0:08

How do you support single mothers

0:11

? It has to be such a different

0:13

process of care when

0:15

you're talking about having a couple and

0:18

you're supporting that couple , versus

0:20

having a young mother by

0:22

herself , you know , with no

0:24

family . You know what I mean . Like yes

0:27

, I know you've run into that . How

0:29

do you do that Again ?

0:30

those prenatal visits are very important . It's

0:33

very important to have an understanding of

0:35

what the birthing person knows

0:38

, what that mother knows and what they

0:40

need . So I have

0:42

had the joy of partnering

0:44

up and teaming up with another doula

0:46

so we can cover so one doula acts

0:48

in the role as the support person and

0:51

I'll be in the role as a doula , or vice versa

0:53

I'm the support person and then the main

0:55

doula is doing the caring and providing

0:58

of the cares and providing the support . Other

1:00

situations I've cared for birthing people

1:02

and their moms being there , their sisters

1:05

, even their boyfriend , even the father

1:07

of the baby or a new relationship

1:09

. So it's really

1:11

important to establish a baseline

1:14

Like what is the

1:16

plan , what's going on ? here , Exactly

1:18

, exactly . I don't go in thinking when do I fit

1:20

Exactly ?

1:21

I'm not trying to take over , I'm just trying to

1:23

, you know , come in and help , exactly

1:25

Because that is the job .

1:27

My job is to fill in the gaps , not

1:29

override anything , not speak

1:31

for , advocate for , but

1:34

empower my mom

1:36

to speak up , empowering

1:39

the birthing person to speak up , and

1:41

if they're not able to speak up , come up

1:43

with very creative ways to have

1:45

their needs be met , without me necessarily

1:47

being the one talking . Sometimes it's the

1:50

partner , sometimes it's the support person . Okay

1:52

, when they come in , can

1:54

you please express what you express with

1:56

me , what you're seeing

1:59

, observing or what the birthing

2:01

person needs that they may not have that

2:03

support ? You know that kind of a thing . So

2:05

my job is really

2:07

it's kind of like okay , all right

2:09

, what's going on , you know , making sure everything is fine

2:11

. My job is to make sure that the atmosphere is positive . Positive , okay , all right , what's

2:13

going on ? You know , making sure everything is fine . My job is to make sure that the atmosphere

2:15

is positive , positive , informative , full

2:18

of love .

2:19

And you can feel that too , yes yes , you

2:21

can feel that when you walk into a room , if

2:23

it's tense or

2:26

if it's like scared , or

2:28

if it's okay , this is a safe

2:30

space , this is a positive space . Or if it's

2:32

okay , this is a safe space , this is a positive space . Everything that's going

2:35

on in this room is normal and

2:37

you're going to see some things and hear some things

2:39

, but just know we're here for support

2:42

. Yes , no judgment . Yes

2:44

, you know what I mean . Yes , you

2:46

know my doula .

2:47

Yes .

2:48

You know she did a really , really

2:50

great job , yes , so

2:52

what advice would you give

2:55

people that want to become

2:57

a doula , because I know you teach doulas .

2:59

Yes .

3:00

So you know , what advice or guidance

3:02

would you offer an aspiring doula

3:05

who is looking to get into the profession ?

3:07

So , first and foremost , know

3:10

your why . Remember your why

3:12

? Because when you show up and you're providing

3:15

care , sometimes

3:20

you'll be challenged by it . Sometimes you may have a situation the outcome didn't come out the

3:22

way , or you and your client , for whatever reason , things didn't go the way as planned and

3:24

it can be discouraging . But know your

3:26

why , hold on to your why , be reminded . Surround

3:29

yourself with other like-minded people . The

3:31

other thing , too , is in the process of

3:33

becoming a doula , make sure you're properly trained

3:36

, because right now doulas

3:38

are trending and

3:40

there's so many different types of doulas only

3:42

because there's so many things you can tack on with

3:44

it . You have doulas who can do aromatherapy

3:46

. You have doulas who are herbalists . You

3:49

have doulas who are like myself I'm a nurse

3:51

. You have doulas who

3:53

add a whole bunch of other things full spectrum

3:55

work , you know so they cover birth and death . I've

3:57

had the joy of being a nurse , having those experiences

4:00

, so that's where I got my firsthand

4:02

training . But there are so many different

4:04

things that you can do in addition to doula

4:07

work that can make you so unique

4:09

Staying up to date , knowing the trends

4:12

, knowing the people you're caring for , making

4:14

sure that you are providing a quality of care

4:16

that's unmatched . You

4:18

know that's unique to who you are . The other

4:21

thing is also making sure that your caseload

4:23

does not burn you out because

4:25

you're chasing the money . You know it's really important

4:28

that you're able to devote the

4:30

time because , like we were talking about

4:32

earlier , it

4:35

could take like maybe two to four hours , as if they're rip and roaring in labor

4:37

and everything's happening . But a lot of times

4:39

, you know , inductions are on the rise , so

4:42

moms are in the hospital for almost three days sometimes

4:44

. That is a long time

4:46

. So as a doula , you got to have a plan . You

4:49

got to make sure that your client is getting

4:52

everything that they need . You're getting what

4:54

you need . So it's like a balancing act

4:56

. So making sure that you're able to

4:58

have that check and balance and

5:00

then also sometimes surround yourself with other

5:02

you know , with some other doulas who know

5:05

you and you know them . Can you

5:07

come in and help me if ? I'm getting in a jam

5:09

yes , or if I'm going into that 16

5:11

, 18 hour every now and again I still

5:14

do like a 24 hour birth . But

5:16

you know , I've gotten better . I've gotten more skilled

5:18

at it and also gotten

5:20

better over the years , educating my

5:22

client to know what to expect so

5:24

that I can pace myself Like that book Know what to

5:27

Expect when You're Expecting Exactly

5:29

.

5:29

That's exactly what it is . I don't know how I remembered that

5:31

Well you probably was reading that book a lot

5:34

.

5:34

Chapter by chapter . I know I was

5:36

when I had my kid , because the interesting

5:38

thing is , when I became a mom and I

5:40

was pregnant with my first , it was

5:42

like all the things I knew kind of went

5:44

out the window , because it's like I'm in the driver's

5:46

seat now I'm not in the passenger seat . This

5:48

is how do I change a diaper . Well

5:50

, that I knew , because the nursing

5:53

part helped . But the thing that it's

5:55

so different when it happens to you versus

5:58

when you've been providing care to others . But I know

6:00

for a fact , when my baby was born and

6:03

I made it through on the other side , I

6:05

became even more passionate and

6:07

I was so grateful that I had the support

6:10

. But

6:14

that's because I've been giving that support all along the way , so I knew how to get it

6:16

.

6:16

So did you have a doula .

6:17

No , I was my own doula . So here's the interesting

6:20

thing , I know , I know , I know

6:22

.

6:22

You're very talented .

6:24

What was interesting was but

6:26

in . But to be honest with you , the visualization

6:29

I have is I saw all my clients , like

6:31

it was like the round table , and

6:33

I can see all their faces making

6:36

comments right Like yeah

6:38

you sure , chana , you ain't doing that

6:40

right , your attitude . So for

6:42

the first 11 hours of my labor I

6:44

did everything they told me to do and I didn't progress

6:46

. And I had to be induced because

6:48

they were concerned about preeclampsia . Everything

6:51

was beautiful . So I literally hit

6:53

the 38th week . My

6:56

blood pressure started creeping up and also

6:58

at this time I'm working at the hospital . I'm in labor

7:00

and delivery . Well , not quite at labor and delivery

7:02

. I was working on another unit , the oncology unit

7:04

, so that's really stressful . And you're talking about

7:07

12-hour days at least three times a week

7:09

and sometimes we have to work back to back to back three

7:11

days in a row .

7:11

Pregnant .

7:12

Yes , sometime overtime .

7:14

Nine months pregnant .

7:15

Exactly , worked all the way up until the end

7:17

, wow , and it got really

7:20

, really hard . But you know

7:22

your first time

7:24

, mom , what is rest , what

7:26

you know ? Yeah , the ankles getting a little swollen , and

7:29

you know it was little , little changes

7:31

, but the biggest change was that blood pressure

7:33

and my family practice doc was

7:36

like no , we're not going to take no chances with you

7:38

, we're going to get you induced . But they

7:40

forgot to tell me . So I'm going thinking they're

7:42

just going to check and monitor my baby . And they said

7:44

, oh welcome , you're getting induced . And I lost

7:46

it because my husband was at work . So

7:49

you know , fast forward , all this

7:52

. I'm doing everything they tell me to do and I go

7:54

from fingertip to two . I said

7:56

, forget this , I'm

7:58

going to take matters into my own hands . I soaked myself

8:00

in the tub . I couldn't

8:02

get the mesoprostol . They gave

8:04

me one dose . It was , you know , the contractions

8:07

was a lot , but it wasn't doing anything . I got

8:09

on Pitocin and I just labored

8:11

in the tub and I had my husband with me and I was talking

8:13

to him . I think he got tired and

8:15

I think his anxiety got the best of him because

8:17

he couldn't carry the load from me and

8:20

at one point he was like why don't you get checked ? I'm like

8:22

no , because if they tell me I'm four , I

8:26

don't know what I'm going to do . And

8:28

long and behold , I went from two to

8:30

eight . The nurse didn't

8:33

even believe it because I had a new resident

8:35

and she was like I don't believe it , let me check . And

8:38

then she said by golly , because I was begging her to

8:40

turn off the Pitocin because it was too intense , and

8:43

she didn't believe me . I'm a first-time mom . I don't know what

8:45

I'm talking about , but I have 10 years

8:47

of experience

8:49

. And then it was like let's , let's rupture you

8:51

. And I'm like no , I

8:54

did everything y'all wanted me to do . I'm

8:56

okay , give me my drugs . So

8:58

I got my IV medicine and it was like no

9:01

, but the baby could come real soon . I said look

9:03

, I've been in labor for quite some

9:05

time and nothing has happened . I'm at 14 now . What

9:08

are you talking about ? And it was awesome

9:10

because the medicine was just enough

9:13

to take . My

9:15

water broke on its own and when it broke I

9:17

was crowning Less than 30 minutes

9:20

of pushing . He was there .

9:21

Wow .

9:22

And that was the most empowering

9:24

thing . I was like you can't tell me anything

9:26

. I got to feel my baby move

9:28

. My baby was working hard

9:30

, just like mommy was working hard . So when

9:32

I got that personal data

9:35

for myself , I can

9:37

share that with the birthing person , I

9:41

can share that with the mothers that I'm caring for , that your

9:43

baby's also trying to come out too and y'all

9:45

work together at some point , and

9:47

that you're going to experience pain . But I'm

9:49

going to explain to you what the pain is . Pain

9:52

is progress . Certain types of pain is progress

9:54

. I'm going to empower you with tools

9:57

and you're going to give me the information

9:59

to let me know what you're feeling , and we're going to figure

10:01

out what's the best position .

10:03

So can you discuss the importance

10:05

of representation and diversity

10:07

within the doula community and

10:10

how it impacts the experiences

10:13

of birthing individuals ?

10:15

First and foremost , representation matters . When

10:17

I see my client , my patient

10:20

, who looks like me , it's like unspoken

10:22

common language

10:25

that unifies us , just like when you

10:27

see two black dudes you know they

10:29

, what's up that head nod

10:31

, right , you won't get that with your white

10:33

counterpart or another person

10:36

from another culture . You're not going to get that . It's unique

10:38

to black culture , right . And

10:41

I love when I see the

10:43

patients that I care for that look like

10:45

me . You could see the fear

10:48

lesson oh , she's here

10:50

to help me . Or when , I you know , get

10:52

assigned . I have people in the community that

10:54

refer and I heard about you

10:56

, you know , uchena , I also go by Nurse Uno

10:58

. I heard about you , nurse Uno , and I heard

11:00

about you . You know , uchena , I also go by Nurse Uno . I heard about you , nurse Uno , and I know you're a doula

11:02

. Can you help me ? And just knowing that I

11:04

can do that for them because I look like them

11:06

, there's a whole lot of

11:09

conversation I don't need to have with them because

11:11

we have common , you know

11:13

.

11:14

Commonalities Right .

11:15

And when we break bread it's even more so . And

11:18

that peace of mind of

11:20

having somebody that may have shared

11:23

experiences is enough to

11:25

reduce the anxiety

11:27

and the tension that they go on to have

11:29

a great birth experience , because

11:31

why Somebody that looks like me care

11:33

about me , somebody that knows what I'm

11:35

feeling ? They're feeling it too and

11:38

we're in it together .

11:38

That knows

11:41

what I'm feeling , they're feeling it too , and we're

11:43

in it together . So

11:50

, looking ahead , what changes or improvements would you like to see within the birthing

11:52

and doula community , particularly concerning inclusivity

11:55

and equity ?

11:59

I would like to see more collaboration If

12:04

we're going to change the way birthing

12:06

people are treated at the bedside . This

12:09

term called implicit bias meaning

12:11

I have

12:14

inherent

12:17

things that I know and don't know that

12:19

causes me to maltreat people that

12:21

don't look like me or may

12:23

not have the same economic

12:26

status like me or didn't

12:28

have a similar upbringing like me . It has

12:30

to stop Because at the end of the day

12:32

, that's a heartbeat that's beating and last time I

12:34

checked you got a heartbeat . Last time

12:36

I checked , your blood pulsates just like that

12:38

person's blood pulsates . Even

12:40

though the heart rate might be different , it's still

12:43

pulsating and we bleed red

12:45

. How is it that the color

12:48

of a person's skin determines

12:50

the kind of care that they get ? But

12:53

when anybody who is drawn to

12:55

health care , we're all trained

12:58

to help . So how do we turn

13:00

around as the healthcare professionals

13:02

and now stop caring

13:05

or start judging

13:07

or start maltreating ? So

13:09

we need to see the value in all

13:11

fields . Midwifery , because I'm

13:13

in midwifery school . The thing that blew my

13:15

mind . Midwifery is ancient

13:18

medicine . These

13:20

healthcare systems are new . Check

13:23

it Midwives

13:26

were the first doctors in

13:28

a community . Do we have them

13:30

like we did then ? No , we

13:33

got all these doctors . We got all these

13:35

nurses . We got all these health professions running

13:37

around here saying that they're giving good care , but

13:40

yet bodies are still

13:42

dying , people are still being

13:44

maltreated , and no one is targeting

13:46

that issue . We

13:50

have to as I'm a health care professional

13:52

because I joined in on the fight . We have to

13:54

check our biases . We have

13:56

to recognize that we have them for a reason

13:58

. We have to educate ourselves

14:01

and we have to come back into the space saying you know what

14:03

? I came into the space to make a difference

14:05

, not

14:08

to cause

14:10

divide , but bring some unification

14:12

. And yes , it's not going to be easy

14:15

, but over time it will get better . We

14:18

have people in the community who are joining in

14:20

on the fight , trying to help , but there's knowledge

14:22

gaps . So we got some education . That

14:24

needs to go on . We need to make

14:27

sure that the people who are tied to the work are

14:29

adequately paid . Most

14:31

doulas . I talked about

14:33

27 hours of labor support

14:36

. We're not talking about the hours

14:38

of prenatal visits . The

14:40

late night calls the postpartum

14:43

. Can you come over and help me with lactation ? There's

14:45

so much that we didn't talk about D-Star

14:47

.

14:48

I know because , um , I

14:50

did take advantage . Well , my wife

14:53

and I took advantage of those

14:55

services when we had a doula . Um

14:57

, it was more than just , you

14:59

know , your regular checkups . You know it's

15:02

actually more checkups with a doula

15:04

than it is with a regular doctor

15:06

and it's way more personable

15:09

. You know they're either coming to your

15:11

house or you're going to their house and

15:14

you sit down and you , you know it's

15:17

more about how are you doing

15:19

mentally Exactly . You know

15:21

so the doctor they're going to do , you know

15:24

their checks and after that they might

15:26

ask you a little bit of something , but you

15:28

know they'll send you down the road

15:30

and

15:37

then you're going to have to wait for about an hour . When you get there , you know , but with

15:39

a doula it's it's all about how are you doing , how are you doing ? You

15:41

know they actually like ask the man , like

15:44

how are you doing ? How are you

15:46

feeling ? Um , are you guys ? You know getting

15:48

along and you know how you know getting along and you

15:50

know how was you know how was the baby

15:52

and how was the kids , how was

15:54

the house , how was your life ?

15:56

You know like you get really really

15:58

, really personable and

16:00

it just helps when it

16:02

is time to go through that process

16:04

that there's trust

16:07

built , there's a familiarity , and

16:09

it just makes the process way

16:12

more smooth yes , and the beautiful

16:14

part about it is , as a doula , you become a part

16:17

of the life , absolutely of the family

16:19

, and I have clients who have done

16:21

births years ago and I still get pictures

16:23

, you know

16:25

, or or to just say , like that's my baby

16:27

that's our baby .

16:28

Yes , it's our baby .

16:29

Yes , it's our baby . Look at our baby . I don't know

16:31

how many birthday parties , baby

16:34

showers , all the things

16:36

you could go to one every day if you wanted to .

16:39

If you actually accepted all

16:41

of the invitations

16:43

.

16:43

Yes . Three years plus

16:45

deep , trying to meet all of them . But

16:48

the thing about all of it is it's a beautiful

16:50

thing , it's a sacred thing , because I wasn't there

16:52

when the baby was made

16:54

, but I get to be at their birthday party the

16:57

very first I call

16:59

. I feel like doulas are like quiet intruders

17:01

. You know we're there , you

17:03

know we're celebrating , we're ushering

17:06

in this next generation . I don't

17:08

take it lightly and

17:13

I am very protective over that mother and I want that mother to know how much of an

17:15

honor it is that they invited me into that space

17:17

. You know , and it

17:20

needs to be protected . You know

17:22

, and it has long lasting consequences . You

17:24

even talked about the gentleman you had on your show , how

17:26

it impacted him and , and , and , knowing

17:29

his birth story , it impacted him and and , and , knowing

17:31

his birth story , how he came , he repeated a cycle , not

17:38

knowing because of what he found out about himself . So it's like you know , there's

17:40

so much healing that can take place when things are done in such a dignified

17:43

manner , recognizing the shortcomings

17:45

, doing what we can . We don't have enough people

17:47

in healthcare that look like the

17:49

people that they serve in the community , so

17:52

doulas create a unique space where we can

17:54

train people , have people that look

17:57

like the community that they want to serve to

17:59

be in that space , while we're still working

18:01

on training nurses and doctors that look

18:03

like the communities that they want to serve .

18:06

So , Uchenna

18:08

, what's next for you ?

18:12

What's next ? Man ? I

18:15

can't even begin to piece

18:17

it all together , but I am excited

18:19

that in a very little while

18:22

and I don't want to give

18:24

timelines just yet because you know I

18:26

got to get through the process but I'm so

18:28

excited and I look forward to being a provider . I've

18:31

been in the community , I've been a nurse for over 14

18:33

years . I love the role

18:35

, the different roles that I've been given

18:37

in my career as a nurse at

18:39

bedside . Now as a nurse in

18:42

the community in partnership

18:44

with United Way , really seeing

18:46

the same issue but from a whole different lens

18:48

, a whole different angle , and actually

18:50

being at the table strategizing

18:52

, figuring out how can we

18:54

solve this problem . Because

18:56

one of the things that I want to say while

19:00

I have the mic and thank you , d-star

19:02

, for giving me the mic is in Madison-Dane

19:04

County in particular , there's 600 , a

19:07

little over 600 births by

19:10

black birthing people . There

19:12

is enough money in

19:14

Madison to transform

19:16

600 black birthing

19:19

people . And

19:21

the challenge that I am going to pose

19:24

on the health systems , on

19:26

doulas , on

19:28

nurses , obgyns , family practice , everybody

19:31

who's connected to the work which side are

19:33

you on ? Are you a gatekeeper

19:35

or are you a guardian ? Are you a gatekeeper

19:38

or are you a guardian ?

19:39

So how do people get in contact

19:42

with you , how do they acquire your

19:44

services ?

19:45

If you know somebody that know me , that's a great place

19:47

. No , I'm in the process of working on . I have

19:49

a Facebook page called a doula just for you . That's

19:51

the name of my business Cause that's exactly

19:53

what I am . I'm a doula just for you and

19:57

, feel free , you can email me at a doula

19:59

just for you , F ? O ? R for the four

20:01

you at gmailcom . I

20:03

work at United way , Dane County . You can reach

20:05

out there too . I would like to think I'm easily

20:07

accessible . I am very involved in the community

20:10

. There's so many ways to reach out . I'm on

20:12

Facebook , Instagram I

20:15

don't know about all the other stuff . I'm still trying

20:17

to navigate some systems there and social

20:19

media different types of social media , I should say

20:21

, but it's not hard .

20:23

Well , Uchena , I really appreciate

20:25

you for stopping by the podcast today .

20:27

Thank you for having me D-Star , it's been

20:29

an honor no-transcript

21:31

.