0:00

You're listening to Song Exploder, where

0:02

musicians take apart their songs, and piece

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by piece, tell the story of how they were made.

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I'm Rishi K. Shihirwe.

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Song Exploder is brought to you by Progressive,

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vary.

0:36

Sampha is a singer, songwriter, and

0:38

producer from London. His first album,

0:40

Process, won the Mercury Prize in 2017. He's

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collaborated with artists like The XX, Kendrick

0:46

Lamar, Drake, and Solange. If

0:48

you saw the Song Exploder Netflix show, Sampha

0:51

was in the Alicia Keys episode for the song they did

0:53

together as a duet. This

0:55

year, in October 2023, Sampha

0:57

put out his second album, La Hai, and

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for this episode, I talked to Sampha about the

1:01

song Spirit 2.0. Coming

1:04

up, you'll hear the original demo and some early

1:06

voice

1:06

memos.

1:08

Sampha recruited some collaborators for the song, like

1:11

producer Pablo Diaz-Raixa, aka El

1:13

Gincho, who won a Grammy for his work on Rosalia's

1:15

first album, plus Yeji and

1:18

Lisa Kayinde from Ibeyi. But

1:20

the song Spirit 2.0 first took shape when

1:23

Sampha was by himself at home. My

1:39

name is Sampha.

1:41

I start a lot of songs off by

1:44

learning a new bit of gear or plug-in

1:47

that'll kind of get my brain firing and inspire

1:50

something. And so I

1:53

bought a new synth. It

1:54

was like late summer 2019. I

1:57

was in a music store in a street called Denmark Street

1:59

in London. I bought like an Oberheim

2:01

OB6. I'd also bought some

2:04

semi modular since the

2:06

moves by the 32s I'm

2:09

not super techy, but I do love to experiment

2:12

and spend hours on bits of music

2:15

And I was like, oh this is reminding me of something

2:19

It's like a plucking of like a West African

2:21

stringed instrument like

2:23

an n-goni or like a chora or those

2:27

type of rhythms I got from listening

2:29

to like wasabi music from my favorite

2:35

My dad had

2:37

like a load of CDs and in my teens

2:39

I found this album by

2:42

an artist called Umi Sangari It's called Waratang

2:55

It felt really kind of weirdly futuristic

2:57

but also really sort of grounded in obviously

2:59

it's all these acoustic instruments but the way they were being

3:01

played was so fresh I don't know I just

3:04

felt like it was magic This

3:06

felt like the first time I was really like genuinely

3:09

connected to music that was close

3:11

to where my family from

3:14

was just Sierra Leone There's

3:16

something innate about the way I kind of write music that

3:19

shares this commonality with that type of music it

3:21

has like this foundation

3:23

of complexity So

3:29

the song started with the mood lines and

3:32

so I was like okay I'm gonna build more upon that Do

3:34

another line And

3:38

another line There's

3:42

this writer that talks about Guyanine,

3:45

percussion, where the foundation

3:47

is a complex rhythm that goes

3:49

up like a piece of architecture So

3:52

that's how I kind of felt like while I was doing a little bit

3:58

So after I kind of established that with the

4:00

Moogs, that's when the OB6

4:03

came into play. I started using it and

4:05

I was like, I couldn't get the sounds I was hoping

4:07

to get out of it for a bit. But

4:09

then I decided to bring all my

4:12

sense to the sofa. That's

4:14

just the place to just really relax, just to figure

4:16

it out. And that's where I started

4:18

to really fall in love with it. I

4:24

tuned the oscillators a fifth apart from

4:26

each other and came

4:28

across these particular chords. I

4:31

was kind of transported. When

4:41

I listened to that, I'm like, that's it. I

4:43

personally could just listen. And

4:46

that's what I did for a while, just that

4:48

on loop, just chords in

4:49

mood. And

4:53

I would go to parks and it would just be

4:55

like a calming thing and it was really resonating

4:57

with me. And

5:00

I put down some drums. And

5:08

eventually I heard

5:10

a vocal melody idea. It

5:24

put me in quite a reflective space. I

5:28

was feeling like I needed some bird's eye view all my life. Every

5:34

day was kind of just becoming

5:36

like a groundhog dish and I was just in it and I didn't

5:38

really, I had no

5:40

control over it. I wasn't thinking about

5:43

how to steer my life. Because there's

5:45

times where I felt like very normal, apathetic.

5:52

Yeah.

5:59

I

6:04

still measure this one at the tempo

6:06

of it because it's slightly faster and a

6:09

kind of half time vibe but I

6:11

still have love for it but

6:13

in the final version I'd slow it

6:15

down

6:22

and I just started to hear this other drum beat in my head and

6:25

then I was like

6:28

hearing this kind of break beat version

6:31

of the tune. I was thinking about

6:33

programming it with electronic drums but then I kind

6:36

of wanted something that felt a bit more acoustic

6:39

or like woody. That's when I went

6:41

to a studio called Rack in London

6:44

and invited Yousuf Days down. Yousuf

6:49

is a drummer, producer,

6:52

artist and even writer and he's

6:54

really one of my favourite drummers. I

6:56

sort of like roughly gave him like the

6:59

kick pattern I was thinking of and

7:02

I wanted like half time drums here and then

7:04

it can switch to something and then

7:06

he sort of just took it and just took

7:09

it to like a level that was beyond what I was

7:11

imagining. I

7:25

make music a lot in like pictures in my

7:27

head. One of the pictures was like

7:29

being in like a moonlit room

7:38

and in my head I was thinking about the sun sort

7:40

of hitting the moon and reflecting into this

7:43

room in my mum's house. There was a particular

7:45

type of moonlight that was really beautiful

7:47

so I was imagining being in

7:49

this moonlit room with someone else

7:52

having a conversation.

8:00

And another visual I was having was like

8:03

me sort of levitating through the ceiling towards

8:05

the moon. And then I imagined falling.

8:08

That's where all

8:09

the cat-chew-eck stuff was coming.

8:26

I was thinking a lot about spirituality

8:28

at the time, but I don't

8:30

think I was living a life

8:33

that was recognizing

8:35

my need for whatever I thought the spirit

8:37

was. I feel like all

8:39

of these questions came around as well when I started to

8:42

lose people in my life and I'd be like, oh,

8:44

I haven't had any sort of spiritual

8:46

connection in terms of someone being like, I'm

8:49

here. It's like

8:51

I can no longer locate them apart

8:54

from in my mind and my memory.

8:56

And

8:57

looking for some sort of healing, trying

9:00

to open up yourself to be helped

9:02

can be a difficult journey.

9:11

How far does life go?

9:16

Then I had like a solid version of it and

9:19

left it for a few months. The

9:21

pandemic hit and then I had

9:24

a daughter and the gulf

9:26

between actually working on the music started

9:28

to grow. I got to a point

9:30

a few months after my daughter was born thinking

9:33

about how am I going to actually reconnect

9:36

with working on music. And I feel like I might need

9:38

a bit of help. And

9:40

that's when I reached out to El Guincho, Pablo,

9:43

and he heard the spirit and he loved it. And

9:48

he had some arrangement ideas. He was like, oh,

9:50

maybe start the song off with the chorus.

9:56

He

9:59

didn't want to compare me to the other.

9:59

completely rework

10:02

my whole song and take it and make it

10:04

something totally different. He just wanted to

10:06

help me add and finish and was

10:09

really respectful of my vision. And

10:12

then for the rap vocal bit, I

10:14

just came up with a flow. But then

10:16

I recorded it as a call and response to

10:18

myself.

10:19

Just like Jonathan Livingston, Try

10:22

to catch the cousin I was caught by the wings of

10:24

my people. You pick me up in your food.

10:27

I referenced Jonathan Livingston Seagull, which

10:29

is a book that my brother used to read to me when I was a

10:32

young boy for bedtime. He

10:34

was a bird who wanted to perfect flying. He

10:37

would climb up high and then he would dive down

10:40

at like ridiculous speeds. And

10:42

somehow I think I was just envisioning this as well

10:45

while I was envisioning myself falling,

10:47

but then sort of being caught by

10:50

friends or faith or wings of my

10:52

people. I would start by the wings of my

10:54

people. You pick me up in your food. There's

10:58

Lisa from a bay who's kind of like

11:00

doubling up what I'm doing in this section.

11:16

I just love her voice. I feel

11:18

like I wouldn't have been able to give that same energy.

11:23

I think after that I started to envision

11:25

strings. I'd

11:28

always wanted to work with Owen Pallet, who's

11:31

a Canadian artist, string

11:33

arranger. And I've

11:35

just been a big fan, especially of his album

11:37

in conflict, in particular

11:39

a song called The Passions. The strings

11:41

on there is just like some of the most beautiful

11:44

strings I've ever heard.

11:51

He does this thing with like sort of microtonal

11:54

ascending cluster of chords.

11:57

I was like, this is so beautiful doing

11:59

something. like this in this particular section of the

12:02

second chorus would be amazing. And

12:04

so, Owen, he arranged

12:07

the song and then like

12:09

a 32-piece orchestra recorded it. And

12:20

then by the time I thought I'd finished the song,

12:22

I met up with Yeji. She

12:25

heard some of the music and she was like, do you want me to just jump on

12:27

the mic? And she just freestyled

12:29

a bunch of stuff. She was singing in Korean and I didn't really

12:32

understand what she was saying.

12:39

It was something along the lines of what

12:41

did a word say, where did the words go? And

12:43

she translated it and I was like, oh wow, this is,

12:45

a lot of this is kind of resonating with

12:48

what I'm writing about. And we sort

12:50

of just found space for some of it on Spirit.

13:09

Do you think that your daughter's birth influenced

13:12

this song in any way?

13:14

It influenced the title. I mean,

13:16

the reason I added the 2.0 onto Spirit, I was thinking about

13:22

all these instruments and being surrounded

13:24

by technology, but

13:27

also I had

13:29

a daughter and that

13:31

was the first time I actually had this strong feeling

13:33

of feeling my mum, which

13:36

I hadn't really had up until that point.

13:39

When did you lose your mum?

13:40

In 2015, yeah. And

13:46

I got to thinking about being

13:49

like a part of a continual disconnection

13:52

to everything, including her

13:54

and thinking about the future and the past. When

13:57

you gain something it literally reminds you of what you

13:59

lost. as well.

14:12

Coming up, you'll hear how all of these ideas

14:14

and elements came together in the final song.

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Song Exploder is sponsored by Squarespace, the

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exploder for cash. 10% off your First

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Years membership. And

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now, here's Spirit 2.0 by SAMFA

16:07

in its entirety.

17:00

Two bodies on, it's my trust.

17:07

Save me, this is me.

17:13

Automatic

17:14

self protection.

17:19

The airbags and stuff

17:21

can. This

17:24

is me, just in the open sky. I

17:30

don't feel so scared.

17:37

Dreaming with the heat. Likewise

18:01

Myili

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Shak

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Dr. Moira

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ShriEK Ad

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equivalent for open BMon On

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guitar

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There's

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one place on the street fleas

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or the sun

20:43

For more,

20:47

visit song-experts.com.

20:58

For more, visit song-exploder.net. You'll

21:02

find links to buy or stream Spirit 2.0.

21:06

If you're looking for another episode to listen to after

21:08

this, check out the Yabehi episode

21:11

from 2017. Lisa Kainde,

21:13

who sang backing vocals on Spirit 2.0, breaks

21:16

down a song with her twin sister and bandmate Naomi

21:18

Diaz. You'll find that and all the other

21:20

episodes of the podcast at song-exploder.net

21:23

or wherever you listen. This episode

21:26

was made by me, Craig Ely, Theo

21:28

Balcom, Kathleen Smith, and Mary

21:30

Dolan. The episode artwork is by

21:32

Carlos Lerma, and I made the show's theme

21:34

music and logo. Song Exploder

21:37

is a proud member of Radiotopia from PRX,

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a network of independent, listener-supported,

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artist-owned podcasts. You can learn more about

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all our shows at radiotopia.fm. You

21:48

can follow me on social media at RishiHirwe,

21:50

and you can follow the show at Song Exploder.

21:53

You can also get a Song Exploder t-shirt at

21:55

songexploder.net. I'm

21:59

Rishi K. Shih.

21:59

your way. Thanks for listening.

22:07

RadioTopia from

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PRX.

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Hey, this is Rishi Kesh from Song Exploder,

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and I'm joined by my dear friend Avery Triffleman,

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who makes another RadioTopia show, the award-winning

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fashion podcast, Articles of Interest. Hey,

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Rishi. Avery and I wanted to tell you that

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right now, RadioTopia is holding its annual

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was pitched to me like it was a punk label where

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Rishi, and when I joined, it was because you

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pitched it to me and you believed in RadioTopia

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