0:01

It's. May. And that means that election

0:03

day is less than six months away. If

0:06

just hearing that fact raises your

0:08

blood pressure and since your stress.

0:10

Level through the roof, you are

0:12

not alone. Back And Twenty Twenty

0:14

Two A P A Stress in

0:16

America poll found that fifty seven

0:18

percent of people surveyed said that

0:21

the Twenty Twenty Four Presidential election

0:23

was already a significant source of

0:25

stress for them. The same survey

0:27

found that seventy six percent of

0:29

Americans believed that the future of

0:31

our nation is a significant source.

0:34

Of stress and sixty six

0:36

percent were stressed by the

0:38

current political climate. In fact,

0:40

some recent research has found

0:42

the just thinking about politics

0:44

makes people anxious, stressed, and

0:46

unhappy. So how does

0:49

political stress affect people's mental and

0:51

physical. Well being. Is

0:53

it possible to stay politically engaged

0:55

and follow the news while

0:57

still maintaining your mental health? And

1:00

if so, how. And what

1:03

does this level of political stress mean

1:05

for people's lives and for a country?

1:07

and for democracy as an institution. Welcome.

1:09

To speaking of psychology. The flagship

1:11

podcast of The American. Psychological Association

1:14

that examines the links between

1:16

psychological science and everyday life.

1:18

I'm Kim. Mills. We

1:24

have to yesterday first as Dr.

1:26

Bread Ford, an assistant professor of

1:28

Psychology at the University of Toronto

1:30

and Director of the Effect of

1:32

Science and Health Laboratory their doctor

1:34

for studies where people believe about

1:37

emotions and how they regulate and

1:39

manage. Their emotions. Since

1:41

the Twenty sixteen election, she's been

1:43

looking at how politics affect our

1:45

emotions and how anxiety around politics.

1:48

Drives people to engage or

1:50

disengage with political action. Or

1:53

second guessed his doctor, Kevin Smith,

1:55

a professor of Political Science at

1:57

the University of Nebraska Lincoln. Smith

2:00

studies the biology and psychology of

2:02

individual differences in political attitudes and

2:05

behavior. Why some people are passionate

2:07

about politics while others couldn't care

2:10

less were conservatives and liberals get

2:12

their political beliefs from and how

2:14

those beliefs drive choices and actions.

2:17

In recent years has also been

2:19

studying the effects of politics on

2:21

people's health and wellbeing. Thank

2:24

you both for joining me today. Thanks. For

2:26

having supplies to be here. That

2:29

you both city politics and emotion. but

2:31

she came to these topics from different

2:33

seals and prospectus. something to as supposed

2:35

to start telling us a little bit

2:37

about your background and why you got

2:40

interested in politics Doctor for let's start

2:42

with you. Well. I started as

2:44

a stress. Researcher: So I came.

2:46

I came at this from

2:48

from the sideways. I study

2:50

how people manage stress, how

2:52

people cope with different types

2:55

of stressors in their lives,

2:57

and circa twenty six teams

2:59

had seemed like politics certainly

3:01

qualified as a stressor. As

3:03

the months and years unfolded,

3:05

it seemed like maybe politics

3:07

call fight as. A chronic stress

3:10

or so And we said. That lends

3:12

to it. It seemed like. Studying

3:14

emotion regulation in the context. Of

3:16

politics was an important stress and for

3:18

the worked to go. And

3:21

Doctor Smith, your background is political

3:23

science or what led you to

3:25

the psychological questions? Ah well

3:27

I was involved at a lot

3:29

of quantitative genetic studies where we

3:31

did some of the first of

3:33

is looking at the heritability all.

3:37

Political. Beliefs

3:39

and attitudes. And

3:42

we. By. Now have.

3:45

You know of? Kind. Of amount of

3:47

evidence that. Even though is

3:49

a rather complex social phenotype, political

3:52

or editors who place are fairly

3:54

highly heritable, which of course raises

3:56

the question of how does that

3:58

half of the house. Ethics

4:00

influence attitudes, you behaviors, and one

4:02

of the ways in which we

4:04

were trying to answer that question

4:06

is. Looking. At, it's

4:09

sort of like biological information processing

4:11

systems and one of those systems.

4:13

To make a long story short,

4:16

Was. Part of the autonomic nervous

4:18

system the fight or flight system. Where

4:21

we were looking at levels of cortisol. Which

4:24

is this you know,

4:26

popularly known as the

4:29

stress Hormone. And we've

4:31

found that people's cortisol

4:33

levels are correlated to

4:35

their political engagement and.

4:38

That. Sort of like goddess to

4:40

thinking. Well. If. Engage

4:43

with politics is raising people's

4:45

cortisol levels, and we can

4:47

observe that. Is politics

4:49

having a broader effect on their

4:51

psychological i'm even physical health? and

4:54

certainly their social health? So that

4:56

was kind of my launching point

4:58

intuit. One could

5:00

argue that almost everything controversial

5:02

in life as political elements

5:04

the sisters with anxiety that

5:06

we feel related to electoral

5:08

politics different from the stress

5:10

or anxiety that we my

5:12

feel from say office politics

5:14

or family politics. At

5:16

least from my perspective. I think for the short

5:19

honest answer to that is we don't know. The.

5:21

Data that we have and

5:23

we've looked at it is

5:26

consistent with the argument that

5:28

politics is a unique chronic

5:30

stress or in the environment,

5:32

and the people who are

5:35

not particularly stressed or anxious

5:37

about other parts of the

5:39

social environment still seem to

5:41

get stressed and anxious about.

5:45

Politics. You. Know

5:47

I hesitate to call out on a limb

5:49

and and declare that definitively simply because and

5:51

at least as far as I'm aware, that

5:53

hasn't been a ton of study on on

5:55

that particular question. Is doesn't ring

5:57

true for you Duct ford. It

6:00

useful to think about what

6:02

politics shares. With other forms

6:04

of stress we can triangulate our

6:07

new hypotheses and how we test

6:09

or questions. It. Certainly a

6:12

multifaceted stressors, and so it includes,

6:14

And that might be what makes

6:16

it unique. In the sense

6:18

that it includes both these. And

6:20

of identity based and groups. Based

6:22

forms of stress. When

6:25

we interact with people we don't like.

6:27

the stresses us out. When we don't

6:29

share values with other people, A stresses

6:31

us out. There's also this kind. Of

6:33

super ordinates structural level of

6:36

stress that can come from

6:38

politics right when you're facing

6:40

systems. That are much much bigger than

6:42

you and potentially feel. Like. They are.

6:45

Doing damage to you in some. Way or have

6:47

the potential to affect elections as work out in

6:49

the way that you wanted to airman's be a

6:52

little bit of stress. That ah that's

6:54

linked with being of loot lower socio

6:56

economic status i these large intractable systems

6:58

the seem to be working against you.

7:01

So I think you know it's useful to

7:03

draw on our knowledge about other stressors. But.

7:06

That at the end of the day

7:08

politics may be unique in the sense

7:11

that it's this and of conglomeration of

7:13

several really. Crucial forms of stress.

7:16

And packages follow up on that. I

7:18

I agree a hundred percent with everything

7:20

that the practice said one of the

7:22

other sort of like unique aspects about

7:25

politics is is virtually impossible to avoid.

7:28

You know most of us have smartphones

7:31

these days as is literally and are

7:33

are it in our pockets of in?

7:35

It's just really these. You really really

7:37

have to work hard to avoid politics

7:39

these days. Without

7:42

To For Do published a study

7:44

last year in which you ask

7:46

people to track their daily news

7:48

consumption and their emotions and well

7:50

being. How does political news consumption

7:53

affect people? stress levels, health, and

7:55

wellbeing? So. We assume We

7:57

assume that people. Experienced

7:59

pilot. That's largely through through their

8:01

news consumption. We if we didn't necessarily

8:03

constrain the study to that though. he

8:05

could have been conversations that they hard

8:07

with people that they know. it was

8:09

mostly just. How are you learning about

8:12

politics today? But I certainly expect who had

8:14

of that to come to the news and

8:16

social media. And we

8:18

found first of all that people. And.

8:21

We did not recruit. Particularly special

8:24

participants. We

8:26

found that participants were ceiling thrusts

8:28

filling a variety of negative emotions

8:30

about politics at least seventy five

8:33

percent eighty percent of the days

8:35

that we asked them, and that

8:37

they were feeling intense degrees of

8:40

negative emotion on about half of

8:42

the days that we assessed. Like

8:45

every other day, there's an intense,

8:47

negative emotional experience going on for

8:49

for people from across the political

8:52

spectrum. And. And Doctor

8:54

Smith you've done several national surveys

8:56

on politics, stress and health or

8:58

and the last two presidential elections.

9:00

What did you find? out? What

9:02

we asked our of respondents a

9:04

number of questions about how politics

9:06

is affecting them. Some

9:09

like psychologically emotionally socially it

9:11

in their physical health and

9:13

woke we found is that.

9:17

Your kind of like

9:19

astonishingly large percentage of

9:21

Americans identify politics. As

9:24

a source of not just

9:26

stress but it is interrupting

9:28

with their sleep patterns is

9:31

that they have like associate

9:33

politics with. You. Know I've

9:36

said things on social media or or

9:38

to people that I am requesting I

9:40

am. I kind of what compulsively follow

9:42

some sort of like social media news

9:45

that sort of thing. And.

9:49

To. Of our studies, we asked

9:51

about suicidally the Asian and I.

9:53

Both of those samples one and

9:55

twenty said that they had thoughts

9:58

of suicide associated. With. Paul. Six

10:00

which just. I'm astonished.

10:02

the. Arm. And in

10:04

if our ah the estimates from

10:07

our national surveys or even within

10:09

the ballpark miller sit for the

10:11

the short description is this the

10:13

politics is not being very good

10:16

mental health of ah of americans

10:18

and maybe not even their up

10:20

physical health. The

10:23

house political stress compare with other stressors

10:25

in people's lives mean that sounds pretty

10:27

cute on our politics. As big a

10:29

source of worry as money or health

10:31

and we we do surveys at the

10:33

A P A every year and we

10:35

find money and Health or way up

10:37

their politics is is on the list.

10:40

But how do you mind when in

10:42

your work where politics falls on on

10:44

the stress continuum. I. Haven't

10:46

looked specifically. At

10:49

those types of comparisons if

10:51

I. Were. To

10:53

speculate. Part.

10:56

Is what makes

10:58

politics stressful is

11:00

potentially. The implications, The

11:02

downstream. Implications that it

11:04

has for. Personal.

11:06

Outcomes. Right like.

11:08

What What is so upsetting about

11:10

having some ones in power for

11:12

you don't agree with? It's largely

11:14

because you think they're going to

11:16

and acts, policies, laws, whatever that

11:18

are going. To impact you are

11:20

the ones that you love. so

11:23

perhaps. In that sense, it's a bit more

11:25

distal. Than some of

11:27

these in a moment to moment. I can't

11:29

make ends meet today. But

11:31

I do wonder if it is. I liked the. Word be

11:34

no continuum or spectrum says I imagine

11:36

that these things are kind of falling

11:38

along a spectrum. In there aren't

11:40

necessarily discrete categories, but that is

11:43

speculation. That. We've come

11:45

at it from a slightly

11:47

different perspective in the sense that

11:49

we have been not looking

11:51

at. Your.

11:54

Sort of like diagnostic survey

11:56

bathroom for anxiety and stress

11:58

that are general. And

12:00

then we've been trying to see

12:02

whether you know measures of political

12:04

stress and anxiety? Are they. Sort.

12:07

Of like, highly correlated with these.

12:10

Are you can play the cause stress

12:13

still be an independent predictor or are

12:15

you know, is it an independent predictor

12:17

of these? Kind of like negative. Emotional

12:21

and psychological effects when

12:23

you control for what

12:25

generalized anxiety. And

12:28

generally speaking we were at least and

12:30

the data that we have so far

12:32

we haven't on it's on, on on

12:34

on This It seems to suggest that

12:36

politics and be separable from. Some.

12:38

Like more generalized measures of anxiety and

12:40

stress. but we have looked at all

12:43

about specific stressors like are you worried

12:45

about money or or let's with i.

12:48

When it comes to election

12:50

stress levels, do you find

12:53

the terrorists a Partisan Differences

12:55

are differences between the sexes

12:57

or other demographic factors. We

13:00

rarely find partisan differences

13:03

in. What?

13:06

In day to day experiences

13:08

of stress about politics. And

13:10

that's the The Study reference

13:12

earlier read. And of

13:14

things people day after day. Either

13:17

two weeks or three weeks

13:19

and. They're just they're

13:21

arts in that context. partisan differences

13:23

Now when we zoom out and

13:26

look at macro level of Us

13:28

Army as to forthcoming work, looking

13:30

at the impeachments of Donald Trump

13:32

at different points in that the

13:35

time course before you know. Impeachment.

13:38

The acquittals, impeachment, acquittal, and so

13:40

forth on. There. Are huge

13:42

to stick with. Huge Partisan

13:45

a fax. Not track exactly as

13:47

you think they would on based on

13:49

who kind of quote won or lost

13:51

in a given context. Says is a

13:53

really interesting pattern. It really depends on

13:55

the context in which you're measuring. know

13:57

the motions, does macro level events with

13:59

her. Clear wins and losses,

14:01

you see partisan differences. That.

14:04

Are very consistent. Very strong. When

14:07

you're asking people about day to day life, we're

14:09

all kind of on. An emotional rollercoaster

14:11

it seems. You. And and

14:13

and our research I me we have

14:16

looked day to day. I mean are

14:18

we taking like national samples and what

14:20

we've found fairly consistently? And. Terms

14:23

of the demographic factors that

14:25

predict higher levels of these

14:27

negative effects of politics: Ages

14:29

of Pick One. Younger

14:31

people tend to suffer from these facts more

14:33

than. An. Older people we have

14:36

found it he all injury to

14:38

be a fairly consistent predictor with.

14:42

Liberals tending to report more

14:44

of this than than than

14:46

than conservatives. during

14:49

the we happen to we found some

14:51

stuff with is kind of kind of

14:53

mixed up and I would make anything

14:55

definitive on that but to the other

14:57

things that we found kind of like

15:00

consistent is the people who are interested

15:02

in politics and pay attention to politics

15:04

tend to suffer from this more report

15:06

more of the sort of stuff which

15:08

I guess isn't too surprising. The

15:11

other thing. That is I found

15:14

really interesting is the people

15:16

who do not like they're

15:18

partisan opposites. You

15:21

know, if you're up with conservative really

15:23

the like, Liberals and and. Yo.

15:25

Think they're lying and cheating, or if

15:27

we are, you know vive vice versa.

15:30

You tend to report more stress and

15:32

anxiety from from politics and I think

15:34

those are the big sort of like

15:36

demographic predictors of the sort of thing

15:38

that we file. Nail

15:40

United States citizens. Are certainly not

15:42

alone in having a very fraught political

15:44

atmosphere these days. What about people who

15:47

live in countries where the head of

15:49

state is is absolute in other words,

15:51

a dictator, And people don't really have

15:53

a choice as to who their leader

15:55

is. Doesn't have any impact and

15:57

whether people feel more or less stress

15:59

to even. No. Yeah.

16:01

As far as I know, maybe bread know

16:03

something. Different. But I, I, I, I

16:05

don't think we know, do we brand? I mean. There.

16:08

Are there is really interesting

16:10

work being done in other

16:13

cultures and other countries. There's.

16:18

Several. Wonderful

16:21

or researchers who focus on

16:23

emotion, emotion, regulations and stress

16:25

and and groups based conflict

16:28

in Israel. And

16:31

I think ah, System.

16:34

To some degree, some of the

16:36

patterns that we're talking about. Our.

16:39

Kind of human. Patterns

16:42

were something big and

16:44

frightening happens. Something threatening

16:47

happens. It. Naturally evokes

16:49

response. but of course people

16:51

very from each other, but

16:53

on average there will be

16:55

a response on average people

16:58

want to manage that stress

17:00

on average, Humans are relatively

17:02

resilient and were actually pretty

17:04

good at coping with stress

17:06

on average and. And

17:08

yet there you know my be really

17:10

important downstream consequences of managing that stress.

17:12

This is a question that I guess.

17:15

Semi regularly when I talk about work

17:17

on how when you're really good at

17:19

coping with the stress of politics, you're

17:21

actually less likely to be engaged. Because

17:25

emotions can drive engagement and people

17:27

will ask, what about in countries

17:29

where your engagement doesn't necessarily. Might

17:33

not have the impact that it

17:35

can. and other countries that are

17:37

more us ah, il democratically oriented

17:39

or in countries where are locations

17:41

where your action for directly ill

17:43

jeopardize your health and wellbeing. What

17:45

happens in those. Countries and I say

17:47

that would that work is really important and

17:49

needs to be done and they don't yet

17:52

know that we're now has done it. You

17:54

like what you hear on this podcast? Then

17:57

you should check out Eight Years

17:59

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P A .org/monitor

18:26

Today. Has politics

18:28

always provoked so much stress and

18:30

anxiety? and our culture's this new

18:32

with the level of polarization we're

18:34

seeing today? Or do we not

18:36

even have the historical research? So

18:39

no. I don't think

18:41

that having certainly have a sense of

18:43

pride of stuff that for at night

18:45

doing. I mean I don't think we

18:47

have research that goes back decades and

18:49

decades. Of to where we

18:52

can avoid practice and a fine

18:54

great way but. I mean.

18:57

We've. Gotten pretty upset and stress. Orleans is about

18:59

politics in the past and me at one point.

19:01

We have a civil war. And. I

19:03

would imagine that that was pretty stressful of anxious

19:05

for up for an awful lot of people. Certainly

19:07

if you went back to the lighting system in

19:10

the nineteen sixties with some of things that was

19:12

going on. The. Civil Rights movement of

19:14

troops. A lot of stress and anxiety around

19:16

those sorts of things. But.

19:20

Are we sort of like any kind

19:22

of like have a new sub like

19:24

unique and farm and that is conducive

19:26

to produce and these sorts of emotional

19:29

responses to politics and mean I think

19:31

there's a reasonable argument that there is.

19:33

I mean everybody's blaming social media for

19:35

everything of of these days, but I

19:37

meet the top is it's a different.

19:40

Information. Environment and a good

19:43

deal of that information and

19:45

farm. It was no gatekeeper

19:47

and it's specifically designed. To

19:49

provoke. Emotional responses. So in that

19:52

sense I I I would say

19:54

that. You know, We're.

19:57

Living and and and sort of like

19:59

a. The unique and different time. And

20:02

that's even without talking about sort of

20:04

like. You. Know Ah,

20:07

All. The attendant things that go

20:09

with every run up the twenty

20:12

twenty election which. In

20:14

and of itself was not too

20:16

stressful put if you listen to

20:18

some of our subject of a

20:21

traumatic event so it was Yeah

20:23

yeah. I'm a doctor

20:25

for one of the findings of your

20:27

research. is it when people are feeling

20:29

anxieties just because of politics to strategies

20:31

that can enable them to feel better.

20:33

You just mentioned disengagement as as one

20:36

of them, but these strategies have trade

20:38

offs. Mean can you talk about that?

20:41

So. Given that our emotions

20:43

help us do things. And

20:45

have emotions or reason that helps

20:47

push us to take actions in

20:49

the world and are negative emotions

20:51

also help us do things when

20:53

we are angry. it helps us

20:55

conference when we're anxious of helps

20:57

us and have to care if

21:00

you know of threats. And

21:03

when we focus on. Getting

21:05

rid of those motions And there's

21:07

a variety of strategies that people

21:10

use in their daily lives to

21:12

help manage these types of negative

21:14

emotions that are really us activists

21:16

and useful and help promote mental

21:18

health and even physical health. When

21:22

we get rid of these emotions, sometimes

21:24

we miss out on some of the

21:26

benefits. That those emotions provide us.

21:29

And to the extent that they can

21:31

help push us to be engaged to

21:33

stay motivated to take action. When

21:37

we lose them, we lose some of

21:39

that motivation and so did the same

21:41

strategies that help us can get through

21:43

the day and manage in a family.

21:45

Stressors and money stress and things like

21:47

that and really important ways can also

21:49

help us in the context of politics.

21:52

But then we find that the

21:54

people who are very successful and

21:56

using these strategies they have better

21:58

of wellbeing and daily. But

22:00

they're the ones you are least likely to take

22:03

action. Yeah. That is

22:05

something that and the especially supply

22:07

because scientists they find not just

22:09

concerned about not just sort of

22:11

like super interesting but but really

22:13

concerning I meet the. Findings

22:15

the we'd come up with track

22:18

exactly with bought bread is is

22:20

is saying is you know. That

22:23

the negative emotion that essentially motivates

22:25

you to pay attention and get

22:27

engaged civically. And. That

22:30

if. You. Know your your way

22:32

to deal with or negative emotions is

22:34

to. You. Know, ignore the

22:36

stuff that is producing those

22:38

negative emotions. Basically, you civically

22:41

disengage. And. That's

22:43

not healthy for democracy, right? So I

22:45

mean right now we're having a little

22:47

bit of a conversation earlier this week

22:49

is it's sorta like the Sixty Four

22:52

Thousand Dollar Question And our research right

22:54

is how did you get. People.

22:56

To civically engage while

22:58

still mitigating these sorts

23:01

of a fax. Of.

23:04

And yeah, as I would really like

23:06

to know the answer to that question,

23:09

Are there positive effects from being

23:12

absorbed by politics? For instance? I

23:14

mean, I've been to a few

23:16

national political conventions smooth as reporter

23:18

and later as an advocate. I

23:21

can tell you that the delegates

23:23

in the other attendees seems really

23:25

happy in this hyper partisan million.

23:28

Is that healthy? Well, what

23:30

is health? Statistics.

23:34

For another? Podcasts? Yeah! I

23:37

think you're exactly on the right

23:39

tax, and that's where. Our

23:41

research is going in were hints

23:43

in some ongoing research is pointing

23:45

us as well. So when. When

23:47

we focus on the negative emotions

23:49

and getting rid of them, that's

23:51

where. We see these very consistent

23:53

patterns of trade off because. Me:

23:56

Focus on the strategies that. A Really effective

23:58

for getting rid of negative. The Ocean. They

24:00

often involve disengagement tuning out, making things be

24:03

less bad in our minds which is super

24:05

effective right things not being such a big

24:07

deal or you know it'll blow over or

24:09

whatever. Those are really important strategies that we

24:12

apply to other stressors in our lives and

24:14

to make sense it part of our tool

24:16

kits when we apply it to put politics

24:19

as may where we get into trouble because

24:21

we. Start disengaging and tuning out. But.

24:24

Your point Kim, there are positive

24:26

emotions to and I don't talk

24:28

about positive emotions to be no

24:30

a pollyanna and say let's all

24:32

just put on rose colored glasses

24:34

and like oldest, hold hands and

24:36

sing kumbaya That's not really what

24:38

it's about is not meant to

24:40

be a denial of what is.

24:43

Very stressful is actually the opposite. so

24:45

we can let them or negative emotions

24:47

be. We don't have to make the

24:49

situation be less bad, We don't have

24:51

to make it be less severe. Whatever

24:54

we can let that sits. We want

24:56

to engage in the cognitive strategies to

24:58

distort the situation to be something that

25:00

it's not. We can let it be.

25:03

Scary. And frustrating. And you

25:05

know, whatever despairing some depending on who

25:07

you are. But it

25:09

can also be an opportunity to

25:12

connect with other people to have

25:14

admiration or inspiration to to form

25:16

these collective. These.

25:19

Collective groups or or have these

25:21

collected experiences that can be uplifting

25:23

and induce all sorts of other

25:26

emotions: compassion, pride, admiration, gratitude, Those

25:29

emotions. Also. Drive political

25:31

engagement, And. So if

25:33

we focus on cultivating those

25:35

types of and socially connected

25:38

experiences, you get the benefit

25:40

of of feeling good. Which

25:43

in. Turn also helps keep

25:45

you motivated, so that's.

25:48

That's who I think. a really promising direction.

25:50

I think one of the things that

25:52

a lot of people don't quite realizes

25:54

this. you know it, subsection Book. Of

25:57

of the population that really enjoys

25:59

politics. Right at a me. They

26:01

enjoyed his contacts or they like

26:03

the conflict. They they

26:06

like to get involved with a like

26:08

birds self satisfaction of being involved in

26:10

the course that they think is is

26:12

better than them and and draw emotional

26:15

sustenance from that. So.

26:17

Yeah, I mean I I think there

26:19

are sort of like positive emotions. Involved

26:22

fear. but there's a lot of individual

26:25

level differences right? And the you know

26:27

the notion of ghetto up in front

26:29

of people and going after someone who

26:31

disagrees with you hammer and tongs and

26:34

having back to the take you know

26:36

many people that would suppress the mouth

26:38

enormously. On. But for lot of

26:40

people involved with the political raiders, okay, yeah, that

26:43

sounds like fun little prick. Not bring it on

26:45

when they have more that. Now.

26:47

Lot of conversation so far. This. Election

26:49

Year About how many voters are

26:52

not happy with either of the

26:54

presumptive major party presidential. Candidates.

26:57

Is that an unusually sprint stressful position

27:00

to be? And is it more or

27:02

less stressful to feel like you have

27:04

no good choice? at least at the

27:06

top of the ticket. Integrate.

27:09

Now. It's. Not a great

27:11

situation, I mean to the sense

27:13

that it links up with with

27:16

other concepts that we know about

27:18

learned helplessness I, the idea that

27:20

there's nothing you can do to

27:22

really change things because if you're

27:24

proceeding either option as not so

27:26

good. It sounds to me

27:28

like a recipe for and action. And

27:32

that's that's not going to be. Good.

27:34

For the country as likely. And

27:36

even if it does, prompt action is

27:39

probably a negative overpass Him And other

27:41

words, I'm going to the polls not

27:43

vote for someone of going to polls

27:46

for vote against. Someone.

27:48

The really is a choice here that I'm going to feel.

27:51

Feel. Good about. And. I

27:54

mean I'm I'm I'm not sure what that

27:56

those the people psychologically but I. I

27:58

I kinda doubt it makes. She'll be heard.

28:03

This. Is a sensitive more intense this year and and

28:05

then in prior years. I mean I know I always

28:07

hear people saying oh I don't like either candidate but

28:09

you know I'm going about or I'm not going to

28:11

do anything. Yeah, I mean that

28:13

so. For. I mean for

28:16

a variety of different reasons

28:18

we have to uniquely unpopular.

28:21

A major party candidates and the

28:23

and the United States and that

28:25

does not make for. A

28:28

happy isn't the few to go to

28:30

be great sort of of mood amongst

28:32

the electorate. Oh. Come

28:34

Back.is the something that you said

28:36

right at the beginning about. People's.

28:41

Political bent beings. Ah, hereditary. In

28:43

essence, I can you talk a

28:45

little bit more about that and

28:47

and how we know. I mean,

28:50

it's not so much, that's you'd

28:52

be necessarily republican or democrat mean

28:54

that didn't But parties are sort

28:56

of. Made

28:58

up constructs Butts for conservatives and

29:00

liberal for example is that we're

29:02

talking about. A yeah that.

29:04

that's exactly what we talk about. And

29:07

there's been a number of studies done

29:09

over the past twenty or so years

29:11

as the first, what was the back

29:13

in Nineteen Eighty Six, but nobody really

29:15

picked up on it. But certainly since

29:17

the early two thousand and a lot

29:20

of these, that is our twin studies,

29:22

so they take offence the fact that

29:24

there's. No. Identical twins

29:26

are literally are genetically identical

29:28

and fraternal twins die psychotic twins

29:31

Sheryl Lee about sixty percent

29:33

of their genes. So very,

29:35

very rough terms of identical twins

29:37

are more like each other

29:39

politically. Fraternal. Twins

29:41

that such prima facie case. Or.

29:44

as long as he statistics that from comments

29:46

were but that's the basic idea. That.

29:48

Is. Identical twins

29:50

immoral was. Banned. For

29:53

eternal twins it's of. Evidence

29:55

that. That. That trait

29:57

is genetically influence, but.

30:00

I also have options for this. People.

30:02

Tend to be more politically like their

30:04

biological parents and their adoptive parents. We.

30:07

Have twins rate of waste apart

30:09

studies. And the twins tend

30:11

to be more like each other. We

30:15

have now. We have

30:17

like a genome wide

30:20

association scams that predict

30:22

a theology. So.

30:24

There's a a number of different.

30:28

Ways. That been triangulated with.

30:30

The. Bottom line is idiotic. Use

30:33

Not only heritable, it's kind of.

30:36

Us who are hurtful than a lot of

30:38

other psychological traits. I mean, he estimates vary

30:40

up around the low end. It's thirty. Percent.

30:44

And on the high end at sixty. Next

30:47

time you get a twenty three and

30:49

meters you find emphasis. On

30:51

a server to. Go.

30:54

Up the let let me ask of these

30:56

were kind of getting into wrapping up here

30:58

it would you have advised to leave our

31:00

listeners with the that's how to manage their

31:02

stress around the elections this the summer and

31:05

fall does is only going to ramp up

31:07

I'm afraid. My. My

31:09

advice would be. To

31:12

not follow the. Common

31:15

refrain as. You. Beat.

31:17

Keep calm and carry ons. I

31:19

think that type moves. Messaging reinforces

31:21

the idea of if you're feeling

31:24

bad, get rid of those feelings.

31:27

It's okay for things to fill up

31:29

settings and doesn't letting yourself sit with

31:31

that and except those feelings and accepts

31:34

the signals that they're providing you about

31:36

how you feel, about how. Things. Are

31:39

and Connect. With people

31:41

that you care about, you know, connect

31:43

with people who. Who

31:45

share your values? Connect with

31:48

people who don't share your

31:50

values. Provide yourself with opportunities

31:52

to have moments of of

31:54

compassion and inspiration and pride

31:56

and connection and love. And

31:58

these things. Not mutually exclusive,

32:01

you can let the world be

32:03

kind of a scary place and

32:05

you can also be a beautiful

32:07

place where you can connect with

32:09

people and through that balance I

32:11

think we can maintain that connection

32:13

to our values and those values

32:15

can help keep us engaged in

32:17

motivated to do in our civic

32:19

duties And then these opportunities to

32:21

connect with people help us maintain

32:23

our mental health and well being.

32:26

As well try to do i'm interface with me

32:28

and he. Or

32:31

his as a I think by

32:33

responsible made every. Police. I

32:35

want to. One teacher really, really happy.

32:38

Hum. I think one of the things that

32:40

people can do is become better informed. About

32:42

the democratic process in the

32:44

institutions of our political system. One.

32:47

Of the things that we find this the

32:49

people who are truly politically knowledgeable about. What?

32:52

A representative democracy is how

32:54

it functions and what our

32:57

institutions do. They can consistently

32:59

to report less of these

33:01

negative effects. Than. Those who

33:03

are less informed and we think

33:06

the part of what's going on

33:08

there it is. If you want

33:10

this and the institutions and you

33:13

understand how democracy works, Democracy. Doesn't.

33:16

Get. Rid of conflict. It just

33:18

manages. That's all it does.

33:21

And. The institutions and our system

33:23

set up to manage that conflict, and

33:25

they've taken a pretty good picking over

33:28

the past five or six years. And

33:30

you know what? they've held. More

33:33

or less done their job, And

33:36

I'm pretty sure that the Republic

33:38

can survive the twenty twenty Four

33:40

election. Regardless, Of of

33:42

what happens and the reason why

33:44

I can say something like that

33:46

is because you know. I

33:49

am. I not only understand these two

33:51

sons, but have some faith in them

33:53

and some faith in the process. And

33:56

I think if people could not and

33:58

a pollyannaish my a Night. Way

34:00

better than old Way. Again,

34:03

some of that. I think that could

34:05

take some of the edge off the

34:07

anxiety and stress. You know what if.

34:09

You. Know if I'm a. Conservative employed wins.

34:11

Or if I'm a Liberal and

34:14

Trump wins, you know what? Things

34:16

would probably be Okay, not great.

34:18

Not. Great a month I'm I'm not

34:21

really not try to be pollyanna here

34:23

but will survive. And this

34:25

is really. My last question: Are you either

34:27

of you both of you doing any kind

34:29

of research now related to the Twenty Twenty

34:32

Four election specifically? I am

34:34

now. A

34:37

success. Snow We the I mean

34:39

we need to understand what's going

34:41

on so it's certainly on our

34:43

radar and will be stay tuned.

34:47

Okay yeah and I'm a political

34:49

scientists and so we agree with

34:51

you know where as a book

34:53

covers A shocker is absolutely were

34:55

taking advantage of that twenty twenty

34:57

four election to to redo some

35:00

ah to replicate some studies and

35:02

also said like investigate a few

35:04

few new avenues. About how people are

35:06

feeling about politics and dealing with it. Or

35:08

it will have to talk again. Thank

35:11

you both for to any me to that

35:13

has been really interesting. Thank you thank you

35:16

think so much. You. Can find

35:18

previous episodes of Speaking of Psychology

35:20

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35:22

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35:41

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35:43

Com Die and to the American Psychological

35:46

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