0:09

One. To an Arrest and Carry the

0:11

shower. We don't just report on fringe

0:13

science, spirituality, claims of the paranormal. No

0:15

way we take part ourselves. Yup, when

0:17

they make the claims we shrubs you don't have

0:20

to our most boucher. And I'm Carrie,

0:22

Poppy and we showed up

0:24

this time to meet Thomas.

0:26

John for psychic. The

0:28

psychic medium. The seatbelt

0:30

psychic medium. Oh he drives around

0:32

people in his car. Yeah he never a

0:34

he had a tv show to that effect.

0:36

Yeah we've talked about a model for but

0:38

we haven't seen him before. Yeah, I

0:40

didn't ever pull up that show.

0:42

I don't think. It was one season

0:45

he had eight episodes of the Seatbelt

0:47

Psychic and then he had another show

0:49

called the Thomas John Experience. Also one

0:51

season with eight episodes. Having seen him

0:53

in person, it's hard to imagine him

0:55

carrying a show to. Probably why there was

0:57

one season. And yeah, he did. So that's. Right!

1:00

There's so many opportunities for

1:02

pizzazz that this man turned

1:04

down. He just to me

1:06

kind of lacks showmanship. That's

1:09

correct. Yeah, and we saw him

1:11

at Your Old Conscious Life x.

1:13

Hi Answer: Sly facts spell. Yeah,

1:16

we will be at the Twenty

1:18

Twenty Four Conscious Live Expo. Yes!

1:20

Dot. Walk up to me and say

1:22

are you carry. It'll be too late or by the

1:25

time you hear this you will have missed your chance

1:27

to see Carry. Oh, is that right? Okay,

1:29

I. Carry a long he legs. were kids

1:31

and visit. Conscious, I've expos first

1:33

people who don't even know what that is.

1:36

Yes here. In Los Angeles

1:38

where where recording? There is

1:40

a meeting every year at

1:43

this big hotel downtown where

1:45

psychics and clairvoyance and channel

1:48

errors and. Crystal Healer,

1:50

Fringe Doctors, Red Pill

1:53

All Anarchy enthusiasts. see

1:55

billie talk to angels people

1:57

who talk to demons astrologers

1:59

Hero card readers. They're all here.

2:02

Past life astrologer, past life,

2:05

past life blood draws. Oh

2:08

yeah, yeah, that's right, yeah. Blood

2:10

analysis types. Pretty much everything that

2:12

we are interested in looking into

2:14

is represented at this one expo. They

2:17

pull them out of the Hinter regions

2:19

across the world, all to Los Angeles

2:21

at the LA Exhilton, making it super

2:24

easy for us to go down and

2:26

see some old friends and meet some

2:28

new ones. So we try to

2:30

see these people one at a time and

2:32

give them our full attention. And this guy

2:34

we saw almost a year ago now. No,

2:36

a full year ago now. Yeah, we covered a

2:39

lot of Conscious Life Expo kind of in dribs

2:41

and drabs over this past year, but there's still

2:43

a lot of stuff we never told you about

2:45

a lot of people we saw. A lot of

2:47

really interesting moments. And so we're hoping maybe at

2:50

this year's Conscious Life Expo we'll revisit some of

2:52

the people that we didn't report on last year

2:54

and give you kind of a comparison. This year

2:56

we won't be seeing Thomas John again, but he

2:58

was there and we were very excited at the

3:01

opportunity to see this psychic that we'd heard a

3:03

lot about who does feel kind of like an

3:05

up and comer in the, what do

3:07

you call it? The psychic world, the medium

3:09

world, because he's had a couple.

3:12

Medium media. Very good, yes. He's

3:15

had the couple TV shows. He had

3:17

a Vegas gig at Caesars Palace that

3:20

he started in January, 2020. Oh

3:23

no. Wanna guess how that went? Yeah. Roughly.

3:26

It was suspended March 16th, 2020. Then

3:29

he had to handle a bunch of jokes for

3:32

a very long time about how good his

3:34

psychic powers were or weren't. Guess you didn't

3:36

plan for this. Of course. I

3:39

don't feel too much pity for him. Sure. But

3:42

yeah, sure. I bet that got old. So

3:44

when we've talked about him before on

3:47

the podcast, it was with Susan Gerbick

3:49

and Mark Edward who were leading this

3:51

effort, this thing called Operation Pizza Roll.

3:54

Yes. And both of them

3:56

and some of their operatives have attended

3:58

many Thomas John readings. And they've

4:00

caught him doing hot reading, which we've

4:02

talked about on the show, which is

4:04

where you look people up. And then

4:06

you use that info in your reading,

4:08

passing it off as something you are

4:10

hearing from the spirits, from the dearly

4:12

departed loved ones. And usually then

4:14

you have to sort of buy a

4:16

ticket in advance or something like that

4:18

so that the psychic gets your name

4:21

in advance. Do people have the

4:23

opportunity here? I don't remember. No, and

4:26

the reason I know that is

4:28

because afterward, I talked with Susan

4:30

Gerbick, who if you don't remember

4:32

from our interview, she's often

4:34

referred to as the Wikipedia-trition. She

4:36

runs this group called Gorillaz Skeptics

4:39

on Wikipedia that do a yeoman's

4:41

job of keeping an eye on

4:43

Wikipedia on people who make extraordinary

4:45

claims and just keeping Wikipedia entries

4:48

factual in that regard. It's an

4:50

amazing effort. I contacted her

4:52

beforehand just to say, hey, I'm gonna

4:54

go see Thomas John. Any things that you would say

4:56

to look out for or things I should ask him

4:58

if I get a chance to, she wanted me to

5:01

ask him, and it's funny, you ended up doing something

5:03

very similar, which we'll get to, but she wanted me

5:05

to ask him like, hey, I looked you up and

5:07

I saw this Operation Pizza Roll thing. What is that?

5:10

Just to see how he would react to such

5:12

a query. But then afterwards, getting

5:15

back to the original reason for this rabbit

5:17

trail I'm leading you on, she

5:19

let me know that one of her

5:21

Wikipedia folks was there in the room

5:23

with us at the Thomas John reading at

5:25

Conscious Life Expo. Oh, interesting, okay. Yeah,

5:28

and so I got to talk to him on

5:30

the phone and he wishes to remain anonymous, but

5:33

I'll use the pronouns he, him. Anyways, he

5:35

had come as someone who has been in

5:38

the alternative field for a long time. He

5:40

himself used to be very involved and he's

5:43

good friends with a lot of the organizers

5:45

of Conscious Life Expo, and he got to

5:47

talk to them to ask, was there any

5:49

way for Thomas John to have accessed in

5:51

advance to about tickets for his workshop? And

5:53

he was assured that no. And

5:55

I think what we're about to describe to

5:57

you is fully consistent with Thomas John. having

6:00

the ability to look people up in it. Yes, it

6:02

is, it definitely is. And I gotta

6:05

say, not that impressive at cold reading,

6:07

which is the alternative. Yes, I

6:09

fully agree with that assessment. And I

6:11

think he has one interesting

6:13

card that he plays that I kinda

6:16

noticed this time to make

6:18

it feel like he's doing better than he is. Okay.

6:20

As a cold reader. I think I know what that is. I

6:23

think I know what that is, yes. I think I know what

6:25

that is. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think I know what that is.

6:28

Yeah. Do you

6:30

know what I think? I think. Do you know what I

6:32

think it is that's making sense to you? Well, I think

6:34

that you think you know what it is. And I think

6:37

you do actually know what it is. Okay, interesting, yeah. Getting

6:39

sense that. I was getting a sense of that already now.

6:42

Very good. So another thing

6:45

I learned from this gentleman who was

6:47

in the audience with us, who had

6:49

been part of some of these previous

6:51

stings and caught Thomas John hot reading,

6:53

he had brought equipment to perform a

6:56

scan kind of like what James Randi

6:58

famously did with Peter Popoff to

7:01

see if he could catch him using a

7:03

device. Oh yeah. Maybe

7:05

getting info fed to him live. Old

7:07

school. And he said that after he

7:09

started hearing Thomas John do his readings,

7:12

he decided, oh, I don't even need

7:14

to look for that. And Susan said,

7:16

see if you can find any like

7:18

earpieces or is Thomas John wearing a

7:20

hearing aid or anything like that. But

7:23

no, quickly, it was apparent. If he's

7:25

using that, he's misusing that. Right. Because

7:27

his reading should be a lot better.

7:30

Yeah, exactly. His readings are not impressive.

7:32

Not to say he's, well, we've

7:34

already said he's not good at cold reading.

7:36

Cold reading isn't easy. Not everyone can do

7:38

it. And he's, I would say decent at

7:40

it, but we've seen better. Yeah.

7:44

Okay. All right. I

7:46

mean, I'm not claiming to be good at it myself

7:49

here or something, but I've seen way better. Okay.

7:51

I don't want to dismiss that these people were

7:53

able to make it as far as having a

7:55

TV show and a Vegas show that, you know,

7:58

they have a skill. I mean, I'll. like

8:00

it ethically, but it is

8:02

a skill. I just often

8:04

think the skill is confidence. The skill

8:07

is like, no, seriously, I mean

8:09

it. And then that just makes

8:11

enough people go, he seems

8:13

sincere. Yeah, that's

8:16

an unfortunate tactic that seems to work quite

8:18

well. People who just believe

8:21

whatever's coming out of their faces. Yeah, yeah,

8:23

yeah. Well, there we go. We've already prejudged

8:25

him, but let's have you be the judge

8:27

as well. We're gonna tell you about our

8:29

event with Thomas John. So he was advertised

8:31

here in the booklet for the Conscious Life

8:33

Expo. This was a keynote workshop, so that

8:35

means it was a paid event. You had

8:37

to either have an all access pass or

8:39

pay 40 bucks in advance, I think it

8:41

was. I think that's right, and I think I

8:43

did. And he was in the big room, but

8:45

there weren't that many people. It was 50 people,

8:48

something like that. I wrote down an exact number

8:50

somewhere. So definitely that room can hold a lot

8:52

more people, and we've seen it hold a lot

8:54

more people. But the talk

8:56

was called Messages from the Other

8:58

Side, and the description was, during

9:00

this special workshop, Thomas John will

9:03

deliver messages from spirit, from

9:05

loved ones, I'm emphasizing those words because

9:08

they're capitalized, to as many people as

9:10

he can. Whether you or

9:12

someone else receive a message, that's

9:15

telling, it is amazing to

9:17

witness this event. Messages will

9:19

be directed to people to

9:21

provide validation, inspiration, support, and

9:23

guidance. Thomas John is

9:25

one of the most prestigious

9:28

psychic mediums in the world,

9:30

with a documented history of

9:32

extraordinary and authentic psychic mediumship

9:34

readings. At age four,

9:37

Thomas first discovered his divine

9:39

abilities of clairaudience, hearing, and

9:41

clairsentience, sensations. His family was

9:44

astonished, when young Thomas communicated

9:46

with the spirit of his

9:49

deceased grandfather, and revealed the

9:51

precise whereabouts of a lost

9:53

family watch. Thomas

9:55

has had two television shows,

9:57

Seatbelt Psychic on Lifetime, and

10:00

the Thomas John experience on CBS All

10:02

Access, and continues to be

10:04

in demand by high profile figures

10:06

and A-list celebrities. Additionally, Thomas

10:09

authored the novel, Never Argue with

10:11

a Dead Person. An

10:14

admittedly good title. Yeah, okay, that's

10:16

fun. Yeah, I'm in, and I

10:18

wanted the opportunity to see him

10:20

in person. I should also mention

10:22

that my informant, who had also

10:24

been at the event, said that

10:26

he followed Thomas John around for

10:28

half an hour before he found

10:31

him and just tried to stay in

10:33

eyesight of Thomas John, and said that

10:35

Thomas John was just on his phone.

10:38

Okay. All right. Well, good, I'm glad he

10:40

still told us his null result. So you got

10:42

here before I did, you got to see the

10:44

intro. I was running late from home, because I

10:47

think I was putting out this podcast. But- Thank

10:49

you. Yeah, how did it get started? Well,

10:51

he was introduced by none other

10:54

than Alan Steinfeld. How

10:57

did he do it? How is he everywhere? And

11:00

Alan, you've heard of him before on Ono

11:02

Ross and Carrie. This is

11:05

a fellow with long flowing,

11:07

blondish, whitish hair, who

11:09

just gets around Conscious Life Expo,

11:12

doing his own little podcasts and

11:14

videos, and introducing person after person,

11:16

but doesn't give his own talk.

11:19

He's the host of this space.

11:21

Yeah, he does have at least one

11:23

book, and he's given, I know he

11:25

has given talks, but- Oh, he has?

11:28

Okay. But he's just friends with

11:30

everybody. He's been involved in this so

11:32

long, he's interviewed everybody. We should try

11:34

to get him on the show. He

11:36

feels like the blogger or the reporter

11:38

of this spouse. Yeah, and as

11:40

such, he's just a fixture. Everybody knows him. Everyone

11:42

knows him. He needs to like him. He's

11:45

got a very warm delivery. Always

11:47

has something specific to say at all

11:49

his intros. Which is nice. Which

11:52

is, yeah, he always feels informed.

11:54

And he has a very weathered

11:56

face, very gaunt, almost skeletal, That

11:59

you very much see. The prominent like ridges of

12:01

his face and then he's got this kind

12:03

of long with be white flowing hair a

12:05

little bit like day I get Doctor Emmett

12:07

Brown from Back to the Teacher that sort

12:09

of say air base that he occupies in

12:11

my mind can have a similar type of

12:14

person so. He introduces Thomas

12:16

John, And. He says that

12:18

tell his son is one of

12:20

the experts here is who can

12:22

really see instead dimensions and the

12:24

other side and make that connection

12:26

even more solid than that. So

12:28

important about how his sons work

12:30

at that: he's a really clear

12:32

medium and you can really tune

12:34

into your loved ones city you

12:36

know there are around you. You

12:38

know? maybe you can send Sapper

12:40

you're not quite sure right now,

12:42

but he's one of these amazing

12:45

people. That decision and he's gonna.

12:47

Be able to tell us that they're

12:49

really here and when you feel and

12:51

it's just magical. So let's give him

12:53

a really big hands. Ah

12:56

K. Ow and Seinfeld move even

12:58

through you're telling getting me in the movie.

13:00

I. How and that's a

13:02

witness? Something else to say. Salad

13:05

Thomas sun comes up. Recent

13:07

describe him so yeah, Tommy

13:09

John. He looks pretty tall.

13:11

Yeah. He strikes see a high cel

13:13

not that I sit next film, but

13:16

I feel it's gotta be around six

13:18

feet or more. Say so. Large

13:20

fellow in, he's starting to gray.

13:22

Like he said, just in terms

13:24

of him not putting a lot

13:26

of effort into presentation or showmanship.

13:28

I feel like that was the

13:31

case here. Like he had this

13:33

kind of bright reddish orange and

13:35

black and white checkered shirt, but

13:37

he had matching niggers. Iii that

13:39

says that kind of in every

13:41

mankind as. It was as hell up on

13:44

going to go for a walk around the

13:46

neighborhood. Yeah not let me put something on.

13:48

Oh hey I have used the go with

13:50

the survey says it says great looks. Nice

13:52

and everything, but yeah, doesn't seem like a

13:54

medium. He seems a sort of out of

13:56

place in that last. Year which is interesting

13:58

as I feel like we. That about a

14:00

lot of media yeah that they find some

14:03

way to be like oh I'm not

14:05

your usual Media here are as I'm not

14:07

wearing the headband and are you hearing Grandpa

14:09

repair and I've got a long fingernail I

14:12

ducked you at the supermarket and I look

14:14

like you're a cast the dryer. I feel

14:16

like every side has some little way have

14:18

been I have I I'm not a hug

14:21

island access to specifically so I guess this

14:23

is his way of thing and kind of

14:25

like your everyday schwab I happen to be

14:28

as I did. I gotta say he reminds.

14:30

Me a lot of George

14:32

Santos, the disgraced former hombres

14:34

person that got a lot

14:36

in common here. Yeah, very

14:38

similar builds, okay similar voices

14:40

as guy A both openly

14:42

gay men, a guy who

14:44

have been dragged performers in

14:46

the past. No positive correlation

14:48

between being dragged performer and

14:50

being our public bamboozling on.

14:52

Make that clear his success

14:54

or but also both have

14:56

committed fraud in Thomas son's

14:58

case he was putting. Out craigslist

15:00

ads for houses and then accepting

15:02

downpayments like rental deposits and then

15:04

just making offered money. Well, yeah,

15:06

he pleaded guilty to this in

15:08

two thousand and nine. Wow. Okay,

15:11

and then anybody who already knows

15:13

it or centers knows of the

15:15

many things that he is under

15:17

fraud investigation for a perpetual liar

15:19

are both of them use names

15:21

that they were not born with.

15:23

His may be modified stage name

15:25

for Thomas John. And actually

15:27

I don't know for even Sir Richard

15:29

Santos. but most people knew him as

15:31

a totally different name. Anthony doubled or

15:33

L. And then he ran for Congress.

15:35

and people be like wait, that's my

15:37

roommate Anthony who so my scarf. oh.

15:40

That is wearing a scarf and some

15:42

of the capital was telling us anyways

15:44

as detail say that as I don't

15:46

have this in my mind they feel

15:48

like almost the same person. yeah and

15:50

that's strange little niche. they sound and

15:52

light. Yes, it's house and

15:54

it's up there and See

15:57

has a serious assorted disarming.

16:00

presence because

16:02

he doesn't have much showmanship. He

16:04

has a little bit of a

16:06

guileless sort of delivery for a

16:08

medium. Oh yeah. Yeah, he

16:10

doesn't sound super confident. Yeah, and none

16:12

of his lines are that practice.

16:15

So he's just saying things like,

16:17

so who here has worked with

16:19

a medium? Good. So some

16:21

people have done this before. Okay, great. So we're

16:23

going to do a method with

16:25

like, sort of messages with sort of

16:27

different people. He doesn't have jargon. He

16:30

doesn't have like, bam, bam, bam. There's

16:32

nothing to wow me in the language.

16:35

This is also a very long setup that

16:37

he does. Oh my God, this guy. And

16:40

I came in while he was still just

16:42

like establishing the rules of the road. And

16:44

it kind of made me reflect on how

16:46

all of our psychics have to do this.

16:48

And I think it says something to

16:51

be it the Long Island medium, Teresa

16:53

Caputo, any of these folks,

16:55

whatever they're doing is not what people

16:57

come in expecting, if they haven't seen

16:59

them before, for how communication

17:01

with the other side is supposed to

17:03

go. Right. So they

17:05

have to like, do all of the setting

17:07

of expectations and kind of like preparing you

17:09

not to be disappointed. Oh, right, right, right.

17:12

Like if the doctor came in the room

17:14

and started explaining germ theory to you

17:17

before they could give you treatment, you'd

17:19

be like, maybe something weird is up.

17:21

Yeah, like people have what they expect from

17:24

seeing movies where in a movie you can

17:26

write a script and make these excellent, amazing

17:28

connections happen. Or even on a TV show

17:30

where you can do editing, but in a

17:33

live performance, you have to start telling people,

17:35

okay, so I'm going to talk to like

17:37

a group of you. Yeah,

17:39

but one of you is going to connect.

17:42

And kind of the reason I have to do that is

17:44

because I get these hazy visions. And

17:46

you know, I may say something that doesn't feel right,

17:48

but you might find out later that it is right.

17:51

I think it may creep you out that that

17:53

lady over there is so happy about the hit

17:55

for her brother John, but you have a brother

17:57

named John and it also matches exactly in action.

18:00

So that feels like it tells you more than

18:02

it should. So I feel for all

18:04

of our psychics, we've seen them run through

18:06

that. But yeah, he had a particularly long

18:08

spiel. Yes, he talks in

18:10

a very recursive way. He repeats

18:13

himself a lot. He seems

18:15

to think he's on his way to a

18:17

new thought, not quite get there and loop

18:19

back to the last one and kind of

18:21

restate it in new words and do that

18:23

a couple times before moving on. Yeah, and

18:25

part of that may be stalling for time while

18:28

he comes up with something new to say. But

18:30

I think part of it is going to be

18:32

to increase the illusion of effectiveness. Yeah. We'll

18:35

definitely run into that. So he introduces himself

18:37

as a medium, an

18:39

intuitive, a clairvoyant, a psychic.

18:42

All right, lots of terms there. But

18:44

we've run into this before. Not every

18:46

psychic is a medium. Right. I

18:48

guess every medium is a psychic. He says so.

18:51

Okay. He says every medium is by definition

18:53

a psychic. And yeah, it feels like a

18:55

square rectangle thing. Yeah, exactly. That

18:57

category. Right, right. Psychic is the

18:59

broader terminology. And medium is very

19:02

specific talking to the dead

19:04

loved ones. Yes, exactly. So he

19:06

says that there are lots of reasons

19:08

that people come through. And by come

19:10

through, he means start talking to me.

19:13

He used to think that the reason that

19:15

people came through was because of the person

19:17

sitting in front of him. That connection between

19:20

those two people. But now he knows that

19:22

that's wrong. It's actually driven

19:24

by the people on the other

19:26

side. Convenient. Yes, yes.

19:29

Because he's the only one who sees them in the room. Right, right,

19:31

right. Yeah, so. Good to

19:33

know they're in charge. Right. So

19:36

if the person who you can see

19:38

is disappointed, take heart. The person

19:41

that you can't see is thrilled.

19:44

And he uses the term spirit world. And

19:46

he says that's kind of his term of

19:48

art, spirit world. I mean, other people use

19:50

it, but that's how he likes to refer

19:52

to it. He says that

19:55

there have been hundreds and

19:57

thousands of kinds of documents.

20:00

things where

20:03

people get spontaneous communication

20:06

from loved ones. Yeah,

20:08

so he's talking about how

20:10

you see the butterfly outside the

20:12

bus and you're like, oh, I

20:15

got a butterfly outside the bus.

20:18

I mean, it's... Yeah, yeah,

20:20

no, it's not exactly right. The science of that is

20:22

trivial. It's exactly right. It's

20:24

that small of a thing where you're

20:26

like, oh, you know, my sister Mirabelle,

20:28

she loved butterflies. And there's a butterfly.

20:30

Wow, that's her trying to contact me.

20:32

And she was hit by a bus.

20:36

And he'll briefly acknowledge, oh, sure,

20:38

yes, there are coincidences in the world, but

20:40

then that's the last mention of them. Everything

20:42

else is going to be fraught with significance.

20:44

Right. I also just love hundreds

20:47

and thousands of kinds

20:49

of documented things. Just

20:53

nothing could be less specific. Yeah. Oh,

20:55

yeah. Let's see this documentation. There's

20:57

a story there too that I felt

21:00

was so telling about this woman that

21:02

he had been reading and she had

21:04

lost her son and she was about

21:06

to go on a trip to someplace

21:08

that they had shared before. And

21:10

he let us know that at some point he said

21:12

during the reading, why am I seeing

21:14

like a big bright yellow

21:16

smiley face? Oh, yes. I

21:19

remember this story. So she said, oh, that's, I

21:22

don't know. That doesn't really ring any

21:24

bells. But then she had wanted to know

21:26

that her son was going to be with

21:28

her on this trip, but she said that

21:30

when she went to sit down on the

21:32

airplane, someone sat next to her and the

21:34

woman was wearing a bright yellow smiley face

21:36

shirt. Can you believe this,

21:38

people? I thought, Thomas, John is the

21:40

one who introduced that idea. That

21:43

was the beginning of this. And then the

21:45

culmination was the happy coincidence of this person's

21:48

signature. Oh, yeah, totally. No, it's exactly

21:50

like putting the owl idea in people's

21:52

head at the UFO conference and then

21:54

when you see owls later that day,

21:56

you're amazed by it. But as you

21:58

pointed out, owls are amazing. major part

22:00

of our culture and

22:02

happy faces are a major part of

22:04

our culture. Yeah, and it wasn't like

22:07

he correctly identified something that was important

22:09

to her and her son and then

22:11

she saw it. In fact, part of

22:13

the story was like, initially she wasn't

22:15

impressed by that. Yeah, he planted it

22:17

and then it paid off. Yeah, in

22:19

fact, you know what, listeners, today

22:22

you are going to

22:24

see a smiley face.

22:28

You're going to see it out there in the world and

22:30

you're going to be amazed and then you're going to come

22:32

back and you're going to tell me about it. And

22:34

also someone will do a kindness to you

22:37

and then you will see they are wearing

22:39

green. Yes, and

22:41

then you'll

22:43

slip and hit your head and then

22:46

you'll have a hallucination about heaven and

22:48

then you'll start a new religion. That

22:50

could happen too. Yeah. But

22:52

if any of those come back to us

22:54

as someone saying, you know what, you said

22:57

that and then someone was wearing green who

22:59

didn't make a kindness, that's great. Then we

23:01

can share that and brag about that and

23:03

we'll ignore all the other people. Exactly, it

23:05

will be so powerful. That's

23:07

right. It only matters if it regounds

23:10

to our benefit. So

23:12

anyway, that particular story is like looking

23:14

around like, are you impressed by this? Are you impressed?

23:16

You shouldn't be impressed by this. Yeah. So

23:19

yes, as you mentioned, he acknowledges

23:21

that coincidence exists, but

23:23

he says that sometimes you get

23:25

a feeling with the coincidence and

23:27

that's where it's different. When you

23:29

get that intuitive knowing, that resonance.

23:32

Oh, also with that story you just told,

23:34

I love this line as he was describing

23:36

that he said, and so her son had

23:39

passed kind of like a tragedy. Oh

23:43

no. I

23:46

love that. Kind of

23:48

like a tragedy. Kind of like, you know, one of those. How

23:51

could it not be exactly a tragedy?

23:56

Most of the time the answer is that your loved

23:59

ones are trying to. reach out to

24:01

you but vibrationally you just may not

24:03

be receptive to it so it's it's

24:05

kind of your fault of course yeah

24:07

we're so wrapped up in this reality and

24:10

I know you're all you're all at a

24:12

higher level because he's at the Conscious Life

24:14

Expo where you know this is what we

24:16

do we need to compliment you a little

24:19

yeah so he said even so we miss

24:21

a lot of this you have to be

24:24

in the right vibrationally in a place where

24:26

you can be receptive so he says if

24:28

you set an intention that you want to

24:30

hear from a loved one you should include

24:32

signs in that so it may not be

24:34

that you hear a direct message from me

24:37

tonight but you may get a sign in

24:39

some other way and then I still get credit for

24:41

it thank you okay

24:44

so then the readings begin so one thing

24:46

he tells us is that one

24:48

message can be for many people and we've

24:51

heard this before it seems

24:53

so I don't know too obvious

24:56

to me but the claim is that

24:58

the medium will get a message like

25:00

I'm getting a man whose name begins

25:02

with Jay and who was in the

25:05

military and if there

25:07

are actually two people in this room who

25:09

know guys named Jay who died in the

25:11

military instead of being skeptical of

25:13

that you should say to yourself no I

25:16

know what happened it's that there were two

25:18

people on the other side

25:20

killed in the military first

25:22

names Jay we're hanging out

25:24

together who knocked on the

25:26

door of Thomas John spirit house

25:29

can I come in at

25:31

the same time and that's

25:33

how these two people felt like they

25:35

were both being called but definitely don't think about

25:37

it in terms of why I would say

25:39

something that would apply to two people in one

25:41

area of a single room with

25:43

oh 56 people that was my count oh

25:46

there you go and 12 men

25:48

including myself thank you yeah we're talking 80%

25:50

women in the

25:54

audience okay and another thing that he did warn

25:56

us of in his preamble is that if I

25:58

come to you be ready to go

26:00

like have your issue ready don't

26:03

be frozen yes please just speak

26:05

up don't just suddenly be like I

26:07

don't know I don't know you can

26:09

get a sense in these preambles kind of

26:12

what their bugaboos are what really annoys them

26:14

he doesn't like getting to someone then going

26:16

oh yeah

26:19

so he says that we may

26:21

resonate with one or two messages even

26:23

if it's clear that it's not our

26:25

loved one coming through we may just

26:27

realize like oh even though I

26:29

don't know that lady her grandfather has something

26:31

to say to her that really applies to

26:34

me too yeah and I've definitely

26:36

heard that from John Edward and I'm pretty

26:38

sure from many of our other psychics like

26:40

if you feel disappointed that you came all

26:42

the way here traveled across state lines whatever

26:45

paid a lot of money to see a

26:47

psychic medium and you didn't get read you

26:49

can feel like the message was also for

26:51

you because that's just how the fabric of

26:54

the universe works right right the

26:56

alternative thing that it's a Barnum

26:58

statement which means that it just applies to

27:00

many of us yep by nature I counted

27:03

17 minutes of setup just

27:05

communicating these rules to us okay

27:07

now when he's ready to get

27:10

going he has us do

27:12

a bunch of deep breaths together good

27:17

exercise in general oh it's nice

27:19

so then he wanted us to

27:21

picture ourselves in a pleasant place

27:23

as we were doing this breathing

27:26

exercise just to get peaceful I

27:28

imagined a beautiful level from the

27:30

VR game walkabout mini golf really

27:32

you can remember that wow I have no idea what

27:35

I pictured in my notes at the time I said

27:37

that okay that's how I know and

27:39

then he also wanted us to picture people

27:41

that we might want to connect with and

27:44

so I thought of some friends of mine who

27:46

have passed away and I had them

27:48

ready I see that I wrote

27:50

down he was not saying his meditation

27:53

in a terribly soft voice yeah

27:55

yeah I remember re-listening to this

27:57

and being like this is not meditation

28:00

It's not even your indoor voice. Yeah, some people

28:02

just can't do that. Yeah, they just keep talking

28:04

at the normal volume and then they're like, good,

28:06

picture going to the lake. Hee hee

28:09

hee hee hee hee. And this could

28:11

be a place that I'm feeling, it could be a

28:13

place that's a real place, it could be a

28:15

place that's an imagined place. But

28:18

go ahead and get yourself into

28:20

a nice, peaceful mindset of really

28:23

hearing from your

28:25

loved ones and really visualizing the

28:28

connection with them, okay? So

28:30

eventually he brings us back, that was a

28:32

thoroughly short meditation to

28:35

get us in the mood. And then he

28:37

began doing readings. He started with

28:39

a just swath of the audience on the

28:41

other side of the room. So we weren't

28:43

sitting together, but you and I were both

28:46

on the right side of the room or

28:48

to his left as he's standing up on

28:50

the stage. So he kind of motioned over

28:52

to his right and said, okay, so I

28:54

sense a woman coming through. He

28:57

spent a lot of time just painting a picture,

28:59

all of these little bits of detail that were

29:01

coming out and kind of gently waving his hand

29:03

back and forth to this portion of the room,

29:05

which could include maybe 20 people. So,

29:09

okay, it was maybe a mother

29:11

or a mother figure who's passed.

29:14

Maybe a stepmother, maybe

29:16

a mother-in-law, maybe, just

29:19

a woman you had a closeness

29:21

or a bond with, or maybe

29:23

like a nurse, you sing a

29:25

nurse hat. It doesn't have to be

29:27

a literal nurse though. It could be literal

29:29

or it could be that you were a

29:32

career-taker to her. In fact, it's

29:34

more likely the latter did you

29:36

live together. If not, then maybe

29:38

you went to her house a

29:40

lot. By the time

29:42

finally he gets someone. Yeah,

29:45

did this resonate with any of you? And

29:47

he's probably just looking at everybody's faces as

29:49

he's doing this, like, am I getting anything?

29:51

Oh, I'll make this a little more broad.

29:54

Oh, you're interested? No, and as a

29:56

mother, not one person. I didn't have

29:59

hot readings prepared. Nobody's responding so

30:01

he said there was there was a dog and

30:03

he didn't give any details on the dog Okay.

30:06

Yeah. No, I'm getting this is a mother

30:08

and so then there was one woman who

30:10

raised her hand and he said Oh, I

30:12

knew I was I know it would be

30:15

you I saw you in the line in

30:17

the hall earlier second. I Knew

30:21

it he must he must be psychic It's

30:24

like the guy who walks up to every woman in

30:26

the bar It's like the second I saw

30:28

you love at first sight So someone

30:30

brought her a microphone and so the

30:33

woman said yes, my

30:35

mom had a dog Thrilling

30:38

a credible hit my mother had

30:40

a dog and so Thomas John

30:42

said what is the connection to

30:44

New York? Nailing

30:47

it. Uh-huh. She's like, well, I've

30:50

traveled to New York Incredible

30:52

your mother had a dog and you've

30:54

been to New York. Well, I'm on

30:57

fire amazing He said I'm

30:59

sensing like a rift in the family. Does

31:01

that make sense? And then when she

31:03

doesn't answer immediately He's like does

31:05

it make sense even a little bit? A

31:09

little bit. He's like do you have

31:11

siblings? Oh this okay. Yeah, this is

31:13

really interesting. Yeah I noticed how this

31:15

played out soon. Mm-hmm. This is do

31:17

you have siblings? She says I do

31:19

good for her for answering vaguely Uh-huh,

31:21

then he says I'm seeing

31:24

your mom keep showing me three Do

31:26

you have three siblings or are you

31:28

one of three? Now? This is very

31:30

clever of him So when he said

31:32

do you have siblings? Yeah,

31:35

that puts her in the position of

31:37

analyzing because I as someone with only

31:39

one sibling. Mm-hmm. I Sometimes

31:41

will automatically correct right and say

31:44

siblings. I have a sibling right,

31:46

right? But she

31:48

kind of withholds that corrective

31:51

impulse good for her, but she's good here

31:53

But yeah, look what we're doing with the possible

31:55

numbers So he says do you have three siblings

31:57

or are you one of three? So that's I

32:00

either three or four siblings in the

32:02

family that he's just allowed for. And

32:05

she said, I have one brother. And

32:07

so what does he do with that? He says, hmm,

32:10

was there a miscarriage? Yep,

32:13

and she says yes. Okay, that

32:15

must be what I'm getting because she's still

32:18

feeling the additional sibling. So. But

32:20

you know that internally he's thinking like,

32:22

God damn it, lady, I said, do

32:24

you have siblings? Uh. Right.

32:26

And he said yes, and I

32:28

tracked it faithfully. And you dropped

32:30

the bow on me. And she agreed to the miscarriage

32:32

thing, but even if she hadn't, he could have said,

32:35

oh, well, maybe she never told you about that. Right,

32:37

right. Or something. There's

32:39

another on the way. But he was ready

32:41

for this family to have one person, then

32:43

he asked the sibling question, two people, three

32:45

people, four people. I think he could have

32:47

worked five okay. Yes, and

32:49

if you say, do you have any siblings?

32:52

And the person goes, oh yeah.

32:54

Then you know, okay, now we're in

32:56

lots of siblings. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You

32:58

get so much from just the reply.

33:00

There was a clever little use

33:03

of the turns of phrases and the very limited

33:05

options of how many siblings one could have. Yep.

33:08

So he says, I see a woman with

33:11

your mom, someone doing lots of baking, cooking.

33:13

Person might've had diabetes and

33:16

heart issues, maybe both. And

33:19

I guess she wasn't really replying to

33:21

that. Yeah, he was starting to

33:23

fail even more with her because

33:25

he was also asking about that

33:27

separation thing, like, oh,

33:29

were you separated? And Anna was her name.

33:31

She's like, oh no, not really. He said,

33:33

but maybe with the brother. Yeah, yeah, that's

33:35

true for the brother. Yeah, okay, because I

33:37

was sensing the separation. And then

33:39

he starts asking if there's anyone else

33:41

in this room that knows Anna's mom.

33:44

Oh, big swing and a miss. Yeah. Yeah,

33:46

like is there someone maybe who's hoping she

33:48

had a friend with her or someone who

33:50

knew the family member? Is there someone else

33:52

here who knew her? And Anna's

33:54

like, no. No, he's like, oh, weird. I

33:58

feel like there's someone she's trying to. The

34:00

Draft Schwab and men who

34:02

is a woman with heart

34:04

disease or diabetes issues is

34:06

a grandma. Your mom's mom.

34:08

Who's that as his Geico?

34:10

Yeah, my mom's mom. Sir

34:12

Yeah, I think she offered the

34:14

grandma as and then he took

34:17

ownership of that. Okay gotcha said.

34:19

The Grandma had taken care of

34:21

and at some point in time

34:23

comes out says our yes yes

34:25

and your Mom is a strong

34:27

entity in the spirit around you

34:30

are lots. And then he was done

34:32

with the mothers because he said you connect

34:34

to the names uses and. See I think

34:36

this is very polite or for just

34:38

says yeah My father was Jose. Joseph,

34:41

Jose, or or any of

34:43

the ad says that the

34:45

Mohegan Spanish Verse and my.

34:48

polite, And the dom isn't as or

34:50

oh was he funny. I'm sensing he

34:52

was like the my for the party

34:54

and she's like oh yeah absolutely like

34:56

what are you going to say like

34:58

no actually really boring door you'd. Hate

35:00

him and then asks if her parents are

35:02

split up and she says yes. And.

35:04

Then he opened it up. He said somebody hears

35:06

got rosary beads I keep seeing It was like

35:09

almost a distraction from when. Ever since he was

35:11

saying. As soon as we

35:13

get from her. Are

35:16

ya grandfather? At all not

35:18

say suing not even less hi

35:20

that we sometimes gas. Right

35:23

I was noting the as right as he

35:26

kind of like I think must have club

35:28

himself because at some point during this reading

35:30

I think he did sort of come to

35:33

the realization like oh shoot, I haven't actually

35:35

been delivering any messages on the office. if

35:37

it's all just been about verifying that I

35:39

have, I've now I see that ah by

35:42

the others. Poor lady got nothing like that.

35:44

And the rosary beads. Okay you find out

35:46

that her father's name is Jose so not

35:49

a bad guess that she might have been

35:51

raised. Catholic might have rosary beads or someone

35:53

in power will have rosary beads. No one

35:55

says anything to that though, so he does

35:57

moves on. oh hi to do so, the.

36:00

The next reading was with a woman named

36:02

Sarah. He asked her, did your

36:04

mom die? And

36:06

she says, no. Maybe.

36:09

Okay, then maybe someone who was

36:12

motherly. Yeah, my

36:14

grandma, wow. Then he also

36:16

threw out the like, maybe it's like the row in front

36:18

of you I'm getting. So he's just like casting

36:21

all these reasons to not take it

36:23

too seriously if he didn't make a

36:25

strong connection right away. Right, right. Or

36:27

maybe the energy is slightly in a

36:29

different location. About the

36:31

grandma, he's like, so she was sickly

36:33

toward the end, but her passing was

36:35

sudden, right? She's like, yeah, yes and

36:37

no. Which Drew's grandma

36:39

just passed away. And this is so

36:42

fresh in my mind that like, every

36:44

death feels both sudden and,

36:47

you know, like it takes a long time. Well, not every

36:49

death, but every death in old age basically, feels

36:52

both sudden and drawn out. You were putting

36:54

that into words recently about that situation. I

36:56

thought that was a good observation that like

36:58

you get so inured to the expectation that

37:01

it's going to happen. Like you kind of

37:03

set yourself up for, oh, this might be

37:05

the last time we see her. This might

37:08

be the last time. Oh, well, this might

37:10

be the last Christmas. Oh, nope.

37:12

Oh, we've had six last Christmases. Okay, oh, wait,

37:14

she died. Oh, what do I, what? I wasn't

37:16

ready for that. Yes, exactly. I was so busy

37:18

being ready for that. I wasn't ready for that.

37:21

Yeah, you get so used to them being here.

37:23

But yeah, so sickly toward the end, but

37:25

the passing was sudden and she's like,

37:27

yeah, yes and no. He

37:29

explored a few different things, whether she got to say

37:32

goodbye to her or not, but nothing too strong. And

37:34

then he said, do you have a ring of hers?

37:37

She said yes to that, which is

37:39

a strong hit. Yeah, it's a good

37:41

one. He didn't follow up on that

37:43

at all, which is almost like malfeasance.

37:45

That's your one good hit so far.

37:47

Yeah, totally. Play with it. Yeah,

37:49

and it's exciting. Haunted objects,

37:52

come on. He also said

37:54

that people don't always come through the

37:56

way that they were when they died.

38:00

I'm getting that she's much younger the way I'm seeing her,

38:02

maybe like 50 or 60. I'm

38:04

thinking, oh, okay, that's not like 20 or something.

38:07

Right. It's funny how it's

38:10

always younger and more stereotypically

38:12

attractive. Yeah. It

38:14

just seems like heaven is just full of

38:17

everyone being 26 or whatever. At the peak

38:19

of their lives, right. Unless, of course, they

38:21

died before they reach that. In

38:23

which case, yeah, if they died as a toddler, are

38:25

they just a toddler in heaven? They're just modeling. Or

38:27

do they- It's so frustrating. They get advanced to 26

38:30

or whatever the ideal age is.

38:32

Yeah. All of these things I don't think you're

38:34

supposed to think about too hard. Well, we'll

38:36

continue thinking about them for 13 years. That's

38:39

our job. So

38:41

then he asks, who smoked a lot? Is

38:44

your grandma connected to someone who smoked

38:46

a lot? And she recalls that I

38:48

believe her grandpa did smoke a lot,

38:50

but Thomas John is like, oh, and

38:52

I bet he kept it a little

38:54

bit from your grandma. And he's like,

38:56

oh, maybe, but she knew about that.

38:58

And everybody has a good chuckle about

39:00

what feels like a fight. And we've

39:02

justified me bringing up smoking for no

39:04

particular reason. Did she

39:07

have well-manicured nails? No. Okay.

39:10

Well, that's strange because I'm getting a feeling

39:12

from a long time ago. So he's trying

39:14

to introduce that. Well, maybe when she was

39:16

younger, she painted her nails. And I got

39:19

to say, this is another pretty good hit.

39:21

Yeah, this is wild. That she remembers, oh,

39:23

you know what? My grandma did once work

39:25

at a nail polish factory. Okay. I'm calling

39:28

that a good hit. Wow. I mean,

39:31

yes, it would be much better if

39:33

he had said I'm seeing nail polish

39:35

instead of, does she have well-manicured nails?

39:37

And here's a good example of Thomas John

39:39

doing the thing that I feel like is

39:41

kind of, maybe not uniquely his

39:44

shtick, but like that he works quite a

39:46

bit because she said that it was a

39:48

great hit. The audience was impressed with this.

39:50

And then he said, I'm sensing this was

39:52

before you were born after she'd already said

39:54

during World War II. So, yeah. And

40:02

so the audience was impressed with this, but

40:04

I was thinking, okay, you just double dipped

40:06

on that. Right. All right, good for

40:08

you. He is good at that, at just picking

40:10

something that you just told him like a sentence

40:12

ago. So the working

40:14

memory is still building a little narrative

40:16

about how this went down. And he

40:18

interrupts that narrative and says like, no,

40:20

actually, you just got that information from

40:23

me. He said,

40:25

fuck around here. Everyone loves that. Oh,

40:28

yeah, it's so saucy. He's just stuck on stage and some

40:30

people just lose their

40:32

shit about it. Just, that's so

40:34

great. He's broken the chains

40:36

of formality. He said the F word. He's

40:38

broken the chains of formality. He's one

40:41

of us. He's just like us. He's

40:43

not funny, but he did get a few little

40:45

laugh lines here and there. And I think it's

40:47

that form of humor where it's like, oh, I

40:49

just said something unexpected and a little bawdy or

40:51

a little rude. And

40:55

now we can all titter for a moment. And like I

40:57

said, he is disarming. I find him

40:59

disarming anyway. Oh, wow. Okay.

41:02

Well, anyway, so if you're listening. Who's

41:04

it, Hutton here? So he did pretty

41:06

well with Sarah. That was her name

41:08

out of all these people. But afterwards,

41:11

she was quite ecstatic from this exchange.

41:13

And so she tells them, you know,

41:15

I was about to walk out earlier

41:17

and he's like, I'm sorry, out

41:19

of where, honey? And she said, this room.

41:22

But yeah, because I. You were so bad

41:24

at this. I paid $40. This

41:27

was boring. Took me 17 minutes to set

41:29

this up. I was going to get out of here. But

41:32

clearly he changed her mind. And she said,

41:34

thank you so, so, so, so much. That's

41:37

wild. I wonder if she just felt

41:39

the increasing pressure of interpreting it

41:42

in a positive way or if

41:44

she actually was impressed by this.

41:46

Well, anyway. Now, by the

41:48

way, we're about to move to another

41:50

reading and I'll just note that all

41:52

of the people that he chose for

41:54

the readings were women. And you

41:56

know, we already established 80% women in the

41:58

audience, but just thought it was interesting. Interesting. Mm-hmm.

42:02

Yep. All right. My

42:05

name is Doug Dugay and I'm here to talk

42:07

about my podcast in the middle of the one

42:10

you're listening to. It's called Valley Heat and it's

42:12

about my neighborhood, the Burbank Rancho Equestrian District, the

42:14

center of the world when it comes to foosball,

42:16

frisbee golf, and high-speed freeway roller skating. And there's

42:18

been a jaguar parked outside on my curb for

42:20

10 months. I have no idea who owns it.

42:22

I have a feeling it's related to the drug

42:25

drop that was happening in my garbage can a

42:27

little over a year ago. And

42:29

if this has been a boring commercial, imagine 45 minutes of

42:31

it. Okay, Valley Heat,

42:33

it's on every month on

42:35

maximumfund.org or wherever you get podcasts. Check

42:37

it out, but honestly, skip it. These

42:40

are the chronicles of the Rancho Equestrian

42:42

District in Burbank, California. These are the

42:44

events taking place in my house around

42:46

my home. So

42:49

new reading, somebody's soulmate is coming

42:51

in. Okay. He's getting

42:53

a male energy. Ooh. He doesn't

42:55

want to say husband, maybe boyfriend,

42:58

fiance. Feels like

43:00

it's romantic. It's someone

43:02

who passed quickly. Yeah, he called

43:04

it a fast passing and I pictured someone at Disneyland.

43:06

I did that exact thing as I was reading this

43:09

note. Even though it's lightning lanes now.

43:11

Oh, right. Okay. Did

43:13

someone lose their soulmate? I keep

43:16

seeing the outdoors, the outdoors

43:18

coming through. He's painting this picture. He's just

43:20

throwing out a bunch of little word pictures

43:22

just to see what will land with somebody

43:24

who raises their hand. But

43:27

he's making it very clear that it's

43:29

romantic. Yes. And he's been gesturing

43:31

to this part of the audience and then he

43:33

says, but I'm not getting a feeling of where

43:35

in the room this is, which I thought was

43:37

super clever. It was a way for him to

43:39

broaden the scope of this. Oh, you know what?

43:42

Maybe I'm getting this from the left where I

43:44

wasn't looking at all. Right, right, right. Just a

43:46

moment ago. That explains the silence over

43:48

here. So finally a woman in

43:50

the area he's been hovering says,

43:52

well, I lost my brother and

43:55

he's committed to it being a romantic

43:57

figure. So that brings up new questions.

44:01

And so she says, I lost my brother. And he's like, no,

44:03

no, sorry, not a brother, not a brother. Maybe

44:07

there's more to this connection between them. There

44:09

could be... Yeah, right. They

44:11

could be Targaryens. I don't

44:14

know what that is. From Game of Thrones. Oh,

44:16

okay. Notably, incestuous family. Yeah, yeah,

44:18

yeah. Yeah, he's making assumptions here

44:20

that like it couldn't be. But

44:23

she says his name is Jared. He

44:25

says he's seeing the letter J. And so the

44:28

woman with the brother says, yes, yes, it's Jared.

44:30

And he's like, okay, no. I

44:33

really would prefer it wasn't your brother.

44:35

Yeah, listen, this is a romantic brother.

44:37

Can we move somewhere else? And she's

44:39

like, oh, but he was my shadow.

44:42

She really wanted to be read by Thomas

44:44

John, her brother. Please

44:46

tell me how my brother's my boyfriend.

44:48

And he said that this was longer

44:50

than 10 years, like the relationship. And

44:53

again, she's like, oh, okay, well, that's

44:55

definitely him. I'm

44:58

still trying to find this romantic partner.

45:00

And she said, well, an older brother is a

45:02

protector. Yes. Maybe

45:05

that'll help you, Thomas John, to

45:07

turn this from a romantic relationship

45:09

into a protection slash brotherly relationship.

45:11

Yes, protector is kind

45:13

of like a soulmate.

45:16

He found a way to get away from her. But don't worry,

45:18

she'll get him back later. Yeah. Then

45:21

he started just realizing he had something

45:23

for a particular person. Yeah. This

45:26

woman named Kaylin. Very far away from

45:28

the woman with the brother. Oh, was she? Yeah.

45:31

He was like, oh, sorry, honey, I'm going to have to go over to this side

45:33

of the room over here. And yes. Definitely

45:35

being called over on the other side. And

45:37

just started a whole new reading. Yeah. So

45:40

something for you. I'm getting a woman and

45:42

she's like my mother. Great. All

45:44

right. Great. Ready to

45:46

go. I'm sensing that she had breathing issues

45:48

and the woman says, oh yeah, she had tumors in her

45:50

lungs. Yeah. Okay. Good

45:53

hit. Sad story. And

45:56

he says, yeah, because I'm getting breathing issues. Yes,

45:58

exactly. That's exactly what I'm saying. You just

46:00

gave me info and then here's the thought

46:02

that I swear I was thinking before you

46:04

said that. Yeah, breathing issues is a

46:06

decent guess, but still like one of the

46:09

most common things you could guess for an

46:11

older person. So he asked,

46:13

did she get misdiagnosed? And she

46:15

says, well, it was delayed.

46:18

That's so telling at Conscious Life Expo though,

46:20

of course your mother's treatment was delayed, but

46:22

he's your mother. She's in this, Oh,

46:24

maybe. In this social circle where she's

46:26

probably not being encouraged to get the right

46:29

kind of care. So then

46:31

Thomas John does what Thomas John does

46:33

and says, okay, because I got something

46:35

about it being misdiagnosed or delayed. Oh,

46:37

cool. You said misdiagnosed, she said delayed.

46:39

And then you said you got something

46:41

about it being misdiagnosed or delayed. Right.

46:44

We've confused the timeline of causality

46:46

here. Also that still wouldn't

46:49

add at all to this woman's

46:51

understanding. Tell her something she doesn't

46:53

know. Yeah, I was just talking with

46:55

a coworker about this the other day that when

46:57

you talk to a psychic, it's all gonna end

47:00

up being things that you already knew and just

47:02

confirming those. Yeah, and then

47:04

on the outside chance, it's some piece

47:06

of new information. Either it's likely to

47:08

be generic. You should consider that option

47:10

that it might apply to multiple people,

47:12

or it's going to be wrong, or

47:15

maybe a lucky guess. At least you should

47:18

consider those options. And most of

47:20

all, forgettable. Yeah. You're

47:22

gonna forget most of it. And

47:25

unless you keep a spreadsheet like

47:27

me and Ross, like psychos, you're

47:29

not gonna retain it anyway. So you're just

47:31

gonna be so impressed forever, but I have

47:33

no idea what happened. And then I know

47:36

you're gonna feel like a spoilsport, but when

47:38

you hear the stories in his bio about

47:40

him discovering a lost watch or whatever it

47:42

was, you might want to see

47:44

if you can find someone else who was

47:46

there at that moment and see how they

47:48

tell the story. Because oftentimes the way it's

47:50

presented to you is in how it went

47:53

down. Anyway, stand up at the

47:55

Conscious Life Expo and sell this

47:57

as a monologue. In

47:59

under 17. during the Q&A. Okay,

48:02

so Thomas John asks, Kaitlyn, was

48:04

there ever a time when your

48:06

mom was very poor? She

48:09

says yes. Okay, because I'm

48:11

getting a feeling like she'd be down

48:13

to her last dollar. Yeah, we've

48:15

just rephrased being poor. Yeah,

48:18

I didn't see her bank account at the

48:20

time, but somewhere around her last dollar, yes.

48:22

She confirms that too, and then he says, I

48:25

don't know, does that make sense to

48:27

you? Yes. Yes. Okay, you just got

48:29

the confirmation. And then he says,

48:31

was it that way when you were a kid? Obviously,

48:34

yes. Well, I

48:36

guess it could be before. When

48:39

I read that, my mom was poor when she

48:41

was a kid and not when I was a

48:43

kid. Boy, just like, it made me really attentive

48:46

to this tactic when he just kept drilling down

48:48

on this one revelation. Because then he said, I

48:51

just feel like there was always a lack of

48:53

money. Lack of money, does that make sense to

48:55

you? I just rephrased it

48:57

again. What are you doing? And

48:59

she keeps saying yes. And if you're just

49:01

absorbing this conversation in terms of the repeated

49:04

yes, yes, yes, yes, you can go away

49:06

later and be like, wow, that

49:08

was so many hits when it was one.

49:10

It was one hit, they got six yeses.

49:13

Yep. And he still kept going like,

49:15

oh, and so that's always been imprinted on you. Yes.

49:18

And you've always wanted to

49:20

be different in that regard. Yeah.

49:23

Also, with class guesses, you get so many

49:25

visual cues. He can be looking at her

49:27

purrs, he can be looking at her makeup,

49:30

he can be guessing a whole bunch of

49:32

things just by, how much money does it

49:34

look like she's found? Maybe she's wearing Guess. Right.

49:37

That tells you a lot. Yeah, and of course

49:39

her body language. She may

49:41

be saying yes, she may just be nodding,

49:43

she may be looking excitedly. All

49:45

of these are clues. Okay, so then he starts

49:48

getting the letter M with

49:50

someone connected to her mom. And she

49:52

says her name was Marilyn. Yeah,

49:54

the mother's name is Marilyn. And he

49:56

says, okay, so that's still your mother.

49:58

Yeah, yeah. saying like it's

50:00

somebody connected to your mom and if she

50:02

could have thought of a friend or relative

50:04

who's started with him, that would have been

50:07

a hit. But the fact that the mom's

50:09

name is Marilyn. Okay. Okay. So

50:12

that's still your mom. I'm getting. Just wanted to

50:14

make sure. Great. Right.

50:17

So then he asked if the parents were hiding money from each

50:20

other. She says, not that I know of the seems

50:22

like an opportunity to tell her

50:24

information. No, not really. He says,

50:26

was there a lot of paperwork?

50:29

And she's like, yeah, I was the executor. So

50:31

you have to do a lot of paperwork. Yes.

50:34

Yes. Yes. And

50:37

answered. So then he asks whether she

50:39

appears in her dreams regularly. She says,

50:41

yes. That's a clever one. I feel like I

50:43

need to add that to the old repertoire. Oh

50:45

yeah. Ella visits my dreams

50:48

sometimes and to me. Yeah. Yeah.

50:51

I remember my dad telling me a story about

50:53

seeing his dad in a dream after my grandpa

50:55

passed and yeah, it was very sweet, but I

50:57

thought that's what we do. Yeah. I

50:59

didn't say that though, because you don't want to be the

51:01

spoilsport. Mm hmm. Unless you make a podcast. So

51:04

anyway, the mom is glad

51:07

that Kailin is finally happy.

51:10

The closest thing we've gotten to a message.

51:12

Yeah. So, okay. Good

51:15

for you, Thomas John. Yeah. I think

51:17

maybe around this time is when he realized, oh shoot,

51:19

I better actually be. Yeah. Sealing

51:21

the deal on this, like actually communicating

51:23

some information from the other side. It's

51:25

got to be around the hour, Mark.

51:27

Wow. Yeah. He

51:29

says, you're focusing on your own happiness now. Does

51:31

that make sense? She says, yes. He's like, not

51:33

in a selfish way, but you know, I need

51:35

to take care of myself. He's like, yes. Goodness.

51:39

Oh, who is that that's sitting next to

51:42

you? That's my son. She

51:44

watches over him a lot. Yeah. She's

51:47

just really happier in a better place, if that

51:49

makes sense. Does that make sense? Yes.

51:53

All right. Yeah. Let's get

51:55

back to this confusion with the brother

51:57

slash soulmate. got

52:00

to come to the other side over here.

52:03

Somebody's sister or maybe

52:05

sister-in-law or close female

52:07

friend or. Yeah, it's very

52:09

sisterly energy. Sisterly energy. Please somebody give

52:12

me something. Someone's fun. Someone out going.

52:14

Give me an I twitch, give me

52:16

something. Keeps mentioning hair or something

52:19

about hair. Like

52:21

nobody's biting at this. Nobody

52:24

has a sisterly anything in their lives.

52:26

What's what's going with hair? Yeah, long

52:28

hair. No, thank you. So then

52:30

he asks the person with the microphone, can you

52:32

go to this lady in the second row? Not

52:35

related to the sister energy. Yeah, we're giving

52:37

up on the sister. Let's try something new. Going up

52:39

for you. There's still this poor

52:41

other woman with the brother who really

52:43

wants to talk. She's so eager. This

52:45

woman's name was Susan. Not

52:48

Susan Gerbick. That would have been awkward. She

52:51

was not in the room. But yeah, when he

52:53

got Susan holding the microphone, he said, do you

52:55

connect to the sister energy? No.

52:58

Okay, I didn't think so. Did

53:01

you lose a sister? No.

53:03

She looked to me to be about in her sixties.

53:05

So not a bad guess. Sure.

53:08

She would have lost either a sister or

53:10

a very close friend who she thought of

53:13

as a sister. Nope. Never.

53:16

I've never known a woman who died. Well,

53:18

speaking of that, I'm getting a male

53:20

energy. So they

53:22

decide together that that's her father.

53:25

I'm really looking forward to the

53:27

day when I get my first

53:29

psychic who senses a gender non-binary

53:31

presence in the room. That hasn't

53:34

happened yet. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That'll

53:36

really be some progress. Yeah. Yeah.

53:39

Yeah. Waiting for that moment.

53:41

Finally, a non-binary person died and they're

53:43

coming back. Okay,

53:46

so he was sensing lots of

53:48

books. Yes, with this male energy,

53:50

which she identified as her father. So, okay,

53:52

what's all these books I'm getting? Yeah, what's

53:54

this thing with books? And she

53:57

doesn't really get that. Yeah, she's like,

53:59

ah. I'm in. into book and

54:01

Thomas John's impressed by that

54:03

enough. Yes, yes, you, exactly,

54:05

that's what he's saying. You

54:08

like books. Yeah, all

54:10

I got is he's babbling on about books.

54:12

You like books, amazing, look what we've done

54:14

here. We've

54:16

broken the law of physics and we've established

54:19

that you like books. You like books. And

54:22

he says, and this wasn't a recent

54:25

death, right? She's like, well, six or

54:27

seven years now. He lets that

54:29

one lie. Okay, do I connect him

54:31

to a cigar or a pipe? Well,

54:34

no, that was my grandpa. Okay,

54:36

well, was he quieter? Yes, okay.

54:39

Yeah, cause he'd thrown out like, was he a

54:41

quiet man? No, that would be my grandpa. So

54:43

now he's gotten two distractions with the grandpa. We're

54:45

just bumping back and forth to see if he

54:47

has two characters. Why not, we've got, yep. Yeah,

54:50

we've created a composite character for whom

54:52

all hits are fine. He

54:54

starts to sense that there's a move around her

54:56

and she's like, well, I move all the time.

54:59

He's like, there you go. And did

55:01

he help you move? Yes, wow, now there's

55:03

a reason for us to be talking about

55:05

grandpa's and he'll move. Has anyone ever

55:07

heard of a father who helped his daughter move?

55:10

I've never even heard of that. Never, it's never

55:12

happened before, nope. And then he says, I don't know

55:14

if he had a lot of friends, did he? Yes. Oh,

55:18

okay. There you go, you

55:20

didn't know, but now you do. Yeah, and he did

55:22

phrase it as the, I don't know if he had

55:24

a lot of friends. Because

55:26

he didn't, he really didn't know.

55:29

Because they're strangers. Yeah,

55:33

so he could have gotten credit for that either

55:35

way. But yeah, what are we exactly doing here?

55:38

We've just gotten you to tell me that

55:40

your deceased father did not have a lot

55:43

of friends. No, did have a lot of

55:45

friends. Oh, sorry, yes, did, popular guy, okay.

55:48

Okay, then did anyone have any

55:50

sinus issues? She's like, yeah, my

55:52

grandmother. So you remember

55:54

her going through that in the slice?

55:57

Yes. Oh, that was one of

55:59

those ones that really. Annoyed me my mother

56:01

had sinus issues. So you remember her

56:03

going through that in life Well, yeah,

56:05

otherwise, how could you have just answered

56:08

the question? Unless

56:10

like that's in your

56:12

family heirlooms somewhere grandma

56:14

always had sinus pressure

56:17

If this were in the courts, I would be

56:19

like I asked you to strike That

56:23

was not an earned yes, but he really

56:25

spends a lot of time on this woman and he

56:28

even told her This is different with

56:30

you specifically out of all the people I'm reading

56:32

because more than just like an individual I'm getting

56:34

a lot of people because we've

56:36

already had a sisterly energy that never

56:38

materialized. We've had the father We've had

56:41

the grandfather say yes to anything Yeah,

56:43

of course the reason for that is because you've

56:45

got this cloud of people around. Yes So

56:48

who had the sewing machine?

56:50

She says my mother? Okay.

56:52

Okay. Did you lose a

56:54

cat? No Well, I

56:56

see a gray cat See

56:58

there is one like living under the porch

57:00

at my house and he says that

57:03

okay gotcha You know,

57:05

what's crazy about this? Why are we talking about

57:07

that cat now? What's the spiritual significance? Yeah Yeah,

57:09

we're like go with it. Don't say okay gotcha

57:11

be like yes Exactly. That

57:13

cat's name is cricket and she comes from

57:16

Jupiter and she needs you to deliver this

57:18

message To the groundhogs

57:20

that they need to get the batteries

57:22

into the earth Save everybody

57:25

by June outside of just a

57:27

solid miss Yeah, I think

57:29

the most old thing a psychic for is

57:31

not taking advantage of a hit. Yes Yes,

57:33

he did that a few times where he

57:35

just got okay, let's move along Yeah, I'll

57:37

keep doing the thing that I do because

57:39

my brain is already working forward I

57:42

am the next interaction I miss the fact

57:44

that you actually just validated the one random

57:46

thing I got right because all he's

57:48

marked as success in his head

57:50

Is a moment of validation for

57:52

him So he just

57:54

automatically moves on when he hits that moment

57:56

of validation for him missing that that's not

57:59

the moment of necessarily for the audience

58:01

or the center. Right, yeah. The really important

58:03

thing to establish, I would say

58:05

for most of the psychics that we see is

58:07

just that I'm valid, I'm

58:09

doing something here. You will

58:11

attend other shows of mine. But you gotta ask

58:14

for your $40 back. And sign up for my

58:16

newsletter, please. Buy my book in the back, I'll

58:18

sign it for you afterward. I

58:20

feel like that's the real goal. But about

58:22

great cats, there's a great cat

58:24

who lives in our backyard and I call her Amy

58:26

and I leave food for her and she's just so

58:28

cute. Amy, okay. Amy, yeah. I

58:31

was recently reading the Lesser Key

58:33

of Solomon, the Goetia, it's like

58:35

that book about all of the

58:37

different demons that we talked about

58:39

when we were talking about Travis

58:41

McHenry's cult. Taro,

58:43

anyways, you just reminded me

58:45

of this because there were all the

58:47

traditional names you would expect for these

58:49

demonic sounding figures, but one of them

58:51

was named Amy. Aw,

58:54

nice. AMI. I love that name, I

58:56

love that name. This is one of

58:58

the 72 demons. There you go. Why

59:00

not? Perfect. Okay, then he got

59:02

something about her overworking and she's like, yeah,

59:04

I work all the time. Of

59:06

course, that's what everybody says always. No

59:09

one's ever like, mm, I really am, lazy

59:11

stuff. Speaking of laziness, that was how

59:13

he was closing the loop of I've had

59:15

all these just random things about your dad

59:18

and your grandpa and smoking

59:21

and a pipe and a cat and now

59:23

they're all just telling you you work too

59:26

hard. Right, right, right.

59:28

That was the big cosmic message. The

59:30

cat said to the pipe, said to the grandma,

59:32

said to the mom that you're working too hard.

59:34

And if he told me I'm

59:36

working too hard, I could connect with that. If he told

59:38

you you're working too hard, I'm sure you could connect with

59:40

that. All of us can be like, oh yeah, I need

59:43

to rest more. I guess the cat, the gray

59:45

cat in the backyard thinks I need to rest more. Oh

59:50

my God. But as much as she kept

59:52

giving him, he seemed to have forgotten that

59:54

he already started off with her not connecting

59:57

with the sisterly energy. So he moves on.

1:00:00

when he opened it up on the sisterly

1:00:02

energy. I guess he was looking towards our

1:00:04

side of the room because this time we

1:00:06

had four women all raise their hands, including

1:00:09

Carrie Poppy. Oh, okay. I don't remember why.

1:00:11

But one woman spoke up and said, that's

1:00:13

me, her name was Pamela. Oh,

1:00:15

he knew he was gonna read her

1:00:18

when he saw her in line. Can

1:00:20

you read that? Yeah, he was identifying all these people

1:00:22

in advance. He knew he was gonna be reading. So

1:00:24

yeah, she thinks that this was

1:00:26

her female cousin who she

1:00:29

was a sister to this

1:00:31

cousin in another life. In a

1:00:33

former life, yes. And at this

1:00:35

sort of convention, He was okay with that. He

1:00:37

was okay with that. He was okay with that. That's given

1:00:39

information, I guess. Yeah, he did make

1:00:41

a point in his intro that he

1:00:44

only connects with dead loved ones. And

1:00:46

I'm not invalidating that, you know, there

1:00:48

are ascended masters or spirit guides. In

1:00:50

fact, I think he was even going

1:00:53

to have a spirit guide session the

1:00:55

following day, like post conference that you

1:00:57

could go to. Yeah,

1:00:59

he talks about spirit guides in the Q

1:01:01

and A. But that's not what he was

1:01:03

about at this particular reading. And he was

1:01:05

saying that there are other categories like aliens

1:01:07

or guardian angels that he wasn't going to

1:01:09

discount. He's just saying, I don't work with

1:01:12

that particular energy. But he was

1:01:14

totally fine with this lady saying that

1:01:16

she had a cousin who was her

1:01:18

sister in a former life. Also, she

1:01:21

mentioned that this cousin slash former sister

1:01:23

had a wig which connected to the

1:01:25

long hair thing he was saying earlier.

1:01:28

Something about hair. There we go. Oh,

1:01:30

she didn't have hair, that counts. She

1:01:33

had a wig, long hair. Maybe the

1:01:35

long hair was on the wig. Yeah, yeah,

1:01:37

yeah. And did she march to the beat

1:01:39

of her own drum? Yes. Do

1:01:41

you understand that? Yes. No,

1:01:45

she was a joiner. She was a

1:01:47

sheep. She did anything anyone

1:01:49

said to her. She marched to the

1:01:51

beat of everyone else's drum. Yeah,

1:01:55

lots of Barnum statements ready to go.

1:01:57

Just these things that connect with anybody.

1:01:59

Okay. Okay, so when

1:02:01

she sees butterflies, that

1:02:04

is her cousin dropping in on her.

1:02:06

There we go. This is

1:02:09

basically the big message here. Finally

1:02:11

nailing it, Thomas John, picking

1:02:14

an animal everybody will see a couple

1:02:16

times a year and saying it's their

1:02:18

dead cousin. Yep, she's sending you

1:02:20

butterflies. Okay, so when I die,

1:02:23

I get to alter the flight

1:02:25

pattern. When

1:02:28

you die, you get to name an insect

1:02:31

and send it to all your friends.

1:02:33

What's up with all these June bugs? What

1:02:36

are you gonna send me? Why didn't you

1:02:38

die first? Okay. How will I

1:02:40

know it's you? Praying mantis. Oh, my

1:02:42

spirit animal. Yeah, so then

1:02:44

you'll know it's from me. Okay, if I

1:02:47

die, I'll send you, ooh. A

1:02:53

little nervous. I

1:02:55

don't know many. I'll send

1:02:57

you rolypoles. Okay. Yeah. I haven't seen

1:02:59

a rolypole in a while. Yeah, right? Okay.

1:03:02

I collected some when I was little, but I gotta

1:03:04

tell you, you can't just keep them in a box.

1:03:06

Boy, those things, oh no. This

1:03:08

has a sad ending. They've got so

1:03:10

many names. Everybody calls them something

1:03:13

different. Frank. Well, no, like

1:03:15

pill bugs and sow bugs. I

1:03:18

feel like they're, that's one of those ones. Yeah,

1:03:20

what are they really called? It's a regionalism where

1:03:23

everybody's got a different name for this thing. Babe,

1:03:25

what do you call rolypoles? I

1:03:29

mean, rolypoles. Drew calls them

1:03:31

rolypoles. Okay. He's from Texas. Good

1:03:33

name. It's an armadilla d-a. Oh,

1:03:37

that is a great. It's an

1:03:39

armadilla d-a. That's a

1:03:41

great family name. Yeah. It does

1:03:43

look like a little armadillo. It's got all these little segmented

1:03:45

plates. This is a crazy spelling, y'all.

1:03:48

A-r-m-a-d-i-l-l-i-d-i-i-d-a-e.

1:03:53

A family of woodlice

1:03:55

and terrestrial crustacean group

1:03:57

in the order Isopoda.

1:04:00

See, this is fun. Other common

1:04:02

names include Slaters, Potato

1:04:04

Bugs, Butchie Boys, and

1:04:06

Doodlebugs. Yes, this is the one I've heard.

1:04:08

Doodlebugs, I've heard that one. This is what

1:04:11

I'm sending you. Butchie Boys, I haven't

1:04:13

heard before, but okay, that's pretty good, thank you.

1:04:15

You're welcome. What am I getting,

1:04:17

Junebugs? Praying Mantis. Praying Mantis,

1:04:19

okay. After I die, I'll have to

1:04:21

play back this episode on the great podcast

1:04:24

Player in the Sky, so I

1:04:26

can remember what I'm supposed to say. Yeah, remember what the hell we're

1:04:28

supposed to be sending. I'll get right the hell on that. There'll

1:04:32

be like five of them in a row

1:04:34

outside your window just praying Mantis. All praying?

1:04:36

Yeah, that'll be... Yeah, what if I get

1:04:38

them to spell out an R or something?

1:04:41

Okay, I'm gonna go full bore on this.

1:04:43

Why an R? My name is Ross. Oh,

1:04:46

yeah, I knew that about you. That's right,

1:04:48

that's right, now I remember. Yeah,

1:04:50

I don't want this to feel random. I

1:04:53

love that we get the ability to control the

1:04:56

paths of inside. Yeah. Just

1:04:58

one species. So anyways, when this

1:05:00

is where he sees butterflies. Yay.

1:05:03

So then he rolls up his shirt sleeves and knocks over the

1:05:05

microphone. Oh, yeah, this is a real moment just

1:05:07

fumbling with the microphone. I don't know, I had

1:05:10

fun. Okay,

1:05:12

so he goes back to the soulmate

1:05:14

brother. He says

1:05:16

that the brother had very much

1:05:19

soulmate energy. And I see you

1:05:21

wrote down, Carrie gives me a

1:05:23

very intense side eye. Yeah,

1:05:27

because finally he said, all right, well, I

1:05:30

guess we have to do the brother thing,

1:05:32

but definitely you were soulmates. So there we

1:05:34

go. That's hopefully threading the

1:05:36

needle between a romantic relationship and

1:05:38

you and your brother. Her

1:05:41

name's Alyssa, her brother was Jared. And

1:05:43

she says the reason, this is Alyssa

1:05:45

speaking, the reason he said, I'm so

1:05:48

sorry is because he took his life.

1:05:50

That was one of the searching pieces

1:05:52

of information earlier. I'm sensing this

1:05:55

significant other that you lost is saying that he's

1:05:57

so, so, so sorry. And she's like, oh, but

1:05:59

I know why my. My brother said that. Yes.

1:06:02

And Thomas John kept saying that he was

1:06:04

getting an image of the outside

1:06:06

being not any more specific.

1:06:09

And now this woman is saying, and

1:06:12

I can confirm because when he took

1:06:14

his own life, that was outside. And

1:06:17

instead of taking any moment

1:06:19

to say anything like, I'm sorry,

1:06:22

or just have a moment of

1:06:24

eye contact, he just goes like,

1:06:26

yes, remember, I said outdoors. He's

1:06:29

so excited that he got something right.

1:06:31

It's for me. Yeah, exactly. Oh, whew.

1:06:34

So off key. Yeah, you're right.

1:06:36

I'm coming farther down on his reading

1:06:38

abilities. These are some pretty

1:06:41

bad gaffes. So he says,

1:06:43

your brother was really intelligent. She's like,

1:06:45

yeah, he was a comedian, actually. He's

1:06:47

like, yes, he saw the world in

1:06:49

a different way. And then he repeats

1:06:51

that in different ways. He

1:06:54

was very, very sensitive, though he didn't

1:06:56

always show it. And he was very

1:06:58

funny. Yeah, he said he's a comedian. He

1:07:01

said he's a comedian. He better be funny. He keeps telling

1:07:03

me that he wants you to write a book. Does that

1:07:05

make sense to you? And she

1:07:07

said, oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Well, it's funny,

1:07:09

again, a little bit of humor here. He's

1:07:11

telling me that you need to get off

1:07:14

your ass. We

1:07:16

all have a chuckle at that.

1:07:18

And he wants to help you with that. Of

1:07:20

course, because if you don't do it,

1:07:22

it'll never get done. Oh,

1:07:24

yeah, great. Very incredible advice.

1:07:28

Incredible. This reminds me that

1:07:30

I pick on Drew for this all

1:07:32

the time. One time, maybe six months

1:07:34

ago, he said that I was

1:07:36

funny. And I said, not as funny as you. And

1:07:38

he said, well, I should hope not. Oh,

1:07:40

all right. It's

1:07:45

got to be a hierarchy. Yeah, yeah, all

1:07:47

right. OK. Well, that was pretty

1:07:49

funny. Yeah, it's funny. OK, so

1:07:51

then Thomas John started chastising this

1:07:53

woman. Listen, you have to put

1:07:56

your own energy forward about this,

1:07:58

about writing her book. Or there's

1:08:00

not much the spirits can do to help

1:08:02

you what's holding you back So

1:08:05

then she explains what's holding

1:08:07

her back. She's totally blind

1:08:10

That's an impediment to writing a book. Yeah, it

1:08:12

can still be done If you're

1:08:14

supposed to be psychic and a woman

1:08:16

sitting in front of you with a

1:08:18

cane and glasses Oh,

1:08:21

I thought she might be blind

1:08:23

and I don't claim to be

1:08:25

psychic. Uh-huh. Interesting. That's very interesting I

1:08:27

just picked up on the context cues.

1:08:30

But remember she needs to get off her ass. That's So

1:08:34

she says well what's holding me back

1:08:36

is I'm totally

1:08:39

blind And

1:08:41

I went blind around the time that

1:08:43

my brother died and he had vision

1:08:45

problems too and then her voice begins

1:08:48

to quiver And again, he just completely

1:08:50

misses the note and he just cuts

1:08:52

in. Yeah Yeah So you and your

1:08:54

brother were together in other lifetimes and

1:08:56

why am I getting a vision of a kangaroo? Yeah,

1:09:01

why is he and then she struggles to

1:09:03

make sense of that he's like, well,

1:09:05

I don't know maybe something about Australia

1:09:08

Anyway, you and your brother were spiritually

1:09:10

connected. She says very much and he

1:09:12

says, yeah, I feel that so Trails

1:09:17

off I feel that yeah,

1:09:19

he doesn't know how to Get

1:09:22

it across the the finish line Yeah,

1:09:24

a man took his own life reached back

1:09:27

across the divine to talk to his sister

1:09:29

and Send a

1:09:31

picture of a kangaroo and outdoors Yeah,

1:09:37

I don't know what to do with that and

1:09:39

write that book get off your ass So

1:09:43

then Thomas John

1:09:46

Unceremoniously moves on to the Q&A. Yeah,

1:09:48

let's just do Q&A now Why not sure it's

1:09:51

my favorite part. So he's gonna

1:09:53

take five questions question one Does

1:09:55

it feel different to you when

1:09:57

you connect with spirit versus channeling?

1:09:59

with higher level entities. Oh,

1:10:02

this is the kind of question a psychic

1:10:04

just loves because the answer is just purely

1:10:06

in their own head. So

1:10:08

let's extrapolate on this. He says,

1:10:10

oh yeah, yeah, yeah. People ask a

1:10:12

lot who my spirit guide is, which

1:10:14

is funny because we all have a

1:10:17

team of guides. You know, we have

1:10:19

ancestors, loved ones, angels, relatives, spirit guides,

1:10:21

ascended masters, self source, other dimensional beings.

1:10:24

Boy, that is funny. That's hilarious.

1:10:27

But you know how there are certain

1:10:29

friends you go to for certain things.

1:10:31

Well, it's the same thing here. You

1:10:33

know, different guides give you different things.

1:10:35

And I can sense the difference between

1:10:37

the kind of energy coming through and

1:10:39

who it's coming from. Okay. There

1:10:42

you go. Another woman asks him, do you ever have a

1:10:44

battle between the spirits who are like trying to get through

1:10:46

to you? Which makes sense. Yeah,

1:10:48

you'd think they'd all be like kind of shouting through

1:10:50

the ether. Yeah. And I mean,

1:10:52

even from this reading alone, you could tell there were

1:10:54

some mixed up energies. He

1:10:57

said, oh, if that happens, that's

1:10:59

the way it's supposed to happen. There must be a

1:11:01

reason for it. I think that was just

1:11:03

the quality of his answer. It's just like, oh, I just

1:11:05

kind of go with the flow of what the spirits are

1:11:07

doing. They have a reason for it. Okay. Next

1:11:10

question was from a guy. He said, so when

1:11:12

they come through, how clearly can

1:11:14

you see them? And what's behind

1:11:17

them? Like what's the background on

1:11:19

this scene? I've heard this question asked

1:11:21

before. And it's a great question because you

1:11:23

don't see a psychic sort of stop and

1:11:25

like stare at the wall like, oh wow,

1:11:27

I'm seeing her over there. Like, I

1:11:31

have seen that once. Okay. Someone

1:11:33

who's actually acting like, okay, I see something. I'm

1:11:35

visualizing, I'm describing to you what I'm seeing. And

1:11:37

I'm acting out. The eyes are like locked on

1:11:40

the wall. I'm acting out the motion of, okay.

1:11:42

Yeah, that's rare. Yeah, this is in school. So

1:11:44

what does he say? Okay, so

1:11:46

Thomas John replies, well, they don't

1:11:48

have to show me what they

1:11:51

look like at all. I may

1:11:53

just get thoughts or feelings, impressions

1:11:55

that I know don't belong to

1:11:57

me. Like I know I'm not.

1:12:00

thinking them. So I

1:12:02

was like, oh, I've

1:12:04

heard of this. Yeah. Um, thought

1:12:06

insertion is a common delusion. Yeah.

1:12:08

The, if you

1:12:10

have an auditory hallucination and just

1:12:13

for whatever reason, your body, your

1:12:15

brain doesn't recognize that as a

1:12:17

hallucination. Interesting. Thought insertion. Okay.

1:12:19

And I feel it could even be

1:12:21

more mundane than that, where as we

1:12:24

all know, if we try to meditate,

1:12:26

we have these monkey minds that just

1:12:28

throw up all kinds of random stuff

1:12:30

all the time. And if

1:12:32

you just label that input source

1:12:34

or guides or whatever, just

1:12:37

whatever random thing pops into your head, you

1:12:39

can say like, Oh, well, I didn't think

1:12:41

of that. It just popped into my consciousness.

1:12:43

So let's run with that. Why am I

1:12:45

getting the color chartreuse? Yeah. That's weird. I

1:12:48

wasn't thinking about that earlier today. That's not

1:12:50

from me. I don't have like a

1:12:52

inner monologue to you. Oh, I definitely do.

1:12:54

Oh, you do. And it's like sentences. Yeah.

1:12:56

Wow. Sometimes. Yeah. Okay. I can turn

1:12:58

that on, but it's not automatic. And

1:13:01

anyway, a few weeks ago I

1:13:03

was standing in our kitchen looking

1:13:05

at the backyard and I just

1:13:07

suddenly had this fully formed thought,

1:13:11

Drew's going to build a train back there. Okay.

1:13:15

That was the whole thought just like just dumped

1:13:17

in my head and it felt so real.

1:13:20

Oh yeah. It felt so other because I

1:13:22

don't usually use words like that, but it

1:13:24

was so just sudden and like it really

1:13:26

felt like I told Drew, it's like, this

1:13:28

must see when people say they have a

1:13:31

download. This is what it feels like. I

1:13:33

was suddenly so certain you're going to build

1:13:35

a model train in the backyard. It'll

1:13:37

be interesting to see if Drew proves you right or

1:13:39

wrong. Yeah. He seems to not really want to build

1:13:41

a model. Okay. Likely that voice

1:13:43

was wrong, but I can see how you

1:13:46

would easily just label that and say, Oh

1:13:48

wow. Okay. That's someone telling me that something

1:13:50

else other than me. Carry in

1:13:52

a different timeline. Where what is really

1:13:54

true is that you contain multitudes. Exactly.

1:13:57

He also mentioned Thomas.

1:14:00

John mentioned that sometimes he

1:14:02

sees people at the foot of his bed, which

1:14:05

makes you think of hypnagogic

1:14:07

and hypnopompic hallucinations. Right, good

1:14:09

old sleep paralysis. But

1:14:12

he said he teaches his students

1:14:14

not to focus on what the

1:14:16

spirits look like. Because

1:14:18

they often kind of try to start there,

1:14:20

they'll say, oh I see someone with brown

1:14:22

hair, or I see someone in a three-piece

1:14:25

suit, or whatever. And he's like, that's not

1:14:27

really the place to start, start with personality

1:14:29

characteristics, or names. He was

1:14:31

also saying it's important to focus on the

1:14:33

message, which I feel like he didn't do

1:14:36

too well in this particular reading. Yeah, the

1:14:38

medium was not the message here. Do you

1:14:40

get me? Yep, I gotcha.

1:14:42

Thank you. And the next

1:14:44

person asked an interesting question. Yeah,

1:14:47

yeah. She said, so say you

1:14:49

lose your mediumship because you weren't really

1:14:51

working at it. How do you get

1:14:53

it back? Asking for a friend. Yeah,

1:14:55

and she said it in a way like, we've

1:14:57

all been there. And he kind

1:15:00

of received it as we've all been there. He's

1:15:02

like, yeah, it could be a day, it could

1:15:04

be months. Not everybody's

1:15:06

supposed to be a professional medium, but

1:15:08

everyone has some level of psychic power.

1:15:10

So it's still there for you. But

1:15:12

yeah, you might have to practice again.

1:15:14

Seems consistent with the answers.

1:15:17

Yeah. We usually hear on that kind of

1:15:19

question. Yeah. There was another woman

1:15:21

who had a question about spiritual activity

1:15:23

that she was sensing and was wondering

1:15:25

like, was it an ancestor or a

1:15:28

spirit that somehow got trapped in the

1:15:30

house? And she was talking about

1:15:32

some of the phenomena. There's knocking on the door.

1:15:34

There's an old alarm system turning on at 2

1:15:36

a.m. and said that the

1:15:38

house was built in the 70s. So

1:15:40

quick, solve my ghost problem. Maybe

1:15:43

that's just a slip of the tongue, but if

1:15:45

it keeps turning on at 2 a.m., that's not

1:15:47

random. You need to turn off

1:15:49

the 2 a.m. alarm. But. Right,

1:15:51

you're right. The definition of

1:15:53

random would be not reliably at the

1:15:55

same time. Yeah, but maybe

1:15:58

that wasn't exactly what she meant. But

1:16:00

yes, the homeless from the 70s. So

1:16:02

he thought about this for a

1:16:04

long time and boy, he rambled,

1:16:06

he defined what a ghost is.

1:16:09

He just really

1:16:11

traveling nowhere as he thought about this.

1:16:13

But he finally lands on, I don't

1:16:15

think that's one of your family members.

1:16:17

I do think that it's someone who

1:16:20

used to live in the house. And

1:16:22

so she's like, okay, I thought that,

1:16:24

you know, we're on Chumashland. It's like,

1:16:26

okay, then yeah. Chumashland,

1:16:29

probably someone who was there before. And

1:16:31

when it's like that, it's usually just a

1:16:33

paranormal thing. Oh, okay. Just a

1:16:35

paranormal thing, no begging. Oh, okay. And then it was

1:16:37

over. He asked us all to buy his book

1:16:39

and line up for him to sign it. You

1:16:41

and I kept raising our hands and he didn't pick

1:16:43

on either of us. I was going

1:16:45

to ask him, I was trying to like work

1:16:47

out a phrasing in my mind. And here's what

1:16:50

I wrote down at the time. What research do

1:16:52

you do to make yourself better prepared for your

1:16:54

readings? And do you ever follow up afterward or

1:16:56

is the reading over when it is over? Because

1:16:59

I thought that might be just sort

1:17:01

of a nod to the fact that he prepares

1:17:03

for some readings he does. Yeah, yeah. There's

1:17:06

pre and post to this production.

1:17:08

Yeah, he didn't seem to do any of

1:17:10

that today, but certainly he has at other

1:17:12

times. And then also I was curious about

1:17:14

whether he follows up because I feel like

1:17:16

we go to these conferences and these readings

1:17:18

and people say all these important, meaningful things,

1:17:21

but then do they ever try to get

1:17:23

the person's contact info reach out to them?

1:17:25

I mean, he did have a story about

1:17:27

a woman writing back about the smiley face,

1:17:30

but I mean, how much does he

1:17:32

actually care about the wellbeing of these

1:17:34

people and what these messages do for

1:17:36

them versus just acknowledging that he

1:17:38

has a connection? So I

1:17:40

asked you what you were going to ask him. Oh,

1:17:42

what'd I say? I Googled you and I saw a

1:17:45

New Yorker article. What are your thoughts on that? Because

1:17:48

there was a very negative article about him. Okay, there

1:17:50

you go. The New Yorker. Very similar

1:17:52

to Susan's pitch for a question. Exactly, yeah. Would

1:17:54

have been fun if we'd been called upon, but

1:17:56

yeah, he was standing in the back of the

1:17:58

room. There was a small line. up of people

1:18:00

maybe like eight or so people with his

1:18:02

book waiting to get it signed. He is

1:18:05

not back there this year. For

1:18:07

whatever reason. But again, the book is... Never

1:18:10

argue with a dead person. True

1:18:13

and unbelievable stories from

1:18:15

the other side. That's

1:18:17

a great book title. And that was it

1:18:19

for our experience with Thomas John. So didn't

1:18:21

knock our socks off. It felt

1:18:23

like he didn't prepare for it at all.

1:18:25

Yep. Which is commendable in

1:18:28

one sense. Yeah, but when you pay 40

1:18:30

bucks for something or $600 for an all

1:18:32

access pass, I don't know. Expect a little

1:18:34

bit of preparation. Yeah, I wonder if he

1:18:36

just wasn't able to get to that list and he

1:18:38

normally can or what happened there. Maybe.

1:18:41

Yeah, would he have put in the effort if he could have

1:18:44

known who was in the audience? And also it's often a practice,

1:18:46

I was going to say good practice,

1:18:48

to have plants in the audience as well

1:18:50

that you can call on for the occasional

1:18:52

hit. But I didn't get any indication he

1:18:54

did that either. Yeah, I mean either. There

1:18:56

were a few good moments. I mentioned one

1:18:58

reading where there was an R name and

1:19:00

the woman had a son named Rodrigo or

1:19:02

something. That was a pretty good hit. So

1:19:04

he had to make maybe three or four

1:19:06

good hits over the course of an hour.

1:19:09

Yeah, not impressive. Not great. Not

1:19:11

impressive. So, yeah, Thomas

1:19:13

John. Thomas John. Well,

1:19:16

if you listen to this Thomas John,

1:19:18

we'd love to have you on. You are

1:19:20

more than welcome. And yeah, we'll

1:19:22

ask you those questions we suggested and others.

1:19:24

Yes. But yeah, we'll

1:19:26

be telling you more soon about some

1:19:29

friends old and new at the Expo.

1:19:31

Oh, hey, speaking of extraordinary knowledge, when

1:19:34

we had our episode about

1:19:36

the Mark the Beast VHS

1:19:38

tape that you had brought

1:19:40

up, this was all done by this guy

1:19:42

named John Shepherd. And

1:19:44

we had read up that he had

1:19:47

more predictions and one of them fell

1:19:49

on yesterday as we were

1:19:51

recording. So he predicted for February

1:19:53

6th, 2024. Yeah.

1:19:57

That there would be a peace treaty with.

1:20:00

Israel. Whoa! This was mentioned in

1:20:02

our episode Scan for Satan, Mark

1:20:04

of the Beast edition. Okay, and

1:20:06

did it happen? That was yesterday.

1:20:08

I'm doing a search. I feel like that

1:20:10

would make some news. Yeah, well, and I mean, I

1:20:13

got a little bit of a chill

1:20:15

just being reminded of this thinking, wow,

1:20:17

okay, well, Israel certainly in the news.

1:20:19

There's a lot going on. Sure, but?

1:20:22

Nope. No. No, certainly not.

1:20:24

That's been advertised or mentioned

1:20:26

anywhere. So I think failed

1:20:28

prediction, but at least right part of

1:20:31

the world to need a peace treaty.

1:20:33

Yeah. No, I'm pretty sure

1:20:35

that would come up. I think

1:20:37

so. Yeah. So nice try, John

1:20:39

Shepherd. Nice try. All right.

1:20:42

Well, that's it for this episode. Our theme

1:20:44

music is by Brian Keith Dalton. Our administrative

1:20:46

manager is Ian Cramer. You

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1:20:50

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1:20:52

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find the podcast. And remember from Thomas

1:21:22

John. So yeah, you

1:21:24

know, when you have spirit activity like that, you're right.

1:21:27

There can be, there can be, um, a

1:21:29

couple of things. I mean, number one, it

1:21:32

could just be, you know, coincidental weird stuff,

1:21:34

but probably not if it's happening so much.

1:21:37

And then you also have spirit

1:21:39

people, um, that have not transitioned

1:21:41

that are within

1:21:43

the physical realm. We call them ghosts, you

1:21:45

know, um, that can

1:21:47

be within a home,

1:21:51

um, that they may have lived in before.

1:21:53

They could be really be anywhere. You know,

1:21:55

you can have ghosts are

1:21:57

one of those things that, so when we say. ghost

1:22:00

typically we wouldn't you know typically they're

1:22:02

not your own loved ones you know

1:22:04

they're ghosts you know so they could

1:22:07

be a spirit that's connected to that

1:22:09

house a spirit that's connected to

1:22:11

that area sometimes you have random spirits

1:22:14

that didn't cross over they've chosen not

1:22:16

to cross over for whatever reason and

1:22:20

they just are like oh I'm gonna

1:22:22

go in that house you know they there's not a they don't have

1:22:24

it most of the time we find with

1:22:26

a ghost like that that

1:22:29

they it's more

1:22:31

common that they had something to do with that

1:22:33

house so maybe they live there once or they

1:22:35

lived in that area or something it's

1:22:37

usually uncommon as it can

1:22:39

happen but it's uncommon that

1:22:42

you know it sounds like

1:22:45

with that to me I mean I have to

1:22:47

really know more about it but I it

1:22:50

doesn't feel to me as much that it's your

1:22:52

loved ones that feels

1:22:54

more like spirit activity that's with your

1:22:56

house like I would say more it

1:22:59

seems more paranormal go you

1:23:01

know that's the feeling I'm getting but I

1:23:03

have to know more hello

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