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FDIC. Hey,

2:21

this is Annie. And Samantha. And welcome to Stuff One

2:23

Never Told You, a production of iHeartRadio. And

2:34

y'all, as you heard yesterday, obviously, when

2:37

we were doing our Monday Mini, and

2:39

Annie was like, hey, July, that's Disability

2:41

Pride Month. So of course, we wanted

2:43

to jump in to celebrate activists who've

2:46

been working not only in disability justice,

2:48

but so much more, because you know

2:50

it's always intersectional here. And

2:53

today we're starting off with activists,

2:55

lawyer, writer, speaker, and so many

2:57

other titles, Haben Girma. And

2:59

Girma is a Harvard Law School graduate

3:01

born and raised in the San Francisco

3:03

Bay Area and is a human rights

3:05

lawyer. And here's a

3:08

bit from her website. The first

3:10

deafblind person to graduate from Harvard

3:12

Law School, Haben Girma is a

3:14

human rights lawyer advancing disability justice.

3:17

President Obama named her a White

3:19

House Champion of Change, and the

3:21

World Health Organization appointed her Commissioner

3:24

of Social Connection. And

3:26

in the site, she talks about why

3:28

she decided to be a disability rights

3:30

lawyer. Quote, as a deafblind student in

3:33

college, I witnessed advocates using the Americans

3:35

with Disabilities Act ADA to

3:37

change social attitudes. The National

3:39

Federation of the Blind regularly

3:41

referenced the ADA when explaining

3:43

to technology developers why designing

3:45

access for people with disabilities

3:47

is a necessity. I

3:50

heard how the National Association of

3:52

the Deaf used the ADA to

3:54

increase closed captioning online, and how

3:56

disability rights advocates use the ADA

3:58

to compel targets tech to... team

4:00

to make target.com accessible to blind

4:02

Americans. Impressed by the

4:04

success of these advocates, I felt

4:07

inspired to join them. Back then

4:09

and even now, I encountered many

4:11

barriers in the digital world, not

4:13

because of my disability, but because

4:15

of attitudes among tech developers that

4:17

trivialize access for disabled people. Yeah,

4:20

we've talked about that previously on

4:22

different episodes about the fact that

4:24

it could be easy, but they

4:26

don't think it through and trivialize

4:28

the needs. Just as

4:30

a kind of asterisk there, Germa

4:33

lost her sight and hearing as a young

4:35

child and currently retains 1% of her sight.

4:39

Growing up, she did have access

4:41

to technology such as digital braille

4:43

device, but she talked about the

4:45

fact her brother, who was

4:47

also deaf blind, did not because they did

4:49

not live in the US at the time. And

4:51

so it was kind of a conversation about the differences

4:54

and the privileges she was able to have in the

4:56

US. Later, she would go on

4:58

to successfully graduate from Lewis

5:00

and Clark College, graduating magna cum

5:02

laude, going on to Harvard Law,

5:04

obtaining her Juris Doctorate, JD. And

5:07

after receiving her degree, Germa joined

5:09

the Disability Rights Advocates, or

5:12

DRA, representing people with disabilities

5:14

as a staff lawyer. Since

5:16

she started her work as a human

5:19

rights lawyer and justice advocate, Germa has

5:21

been very vocal in talking about the

5:23

importance of countering ableist attitudes and inaccessibility.

5:25

Here's a quote from a 2023 Forbes

5:28

article titled, Disability Sparks Innovation, insights

5:31

from deaf blind human rights

5:33

lawyer, Haben Germa. During

5:35

her powerful speech, Haben shared that the

5:37

barriers she has encountered as a disabled

5:39

person have been due not to her

5:42

disability, but rather ableism, a system of

5:44

beliefs and practices that treat disabled people

5:46

as inferior to non-disabled people. The daughter

5:49

of refugees and a black disabled woman,

5:51

Haben says she's built her path to

5:53

success, which she documents in her best-selling

5:56

memoir, Haben, the deaf blind woman who

5:58

conquered Harvard Law. on the belief that

6:00

inclusion is a choice. And the article

6:02

continues, as someone who was named a

6:05

White House Champions of Change by President

6:07

Obama appeared on Forbes' 30 Under 30

6:09

list, has

6:11

learned to dance, ski, climb and surf, and

6:14

is an accomplished lawyer and

6:16

a disability rights advocate, Hobbins

6:18

disability hasn't held her back.

6:20

But ableism, she said, whether

6:22

intentional or unintentional, creates barriers

6:24

for people in the disabled

6:26

community every day, often preventing

6:28

them from full inclusion in the

6:31

workplace, being supported to achieve their

6:33

potential and contribute their skills, as

6:35

well as being able to fully

6:37

participate in other aspects of their

6:39

lives and society. We

6:41

need people to recognize that disabled

6:43

people are talented, said Hobbin, during

6:45

her remarks at the forum. In

6:47

many organizations, disabled people are not

6:49

represented. Or if disabled

6:51

people are represented, it's often

6:53

just white disabled experiences. Diversity

6:56

is multilayered. We need all

6:58

our different experiences represented. Every

7:01

single one of us has something to

7:03

bring to the organization. Right.

7:05

And on her website, she

7:08

includes why organizations need to

7:10

invest in accessibility. As she

7:12

writes, prioritizing inclusion helps your

7:14

organization. Disabled people are one

7:16

of the largest historically underrepresented

7:18

groups, numbering over 1 billion

7:20

worldwide. Reaching a group of

7:22

this scale creates value for

7:24

everyone. Organizations that prioritize accessibility

7:26

benefit by gaining access to

7:28

much larger audience, improving the

7:30

experience of both disabled and

7:32

non-disabled people and facilitating further

7:34

innovation. Organizations also have legal

7:36

obligations to ensure access for

7:38

disabled people. But with that, yes,

7:41

we do need to come back to the fact

7:43

that the new Supreme Court ruling has really messed

7:45

this up. So, of

7:47

course, yes, we will come back and

7:50

have a deeper conversation because we don't know about

7:53

this legal obligations anymore. But we'll

7:56

just pause on that and come back later and cry about

7:58

it later. And from the Forbes article, they write... When

8:00

thinking about accessibility, Haben shared her belief

8:03

that organizations need to consider not just

8:05

their employees, but also their clients, customers,

8:07

and the larger population. For instance, she

8:10

emphasized how important it is to make

8:12

technology more accessible. Sometimes

8:14

when I think about accessibility, people think, oh,

8:16

we'll build a separate website for

8:18

disabled people. Separate is never equal.

8:21

It might start out with good intentions, but down

8:23

the line, the separate app or website for disabled

8:25

people ends up with fewer updates, fewer

8:28

resources, and that's not equal. So what we want is one

8:30

app, one website, or

8:32

one organization that's accessible to everyone.

8:34

And when you are designing digital

8:36

services, the web content accessibility guidelines

8:38

are a great tool. Have

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you ever heard of the term nuclear family?

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The term was coined by an anthropologist in

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the 1920s to describe the

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9:23

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businessodge. pits She

12:03

continues to educate companies, organizations, and

12:05

the general community about the importance

12:07

of understanding language and

12:10

wording as well as accessibility when it

12:12

comes to being inclusive. From

12:14

her website, she advises, quote, challenge

12:16

yourself to create a disability story

12:18

without using the word inspiration. The

12:21

overuse of the word, especially for the

12:23

most trivial things, has dulled its meaning.

12:26

People sometimes even use the word as a

12:28

disguise for pity. For example,

12:30

you've inspired me to stop complaining about

12:32

my problems because I should feel grateful

12:34

I don't have yours. Messages

12:37

that perpetuate us versus them

12:39

hierarchies contribute to marginalization.

12:42

Engage audiences by moving beyond

12:45

the inspiration cliche. Oh,

12:47

that made me cringe. And she continues

12:49

on her website giving advice about harmful

12:51

messages people should avoid, including

12:54

things like non-disabled people

12:56

should feel grateful they don't have disabilities.

12:59

This perpetuates hierarchies of us versus

13:01

them, as we talked about previously,

13:03

and continuing the marginalization of disabled

13:06

people. It goes on

13:09

with another example of what not to use. Successful

13:12

disabled people overcome their disabilities. When

13:14

the media portrays the problem as

13:16

the disability, society is not encouraged

13:19

to change. The biggest barriers exist

13:21

not in the person, but in

13:23

the physical, social, and digital environment.

13:26

Disabled people and their communities succeed

13:28

when the community decides to dismantle

13:30

digital, attitudinal, and physical

13:33

barriers. And advice on

13:35

messages that should be included, like

13:37

we respect and admire disabled leaders,

13:40

just as we respect and

13:42

admire our non-disabled leaders. We're

13:44

all interdependent and go further when

13:46

we support each other. And of

13:48

course, she has received many accolades

13:50

for her work, including being named

13:52

a champion of change by the

13:54

Obama administration, being one of Forbes

13:57

30 under 30. the

14:00

Helen Keller achievement award. And she,

14:02

as we said earlier, has written

14:04

and published a memoir titled, Haben

14:06

the Deaf Blind Woman Who Conquered

14:09

Harvard Law. Obviously being noted as

14:11

the first to do that. It's

14:13

amazing. And apparently it's a bestseller. We need to put

14:15

this on our list soon of

14:18

our many memoirs that we need to read. Yes,

14:21

yes, we should. And we've

14:24

talked about this before, but this is something we've

14:28

seen in our line of work

14:30

where we've been pushing for transcripts.

14:32

There has been some movement on

14:34

that. The listeners let us know

14:37

because I think that's really important. And that's been

14:39

something for me that I've really

14:42

wanted. And

14:45

I hope that we're moving

14:47

in the right direction. But Haben

14:51

is right that it was like

14:53

not a priority. Because

14:55

it's always,

14:59

the disability is a bit

15:01

lower of a priority. And

15:03

I don't think it should be that way. So,

15:08

well, as always, if you have any thoughts

15:10

about this or any

15:12

suggestions, please let us know.

15:15

You can email us at stephaniemomsuff at

15:17

iheartmedia.com. You can find us on Twitter

15:19

at MomsToPodcast or on Instagram and TikTok

15:21

at stuff when never told you. We're

15:23

also on YouTube. We have

15:25

a tea public store. We have a book you can

15:27

get wherever you get your books. Thanks

15:29

as always to our super producer, Christine Nairn,

15:31

executive producer, Maya, and our contributor, Joey. Thank

15:33

you. And we're so sorry, especially

15:35

me. Christina, you're the best. We

15:38

love them. So many mix ups. Yeah, thank

15:40

you. And thank

15:42

you for listening. Stuff I never told

15:44

you is a production of iHeart Radio. For more podcasts

15:46

from iHeart Radio, you can check out their Heart Radio

15:48

app, Apple Podcast, or every listen to your favorite shows.

15:51

Thanks for watching. Thanks for watching. See you next

15:53

time. Bye. Bye. Bye.

15:56

Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.

16:01

This podcast is brought to you by

16:03

Kim Crawford Wines. Kim Crawford invites you

16:05

to Savor Amazing with a chilled glass

16:07

of New Zealand's finest, named in the

16:10

Wine Spectator Top 100 list

16:12

four times. Every sip of Kim

16:14

Crawford Sauvignon Blanc is filled with

16:16

tropical fruit flavors like passion fruit

16:18

and citrus to help you experience

16:20

Golden Hour how you see fit.

16:22

Visit kimcroffordwines.com to learn more and

16:24

find Kim Crawford Wine near you.

16:27

Savor Amazing. For those 21

16:29

and over, please Savor responsibly.

16:31

Constellation Imports, Rutherford, California. This

16:34

episode is brought to you by PNC Bank,

16:36

who believes some things in life should be

16:38

boring. Like banking. Because

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boring is safe and responsible,

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level-headed and wise. All

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things you want your bank to be. You

16:47

don't want your bank to be cool or

16:49

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That's why PNC Bank strives to be

16:53

boring with your money so you can

16:56

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