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the exercise friday i'm ira plato

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later in the our a master course on

0:47

monkey pox debunking some

0:49

common misconceptions about the virus

0:52

and to meet the all knowing galaxy

0:54

we live in the milky way and

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a sassy new tell all with

0:59

firsts thirty million people in

1:01

the us live with diabetes and

1:03

access to insulin can be very

1:05

expensive more than one in five

1:07

people with private insurance pay

1:10

more than thirty five dollars a month for

1:12

this necessary medication the

1:14

us senate has senate plan to cap insulin

1:16

prices for some seniors but

1:18

critics say this plan would

1:20

not help make insulin affordable

1:23

insulin affordable majority of people joining

1:25

me to talk about this another science stories

1:27

of the week is catherine wu's

1:30

staff writer for the atlantic

1:32

based in new haven connecticut welcome

1:34

back the science friday katie

1:36

allows it to be your again

1:37

nice to have you okay let's start

1:39

with this insulin story what's the current

1:42

status of insulin access for

1:44

diabetics and the u s

1:46

yeah so insulin

1:48

is very very very expensive

1:50

which is very unfortunate as you pointed

1:53

out this can be a life or death

1:55

drug for some people especially those

1:57

with type one diabetes cabinet

1:59

and four on their own and as

2:01

you pointed out there some people paying way

2:03

more than thirty five dollars a

2:05

month for this medication some people are paying into

2:08

the hundred per month which wow a huge

2:11

poor said as their paycheck that

2:13

is nice if you know that's on par with

2:15

but they may be paying for

2:17

would even part of their housing and then

2:19

this is much more than people elsewhere in

2:21

the world pay

2:22

absolutely so there is a study

2:24

i believe that was last year by the rand corporation

2:26

that sound that you know average prices for

2:28

of violent and flynn of the u s a the

2:30

prices in any other country

2:33

and it's about ten times more and

2:35

the global average which is

2:37

huge gap so the senate

2:39

plan have four insulin

2:41

access doesn't quite solve

2:43

this problem doesn't

2:45

no so you know obviously

2:47

this bill is still kind of working

2:49

it's way through all , the

2:51

legislative red tape but it has cleared

2:54

the summit in kind of a a mixed bag

2:56

form so people with medicare are

2:59

slated to get a kobe camp as

3:01

thirty five dollars per month people

3:04

with private insurance to get the benefit people

3:06

who are uninsured and painter pocket are

3:08

getting and effects and people

3:10

on medicaid or not getting that benefit which

3:13

is as he pointed out

3:14

a lot of people who is is this

3:16

just an instance of far companies getting

3:18

as much as they can i

3:20

we think that plays a role though

3:22

you know the companies that have sort of a monopoly

3:24

on the insulin market have pushed back on that

3:26

characterization but the reality is you

3:28

know insulin it's not the

3:30

most expensive dragging the world but it's not necessarily

3:33

cheap to make we have remission eric

3:35

version available and released we

3:37

paid for companies dominate the market

3:40

and sell both of the sort of put prices

3:42

wherever they like who who are us move

3:44

onto something there was a little surprising i

3:46

think the most people about

3:48

over nineteen and that

3:50

is the cdc releasing new

3:52

guidance on covered ninety protocols

3:55

in schools i just this week

3:57

right what are the new guidelines say

3:59

there are several things are

4:02

that are rolling out this week from the cdc

4:04

are basically it is kind of a massive

4:06

listening of protocol sell spare

4:09

is going to be no more routine testing

4:11

recommended in schools and workplaces

4:13

so this is very very precisely

4:15

times a lot of kids are about to go back to

4:17

school and that me

4:18

be a huge teams for them i

4:20

before they were a lot of places that had policies

4:23

in place that you know if you are a

4:25

kid and he were exposed to someone

4:27

who has presumed kobe has

4:29

symptoms has recently tested positive you

4:32

either have to quarantine or you have to

4:34

cheat tests and make sure that you're testing

4:36

negative to come back to school i sort of test

4:38

to stay policy that is

4:41

known for being recommended and

4:43

more generally for everyone else no one

4:45

needs to quarantine anymore after they've

4:47

been exposed to the virus even if they're and

4:49

vaccinated or not activate their vaccines

4:52

and there's no my recommendation of staying

4:54

six feet away

4:55

or is there a general

4:57

feeling of why they're doing this

5:00

you know which it's a little trump or didn't

5:02

they certainly can't speak for the cdc

5:04

by the general sense seems to be

5:06

the cdc has taken

5:08

a look at the situation i feel pieces

5:10

are quite high still in the country

5:13

but step proportion of cases that are proceeding

5:15

few hospitalization or death has stayed

5:17

it's thankfully very very low

5:20

you know and up press call yesterday the cdc

5:22

was saying a lot of people have some

5:24

form of immunity whether it's through vaccination

5:26

or prior infection or the

5:28

fires it's just i mean fewer ways to cause

5:31

the beard if he is

5:32

if it if you're saying maybe it's

5:34

time to listen up a little

5:36

bad and this is kind of a way to quote unquote

5:39

live more sustainably with the virus

5:42

let's loosen up a good ourselves

5:44

from movements and moved

5:46

to less space for our next story

5:48

many of us have been following the discoveries

5:51

from the james webb best space telescope

5:53

j w s t with a good

5:55

form of shock and awe and it seems

5:57

astronomers may have found the youngest

6:00

excerpt why don't we know of tell

6:02

us about that

6:03

so i do you want to highlight that robin

6:05

dirge andrews had a great story on this

6:07

in the new york times with ,

6:09

amazing eugene slide telescope we are

6:11

seeing or university

6:14

unprecedented detail and

6:16

scientists have found evidence that

6:18

there is an exo planets orbiting planets star

6:21

about three hundred ninety five let you away

6:23

from us and that story is just

6:26

one point five million years old which

6:28

means that mean it it probably about

6:30

the same it's am now you

6:32

may be thinking one point five million years sound

6:34

like a really really long time

6:37

that sounds kind of old but you know for prospective

6:39

your earth is four point five billion

6:42

years old so this is like a little bb

6:44

accept planet wow so we can might

6:46

might learn something about how planets

6:48

form from watching this the

6:50

weird i've been thinking about this is it's like we're

6:53

getting baby pictures of this planet

6:55

send such as ah we sort of keep

6:57

at it with seems lab or lab or to our

7:00

telescopes that's ah come out

7:02

in the future we could sort of watch

7:04

this planet get older and older i'm

7:06

you know i certainly don't know with will be following

7:08

it in this much detail four

7:10

billion years from supports but at

7:12

the very least we can sort of look into

7:14

our own past if all planet form the same

7:16

way this could be the closest we come to

7:18

watching ah you know our own

7:21

and yeah development so why not

7:23

actually seeing a finished planet yeah

7:25

right it's sort of in stage

7:27

of development right right so

7:30

you know when planets are bored

7:32

at less you know a fully formed

7:34

tiny planet being birthday about

7:37

explain it it's smells like an animal

7:39

but basically the idea here is we

7:41

have this store and there's a a lot of dust and

7:43

gas orbiting around and

7:45

it looks like they are clumping together to

7:47

form a planet imagine about coming

7:50

together and i was going to get cooked from

7:52

you know something raw and battery into a finished

7:55

cake like practice a this planet is

7:57

in the various

7:58

the pages of that well

7:59

glad you made this food analogy

8:02

with a spy emphasis it's a great segue

8:04

into this others to for heath's

8:06

a bit are hub bub and the space community

8:09

about it emerged that look beautiful

8:11

like a beautiful star deep in space

8:14

and it turns out that the photo was actually

8:16

something much closer to home a

8:18

slice of to resell tell

8:21

, about this is

8:23

the biggest swamp plants

8:26

we'd been

8:30

we the photo that's what heard a peep it dot fate

8:32

was it's retail he said it was a game plan

8:35

photo of this beautiful brightest

8:37

star elsewhere in

8:39

, universe and ah a lot

8:41

of people fell for at the tweet totally

8:44

went viral and maybe it's not shocking

8:46

that they get you know this was an established as assess

8:48

yeah blue checkmark cancer followers

8:51

but he later admitted he later yeah

8:53

no that is cured meat not

8:56

a

8:56

there are no way we're people so fool

8:58

their meeting you know maybe

9:00

it's because we're so used to seeing some

9:03

incredibles pictures coming back

9:05

from the jays of us hey we didn't question

9:07

is thing so i mean there's

9:10

probably little reason to

9:12

question it you know how the photos he didn't

9:14

seem so far has been

9:16

beautiful and showing us as unprecedented

9:18

detail or why not something

9:21

teresa like and at the are just kind

9:23

of hinting at a lot of things and face

9:25

looks delicious obsessed

9:28

, my colleague marine corps

9:30

and of the atlantic read a great piece

9:33

are basically making that argument you know

9:35

this is not going to be be only

9:37

a meat like thing we see

9:39

on twitter and the

9:41

next thing we do seats are gonna be more

9:44

legit more definitely racing

9:46

thing that ever looked like tomatoes

9:48

and meatballs delicious savory

9:51

read things that just also happen

9:53

to be stars

9:54

i'm getting hungry let's move away from space

9:56

quickly as go back there a to tackle

9:58

a very serious medical the worry we

10:01

are no strangers to infectious diseases

10:03

of course at this point and

10:05

in the new york city area a few

10:07

cases of polio haven't

10:09

detected it turns out additional

10:12

cases have been detected in wastewater

10:15

this was happening here

10:18

there are better than an unfolding story

10:20

for a few weeks now and it starts

10:22

a couple weeks ago when health authorities

10:24

and rockland county new york sound the

10:26

and man in his twenties had been paralyzed

10:29

from a poliovirus at had

10:31

actually come from a type of sexy

10:33

that is used in the us but is used in

10:35

other countries to that

10:36

the people against we out of the this the weekend

10:38

form of the virus it can replicate

10:41

people and does not generally cause any

10:43

for the ndp you buy is it

10:45

spreads he would kind of unvaccinated people

10:47

can mutate fact if you're form that

10:49

and be pretty dangerous and seven rare cases

10:51

cause paralysis so

10:54

i will point out here that the man who got paralyzed

10:56

was on vaccinated ah

10:59

, so this is not gonna be a massive

11:01

threat to people who do have the polio

11:03

vaccine on but this

11:05

, guess asked that his paralysis

11:07

occurred means that there probably is transmission

11:10

of the community and at the waist what has captured

11:12

means that it's prob

11:13

we ongoing pyrite we're going to keep

11:15

our eye on that one must talk about our last

11:18

story it's another infectious disease

11:20

or many people's minds monkey

11:22

pox you wrote a story about vaccines

11:25

sexing splitting tell us what

11:27

that is

11:28

right so i is

11:30

quite clear that at this point we do not have

11:33

enough after monkey pox vaccine here

11:35

in the you ask me for using a brand called

11:37

jimmy else and there

11:39

are more than more than people at very high

11:41

risk of monkey pox right now most than

11:43

men who have sex with men many of them

11:45

were living with hiv and so

11:48

to really stretch the resources we

11:50

have the government this week decide it's

11:52

are going to split the junior dos is we have

11:54

into five and a set of injecting

11:56

a fault those under the skin into the letter

11:59

thought that

11:59

the we're going to use a fifth of a dose

12:02

and he's a special needle to inject it between

12:05

the layers of skin it with the more shallow

12:07

shot it's more difficult to administer but

12:09

the hope is that this will stretch

12:12

our supply a tricky thing here

12:14

is that procedure making

12:16

that switched from so called subcutaneous

12:19

using to intradermal of things is

12:21

really just based on a single study that

12:23

was done and twenty fifteen in

12:25

mostly young healthy adults we

12:28

don't quite know if you put your that's gonna perform

12:30

i've rolled out into the public in

12:32

the coming

12:33

that should be operated for can be like

12:35

a little bit of an experiment to find out

12:38

definitely a real world experiment yeah

12:40

well we're going to be talking about them

12:42

monkey pox on our next segment everything you

12:44

wanted to know about of with some experts so

12:46

last will cover that also i want

12:48

to thank you for taking time to be with us today

12:51

absolutely to do so much manning's catherine

12:53

rose staff writer for the atlantic based

12:55

in new haven connecticut we have to

12:57

take a break and when they come back as i

12:59

say it's gonna be or latest installment

13:01

of fact check my feed talking

13:04

everything you wanted to know about monkey

13:06

pox stay with us

13:08

support for this program also comes from the winston

13:11

foundation

13:12

the i had the same reaction they're confused

13:15

concerned at a bit disturbed i'm

13:17

radio radio were actually gonna give us real power

13:20

one man desperately tries to

13:21

the

13:25

clinton

13:33

the media

13:35

lab however

13:38

you get podcast

13:43

science friday i am i replayed oh

13:45

you've probably heard the headlines about monkey

13:47

pox as of last week the white

13:49

house declares the outbreak a public health

13:51

emergency currently there are

13:54

there are over nine thousand confirmed cases

13:56

in the us and just under thirty

13:59

thousand world wide spreading

14:01

in countries where we've never seen

14:03

it before or since the end of may

14:06

the virus is mainly spreading within

14:08

gay and bisexual men and

14:10

other men who have sex with men and because

14:13

of that there's a stigma associated

14:15

with the outbreak a lot of you

14:17

have written in with your questions about

14:19

monkey pox and joining me not to answer

14:21

those questions are my guess

14:24

rachel roper p h d we're all just

14:26

and professor microbiology and immunology

14:29

has a brody medical school had east carolina

14:31

university based in greenville north carolina

14:34

and perry how tedious

14:37

ph tedious dean of the rutgers

14:39

university school of public health based

14:41

in piscataway new jersey or them

14:44

both of you decide friday

14:45

thank you iran

14:47

era

14:48

they have you doctorow problem is

14:50

again with you let's start with the basic

14:52

questions here we've gotten so many questions

14:54

for listeners to clarify

14:57

stuff they're seeing misinformation

14:59

circulating how does make effects

15:02

monkey pox can spread

15:04

for the respiratory rude if you're very close

15:06

to some month but the way that this variant

15:09

is spreading his through close personal

15:11

contact skin to skin contact

15:14

and like you said mostly it's spreading

15:16

now a sexual contact between

15:18

men who have sex with men so

15:20

it's much less contagious uncovered

15:23

you're not gonna catch it true that era

15:25

he would get covered

15:26

the you're not going that you're from touching a

15:29

surface or clothing that someone else

15:31

that's a pulitzer safer

15:33

monkey pox is actually more of a problem

15:35

and cove it would be monkey pox apart

15:38

ferriss have very stable virus particles

15:41

so is it can spread more

15:43

easily on surfaces just because it's more

15:45

stable so that that

15:47

if you go to the cdc website you can

15:49

look for a how to disinfect clothing and

15:51

surfaces they could potentially

15:54

spread that ways it's not likely as much

15:56

less contagious and covance but if you're

15:58

out somewhere need to the doorknob it's i'm

16:00

i'm just tired than they've got monkey

16:02

pox you could get it on your hand and then if he

16:04

touched your eyes your face it could

16:07

get him into your body in ah it's

16:09

a good idea always if you've been out in the public

16:11

somewhere in out like don't don't touch your

16:13

face while you're out in the public's especially

16:15

for touching things and then when you get

16:17

home wash your hands with soap and water it's

16:19

just always a good idea to do that

16:22

i'd like to hello kitty says

16:24

dr roper mentions monkey pox can

16:26

spread during sex but it's not

16:28

a sexually transmitted infection

16:30

is it asks how has this framing

16:32

of monkey pox has an s t

16:35

i impacted the public's understanding

16:37

of the virus and how policy makers

16:39

dole out resources needed

16:42

to contain the outbreak the

16:44

i r that's a really terrific question

16:46

i you know just to clarify that

16:48

when we say sacks right we don't necessarily

16:50

mean intercourse people can

16:53

it can be engaged in intimate relations

16:55

with each other they can be rolling around

16:57

with each other there doesn't have to be an

16:59

active in recourse for monkey pox to

17:01

spread and so it is not

17:04

as not i per se as we might think

17:06

of syphilis gonorrhea chlamydia

17:09

you know to eat you can be in bed with an individual

17:11

you can be kissing that individual yet been hugging

17:13

that individuals and that person has an

17:15

infection you may become infected now

17:18

what's really interesting here as here think

17:20

so much of our response over the course of

17:22

the last few months i think is think some

17:24

ways been shaped bikes people

17:27

concerns about

17:29

how we dealt with hiv in the nineteen

17:31

eighties and the messaging there were

17:33

this disease was attributed to gay men

17:36

were game and more stigmatize so i think

17:38

the cdc and other federal officials

17:40

and certainly local health departments are walking

17:42

a very fine line here the bottom line

17:44

here is of we've said this from the beginning of

17:46

monkey pox anybody can get it no

17:49

as my colleague just said however it is primarily

17:51

a gay and bisexual men right now whether

17:53

intimate relations with each other so

17:56

the high seas

17:58

in some ways

17:59

have been shaped by the past and

18:02

fear of making a mistake

18:04

right now in the present i will say one

18:06

more thing ira i think or

18:08

uptake on uptake response has been has little

18:10

slow and one can't

18:12

help but think not

18:14

the response may have been somewhat

18:17

more quick had a different

18:19

fragment of the population been infected statue

18:21

the hypothesis that's just the conjecture

18:24

let's also as we think about this disease

18:26

and we think about policy it's not ignore the

18:28

fact again bisexual men are be infected i think we

18:30

have to acknowledge that facts and i think as

18:33

a population we have an obligation to

18:35

say let's protect our gay and bisexual

18:37

brothers less and for the virus

18:39

and that sigmund the population and and hopefully

18:42

all of us as a community will benefit they

18:45

found some with like the messaging from the nineteen

18:47

eighties as i recall when ,

18:50

was spreading wildly a

18:52

it is iraq very similar

18:54

with forty one years into the

18:56

aids epidemic so let's just all remind

18:58

ourselves we slept kobe was let

19:01

hiv right was like forty thousand

19:03

new infections of it's have each year in this country

19:05

and now we have monkey pox when you

19:07

make a disease and you call it and sci

19:10

when you're over emphasized sex

19:13

and you make it about gay sex threat

19:15

which is you know sexist stigmatized to begin

19:17

with guy sets of even more stigmatized

19:20

then it becomes a the hands of wrong

19:22

people like politicians who

19:24

are seeking to do harm potentially

19:27

a very lethal weapon that will

19:29

stigmatized answer of diminish

19:31

the wellbeing of the population

19:33

affected and ultimately deny

19:36

in this case gay and bisexual mets the resources

19:39

that they need in order to combat

19:41

this virus in a one

19:44

other question we get his should

19:46

we be concerned about monkey pox mutating

19:49

and adapting like covered nineteen

19:52

has doctor roberts

19:53

yeah so a good thing and pox

19:55

virus is a large double stranded dna

19:58

genomes so does mute

19:59

much more slowly than an hour

20:02

and a virus like covered sars could

20:04

be too so the mutation rate should

20:06

be much lower but a paper did

20:08

come out recently showing

20:10

them or fifty single mutations

20:13

that have occurred already in the last few years

20:16

and that's probably as monkey pox

20:18

is adapting more to

20:20

spread human to human so

20:22

it can mutate it's almost certainly will

20:25

mutate but it should have a mutation

20:27

much much lower than and

20:29

uncovered nineteen

20:31

the very simple test for monkey pox

20:33

like we have for for kobe he

20:35

should we be testing more then

20:37

we are now

20:38

the lab can easily tested a monkey pox

20:40

virus genome or for the proteins

20:43

it's really easy to do the thing

20:45

that makes it more difficult his that diagnostic

20:47

labs have to be certified as

20:50

properly testing right so they have to test

20:52

that they get a certain you know very low number

20:54

of false positives in a very low number of false

20:57

negatives with a large sample of human population

20:59

so that's a much higher standard than

21:01

just being able to detect it

21:03

the research laboratory

21:04

so that's why it's different but the cdc

21:06

has been working with these clear

21:09

certified labs to make to

21:11

get them up and running and testing so that

21:13

we can test more samples at

21:15

a higher rate and i think that is important

21:17

because you know when you can't

21:19

find something sure not watching for

21:22

it and there could be rashes

21:24

in of showing up showing dermatologists

21:26

offices on gynecologists or

21:28

general health practitioners offices that

21:30

we really probably said test

21:33

can i clapper question duck program

21:35

i'm in curious because you know i've been grappling

21:37

with this this issue to is in

21:39

audrey seems that the that that illusions can

21:41

a crawl over the body it seems

21:43

like in this particular outbreak we are experiencing

21:45

right now in the game bisexual male population

21:48

there seems to be lesions that are manifesting

21:50

primarily in the general area is

21:52

that the a friend in the way it's

21:54

we've seen it in outbreaks in the past and

21:57

could that be it could that be

21:59

an f

21:59

and of changes in the virus

22:02

in the weights transmitted

22:03

so i'm not sure if the location

22:05

of the lesions relates to the mutating

22:07

and in humans you do more

22:09

frequently get get lesions on that

22:12

the skin above the face and

22:14

the genitals just because it's more thin

22:16

skin and it's easier to to create

22:18

lesions there but certainly

22:20

the sexual contact you know that's probably

22:23

some localized lease and to lease and

22:25

spread but then people are getting

22:27

even given on your hands your feet and you'll the

22:29

hands are specially problem because people walk around touching

22:32

things with their hands and they could be leaving

22:34

virus on surfaces and they get listens

22:36

and a mouse to

22:38

walker through then what a typical

22:40

person should be looking for in their own viruses

22:42

the thing that i worry about

22:44

is that the first symptoms can

22:47

be just like many illnesses you can

22:49

get fever chills the

22:51

tired and have muscle aches backache

22:53

respiratory symptoms so sore throat

22:55

and nasal naval can

23:03

they might have monkey pox for four

23:05

days and not know it so people could

23:08

get it in an end up transmitting it before

23:10

they realize that they have it

23:12

the teacher think i'm the

23:14

ft a announced this week that they'll be splitting

23:17

single doses of

23:19

the vaccine the most widely

23:21

used monkey pox vaccine into

23:23

five smaller doses to stress

23:25

the supply stuck to roper is that

23:28

is that approach to get more people vaccinated

23:30

they're changing the way to vaccine is injected

23:32

to run yes i think that's a reasonable

23:35

approach in assets

23:36

if you want to stimulate a good immune response

23:39

usually want to use a lot of antigen a lot

23:41

of the vaccine but i'm but you

23:43

can get a reasonable response

23:45

with a smaller amount of the antigen

23:47

that that's in the vaccine so again

23:49

have given are limited supply right now

23:52

i think it's probably a good idea to go

23:54

ahead and reduce the does like they are

23:56

planning to do and as the juniors

23:58

vaccine

23:59

the vaccine we had is called a cam two

24:02

thousand and it's very strong

24:04

and very effective but it has some safety

24:06

concerns and so that's why they're recommending

24:09

using the ginny

24:09

the vaccines now for monkey pox

24:13

in the back see now is talking about

24:15

being injected just underneath their skin

24:18

yeah the subcutaneous

24:20

they can two thousand and the reason

24:22

other old vaccine they put a drop a virus

24:24

on your skin and then

24:25

right or fifteen holes in your arms

24:27

i remember that a little babies

24:29

different version as simon seeing

24:32

simon seeing do that

24:33

yeah and then you will get us a lesion

24:36

a blister and eventually be scab over

24:38

and most of us who have had this vaccine have

24:40

a scar in our upper arm and sets

24:42

the round dime sized scar

24:44

on the upper arm of people that are you know fifty

24:46

years or older generally and

24:48

, now with the genius vaccine they don't

24:51

do that multiple whole

24:53

poking mechanism these to deaths

24:56

but they're injecting subcutaneous way

24:58

the

24:59

we've got a question from listener rate so

25:01

who wants to know if you think the smallpox

25:04

vaccine the be made available to

25:06

healthy adult as we ramp up production of

25:08

the monkey pox vaccine

25:09

though the smallpox vaccine is

25:12

the monkey pox vaccine smallpox

25:15

monkey pox and vaccine and vaccine virus

25:17

which is let the vaccine strain as are all

25:19

in the same genus they're closely

25:21

related viruses so

25:23

the government and the scientific community

25:25

has focused on small parts of the last

25:28

thirty years because that's really what we've been concerned

25:30

about so all of these vaccines and

25:32

drugs were designed for smallpox

25:34

but they also worked for monkey pox and that's

25:36

our current problems so that's why those

25:39

vaccines and drugs are being used for monkey

25:41

pox now

25:43

hope i got those scratches when i was a kid

25:45

are they still good that we still haven't

25:47

yet

25:48

probably do have some residual immunity

25:50

but immunity does win over time

25:52

so the older you get to the less

25:54

strong immune responses and also the

25:56

longer ago the you had the vaccine the less actually

25:59

you already have

25:59

protection from it

26:01

the matter this monkey pox

26:03

said circulating right now is

26:05

a less virulent strain

26:07

as the west african strain so that's

26:09

really good news it only has a

26:11

fatality rate untreated around one

26:14

percent and in the us we

26:16

have drugs for we have good medical treatments

26:18

so it is unlikely to kill

26:21

people in in the us it's

26:23

not going to be much more of a problem for someone who's immuno

26:25

compromised or also potentially

26:27

people that have eczema or other

26:29

skyn inflammatory conditions it would be more

26:32

dangerous for them and for pregnant

26:34

women it can cross the placenta

26:36

so it is danger for

26:38

for certain subgroups of of people

26:41

your line of questioning raises some interesting

26:43

ideas which is you know there are people

26:45

like myself who is fifty nine years old

26:48

right hook clearly had the smallpox vaccine

26:50

a knowing in an era you know and i'm

26:52

a game and right but i'm not a game and was twenty

26:55

five years old and socializing at

26:57

clubs every single night of my life and

26:59

god arm and a new

27:02

and makes me wonder as were seeking through

27:04

the the vaccination strategy and i

27:06

appreciate you know my colleagues comments that

27:08

you know you want to get as much vaccine and people's arms

27:10

as possible and on law this be

27:12

using the way that wasn't really tested for but

27:14

i can live with it but i wonder if

27:17

there should be some more nuanced thinking

27:19

about you know which members of the game

27:21

bisexual population might be most

27:24

you know in need of the vaccine should we

27:26

start with the twentieth thirty something and

27:28

the hiv positive populace i think i'm

27:30

not saying that i have the answers to these things

27:32

but i think there's there's a more complex

27:35

thinking that should go on that might

27:38

the benefit the whole population

27:40

generally are in a more effective way

27:43

this is a friday from w n y

27:45

c studios i

27:47

remember larry kramer saying

27:49

is an eighteen eighties that gay

27:51

people were getting infected because

27:55

they were having too much promiscuous sex

27:58

is set a kind of complexity

27:59

talking about the actually larry the

28:02

was a dear friend axis and we

28:04

should stop should stop stop so much

28:06

rampant anonymous sexual partner

28:08

and and the fact of the matter is only takes one

28:10

person to insecure with hiv south's

28:12

you know the choice of a wrong partner who

28:14

you are monogamous with itself and such you with

28:16

hiv know i think in this particular

28:18

situation i again i'm walking a fine

28:21

line here this problem we're

28:23

not a bad idea for individuals

28:25

who are not get vaccinated the

28:28

to consider their behaviors and

28:30

to use harm reduction strategies you

28:32

know to engage in sex perhaps not

28:34

close intimate contact perhaps you

28:36

know postponing until somebody is is

28:39

vaccinated there are things you can do to

28:41

protect yourself i'm we're not saying

28:43

that you should

28:44

point we stop having sex but perhaps

28:47

having sex that might not put you at risk in

28:49

the absence of a vaccinations niles

28:51

want to bring up the disparities he

28:53

who even has access to this limited

28:56

supply vaccines are

28:58

poor and black men have lower vaccination

29:00

rates right

29:01

i remember at the beginning of kobe doing

29:03

the serve interviews about you know

29:05

that the disease and how was spreading

29:07

and you know with reporters were asking me why

29:09

is it block at the black population

29:12

a lap puppy chow mcguire was surprised if this

29:14

when we look at health disparities in our country that into

29:16

manifest in those populations that have less

29:18

access that it's that are more marginalize

29:21

anything about the black community black population

29:23

as compared to the white populations you know certainly

29:25

more levels of discrimination in a less

29:28

economic wellbeing and as a result increased

29:30

health disparities so it just costs

29:32

manifesting the same way in the game

29:35

bisexual population the lgbt

29:37

population is not monolithic and the

29:39

latest data show that you know black

29:41

men are more likely to not be better

29:43

and more likely to be in fact with the monkey pox

29:45

in a very similar way that in the united

29:48

states a dodge or even sections

29:50

that we're seeing for hiv the

29:52

present time is young black

29:54

gay matt and so it's like you

29:56

history repeating itself your and i think

29:59

what the speaks to is making sure that we

30:01

provide access to

30:03

the vaccines in a way that's easy for

30:05

people who might not have the means

30:08

to like you know take off their of their work or travel

30:10

long distances you know to bring it

30:12

to neighborhoods that primarily sir

30:14

of racial racial ethnic minority

30:16

populations and you know being really

30:19

spurts egypt and getting the vaccines

30:21

in those arms of those folks who might not

30:23

normally have access to the virus that we

30:25

know and that would that's been around and

30:27

as insect in humans since since nineteen seventies

30:30

to were way ahead of the game or wish

30:32

our response

30:34

that are given that the fact that we've known about this

30:36

virus for such a long time

30:38

that place to end the great discussion thank

30:40

you both for illuminating

30:42

and earth tickets have to talk with his to

30:44

the same tier what

30:47

a pleasure thank you ira i can reach roper

30:49

virologist and professor microbiology

30:51

and immunology eats brody medical

30:53

school at east carolina university

30:56

has in greenville north carolina and

30:58

doctor perry how tedious p h

31:00

d dean of the rutgers university school

31:03

of public health for to take a break

31:05

and will come back when it's a dead sea

31:07

we live in could talk or

31:09

even write a sassy tell all memoir

31:11

now have this for you stay tuned

31:14

support for this program also comes from the winston

31:17

foundation

31:19

science friday hi my rough later

31:21

picture this you are a galaxy

31:24

a vast collection of stars planets

31:27

does the hot gas your

31:29

thirteen point six billion years old

31:31

you know pretty much everything and

31:34

you've decided to tell all that's

31:36

the premise of astronomer and folklorist

31:38

my i'm in tears new books the milky

31:40

way and autobiography of our galaxy

31:43

she tells the story of our galaxy

31:45

and the universe from the voice of

31:47

us sassy sometimes depressed

31:50

milky way and along the way

31:52

we meet our galaxy's love interest

31:54

and sentiments we spend time with

31:56

the bullying black hole at it's center

31:59

and we meditate the eventual death

32:01

of stars yes even

32:03

our star why does

32:05

or galaxy need to tell us all

32:07

of this and what can we earthlings

32:09

take away for are more mundane

32:11

planetary life doctor mcteer

32:14

joins me now to explains or them

32:16

back to the show

32:17

thanks so much or as really good to be here

32:20

your won't have you read this book

32:22

as if our galaxy were what

32:24

shall i say a celebrity right a character

32:27

in a tabloid gossips

32:29

figure galaxy has a real attitude

32:31

served as early as this a person right if

32:34

it's a person who is the milky way

32:36

oh

32:37

i think that the milky way is your

32:39

sassy friends who

32:42

might be a little reluctant to joy in all

32:44

of the friend group activities not

32:46

activities beyond say not say lady gaga but someone

32:49

with that definite clean energy

32:52

like that i like that how many

32:54

users personality as a way to tell

32:56

a story of the universe from

32:58

the beginning to the and really telling

33:00

it really really well how

33:03

many were after all these people whole

33:05

these other people have told stories about

33:07

the universe and have written about them why

33:10

does your story still need

33:12

telling it's

33:13

my story i read the milky way's

33:15

of when i was the opposing

33:17

this book and trying to figure out how i

33:19

wanted to write a book about the milky way i

33:22

was thinking about this very question who

33:25

am i more yeah mcteer to add

33:27

my voice to people like brian cheating

33:29

or michio kaku these people who have

33:31

been talking about the universe already and

33:34

i realized i don't have that much to

33:36

add but the milky way sir does so i

33:38

wanted to

33:39

use the science to craft a voice

33:41

and personality for the galaxy you

33:44

grocer was grocer was names that

33:46

the milky way as over over the aeons

33:49

how digits houses it's stick the word

33:51

milky way has that get to be it's name

33:54

according to the international astronomical

33:56

union which is in charge of official names

33:58

for all estrada the objects

34:00

the milky way he doesn't have an official name's

34:03

it's just called the galaxy but

34:05

in the west we tend to draw

34:07

a lot of our astronomy names

34:09

from classic ecology greek and roman

34:11

mythology which themselves are inspired

34:14

a lot by egyptian and babylonian

34:16

myths so the name milky

34:18

way probably comes to us from

34:20

greek mythology and it has to do with this

34:22

story where hara the

34:24

goddess of marriage and

34:27

the hearth see was

34:29

unbeknownst to her

34:32

forced to nurse baby

34:34

hercules and when she looks down and

34:36

realize that this

34:37

the not her baby that she

34:38

breastfeeding see pushed hercules

34:41

away and that sort of breastmilk

34:43

that came out of hercules mouth

34:45

was the milky way or and that's

34:47

that's where we get the word milky way

34:50

from and even where galaxy comes from

34:52

old greek for for milk galaxy

34:54

[unk]

34:55

why that is a great story what over

34:57

some of the other names and has from other cultures

35:00

there's so many i

35:02

, in the book i talk about an old

35:04

sinister mess where where

35:07

milky way is called the straw cease

35:09

way there are people who called the milky

35:11

way the way of the birds because it

35:13

looked like birds were following the path

35:16

of the milky way as they made their annual migration

35:19

annual , that if you look at myths

35:21

about the milky way from around the world you can

35:23

see that people hide

35:25

very similar thoughts on it a

35:27

lot of it was the this

35:29

is drawn out pass this diffuse

35:31

milky looking past but they're also

35:34

fun differences

35:35

the different cultures put in their math and

35:38

, should know because you're the only

35:40

person who ever graduated

35:42

from harvard a majoring

35:44

in both folklore hand

35:46

astrophysicist as

35:49

style of opposite ends of the spectrum

35:51

believe that's what most people

35:53

think when they hear it's but the more you start

35:56

thinking about that connections the more

35:58

overlap you see between them initially

36:00

it's oh you're gonna talk about constellations

36:03

or astrology but then when you think about it more

36:05

it's well maybe you can start comparing

36:07

creation myths from different cultures around

36:09

the world and see how they compared to ours big

36:12

bangs like scientific understanding

36:14

of cosmology it's and then that

36:16

direction i target was fictional

36:19

world building and and seeing how space

36:21

has influenced our culture and our full color

36:23

here on

36:24

because it it really has there's a lot

36:26

of influence there for example give me one

36:28

of the greatest influence

36:30

i mean we have used

36:33

the milky way to navigate to

36:35

keep time so there are a lot of practical

36:37

influences but even today

36:39

with modern astrology which has

36:41

roots in very practical useful

36:44

things i think it's something like seventy

36:46

million americans read their horoscopes

36:49

everyday so that is absolutely

36:50

the connection we have

36:52

the and yeah we still name satellites

36:55

in space missions and ah

36:57

and i all kinds of objects presented to space

36:59

after folklore

37:00

sure do yeah usually there

37:03

are like competitions

37:05

the competitions you will often or nasa

37:07

will often ask the public what they

37:09

think something should be named with the few options

37:12

and often those options are based on mythology

37:14

because now there's kind of a naming a

37:17

trend in place where

37:19

we wanted keep with that same

37:21

pattern of having constellations

37:23

and comments and

37:25

moons that we find we find solar system named after

37:28

creatures and and figures from folklore

37:30

what talk about the milky way social

37:33

life the milky way has friends

37:35

and yes romantic relationships with

37:38

other galaxies in his neighborhood that

37:40

we called the local groups which

37:43

is kind of true and realize what's what's going

37:45

on there

37:46

the milky way is just one of

37:48

about fifty or so galaxies

37:50

in this little neighborhood that you're right we

37:52

call the local groups and most

37:54

of those are tiny dwarf satellite

37:57

galaxies that orbit around the milky way's

37:59

or andromeda which is the other really

38:01

big galaxy in our neighborhood when

38:04

i was trying to think of the milky way

38:06

as a person it made sense that some

38:08

of it's neighboring galaxies would

38:10

be really annoying to the milky way's

38:12

and some that would be

38:15

more endearing and so the

38:17

large and small magellanic clouds or

38:19

larry and sammy as their as

38:21

called in the books they make they

38:23

make of appearances larry

38:26

is boring and gets

38:28

on the milky way's nerves but sammy

38:30

small magellanic cloud is more

38:33

of that the galaxy would consider a

38:35

friend and then andromeda is this

38:37

long term effects long

38:39

distance romantic partner that the milky

38:41

way has been courting for

38:43

millions of years

38:44

call it an absolute smoke so i

38:46

put enough effort at one point is

38:49

the syntax yeah andromeda thought

38:51

assess thought assess an and the

38:53

language you use it a set of sassy

38:56

it certainly is you see you as a communicator

38:59

finds that that language

39:01

is appealing to a certain demographic

39:03

you want to read something about like younger

39:05

people than normal astronomy

39:08

or astrophysics of books

39:10

no not really i don't

39:12

think that there was much strategy

39:14

in coming up with the voice of the milky way because

39:17

i have received some feedback that it's a

39:19

little too sassy for some people but

39:21

that says what made sense for me

39:23

at the times if you have this being

39:26

that has been alone for billions of years

39:28

and much of it's time is spent

39:30

creating stars that it knows

39:33

are going you die

39:35

eventually that it would be coffee

39:38

and it would have kind of a chip on

39:40

his shoulder so i wanted to stay true

39:42

to the science in that way

39:44

and the milky way is

39:46

a three dimensional galaxy emotionally

39:49

i mean it's depressed right

39:52

as a reveal yes when discussing

39:54

the emotional turmoil that it's

39:56

famous black hole said

39:59

jay start for

39:59

it's for it right

40:01

well what do you have against black holes

40:04

i was worried i would get

40:06

this questions i saw a

40:08

mixer have nothing against black holes

40:10

the professors but i was writing

40:13

this book during the pandemic i got the deal

40:15

to write it just a week before lockdown

40:17

happened in new york and i

40:20

myself was going through a lot of mental

40:22

health struggles over the past two

40:24

years so of course that was reflected

40:26

in the book that i wrote and i thought it may

40:29

be it could help other people are

40:31

throughout the the book the milky way

40:33

learns to games it's

40:35

inner turmoil a name it

40:37

calls the the black hole at the center of our galaxy

40:40

sarge and once it

40:42

gives it a name the milky way

40:44

can control more of

40:46

what it does around the black holes so

40:48

it learns how to not let all i

40:51

think variety and depression get to it in

40:53

a way that i have had to learn how

40:55

to do that over the last couple of

40:58

the thing that's really interesting in and you

41:00

do describe the physics

41:02

have a black hole and terms of gen

41:04

folks like me can understand you do it very

41:06

well and i thank you for that thank you the

41:10

milky way also think that

41:12

it is to be all of the phone catholic

41:14

cities said that know it is there really

41:16

such a special galaxy in the context

41:19

of all the good zillions of them in our universe

41:21

now not real

41:22

they are but have you ever been a big sis

41:25

in a small pond it's really easy to feel

41:27

like you are the biggest baddest saying

41:29

out there and in terms of the local

41:31

group in this neighborhood that the milky way spends

41:34

all of it's time interacting with yes

41:36

it is the biggest and baddest so that's

41:38

what informs it's personalities but if

41:40

it went to a nearby galaxy

41:43

cluster like the

41:43

virgo cluster for example it

41:46

would not be that big of a deal right and

41:48

the milky way takes credit for making

41:50

scientists say meet astronomers

41:53

better astronomers what they do is my

41:55

developing new tools and techniques

41:57

to study

41:58

we would

41:59

the have the technology if the milky way

42:02

weren't so interesting that we had

42:04

to study it's some people call astronomy

42:06

the oldest science and the milky way

42:08

is very proud that it was able to inspire

42:11

that type of creativity and curiosity

42:13

in human side

42:15

then in that science i find that you make a really

42:17

interesting observation about how

42:19

science by definition is usually

42:22

conducted by experimentation

42:24

but not astronomy a

42:27

quote some science is observational

42:29

in nature but not experimental

42:31

right

42:32

absolutely i have never

42:34

touched the stars i have never touched

42:36

the planet that wasn't earth and yet

42:38

i got my phd studying stars

42:41

and planets and how they move around the galaxy

42:43

so it we have observational

42:45

we can't create control groups

42:47

added that we make instead

42:49

we have to look out at all of the examples

42:52

the universe has given us say we're studying

42:55

a stellar evolution how stars change

42:57

over time we have to fight in stars

42:59

at different stages of the revolution

43:01

to study or weekend look at one star

43:03

and three sit over it's entire life because

43:06

they live a lot longer than humans

43:08

do

43:08

it's pretty hard to make one in our laboratory

43:11

exactly a hard and like might be pretty

43:13

dangerous ssssss

43:16

that

43:16

for the milky way wants to tell us about

43:18

the end i mean the end of the universe

43:21

that that the death of stars the

43:23

death of everything and from our own myths

43:25

about the end of the world's we have all

43:27

different kinds of myths about their they apocalypse

43:29

rights how it is the science of

43:32

cosmological collapse relate

43:34

to our own stories of creation

43:36

and deception and all these men

43:38

i love that question i think

43:40

it's really interesting that we

43:43

the only kind of recently in this grand

43:45

scale of humanity started

43:47

thinking about the ultimate end of the universe

43:50

because we only recently had the technology

43:53

to know what the universe was and

43:55

how it could end

43:56

but

43:57

the even though that's a recent thing human

44:00

in have thought about the end of the world

44:02

for a long as we have thought about the beginning of the

44:04

world i ,

44:06

that we assumed that things would

44:09

end because that kind of makes the time

44:11

we have precious i love

44:13

the way that you can can

44:16

are human lifespan and the fact that

44:18

we will die onto the biggest

44:20

things that we could possibly comprehend

44:22

like the universe which will also

44:24

die also in a way that makes it just like just

44:27

but of a lot bigger

44:28

it gives us a sense of our own mortality

44:30

yeah that and that's really important for us

44:32

to have

44:33

yeah yeah and and the milky way

44:36

is also sad about us because

44:38

we're not telling stories about and like we're

44:40

used to aunts and you are leave

44:42

us with said directive to start telling

44:44

these stories are exactly

44:46

where will these new myths come from

44:49

we are creating new mess

44:51

all the time there's a chapter in the book

44:53

called modern miss and i poke

44:55

a lot of fun at science fiction and especially

44:58

star trek or in an earlier version

45:00

of the book there was a there were a lot more digs

45:02

at star trek that you see in this final coffee

45:04

hang well i'm glad you brought that up because

45:07

wounded , digs about star trek and

45:09

other creatures that we make

45:12

up is a worry that

45:14

humanoid looking aliens on rocky

45:16

planets with breathe the bow atmospheres

45:19

or to give us the wrong idea

45:21

about what lies outside of our own solar system

45:25

and what to look for

45:26

the what we why should anything else

45:28

in the universe look like us when there is an amazing

45:30

diversity of planets out there that

45:32

vary in size the type of star they

45:34

orbits i think it's a lot

45:37

more interesting to think about

45:39

the aliens that way evolve

45:42

and adapt to the environments that they're in

45:45

and there it is so many fun environments out

45:47

there like why limit our imaginations

45:49

of stuff that looks like us

45:51

may want one last question about

45:53

sub the webb telescope by idea

45:55

i'm sure you've seen these wonderful images

45:58

what what do you think the suspect though about

46:00

the j w s t images that you

46:02

saw

46:04

hi

46:05

was blown away by how far

46:07

weaker the with t w s t for the

46:09

first time we were looking the galaxies

46:12

some of the first galaxies to ever form

46:14

in the universe and that gives us a

46:16

better understanding of where we came from and

46:18

where we might go eventually but i think

46:21

it also give us

46:23

a better sense of this scale

46:25

of time in

46:26

the universe one thing that i really wanted to

46:28

do in the spoke with get people to shift their

46:30

perspective

46:31

the them out from their tiny

46:34

scale both in time and space

46:36

and the more we can learn about the vast

46:38

expanse of the

46:39

the be easier that will be for

46:42

imagine aside the milky way

46:44

says that we need to rename the telescope

46:47

an hour we'd argue whether own galaxy

46:50

yeah they're as absolutely been

46:52

a plus in the astronomy community to rename

46:54

gw estes the milky way as

46:56

all for that because even though it's this

46:59

big they admit doesn't really care about us

47:01

it also thinks we're pretty silly for

47:04

judging people based on who they love

47:06

or what they look like so the milky way

47:08

for changing the name of jw sd

47:10

well that's a good place to stop i wanna thank

47:13

you for of for that this book it's a great

47:15

book thank you very much for writing a book and

47:17

for taking time to be with us today

47:19

thank you so much i'm really glad you enjoyed it

47:21

and it has been a blast talking to about

47:23

it

47:24

dr maurya mc tier astronomer

47:26

of folklorist and author of the book the milky

47:28

way an autobiography of our galaxy

47:31

that's coming out next week but you

47:33

can get a sneak peek on our website read

47:35

all about it that science friday dot

47:38

com slash milky way speaking

47:40

of great storytellers ever wonder

47:43

how authors make realistic and

47:45

alarming science fiction well

47:47

you can meet the team behind one genetic

47:49

engineering thriller and this month

47:51

sci fi book club pick on

47:53

tuesday july sixteenth at seven p m

47:56

will live stream with author blake crouch

47:59

and geneticist michael wiles who

48:01

helped make the science and blake's book

48:03

upgrade feel closer to life

48:06

go to saying it's friday dot com slash live

48:08

stream for details that science

48:10

friday dot com slash live

48:12

stream and that's about it for this our

48:15

here's the melissa mayor's with some of the folks

48:17

who helped make this show happen

48:19

thanks iraq

48:20

john duncan sky is art director of

48:22

news and audio

48:25

yeah to montana is i experiences

48:27

manager rami

48:29

is or controller

48:31

i'm an office manager walesa man

48:33

thanks for listening thank you walesa

48:36

feature , composer theme music

48:38

and a quick reminder it's a big weekend

48:40

for the proceed meteor shower

48:43

a full moon is gonna make it tough

48:45

but here's wishing you some good

48:47

viewing whether have a great weekend

48:50

i'm ira plato plato

48:52

david remnick and each week on the new yorker radio

48:54

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