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This episode of Retronauts is brought to

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you by Squarespace, the all-purpose DIY

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alike. This week

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on Retronauts, that one time an

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adventuring party hunted down a clown by

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literally following a horse's ass. Hello

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and salutations! I am Nadia Oxford,

0:40

your host for this week's episode

0:42

of Retronauts. Hello. I'm

0:45

here to talk to you all about a very

0:47

important 20-year anniversary, Dragon Quest VIII. I

0:49

know, I can't believe it either. Dragon Quest VIII,

0:51

like 20 years now, we're talking

0:53

about five years at the most here. But, you

0:56

know, I don't make the rules of

0:59

time, apparently. So, yeah, this PlayStation 2

1:01

RPG classic, it made some pretty big

1:03

changes to Dragon Quest games as

1:05

a whole, especially as to how they were

1:07

localized and received in the West, which is

1:10

a impression that persists to this very

1:12

day. This is a very cool and overwhelming

1:14

topic, which is why it is a good

1:16

thing I have my good friend, Derek

1:19

Bittner, of Good Vibes Gaming to talk

1:21

to me about Dragon Quest VIII. Hello

1:24

for... Hello and thanks for joining

1:26

me, Derek. How are you doing? I am

1:28

doing very well. Thank you for the invite

1:31

because I have

1:33

gotten fascinated by Dragon Quest over the

1:35

years, I gotta say, and VIII is

1:37

an interesting topic. Like, it's

1:39

a very much a linchpin game, I feel, at least

1:41

for the Western audience. Absolutely. Like,

1:43

we'll get a little bit more into the

1:45

history of Dragon Quest, like, on a personal

1:48

level, but very briefly, are you, like,

1:50

a new fan or an old fan? I am...

1:53

I guess I'm mostly a new fan because

1:55

I played a little

1:57

bit of VIII when I came out. I played... 11

2:01

and just fell in love with that one. Actually, nine

2:03

was the first one. The first Dragon Quest I fully

2:06

completed and really fell in love with that one. Was

2:09

able to play 10 and then 11 came out and

2:11

was like, oh, this is really good. And it gave

2:14

me an interest. So I actually went back and

2:16

played the original Dragon Quest and just recently beat

2:19

Dragon Quest 2. It's one of my goals to

2:21

actually go through the entire Dragon Quest series

2:24

and see more. But every time I

2:26

play it, whether it's the Dragon Quest

2:28

heroes, Dragon Quest builders, it

2:30

is so charming that I can't

2:32

help but really love the series. And I think

2:35

once you sort of take hold of Dragon

2:37

Quest, you wish for its success, like bigger

2:39

success in the West. Absolutely.

2:42

Actually, now that you mentioned it, yes, my husband and

2:44

I, we have been watching your Dragon Quest videos and

2:46

they are really excellent. And we just watched the one

2:48

where you went to Dragon Quest 2. And if

2:51

you got the Dragon Quest last Dragon Warrior 2

2:53

on the NES, you are prepared for everything

2:55

that the series will throw at you. The

2:58

only other one that I'm worried about is when I eventually

3:00

get to 7, because I will

3:03

say I'm going to try my best to play the

3:05

original versions of all of them, which means I'm playing

3:07

PS1 version of 7 and oh, dear. Yeah,

3:11

not even I've touched the PS1 version of 7.

3:13

I have done the 3DS version

3:15

and I liked it quite a bit, but I

3:17

understand why people are, you know, it's not really

3:19

their favorite one. But I enjoyed

3:21

parts of it quite a bit. I think you'll

3:23

like it. I am curious to see how you

3:25

like it from a PlayStation perspective, especially

3:28

since the game that we're talking about now

3:30

is so different from Dragon Quest

3:32

7, which was kind

3:34

of estranged a lot of people from the series, I

3:36

think, especially in the West. Dragon

3:39

Quest 7 was a very kind of muted slash

3:41

retro-looking game, retro-playing

3:43

game even, like in the

3:46

age of 3D polygonal RPGs

3:49

that were hugely cinematic like Final

3:51

Fantasy 7. It did look a little bit

3:53

rundown. Is that why you kind of passed on

3:55

Dragon Quest 7 the first time, Derek, if you remember?

3:58

I mean, I was into RPG. RPGs, but I

4:00

was very much focused. Final Fantasy VII was

4:02

my first RPG, so I was very much

4:04

focused on Square. Anything

4:07

Square is getting, but they weren't combined

4:09

with Enix yet. Dragon Warrior

4:13

VII just completely passed me by, and it wasn't

4:15

until I looked at it later and heard

4:18

everybody sort of talk about its weaknesses

4:20

and just how long and dragged out

4:22

it is, which differs

4:25

from a playstyle point,

4:27

but it's also fascinating as I've

4:29

looked ahead and sort

4:31

of prepared for these later videos. Dragon

4:34

Quest VII came out in, I

4:36

believe, 2000, the

4:38

same year as Final Fantasy IX. And if you

4:41

look at a screenshot of Dragon Quest VII, which

4:43

looks straight out of the SNDS, and look at

4:45

Final Fantasy IX, to me

4:47

it's no wonder that nobody in

4:49

the West really paid attention to it. Yeah,

4:52

yeah, I hate to say it, but you're absolutely right.

4:54

Especially since VII did not look

4:56

like much of a graphical upgrade

4:58

from VI, which was a very

5:00

impressive game at its own rate, because I think that was

5:03

the first Dragon Quest game where it got animated enemy sprites,

5:06

but they kind of had the same meager

5:09

animations on the PlayStation, and I don't think people were

5:11

very fond of that in that day and age, 2000,

5:14

so we were very close to the PS2 by that

5:16

point. Yeah, it wasn't taking long

5:18

at all, but I mean, Square

5:21

did go hard with Dragon Quest VIII. Not

5:23

only this is being 3D and all the

5:25

changes we'll get into, but they packaged the

5:27

demo for Final Fantasy XII with it. That's

5:30

right, yes. Back

5:32

in the day, children, the way that people

5:35

used to kind of at least attempt to

5:37

sell their games was to put the demo,

5:39

like put demo discs in for very anticipated

5:41

games with games that might otherwise never get

5:43

a second glance. I think

5:46

Total Number One in Final Fantasy

5:48

VII was probably the most popular

5:50

example, although Total Number One certainly

5:52

has its defenders, and rightfully

5:54

so, I hear. I mean, I

5:56

think this is why most people are aware of Zone

5:58

of the Enders, because it packs

6:00

the MGS2 demo with it. I

6:04

wasn't aware of the hype for Final Fantasy VII,

6:06

so I completely missed Toeball, but I was very

6:08

much aware of, oh hey, I should check out

6:10

this Brave Fencing Massage because it comes with the

6:12

Final Fantasy VIII demo, and I'm very excited for

6:14

that. I forgot about that pair-up, yeah. And

6:17

I guess Brave Fencing Massage was actually a pretty

6:19

good game to be packed with. Yeah,

6:21

it's actually very enjoyable. It's very different from

6:23

your typical square RPG, but it works as

6:25

sort of an action sort of thing. And

6:27

in retrospect, kind of, oh,

6:31

I'm blanking on his name, but the

6:33

Art of the Mystical Ninja Goemon, there it

6:35

is. Yeah. Kind of Goemon-

6:37

Konami dude, yeah. In retrospect. Yeah.

6:40

Absolutely. But yeah, that demo kind of pulled

6:42

me in, and I was seeing all the graphics, and at that point

6:44

I was really into the preview

6:46

culture, and it's like, huh, this is

6:48

looking pretty interesting. I should check this

6:50

out. Yeah,

7:00

I feel like Square Enix was hitting a high

7:02

point by

7:26

that point. We had Dragon Quest VIII, we had Final

7:28

Fantasy XII. We

7:30

were having some good times. And Dragon

7:33

Quest VIII, Journey of the Cursed King, that

7:35

is the full name, came out on November

7:37

27th, 2004 in Japan. And

7:41

almost a year later, November 15th, 2005, in

7:44

North America, and that could be because it did

7:46

a lot of extensive localization here. Developer,

7:48

this is very interesting, Developer IV,

7:50

Dragon Quest VIII was level five,

7:53

the House of Layton itself. I

7:56

think that's what drew me in as well, because at that point I'd

7:58

become a Level Five fan. The

8:00

Laden you had your armed. The Dark Cloud

8:02

games are they were just sort of taken

8:04

off as this new big developer that is

8:07

like all the working on this game as

8:09

well. oh that's cool and it's like at

8:11

them on the whatever look so gorgeous. They

8:13

were just sort of accuser crafted especially with

8:16

those I'm. Cel shaded

8:18

Rpgs. Yeah, that's right, I

8:20

didn't, They didn't You know? Clooney? Correct Yes,

8:22

they would garner least one of them

8:24

with me and I think sometime after

8:27

this was of Brogues galaxy on Ps.

8:29

To. I've not play down by

8:31

do remember it. They also had

8:33

an office around the same time. I'm

8:35

sad to see life which at the

8:37

in it is rarely record this now

8:39

sea level five sign. A call out of

8:41

a very, very. Long slumber/hibernation where they were

8:44

like you the new hotness during a

8:46

time of of Dragon Quest. Eight in

8:48

the certainly deserve the title, but they

8:51

kind of. Sell. Out of

8:53

favor for quite awhile, and I'm not

8:55

entirely sure why. Maybe.

8:57

They went to the late and well

8:59

on too many times have declined to

9:01

cattle Bailey who is our house. The

9:03

Acts of Lazard podcast alongside myself I

9:06

see says they really mess up the

9:08

condom lights and something fierce and seen

9:10

that did not help. Yeah,

9:12

I think they also aims. To

9:15

hard to quit one yolk I watched as

9:17

Euchre watches has huge they would be was

9:19

yams massive in Japan. didn't quite take off

9:21

the same in the west but it was

9:24

just everywhere in Japan. With the nigga I

9:26

think they got for sequels are yeah for

9:28

some yes and like just a couple years

9:30

and. He chooses a

9:32

different streams. Why? Pokemon with ended up not

9:34

being a bad but Uk was signed his

9:36

even though I know there's a lot to

9:38

a love it but it's one of those

9:40

things like they were too hard on it

9:42

they did. He need is a space out

9:44

give it time to breathe and really that

9:46

people get excited. His new release The Daylights

9:48

know this printing money we gotta get it

9:51

out there is a bit him. Hard.

9:53

Unfortunately, Yeah I will say I

9:55

do. enjoy the api watts final fantasy fourteen

9:57

of answer comes round every couple years

10:00

Everyone on the field hunting Yokai is actually a lot

10:02

of fun, but beyond that, Yokai

10:05

Watch was not really something that I

10:07

found extremely interesting. I found the gameplay

10:09

a little bit juvenile. And yeah, there

10:12

was that. I feel like Professor Layton,

10:14

I adore Professor Layton, except I think

10:16

it peaked at Unwound Future, which there's

10:19

just no better Layton story than that one for me.

10:22

Oh, not even close. I mean, they're

10:24

still fun in their own ways, but 3 is definitely

10:27

the peak. I mean, I would

10:29

never have expected a Layton game to make me cry.

10:32

Oh, man. It just broke my heart. And

10:35

it's a bit of a shame because it took such

10:37

a long time for Layton to

10:39

finally have specialized Canadian localizations where

10:42

we have the metric system in

10:44

the puzzles, please and thank you, not having to

10:46

deal with American Imperial system. And

10:49

unfortunately,

10:52

that's when the series kind of went

10:54

to sleep. But it's emerging like cicadas,

10:56

I suppose. And yeah,

10:59

the CEO of Level 5

11:01

is and apparently always has

11:03

been Akihiro Hino, who

11:05

was a director on

11:08

Dragon Quest 8 as well. I

11:10

don't think I realized that. I mean, they went all out.

11:13

To be honest, working on Dragon Quest is probably

11:16

the big thing you can do in

11:18

Japan. Yeah, I mean, after that.

11:21

Actually, when I went to go preview Dragon Quest XI

11:24

for the U.S. Gamer back in the day,

11:26

I actually went to Japan for that. And

11:28

I was sitting in the airport waiting to go

11:30

home, and a woman came up to

11:33

me because she was doing kind of a

11:35

survey for foreigners about Japan

11:37

and the Olympics coming up. And

11:40

she's asking me why are you here? And

11:42

I said, oh, I came to see the

11:44

Dragon Quest game. And she was like, oh.

11:47

You know exactly what that

11:49

was, even though she was obviously an office worker. I thought that

11:51

was really funny. I've

11:54

seen old pictures of The

11:57

lines for Dragon Quest III. It

12:00

it's it's. It's amazing

12:02

how much that series of just clicked with

12:04

Japan and you can see why because it's

12:07

the originator it done so much ah for

12:09

it was like is where does it get

12:11

out now because you you sort of you

12:13

drank less as I guess the throwback to

12:15

the old school rpg is a bit but

12:17

back in the day it was the for

12:19

run it's absolutely hundred yeah and. It's

12:22

it's it's sort of. I don't

12:24

exactly know when they're since happens

12:26

where it wasn't bad Rpg that

12:28

pushed everything forward by any. Obviously,

12:30

it's still incredibly loved. Ah, A

12:32

To the point that American started

12:34

hearing about the fact that bikes

12:36

out of the government meaty law

12:38

that the cameras leader on on

12:40

weekdays because people skip school and

12:42

work. and I did find out

12:44

that that actually is not true.

12:46

He was actually decision by using

12:49

Hori because even when people get

12:51

in trouble for doing that, With

12:53

us it's funny. I see remember that kind

12:55

of thing like even that Monday that was

12:57

printed and like Nintendo Power Cell I'll is

13:00

one of those little bits of playground knowledge

13:02

he can a captain like in your back

13:04

pocket. Impressive all the for the internet. Via.

13:07

Back when there's like else crevice

13:09

fact checkers. Now the ssssss. A

13:11

split. You're right. I think I'm

13:13

ever hearing that as. Wasn't.

13:15

Quite a law. But yeah. third l A How you do

13:17

I do that You know what? to the. Is

13:20

kind of Yoshi P. Delaying.

13:22

The. Dontrelle expansions held

13:25

it up the aisle during Dlc

13:27

comes out a. So I agree. I

13:29

appreciate that because I still need to get through

13:31

and walker I want to try to be day

13:33

in day with fourteen That with Dontrelle Cel. Oh

13:35

man what a great expanse and given have to

13:37

wait another month lease. Time

13:40

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Dihino. Have you ever played, I think

16:48

it's a little bit of a diversion, have you ever

16:50

played the, what

16:53

was it called? Mystery Room.

16:56

It wasn't a series, but the Mystery Room game featuring

16:59

Professor Layton's son, Alfendi. I've

17:02

heard of it, but I've never played it because I

17:04

feel like I don't play mobile games too often. And

17:06

I saw that and I'm like, I'm kind

17:08

of offended. I had the idea that how they, how the heck

17:10

did he have a son? It's sort of, I was as

17:13

an unwell future fan.

17:15

I'm like, no, what

17:17

happened? And it is such

17:19

an interesting question because everything about the

17:22

game is screwed up. And

17:24

I really, really wanted answers and I

17:26

don't think they're forthcoming. I'm very angry about

17:28

that. I think doesn't that,

17:31

that character get a reference in

17:33

the Lady Layton game or something

17:35

like that. I feel like they've,

17:38

I've not played that one either, but I

17:40

feel like they attempted to make

17:43

those both work because, you know, we got Layton's

17:45

daughter and we got Layton's son now. So yeah,

17:48

I'm not sure how it works. I don't know the, I

17:51

don't know the answer. I just, my guess is that

17:53

he just grabbed orphans off the

17:55

street. That feels

17:57

fine to me. I'm okay with that. Just short.

18:00

Take some orphans. That's all good. Grab a handful of

18:02

orphans from the gutter. They're all over the place in

18:04

Victorian England. To me, there is no way

18:06

they're acknowledging any of that when it comes to the next latent

18:08

game. No, and I'm really hoping they

18:10

will, but I know it's just a hope against hope. Of

18:14

course, you know, you have the rest of

18:16

the, quote unquote, Dragon Quest dream team on

18:18

this. UG Hori is one of the game's

18:20

writers and scenario directors. The

18:22

late, great Akira Toriyama is the

18:24

character designer slash monster artist, and

18:27

we'll get into that, but still

18:30

reeling from that loss, just I'm never going to

18:32

get over that one. It's

18:35

far too soon, and it just makes you wonder,

18:37

like, what do they

18:39

do for this point on? Like, I have

18:41

to assume that probably most of his designs

18:43

are in the can for Dragon Quest XII.

18:46

I would assume so, yeah. But what's it

18:48

mean for beyond that? For a game that's a

18:50

series that's so traditional and so set

18:53

in its way to not have that dream team of

18:56

Toriyama and Sugiyama, and say what you were about

18:58

Sugiyama and the later point of his life and

19:00

just his politics in general, but he was sort

19:02

of the, a pillar of

19:04

the series for so long. He was, yeah. He's

19:07

gone, Toriyama's gone. UG Hori is standing

19:10

firm. May

19:13

he reign for many, many more decades.

19:16

But for now, we have

19:19

this team together on Dragon Quest VIII,

19:21

and actually Sugiyama, I would

19:23

say this is one of his best soundtracks. Three

19:27

and eight, I think, are my favorite works by

19:29

him. And it says

19:31

something that Dragon Quest VIII, sorry, Dragon

19:34

Quest XI, as

19:36

much as I adore that game, they let you

19:38

download the overworld theme from VIII, and there's

19:40

a reason for that because the overworld theme

19:42

for XI is just so horrible. But

19:45

I love replacing it with VIII. It

19:47

just really, really ups the adventure,

19:50

the sense of adventure in that game

19:52

because Dragon Quest

19:54

VIII was such a, it

19:57

was much more open and free feeling

19:59

than any Dragon Quest game to

20:01

that point. Can you actually remind

20:03

me how you got into

20:05

8 specifically? Because I know you're kind of

20:07

like going back and forth with the

20:10

series right now. So how did you kind of get into 8? I

20:14

specifically discovered 8 because

20:16

I was still a huge RPG fan

20:18

in the PS2 era. I was looking

20:20

forward to what comes next. And a

20:22

lot of previews were talking about 8.

20:24

And how Dragon Quest

20:26

was just this big thing. And it was like,

20:28

oh cool. There's all

20:31

these changes because

20:34

I was raised on Final Fantasy. So I'm

20:36

used to seeing my party. I'm used to

20:38

seeing them attack the monsters and not have

20:40

that for certain games. Like when I saw

20:42

stuff for Earthbound or older Dragon Quest, I'm

20:44

like, I don't know about

20:46

this. But actually being able to see your characters, see

20:48

them doing the attacks, that kind of drew me in.

20:50

And then just like, again, the

20:52

level 5 connection. And then the fact

20:54

that it was just this beautiful cel-shaded.

20:57

It drew you in. And being a

20:59

Dragon Ball fan, it's like, OK, yeah.

21:01

I see the style now. I want

21:03

to see this. I want to take

21:05

part in this. And it's extremely charming,

21:07

even though I never finished the original

21:09

PS2 version. I got pulled

21:12

away in that way you always get pulled away

21:14

with RPG. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. I know

21:17

the way. It's the way, for sure. I

21:21

wish it wasn't, but it is. Every

21:23

RPG fan knows that feeling. Yeah.

21:26

As for myself, I did not have a

21:29

PlayStation 2. But at the time, I was

21:31

really getting into the Dragon Quest revival that

21:33

was going on in the West. Basically,

21:36

I had been a Dragon Quest fan my whole life.

21:38

And when I was a little girl, of

21:40

course, the series kind of stopped coming over here to

21:43

the West. So I never really forgot about it. But I

21:45

kind of lost interest in favor

21:47

of Final Fantasy and Breath of Fire and

21:49

the 16-bit RPGs. I didn't really think that

21:51

actually did make it here. And

21:55

then around the time, I think that

21:57

Pokemon started to become big, you

21:59

got... taking more of a

22:01

chance on like, hey Dragon Quest monsters kids come

22:04

over here. And with that, they

22:06

started releasing things like the Dragon

22:09

Quest, sorry the Dragon Warrior ports

22:12

for the Game Boy and the

22:14

really excellent Dragon Warrior 3 for

22:17

the Game Boy Color. I

22:20

have that, absolutely recommend it. But

22:23

I didn't have a PS2 so I was kind of salty

22:25

about Dragon Quest 8 I guess and just kind of pretended

22:27

it didn't exist. But then I

22:30

spent like a weekend with my friend out in like

22:33

the boondocks of Ontario and

22:35

while she was spending the day

22:37

trying to download Half-Life 2 of

22:39

her dial up on Steam. Oh no.

22:42

I was just like, oh hey Dragon Quest,

22:44

can I play Dragon Quest on your PS2? She's like sure

22:46

of course. And I was

22:48

just like, wow I cannot

22:50

believe how freaking incredible this game is.

22:52

It looks great, it sounds great. Has

22:56

really British voice acting which took a minute to

22:58

kind of get used to. But

23:00

I was quite impressed and very

23:03

much back baby into Dragon Quest. I did

23:05

get a PS2 eventually. I

23:08

don't think I finished the game on the PS2

23:10

even though I bought it for that. But

23:14

I did finish it on the 3DS

23:16

when the 3DS version came out

23:18

and there was a mobile version as well. I think

23:20

there still is. You play it with one hand, that's

23:22

how it was formulated. It's like you

23:24

know, portrait. Is it portrait

23:26

or lens? Yes, portrait

23:28

orientation. It's not great

23:31

but it's something. If you really

23:33

want that, like the 3DS version I would

23:35

say is probably the definitive way to play

23:37

the game. It's missing

23:39

some things but it's also- You lose that

23:41

on the soundtrack, the graphics aren't quite as

23:43

good. But there are some quality of life

23:45

improvements that do make it the definitive version.

23:48

I think so. The orchestrated soundtrack, that's

23:50

something we'll get into because that falls

23:52

into the localization which was really fantastic.

23:55

But you lose that with the 3DS version

23:58

but you do- have

24:00

great quality of life improvements like oh

24:02

my gosh you can see enemies on

24:04

the field now you don't have to

24:06

run into random encounters god bless oh

24:09

it's oh it's that's such a magical

24:11

feeling at first i kind of missed it when they started

24:13

getting those encounters because like well now

24:15

it doesn't feel as important because now i can avoid

24:17

everything i like i kind of like i'm not grinding

24:20

anymore that feels weird how am i leveling up my

24:22

characters but every time it's like oh god i could

24:24

just pick and choose when i want to grind you

24:27

kind of adjust to it a bit but yeah dragon quest

24:29

they certainly had the old school uh at

24:32

least on ps2 had the old school run

24:34

into your encounters as uh much

24:36

as possible i i don't i'm

24:39

curious i don't remember how bad the encounter

24:41

rate was i think it

24:43

was original it was like perfectly reasonable

24:45

thankfully uh you did have some enemies you could

24:47

see on the field and those were the ones

24:49

he could i believe take into the arena and

24:52

uh yeah so uh

24:54

those ones you knew were very special but otherwise

24:57

everything else was just kind of out there and

24:59

kicking your ass it was a pretty grand i

25:01

should mention that this was

25:03

the first official dragon quest like

25:06

no more dragon warrior dragon warriors out

25:08

dragon warrior is cancelled uh

25:11

what had happened originally was dragon

25:13

quest was trademarked by um some

25:15

pen and paper company

25:17

for until 1982 then tsr bought it

25:19

and had the stee copyright forever i

25:22

don't know if it expired but either

25:24

case uh square enix finally applied for

25:26

it and got it yeah

25:28

thank god i

25:54

i miss dragon warrior like i think the

25:56

last dragon warrior game quote unquote was dragon

25:59

warrior 3 which I mentioned

26:01

for the Game Boy color. And I'm

26:03

looking at the box art for that

26:05

now, and that is such an interesting

26:07

game because the Dragon War, your name

26:09

is 100% like American, you

26:12

know, old localization. And

26:15

the artwork is very

26:17

Akira Toriyama, whereas the artwork, per

26:20

se, the Dragon Quest one and

26:22

two collection on the Game Boy were these really

26:24

horrible computer renders

26:26

that are really you remember, right? I

26:28

was just like, Oh, it looks like a game

26:31

for kindergartners. Why do you do that? I

26:33

think they realized that by Dragon

26:36

Warrior three's release that Oh, Americans

26:38

love Dragon Ball, we need to capitalize

26:41

on this. Yeah, yeah. Have

26:45

you taken like a really good look at

26:48

the Western box art for the Dragon Warrior games

26:50

you're playing right now? I have

26:52

actually. It's interesting because at

26:55

first I'm like, I will

26:58

always gravitate towards the Japanese box art when

27:00

it comes to those. But

27:02

it's also fascinating when I was really looking

27:04

at the Dragon Warrior one box art for

27:06

the American side, they're essentially the

27:08

same. It's just completely in style. It's

27:10

a warrior fighting off a dragon, but

27:12

the styles are completely different, where it's

27:15

more traditional. And then Dragon

27:17

Quest two, three and four, I think all

27:19

just went with treasure as their box art.

27:22

Yes, you're right. No, sorry, Dragon Quest

27:24

two, Dragon Warrior two, it has an

27:26

absolutely metal box art where somebody

27:29

I can't remember the name of the artist, but

27:31

they were from Japan. They basically took Akira

27:33

Toriyama's characters and made them

27:35

into like, I guess what they assumed

27:38

the West wanted to see out of

27:40

fantasy heroes. So you have

27:42

these classic characters of like, Lotus

27:44

descendants, except they're all depicted as

27:46

like, 80s

27:48

western fantasy. Like, I'm

27:50

looking at it now. And yeah, that is

27:53

absolutely the case. It is fascinating taking a

27:55

closer look at this, because one,

27:58

you got the hero. who typically

28:00

has like a pilot's cap on, but now they give

28:02

him a horn helmet like in Dragon Warrior 1. Yes.

28:06

But he does have the symbol of, I will

28:08

always say Erdrick. It's Erdrick

28:10

in my mind. I know it's supposed to be Lodo from

28:13

Japanese version, but I think

28:15

I prefer Erdrick. It has been

28:17

retconned back to Erdrick, so you're okay.

28:19

Yeah. And then, but it has

28:21

that symbol, but then behind him, you can see

28:23

Hargon in Americanized version. First, I've

28:25

really looked this closely. And then behind it,

28:28

there's Malraut. I'm like, holy crap. They went

28:30

all out for this. Isn't it cool?

28:32

And like the hero has like a WWE

28:34

belt, like with the symbol on

28:36

it. Brother. No,

28:39

it is pretty, it is great box art. That's

28:42

way better than I remember. But

28:45

yeah, I think for three and four,

28:47

they went very simple after that point,

28:49

right? They just treasure. Three, yeah. Three

28:51

is actually one of my favorite box arts of all

28:53

time because it has like the, one of the dragon

28:56

orbs, which is something, you know, you'll collect in the

28:58

game, surrounded by what

29:00

is actually like weapons that you see

29:02

in the game and Toriyama has designed,

29:04

but again, it has been westernized and

29:07

it's just like a really nice collage

29:09

of fantasy stuff. Four is

29:11

just someone drew a sword, someone

29:13

did the sword. Cool. Yeah,

29:16

I'm looking at the, since I haven't played three yet,

29:18

so I'm not fully aware of the weapons, but yeah,

29:20

it is all just about all

29:23

of those. Oh yeah,

29:25

they do have Erdrick's sword right there in the foreground.

29:28

That's, wow. There is

29:30

way more effort placed on these box arts

29:32

than the typical localizations

29:35

for RPGs. For sure. I

29:38

mean, it matches the sword you have. It's just. That's

29:41

a Canadian sword. It's fine. Yeah,

29:43

it does its job. Honestly, there's a

29:45

thing I've been wondering for a while and I don't

29:47

know why it didn't happen, but I

29:49

feel like Dragon Warrior, Dragon Quest, what have

29:51

you, could be somewhat, would have been so

29:53

much bigger in the west if

29:56

five had come out. Because SNES

29:58

is when RPGs. truly

30:00

took off. And you

30:02

have one of the all-time greats with Dragon Quest

30:04

V and it never came to the West until

30:07

the DS. Yeah,

30:09

officially with the DS. I did play like

30:11

a fan translation before that

30:13

and it was certainly wasn't

30:15

as impressive looking as say Chrono Trigger or

30:17

Final Fantasy VI, but gameplay wise it is

30:20

one of the deepest RPGs on the system.

30:23

I always had a theory myself and I wrote this

30:25

up for US Gamer way back in the day that

30:27

Nintendo should not have taken the

30:30

time to when they

30:32

localized Dragon Quest I for the

30:34

West like they really went all out as you

30:36

know. I feel like

30:38

they should have taken that time and effort and used

30:40

it to localize Dragon Quest III because by the

30:43

time we got Dragon Quest I, Japan was getting

30:45

Dragon Quest III which is a much

30:48

better game, much

30:50

more engaging. It still holds up today. I wonder

30:53

if maybe RPGs would have had like a better chance

30:55

if we'd had that instead and of course it looks

30:57

a lot better than Dragon Quest I. Yeah,

31:00

that is an interesting alternate timeline

31:02

there because look what Final

31:04

Fantasy did. They skipped like from one to two.

31:06

It's like well let's get to two and three.

31:08

Let's get to the really good one that's like

31:11

has a better chance and it

31:13

seemed to work for them. It did. I mean

31:15

we all forgot how to count for a while but otherwise it

31:17

was a it was all pretty great. Yeah.

31:21

It's so interesting that just that delayed

31:23

release schedule might have been what that

31:25

was the death knell of five because it was just

31:27

too late because probably four came out really late in

31:29

the NES's lifespan. It did.

31:31

I think also by the time

31:34

four was done and or

31:36

the SNES became a thing, Enix of America

31:38

had to close up. I

31:41

forgot about that. Yeah, so there was

31:43

like no one really around to localize the

31:45

games. I think even like Illusion of Guy

31:47

was localized by Nintendo. Hmm.

31:50

Oh yeah. It's a shame but

31:52

I think that's what makes Strang Quest 8 all the

31:54

more important because it was it's it's it's

31:56

the push. It's it's square and he's trying

31:58

to make the pipe. for this series

32:01

as big in the West as it is

32:03

ever in Japan is actually the

32:05

first Dragon Quest game my

32:07

mainline Dragon Quest game to hit power regions

32:11

sport be They had

32:13

a rough back in the day Did

32:15

like I know they had terror enigma

32:17

which I absolutely adore But I understand

32:20

like just the pain of being left

32:22

behind then it had to hurt

32:24

like I was that's where I was Was when I

32:26

got the GameCube instead of the ps2 and missed

32:29

out on like one of the best rpd generations

32:31

of all time I'm

32:33

so sorry I mean you got some good ones in

32:35

there, but not not as many as would you would

32:37

have had on the ps2? No,

32:40

I mean it was worth it for

32:42

Metroid Prime, but otherwise Yeah,

32:45

good old GameCube Enjoy

32:48

your tales of Symphonia and skies of

32:50

Arcadia legends I didn't think I played

32:52

those I think I gave up by that point. I

32:54

was just so like oh god I

33:45

Do you remember the commercial for Dragon Quest

33:47

8 because there was a commercial I Don't

33:50

think I do I don't know if I've ever seen it it

33:52

had I just remember weird vines growing out of a

33:55

sink I mean, I think it was supposed to

33:57

your efforts to the vines that When

33:59

you get up to the castle that's been

34:01

cursed, the aforementioned cursed castle, the

34:03

cursed king or whatever, is

34:06

covered in thorns. So for some reason, that was

34:08

part of the commercial. And it was that

34:11

was strange to me because Canada

34:13

did not get a lot of commercials for

34:15

RPGs. Like I did not know for years

34:17

that there was like commercials

34:19

with MOG and about Final Fantasy and stuff like

34:21

that. Like that was just complete news to me

34:24

when I got on the internet. But we got

34:26

this one for some reason and it was like,

34:28

okay, fine. Yeah,

34:31

I'm watching a

34:33

commercial now and it's all it's all gameplay just

34:35

talking to you know, having I don't have the

34:37

sound or anything like that. But it's yeah, it

34:40

definitely seems like it's surprisingly all gameplay with

34:42

just a few things about like, you know,

34:45

here's the plot line, got this curse kingdom,

34:47

we got a hero stepping up, they make

34:49

a very pointed point of

34:51

showing the main character at his

34:53

100% tension. Yeah, tension

34:55

thing, definitely a big big deal here.

34:58

And then of course, including the demo for

35:01

Final Fantasy 12. So yeah, they I

35:03

think they were really trying to show off look how pretty it is.

35:05

And got Dragon

35:08

Ball connections and then hey, Final Fantasy

35:10

connection. So it does feel like a

35:12

big push for people. Yeah.

35:15

So around this time 2005

35:18

was dragon like I had kind of

35:20

a different schedule in Canada. Was

35:22

Dragon War sorry, Dragon Ball like really starting

35:24

that when they started to really hit to Nami

35:27

and just kind of blow up? I

35:30

cannot remember. I remember it was when I was

35:32

in high school, which would be early 2000. So

35:34

it was right before

35:36

I think it's okay.

35:39

The finale, I just looked it up here. The

35:42

original American air date was April 7 2003. So yeah,

35:44

it was it was very much fresh at that point.

35:49

Right. This would have also

35:52

been around the time that like, the Western

35:54

game developers are like, oh my god, what

35:56

can we localize that has Dragon Ball on

35:58

it? Oh, here's Dragon Ball GT.

36:01

Let's do that. So I could

36:03

see why maybe they started

36:05

to hang their hopes on Dragon Quest

36:07

and how distinctive Akira Toriyama's artwork

36:09

is. And it's interesting. I brought

36:11

up the Western box art

36:14

and how they changed that to a more Western – you know,

36:16

what they thought was more appealing to a Western audience. But

36:19

they finally let Toriyama out of his

36:21

cage in the West and said, here

36:23

is the man who is making all

36:26

these cool monsters. Everyone say hello. He's

36:28

the Dragon Ball guy. I mean,

36:31

it's effective. It's a gorgeous box art for

36:33

sure. Everything about Dragon Quest

36:36

8 is just pretty. Yeah,

36:38

it really is one of the –

36:40

Akira Toriyama's box art for these

36:42

games, especially in Japan, are just absolutely

36:45

perfect. Like we were talking about how the

36:47

box art, the Japanese box art for Dragon Quest

36:50

V is just epic. One

36:52

of his best pieces. Absolutely. And

36:55

I think 8 in Japan

36:57

and America more or less share the same box

36:59

art. But either way, there's like

37:01

that image of like – I don't really know

37:03

if Akira has an official name. Some people call

37:05

him 8. Some people call him other things. But

37:08

just him climbing and you see

37:10

like Jessica with the horse, the

37:12

princess horse behind her and just

37:15

a really action-filled shot that

37:17

gives you that sense

37:19

of serious adventure while also making it

37:22

like playful and fun. Everything he does,

37:24

Akira Toriyama does has like life. He's

37:27

kind of like James Baxter in that way. Like everything he

37:29

draws has like a movement to

37:31

it. Although poor

37:33

Angelo always gets left out. Yeah,

37:36

we should talk a little bit about the

37:39

characters we have here because we do have

37:41

Angelo, aka Trunks. I mean I love Akira

37:43

Toriyama like I just said, but his humans

37:45

tend to kind of follow templates, which

37:47

maybe he always wanted it that way. I don't know.

37:49

But he looks like fancy Trunks. So that's

37:52

why I kind of know him as. Yeah,

37:54

there's a lot. Like people were always hoping for

37:56

Goku and Smash. Like they got the – You

37:59

got to hear him. They could drink or three like very

38:01

go there is go girl with a girl jazz.

38:04

Yeah, they they tend to blend together a

38:06

little bit. He'll have some designs are sort

38:08

of stand out from others, but to yelled

38:10

I always see Luca as bomb up as

38:12

Boma. I just have that sort of idea.

38:14

With that said, I don't. Simply going about

38:17

it really looks like he Angus Sanders. Was

38:19

younger there has never have another youngest. He

38:21

is a singularity. Gasoline.

38:23

And I I appreciate that. and over Jersey

38:26

it's mostly positively but every so often he'll

38:28

give you that sort of outside the box

38:30

is it just stays with you. Stay.

38:33

Is funny cuz Yang as well as characters that

38:35

you see once and. Then he never forget him because

38:37

he can close your eyes and ears. I just like right behind

38:39

your eyelids like a ghost. In.like that.

38:41

like to eat yellow sell

38:44

items. Memory my memory: yellow

38:46

like tough sell hotness Scruffy,

38:48

weird, vast and nag. Allergies:

38:50

bare chested Gallic we're green pants and.

38:52

Or we're paying pass and we are green shoes or

38:55

vice versa. He sister a

38:57

very loud, discordant kind of

38:59

guy. Was very cockney accent. The

39:02

I'd The Decline yeah acts and really sells

39:04

it on the Just. Honestly,

39:06

The got cockney accent is kind of and inspired

39:08

choice. I wondered because every so often I look

39:10

at him I don't know whether it's design makes

39:12

me think of it or in the absence makes

39:14

me think of it. but I i I just

39:16

youngest screams Bob Hoskins to me. Who

39:20

framed Roger Rabbit with the Angus? Exactly

39:23

And did. He

39:25

works well. It's as. I'm

39:27

amazed how well the British voice acting works

39:30

for Dragon Quest. Yeah the

39:32

I think maybe to give. The

39:34

series or really fresh start in America like.

39:36

They completely changed how the games a localized

39:39

and. Another say the i mean you

39:41

have an acid in your opinion Add Derek since

39:43

you're playing is all the games like what do

39:45

you think of the localization in. Them so far.

39:48

See. The and yes games. They're

39:50

surprisingly good. Like right, good did

39:52

they don't have that? Element.

39:55

Of some like Newcastle, you choose where this facing

39:57

something a bike. What the heck do you mean

39:59

yeah. You're not. News is that if somebody.

40:02

You if you put the worked in.

40:04

There. Is enough information there that you can

40:06

easily that? not easily but you will figure

40:08

things out There clues are all their just

40:10

been having a notebook nearby seat actually track

40:13

I'm also and actually yeah, track of everything

40:15

that you need to do or clues that

40:17

you've been given. But. They're all their

40:19

and I to me that makes for an

40:21

impressive localization. There is not like a lot

40:23

of story or anything for them to really

40:25

see track of a lease with. I wanted

40:27

to, but. I'm. Not confused and to

40:30

me that's impressive for those old days and

40:32

the British kind of works because even set

40:34

from the beginning they were using the sort

40:36

of old English style was like yell thou

40:38

must go on urge you know that that

40:40

sort of idea and it's funny thing the

40:42

new of was a sense for this older

40:44

games like on the switch to the mobile

40:47

games and they make it even more flowery

40:49

for some was yes period without sort of

40:51

the dos. With. That dost the villain

40:53

hit us that way. Your that that

40:55

sort of idea? Yes, actually

40:57

very interesting how they do that. is

40:59

all that. The localization team which by

41:02

the way I am I think is

41:04

still lives there are these guys down?

41:07

Ah Plus Alpha translations are

41:09

Japan. Scouts. Vamp and Plus

41:12

Alpha translations who were brought in

41:14

to do the new translations. I

41:16

think this they still handle the

41:18

games to this day. They.

41:21

Have adopted early screening server. the

41:23

using now has adopted that Old

41:26

English kind of. Translation.

41:28

that they used to use his

41:30

way back in the day into

41:32

the cannon for the newer Dragon

41:34

Quest game. So it's like as

41:36

you say, Derek know Gary playing the

41:38

old games on the sweats and yeah, they

41:40

really kind of lean into the hall victorian.

41:43

English aspect of it whereas Dragon

41:45

Quest a British Ross has done

41:47

depends who you ask that I

41:49

think I'm. Sounds. Natural, more natural.

41:51

He definitely does. It doesn't feel

41:53

like that because nobody seems like

41:55

they're on airs. And

41:57

exactly yeah. Like I find that.

42:00

Better. The cartoon characters in these games

42:02

like to talk really naturally and is

42:04

always amusing and fun. Whereas if if

42:06

you ask, some of the British colleagues

42:09

I have worked with in the past,

42:11

present and probably the future suddenly get

42:13

very angry when a video game has

42:16

a British accent they say that's not

42:18

what we saw like. And.

42:21

I'm sorry, but. You

42:23

sound like Rex. From since the

42:25

Know played with a sorry if I'm

42:27

sent out yeah I know you want

42:30

to hire who had assisted just the

42:32

way the slimy motors except your wells

42:34

cat girl as is the way it

42:36

has to be. As

43:05

the I think the best senior officer

43:07

because of more british sounding voice bless

43:09

you know as as you haven't your

43:11

notes here. All the on

43:13

any means buildings really wise as

43:15

well which I think. For

43:17

the most part work for a bit better

43:19

cause I am from from both and cases

43:22

I haven't seen a lover to him compared

43:24

to cells back and forth but I think

43:26

a little bit more obvious what they do

43:28

with these new translations of the smell name's.

43:30

Answer. I think drank

43:32

was got a real sense of identity

43:34

thanks to it's monster localization because you're

43:36

you got his. As you mentioned here

43:39

we have both lords but now there's

43:41

out a bit I think it was

43:43

something I think it which was with

43:45

but now we got puns. Tons and

43:47

tons of puns. That lobby point here

43:50

and any world where we gotta translation

43:52

the game with that little pagan and

43:54

I made has the called a Hampshire

43:56

a sandwich yes I'm sorry that's amazing.

43:59

That's a good. localization name.

44:01

And I'm all about those. A werewolf.

44:05

Yes, thank you. That

44:08

is great. There's also a dude

44:10

who is just a man and a tiger. So

44:12

it is called a were tiger as in W

44:15

a are wearing the tiger skin.

44:17

He's a were tiger. The game

44:19

the games are full of that kind of thing. I

44:22

think that gives it so much identity. It's actually

44:25

very weird to me. I was like, I was

44:27

very curious where that change was. I figured it

44:29

was either seven or eight. And with

44:32

this, yeah, confirms eight was where that really

44:34

started. And I think that

44:36

says a lot of how, like we had five

44:38

games before this. And those

44:41

that's Instagram, as soon as they had this new

44:43

localization, great, more people played eight, then those old

44:45

games, I believe. But still, I think it's

44:47

stuck with people at least stuck with me. And I mean,

44:50

they kept some of them standard like a green

44:53

dragon still green dragon, a slime, a soul

44:55

slime. You know, you have those

44:58

aspects, the orcs are still there. Draggies

45:00

are still the same. But I'm

45:03

one of my favorite discoveries from Dragon Quest two

45:05

was that called

45:08

the poison slimes. I forget what they're the

45:10

new the babble, the babble or bubble slimes.

45:12

Yes, bubble slimes. They used to be called

45:14

Babble's and I have all I'm sorry. That's

45:16

wonderful. I don't know why I call them

45:19

Babble's to be honest with you. Like

45:22

I largely prefer the new localization is of course,

45:24

just a matter of habit. Like, why would

45:27

you call a chimera, which doesn't even look

45:29

like a chimera or wyvern? It's like so

45:32

weird twice over. But I still think of

45:34

the chimera as wyverns. I can't help myself.

45:37

Yeah. Yeah, it's

45:39

interesting going forward. The older

45:42

aspect because I'm so used to having

45:44

like a chimera wing. Yeah.

45:47

I think of them as wing of the wyvern, which

45:49

is what they're called in the NES games. But actually,

45:52

I think the localization added

45:55

voices, if I'm not mistaken, I don't think the

45:57

Japanese version of the game had voices and That

46:01

was a very big deal. That's what really,

46:03

of course, we're sitting here talking about how

46:05

these great cockney characters, like

46:08

that, I think, was a big step to helping

46:10

us bond with Dragon

46:12

Quest for the first time in a long

46:14

time. Yeah. You had

46:16

those – you have some

46:19

really great voice actors. I don't know any

46:21

of their names, but I do know that Angela's

46:24

voice actor would go on to voice Albus

46:26

in Xenoblade Chronicles, so you have that connection.

46:28

That's right. Yeah. And it is – they're

46:31

all excellent. It

46:35

ranges what they actually get to do, but

46:38

you get to – and I like that

46:40

each town sort of has its own style, because

46:42

you go to the first town and they have

46:44

this sort of Russian accent almost. Yes. Okay.

46:48

Sure. For some

46:50

reason, that was just something games did

46:52

back in the day, especially local

46:55

– like the new localized Dragon Quest games, but

46:57

in general, like I was thinking about, say, Paper

46:59

Mario is coming out soon, right? And if I

47:01

recall correctly, Thousand Year Door, they

47:03

had a whole town of penguins that were just

47:05

Canadians. They just, like, talk like

47:08

Canadians, eh? I

47:11

guess they try to give it that sort of

47:13

uniqueness. I have to assume in those cases that

47:15

there is some sort of, like, way

47:17

they spoke that's very much reminiscent of the area they

47:19

come from in Japan or they're

47:22

referencing in Japan, because I'm used to the

47:24

idea that, oh, there's characters

47:26

from Osaka. They have their own

47:28

stock and accent. Also, South. South.

47:30

They're Southern. They're Southern in translations

47:32

or manipulations. We have

47:34

talked about that, I think, with – I

47:36

don't remember if it was on retronauts or acts of

47:38

Blood God, but Breath of Fire 3 has

47:41

the Osaka – there's a dolphin who

47:43

is supposed to be Osaka, and

47:46

he was localized to

47:48

Australian. And I think

47:50

the developers found out, and I thought that was hilarious,

47:52

but just – yeah, I love

47:55

the associations that we get, but yeah, usually

47:57

Osaka is Southern, if I recall correctly, the

47:59

titular socks. Osaka from

48:01

Azumanga was Southern

48:04

as well. Yeah, so that's

48:06

how you get your different dialects in

48:08

these games. And I always think those

48:10

are really cute. So who knows? Maybe

48:12

the maybe the penguins are from Hokkaido,

48:15

which is well, then they play ice hockey

48:17

up there unlike most of the world

48:19

and Canada. So yeah, it's

48:21

possible. I mean, it makes for a good fit at

48:23

the very least. One

48:51

thing we should mention is that gameplay

48:53

wise Dragon Quest 8 was also a

48:56

little different in other ways. For example,

48:58

I think we mentioned that this is us

49:00

seeing the our characters

49:03

attack at the same time. You know what

49:05

I mean? Like, I think you mentioned

49:07

that already, didn't you? That

49:09

was sort of how one of the appeals

49:11

to me because before you never saw the

49:13

characters. I'm pretty sure is just here's the

49:15

monsters and you get to see a little

49:17

spell effect or attack effect over the monster

49:19

that you attack. And that's it.

49:22

But with eight, you see like, ah, here's the

49:24

hero. Ah, hero goes in for attack and you

49:26

see your hero jump forward and do the attack.

49:29

It's stuff that was all the way back in

49:31

Final Fantasy 7, but it's appreciated. And

49:33

you know, to me, it just gets you

49:35

a little bit more involved in the action, like

49:38

to see your characters actually pull off these moves

49:40

and make the spell effects that

49:42

much more entertaining or

49:44

interesting. I mean, without us being

49:47

able to see the characters, we

49:49

would never have gotten to see Genghis's underpants

49:51

stance and that would be criminal. Oh

49:54

my God, I forgot about how

49:56

could I forget about the underpants

49:58

because that's not another thing with this game. is that

50:00

you don't really change classes in the way that

50:02

you do in many Dragon Quest games, but by

50:04

God, they gave you some interesting skill trees. Like

50:07

the... Yeah? I can't

50:10

remember what unique skill... Like, everybody has,

50:12

like, skills that they can use, or

50:14

they can learn surrounding weapons, and

50:16

then they have, like, an individual, unique kind

50:18

of tree that they can develop themselves. Like,

50:20

I think the hero has courage. I

50:23

can't remember what Yengas has. It might

50:25

have been, like, something to do with his ugly

50:27

but lovable face. And one of

50:29

the things, I think, you can learn of the Underpants Den. And

50:32

just the... When you said it, like, I

50:34

remember the sound of... Stupid.

50:38

Just brings out two pairs of boxer shorts, does a little

50:40

dance, and I forget what effect it has on the enemy,

50:42

but it does it. Yeah,

50:45

the enemy is shocked, and it's

50:47

just so scandalized that they're just... But

50:51

of course, we have Jessica, which... She

50:55

has her fans. Puff,

50:57

yeah, as I recall. Give her the puff puff,

50:59

give her the sexy beam. Oh, right, she has

51:01

a sexy beam. That was actually pretty powerful, as

51:04

I recall. Yeah, it was actually pretty decent as

51:06

far as attacks go. Definitely

51:08

using more with her than I ever did with Jade

51:11

in 11. Oh, man,

51:13

I have a weakness for Jade. But yeah,

51:15

there was also... I

51:18

think the reason I like to use Angelo is

51:20

because, if I'm not mistaken, he was a group

51:22

attacker. Like, he could use whips, he could use

51:24

boomerangs, I think, maybe? I

51:27

forget exactly what he had access to. I know he

51:29

had swords, and I know he had bows. Bows,

51:32

okay, yeah. So he was pretty well kitted

51:34

out. And yeah, everyone,

51:36

once you kind of play

51:39

around with the skill trees, you could get a pretty

51:41

cool party going. If you were really brave,

51:43

you could do fisticuffs. I know some people who do that,

51:45

I don't do fisticuffs. I like weapons. Yeah,

51:47

I definitely prefer the weapons. I

51:50

looked it up, and Angelo had

51:52

swords, bows, and staves. Stays

51:55

right. Okay, God, he has like a real red mage type

51:57

going on, wasn't he? Yeah, very much so. was

52:00

WIPs, WIPs, staves, and something else.

52:02

I forget the last one of

52:04

those. You could really

52:07

change it up, but that also,

52:09

again, gets into the improvements

52:11

that the 3DS version had over the original

52:14

PS2 version. Because in the original, you had each

52:16

for their, as far

52:18

as you're getting ability points, and you could put

52:20

it into each of their weapons

52:23

or that other thing, but

52:25

you had no idea what you were unlocking or how much

52:27

you needed to put in there to unlock. And there are

52:29

not enough skill points in the game to max out

52:32

everything. So you have to kind of just

52:34

pick two. You won't be as powerful if you don't,

52:38

if you try to spread it out evenly. So you kind

52:40

of have to pick one or two to really

52:42

focus on and have that be their

52:45

thing. And if you want

52:47

to prepare for it, well, you need a guide or you're

52:49

just going to have to go blind and just hope that

52:51

it works out for you. But with the 3DS version, they

52:53

show you the entire list. Like, here's the only point you

52:55

need. And you have that as the list many points, you'll

52:57

get this thing. It's

53:00

something else I should point out too, is

53:02

that I believe the localization did a real

53:04

overhaul to the UI to make it like

53:06

less text based and more image based. And they

53:08

really made it very pretty like the menus, the

53:11

monster listings and whatnot all

53:13

organized very nicely and all

53:16

illustrated and presented very nicely as

53:18

well. Oh, yeah, absolutely. It's

53:21

very appealing to the eyes. It's

53:24

I don't know, like there's just an instant charm

53:26

to it all. That's the one thing I came

53:28

back like I think this is obviously

53:31

there's a some retrospective stuff when it comes to

53:33

the old stuff I have not played yet. But

53:36

I think the charm really gets full push

53:38

forward with Dragon Quest and its spin offs

53:40

from this point on where they're just like,

53:42

this is what we're all about. We have

53:44

just a feel good time, even

53:46

though we can get dark, but this is a

53:48

feel good time. But with all these, you know,

53:51

these, these silly aspects or the silly monster

53:54

names, the characters at times.

53:57

One of my favorite scenes in this game is the bar fight. So...

54:01

And that's pretty early in the game as I recall. It is. But

54:04

it's iconic. You've got this bar fight breaking

54:06

out and you have the hero just standing

54:09

there like what is happening? Yeah. It's

54:11

personal. It gives

54:13

so much personality to the hero when most

54:16

of the time they don't get a personality. Yeah,

54:38

actually one reason I have

54:40

sometimes a little bit hard time remembering

54:42

parts of it and this is actually to its

54:44

credit is that Dragon Quest

54:47

XI which is also like a

54:49

beautifully charming little game, it builds

54:52

a lot off VIII and

54:54

so certain things are like I'm

54:56

thinking of the skill tree in VIII with the

54:59

skill tree in XI and

55:01

it's like oh well okay I'm picturing XI

55:03

here. I'm trying to remember what VIII was

55:05

like in comparison but I just remember

55:08

XI had that really satisfying crunch every

55:10

time you unlock something. Yeah,

55:12

I think it was literally just pumping in points and

55:15

bam you got this and there was no like presentation

55:18

I guess is the best way to put it like XI does.

55:22

I see a note

55:24

here from you like crafting, you got the

55:26

alchemy pot. That

55:29

was just fun to just toss in stuff and see what you got.

55:32

Yeah, I think there was an improvement over

55:34

the American version, sorry with the Japanese, over

55:36

the Japanese version, the American version. I think

55:39

they made it a little simpler to make

55:41

combinations whereas in Japan it was a

55:43

lot more guesswork. Yeah, and

55:45

they further improved it for the 3DS version. They would

55:48

have some thinking of, yeah. Basically you'd

55:50

pop those in and you have to walk a little

55:52

bit then you'd see what you got. Yeah.

55:55

With the 3DS version it was instant.

55:58

Yes, that's right, okay. good

56:00

because as I recall, one

56:03

of my favorite things to do in Dragon Quest

56:05

8 was to start the game and

56:07

use the alchemy pot as soon as possible to make

56:09

a fire boomerang and just kind of cheese my way

56:11

through the early part of the game. Boomerangs

56:15

early on are really effective. They

56:17

really are and they kind of lose

56:19

their effectiveness later in the game, which unfortunately,

56:22

but that's why you bring Eric aboard and

56:24

he can just kind of kill everything in Dragon

56:26

Quest 11. I love boomerangs.

56:29

They are a lot of fun. I think that's

56:31

kind of a blind spot to me

56:34

with the Dragon Quest history because when

56:37

I first encountered like boomerangs and thieves

56:39

and whips, they had been

56:41

added to Dragon Warrior 3

56:44

for the Game Boy Color and they were

56:46

not part of the original lore of Dragon

56:48

Quest that I knew it. So

56:51

I think they were added with

56:53

six and kind of retrospectively, retroactively

56:55

added into remakes and stuff like

56:58

that, which is why they're in 3. But

57:01

yeah. It's

57:03

fascinating to think about them because they're sort

57:05

of the weaponized versions of certain spells where

57:08

whips are good against groups while boomerangs

57:10

hit everything and spells work

57:12

in much the same way just because of that

57:14

physical aspect. So it's kind of an ingenious way

57:16

to expand upon the system that they've had for

57:18

so long. Yes. I

57:21

actually, my heart went out to you when you

57:23

were playing Dragon Quest 2 and you learned the

57:25

difference between groups and all

57:28

enemy attacks. Especially

57:30

since I think Dragon Quest 2, that

57:33

is the game where if you miss

57:35

a group, then you're not getting any kind

57:37

of damage done as I recall. That is

57:39

right. Oh man. And

57:43

that was something as I recall that really

57:45

frustrated me too with the original Final Fantasy.

57:47

Like I'd go to attack an enemy that

57:49

was long dead and it just

57:51

like felt so slow and pointless and

57:53

hurt my very soul. That's

57:56

why I prefer Dragon Quest 2

57:58

to Final Fantasy. terms that

58:00

way because each enemy was individual in Final

58:02

Fantasy, but because of the groups, if

58:04

you thought you were going to kill something, you'd go for

58:07

the group or you'd go for

58:09

the single for that kill and have the

58:11

others work on the group. Yes. So

58:13

it felt a little easier to plan around. It

58:16

really did, yeah. I don't

58:18

know about you, but for me at least,

58:20

this was the first RPG that really kind

58:22

of gave me the sense of what an

58:24

open world RPG could feel like, by

58:28

today's standards, especially for the PlayStation 2

58:30

version of the game. The

58:33

overworld is kind of simple. It's sprawling,

58:36

but for me, that was the first time

58:38

I could really stand on a cliff and see

58:40

a mountain off in the distance and say, oh

58:42

crap, I want to go to that mountain. And

58:44

I could, and I did. And I

58:46

mean, along the way, it's not as exciting as you'd

58:48

get in God knows a game like Zelda and Tears

58:50

of the Kingdom or something. Like, oh boy,

58:53

I found a treasure chest. So for the time, it was

58:55

really cool. I don't know. Was that

58:57

like the first experience with you when you first played this game? I'm

58:59

thinking about it, and I think it is. Because

59:03

nobody else had really done it like that. I'm

59:06

thinking to Final Fantasy X, which is the other

59:08

big PS2 RPG. And

59:10

yeah, that was very much a guided experience

59:12

where you're just not really able to go

59:15

anywhere, but it was pretty. Yeah. And

59:18

on the PS1, obviously, you went to the overworld

59:20

and it's just there. But this, you go out

59:22

to the overworld, it's just there.

59:24

You're exploring it like you would any other

59:26

town, and it's just massive and sprawled out.

59:29

But I think that also reminded me why

59:32

I stopped playing Dragon Quest 8 originally on PS2.

59:35

Because I got the boat and I got

59:37

lost. I couldn't figure out which town to go

59:39

to next. And because of the random encounters, I

59:41

got frustrated and stopped for a while and then

59:43

never came back to it. And

59:48

it works very well when you're

59:50

landlocked and only have certain, only so many places

59:52

to go. And if you get anything

59:54

that opens it up and you got to figure out where to

59:56

go and you don't have those exact directions yet. Oh

59:59

boy. be rough. Yeah,

1:00:02

as you know now, that is very much a

1:00:04

Dragon Quest thing where it's like, hey everyone, here's

1:00:06

a ship, where do I go? Wherever you want.

1:00:08

It's not really any rules. Thanks. I

1:00:11

appreciate the openness. It's cool in that

1:00:13

way, but it is so

1:00:15

easy, especially in aid to just go where you're

1:00:18

not supposed to and just get wrecked. Absolutely.

1:00:20

Especially, I find Dragon Quest games are

1:00:23

extremely merciless when it comes to enemies

1:00:25

on the high seas. You can really

1:00:27

throw some assholes at you. Mm-hmm.

1:00:30

I think that's the truth. 10

1:00:33

squids, go for it. Can

1:00:35

I run? No. Yeah,

1:00:38

have fun. It's essentially what it

1:00:40

all comes down to. I

1:00:43

mean, I don't think... It is certainly not the

1:00:45

hardest Dragon Quest, but it can wear you down,

1:00:48

especially with the original. 3DS, of course, solves

1:00:50

that. Yes,

1:01:21

it really can. This has

1:01:24

been a really great discussion on what

1:01:26

is a very influential Dragon Quest game,

1:01:29

which is celebrating its 20th anniversary

1:01:31

this year. God,

1:01:35

I can't believe it. To me, I'm

1:01:37

sitting there five years ago, like I

1:01:40

said, sitting in my friend's place on

1:01:42

dial-up internet, playing Half-Life 2. It

1:01:44

all happened five years ago. What do you say, Derek?

1:01:48

Yeah. I was just hanging out in college not

1:01:50

that long ago, playing this in my room, and

1:01:52

just blown away by how pretty it looks and

1:01:54

how much fun I'm having. Yeah, that was only

1:01:57

five years. Yeah, absolutely. Oh. Goodness

1:02:00

gracious me, but yeah, this is a fantastic

1:02:02

game Again, one of the

1:02:04

most important dragon quest games out there

1:02:06

and especially for the west and we even

1:02:08

talk about the story like that's

1:02:11

the funny thing I mean That's

1:02:13

the thing like I liked the

1:02:15

story but it's for me dragon quest

1:02:17

is really more about the characters and

1:02:19

the journey and like

1:02:22

the visual storytelling like like

1:02:24

I said going across the planes chasing

1:02:26

dual maggots because of course dragon quest

1:02:28

like you're chasing an evil clown

1:02:30

named dual maggots and There's

1:02:33

a curse and a king and I

1:02:35

have to admit one of my favorite things about this

1:02:37

game is that you can fear the carriage behind you

1:02:40

and the horse princess But you never really see them

1:02:42

you turn around It's

1:02:44

a nice patch. I will say My

1:02:47

general opinion in the story that is I think

1:02:49

it starts extremely strong But

1:02:51

it peters out by the end. It

1:02:53

kind of does I think to be honest like it's

1:02:56

just not the strongest aspect of the game barring

1:02:59

the character voice acting interactions and

1:03:01

whatnot is just But

1:03:03

that's always kind of been the thing with

1:03:05

dragon quest the overarching story is rarely impressive

1:03:07

And it's just more about how the characters

1:03:09

interact and what happens around them

1:03:12

So I can forgive dragon quest eight for

1:03:14

being a little bit forgettable. Um in

1:03:17

that regard this still has pretty cool moments like

1:03:20

you know, we we haven't really had too many spoilers

1:03:22

going on but there's a A

1:03:25

little post game or end game twist that I

1:03:27

think is kind of cute. So yeah again feels

1:03:29

like a precursor or a Inspiration

1:03:32

for dragon quest 11 greatly expanding that

1:03:34

idea Absolutely. Yes. Um, if

1:03:36

you are any kind of a dragon quest 11

1:03:38

fan You will like

1:03:41

dragon quest eight a lot. It's still very

1:03:43

playable especially on the nintendo

1:03:45

3ds, I Whole

1:03:47

heartily recommend it and I am assuming

1:03:50

you do as well. Derek Absolutely.

1:03:52

Good luck hunting it down. Hope for

1:03:54

another another port of that game because

1:03:58

It's pretty expensive And the

1:04:00

eShop I think is down now. The eShop is dead.

1:04:03

I don't know if it was on the eShop to

1:04:05

begin with. It must have been. I

1:04:07

would imagine it had to have been, but I don't know

1:04:09

for sure. I just know it goes for a lot. But

1:04:11

it is great. The

1:04:15

3DS version is the best way to play it. I

1:04:17

highly recommend it. It's a really

1:04:19

great entry point into Dragon Quest. It sort of

1:04:21

combines the old school and the new school. I

1:04:23

think Dragon Quest XI definitely leans more new school,

1:04:26

while still being very classic. You want

1:04:28

more classic Dragon Quest, 8 is

1:04:31

where it's at. Then you can sort of

1:04:33

expand your horizons from there. For

1:04:35

sure. I think it is actually a very

1:04:37

interesting bridge between the classic and the

1:04:40

more modern Dragon Quest. You can really see where it

1:04:42

all came together here, especially with the 3D backgrounds, the

1:04:46

3D traversal, and the very

1:04:49

animated battle

1:04:51

scenes. First

1:04:53

time getting 3D monsters as well, which is another big

1:04:55

step up. As

1:04:58

I said earlier, the animations,

1:05:01

which were pretty groundbreaking for Dragon

1:05:03

Quest XI on the SNES, and

1:05:05

then we had animations in 7,

1:05:07

which were also kind of

1:05:10

stiff, but still kind of impressive the fact that

1:05:12

they were even happening. 8

1:05:15

really just kind of takes those jerky

1:05:17

movements and makes them into living animals,

1:05:19

like living creatures and things

1:05:22

like satyrs and slimes and all these fun

1:05:24

things that you come up against like snakes

1:05:27

that look like dragons and dragons that look like

1:05:29

snakes. Kiri Toriyama never needed

1:05:31

an excuse to draw a dragon, and that's one

1:05:34

of the reasons I loved him so much. We

1:05:38

will miss him very, very much, and

1:05:40

things won't be the same without him, let alone Dragon

1:05:42

Quest. No, it will not. Oh

1:05:44

boy. All respect. So

1:05:47

thank you so much, all of

1:05:49

you, Dragon Warriors and Questors alike,

1:05:52

for tuning into this

1:05:54

week's episode of RetroNauts. If

1:05:56

you support us, you can get episodes a

1:05:59

week early and add for the

1:06:01

next episode. All you have to

1:06:03

do is go to our Patreon

1:06:05

at patreon.com/retronauts ton of cool stuff

1:06:07

They're cool exclusive stuff in our

1:06:09

tiers including bonus episodes Written

1:06:11

content from our good friend diamond

1:06:13

fight find out tons more at

1:06:16

retronauts calm Derek where

1:06:18

the heck can we find you? You

1:06:21

can find me over as part of the team

1:06:23

at good vibes gaming over on YouTube As

1:06:26

you mentioned earlier my most recent video

1:06:28

what is a look at Dragon Quest

1:06:30

2 and Playing

1:06:32

me playing through the original NES

1:06:35

version and going over its history

1:06:37

the development why it ended up so

1:06:39

freaking hard and kind

1:06:42

of how it holds up nowadays and what

1:06:45

it does well and why

1:06:47

it kind of Kind of

1:06:50

fails in the grain Things So

1:06:53

there is that I'm also working on my new newest

1:06:55

video. I'm working on right now I hope to have

1:06:57

it up this week or the next

1:07:00

Is looking at the history of the mystery

1:07:03

dungeon series and how you probably don't know

1:07:05

this But it's definitely more than Pokemon related

1:07:07

and believe it or not started

1:07:09

out as a Dragon Quest spin-off

1:07:11

So have that connection. Oh, so

1:07:14

you've gotten into Torniko Yes,

1:07:16

I've not played them, but I'm just it's sort of just

1:07:18

an overview of Of

1:07:20

the mystery dungeon as a series rather

1:07:22

than me playing each individual one because

1:07:25

I'd be here a while Yeah,

1:07:28

mystery dungeons a bit hardcore even for the likes

1:07:31

of me But I am looking very forward to that

1:07:33

definitely looking forward to your Dragon Quest 3 retrospective

1:07:36

slash review play I Wholly

1:07:40

recommend these videos. They're really great. I recommend everything

1:07:42

by good vibes gaming say the you guys do

1:07:44

good stuff People who support you I appreciate

1:07:47

that. Yeah. Yeah as for me,

1:07:49

I am not in Oxford I also

1:07:51

go host the acts of blood got RPG

1:07:53

podcast aside from doing this at Axel

1:07:56

Bluga we talked about RPGs old and new Eastern

1:07:58

and Western you can support support us and

1:08:01

all our really cool

1:08:03

stuff over at patreon.com/bloodgodpod

1:08:05

or just bloodgodpod.com. And

1:08:08

until next time, remember, you can incinerate a

1:08:10

man if you just feed a mouse some

1:08:13

spicy cheese. And

1:08:24

until next time,

1:08:30

remember, you can incinerate

1:08:32

a man if you

1:08:40

just feed a mouse some spicy