0:00

Welcome to Stuff you missed in History

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Class from works dot Com.

0:10

Hello, and welcome to the podcast.

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I am Crazy d Wilson and

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I'm Holly Frying and today's

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podcast is inspired

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by Miss Fisher's Murder Mystery.

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I love that show and I love those books,

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and a couple of the recurring characters Bert

0:28

and Says met while fighting at Gallipoli

0:31

in World War One. And the books are

0:33

set in Australia, and a couple of

0:35

them that I've read so far have Australian

0:38

soldiers experiences at Gallipoli

0:41

as a recurring theme. So

0:43

here are some things that I knew about

0:45

Gallipoli before researching this episode.

0:47

The first was it was a battle, a

0:50

campaign, really, there were several battles within

0:53

it. Uh. I also knew

0:55

it was in World War One, And

0:57

then based on things that I gleaned from context

1:00

while reading and watching Miss Fisher's Murder

1:02

Mysteries, Uh, it seems

1:04

to have been a pretty hard time for a lot of

1:06

the people involved in it. And if you grew up in

1:08

Australia, New Zealander, Turkey, you probably

1:10

know a whole lot more about it than what

1:12

I did. Right, So

1:15

Glippoli has actually become a part of the national

1:17

identity of all of those three places. We've

1:20

also gotten a bunch of listener

1:22

requests to talk about the Glipi the Glippoli

1:25

campaign, including Shawna, Amelia,

1:27

Julie, Evelyn, Brandon, Louise and

1:29

Katrina. Probably other people

1:32

too. Some of that stem from the fact that this

1:34

year was the anniversary

1:36

of the Glibpoali campaign.

1:38

Fortunately, the folks at Oxford

1:41

University Press graciously sent us

1:43

a review copy of a new book on

1:45

Gallippoli a few months ago by historian Jenny

1:47

McLoud. Really good book.

1:50

I'm just gonna go ahead and say that now and I'm gonna

1:52

say it again later. But that made it easier

1:54

for us to get started on this one. And

1:57

one of the most memorable and infamous aspects

1:59

of World War One was its long, brutal

2:01

steelmate against the enormous system

2:04

of trenches known as the Western Front. Although

2:06

the powers involved all expected the war

2:08

to be over quickly from the outset, it

2:10

reached an impass almost immediately.

2:14

Tensions had been building for decades

2:16

as various European powers expanded

2:18

their empires, and the tipping

2:20

point came as a lot of folks

2:22

probably know with the assassination of Austrian

2:25

Archduke Franz Ferdinand and his wife

2:27

by Serbian nationalists on June. Within

2:32

a month, Austria Hungary had

2:34

demanded that Serbia takes steps to

2:36

prevent terrorism, and Serbia

2:38

went to its his ally Russia

2:40

for help. Austria Hungary's

2:43

allied Germany declared war on Russia,

2:45

France and Belgium, and by August

2:47

four Britain had declared war on Germany

2:50

as well. More declarations

2:52

of war followed really soon. This

2:55

is in August. By September fift

2:58

the first trenches are being dug. The

3:01

Glipoli Campaign, which started in early

3:03

nineteen fifteen, was an attempt

3:05

on the part of the Allies, that meaning

3:07

Great Britain, France, and Russia, to

3:09

break their stalemate with the Central Powers,

3:11

which were Germany, the Ottoman Empire, and

3:13

Austria, Hungary. Bulgaria

3:15

at this point had not yet entered the war. There

3:18

were two main goals driving the Glipoli Campaign.

3:21

The first was to weaken Germany by going

3:23

after the Ottoman Empire, which had entered the

3:25

war in November of nineteen fourteen. Allied

3:28

leaders also hoped that active warfare going

3:30

on near their borders would prompt other

3:33

Mediterranean nations to enter the war on

3:35

their side. The

3:37

other was to try to open a sea

3:39

route between Russia and its

3:42

allies in Europe. The Glipoli

3:44

Peninsula is bordered by the Aegean Sea

3:46

to the north and the west and the Dardenell

3:49

Straight to the south and the east. If

3:51

the Allies could get access to the Dardnell

3:54

Straight, you could have a water route to the Sea

3:56

of Marmara and that would lead them to

3:58

the Ottoman Empire capital Constantinople,

4:01

which is now Istanbul. If the Allies

4:03

then took Constantinople, this

4:06

would number one be a decisive

4:08

victory over the Ottoman Empire and number

4:10

two allow them to go from the Agency

4:13

into the Black Sea and therefore Russia

4:16

via the Bosphorus Straight. This

4:18

is something the British military had actually been

4:20

discussing for a while, even before

4:22

the Ottoman Empire formally entered the war. A

4:25

water route that was navigable year round

4:27

and could connect Russia to its European allies

4:30

would, after all, be an extremely

4:32

handy thing to have, and this was the

4:34

only one. Winston Churchill

4:36

was the first Lord of the Admiralty and was one

4:38

of the plans earlier proponents. However,

4:41

the rest of the Admiralty thought it much too

4:43

risky until the war actually started to drag

4:45

on, much like everyone

4:48

had thought the whole war would be over by

4:50

Christmas back when it had started in June

4:52

of nineteen fourteen. The British belief

4:54

the Gallipoli campaign would be swift

4:56

and decisive, and the words of Churchill

4:59

quote a good army of fifty thousand men

5:01

and seapower, that is the end of the

5:03

Turkish menace. However, the

5:06

fact that the Allies could use a water route

5:08

to Russia was just as obvious to the

5:10

Ottoman Empire as it was to the Allied

5:12

powers themselves. So in

5:14

the months between the start of the war and the Allies

5:16

actual attempt to take the Dardanelles straight,

5:19

the Ottoman Empire was building fortifications

5:21

on both sides of the street and laying

5:24

mines in the street itself. This

5:26

meant that by the time British and French ships

5:28

moved into bombard the Dardanelles for the

5:31

first time on February, the

5:34

Ottoman Empire was more than ready.

5:37

The British navy knew that its guns were

5:39

better at fighting other ships than at

5:41

fighting targets on land, and this actually

5:44

held true during the first bombardment of

5:46

the Dardanelles. While the

5:48

Allies naval force did successfully

5:51

prompt the Ottoman Empire to abandon some

5:53

forts and outposts that were very close to the

5:55

shore, it did not have a lot of other

5:57

success. The Allies tried to bring

5:59

in i'm sweepers to clear the minds out

6:01

of the strait, but they fell uh.

6:04

The force fell under heavy fire from the remaining

6:06

Ottoman forces and had to fall back. A

6:09

second naval advanced into the Dardnells

6:11

was attempted on March eighteenth of nineteen

6:13

fift Once again, the British

6:16

battleships came under heavy fire. They

6:18

also ran into undetected mines. Three

6:21

Allied ships sank and three others

6:23

were heavily damaged, so this was

6:25

a second unsuccessful attempt. At

6:28

this point, the strategy shifted to invading

6:31

the Gallipoli Peninsula by land

6:33

instead of the dardenell Straight by sea,

6:36

and there were troops reasonably nearby.

6:38

The Australian Imperial Force and the

6:41

New Zealand Expeditionary Force had

6:43

been diverted to Egypt and we're actually training

6:45

there. These two forces eventually

6:47

became the Australian and New Zealand Army

6:50

Corps or ANZAC. The ANZAC

6:52

troops combined with troops from Great

6:54

Britain and Ireland, France, India and Newfoundland

6:57

to become the Mediterranean Expeditionary

6:59

Force, led by Lieutenant General

7:01

Sir Ian Hamilton's We will

7:03

talk about the Mediterranean Expeditionary

7:05

Forces attempt to take Gallipoli after

7:07

we have a brief word from one of our fantastic

7:09

sponsors. So

7:12

getting back to the story. On April nineteen

7:14

fifteen, the Mediterranean Expeditionary

7:17

Force launched an amphibious assault of

7:19

the Gallipoli Peninsula, which required about

7:21

two hundred ships to maneuver into position.

7:24

It was a difficult and devastating mission.

7:26

Throughout the Ottoman forces had

7:29

the high ground and the cliffs above the beach were

7:31

dotted with sniper's nests. The

7:33

Ottoman Empire also had a good intelligence

7:35

network and had correctly predicted where

7:38

the Allied forces we're going to try to

7:40

make landfall, and it

7:42

had fortifications at those points, including

7:44

men and barbed wire already in place.

7:47

The Allies had two landing

7:49

points in that April assault. One

7:52

was the southern tip of the peninsula, at

7:54

Cape Helly's. This one was

7:56

the more strategically important point,

7:58

and so the most experienced units

8:01

were sent there. About seventeen thousand

8:03

Allied troops landed at the Cape in that first

8:05

assault. The other,

8:07

which is nicknamed Anzac Cove, was

8:09

on the Aegean Sea side of the peninsula,

8:12

and it was where another twenty thousand men, predominantly

8:15

Anzac troops, made landfall on

8:17

the twenty five. The force that

8:19

landed there attempted to do so under

8:21

cover of darkness, and consequently they

8:23

wound up a couple of kilometers off course

8:26

due to a navigational error. Because

8:29

they came in at a particularly treacherous

8:31

and indefensible spot, the force

8:33

that landed there had real difficulty reconnecting

8:35

with one another and getting to where they were actually

8:38

supposed to be. The

8:40

Allied force making this initial assault

8:43

on Gallipoli was a much much

8:45

bigger force than the Ottoman troops defending

8:47

it. The Allies outnumbered

8:49

the Ottomans almost two to one in

8:52

that first piece of the campaign.

8:54

But even though the Allies had much bigger numbers

8:57

the Ottomans had, as we noted before the

8:59

high ground found. Plus they were defending their home

9:01

territory, which a lot of them were already

9:03

deeply familiar with. The

9:06

people who were landing from the sea, on

9:08

the other hand, had almost no knowledge

9:10

of the rocky, jagged, crypt cliff

9:12

lined, ravine filled peninsula.

9:16

This meant that during the initial assault the

9:18

Allied force encountered enormous

9:20

casualties, and the assault did not make

9:23

the quick, decisive hole in the stalemate

9:25

that the British had hoped for. Instead,

9:27

it simply turned into a second stalemate, once

9:30

again driven by trench warfare. With

9:33

much difficulty, the Mediterranean Expeditionary

9:36

Force established two beachheads

9:38

at their two landing points that

9:40

they had made in that initial assault. But

9:43

on top of this territory being difficult

9:45

to take, it was extremely hard to

9:47

hang onto. The terrain was

9:49

so rough that they really couldn't get in

9:52

and out with vehicles. Stretcher

9:54

bearer John Simpson Kirkpatrick of the

9:56

Australian Army Medical Corps, better

9:58

known just this John Simpson, became

10:00

famous for carrying injured men from

10:03

the front down to anzac Cove on

10:05

a donkey that had been brought into carry

10:07

water, and he did this basically from

10:09

the time of the first landing on April until

10:12

he was killed in action on May nine.

10:15

Unfortunately, in spite of heroic

10:17

efforts like Simpson's, evacuating

10:19

injured men from the Gallipoli front was often

10:21

not enough. Because the expeditionary

10:24

force had come in from the sea to try to take

10:26

a narrow peninsula, they had a shortage

10:28

of land and nowhere to really build a field hospital,

10:31

so injured troops had to be taken by boat

10:33

to hospital ships that were waiting off shore,

10:36

and men waiting at the beach for these boats

10:38

often came under fire. Once

10:41

aboard these hospital ships, sometimes things

10:43

were not much better without a source

10:45

of fresh water. Water had to be strictly

10:48

rationed, and there just was not enough to

10:50

keep sick and injured people both clean

10:52

and hydrated. This meant the illness

10:55

was an enormous problem, both on the front

10:57

lines and on the hospital ships themselves,

11:00

with dysentery striking both the wounded

11:02

and the doctors and nurses taking care

11:04

of them. Overall,

11:06

illness ended up causing far more casualties

11:09

among the Mediterranean Expeditionary force

11:11

than combat did. Aside from

11:13

the lack of fresh water, there also wasn't enough

11:15

available space to dig good latrines.

11:18

People were living in close proximity

11:20

to their waste and to the bodies of people

11:23

who had died in no man's

11:25

land and could not be retrieved,

11:27

so there was absolutely no good way to keep

11:29

flies who landed on bodies, waste

11:31

and food alike from spreading

11:34

disease, and as a result, it's

11:36

not a great leap of logic to figure this out, but

11:39

typhoid was rampant. So

11:41

the Mediterranean Expeditionary Force was

11:44

basically trapped in their trenches, eating

11:46

mostly corned beef, which they knew as bully

11:48

beef, and ration biscuits. There's

11:50

actually a sweet biscuit that's known as

11:52

anzac biscuits, reportedly because they

11:55

were a common treat and care packages from

11:57

home. These ration biscuits

11:59

that they were subs sting on were not that they

12:01

were basically hardtack that had to be soaked

12:04

to be edible at all. Rats

12:06

were everywhere. The troops had nowhere

12:08

to relax or rest other than

12:11

literally in the trenches in the

12:13

summer heat and hot weather. Illnesses

12:15

flourished only to be replaced by cold

12:18

rain, hypothermia, frostbite,

12:20

and cold weather illnesses in the winter.

12:23

It was to be short miserable.

12:27

By comparison, the Ottoman troops, who were

12:29

defending their own territory using a system

12:32

of trenches they'd had plenty of time to dig

12:34

before the Allies even arrived, were frequently

12:36

supplied with fresh fruits and vegetables from

12:39

local farms. They even had

12:41

brick ovens for cooking in their

12:43

trenches. Their rations of food

12:45

and water were generous. The Ottoman

12:47

field hospitals were well appointed,

12:49

and illnesses were not nearly the

12:51

problem for them as they were for

12:53

the Mediterranean Expeditionary Force. Throughout

12:57

the Allied occupation of Gallipoli, there

12:59

were repeated tempts by the Allies

13:01

to take the high ground and by the

13:03

Ottoman force to drive the Allies out.

13:05

One of the most horrific came on May nineteenth

13:08

nine, when an enormous Ottoman

13:10

force made a direct assault on Anzac

13:12

Cove, which, though fierce, did

13:14

not break through the Anzac line.

13:17

There were, however, six hundred and twenty eight

13:19

Anzac casualties on the Ottoman

13:21

side. There were about ten thousand casualties

13:24

with three thousand, five hundred dead the

13:29

worst. I mean, that's awful.

13:32

But to make things worse, many

13:35

of the dead were left in no man's land

13:37

between the two to the two trenches.

13:39

And it was May, and it was hot, and

13:41

these bodies were left there until May

13:45

when the two forces arranged a temporary

13:47

ceasefire to bury them.

13:50

After this point, attitudes among

13:52

many Anzac shifted when it came to their

13:54

Ottoman adversaries. Previously,

13:57

the prevailing perception was that the Ottomans were

13:59

brutal and average think of those

14:01

propaganda posters that really dehumanize

14:03

the enemy. But particularly

14:05

after the experience of both armies simultaneously

14:08

burying the bodies of their falling compatriots,

14:10

who had all been lying dead in no man's land

14:13

for almost a week, they instead

14:15

began to feel some sympathy. The

14:17

Allies brought in another wave of troops

14:20

on August six, hoping that greater

14:22

numbers would help them finally rest

14:24

Gallipoli from Ottoman control.

14:26

I want to make it clear that both sides had been

14:28

bringing in reinforcements at various

14:30

points during this whole campaign. The

14:33

number of troops that was sent for this August

14:35

six assault though, was far smaller

14:37

than what had actually been requested, and the effort

14:40

was once again ultimately unsuccessful.

14:43

The planned fast, efficient takeover

14:45

had actually dragged on through eight months

14:47

of trench warfare, with both sides

14:50

building dizzy and dizzying complex

14:52

systems of trenches and tunnels which

14:54

they used to try to sabotage one another

14:56

from below. Lieutenant General

14:58

Sir Charles Monroe eventually replaced

15:00

Hamilton's as the commander in chief of the Mediterranean

15:03

Expeditionary Force, and he immediately

15:05

recommended an evacuation. The

15:08

Allies decided this was the best course of action

15:10

on November. A series

15:13

of nighttime evacuations started on

15:15

December, with most of the Allied

15:17

troops departing on the course of four or five

15:19

nights. The last of the Mediterranean

15:22

Expeditionary Force left Gallipoli on

15:24

January eighth and ninth, nineteen six.

15:27

The evacuation was covered by self

15:29

firing rifles, which used water trickling

15:32

into a can to create enough weight

15:34

to move a lever which would fire the gun. These

15:37

served mostly as a distraction for the Ottoman

15:39

force, making it seem as though those trenches were

15:41

still occupied. The evacuation

15:44

was made with a minimum of casualties. It

15:46

was the most logistically effective move of

15:48

the entire campaign. We

15:52

will talk about the aftermath of the Gallipoli

15:54

Campaign and how it's remembered today after

15:57

another brief word from our sponsor,

16:00

and now we will get back to our story.

16:02

Outside of the context of the rest of World

16:05

War One, the casualty toll of

16:07

the Glipali campaign seemed staggering.

16:10

More than four hundred and eighty thousand

16:12

Allied troops took part in the Gallipoli

16:14

Campaign and there were more than two hundred

16:16

and fifty thousand casualties, including

16:18

forty six thousand deaths. Just

16:22

from Australia, there were twenty eight thousand,

16:24

one hundred fifty casualties and eight

16:26

thousand, seven hundred deaths. Nearly

16:29

a sixth of the Australians who lost

16:31

their lives in World War One did so at

16:33

the Gallipoli Campaign. Two

16:36

thousand, seven hundred seventy nine New

16:38

Zealanders died at Gallipoli, which

16:40

was about a fifth of the New Zealanders

16:42

who landed there. Total

16:45

numbers were similar on the Ottoman side,

16:47

with two hundred and fifty thousand casualties

16:50

and was somewhere between sixty five thousand

16:52

and eighty five thousand killed. In

16:54

other words, all told, there were almost

16:56

half a million casualties of just the

16:58

Gliboali campaign. These

17:01

numbers due pale in comparison

17:03

to casualty figures from other parts

17:05

of World War One, and certainly for World

17:07

War One as a whole, in which there were seventeen

17:10

million civilian and military

17:12

deaths, But considering the

17:15

length of the campaign and the fact

17:17

that it ultimately made almost no

17:19

difference in how the war played out, makes

17:22

it seem particularly tragic. In

17:24

part because of the failure of the Glipoali

17:26

campaign, Winston Churchill was forced

17:29

to resign his post as the First Lord of

17:31

the Admiral Team, He lost his seat

17:33

in the House of Commons, and did not even begin

17:35

to politically recover until the

17:39

Ottoman Empire, whose strength had

17:41

been waning since before the war, collapsed

17:44

in nineteen eighteen, and November

17:46

of that year the Allies finally got control

17:49

of the no longer defended Dardenell

17:51

Straight. Today, the Glibbali Campaign

17:53

is an enormously important part of the national

17:56

consciousness and identity of three nations

17:58

Australia, news Eland and Turkey,

18:01

where the campaign is known as Chanako

18:03

Lay. Australia and New Zealand

18:05

were both relatively new as established

18:08

nations within the British Empire during

18:10

World War One. The Commonwealth

18:12

of Australia was established on January

18:15

one, nineteen o one, although of course it

18:17

had been a British colony much longer than

18:19

that. New Zealand had become

18:21

a nation with the signing of the Treaty of White

18:23

Toungy on February six, eighteen

18:25

forty. Particularly for

18:28

the Australian military, this was the first

18:30

time so many men had fought on so

18:32

large a scale, specifically as

18:34

Australians. Heavily

18:37

romanticized accounts of the valor and

18:39

bravery of the ANZAC soldiers came out

18:41

almost immediately after the campaign had ended,

18:44

including pieces by Charles Bean, the

18:46

official correspondent from Australia, whose

18:48

account drew from the epic poem Song

18:50

of Roland. The first

18:52

Anzac Day was celebrated in Australia

18:55

on October thirteenth, nineteen fifteen.

18:57

This first one was basically a memorial

18:59

and a fundraiser for the surviving veterans.

19:02

However, it almost immediately moved

19:04

to April, so the anniversary of

19:06

the day of that first assault, and it gradually

19:08

morphed into a memorial observance taking

19:11

place annually and honoring all veterans

19:13

of all wars, including both

19:15

Maori and Pakeha or European

19:17

descended contributions from New Zealand.

19:20

Commemorations include memorials that take place

19:22

at dawn, parades and ceremonies.

19:25

Anzac Day's popularity waned for a

19:27

while after World War Two as anti

19:30

war and anti colonial sentiments started

19:32

to rise in both Australia and New Zealand,

19:34

but it experienced a resurgence in the ninety

19:37

nineties. Going along with

19:39

this has been the idea of the Anzac myth.

19:41

This is the idea that Anzac soldiers were

19:43

united by a unique brand of courage,

19:45

friendship under fire, discipline,

19:48

loyalty, and leadership, among other

19:50

admirable qualities. And

19:52

there has of course been some criticism of

19:55

both Anzac Day and the Anzac myth, for

19:57

example, whether they glorify war

20:00

and whether they ignore the contributions of women

20:02

who did things like working as nurses, worked

20:04

im munitions factories and things like that during

20:06

the war. In the earliest years,

20:09

of the memorials, mothers who

20:11

had lost their children in the campaign really

20:13

had a place of honor, but that gradually

20:15

faded and the focus turned mostly towards

20:17

the men. There are also some critics

20:20

and theorists who contend that Anzac

20:22

Day has become such an important national holiday

20:24

in Australia and New Zealand because

20:26

it does not have some of the cultural baggage

20:29

tied to White Tangi Day and Australia

20:31

Day, which can't really be discussed

20:33

truthfully without getting into New Zealand and Australia's

20:35

historical treatment of Indigenous peoples.

20:38

But just know that there's controversy around

20:40

all that. Yeah, it's definitely a

20:42

deeply important holiday in both of

20:44

those places, and that's one of the reasons I think we got

20:46

so many requests to talk about the campaign.

20:49

But as is the case for us

20:51

in the United States and some of our national holidays,

20:54

not without criticism from some folks,

20:57

the Gallipoli campaign, or as we said earlier,

20:59

to not glay, it's also nationally important

21:02

in Turkey. Mustapha Kamal

21:04

was the commander of the nineteenth

21:06

Division of the Ottoman Army during the campaign

21:08

and he was one of the strategic minds behind the

21:11

successful Ottoman defense of the peninsula.

21:13

There have actually been people who said that if he had been

21:15

in command of the Allied troops, the Allies

21:17

would have taken the peninsula successfully.

21:20

After the war, he became involved

21:22

in the movement for Turkish independence, and

21:24

when Turkey became a secular republic

21:26

in nineteen twenty three, he was its first president.

21:29

He was given the surname add A Turk, meaning

21:32

Father of the Turks, in nineteen thirty

21:34

five. So the importance

21:36

of the Gliboli campaign is important to the

21:38

Turkish national identity, in part

21:40

because of added Turk's involvement in

21:42

both the campaign and the founding of that

21:44

nation. Like the Anzac myth

21:46

in Australia and New Zealand, the campaign

21:48

is connected to cultural identity in Turkey,

21:51

tied to ideas like bravery and defense

21:53

of the homeland. However,

21:55

Anzac Day and Turkey has also had to

21:58

a lot of people's minds a more specifically

22:00

nefarious quality than in other nations.

22:03

Turkey has been widely criticized

22:06

for its refusal to acknowledge a mass

22:08

deportation and massacre of Armenians

22:10

by the Ottoman Empire, which many

22:12

other nations have agreed was a genocide.

22:15

A lot of people have asked us to do a podcast

22:18

on the Armenian genocide, and I want to be clear,

22:20

it is on the list. It will probably

22:22

be a while before we can get to it, though.

22:25

Focusing on the Gallipoli Campaign, which

22:28

only started a day after these

22:30

mass deportations and massacres started,

22:33

sort of take some of the attention away

22:35

from an anniversary that Turkey doesn't

22:37

really want to talk about. As

22:39

we said at the top of the show, the

22:42

anniversary of the campaign was this year and

22:44

memorials took place at Anzac Cove in

22:46

what is now Turkey, with most of the

22:48

demand for tickets coming for Australia

22:50

and New Zealand. And I

22:52

am not kidding at all. If you

22:54

are interested in this subject, especially

22:58

in terms of like how the

23:00

campaign became so culturally important to

23:02

three different nations, do pick

23:04

up Jenny McCloud's book Gallipoli. It's

23:07

definitely worth reading. It is a very

23:09

slender book. When I got it, I was actually

23:11

like, really I expected it to be twice as

23:13

long as it is, but

23:15

it is really really packed with a lot of information

23:18

and it does a great job of

23:20

talking about both

23:23

talking about the multiple different influences

23:26

in the campaign and how the different sides viewed

23:29

it, and also in acknowledging

23:31

the fact that a lot of military history

23:33

is definitely written from one side,

23:36

and it talks about all the steps that were

23:38

taken to try to make this not just be a

23:40

one sided look at

23:42

the campaign. So that one more time

23:44

is Glippoli by Jenny

23:46

McLeod Tracy. Do you also

23:49

have a little bit of listener mail for us

23:51

to enjoy that I do?

23:53

This is from Jeff and Jeff says, Hello,

23:55

ladies. I just finished listening to the

23:57

Harlem Health Fighters podcast. While

24:00

did not particularly like it, only because

24:02

I rarely like things showing man's in humanity

24:04

to Phillowman, I didn't find it interesting,

24:07

very worthwhile, and African American

24:09

serviceman in the First World War is something

24:11

I definitely missed in history class. Thanks

24:14

for the enlightenment. I'm going to take a pause

24:16

here and say I kind of feel similarly

24:18

about a lot of our topics that are about

24:20

men's humanity to man. I do

24:23

not necessarily love working on those

24:25

ones, but I think they are important.

24:29

So to get back to the

24:32

listener mail, you mentioned again how

24:34

many Americans think segregation was only

24:36

in the South. I'm a fourth generation

24:39

Nevadan born in Reno and raised

24:41

in Las Vegas, but left the Silver State fifteen

24:43

years ago. Since most people outside

24:45

the state only seem to know about the Neon Desert

24:48

and brothels, and little else about Nevada,

24:50

I often seem to end up in conversations

24:53

about the state because so many current

24:55

Nevadans grew up elsewhere. Even back home,

24:57

there is a lack of knowledge about the state's

24:59

his three. I thought i'd share something

25:02

I've always found interesting about the segregation

25:04

in Las Vegas. Nevada's casinos

25:07

were whites only until the early sixties.

25:09

Few workers and no patrons were

25:11

quote colored. Even entertainers

25:14

had to use the back door and weren't allowed

25:16

into restaurants and casinos. Besides

25:19

the rising civil rights movement, the biggest

25:21

change to this where the members of Hollywood's

25:23

rat Pack, big names and show

25:25

business would go to the Moulin Rouge Las

25:27

Vegas Black Casino to hang out. Since

25:29

Sammy Davis Jr. Was not allowed

25:32

on the strip, off the stage, the

25:34

casino owners mobsters for the most part

25:36

back then hated that their high priced

25:38

headliners weren't hanging out with the script

25:40

patrons, bringing in more money and customers

25:43

to the resorts. Frank Sinatra himself

25:46

finally demanded Davis be allowed

25:48

on the strip. The bosses caved,

25:50

as most do when it comes to money, and the casinos

25:52

were desegregated. The University

25:55

of Nevada Las Vegas still has a Confederate

25:57

Soldier as the mascot and are still the Rebel.

26:00

I always thought that odd. Anyway, I

26:02

hope you found the Sotts had been interesting. If you already

26:04

knew it, I bet you didn't learn it in history class.

26:06

That is true. I learned it from this email.

26:09

Jeff says, keep it the great work

26:12

and another thought provoking podcast. Jeff,

26:14

thank you so much. Jeff. Uh

26:17

Well, like I think it was more. In our our

26:20

podcast about Lindy Hop, we talked about

26:22

uh, black entertainers not

26:24

being able to be in

26:26

the venue in some of the places, like the

26:28

Cotton Club was a

26:31

club where the patrons were

26:33

white, but the entertainers are black. I did not realize

26:36

that that existed out in Nevada.

26:38

Also, I had heard the

26:40

Frank Sinatra story before because maybe

26:43

like Frank Sinatra a little bit. But uh

26:45

yeah, it's one of those things that is interesting to think

26:47

about in it it kind of reframes

26:50

that whole era in a new way for me whenever

26:52

I think about it. Yeah, if

26:55

you would like to write to us, we're a history podcast

26:57

but how Stuff Works dot com. We're also

26:59

on Facebook at Facebook dot com slash

27:01

mss in history and on Twitter at miss in

27:03

history. Are tumbler is missed

27:05

in History dot tumbler dot com. Are also on

27:07

Pinterest at pinterest dot com slash

27:10

miss in history. If you want

27:12

to come to our parent company's website, which is how

27:14

Stuff Works dot com and put the word Gallipoli

27:16

in the search bar, you'll find us all kinds of

27:18

various things about World War One and Glipoli

27:21

and how things are now, and

27:24

also a bit specifically about Australian

27:26

traditions, uh to talk about inzact

27:29

day. You'd like to come to our

27:31

website, which is ms in history dot com.

27:33

We have an archive of every single episode we've

27:35

ever done, show notes for this

27:38

episode and the episodes that Holly and I have worked

27:40

on together, other cool stuff that we put

27:43

up there periodically, so You can do all

27:45

that and a whole lot more at how stuff works

27:47

dot com or miss in history dot com

27:53

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27:55

because it how stuff works dot com,

28:00

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