

had the magician, he played

3:15

multiple nights. Yeah. Like

3:17

one night. So when we saw him the first night, my

3:19

dad, I think like bribed him. I think he's like, you're

3:21

50 bucks. Get my kid on stage. Really? You

3:23

know, it's his birthday. Yeah. And so they got

3:26

me on stage and got picked out at random. And

3:28

I had a sleight of hand magic trick done

3:30

to me, which is called the sponge balls. It's

3:32

a very popular. Oh, I know the sponge ball.

3:34

When you put them in your hand, they turn

3:36

to two balls and they disappear and reappear and

3:38

move around stuff. And it just, I was just

3:40

shell shocked. Yeah. And I

3:43

stalked this guy on the boat. Yeah. Because

3:45

he's on the boat. He can't leave. That's the

3:47

thing about cruise ships. Yeah. Where's he going

3:50

to go? Yeah. So I found him two

3:52

more times. I was like, dude, show me more magic. And

3:54

in hindsight, as now a performer, I'm like, I must've been

3:56

the most annoying kid ever, but it

3:58

was a good kind of annoying in some way. It was

4:00

obsessive. Yeah. And then

4:02

when I got home, I just got fully into

4:04

it. I went to the library. I checked out

4:06

all the books, started reading them. I went to

4:09

Borders, bought books, and then found there was a

4:11

magic store in my neighborhood, like

4:13

a 25-minute drive away in Michigan, Royal Oak, Michigan.

4:15

And that's when I started buying my first tricks.

4:18

Yeah. Yeah. And

4:20

then would you perform for your friends and birthday

4:22

parties? And you were the guy that did the

4:24

magic. Full on. Yeah. My

4:27

mom is not one for, I'm just going to buy you a bunch of crap.

4:30

You need to prove to me that this isn't some fleeting...

4:33

You buy a whole guitar and a month later, you

4:35

think, I don't play guitar anymore. So I started doing

4:37

birthday parties and I started working at

4:39

a restaurant. So ever since I was about 14,

4:41

I would always work at restaurants

4:43

doing magic. It's kind of my first thing.

4:46

And I credit it with so much of my

4:48

success later in life because it's almost like people

4:50

that do cold calling. You know those people that

4:52

are on street corners who make you stop with

4:54

an iPad and you're like, oh, I'm too busy. I

4:57

always feel so bad for them. Yeah. You feel

4:59

bad for them. But imagine this is even worse. If

5:01

some like twerpy teenager, you're out to dinner, you're

5:04

at a restaurant, you got a babysitter and there's

5:06

like, this kid comes up to you to do

5:08

magic tricks. You get out of here. I would

5:10

love it though. You would if they were good.

5:12

Yeah. And if you were expecting

5:14

it. So I think I learned trial by fire,

5:16

how to approach people that are skeptical, that don't

5:18

necessarily want you. And

5:20

how to diffuse that tension and

5:23

really learn people's body language. Sales

5:25

101. How do you get someone to

5:27

buy something from you who either doesn't

5:29

know your product, doesn't want your product, or has

5:31

no idea who you are? Right? All

5:34

three of those in my products weird because it's like

5:36

a magic trick and keep my

5:39

attention economy. Me getting your

5:41

attention was the value. And so

5:43

I think I learned over many years

5:45

how to get people captured,

5:48

how to speak, when to pause, like

5:50

misdirection, all of these things that are kind

5:53

of critical to what I do now. So, I think

5:55

I learned a lot from myself. Todd, or did you undergo any formal training? I

5:57

don't have any formal training when you call it like this.

6:00

no real school for what I do. There's

6:02

people that do what I do, and you can

6:04

get a mentor, somebody who will take you in

6:06

and kind of like karate kid

6:08

style, wax on, wax off. And

6:10

so I knew a few people that did

6:13

this who kind of would guide me in a certain

6:15

way. And as I've gotten kind of higher up within

6:17

it, I know all the people that do what I

6:19

do at a very high level all over the world.

6:22

So I know like the best mentalist

6:24

in Singapore and the UK and Israel,

6:26

there's a ton. And like, you know,

6:28

Australia and Argentina, we all know each

6:30

other and we're such a

6:32

small group that it's primarily, I would

6:34

say everybody is friendly and kind of

6:36

cheers on everyone's success. There's a few

6:39

frenemies here and there at certain levels

6:41

and a little jealousy and stuff like

6:43

that. But overall, I really do think

6:45

that there's such a supply and demand

6:47

that there's so much more of

6:49

people that want to see what we do. And

6:51

there's so few of the people that do what I

6:53

do that we're not, I wouldn't say

6:56

we're not competing, but

6:58

if one person does something great, like if I go on and

7:00

do something for an NFL team, I've created

7:02

a market for all these other people that do

7:04

what I do that now do other sports teams

7:06

because no one knew that market and that kind

7:09

of keeps happening. I'm

7:11

a very competitive person, but

7:13

I heard something the other day, someone said to me, I'm gonna have

7:15

to look it up. It's so good.

7:17

Like I can tell you one that I've

7:19

like really internalized, which is compare and despair, which

7:22

is so much of with social media now

7:24

where everyone puts the best foot forward and

7:26

everyone's trying to just get clicks and views

7:29

and everything of that sort, that you can

7:31

compare yourself, you will always find somebody. Richer,

7:34

better looking, younger, like evolves. So

7:38

if you don't derive a benefit from either

7:40

like deciding what your goals are and

7:42

achieving them or being better than you were

7:45

yesterday, things that I have kind

7:47

of the ability to do versus external

7:49

sources, I can't. So I used to compare all this

7:51

guys killing it and he's doing so well and always

7:53

making good money and always do, and I said, that's

7:56

stupid because that brings you down. I just look at it and

7:58

say, what could I do? to get to

8:00

that level or higher and I use it as fuel

8:03

now and I really truly it's like a mindset shift

8:05

that I don't look at somebody and be like oh

8:07

screw them I look at them go that's awesome yeah

8:09

I'm gonna do I'm gonna go for it too yeah

8:12

like you said how there's not so many

8:14

people that do that so it's even more

8:16

unique opportunity okay I found the quote just

8:18

because someone else is winning doesn't mean you're

8:20

losing right I love that because I'm

8:22

always like oh that person's doing this I'm like it

8:25

I thought it said something about me when it doesn't

8:27

at all so that's cool that you say that because

8:30

it is like I did this I'm blanking

8:32

on his name Dan he's

8:34

a magician in New York yeah yeah yeah

8:36

yeah great show I did the online

8:38

one yep yeah the red balloon

8:41

yes awesome I I didn't

8:43

even know how to process it at the

8:45

end that I just started crying wow like

8:47

I just like you know when you just

8:49

have so many emotions yeah it's great yeah I'm

8:51

sure that's what he's going it

8:53

was crazy but I feel the same way

8:55

like when I watch well I my girlfriend

8:57

saw you on was America's got talent yeah I

8:59

was on my girlfriend saw you on that and

9:01

she was like you need to have this person

9:03

on your podcast so I went to look up

9:05

your Instagram and I got the same feelings like

9:07

full body chills I was just like how did

9:09

you go from like magic and being a magician

9:11

into like a mind what is it called mentalist

9:14

mentalist mind reader yeah how did

9:16

you do that honestly it's it's

9:18

it there's practical reasons yeah and

9:20

then there were the practical

9:22

reasons is that when you start doing shows that are

9:24

bigger and bigger you either

9:27

need bigger props or you need

9:29

things that play bigger so what I mean by that is if

9:31

I start doing a room for from 75 people yeah or

9:33

like 50 people in someone's living

9:35

room to 250 people nobody can

9:37

see cards like if you're doing a card trick like

9:39

I can't see those cards right it's not big enough

9:42

so what you started doing is finding tricks

9:44

or routines they call them that pack small but play

9:47

big yeah so what can you bring in a small

9:49

suitcase if I don't want to check all these bags

9:51

with all this crazy stuff so it became a thing

9:53

that was practical where I did a little bit of

9:56

mentalism but I was a little scared to do all

9:58

mentalism think of it as like your your

10:00

props when you're a magician are your crutch. Yeah.

10:03

Right? It's kind of like it's a little nerve-wracking

10:05

to go to a show with no props. Because you go, oh my

10:07

God, the props are what work and do the stuff. It's

10:09

like me when I'm traveling. I need to have a Xanax

10:12

on hand. I'm not going to take it. I'm not going

10:14

to take it, but just knowing it's there is my little

10:16

crutch. There's your comfort zone. There you go. That

10:18

was my magic tricks at the time. Yeah. The

10:21

card tricks always work. The mentalist tricks don't always work.

10:23

And there's elements of risk. And kind of the more

10:25

you get advanced with it, the more stuff you do

10:27

that becomes a bigger and bigger swing. Yeah. So

10:30

to answer that question, I was

10:32

slowly transitioning from doing magic to more

10:34

and more of what's described as mentalism.

10:37

Yeah. And then at a certain

10:39

point when I did that show, America's Got Talent,

10:41

I made a concerted like strategic decision, which is

10:43

the year before me, a magician had won the

10:45

show. He was awesome. This guy, Matt Franco,

10:48

friend of mine. But if you

10:50

look broad strokes, we look similar. We're like two

10:52

white dudes in our twenties and thirties. So how

10:54

much can you differentiate between the two of us?

10:56

So I need to create like a barrier to

10:59

be like, that's this guy. And I'm this person.

11:01

And so that's when I went from being like, I

11:04

was always Perlman, whatever magician, mentalist to owes the mentalist.

11:06

That's what became my social. I like locked it in

11:08

with all of them. And that's when

11:10

on the show, I did all mentalism. And

11:13

it really set me apart where a lot

11:15

of people, I get this a lot

11:18

where people will see a magic show and they'll just say, Oh,

11:20

I don't really like magic that much, but I love what you

11:22

do. So they see what I do is a

11:24

very different. I want to call it kind of

11:26

cerebral because magic can be seen

11:28

as a puzzle, like an

11:30

intellectual challenge. If I do a trick,

11:33

you're like, I don't know you did that, but you know, and

11:35

you're trying to pull it off that you're smarter than me because

11:37

I don't know how you did it. Right. It's

11:39

kind of like a puzzle. Yeah. That's

11:41

not what I do. I'm not setting up challenges for intellect. I'm

11:43

kind of showing you the way that I've learned

11:46

how to reverse engineer the human mind. So

11:48

people find it more fascinating because they realize there's a method

11:51

versus a trick. I think this

11:53

is probably everybody just sits here and goes,

11:55

how, like, how do you do it? Is

11:57

it body language? Is it like there's somebody.

12:00

body language, there's a lot of misdirection, there's a

12:02

lot of skills applied together. It's

12:05

kind of like a chef, where a chef knows how to

12:08

do this, do that. I can do French

12:10

cuisine, I can do American cuisine, I can do Thai

12:12

cuisine, I can make a sauce. I have a lot

12:14

of tools that I use, that I combine, and

12:17

that I know if you're

12:19

going through a path. You know when little

12:21

kids have those little, on a kid's

12:24

menu, how there's that little box where you try to get to

12:26

the, mom gets to the cheese? So

12:29

when you go through there, and your brain at that moment just

12:31

says, I'm gonna go to the right, what

12:33

made you go to the right instead of go to the left?

12:35

And then when you got to this part, what made you do

12:37

that? So you don't really stop to think

12:40

about those things. What if somebody

12:42

had spent years understanding, or if

12:44

I asked you to think of a color, and

12:46

you go okay, I'll think of a color, and

12:48

you're like, that seems so spontaneous, but what if

12:50

the way that I asked the color? And what

12:52

if the things we said before that, what if

12:54

all of those little tactics, which

12:56

you didn't realize were designed to

12:59

elicit a certain response? And

13:01

so the same way that a

13:03

really good advertiser, marketers, they have like ways that

13:05

they've spent billions of dollars to try to get

13:07

you to buy their product, instead of

13:10

that one right next to it. A

13:12

lot of those same skills that

13:14

are very subtle, that involve kind

13:16

of coaxing, influencing people. What

13:18

if you could do that, and again, I'm

13:20

not like saving the world or a CIA agent, I'm

13:22

doing it in the guise of entertainment, I can show you

13:24

that I know how you think. And

13:27

so that's the setup, that's what's

13:29

so impressive, if you all goes wow, how could you have

13:31

done this? And I go, well I've spent like years learning

13:33

how to do that. I guess so,

13:35

but are you ever scared, like could you tell

13:37

if somebody didn't like you? I mean I

13:39

think so, yeah. Because I feel, well maybe it's even

13:41

obvious, like if someone didn't like me, I'd be like, oh they

13:43

don't really like me, but could you be like, they're thinking this

13:45

about me? Yeah, I think I could tell

13:47

that a lot of the time, yeah. I

13:50

like you. Sounds like I know.

13:52

She was like, I donate, you know. Don't

13:55

worry, I'm like very fascinated by you. I

13:57

also found this fascinating, that you were actually

13:59

like in corporate. America and

14:01

you performed at your own company

14:04

party and then quit corporate

14:06

America and went after your dreams. I need to

14:08

know that process because it's one of my favorite things

14:10

when people do that. They just go

14:13

follow their dreams and go for it and get

14:15

out of corporate America. Not that there's anything. Obviously

14:17

we need corporate America. You do. Here's

14:19

what it comes down to. What is

14:21

your calling? People I think realize

14:23

it more and more now is you have a finite amount of

14:25

time. Like all the money in the world you only have so

14:28

many years alive. You never know how much that's gonna be. I

14:30

think I hit a point

14:32

where I didn't dislike my job. I wasn't digging

14:34

graves or ditches. Trust me, I didn't have a

14:36

bad job. I worked on Wall Street. I

14:39

made way more money than a 21 year old

14:41

should have. But it was not my calling. When

14:43

you fast forward in your life, you're like five

14:45

years go by quick, ten years go by. They

14:47

go faster and faster as you keep going. I

14:49

go, is this where I see myself forever? The

14:52

answer was no. Everyone around me

14:54

even knew it. What was funny,

14:58

I'll give you a quick debrief. My job was red

15:01

tape. I was bureaucracy. I worked at

15:03

a company where I would have somebody who was

15:05

20 years older than me, a million times smarter

15:07

than me, say we need to buy all these

15:09

servers to create these applications for the bankers. We

15:12

need three million dollars. I go, you have one

15:14

million dollars. They hate me. Imagine you get off

15:16

a call and everyone just hates you. You're like, I

15:19

hate this guy. That gives me anxiety. Exactly.

15:21

But my job was designed to save money. I

15:24

was this annoying person who had all

15:26

these rules. I was a customer service

15:28

in a company. What would

15:30

take away the sting is we'd all

15:32

go to happy hours and then I

15:35

would do tricks. The people that hated

15:37

me were like, this guy's not so

15:39

bad. Exactly. I like him. It was

15:41

a great sweetener where when you give

15:43

someone bitter medicine, if you could

15:45

just insert it inside of honey or chocolate or

15:47

Nutella, oh my god, it went down smooth. So

15:50

long story short, within the company, I

15:52

started doing parties because the party

15:54

planners heard about me from this person or that person

15:57

and a lot of them knew who I was. But at a went

16:00

so high up the food chain that they

16:02

would normally hire professionals. They wouldn't hire like

16:04

hobbyists, you know, it's not a talent show

16:06

within the company. And so I did

16:08

something for the second in command, the CFO of the company.

16:11

I did a magic trick where I turned a $1 bill

16:13

into a hundred and he just goes,

16:15

Oh my God, we got to get you working

16:17

here. And I go, I do work here. And

16:19

it was like this joke and he didn't know

16:21

and he's Australian. He goes, what the hell you

16:23

doing working here, mate? And it was one of

16:25

those aha Oprah moments of whoa, you

16:28

know, this is not even my boss's This

16:30

is like my boss's boss's boss's boss, you

16:32

know, and he just saw it

16:34

and everyone else taught and I quit. It was about

16:36

a month later and it's not this

16:39

perfect story because I was younger. I didn't

16:41

have any kids. I didn't have any responsibilities.

16:43

I had saved up a ton of money,

16:45

had all these jobs when I was a

16:47

teenager doing those birthday parties and restaurants and

16:49

saving money, which gave me options later so

16:51

that if I went for it, you know

16:53

what? Timing is everything in life, but

16:56

also a lot of the time you

16:58

can't jump in the pool. If you're like

17:00

sitting on the sideline, right? So it came to

17:03

the point where I needed to go for it

17:05

and be hungry. So when I quit

17:07

my job, day one was like wake up on the

17:09

couch, you know, I can wake up at 10 a.m.

17:11

And I had no boss. Yeah. And I think that's

17:14

both the best thing and the worst thing in my

17:16

life, because if you're not out there busting your ass,

17:19

no one's going to do it for you. There's no

17:21

like, oh, I saw you. You're going to be a

17:23

star. That doesn't happen in life. No

17:25

one that you think of that became a star just had it

17:27

handed to them. They worked their butt off. They

17:30

made their luck. And so I think

17:32

especially in some field like yours, like

17:34

people that now have content creation, podcasts,

17:36

like there's so many avenues to amplify

17:38

your voice and have people find you

17:40

and connect with them and in mind,

17:43

it's entertainment and also provide

17:45

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Good fine. How

20:14

did you go on? America's Got Talent? Did you just

20:16

audition? So. I auditioned, but I auditioned multiple

20:19

times a day. That's also just a

20:21

great lesson for people in which. In.

20:23

Hindsight he was looking oh that easy you

20:25

add on that show new became know the

20:27

i tried to get on that show and

20:29

the first time i tried to get all

20:31

i had what's called a producer call which

20:33

is red velvet rope it walk rate in

20:35

sir it wasn't since the that normal where

20:37

you you apply is you either send in

20:39

a video now is zoom they do it

20:41

since coven are you going do like. A

20:44

giant hangar or you know like this open

20:46

space warehouse with thousands of people. give you

20:48

a number, go sit on a chair with

20:50

like you don't like football field size Wait

20:52

all day summit wait two days and then

20:54

they call you in for a minute. has

20:56

yet that's at that Wage is the first

20:58

time the first time actually a call by

21:00

producers. Some he knew me which should be

21:02

the best way to zoom in weight yet

21:04

but it went terribly and not even my

21:06

fault. But again timing is everything. They brought

21:08

me in a room one p A like

21:10

for those who don't know it's production assistant

21:12

like at headphone on he goes start going

21:14

to do it. I could do what a

21:16

sound like I'm doing. A. Mitering thing

21:18

like i need someone to help you try to know

21:20

that I'm just for the camera. oh my kids sing

21:23

and day I am so they bring someone in was

21:25

distracted is not really into it goes terribly. they don't

21:27

react while the what on a thing they're listening some

21:29

other or what I do what about it's just when

21:31

really poorly and I knew was shot. And.

21:33

Then I went back to years later.

21:35

Those two years I had done probably

21:38

close to five hundred shows, my conference

21:40

and gone up near my presence just.

21:42

Just put. In those ten thousand

21:44

hours and then some and improved when I

21:47

got there I didn't really care as much.

21:49

I wasn't nervous, I just felt easy going

21:51

and app that when I just killed and

21:53

it he you know right time right place.

21:56

At a time mean I'm tolerably that

21:58

and of what's been your favorite experience

22:00

Forgive I've seen you like you are

22:02

saying earlier, do football t and of

22:04

you were on net. Sunday conversations

22:06

with tale of who does like the

22:09

biggest celebrities of all times and at

22:11

but there's gotta be a moment for

22:13

you that you're like this one. This

22:15

moments there. This person. what is it?

22:18

There's. A bunch, you know if you were

22:20

to put a trend of a time stamp

22:22

as to you know, before I was a

22:24

boy and then it became a man, they'll

22:26

lives. When I did the finale of America's

22:28

Got Talent it's live on Tv, It's the

22:30

highest rated show it's at. Radio City Music

22:32

will see that six or seven thousand people

22:34

in the room is so high pressure because

22:36

on live Tv there's a clock. When the

22:38

clock ends. Your.e M C O M

22:40

easier and so if anything's going wrong, the

22:42

clock doesn't stop. Yeah, it's like the Superbowl

22:45

yeah for what I do yet. And so

22:47

that the level of. Intensity in

22:49

laser focus weird but also if you to

22:51

focus in you look nervous, you're not loose

22:53

and much much of what I do has

22:56

to be loose or people get dance and

22:58

then it doesn't work and also it has

23:00

to look like I'm enjoying myself and I

23:02

have to be enjoying myself for the audience

23:05

can see through it some having fun, they're

23:07

having fun and so I think that was

23:09

one of the biggest ones. There's been a

23:11

lot since there's been like all these steps.

23:14

I had i am own tv show we

23:16

won an emmy award that was crying like

23:18

yet. They're just all these things where he

23:20

of the that sl stuff. I've met

23:23

a lot of my heroes a met like of

23:25

you. We civil Brock Obama, By. Performed

23:27

show used by opening act know and I had

23:29

to read his mind ill and then he adi

23:31

me as it's like just you know it's like.

23:34

Pinch. Me moments of i can't believe this is

23:36

realize what an honor not own eyes and ah

23:38

i guess the name some he was going to

23:40

talk to the next day really up by him

23:42

a business card and I said sir what not

23:44

or to me unique as what's this like a

23:47

hold on ago you think of someone going to

23:49

talk to you tomorrow deals oh okay and the

23:51

other crazy part about this is. A

23:53

Huge he went on before me and then when

23:55

I would to shake his hand it's a low

23:57

She knew I was either there was a law.

24:00

Are you can introduce myself but I see

24:02

that as a gonna die as like Obama

24:04

knows who I am right now. You have

24:06

Amazing! I saw your hard knocks a good

24:08

what's going on right now so that was

24:10

very. It was cause real. That.

24:12

Is Surreal. That's it for me. That was

24:15

Jennifer Anniston knew I was and I was

24:17

like. Right, you heard

24:19

it. Also the story. Yeah,

24:21

exactly. I love it though as so it.

24:24

Obviously we know that you're at like

24:26

abilities and ice. I wanted to challenge

24:28

you obviously on this podcast to do

24:30

something with me so that the people

24:32

at home can see it. Should.

24:34

We do it. Now you have any other questions his.

24:36

Once we start doing crazy stuff, it's hard to go

24:38

backwards. Can do that until this morning by snowbirds.

24:40

Have to because they would you do. Your mind is

24:42

gonna be melted. your inability of them like my mind

24:45

becomes yellow are you know to see right now so

24:47

I could do up with then you can go back.

24:49

Of the idea of a few more control. Questions for

24:51

ago and I'll house. Is so so

24:53

many guys is actually but I'm I'm picking and

24:55

choosing to. They really want to get to that.

24:57

Bless you! Talked about earlier about a little bit

25:00

of like skepticism in your industry or like when

25:02

you perform for Be Both but how do you

25:04

navigate back as I think I love that you

25:06

do. The I Love skepticism. What you

25:08

mean that's that's my favorite Psyche I

25:10

literally will. You don't know if you

25:12

don't see it is nuts. Skepticism to

25:14

me is is someone is engaged. So

25:17

when you look and you see show

25:19

hecklers. Which. To a degree. Listen

25:21

I'll give you great for at the end of

25:23

this where I just did my second grade son's

25:25

class and that's like next level heck was like

25:27

openness and show me that I don't want to

25:29

give me a break. Bodies your secondary hackers are

25:31

different level than L hecklers but if someone skeptical

25:33

what does that mean it means they're interested in

25:35

means or sassy means are trying to figure how

25:38

you did it's I'm not opposed that think of

25:40

who am I am I corps I'm just a

25:42

guy who wanted to the house was on to

25:44

read but I took that to the. Obsessive

25:46

Nth degree. We're not only to learn how.

25:49

But. I learned how to do it.

25:51

Yeah so anyone who became a mental

25:53

was very skeptical at some point because

25:55

they wanna know how is is done.

25:58

Most people have a light cessation. And

26:00

what Dick The death of me is apathy.

26:02

If somebody watches my showing leaves an hour

26:04

later like a popcorn movie and it only

26:06

remember what happened that means I did a

26:08

terrible job So me skeptical know I he

26:10

did this You this I love that So

26:12

no I when I get on stage I

26:14

tell people on the biggest skeptic out of

26:16

all of you and I go let's try

26:18

to debunk how I'm doing this because I'm

26:20

not a psychic because I'm not a media

26:22

like I'm not supernatural and I'm very clear

26:24

at the outset explain that there is a

26:27

method It is something you could learn is

26:29

a skill that is. Transferable. It is not

26:31

in eight or god given but there is

26:33

a talent so way I lean that like.

26:35

Think. Of somebody who can figure skate. I

26:38

can't figure skate A to make it's ice

26:40

skating. I almost died besides. so could I

26:42

ever do a triple axel or whatever? No

26:44

right to do it for next twenty years.

26:46

I don't have that gene. I don't have

26:48

a music gene, but I could get better.

26:50

So I have some sort of innate skill

26:53

that I think has to do with reading.

26:55

People think a lot of my folks gets

26:57

worse. Thirteen I think. like I had an

26:59

older siblings. I think there's certain things that's

27:01

helped me as a child become more intuitive.

27:03

but it's not supernatural. It was just a

27:05

skilled assembly. Comedians. So they have really

27:08

sad home lives. Yeah so what are they

27:10

do the over compensate to make it one

27:12

last to take away all the like sad

27:14

things that are going on. So I think

27:16

with with what I did I like that

27:18

attention. I like seeing people amazed and that

27:20

was my that was my drugs or like

27:22

wall. They love that when I was thirteen

27:24

now I just kind of became superman so

27:26

that skill. I. Think I got off track

27:28

with your question, but. I. Love when

27:30

people are skeptical. Her. More. Than

27:32

anything I don't I don't mind it at all

27:35

because I think my job is converting skeptics in

27:37

so much of what's been amazing to me as

27:39

I will meet. You. Humble

27:41

brag, but like it's it's wanted to join

27:44

my job. Some of the most successful

27:46

fasting rich like I've just met. all these

27:48

people President's Ceos accompanies. Multi

27:50

multi billion do It sounded The

27:52

largest companies in the world's end.

27:55

These. Are hyper intelligent people?

27:57

and it's funny because i've learned this one nice where

28:00

they're blown away and they're blown

28:03

away because this is the thing I've learned

28:05

how the mind works. I want to

28:07

learn how the mind works but I don't have the time.

28:09

Right in a book, I'm writing a book right now. You put in a

28:11

lot of hours and time and years. Yeah, what is

28:13

your book gonna be about? So the book

28:15

is really how to apply the principles

28:18

of mentalism to your everyday

28:20

life. You know, skills and habits for success

28:22

that you can do today, tomorrow, ten years

28:24

from now, you're not going to become a

28:26

mentalist because you know what? 99.999% of people

28:28

don't want to but

28:31

what if you can go into a room and

28:33

read people more effectively? Right? Like you just said,

28:35

what if you had 10% more skills in knowing

28:37

how does this person feel about me? How many

28:39

people want to raise at work? When's

28:42

the right time to do that? What's really going on

28:44

in your boss's mind? Right? What if with your spouse

28:46

or with your significant other, with your kids, getting a

28:48

sense of when are they lying to you? When are

28:50

they telling the truth? How do you engage them more

28:52

effectively? Just skills that are useful. How to

28:54

become the most memorable person when you walk in a room. When

28:56

I was 14 and I walked into

28:59

a restaurant, first thing I learned, how do you know

29:01

everybody's name that you meet? Because how does that make

29:03

them feel when you know their name and something

29:06

about them and their family? Suddenly that's like

29:08

a Superman or Superwoman ability because you care

29:10

about them. So all of these

29:12

skills that allowed me to leave my job in

29:14

corporate America, right? Everybody has a dream. What do

29:17

you want to do that you're not doing now?

29:19

How do you get from A to B to

29:21

C? Those skills that I

29:23

used are the same ones you can use.

29:25

That's cool. I want to read that book. Knock

29:28

on wood. Hopefully next year. Do you have a name for

29:30

it? I don't want to say the name yet. I'm

29:32

gonna say it and then you're gonna be like, where's

29:36

that book by the way? That's fair enough.

29:38

That is the core of the book is

29:40

never before revealed secrets that aren't gonna make

29:42

you a mentalist but give you the skills

29:44

of a mentalist for your life. Does it

29:47

drive your wife nuts? I

29:49

drive her nuts on so many fronts. We

29:52

could get into that in a whole different level. She'd get on

29:54

the podcast and be like, I wish she could read my mind

29:56

more. She's like, why didn't you take the kids? Why didn't you

29:58

pick up the trash? Read my mind

30:00

out. Here's what I want you to do. No,

30:02

I can't read her mind. I wish I could that's honestly I

30:05

think that's why we're a good couple. Oh Yeah,

30:07

that makes sense. What about what about the kids like

30:09

I think I have a good sense in my kids I

30:11

have four kids. I know right busy

30:14

Four kids and you're traveling all the

30:17

time. I know I like that I like how Caitlin's

30:19

from Nashville and she's like you have four kids when somebody

30:21

from Nashville is impressed Like in

30:23

New York City, we're like unicorns. Yeah,

30:25

totally Yeah, but I'm also Canadian

30:27

and I'm 38 and no

30:29

kids so I'm like what for everyone's

30:31

like where the kids I know we need them to keep warm

30:35

I'm an honorary Canadian. My wife is from Canada.

30:37

Well, and you're from Michigan, right? I'm from Michigan

30:39

So I'm also honorary Canadian. I was that's true

30:41

when I was 19. We go to Ontario to

30:44

Windsor to drink 19

30:46

was the drinking age 18 where

30:48

I was from so crazy you do the kids

30:50

love when you do magic I'm in this Goldilocks

30:52

zone where my kids actually think I'm cool before

30:55

in just a couple years You're gonna be like,

30:57

please dad stop get out here. You're embarrassing us

30:59

But no, it's really fun funny

31:01

enough. They don't like mentalism to them It's

31:04

so boring because they don't really get it

31:06

this fair they like magic So I'm known

31:08

for doing there's a few tricks that are

31:10

you know, my air quotes greatest hits Yeah

31:12

pulling candy from ears is like the high

31:14

water mark That's like my Bon

31:16

Jovi living on a prayer greatest hits for them

31:18

to date myself But I

31:20

did the biggest TV appearance I ever have done

31:22

in my life. I was on before the Super

31:25

Bowl last year Oh my god. Yep, and I

31:27

was on live TV for the Super Bowl before

31:29

kickoff. I got off stage It was a very

31:32

well difficult trick. There's only I can describe it. It was a

31:34

little too difficult I probably shouldn't have done it and

31:37

I get on a face time with my kids. I'm

31:39

like profusely finishing sweating I just like thank God it

31:41

worked and my son just goes, you know what? You

31:44

just talk too much Just do the candy out of

31:46

here next time and it was just

31:48

it cut the tension so well where just

31:50

brought me down It's like through the Super

31:52

Bowl. Yeah, 20 million people saw you He

31:55

was like just do that lollipop trick,

31:58

you know and my and my daughter three is

32:00

like yeah yeah I do that one oh

32:03

my gosh that's adorable yeah it was really funny also

32:05

holy that's live

32:07

before the Super Bowl why wasn't

32:09

half time Rihanna was halftime so I can't I

32:12

can't go that big still though still big whoa

32:14

that's do you get so mentally drained

32:16

after you do these things too I

32:19

don't get drained I get really focused I

32:21

think it's much it's like an athlete like

32:23

I actually run a lot on the side

32:25

that's my side hustle but I the same

32:27

skills that apply to my career I find

32:29

overlap very much with how competitive

32:31

I am with with athleticism and like running and

32:34

marathon ultra marathon stuff but the training is everything

32:36

which is the ideation and then when I get

32:38

to the start line or when I get on

32:40

camera that's when I'm there's

32:42

no nerves yeah the nerves are gone they're

32:44

just like you asked me when I met

32:47

Barack Obama was their nerves zero interesting because I

32:50

actually can't be nervous or

32:52

the person will feel it because you

32:54

at your core you don't realize you've been

32:56

trained since the moment from like a

32:58

thousand years thousands of years of evolution fight

33:00

or flight you can tell when someone next

33:03

to you has anxiety or nervousness you can

33:05

feel that energy you can see it yeah

33:07

if someone's tense when they're doing something you

33:09

can feel it and it makes you tense

33:11

so if you almost like trained yourself to not

33:14

or the same way that people can beat

33:16

polygraphs you know that the way people can

33:18

be lighted textures is CI

33:20

agents learn how to take away how to reduce

33:22

your heart rate how to take away the nerves

33:24

that you trick your physiology your body has to

33:27

be trained to reduce your heart rate so that

33:29

you can't feel it the same way that you

33:31

know a dog can tell if you don't like

33:33

the dog if a dog feels that you fear

33:36

it you you know those people

33:38

that walk in the room the dog doesn't like you

33:40

and it's nervous and it's barking because you don't like

33:42

it it can it's in essence reading your body language

33:44

and your scent so I've trained

33:46

myself because if I get on camera and

33:48

something's not going right it's spiral then

33:51

it goes really bad really fast I guess the tricks

33:53

going bad it's like whoa whoa this is going really

33:55

bad like you can't get out of it so

33:57

I need to Take charge.

34:00

And even write down with like. The president.

34:02

That this there was no there was no could

34:04

I was in charge. As good as we start

34:07

talking, there wasn't a moment's I took charge of

34:09

a singer. This you gotta hold this and I

34:11

don't us embassies but I'm kind of driving. I'm

34:13

the director of the showed that we're if the

34:15

other person becomes the director. I lose my power

34:18

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Limited by State Law. Read

36:36

my mind now. Read my mind. Damn,

36:38

come on. How many people walk up to you and say that? Not

36:40

often. Really? It's so

36:42

rare. No, it's funny because first off, if I get

36:44

noticed, if I get like quote unquote recognized, it's

36:47

so few and far between that people will actually ask me

36:49

to do something. They're more just like, oh, I love you

36:51

on this, or I love you on this. But if we're

36:53

trapped together, that's why on airplanes, if I'm sitting next to

36:55

a plane, next to somebody, and they're like, what do you

36:57

do for a living? God help me. I'm

37:00

not saying mentalist. I work in insurance. I'm an actuary. They're

37:02

like, oh, we don't want to talk to you anymore. It's

37:04

too boring. I even do the same thing.

37:06

I'm like, like, I'll be like, oh, social media. They're

37:08

like, what do you mean you do social media? And

37:10

then I'll just somehow pivot and be like, well, I

37:13

like help people get brand deals. Because I'm just like,

37:15

I don't want to say anything because then it just,

37:17

I don't know, but I'm also not a plane talker.

37:19

Right. I'm a plane sleeper. So I'm

37:21

just like, boom, man. Yes.

37:24

Ear plugs, I'm out cold. But I was like,

37:26

that's why I've trapped you in this room with me. Right.

37:29

So that you can read my mind. Let's

37:31

say we talked about planes. Do

37:33

you enjoy traveling? Yes. What

37:36

is your favorite type of travel? Is it work

37:38

and pleasure or just unplugging? Can you do that?

37:40

Or are you too busy body? I

37:42

like unplugging and it's really good for me,

37:44

but I enjoy both work and play. So

37:47

let's say we could do a vacation. Let's, you know what, I'm

37:49

going to change it because if you're doing work and play, how about

37:51

this? You're throwing a party. Okay.

37:54

And I Find that when you throw a party for someone

37:57

else, it's different because you got to take their, them into

37:59

account. You're throwing a party for you. Hypothetical:

38:02

it's your birthday cat. Okay,

38:04

and it is. You're. Going

38:06

through the guest list and you're making a

38:08

list and you're not really doing this. Okay,

38:10

Mm. forget Legacy writing down. imagine you're in

38:12

your mind's rained on people you would invite.

38:15

Yeah, And. You're looking through that

38:17

list in your same yourself. Oh My.

38:19

God. This person is yourself. Doing this

38:21

that you take and you circle this

38:23

one person's name and you will. If.

38:26

They are not there. Would be a bit disappointed in hockey.

38:28

See this person. You can visually. Some studies have you thought

38:31

of this person to see them right now in your mind.

38:33

Yes, Agreed. That

38:35

there is no way that I could know

38:37

who this is Ray whether you picked a

38:39

man, woman, family, friend like any of those

38:41

things, Could. Have been rife. But.

38:44

I think right off the bat us me

38:46

body load. I think it's a scene l

38:48

Am I correct? Yeah so that wasn't that

38:50

was fifty sixty. You're not blown away as

38:53

if all unlike some Atlanta has. You know

38:55

because it seems yourself friends and friends are

38:57

going to come in. It's a milestone such

38:59

to be more people want to be national

39:01

folks. If she was having a birthday party,

39:03

this person. How concerned

39:05

are you that she would invite you

39:07

very very there. Is. There

39:10

any way tell your listeners that I could

39:12

know who you just thought of the or

39:14

anything about this person nothing and you'd interesting

39:16

of one person There are tons of people

39:18

who you thought could come your birth of

39:20

our to soar understanding folks there's no way

39:22

to know where your mind with. You

39:25

thought if she was having a birthday party would you

39:27

invite me? Which means in your head, you go. Oh

39:29

my God. When is her birthday? Try not to react.

39:32

But. You're gonna look at me and and just think. January.

39:35

February, March, April, May, May is

39:37

right now said people who says

39:39

keep going.six June, July, August, September,

39:41

October, November, December, Twelve months. One.

39:43

At a twelve? she's born in November,

39:45

isn't she? Has.

39:49

November a lot. Of eminent right,

39:51

discounted, Body

39:53

reacts I can throw other. i'm

39:56

at a rate is down and you're going to

39:58

tell them can you see me right own november

40:00

right now and you're gonna hear this marker right

40:02

in November and then November has 30

40:05

days Thanksgiving's always at the end I'm going to write

40:07

down okay I

40:11

want you to close your eyes you know I know we're

40:13

recording this on video so I have it on video just

40:15

in case but I just showed a camera and

40:18

now open your eyes it's already written so nobody

40:20

can say I changed it question

40:24

for you you thought you knew her birthday and you're

40:26

like double check you're like oh my god am I right

40:28

and you did know her birthday yeah right yeah that's

40:31

even funny because you were on the fence you're like do I or don't

40:33

I say I could tell you that you were shifty it's

40:35

already written tell us what's her birthday the 21st

40:38

November 21st I just turned it

40:40

around says November 21st I'm shaking

40:42

but like what but

40:45

how can you tell the twit okay and

40:47

then and then I think I think that you

40:49

guys are so close that you don't even call

40:51

her by her first name am I right see

40:54

it's like it's like it's a nickname isn't it

40:56

is that right it's

40:58

a nickname it's like a it's not even short it's

41:00

like something a pet name it's what

41:03

is her full and it's the same she starts

41:05

same lady with you Kay it's cat is it cats you call

41:07

her cat with a K I'm

41:13

gonna cry what yes crying

41:15

2.0 I love it I love it like

41:18

my whole body can't wake up the waterworks I'm

41:20

getting nothing no I'm like in

41:22

shock right now because

41:26

like the dance stuff I'm like okay it's

41:28

on zoom and like there's certain things

41:30

that I think but this I'm like how

41:32

how I'm how but how

41:35

would you know that right so how do we

41:37

read we obviously got the month then we got

41:39

the day and then you picked up the name

41:41

like so we wrote this yeah yeah

41:43

absolutely hold on wait I want to try one thing which

41:46

is I don't write anything down I want you to just think

41:48

of this I want you to imagine that you're at

41:50

your bank okay and that

41:53

you walk up and you you're about to type

41:55

in your ETM but you know what imagine you

41:57

lost your card your bank card okay and

41:59

they call you and you have to redo everything and

42:01

I don't want anything that you've thought of before.

42:03

I want this to be a blank slate. I

42:05

want you to make up right this second a

42:08

random four digit pin code that's not a

42:10

real code that you use for anything that

42:12

you've never added up or used. Just make

42:14

it up right now so everyone knows this

42:17

is spontaneous. Give me a fake four

42:19

digit code. Don't do one, two, three, four. That's like the

42:21

only one. Go. Four, two,

42:23

eight, zero. Okay, four, two, eight, zero. Any

42:27

meaning to that? No. You've got

42:30

to date this isn't like the second 1980 or something. So

42:34

you've not written anything down about this.

42:37

You've not said anything. You just said

42:39

it right now. Four, two, eight,

42:41

zero. But right before you said it,

42:44

I asked you to think of your ATM

42:46

payment code. I said imagine you're at the

42:48

bank and so that got in your head.

42:50

That was kind of like marinating. And

42:52

then right after that, you had to give

42:55

me a number. Four, two,

42:57

eight, zero. Here's what I think. I

42:59

think you avoided your real

43:02

ATM pin code because you wouldn't have if your real

43:04

number was like four or five, six, seven, you wouldn't

43:06

have four because it would have been too close. So

43:08

I know it doesn't start with a four. I know

43:10

it. And I think what

43:12

you would have done is not gone really close.

43:15

So if this this I with a

43:17

four being the start, I don't think it's a five or

43:19

three. They're too close. I think they're too close. Are

43:22

you okay if I try to guess your real

43:25

ATM in code? Your real ATM in code. Yeah.

43:27

I've never written this down, posted online,

43:30

told anyone. No. Okay. I

43:33

think the four is wrong. I

43:36

think it's bigger. The first number is a seven, isn't it?

43:39

Yes. Which I think you like. I think it's a lucky number for

43:41

you. So I think you did a seven. Then

43:43

you jumped the two, the two, the two, the

43:46

two is also close. I think you went bigger, which means you

43:48

went one over to three. It's a seven and then a three,

43:51

isn't it? This

43:53

is scary. And now and

43:55

now I've actually gone to ATMs and stood in front of people and done

43:57

this in front before they do their pin code. And

43:59

I'm going to just write down 8080.

44:01

I'm going to cross these

44:03

out. Close your eyes. I'm

44:06

going to hand you the pad of

44:08

paper. Okay, tell everyone open your eyes. It's

44:10

face down so you can't see it. Okay, grab it

44:13

and hold it in your own hands. Hold your hands before

44:15

you turn around. Tell them you already holding this. I cannot

44:17

change what I wrote down. Right? It's

44:19

in your hand. Yeah. Tell

44:22

us all you said 4280 in the moment spontaneous

44:24

you had no idea we would ever talk about

44:26

your ATM pin code. What is your real code?

44:28

Say it 7399. 7399. Take a look

44:30

at what I wrote. Just kidding.

44:35

I was like, wait, maybe

44:38

you made me think that maybe I'm wrong. I wrote 7399. I

44:40

don't understand. Let's go to a chase. There's

44:47

a chase right around the corner. Let's go right now. You can

44:50

guess people's bank pin code. Dangerous

44:52

man. But how would you even? That

44:56

is I mean, I what I

44:59

almost came up with a different number two, but I was just

45:01

like, I'll just pick whatever comes out of my brain. You

45:03

know, how about this? We do a magic trick, a

45:05

disappearing act. What if I just disappeared pow, like a

45:08

little smoke bomb disappeared. And I

45:10

were to ask you, who is the

45:12

number one person that you would love to

45:14

interview? Okay, famous person was called number

45:16

one famous person, you would love to interview but

45:18

number one on your list. Would

45:21

you say that the number one person on your list

45:23

would be an obvious choice for you? Yeah. So you

45:25

think that people that listen

45:27

to your podcast and know you would probably be

45:29

able to guess this within three or four guesses?

45:31

Yes. Okay. Is it a man or a woman?

45:33

woman. And just tell us, I'm not going to

45:35

guess it. If you say it's obvious, what is

45:37

her name? Britney Spears. That's your number one person.

45:39

Yeah. And you haven't had a chance. No. So

45:42

if that was your number one, and I were to say

45:44

to kind of imagine you

45:46

put names in the hats of other

45:48

people that are also fascinating to you.

45:50

Yeah. Could be men, women,

45:52

dead, alive, whatever. And I told you to shake it

45:55

up. And then that you

45:57

you grab one of those out kind

45:59

of at random. and you open it up, but not

46:01

even random, it's like a photo. Like you have a

46:03

photo of this person right now and you can see

46:05

this person, but it's not Britney Spears, right? Yeah, no.

46:08

And that person would be here. Would you

46:10

agree this is a very random choice

46:12

that you made? Yeah. Right? Fully.

46:14

Yeah. Britney

46:18

Spears was your number one. Yeah. I

46:21

think that earlier, when I asked you to think of who

46:24

you have at your birthday and you said, cat, I could tell it was

46:27

a female. I could just tell. Yeah. Now I see

46:29

the subtle shift. And I

46:31

think the person who you thought of, who you like,

46:33

imagine just grabbing their photo and holding it in front of you

46:35

and saying, oh my God, I think it's a guy. Is that

46:37

a man? Yeah. I knew it. I think

46:39

he's alive. Am I right? Yeah. I thought so. And

46:42

normally this would be way tougher because

46:45

you would just have gone out because people are gonna say,

46:47

oh, it's so obvious because she told you, but I think

46:49

this couldn't be more crazy because I think you were trying

46:51

to throw me off the scent. And you

46:53

said, if it's Britney Spears, you also thought

46:55

of her dad, Jamie Spears. Is that who

46:58

you thought of second? Yes. I

47:01

don't understand. How would you even, what

47:04

if you didn't know who it was? Would you still be able

47:06

to guess? I mean, I've guessed people

47:09

in different languages before. So yeah. Can

47:13

you like even give like a tiny hint

47:15

of how? Like, how would you, how? The

47:17

things I do, the event list, not as much,

47:19

but like human lie detector, there's a few things I

47:22

tipped so people can learn how to do it. But

47:24

this is kind of, you've got to learn to crawl before you

47:26

can walk, before you can run, before you can sprint. My

47:30

whole, I feel like into my toes, into

47:32

my heart, into my brain, like I'm like,

47:35

like shaking. I've

47:37

never, I've never, I've never, I've

47:40

never been a part of something so crazy. Thank you.

47:44

What? I don't understand though. Like

47:47

you really, it doesn't make sense.

47:50

It doesn't. That's what I told you. I said, that's what I

47:52

told you. This is, like when I was shaking Barack Obama's hand

47:54

and he goes, what's this card? And I say, who are you

47:56

gonna talk to this week? I should think of anyone. And

47:58

he said, my friend Marty, I go, really look at the card right now

48:01

and he turned it over and said, say hi to Marty for me. And it

48:03

was just, you know, it was just, did he lose his noodle?

48:06

I can't, I can't post videos or anything

48:08

as well. It's off the record, but offline,

48:10

I will show you how freaked out he

48:13

was. Yeah. He was, he

48:15

was pretty, because I had, I

48:17

had the prime minister of France pinch my cheek. It

48:19

was a real one. I don't have video. Nicolas

48:22

Alcozy. I was in Paris and he was, you, you

48:24

are a very dangerous man. It was just so funny.

48:26

I was like, he was looking at me like thinking,

48:28

how can I use your skill? That's what I was

48:30

just thinking. I'm like, we're not solving crimes. This

48:32

CIA ever want to like, how,

48:35

but could you, I'd be open to, to discussing

48:37

with them. Um, I don't know because they

48:40

have people trained in some of the same things

48:42

I do. So I don't think that necessarily, because

48:44

I just think like you, there was

48:47

so many people that I could have

48:49

thought that I would be disappointed. And

48:51

I was, I just went with the first

48:53

person I thought about, like, how would you even know

48:56

that's the G and her

48:58

birthday, there's 12 months and then

49:00

there, it could have been 31

49:03

different numbers. Right. And you

49:06

just know, like you just go 21. I mean,

49:10

also the funny thing is, is what if you had thought

49:13

of the wrong date, which is

49:15

always funny, is what I have gotten the real date

49:18

that was right. Yeah. Or what you thought it was.

49:20

That's, yeah. Yeah. I'll get

49:23

things wrong. Sometimes I've

49:25

had this at a lot of shows, a

49:27

husband and wife sit next to each other and I'll

49:29

guess and they're like, that's wrong. And the wife right

49:31

next to him, like, that's who I was thinking of.

49:33

And you're like, wait, what? And it's, it's crazy because

49:35

it's almost as if you had a radio station, you

49:37

know what I mean? And the dial, you know, when

49:39

there's static and you hear two radio stations, same time,

49:41

it pops in then the other. Yeah. And I'll be

49:43

like, I, it's so weird, but I don't realize I

49:45

actually got it from you, not from him. And

49:47

those types of things are kind of, people are almost more shook

49:50

up because you got it wrong, but, but

49:52

you kind of got it right. So do

49:54

you like see it in your brain? No,

49:56

I, it's not a see it in your brain. Like

49:59

it's not visual. It's not like six

50:01

sense dead people. I narrow it down.

50:03

I narrow it down. But like narrowing it

50:05

down. I play like the game hot cold when you're

50:07

a kid. You know when you play hot cold and

50:10

somebody hides something? Yeah. And you go hot, hot cold,

50:12

cold, hot, hot. So I could play that but a

50:14

much, much, much more advanced version. Well,

50:17

it has to be because how like

50:19

I'm sitting here thinking, okay, what if like,

50:23

how did we get this? I don't even know how to

50:25

speak. How do you get to 21?

50:27

Like, how do you see my brain going? 20

50:30

and 21? Like, was I mouthing it? Was I? No, I

50:32

was in that room. You should try it sometime. You

50:34

should try it and see what you can come up

50:36

with. It's a, people are funny when they try. See if

50:38

you can guess something one to ten

50:40

on somebody. Have them think of a number and see

50:42

if you nail it and you'd be surprised. I'm gonna

50:45

leave your mind. I think you would only get it

50:47

one out of ten times. But if you start learning

50:49

techniques, you'll start hitting it three times, four times. You'll

50:51

be like, whoa, you'll know that certain people do three

50:53

or seven. And then you'll know certain cultures do with

50:56

eight. And then you'll know somebody who kind of was

50:58

a little pushy end up doing two or like, there's

51:00

all, there's categories and ways and there's things that you

51:02

can narrow it down, right? You can, you can

51:05

tip the odds in your favor. I'm

51:07

gonna guess, you think of a color. Okay.

51:10

And I'm gonna guess it. Go. Okay.

51:13

So immediately you were gonna say black because I'm

51:15

wearing black. So you're bringing one and then you

51:17

went, well, that's too obvious. So I'm gonna switch

51:20

it and you went yellow. No. Damn

51:23

it. So no,

51:25

if you're going to do colors with guys, they're always going

51:28

to think of blue first or certain

51:30

ones are a little more alpha. Think of red first.

51:32

And then if you pause and give them a few

51:34

moments before they answer, they will switch the last moment

51:36

from red to blue. More creative

51:38

types go with green. You will

51:40

find less than one out of 50 people. That's

51:42

a guy will pick a yellow or purple. Like

51:45

Non primaries are very rare. But Again, that's a

51:47

very subtle that you're not going to make a

51:49

living off that, but you can definitely try that.

51:52

Do You have to? You Asked someone to think

51:54

of a color versus say a color, you'll get

51:56

a different response also because what people think and

51:58

what they say is completely. Different as we

52:00

all know her thoughts are different than what people

52:02

say. There's a trick those these people which is

52:04

called magicians choice which is you leave many objects

52:07

as you want on a table. Here is t

52:09

got your ring, your phone skill a calming I

52:11

have. I've like up the lip liner of lounge,

52:13

put our stuff on the table and I would

52:15

just look and I could write down what and

52:17

put it right there and say one hundred percent

52:19

pick up any one of those you watts and

52:21

with one hundred percent surreal know when you'll do

52:23

and it's a you know it's not. It's not

52:25

like you're going to. Be on

52:28

Tv with that. Yeah, but it's mind. Blowing surrounded. You

52:30

know I could have picked up this where this when

52:32

I go you think you put us. But.

52:34

You're very easily influenced in the the way you

52:37

laid them down in the that the way you

52:39

handled them gives news as to what people will

52:41

do and then if somebody if you can tell

52:43

that you give set it up as a challenge

52:46

will pick up any when you add or change

52:48

just by me saying that you'll novel all why

52:50

was gonna pick up my phone but that so

52:52

obvious to not less one of the got my

52:54

keys I knew you would do that I knew

52:57

that. Saying. That would make your

52:59

mind eg. understand Yeah Anna like the way

53:01

you know kids lie issue that it will

53:03

lie to you were you'll you'll see them

53:05

eat something has to do They would know

53:07

my play know you did. Yeah and so

53:09

if you position it differently if. You.

53:12

Can kind of suss out when they'll tell

53:14

the truth when the life. Did you have

53:16

to like research me or a like steady me

53:18

in any way and go through my social media

53:20

to like get a sense as I got. So

53:23

that I really tell me what to do. But.

53:26

People. Are watching will know that I might have

53:28

looked you up right? but then when I do

53:30

shows with hundreds of people thousands of the way

53:32

it did no way to do that but Iowa

53:34

I had my that idol my to because that's

53:37

the skepticism says even if he researched you it's

53:39

like even more concerning like how did you get

53:41

my things him go download it off like a

53:43

little worried it's going to call but my Wells

53:46

Fargo radio ah but no I mean how. Things.

53:48

That are spontaneous even We researched. How would we

53:50

know that you would have changed your twice? from

53:53

Britney Spears someone else to some of them And

53:55

and up And Jamie Spears? yeah and of a

53:57

know yet. there's no way there's i don't

53:59

mean research as in like you would have known

54:01

that's who I would say I mean like just

54:03

to get my vibe even sure which is

54:06

more of you know I mean I guess plug

54:08

you plug all of your stuff into an algorithm

54:10

and have it spit out like what would people

54:12

do right that's kind of what is interesting with

54:14

computers now is are we getting to that point

54:16

where Amazon knows what I want to buy before

54:18

I buy it yeah yeah that kind of predictive

54:20

algorithm yeah it's similar in certain ways to what

54:22

I do but I do it in

54:25

the moment so I don't really have the

54:27

luxury of looking people up and even when

54:29

you look people up does that work no

54:32

cuz it's all that's an illusion yeah Graham yeah

54:34

that's great yeah cuz I even say that was

54:36

like mediums that I've gone to people like well

54:39

you can easily Google you and look into this

54:41

and I go yeah but she doesn't only do

54:43

people that are on Instagram right

54:45

right you just don't hear about those people

54:48

as much as they're not sharing that but like somebody

54:51

who doesn't even have Instagram or you

54:53

couldn't like they don't just do famous

54:55

people or recognizable people or people you

54:57

can research it's crazy but people have a certain

54:59

bias where they they remember the hits and they

55:01

forget the misses yeah so if you go in

55:04

like that you're you're only gonna talk about the

55:06

things they did that were amazing yeah and the

55:08

four or five things that were like well what

55:10

about I'm sensing somebody yeah and you know you

55:12

just move on yeah so you don't layer into

55:15

that go well no you got that wrong yeah

55:17

that's wrong like you're not making a checklist so

55:19

we're like if you've gotten to this

55:22

place and and every year

55:24

you somehow find a way to

55:26

get better and evolve and

55:28

grow into this like insane

55:30

mind reader and everything that you do where the heck

55:33

are you gonna be in five years ten years like

55:35

what do you hope ten years is

55:37

like so hard to map out but the three to

55:39

five-year window I can really see what I want which

55:41

is just you can continue amplifying

55:44

where most people don't know what a mentalist

55:46

is yeah and so there is there is

55:48

like a blank space so to speak versus if

55:50

you're trying to be the best quarterback if you're trying

55:52

to be the best magician or if you're trying to

55:54

be the best singer like everybody knows who those people

55:56

are I have a field that's

55:58

somewhat untapped and unknown the US.

56:00

So even if people

56:02

listen to this, it might be like I never

56:05

even heard of a mentalist. So it opens it

56:07

up. So I would love to keep kind of

56:09

growing and building that and eventually build it to

56:11

where people know what it is. And I would

56:13

love to be the household name at what I

56:15

do of people, always the mentalist. Like this is

56:18

what a mentalist is. This is that subset of

56:20

entertainment, infotainment, kind of blowing people's minds, doing a

56:22

lot more stuff. Well, it's like a

56:24

snowball that just goes down a mountain. It can't

56:26

be growing, until it gets to the point where

56:29

it can't be stopped. So I do a lot

56:31

of stuff with sports teams. I do a lot

56:33

of stuff in the corporate sector, a lot

56:35

of stuff within finance. I

56:37

do like CNBC, Fox Business. I've

56:40

targeted certain industries and fields that

56:43

are still growing. Sports keep getting

56:45

bigger and bigger. I wonder if there's a

56:47

space that you could get into where

56:49

it's like helping heal somebody who's

56:51

got like a drug abuse or

56:53

drinking problem. It's not really therapeutic.

56:56

So there's not really, it's akin to

56:58

hypnosis you can kind of use in

57:00

that way. I don't really,

57:02

I don't want to be disingenuous and ever

57:04

try to do something where my

57:06

integrity is on the line. I entertain people.

57:09

What I can do is provide kind of moments

57:11

of wonder and memorable moments that you

57:14

share with other people. And I think there

57:16

is a real value nowadays. Like think of

57:18

comedians. Comedians aren't healing anyone. But how badly

57:20

do we need comedians nowadays where everything's kind

57:22

of very woke? We need that discourse. We

57:24

need to break through. I think what I

57:26

provide on a lot of levels is

57:28

showing you that your mind is more powerful than you

57:30

believe, that things that you could be so

57:33

smart. I meant like people, Nobel Prize winners.

57:35

They are infinitely smarter than me, Caitlin. And

57:37

yet I have found some sort of niche

57:40

where they can't explain what I'm doing. And

57:42

I think that that's a fun

57:44

place to be because that's what we love

57:46

with athletics. That's what we love. We love

57:48

to see things that excite us. Something different

57:50

where you walk out fired up. That's

57:53

what I like to be for people. You did way more

57:55

for me this morning what a coffee could ever

57:57

do. I am fired up. I

58:01

know it's not like a God-given gift or

58:04

whatever and you've worked really hard but like

58:06

you make it seem like just a natural

58:08

gift. Well, thank you. Wow. That's

58:11

the skill. You know when you watch the Olympics and

58:13

they do those dives and they do like six twists and three twists and

58:15

they just like no splash? Yeah. You're

58:17

like, that looks impossible. You both try that

58:19

and when you do like one belly flop and

58:21

come out red and dead, I think that that's

58:23

the skill is making it look so easy.

58:26

And I think that's where the years and years of

58:28

you haven't seen the parts where it wasn't so smooth

58:30

and it got better and it's kind of like polishing

58:32

a stone. Yeah. And I think

58:34

that's really, there's one trick that I

58:36

do that's kind of, I've done it more than anything

58:38

else, which is I just guess a number

58:40

between like one to a hundred and it's just the

58:43

simplest one. It looks just, you did nothing. You just

58:45

guessed it. And it's the one that's taken the most

58:47

years and I could write a book on it. I

58:49

could write 20 pages on how I do something that

58:51

takes me 20 seconds to do. Yeah. But

58:54

it, you know, it's kind of a

58:57

side, but I think that's kind

58:59

of the joy when you asked me five years from

59:01

now is to just get better and better. Do

59:03

you ever see that movie Hero Dreams of Sushi where

59:05

that guy does this? He's a sushi chef in, in

59:07

Japan. You should watch it in Tokyo. And he spends

59:09

like, he has these apprentices who spend years just learning

59:11

how to make the rice before they even get to

59:14

cut the fish. You see what? It's

59:16

J I R O dreams of

59:18

sushi. It's

59:20

just incredible what people will dedicate

59:22

their lives to for the sake of perfection. Yeah.

59:26

Not neither good or bad, but there's something about it

59:29

that you watch and it just like captures you. Well,

59:31

and then you probably go and eat sushi

59:33

and respect it more if the rice is

59:35

like so much more. So it's interesting because

59:37

I always find that too. And when somebody

59:39

like that, we don't see

59:41

all the hard work of the years, like that

59:44

you started at 13 that you've made mistakes that

59:46

you've dropped balls that you've bombed things. We

59:49

don't see all that, but now we get

59:51

to just like, I now I'm just going

59:53

to go back and watch all your stuff and appreciate it even more because

59:55

I learned about you. Yeah, you're going to

59:57

wormhole. Where can people go in a wormhole to find you?

1:00:00

I would say the best place Instagram yeah

1:00:02

you tube also mainstream handle it looks like

1:00:04

ours Subway my parents in Israeli name is

1:00:06

but it's friends owes but it's at Oh

1:00:09

sees the cement list. I post tv clubs

1:00:11

or time I post were touring were to

1:00:13

see me next this coming this fall and

1:00:15

summer. Tons of stuff with the Nsl than

1:00:18

the stuff with his piano. That's been a

1:00:20

real sweet spot for me college football. also

1:00:22

the go to these teams I tried to

1:00:24

show for them I do on a team

1:00:27

building stuff get them in power, get them

1:00:29

really fired up. Like you said Italy create

1:00:31

that moment in the room where this new

1:00:33

team creeds that pushy says element where they

1:00:36

talk about for the rest, the season play

1:00:38

and really just. Blow. Them away. Have

1:00:40

fun, let them be kids again and then we

1:00:42

the air at all these networks and you're good

1:00:44

to see these athletes that you're a fan of.

1:00:46

That you? Yeah you only see them as themselves,

1:00:48

you see them play and for boy seems in

1:00:50

sports but you don't get to see them being

1:00:52

just a percent yeah and letting their guard down

1:00:54

and I think that's where the values been at.

1:00:56

Like whole stars or like us. Yeah we all

1:00:58

know everybody is a person has when you get

1:01:00

to really see it. And. And

1:01:02

see them react like blown away and laugh.

1:01:05

And and be a kid. I think people

1:01:07

really enjoy that. Okay is my last question.

1:01:09

What blows you away? Like what do you see

1:01:11

where you're like That blows my mind like something

1:01:14

that you know I just feel like your mind

1:01:16

when be easily bonnie but a good but I

1:01:18

won't. It. I. Just I

1:01:20

takes. I love people that. Do

1:01:23

things exceptionally well. We I love to

1:01:25

watch greatness like see somebody that's worked

1:01:27

for decades on something. It is that

1:01:29

you know, but I'll never forget. For

1:01:32

example of the the Olympics, Michael Phelps,

1:01:34

Usain Bolt. like some of those epic

1:01:36

epic world record moments yet knowing the

1:01:38

sacrifice the years of like you're in

1:01:41

the pool everyday five am everyone else

1:01:43

go out drinking, haven't been eating know.

1:01:46

That. Sacrificed as that focus I kind of

1:01:48

try to channel that. Yeah, and I just

1:01:50

like the kind of push my boundaries. That's

1:01:52

when I do. I I looked, I run

1:01:54

autre marathons like these hundred plus Now races

1:01:56

and I just like to see what can

1:01:58

I do next. What. I just can't rest

1:02:01

on my laurels. He asked me, what am I doing five years from

1:02:03

now? I want to be better than I am now. Yeah,

1:02:05

yeah. I like that answer. That's, yeah, you've

1:02:07

just, that's just who you are as a

1:02:09

person. I feel like you've probably always been

1:02:11

that way. I've always been very motivated.

1:02:13

And I always consider myself

1:02:15

to be very lazy. My wife would

1:02:18

probably say that I am actually lazy. People from an outside

1:02:20

perspective, like you did two shows, you ran 20 miles that

1:02:22

day, it doesn't seem lazy to me, but I'm like, I

1:02:24

feel lazy. But I- That's funny. I

1:02:26

feel the same way. I am always going,

1:02:28

I'm very motivated. I do

1:02:31

so many things and there's like not

1:02:33

really many days I can think of that I just have a

1:02:35

day off. Yeah, the idea of just sitting and

1:02:37

watching Netflix for five hours seems amazing, but never

1:02:39

happens. But I also feel lazy. Yeah. Interesting.

1:02:42

I think that we have like a clock

1:02:44

within us. Like when I worked in corporate

1:02:46

America and I had this moment

1:02:49

of realization of, I don't want to say

1:02:51

this is it, but what's my goal? Right? What's,

1:02:53

what is it just to make more money? Is it

1:02:55

to climb the next ladder? Like all of those are

1:02:58

great things. Right. And I

1:03:00

think that's the reality of the reality of putting a

1:03:02

roof over your head, being able to feed your family.

1:03:04

Like trust me, that is not something to take for

1:03:06

granted, but is that all it's about? Right. One

1:03:09

day you're going to be on your bed or I don't

1:03:11

know where, dying breath, what are you going to

1:03:13

look back at and what really mattered? And I

1:03:15

think you have to have things that you wanted to

1:03:17

achieve that are goals, whatever

1:03:20

they might be for you, but it's mapping them

1:03:22

out, doing

1:03:24

the hard work and achieving them. And I think that's what

1:03:26

you will look back at and this is what I'm proud

1:03:28

of. That's the perfect way to end the

1:03:30

podcast. I love that message so much. That's, I

1:03:32

try and preach that same thing. Thank you so much. Thank

1:03:34

you. Thanks for having me. I will

1:03:37

call Jamie Spears and get him on here next.

1:03:39

I need to know everything, but it's literally, I

1:03:41

want to just get into his mind because I

1:03:43

want to know, I care

1:03:45

about Britney. The custodianship, right?

1:03:47

Care about Britney. Oh

1:03:50

my God. Thank you so much. Thank you. I'm

1:03:52

Caitlin Bristow. Your session is now ending. And

1:03:57

it's time to be a needy. I want a needy. I

1:04:00

don't think I've really seen that. What

1:04:03

if we go too late? If somebody wants to

1:04:05

write their name in, I'm waiting for you. Might

1:04:19

not be great with me. Let

1:04:30

me ask you a question. Let

1:04:46

me ask a question. You have a best friend. Have

1:04:50

paid. Would it shock you? Have I

1:04:52

told you that your best friend scale

1:04:54

are. Not Amish. I'm

1:04:56

actually. Glad

1:04:58

they became a about and

1:05:00

and demanding power about balance

1:05:02

on September twelfth, Nineteen Ninety

1:05:04

Five twelve year old Mckay

1:05:06

ever disappeared from his home

1:05:08

and Conroe, Texas. It was

1:05:11

a crime that shock the

1:05:13

community because the suspect was

1:05:15

so unlikely, so unexpected. Former

1:05:17

high ranking police official heat on

1:05:19

for share of at one point

1:05:21

one fortunate personnel were pretty much

1:05:23

put down the middle over whether

1:05:26

or not he actually do this

1:05:28

and to this day Mccain mother

1:05:30

Paulette still feels that justice was

1:05:32

never truly served. And I've asked

1:05:34

myself so many times. or. In

1:05:36

they were all have. Ransom

1:05:39

is available Now listen it

1:05:41

Ransom podcast.com or wherever you

1:05:44

get. Your Podcasts. I'm

1:05:51

Brian Greenberg. I'm Victor Rasout. Check out our

1:05:53

new podcast, We Almost Made It. You guys

1:05:55

might remember us from HBO's How to Make

1:05:57

It in America. And guess what? athletes,

1:06:00

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1:06:02

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1:06:05

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