0:00

Hello. Hello, Miss Paige. How are you?

0:04

I'm good. We are fantastic.

0:08

I'm loving that shirt. I'm feeling the background, the everything. Thank you.

0:13

My partner makes tie-dye shirts and they're so fun.

0:18

Like he's a banjoist and what he does, and he made banjo ones.

0:23

Oh my God, it's so cool. I love this. It feels like I'm in a massage parlor in your room.

0:30

I feel like a bedroom was the vibe of camping. We were like,

0:33

how can you make it feel like camping? And that's what we did.

0:36

And my therapy office, actually, I have a big tree mural in the background there too.

0:43

And I love it so much. People are always commenting. They're like,

0:46

I feel like I come into this office and they're just like, we're chilling on

0:50

a patio. That's like, that was the vibe.

0:54

I'm loving it. I'm like, I can hear rain. I don't know if it's raining,

0:57

but I'm like, ooh, the rain, the smell of the forest.

1:00

Don't you see the campfire in the corner? I saw the smoke coming up. We're good.

1:06

Right? How are y'all doing? We are awesome. Thank you for being so flexible.

1:12

I was so excited when you said you could do it because you were so far out in

1:15

the summer and I was like, Dirty Skittles is going to love her some Paige. Love her.

1:22

I love it. Yeah, I'm so glad it worked out. Yeah, but it's so lovely to meet you.

1:26

You like she's

1:29

gonna lay back she's gonna take a little nap get comfy she's

1:33

like i'm gonna just settle in we're ready i love getting

1:36

cozy and it's so funny the majority of the

1:39

clothes i wear people like i don't

1:41

get oh that looks really cool it's always you look

1:44

so comfortable and i'm always like i

1:47

am so whether that was out of criticism or not

1:50

i'm like you're right i am so comfortable my

1:54

friends tease me because they're like oh we're back

1:57

home Sharon's gonna put her comfy pants on I like live

2:00

in like super comfy like yoga pants like the hoodie

2:03

the hat like I'm like look I'm just here to be myself and feel good I need the

2:09

fancy or tight jeans I work from home I wear sweats 24 7 all right I'm cool

2:15

yeah like you don't like it you see me from the top we're good Yup.

2:22

You would have been so excited. We went and saw Wanda Sykes last night in Rochester.

2:28

How was that? Oh, my God. She was so funny. So, I'm so exhausted because it's two hours away.

2:34

So, we drove up last night, stayed, drove home. I left there at 6.30 this morning. We got home.

2:42

What time did I text you? Like, I think we got home at nine.

2:45

And then we record all day. So, I've had like four coffees, a Coke,

2:49

and now I'm having some water because I had the shakes.

2:51

So we're good you're wired

2:55

up you're ready to go not the best self-care but you know what in

2:58

the moment is i'm good it's so good when we can do these different like activities

3:04

that are outside of our norm that is so like fulfilling for our mental health

3:09

but then also it's like now i don't get as much sleep or some of our other like

3:13

routine stuff but it's doing it for the fun Yeah.

3:18

Need it sometimes. We shake things up. We do.

3:21

So do you want to do the intro or do you want me to do it? Go for it. You're on a roll.

3:27

Music.

3:44

I'm on a roll. Ready? Ready. Three. Three. Two. Two. One.

3:50

Welcome back to another episode of Shit That Goes On Our Heads.

3:54

Today we have an amazing guest, Paige. Welcome, Paige.

3:57

And an amazing partner in crime, Dirty Skinless.

4:02

Woohoo! We need like a track. You know what I'm saying? With people cheering.

4:06

Oh yeah. I'll get right on it with the editor. Yeah, can you get a cheering track?

4:13

Just record me. I'll keep doing different, you know. voices.

4:19

Welcome, welcome. How's your day? How's it started so far?

4:23

Which one of us? Yeah, I'm going to let Paige go because Sherry knows how my day's been.

4:29

Yeah, I just heard about your crazy catching. I just got up because last night

4:33

I was just doing gardening stuff and I got really caught up in it.

4:37

And so I just kept going until way later than usual.

4:40

And because here in BC, it's actually only like nine in the morning still. So...

4:45

Whoa, what kind of gardening stuff? Oh, I was just planting all of like the

4:49

things that I'm trying to get for like seedlings for my balcony.

4:52

So this year I decided I'm going to go all out and get lots of little veggies

4:57

and like lavender and tons of different little bits and pieces out there.

5:02

So I have a hutch inside of my house that we've turned into a greenhouse as well.

5:09

Nice. So we're going to have little seedlings in there so that I can plant them

5:12

on the balcony later. So that's what I was up to all day yesterday.

5:16

That's really cool. My son's school today for Earth, like they're calling the Earth Day thing.

5:21

We got to go, they have a garden and he's in kindergarten.

5:25

And we got to go to the garden and buy seedlings and different kinds of plants.

5:29

So I just went and got like four different kinds of tomato plant.

5:34

Cucumbers, like scallions, all kinds of stuff.

5:36

So I'm very excited to, it's his plants, you know?

5:39

Oh, that's so fun. I'm so thankful for the gardening knowledge my mom gave to

5:44

me when I was younger, because we had a massive garden. That's where we got

5:48

most of our fruit and veggies. That's awesome. So can you grow tomatoes off of your balcony?

5:54

So my balcony is super duper windy. So the poor tomatoes get tossed a little bit too much.

6:01

They go on some adventures out there. So this year I was like,

6:04

okay, the peppers seem to do okay out there. So we'll have the peppers and all that jazz, has but the poor tomatoes i'm

6:09

probably like they're probably getting thrown off the balcony i

6:12

wouldn't be surprised can you imagine walking by and then all of a sudden like

6:19

a tomato it just reminds me of like the that movie like or the tv series of

6:23

looney tunes and when everybody didn't like some something or didn't think it

6:27

was funny they throw tomatoes and like could you imagine walking by me like,

6:31

I thought I was hilarious. The universe is just tossing tomatoes.

6:39

I'm so excited that you're here, Paige, when we connected about a month ago.

6:44

Just your journey and just everything you're doing for the community.

6:48

And tell us about you. Tell us about your life.

6:52

Yeah. My life is surrounded by around mental health and well-being.

6:57

Not only for the other people, but for myself too. who I have been in this,

7:02

or I was a psych nurse since 2009.

7:06

And actually, just officially this month, I am no longer a nurse.

7:10

I was able to remove that off of the resume.

7:14

And I'm no longer a registered nurse, but I am a clinical counselor.

7:18

And that journey started in 2019 when I decided to go back to school,

7:23

which I never thought I was going to do. I was like, I'm going to be a psych

7:25

nurse for life. And then suddenly I realized the health care system was really stressful. Shocker.

7:32

I went back to school in 2019. So pre-pandemic shenanigans. So I already knew

7:39

I was planning on exiting at the time.

7:42

And it's only become more and more of a hostile work environment over the years. Wow.

7:49

I can't imagine how stressful that would have been.

7:53

How long did you say you did it for? 15 years

7:56

15 years yeah 2009 and then

7:59

my last shift i ever picked up was april of last

8:02

year and so of april 2023 was the

8:05

last shift i've picked up so it it shifted and changed in ways that i never

8:10

thought it was going to happen being a nurse was a sustainable career previously

8:15

and nowadays you're not seeing a lot of people nursing to retirement it's nursing

8:21

getting a a side hustle and then completely separating and severing that tie.

8:26

Yeah. What drove you to that industry? Yeah. What got me into the industry was

8:31

I was one of the rebel kids. I was one of the outcast kids.

8:34

I grew up in a very small town of 800 people.

8:37

And so a lot of the kids I got along with were really struggling with their mental health.

8:42

Now, of course, me as an adult looking back, I was like, oh,

8:44

they were probably going through some pretty traumatic childhood stuff.

8:47

And they were in and out of hospitals and they would be complaining about their

8:51

psych nurses saying how much of a B-I-T-C-H as they were.

8:54

And I was like, wait a minute, wait a minute. I don't have to become a doctor

8:58

to work with people with their mental health.

9:01

That's dope. And so as of grade nine, I knew I wanted to be a psych nurse because

9:06

my friends were in and out. I wanted to be the cool psych nurse and the one who made people actually feel

9:10

happy, not feel controlled.

9:14

Wow. Wow. Kudos to you. Dude, so when you first started that,

9:19

that journey, was it rewarding? Like, were you like, this is exactly where I want to be?

9:23

Wow. So from nine years old, you get there and you're like, this is it.

9:27

Can I ask you questions about it? Absolutely. Yeah, it was grade nine. It was grade nine when I went into it. Yeah.

9:34

That makes more sense. I'm like, damn, at nine years old? I was so convinced

9:39

I was going to be a famous rock star, which I've had different times of doing

9:43

music in my life, but I didn't ever hit stardom.

9:47

So yeah for sure ask questions what

9:50

i wanted to get to right so you start this industry what was your

9:53

day-to-day like i what did you do how did it start what was the day in the life

9:58

of psych nurse yeah so i was in a pretty small community when i first started

10:04

so it was only a 10-bed unit which was great especially for like a newbie nurse

10:08

so i would get on shift we would do shift change reports.

10:12

I would go prepare the medications that were the morning medications.

10:15

We'd touch base with the psychiatrist, give him a lowdown on what the day was looking like.

10:19

And then often throughout the day, we'd be doing the other in-between tasks

10:24

of providing medications, helping them get certain things sorted out for their home lives.

10:30

I would be able to do some counseling-related work and also lots of admission

10:34

and discharge stuff and And just chatting with the physicians and things.

10:38

But my favorite part then and always has been my interactions with the patients

10:43

and being able to kind of get into those, deeper things that are holding them back from being able to live the lives that

10:51

they were really wanting to live. And yeah, I absolutely loved it for quite some time. And then I moved in 2016.

11:02

Yeah, 2016 to Kelowna, where it was a much bigger space.

11:06

The space I originally went into was Psychemerge. And so that was a very different

11:11

experience because the people when When they'd come in crisis,

11:15

and I would be doing the assessments and working with the physicians to choose

11:19

what was their next path. So I'd provide medications, I would do an interview, I would admit or help the

11:25

person find access to resources in the communities.

11:28

But even at that time period, at that mark, that's when the opioid crisis started really growing.

11:35

And alongside the opioid crisis has

11:38

also been like a huge increase in stimulant use

11:42

especially meth in on the west coast for sure and

11:44

i know that it's a little bit of everywhere but stimulants also increase our

11:48

risk of violence in the workplace and there's only so much we can do when a

11:54

person continues to be struggling in their cycle of addiction and so we'd have

11:59

people people returning over and over again.

12:02

And as much as I wanted to be able to feel the same genuine support every single

12:09

admission, something wears on you when you know that what you're doing is not

12:13

hitting the mark. And I know it's not just the patient.

12:16

It's also the fact that our systems don't have enough of the things in place

12:19

for people to have longevity in their health. And so with counseling, I can work alongside a person and we can create a plan together.

12:28

They feel the full autonomy of it. It's not just focused around medication.

12:32

It's focused around so much more. And I love to empower that autonomy in people,

12:37

which a hospital environment just can't do. It's not the same.

12:40

Because also, because of increases in lawsuits and people being more mindful

12:45

of things as well in patient care, hospitals started to cover their butts.

12:50

That's the amount of paperwork I was doing was unbelievable.

12:54

And for some reason at the hospital here, they kept thinking that we're like

12:58

on psych, we don't do anything apparently. So they kept giving us the trials of the new paperwork.

13:03

So we were trying to figure out like we're under, it took an hour and a half

13:08

to do an admission on our floor while the pediatric floor for the kiddos,

13:13

15 minutes is what was told to me.

13:17

I was like, you have got to be kidding me.

13:20

Wow. So how did you take care of yourself through that?

13:23

Because I feel like, and this might be coming just from a completely narrow

13:27

point of view, but I feel like I would be, a little bit of my heart would go

13:32

out to everybody I talk to. So if I hear something sad, how do you cope with that? How do you take care

13:38

of yourself at the end of the workday? Totally. And that was one of the things that people didn't really talk about

13:43

for us in the mental health world. I'm just snagging a good glass of water because I actually had a professor in

13:50

university say to my class you're about to be a psych nurse you no longer get

13:54

to have a mental illness no way no way really.

14:02

Really, I love the reaction on your faces of clear like, what?

14:10

Yeah. Yeah. You don't become a robot. You're not programmed now to never have

14:16

feelings and emotions and thoughts. That's crazy.

14:18

So I just thought you just don't feel, you know? And if you did feel that there

14:23

was something wrong with you. And so that for me was a very telling sign of what the culture of healthcare

14:30

really truly can have and hold is that we are expected to be professionals always.

14:36

Even in our contracts that we sign, most hospitals have something in their contract

14:39

that is aligned with, you can't shit talk them and you can't,

14:43

and you always have to show up for your profession.

14:46

And that's the same with a lot of our regulatory bodies too.

14:49

We have to put on the persona of a professional all of the time,

14:52

inside of work and outside of work. And as much as I agree with maintaining like respect for the career,

14:59

I do not agree that we suddenly become inhuman.

15:03

Right. Right. Right. It reminds me of like a very militant point of view, right?

15:08

Like you are this thing now and you can't have emotions and you can't like...

15:12

And you are a robot and you will do as I say and not as I do.

15:16

Yeah. Just forget about yourself. Yeah. Caregivers, but we're not allowed to care.

15:21

Right. Not about yourself, at least. Never. Definitely not about us.

15:25

No, we have to be self-sacrificing. pricing for life. Right,

15:28

right. How frustrating.

15:31

But to answer your original question, I did not take care of myself.

15:35

Yeah. I didn't think I was supposed to.

15:38

And when did you start taking care of yourself? As soon as you left the profession?

15:42

It was actually in 2020 when I had a workplace mental health injury and went off work for 10 months.

15:48

I had a moment where it was a shift that That I was feeling good about.

15:54

It's the beginning of January. I was on with two other badass nurses.

15:58

Stepped into the shift. And I just had this one patient interaction for a really

16:03

prolonged period of time. And it actually...

16:07

Something switched in my brain where my fight or flight was activated to a point

16:12

that I'd never experienced.

16:14

And looking back, I don't actually think I'd ever experienced anger.

16:19

Anger. I think anger was an emotion that I had shoved very deeply down that

16:23

I wasn't allowed to have. I wasn't allowed to get upset.

16:27

I'm like the sugar and spice and everything. Nice, because I'm a girl.

16:30

And so there was this inner dialogue of like, we're not angry people,

16:35

like those kinds of things. And did I know it at the time? No, because I didn't listen to my inner world

16:40

before. I very much ignored it. And so yeah, it wasn't until I hit a point where I had no option but to take

16:46

care of myself where I started to. Right.

16:50

What lessons did you learn in the beginning of taking care of yourself?

16:54

Oh, that it is... If you don't know that you're allowed to feel better,

17:01

if you don't know that you're allowed to take care of yourself,

17:03

there is a whole heck of a lot of shame and guilt that comes along with taking care of yourself.

17:09

Yeah. That was the biggest thing that I learned right there.

17:11

I knew I couldn't function. I couldn't even think about mental health. I couldn't talk about it.

17:16

Couldn't think about it. Couldn't even mention the hospital without going into

17:18

a panic attack. I was completely debilitated by my mental health.

17:23

I had extremely high symptoms of PTSD at that time.

17:28

And the thing that kept going on in my head was...

17:32

And I look back now and I'm like, oh my gosh. But the loop that went back in

17:35

my head was they didn't even hit you.

17:38

What's wrong with you? Because I wasn't physically assaulted.

17:41

I completely minimized my body's response to a traumatic event. Wow.

17:49

And so after that, did you start, did you go into therapy for yourself?

17:55

Yes. So I had already, I'd already been seeing a therapist. I guess that was

17:58

one of my elements of self-care was that I did, I did start seeing a therapist,

18:03

I think a year before that incident.

18:08

Cause I knew I didn't feel good. I didn't know what I needed,

18:11

but I just thought maybe I just need a career change.

18:14

So that's why I was like, Oh, let's go back to school. it'll be dope but anyways

18:17

with my counselor I got in touch with her immediately and

18:20

I said something's wrong and I don't know what it is and so

18:24

I was I got connected with her and she started

18:27

doing eye movement desensitization and reprocessing with me or EMDR and then

18:33

after me talking with the disability management team over and over and regurgitating

18:39

my story to so many people which which was re-traumatizing with it itself.

18:44

I'm like panic attacking on the phone every single person.

18:49

But eventually they hooked me up with an occupational therapist and she and

18:52

I did exposure therapy together. And so that all was going on right when the pandemic started too.

19:00

So then there was that all at the same time.

19:03

And then the guilt and shame associated with not being beside my co-workers

19:08

in that event also then sunk in. And so, yeah, really having to kind of process through.

19:17

Yeah. Suddenly I'm feeling anger and not knowing what's true and being like,

19:22

what is this? This feels horrid. Right. That is crazy. That is so crazy.

19:27

And, you know, I'm sure like with your co-workers, you guys would trauma bond, right?

19:33

Like trying to just help each other out of those difficult situations.

19:37

Because if you're not allowed to talk about it, you're not allowed to feel it,

19:41

then how do they expect you to not feel it?

19:46

Have some sort of mental health crisis because of that, right?

19:50

Like, I know from my own experience, not talking about it, you know,

19:54

not being able to find my voice or find my footing and just holding it all in

19:58

was probably worse for me than if I'd just been able to find my voice to begin with.

20:05

But I'm so happy that you were able to get the help that you needed.

20:10

Yes, because so many don't. So many people don't get the help they needed because

20:13

they didn't fill out the right paperwork when it happened. So because I knew

20:16

right away something was wrong, I just sat down, did the claim,

20:21

did the incident report. Because there's paperwork that people have to do. You have to make the call.

20:25

You have to do the report. You have to do all these different things.

20:28

And I did that. And I reached out to my manager to let her know that I wouldn't

20:33

be at my next shift and what happened. And the response was the one that in the nursing world, we always make fun of

20:40

this because management often says, well, what could you have done better?

20:43

Is usually their response is like well

20:46

what where was your learning opportunity it's like too soon girlfriend too soon

20:49

yeah yeah emailing you right now through tears is very telling about how i'm

20:55

feeling but she gave me a very minimizing response to what what had occurred

21:02

one of the the elements that prompted the dysregulation in the person that the

21:06

patient interaction was they wanted

21:09

something from their purse but it was filled with exposed needles

21:12

and because of that I said I'm so sorry but like it's just too dangerous for

21:18

me to go in there and that for her was too much for her system to to take and

21:24

that's where it spiraled but well my manager they their response was we'll just

21:28

use the stick proof loves. And I'm like, okay, well, I guess I'll just bring the bag to you next time.

21:34

No problem. You can use them. I have the right to do this unsafe work.

21:38

I don't know about you, but I do. Yeah.

21:42

Wow. Holy shit. Okay. So you kind of are like propelled into this journey now,

21:48

right? You're switching careers. Did you stay going in school through

21:51

the pandemic? Were you able to do it remotely and keep doing all that?

21:54

Yeah. Because luckily it was all fully remote from the beginning because I wanted

21:59

to be able able to continue nursing throughout my schooling.

22:01

And so, yeah, I was doing my schooling at... So yeah, I was doing my master's

22:06

at the same time as I was doing all my trauma healing. Wow.

22:10

That's tough. It was really hard.

22:14

It was a really hard time period. And yet I look back and I also think being

22:19

a nurse prepares you for hard things at the same time.

22:23

So instead of allowing myself to just rest, which would have been likely much better serving for me,

22:29

I went harder because I was almost trying to prove something to myself so that

22:34

I could still feel productive and still feel like I was doing something,

22:39

even though really my worth should not be being held to what I can produce anyways. Right.

22:46

This is the second... Are you noticing a theme so far, G-Rex, for this?

22:51

It's like the second person we've talked to today where it feels

22:54

like there's this like fiber of like how do we define our

22:57

worth and productivity like what is productivity mean because it

23:00

doesn't have to be you know what your employer expects of

23:03

you or you know how much money are you making like

23:06

there is something there where it's the

23:09

substance of life right because the only person you

23:12

need to prove it to is you you don't need to be out

23:15

there proving it to somebody else you know as long

23:18

as you're feeling better inside you know that you're you're

23:21

a good person that you you belong to society

23:24

that you're doing stuff that makes

23:27

you happy that's all that should really matter right like those outside forces

23:32

because it shouldn't really affect how you live your day-to-day life okay i'm

23:40

gonna preface this right probably should have learned this before i was 60 But

23:44

I'm going to tell you, between the time that I was 59,

23:47

the very next day I turned 60, when I turned 60, I was like, I don't fucking care.

23:52

I don't care what people think about me, right?

23:55

And so for our listeners, like, do shit that makes you happy,

24:00

not somebody else, right? Do it for you.

24:04

And don't wait until you're 60 to figure that out. Because if I figured that

24:07

out in my 40s, I'd probably be in a different place in my life.

24:11

But you know i'm really happy page that you were able to do that for you right

24:17

because workplaces can be so hard on you right and they can take so much life out of you and.

24:26

People don't realize how hostile those environments can be.

24:30

And it's not just in the nursing field. It is across the board in every type of work experience.

24:36

And I think that people don't realize that, you know, there's help out there

24:41

that you can get. And there's not just one type of therapy.

24:44

Like Dirty Skills likes to call it, speed date your therapist.

24:49

Speed date. Oh, that's brilliant! Yeah, ask the important shit up front before. I mean, for me,

24:55

I mean, I went to what, three therapists. The third one was the one that it made sense. It worked.

25:02

But the very first one I went to, I remember just being like too shy.

25:05

Like I thought, oh, if I wasn't fulfilled or getting something out of it was me.

25:09

There was something wrong with me. Like I'm just not ready for it or I, you know, whatever.

25:14

And I put it on a pause. And then I went to the second one and I'm like,

25:19

okay, I'm going to be more aggressive because I know kind of what you were saying

25:22

where I knew something was not right, but I didn't know what it was.

25:27

So I needed to talk to somebody. So immediately the second one, I speed dated them. I'm like,

25:32

okay, can you talk to me about this? And that's the way to do it because they're upfront and honest.

25:36

They're like, actually, no, it's not where I specialize. But, you know, here's this other person, maybe try reaching out to them.

25:41

And boom, that was the one. I love her to death.

25:44

But... Oh, that's so, so good that you knew to continue.

25:49

In your like because it is so awful when we

25:52

go to see someone that words page

25:55

sometimes it takes me a moment to organize them

25:58

in there when we're seeking support we're in

26:01

such a vulnerable position because we're not often looking for counselors or

26:04

mental health support when we're feeling right it's not usually and so there's

26:10

like it's the level of vulnerability and i i feel like There's this idea that

26:14

every therapist knows how to treat and support every patient.

26:20

Thing that comes through their doors. And I have quite a diverse range of what

26:26

I can work with because of my psych nursing background. So I'm incredibly grateful.

26:30

But there are so many areas of specialization that exist.

26:35

And finding the right match for you can be such a personality related thing as well.

26:41

Because if I don't vibe with their personality, if their personality

26:44

doesn't make me feel safe enough to be vulnerable even

26:47

if that that it's even if it's just awkwardness within

26:51

itself is something saying something's not

26:54

matching up here right it's just an emotion being like i feel uncomfortable

26:58

and if their space doesn't make you feel comfortable or their personality doesn't

27:03

just bring that auto comfort then it's going to be so much harder you're not

27:07

going to be able to dive deeper into that stuff because your body's saying no yeah that's exactly

27:12

right I that first therapist I didn't feel comfortable

27:16

and I think it was I it related to not

27:19

feeling safe so I just remember them giving a bunch of paperwork like oh

27:22

here's this paper it'll help you get through that and I'm like okay whatever

27:25

but I just it didn't stick it was the

27:28

last one I felt safe I felt comfortable we meshed like

27:31

our personalities and yeah I was able to be myself

27:34

and be vulnerable and be open and I the

27:38

greatest thing ever yeah and and like with me

27:40

like my first therapist like she just wanted me to go to a bunch of groups okay

27:44

I don't want to be in a group session right I need to just talk to one person

27:49

like don't push me off onto somebody else because I'm already having a hard

27:53

enough time finding my own fucking voice right to tell you what's going on yeah you know.

28:00

And thankfully for me, because I live in a really remote area,

28:03

I don't have to go and see them face to face.

28:05

I can do it over the Internet, which is perfect for me. Right.

28:09

But that may not work for everybody else. But there are people out there that can help.

28:14

And if you're really stuck and you're feeling in a very vulnerable position,

28:21

there's phone numbers you can call. Like here in the States, you can call 988.

28:25

I believe that's the same number in Canada.

28:28

And we just implemented that like a couple

28:31

months ago in Canada yes 988 and it's

28:34

such a great resource right you don't have to give your name you

28:37

the person on the other end is super empathetic they

28:41

get you the resources you need because the very next day

28:44

for me I was in therapy I didn't really

28:47

like my therapist went on to a second therapist by

28:50

the third therapist I'm stuck I see her twice a week still

28:52

you know such a better place and I'm

28:56

a firm believer in therapy and i do i

28:59

do different kinds of therapies too so i do a little hypnosis too

29:02

i'm doing that for sleep now because insomnia sucks okay just gonna tell you

29:08

it sucks but just another kick in the nuts it is you're not feeling good and

29:13

guess what you don't ever get to sleep yeah you never escape it now you can

29:18

just never escape it ever have fun yeah exactly goodbye.

29:27

Oh my goodness. Okay. So you transition into this first.

29:34

One thing I don't want to forget to say, I kudos to you, right?

29:38

Because you had this career. You knew, I mean, you started it because you were passionate about talking with people.

29:45

But you're in this career, you have a traumatic event, it causes a shift in

29:50

yourself, in your life, everything. But instead of completely shying away from anything having to do with this,

29:56

you still pursued that kind of core passion of still working with people.

30:00

So I just wanted to say kudos because I know I probably would have pulled completely

30:05

away. I'm very extreme personality.

30:08

I'd be like, nope, fuck everything having to do with that. like never

30:11

going back there but i that's not necessarily the right

30:13

path right so but i love that acknowledgement of

30:17

it because that's like our fight or flight kicking in right like and

30:20

right for me although i never really experienced anger i had to experience the

30:25

urgency is associated with the fight response so a fight response for me is

30:29

do something and so yeah i just did did a bunch of things to try and tell the

30:37

body like look we're doing the thing. I'm scratching that itch I'm doing it yes yes and

30:43

so for me I'm my my I'm

30:46

more lean into like the fight response versus the flight response that's

30:49

just how my nervous system goes and I already

30:52

had kind of determined I was probably going to

30:55

be specializing in supporting health care providers before I

30:58

even started my schooling after that workplace incident the most healing thing

31:04

that I did was once I settled into the comfortability of being a human being

31:10

and giving myself compassion and working through that inner dialogue of I need something to prove,

31:16

I shared my story in a blog post.

31:19

And I'm even just tearing up even just thinking about it because the response I got from other

31:29

nurses who felt heard because no one no one had shared what they had went through

31:37

with me I thought I was flawed I thought I was broken because I didn't know

31:44

others other people's story, and that the moment when someone said to me if this could happen to you it can happen to anyone,

31:54

it reminded me of how fucking badass I actually am.

32:01

Complete badass. Complete badass.

32:05

And that comment from that person and all of the other people who shared their

32:11

journeys and their stories with me sparked a fire in me that now there is no

32:16

doubt in my mind in any way,

32:18

shape or form that I will change the culture of healthcare care and I will bring

32:24

humanity to health care. That's so awesome because like with my journey, you know, I started sharing

32:30

on social media like right away and nobody knew.

32:35

Dirty Skills didn't know. She's my manager. She had no idea how depressed I was.

32:39

But as soon as I started sharing my story, people thanked

32:42

me because now they didn't feel so alone

32:45

and so terrified in their own journey and that's really how

32:48

the whole podcast came together right it's because

32:51

we wanted to share those stories and give people resources and maybe a little

32:56

levity and giving them a place to feel that they are heard and that they're

33:05

seen and i couldn't do this without dirty skittles because,

33:11

you know, she keeps me on my up and up.

33:15

I think, yeah, I don't need, I don't take any credit.

33:19

I just... Well, you let me talk about squirrels, so, you know.

33:23

That's true. That's true. I want to say that the two, the both of you, right? Like you sharing it in a

33:29

blog post, G-Rex, you sharing it on social media, just how brave that is because...

33:38

I can't... And maybe this is the flight, right? This is the flight in me.

33:41

I can't imagine doing that.

33:44

It's just... And I sometimes question it.

33:48

I'm like, I wonder if it has to do with your time is your time when you're ready to do it, right?

33:52

Don't force yourself into this because everybody else is, right?

33:57

But that takes a lot of guts to be brave because you're being vulnerable out

34:02

in the open for anybody who's going to read this thing to consume and know who you are.

34:08

And I think that is such a brave thing

34:10

so both of you credit like you're not

34:13

only sharing your story but you're you are bringing

34:16

the humanity to it you're putting a face to this thing that

34:19

a lot of us feel but you would never know because we're not going to tell you

34:24

right we're barely admitted to ourselves so to put it out there for the world

34:28

to see I mean congrats you guys are doing huge shit it took me a long time to

34:33

get where I'm at but you know Paige I saw this quote the other day and it's so fitting.

34:38

And it says, sometimes the bravest thing you can do is give voice to your struggles.

34:43

Sharing your story might just be the key that unlocks someone's prism.

34:48

And it's truth, right? Like people, but for me, it was hard, right?

34:53

I needed help to be able to give my voice.

34:56

I needed help to like say it was okay because at my age, you know, I'm 60.

35:01

You know, we were all taught, you shove that shit down. You don't talk about it.

35:05

You don't and it gets to a point where

35:09

it did on christmas day that i couldn't talk about it i'm i was just terrified

35:13

and you know thank god 988 thank god my wife was home and thank god for some

35:18

guardian angel i don't know who it was but thank you for whoever you were because

35:22

i'm here today and i'm alive and i'm so very thankful for that.

35:26

Because I'm in such a better place. And I'm so glad that you're doing what you need to do, Paige.

35:34

Not just for yourself, but for others. Others. And for your practice. You guys are badass.

35:41

I'm so incredibly proud of each and every person who works alongside me.

35:47

My clients as well as my colleagues. Because I have a group practice. and that

35:54

that also wasn't anticipated right off the hop it

35:57

was a year by myself and then one of my girlfriends was

36:00

like hey i want to hang out with you more and i want to work with you it's

36:03

like sure why not and then within a year it grew to eight of us wow and so it

36:09

was like a massive learning curve but my entire my entire goal because i've

36:15

structured it a little differently than some of the other practices in Canada

36:19

with like some lower splits. I want them to feel so valued financially and like socially.

36:28

And just, I want to keep people in the field. I am so anti-burnout club. I am so anti-supremacy.

36:34

I'm just very, how can we just acknowledge our humanness and live within our humanness?

36:41

Because the more we keep trying to work outside of our human capabilities,

36:45

in a world that is very overstimulating.

36:50

Yeah. The more burnt out and more distracted and the less we can actually enjoy

36:55

and the more fight or flighty we're going to feel or even worse,

36:57

getting into that state of freeze, that numbness, that inability to even experience

37:01

emotions anymore because our body is shut down.

37:04

Yeah. And while you were going through this page, was your family supportive of you? Did you feel...

37:13

You were being supported. Yeah, I definitely did. My mom was in the healthcare field as well.

37:19

And I know that all of their comments were so well-meaning, but they would say,

37:25

well, why don't you just go back? If you're avoiding the place, isn't that going to be a problem?

37:29

And I get exactly where they're coming from. And I totally get from where their

37:33

generation knows. It's like, just go, just go do the thing. And then eventually,

37:36

you'll get used to it again. And I'm like, I don't really want to flood my system. I'm doing exposure therapy.

37:43

Exposure therapy is safely returning back where I feel a bit yucky,

37:48

but not crisis level yucky.

37:50

Because if I had just been popped right back up on the intensive psych ward,

37:54

my body would have panicked incredibly.

37:57

Because even after months of transitioning to even step foot in the hospital

38:01

for the first time I was in there, I sat down in the lobby.

38:04

So I wasn't even on the floor of where I had my workplace injury.

38:09

My heart rate shot up to 192, which is very high.

38:15

So that to me was a very physiologic piece of measuring tool of looking at my

38:23

Fitbit and going, oh, I'm really not okay.

38:27

And that was months into the journey. And that was actually around the time

38:32

I probably wrote that blog post because there was something thing about seeing

38:35

that physiological evidence, my body thinks I'm going to die here.

38:40

Yeah. Was just like mind blowing. Yeah.

38:45

Cause you're not, it's, it makes it real, right?

38:48

Like it's, I can see this and it's like the two align, right?

38:53

Like what I'm feeling. And then what I see, it's like a exact reputation representation

38:57

of like something is wrong. Yes.

39:01

Cause before I was like, maybe I'm just making too big of a deal out of it.

39:04

But when my body, when I had that physiological body response there and I was

39:09

like, Oh, yeah. I'm not bullshitting myself.

39:13

Right. You're like acknowledging yourself. Yeah.

39:19

Yeah. So my family was very supportive in listening to my story and my journey and everything.

39:26

But of course, what they themselves and so many other people said,

39:30

it was not just them. Like, why don't you just go back and see how it goes?

39:33

Well, I found out even in the middle of my exposure.

39:36

And then eventually I was working again on that unit. So I was working on that

39:41

unit by the end of my nursing career again.

39:44

And so I was able to get there and be there.

39:47

But I was so happy to be able to go back and have a different lens.

39:54

And I was even that much more supportive of my colleagues.

39:57

So after a violent incident, I'd be chasing them down to make sure they were

40:00

okay. Because often they'll just continue to be in their fight or flight mode.

40:04

Yeah. Or that shutdown professional mode that we get into. to.

40:07

And so then I was the one being like, at the end of shift, call me if something

40:11

comes up, shoot me an email, I started to be the go to person that people would

40:15

text or call after workplace incidences and being like, what did you do? What was your journey?

40:20

Like, what do I do? And that was such an honor to get those those texts because

40:26

I know how scary it is to ask for help.

40:28

But nobody would have known to come to me unless I said something because everyone

40:32

thought I was just taking time off work to go to school.

40:36

Yeah, I can see the exact same thing happening for like policemen and firefighters

40:40

and even doctors, right? Yeah.

40:44

And for police and fire and ambulance, it's almost even like,

40:47

and military, it's almost even

40:49

an extra level because like healthcare is a pretty like hardcore space.

40:53

But at least for us in the ER, we're often getting a call ahead of time from

40:59

whoever is bringing somebody to us. So we at least can have a little bit of mental prep.

41:03

We know we're in a safe place. we know are safe enough place

41:06

we know that there's colleagues around that there's policies and

41:09

procedures we can do first responders might get

41:12

something through the 911 dispatch but often they don't know the details because

41:16

the person who's calling is calling in panic and they don't even really know

41:20

they're not able to fully comprehend what's happening and so our first responders

41:24

they have to shut down things in a whole other level and working with those

41:30

populations now as a counselor, I recognize and acknowledge that even that field is just even harder to tap

41:39

into their emotional side, I would say, than even healthcare.

41:44

I'm thinking even in like a call center environment, right? Or in a service industry.

41:50

For me, you know, I'm a true empath. So I would take on everybody else's crap

41:55

and not take care of my own stuff. And, you know, being in that call center environment, you know

41:59

you're getting you get beat up every day same in

42:03

any like service industry or anything like that and

42:06

you know now i have the tools and i can step back and you know take a look at

42:12

that but i don't think a lot of companies give people those tools right to figure

42:18

out you're you're in that fight or flight you know you can't tell the customer

42:22

shut the f up on the phone i mean I mean,

42:25

you want to, but you can't. You want to, but you're in the back of your head.

42:29

You're like, I need my money, and I need to be able to work,

42:31

and I want to tell this guy to shut the fuck up. But, you know, we can't.

42:36

You know, and that's, you know. I think as the world, the world's a scary place right now, right?

42:46

And that we, not just as individuals, but like companies need to provide people

42:51

with those tools, right? And not make them fucking pay for it, right? Give them a tool that they can

42:58

use on a day-to-day basis, right?

43:01

A stress ball is not going to fucking help. I'm going to tell you, right?

43:04

I had a sand, you know, remember those like squeezy sandballs,

43:08

right? One day, I got so mad at work, I squeezed it so hard,

43:12

sand went all over the carpet. We need to do better. And companies need to acknowledge the importance of having

43:24

an element of choice for their employees and the subcontractors that are at their company.

43:29

Because if there's a policy that if someone starts screaming at you on the phone,

43:35

we should have the absolute right to say,

43:39

unfortunately, based on where this conversation is going, I can no longer continue

43:44

unless you lower your voice. Yes. Because this is assault. This is verbally assaulting me because our very

43:52

natural fight or flight response is so natural to be impacted by that.

43:56

Right. Yeah. And when we work in the service industry and we can't say what

44:01

we want to say, we're stifling that fight or flight.

44:04

And where does it go? It just lives in our body.

44:07

We shut her down, we compress it, and then we don't go back to it.

44:11

And it's so essential that we can acknowledge that kind of behavior.

44:17

No matter how much I understand where people are in pain,

44:21

If I'm screaming at someone, I believe that people have the right to tell me no.

44:28

Sorry, not sorry. If you're in customer service and I'm being a bitch,

44:33

you have the right to say no to me.

44:37

Because obviously, I am being a bitch. If I'm potentially assaulting you,

44:42

that's a problem. That's a me problem. I might be angry about something very validly, but that does not mean that I

44:49

have the allowance to assault someone. Yeah. Yeah. We're still humans. We are. Every single one of us, we're still human.

44:57

Yeah. Just a human with emotions and thoughts. And family and things that we

45:02

love doing. And yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh my God.

45:08

So my kind of final questions for you is, what do you do today to take care

45:15

of yourself and acknowledge your emotions and go through whatever you need to go through?

45:18

One of the most important things for my life that I keep noticing through different

45:22

waves of when I'm like, oh, I took on too much. Now I need to kind of settle down.

45:26

One of the most important things for my mental health is something called time

45:29

affluence, that fluidity and flexibility of time, that ability to have days

45:34

where I can do whatever I want to. Those days where I have the capability to just do like completely spiritually

45:39

reflective day where I can do, like I'm currently doing a course by Dr. Edith Eger.

45:46

It's a self-help and development course. And she's my absolute idol.

45:49

She's an incredible woman. If you've never heard of her, please look into her.

45:53

She's a Holocaust survivor and now a psychologist.

45:56

And so I absolutely love the prompts that she has.

46:01

So being able to do different types of wellness education, listening to certain

46:05

podcasts, being able... And yeah, I do a lot of things.

46:11

I have a list of all of these different things I could...

46:14

I have a backpack that's an art backpack, for example. So if

46:17

I'm feeling called to do something more creative I can that is

46:20

easily accessible for me that if I can journal that's

46:23

easily accessible for me or even breath work I go

46:26

to a free breath work every single Thursday morning with one of my girlfriends

46:29

and there's all of these different little bits and pieces that I add and it

46:33

just intuitively do what feels good I need the time affluence to be able to

46:37

do what intuitively feels good yeah so you're taking the time you're listening

46:41

to yourself and doing what feels right I love that I have my fun questions to

46:45

your access unless you know you No, you get to do it because I stumped you last time. I know, I know. Okay.

46:52

Paige, if you could go back to an earlier version of yourself and tell yourself

46:56

a bit of advice, what would you say to yourself? And how old are you when you go back?

47:03

I would go back to age 14. I'd go back to age 14.

47:10

And I would tell her that she's a good person.

47:16

And that no matter what happens in this life, she is a good person, period.

47:23

And I don't know how to allow her to integrate that into her system so that she believed me.

47:28

But that was a message that I realized last year that was an inner message that I'm not a good person.

47:35

And after releasing that, it was probably one of the most freeing things I've experienced.

47:39

What do you think the 14-year-old version of yourself would ask you now?

47:43

Oh, she would be like, do we still travel? And I would be like,

47:48

no, girl, we're too broke. The economy sucks right now.

47:53

No, girl, we're going to read National Geographic. That's what we're going to do.

47:58

Yeah, we're going to be hitting up some Google Maps. yes google earthing traveling

48:03

nice although this year I am going to be going to New York in June for a women's

48:08

conference so there will be a little a smidge of travel this year,

48:13

what has been the most what has been the hardest lesson that you've learned

48:20

I'm going to make her cry again no this is such a good that's such a good question um,

48:29

Can you ask it one more time? Yeah. What's the hardest lesson you've learned so far?

48:35

Hardest lesson I've learned so far would be, and it's one that I'm still processing

48:40

as I continue forward in my journey, is not being as trauma-informed as I could

48:44

have been as a nurse and learning how to let go and release some of the trauma that I may have,

48:50

incorporated into people's lives based on the nursing practices that we were taught.

48:55

That's a good one. Wow, that's a good answer. soon. Last one,

48:59

trying to think of how to word this. What do you hope, like if we could meet again in let's say three years,

49:07

maybe two years even, where do you hope you, or how far do you hope you've grown?

49:14

So in what area of your life, if there's something you're currently working

49:16

on, or if there's a lesson you know is on the cusp of like, I need to do this

49:20

thing, where do you see yourself in that amount of time?

49:24

Do you think that, And what lesson are you hoping to learn by then?

49:28

I'm hoping that I've figured out how to change the healthcare system.

49:32

I'm hoping that what I do currently know and the people that I have starting

49:36

to make connections with, that I'm speaking worldwide about how we can enhance

49:42

our healthcare systems because we need help like now.

49:47

And so I'm already on the trajectory of like increasing my public speaking and being on stages.

49:53

And I'm going to be speaking at a hospital in Edmonton next month.

49:56

And so it's coming to fruition. And I really would love for in three years time

50:02

to feel so honed in and be just helping more people on a bigger scale.

50:07

That would be theabsolutebomb.com.

50:11

That gave me goosebumps. I'm really excited. I'm super excited.

50:14

I felt like it was happening. I was like, oh my God, it's gonna happen. It's gonna happen.

50:18

Yeah. Even on stage on Thursday, I was at a women's event here in Kelowna.

50:22

Many women and I was doing laughter. Therapy on stage and running around getting to

50:27

be absolutely ludicrous and ridiculous and engaging with an

50:30

audience and it was probably one of the most profound stage performances I've

50:35

ever had and because of my stand-up comedy background and also being a musician

50:39

and things I've been on hundreds I on stage hundreds of times that one took

50:44

the cake and I can only imagine it continuing to grow and enhance just more and more and more.

50:51

So I have one question for you, Paige.

50:54

What is a piece of advice that you could give to any of our listeners that are

51:01

going through something similar to what you went through?

51:05

What is the one thing that they could do for themselves?

51:08

Acknowledge your humanness. Learn about self-compassion. Go to selfcompassion.org

51:13

and learn about self-compassion. Dr. Kristen Neff has incredible work that she has done.

51:19

And if we can't acknowledge our

51:22

humanness and that we are human beings

51:25

and that we are not going to be perfect then we're

51:28

never going to feel a sense of satisfaction because we're always going to think

51:31

we need to do more but our humanist dictates how far we can go i love that thank

51:39

you thank you thank you page thank you i oh my god this was such a good session

51:45

i love it i feel I just had therapy. I'm so excited.

51:48

I'm also excited for you, Paige. Oh, my God. I'm feeling so warm and fuzzy right now.

51:53

I'm feeling all of the good feels throughout my body, like head to toe right now.

51:59

I'm feeling just that excited energy.

52:02

I got tingles. I think you literally spoke it out into the world.

52:05

I'm like, oh, shit, this is fucking going to happen, bro. I'm so excited for you.

52:09

Hi, y'all. Thank you so much for listening to this episode. I'm G-Rex.

52:14

And I'm Dirty Skittles. Don't forget to subscribe, rate, and review this podcast.

52:19

We'd love to listen to your feedback.

52:22

We can't do this without you guys. Music.