0:00

This message comes from NPR

0:02

sponsor, Stripe. Tap to pay

0:04

on iPhone and Stripe can

0:06

help you grow your business's

0:08

revenue and reach through accepting

0:11

more in-person, contactless payments right

0:13

from an iPhone. To learn

0:15

how, visit stripe.com/tap iPhone. This

0:18

message comes from NPR sponsor, Synchrony Bank,

0:20

empowering you to tackle your savings goals

0:22

with flexible access to your money and

0:24

no monthly fees or minimums. It's never

0:26

been easier to take control of your

0:29

financial future. This

0:36

is the TED Radio Hour. Each

0:39

week, groundbreaking TED Talks. Our

0:41

job now is to dream big. Delivered at TED

0:44

conferences. To bring about the future

0:46

we want to see. Around the

0:48

world. To understand who we are.

0:50

From those talks, we bring you

0:52

speakers and ideas that will surprise

0:54

you. You just don't know what you're going

0:56

to find. Challenge you. We truly have to ask

0:58

ourselves, like, why is it noteworthy? And even

1:00

change you. I literally feel like I'm a

1:02

different person. Yes. Do

1:04

you feel that way? Ideas worth

1:06

spreading. From TED and

1:10

NPR. I'm

1:16

Anoush Zamorodi. Getting

1:19

a fancy new phone

1:21

or computer can

1:23

feel so exciting. Like you

1:25

have a superpower. Until

1:28

it inevitably slows

1:30

down, freezes, or

1:33

stops working altogether. It

1:36

is so aggravating. But

1:39

there are some people who

1:41

actually find it thrilling if their

1:43

stuff stops working. Oh yeah.

1:45

Fixing things is a puzzle. I

1:47

just find it enormously satisfying. This

1:50

is Gay Gordon Byrne. Gay

1:52

does not have the latest iPhone. I think

1:54

I have an iPhone 8. Okay,

1:56

so how old is your phone then? I don't

1:58

know how many years it was in... used before I bought it. I

2:01

bought it two years ago. Used. What

2:03

about your laptop that you work on? Pretty

2:07

sure that's about five years old. Have you

2:09

ever needed to fix it? Yeah, several times.

2:12

It was overheating. And I

2:14

suspected I needed a new fan. So I

2:16

ordered a fan. I opened it up. Saw

2:19

the fan was clogged with cat hair. I've

2:25

also had to replace some keys on

2:27

my keyboard. I've replaced the battery. I

2:29

just enjoyed every minute

2:31

of it to see how these things work. So

2:36

gay is unusual. Don't

2:38

feel badly if you've never pulled apart

2:40

your laptop. Because the companies

2:43

who manufacture our products, they purposely

2:45

make it hard for us to

2:47

fix them. When people

2:49

started getting personal computing equipment

2:52

and cell phones and things like

2:54

that, they were told these things are so

2:57

complicated and so difficult. Only

2:59

the manufacturer is capable of making

3:01

these repairs. And people largely bought

3:03

into that whole idea. Look at all

3:05

the old companies that used to be in

3:07

our towns. There was always an appliance repair

3:09

shop. There was a TV repair shop. There

3:12

was a computer repair shop. Those

3:14

places are gone. And they're gone not because

3:16

people didn't want to fix stuff, but because

3:19

they can't repair things if

3:21

they can't get the essential

3:23

parts and tools. And as

3:25

you can see, with the success of companies

3:27

such as Apple, they have

3:30

made a killing by

3:32

making it impossible to repair without

3:34

help from the Apple Store. Gay

3:37

worked in the tech industry for decades.

3:40

And this corporate behavior ticked her

3:42

off. So in 2013, she founded the

3:44

Digital Right

3:47

to Repair Coalition. And because

3:49

that's a mouthful, we are

3:51

also known as repair.org. Their

3:54

mission, it's to fight

3:56

for repair friendly legislation,

3:58

standard regulations, policies.

4:02

When I first heard it, I was like,

4:04

what do you mean the right to repair?

4:06

That's like the right to fix something. Well,

4:09

duh. Yes. I mean, but what you're saying

4:11

is we are at a point where we

4:13

need the law to

4:16

tell these companies that we

4:19

should be allowed to repair

4:21

the things that we buy,

4:23

right? When you first started

4:25

talking about the phrase, what was the response

4:28

from lawmakers, from manufacturers,

4:30

what did they think?

4:33

Oh, they had exactly the same reaction

4:35

you did. They said, what is that?

4:38

And we were able to explain it

4:40

mostly in the context of cars,

4:43

because everybody understood that they need to be

4:45

able to go to the local mechanic. And

4:47

we say, well, those problems exist now for

4:49

everything else. We are stuck

4:51

with whatever the manufacturer feels like

4:53

doing, because we don't have the

4:55

consumer protection laws to require them

4:58

to do what we need them to do. People

5:01

need to fix their stuff. And if they

5:03

can't, there are some really bad consequences. Reduce,

5:07

reuse, recycle. Since

5:09

the 70s, that's been the slogan

5:12

for the environmentally conscious. But

5:14

today, we often feel unsure if

5:17

our daily habits make any difference

5:19

at all. Are the

5:21

items we toss in the recycling bin

5:23

really recycled? Why are we

5:26

getting new phones and laptops rather than

5:28

fixing them? And does clean

5:30

energy or eating sustainably truly

5:33

have to be a political

5:35

issue? Well, on today's

5:37

show, ideas that put

5:39

a twist on reducing, reusing

5:41

and recycling, and could

5:43

upend entire industries, will

5:45

meet people working to radically change what

5:48

we consume and what we

5:50

see as disposable. Let's

5:52

get back to Gay Gordon Byrne. If

5:55

we are going to have any control over

5:57

our e-waste problem, we have to talk

5:59

about repair. Here she is on

6:01

the TED stage. Back

6:03

in 2013, the EPA estimated that

6:06

the average U.S. household already

6:08

owned 28 digitally-driven

6:11

gizmos and gadgets. It

6:13

was everything from garage door openers

6:16

and hot tub controls to smart

6:18

posters. If we just do a little

6:20

math and multiply 28 times our roughly 123 million

6:22

households, we

6:26

come up with a pretty staggering three

6:28

and a half billion pieces

6:30

of e-waste that don't belong

6:33

in our landfills and they are costly

6:35

and difficult to put back as

6:37

raw materials. When we

6:39

look a little more closely at what's

6:41

even possible with recycling, I think we've

6:43

been ignoring some really ugly truths. By

6:46

the time a laptop or a refrigerator

6:48

or even an electric toothbrush gets in

6:50

our hands, almost all

6:52

of the environmental damage has already been

6:54

done. All

6:56

the costs of mining and

6:59

refining and smelting and transportation,

7:01

and we don't see these

7:03

costs when we go to the store, and

7:05

we don't see the human costs of

7:07

terrible labor conditions and

7:10

exposure to toxic materials. So

7:12

fixing more and throwing away

7:14

less just makes sense. Let's

7:19

talk about where we are then in terms

7:21

of the law and

7:23

legislation. The law says that they're

7:26

not supposed to be monopolizing

7:28

repair. They do. So

7:30

more enforcement would be helpful. But

7:32

enforcement is not the same as making a

7:34

requirement that they sell parts and tools. That

7:38

can only be done in states because

7:40

states have the power of

7:42

general business law. States

7:44

can say, Mr. manufacturer, if you're going to

7:46

do business in my state, you must do

7:49

X, Y, and Z. Those

7:51

laws are very powerful and they work. There

7:54

was a successful wheelchair right to

7:56

repair bill that we finally got passed

7:59

in Colorado. Wait, why would you not have

8:01

the right to repair your own wheelchair? Because they

8:03

won't sell you the parts. Hmm. It's

8:06

a ridiculous situation. Where

8:08

the wheelchair manufacturer says, I can't sell you

8:10

a battery until like three months from now.

8:12

And meanwhile you're sitting in a chair and

8:15

you can't move. That's why

8:17

it went through so quickly. Because

8:19

it's so absurd. But the

8:21

same absurdity applies to all these other things. The

8:24

arguments that big manufacturers make

8:26

to keep their customers from

8:28

fixing their things. My understanding

8:30

is that Apple has said

8:33

you could hurt yourself. In

8:35

other states, tech companies have argued that we'll

8:38

create hubs for hackers. Are

8:42

any of those things true? What are some of the reasons that

8:44

you've heard? There are no

8:46

reasons. There's only excuses. You

8:48

are responsible for your own personal safety

8:51

from the moment that you purchase something.

8:54

That's in every contract I've ever

8:56

seen. And I've spent 40 years

8:58

in commercial contracting. The responsibility for

9:01

safety, and cybersecurity by the way,

9:03

transfers at the cash register. I

9:07

think a lot of people don't even know a world where

9:09

they could take something to get fixed, right? They think, well,

9:11

every two years, my carrier

9:13

says that I'm available for an upgrade. They

9:16

go to the store and they get a

9:18

new phone. Where does the old one go?

9:21

The phones that are taken back in trade

9:24

tend not to reappear on the

9:26

used market. They tend to be

9:29

shredded or pulled apart very prematurely.

9:31

And the parts that they're pulling out could be

9:33

used for repairs, but that's not their

9:36

business. Their business is to

9:38

sell new phones. So that

9:40

is what happens when a manufacturer controls

9:42

the secondary market, is they want to

9:44

keep as much used equipment off the

9:47

market as possible. You

9:49

mentioned earlier that most repair shops

9:51

have gone away. If

9:53

we get the right to repair our stuff, would

9:55

there even be enough people to repair them? So

9:59

these jobs that. that have gone away

10:01

will come back. And they will

10:03

come back in droves because there's a heck of a lot more

10:05

equipment out there that needs repair services.

10:08

There's hundreds of thousands of people that

10:10

have the capabilities and the qualifications. And

10:13

there will be jobs in towns that will

10:15

support a family because these are not

10:17

low-level factory jobs. They're great jobs

10:20

and they don't require an advanced degree. I'll

10:23

give you a new example. There's a

10:25

charity in Minnesota called TechDump and

10:28

they take and donate it electronics. And

10:30

then they hire adults that are hard

10:32

to employ, many of whom coming

10:34

out of the criminal justice system. They train

10:37

them to make repairs. They

10:39

then take the repaired goods, sell them

10:41

and use the proceeds to fund more

10:43

training. And secondary markets

10:46

are why used equipment

10:48

is so affordable because the used seller

10:50

has to compete with new. So

10:52

if a new gadget is $1,000, we

10:55

expect a pretty big discount to buy that same

10:58

item used, let's start with 50%. So

11:01

now we have an affordability capability

11:04

that is central to crossing

11:06

the digital divide. We

11:09

had 5 million students

11:11

that went to virtual school this past year

11:14

that didn't have enabling technology. And

11:17

that's because parents and school districts

11:19

couldn't buy new. We

11:23

still have a lot of chip shortages and these are gonna

11:25

be with us for a while. And I think we have

11:27

to think very seriously about doing

11:29

more repair, not just to

11:32

make things last longer, but

11:34

also to be more resilient as an

11:36

economy. The work

11:38

that you do, do you find

11:40

that your supporters follow along predictable

11:42

party lines? Actually, there's

11:45

almost no partisan divide at all. It

11:48

cuts across every possible socioeconomic, political

11:50

or geographic line. I'd say the

11:52

only real divide we seem to

11:54

see is almost an age divide.

11:57

I see that the older the legislature.

12:00

the less familiar they are

12:02

with A, technology, and B,

12:04

with the limitations of

12:06

modern technology. The last kitchen

12:08

remodel they did was 20 years ago. All of

12:10

those appliances still work. But

12:13

if they have done one in the past five years, they

12:15

will have already experienced some pretty severe problems.

12:18

That's so depressing. You're saying that

12:21

the newer your appliances are, the more likely

12:23

they are to crap out sooner. Absolutely.

12:27

You put a computer in a refrigerator, it's not

12:29

going to last 20 years anymore. So

12:34

bottom line, I need a new

12:36

refrigerator or phone. What should I

12:38

keep in mind? Buy

12:41

the least high-tech product you can in

12:44

a home appliance. Don't

12:46

buy the one with the fancy screen

12:49

on the outside because the screen craps out way faster

12:51

than the compressor. Don't

12:53

buy the bells and whistles because they

12:55

don't last and they won't be supported.

12:57

And one day they might drop

12:59

support on it altogether and now you've got

13:02

to replace and reprogram your entire household. So

13:05

low-tech, as low-tech as you can

13:07

get. I think we've been told that

13:09

we want bright and shiny more so than we actually

13:12

want bright and shiny. Cell phones,

13:14

tablets, whatever. People do want to

13:16

buy things that will last. And

13:18

repair is the way that you

13:21

get to long, useful life of

13:23

the product. That's

13:26

Gay Gordon Byrne. She's the

13:28

executive director and founder of repair.org.

13:32

You can see her full talk at ted.com.

13:35

Today on the show, Repair, Repurpose,

13:39

Reimagine. We'll be right back. This

13:51

message comes from NPR sponsor Grammarly. What

13:54

if everyone at work were an

13:56

expert communicator? Inbox numbers would

13:58

drop. Customer satisfaction. Actions

14:00

Gore's would rise and every would be

14:02

more productive. That's what happens when you

14:04

give. Grammarly to your entire team. Grammarly

14:07

is a secure A I writing partner

14:09

that. Understands your business and

14:11

can transform it through better

14:13

communication. Join seventy thousand teams

14:16

who trust grammarly with their

14:18

words in their data. Learn

14:20

more at grammarly.grammarly easier said.

14:24

This message comes from NPR sponsor

14:26

Squarespace. Kickstart or update written content

14:29

on any website, product description, or

14:31

email with Squarespace AI, generating

14:33

instant, personalized results that know and show

14:36

your brand identity. Explain what your site

14:38

is about, choose your tone, and enter

14:40

what you need to get short or

14:42

long-form text. No matter the placement, Squarespace

14:44

AI makes it easier to go live,

14:47

stand out, and succeed online. Use code

14:49

RADIOHOUR to save 10% off

14:51

your first purchase of a website or domain. This

14:54

message concern and years and so better

14:56

hope. The. New, Keep your stress bottled

14:59

up, he can eat away at you.

15:01

Therapy is a safe space to get

15:03

things off your chest and to figure

15:05

out how to make them better. Try

15:07

Butter Help online. Thirty Designed to be

15:09

convenient, flexible and city to your schedule.

15:12

Get it off your chest with better

15:14

help at Better health.com/and Pr. Today They

15:16

get ten percent off your first month.

15:19

This. Message comes from Capital One

15:21

offering commercial solutions you can

15:23

bank on now more than

15:25

ever. Your business faces unique

15:27

challenges and opportunities. That's why

15:30

Capital One offers a comprehensive

15:32

sweet of financial services, all

15:34

tailored to your short and

15:36

long term goals backed by

15:38

the strength and stability of

15:40

a top ten commercial bank.

15:42

Very dedicated experts work with

15:44

you to build lasting success.

15:46

Explore the possibilities and Capital

15:49

one.com/commercial. A Member F B I see. Before

15:53

we get back to the show when

15:55

I asked you to please consider becoming

15:57

a member of Ted Radio Hour plus

15:59

you. You'll get extra advice,

16:01

stories, and expertise from TED

16:04

speakers every other week and

16:06

no ads ever. And

16:09

you'll be supporting public radio. Listener

16:11

support is crucial to keeping us going.

16:14

Go to

16:17

plus.npr.org/TED or

16:19

give it a try right in the Apple

16:21

Podcast and. It's

16:24

the TED Radio Hour from NPR. I'm

16:27

Manoush Zamorodi. Today on

16:29

the show, repair, repurpose, reimagine.

16:31

So Andrew, where are we going?

16:34

Where is the library? The

16:36

other day I took the subway to

16:38

Lower Manhattan to go to a

16:41

library. It's just through here and

16:43

it is. But this isn't a

16:46

library for books. Housed

16:48

on the sixth floor of a skyscraper

16:50

right near Wall Street is a library

16:52

for materials. It's innovative

16:54

and sustainable stuff. So things which

16:57

is new, different materials that perhaps

16:59

you wouldn't have expected. My

17:02

guide, the librarian, is scientist

17:04

Andrew Dent. I work as a

17:07

material researcher for a company called Material Connection. The

17:09

company acts as a kind of matchmaker.

17:12

Yes, yes. We like to match the innovators, the

17:14

people who manufacture these materials or create these materials,

17:16

and the people who use them, whether

17:18

it's an architect, designer, or a manufacturer of

17:21

a product themselves. We

17:23

do of course have resources for the more standard

17:25

materials, the stuff that you make shampoo bottles out

17:27

of, or the leather for your couch. But

17:29

designers kind of want to see what's new and what's next. So

17:32

this is like walking in the future. This is like... The

17:35

materials library is a large room

17:37

filled with movable walls, each

17:39

with dozens of samples of different

17:41

materials mounted on display from floor

17:44

to ceiling. Okay, I'm following you.

17:46

So we go through the wall,

17:48

after wall, after wall of materials.

17:52

And some of these are just like little boxes.

17:54

This one. This is a method for

17:57

turning eggshells and tomato peels.

18:00

Automobile Tire. Oh My. God. This is

18:02

one hundred percent v the leather made

18:04

of app appeals. That's. So. Cool. I

18:06

mean just in front of me here.

18:09

Is a sound absorbing panel made

18:11

from natural hand picked Scandinavian reindeer

18:14

Mosque. Is it okay if I

18:16

touch sensitive. As a kind

18:18

of birthday. Soft exhaust. I would

18:21

love to have a wall made

18:23

out of that. What's what's the

18:25

criteria for something to make it

18:27

into the library? We we have

18:30

a panel of judges the materials and

18:32

we of course want to come as

18:34

much post stuff as possible will restore

18:36

the others on his have access to

18:38

many different options as possible but for

18:40

us we want really just the stuff

18:42

that whoa whoa to be wow ah

18:44

but also the stuff that will offer

18:46

a more sustainable lower carbon future and

18:48

will resonate with consumers. When.

18:52

You throw something away. It's if he goes

18:54

into a landfill. Andrew. Says we

18:56

need to reimagine how we make

18:59

and build things and use materials

19:01

that will never end up as

19:03

garbage. Here he is on. The

19:05

consists. Of into the

19:07

not doing so well as the architecture industry. Where

19:11

the challenges with office has always been when

19:13

we build up we don't think about taking

19:15

down smith show is this ends up the

19:17

about third of all I'm still buy some.

19:19

The Us is architecture. We.

19:22

Just think it it took me about this. There.

19:24

Are programs that can actually reduce some of

19:26

this material. Good example is this is actually

19:28

bricks are made from old demolition waste which

19:31

exceeds the girls because the rebel into the

19:33

concrete to put a big right up for

19:35

altogether heated up and make these pricks. We

19:37

can basically built more building from with only

19:40

a fraction of what we need. I

19:43

hope is that with. Big.

19:45

Data and Geotagging we can us the things

19:47

that and we can be more strict the

19:50

when it comes to believe it's is a

19:52

building down the block which is being demolished.

19:54

Other materials they're that the new building been

19:57

built here can use. can

19:59

we use that abilities to understand all

20:01

of the materials that are available in that building

20:03

that's still usable, can we then basically put them

20:06

into a new building without

20:08

actually losing any value in the process? Okay,

20:12

so let's say I'm one of your clients

20:15

and I arrived here and I said, you

20:17

know, Andrew, I have to look at my

20:19

beautiful design for, I don't know, a sneaker,

20:21

a new fashionable sneaker, but

20:24

I definitely want to market

20:26

it to a conscientious

20:28

consumer. You would then take me

20:30

into the library and show me what? We

20:32

would show you two types of things. We would

20:35

show you materials. We would also show you new

20:37

manufacturing processes as well. Ew,

20:40

Andrew, that looks like a box with somebody's old

20:43

chewing gum in it. Exactly right. So

20:45

there's a company in London that is taking,

20:48

well, basically has put containers around the

20:50

city. So when you finish chewing your gum,

20:52

rather than leaving it on the floor, which is in itself not

20:54

a good thing, you can put it into

20:56

one of these receptacles and they will collect it, they

20:58

will clean it, and then they will

21:00

take that material, because it's basically a

21:03

rubbery material and they'll synthesize it and

21:05

manufacture it into products. Like

21:07

what? Coffee cuplets, coffee cups

21:10

themselves, even the soles of

21:12

shoes, because the material

21:14

is just a chemistry. So yes, it's been inside my

21:16

mouth and I've been chewing it. It's got bacteria from

21:18

my mouth. And once we clean that off, the

21:21

raw material itself has value as basically

21:23

a rubbery, durable and colorable product. So

21:26

is this a proof of concept or

21:28

is this actually? So what's this? So

21:32

this is a rigid

21:34

panel material, perhaps used as a countertop, 100% from

21:37

fish scales. No

21:39

way. Fish scales? So,

21:42

okay, tell me where this

21:44

comes, okay, explain the process here. It looks, by the

21:46

way, it

21:48

really looks just like a, maybe quartz, quartz

21:50

countertop. Yes, or something like that. So

21:53

yes, turns out that kydosan, which is what fish scales

21:55

are made of, is a very wonderful engineering material. So they're

21:57

going to clean it first so it doesn't smell of

21:59

thick. If you sell it. Doesn't.

22:02

Make any think of okay exact excuses. Were not

22:04

able to clean me so things are effectively so.

22:06

Doesn't smell of fists is no sultan in her

22:09

that so we just take the raw material, clean

22:11

it wealth, proceed to get a habit, a binder

22:13

and he becomes a viable valuable material. Is.

22:16

This can happen suit or

22:18

are there and an assist

22:20

canneries in Alaska also turning

22:22

into teaching countertop companies. That

22:25

this company sells getting countertops. you can

22:27

purchase kitchen countertop from this company which

22:29

one hundred. The. Skills. To

22:32

get a discount. The

22:34

kids are most difficult would be

22:37

interesting med medical so it's actually

22:39

some ruff ruff looking cups and

22:41

bowls that a manufactured out a

22:43

common you. Will have. Okay

22:46

so it looks like and a terracotta

22:48

mud you taking it off. Just can

22:50

I touch it again? Just as and

22:52

there's drink sodas, It's

22:54

it was more the concepts of thanks to

22:57

be a visit This is that. This is

22:59

cool. But

23:01

it looks really nice. The

23:04

it's whistles a functional that nothing was you

23:06

had a a I'm a farmer The dairy

23:08

farmer who basically was worried about the amount

23:10

of a new that they're producing set it

23:12

to discard it. Somehow there wasn't any other

23:14

use for it. so if okay we'll since

23:16

it's mostly just cellulose fibers is released it's

23:19

to usable materials. So they decided okay with

23:21

that specially into cups and then just fire

23:23

it a manufactured these products out of it.

23:26

But. I'm guessing that's as that's a

23:28

hard sell, right? I mean, Eat

23:30

today. What? It doesn't need to be a cop.

23:32

It can be So it can be floor tile.

23:34

It can be anything with me. Something out the

23:36

Pepsi wouldn't be drinking out of. As.

23:43

As few as a consumer I

23:45

mean it's really depressing. Everything I

23:47

read basically says that say nice

23:49

that you're recycling year. Now

23:51

Dad, or your laundry

23:54

detergent. Dad but the chances

23:56

are that actually being recycled and

23:58

we used again. That.

24:01

Is. Pretty women ed. It.

24:04

Would be feel that way to is that

24:06

true? With I feel like we don't even

24:08

know what to believe anymore when it comes

24:10

to recycling as consumers. It

24:13

is confusing yes I'm and our

24:15

recycling rates are abysmal if we

24:17

take the most easily recyclable and

24:19

the most valuable material. So I

24:22

had a water bottle for a

24:24

soda bottles so that material is

24:26

a more fuss polyester tix. It's

24:28

clear that recycles very easily. We've

24:30

got a very efficient systems of

24:33

a cyclic. It ends up as

24:35

shares or as clothing so it's

24:37

got a second. Like the has

24:39

values and we silly recent. About a

24:41

cool for it. Or compare

24:43

that to other plastics. Let's say, the

24:46

polyethylene used in milk cartons or in

24:48

shampoo bottles. That number gets down to

24:50

sort of final ten percent. But

24:53

it is possible to do it efficiently.

24:55

There are some Scandinavian countries yes I

24:57

know they always do better than we

24:59

do. Some weather is recycling rates are

25:01

if in the eighties and ninety percent

25:03

certain. almost everything that they are using

25:05

then gets recycled back into something else.

25:07

We have a unique challenge here in

25:09

the Us, but it is possible to

25:11

improve. And yes it can be sometimes

25:13

but you lose faith in it. But

25:15

they've been so many new methods of

25:17

recycling and are efficiencies of our seats

25:19

repurchasing that matter what it does she

25:21

get recycled are so good. I

25:24

believe that there's still hope. Sorts

25:29

of you. Think about the what if you

25:31

make anything if you're and any five a

25:34

design for a few basically a refurbished in

25:36

your house. Any aspect in which you would

25:38

you make something think about how that products

25:40

could potentially be used as a second life

25:43

of her life, a fourth life design in

25:45

the the ability for to be taken apart.

25:49

In the meantime, it sounds like we

25:52

also need to consider changing the way

25:54

we manufacture things said that they are

25:56

is it is the right term circular

25:58

Is that the right. Yes

26:00

that is the ideal that everything should

26:02

work in circles because everything in nature

26:05

what what? Since I was the what

26:07

The water that the water settled into

26:09

the subtle of life arm nature base

26:11

me finds a second life a third

26:13

life A reprise the repeatable life For

26:15

everything it it asks there is no

26:18

waste in in an image of and

26:20

we are thinking about designing. Products.

26:22

So they have the potential for a second

26:25

life. So trying to remove to lose which

26:27

make it right. How to pull things apart

26:29

trying to make things which are will be

26:31

kimono material support from the same material So

26:33

therefore you can put in the same a

26:35

sighting. But so this design and. Evolution

26:38

has tried to approach design as

26:40

a way of ensuring that any

26:42

product can have a second a

26:45

satellite. I

26:48

doesn't ask you what comes to your

26:50

mind as a materials scientist. When I

26:52

say am I mean it's essays, It's

26:54

been said. An. Infinite number

26:57

of times we use we purpose recycle

26:59

is still the right message or is

27:01

there a new message that we need.

27:04

It still of I will message. I.

27:07

Think reuse Me as possibly one of

27:09

the most valuable ones because the matter

27:11

how sustainable you can make a products,

27:13

if we can last two or three

27:15

times the length of another product than

27:18

that is the was going to be

27:20

the better choice. I think that the

27:22

standard three reduce reuse, recycle, off. Or

27:25

iterative. They are steps we can

27:28

take for existing solutions. I think

27:30

for me is very much about

27:32

reimagine. I noted that are tired

27:35

old example but from Cds. Turn

27:37

to I tunes. We. just reimagine the

27:39

now it's a present that uses know

27:41

mature a little for think a lot

27:43

of examples which are the most successful

27:46

as well as a designer an architect

27:48

or a brand owner has completely reimagine

27:50

the product or it's it's use and

27:52

therefore has gone away with any concern

27:54

about that three of his last so

27:56

rematch article forty the best news listen

27:58

if we can That's

28:02

Andrew Dent. He's the Executive

28:04

Vice President of Materials Research

28:07

at Material Connection. You can

28:09

see his full talk at

28:11

ted.com. On the

28:13

show today, repair, repurpose, reimagine.

28:17

When you hear the term renewable energy,

28:19

what do you think of? Maybe

28:22

solar power, wind, big

28:25

hydroelectric dams. But

28:27

if you've ever swum in a hot

28:29

spring or visited a geyser. Or for

28:31

me, I just sat under Mount Rainier

28:33

for a week and that's a volcano.

28:36

Well then you've seen another source of

28:38

potential power, geothermal. It's

28:41

a gigantic source of energy

28:43

that emanates through the earth and

28:46

parts of it actually escape the

28:48

surface. This is Jamie Beard. You

28:51

have rock with pore space in it.

28:53

You have water inside that pore space

28:55

in the rock. And then you have

28:57

a lot of heat close to the surface.

29:00

And when you have all of those

29:02

conditions together, that

29:04

is a gigantic resource. And

29:06

in areas that have these

29:09

resources, the opportunity for cheap,

29:11

renewable energy is huge. 30%

29:14

of Iceland's electricity is geothermal.

29:16

Kenya, 38%. But

29:20

Jamie says that for most of the

29:22

world, geothermal power is nothing. Like

29:25

it's so small now that it's

29:27

barely a blip on the radar.

29:29

Which is why she no longer

29:31

practices environmental law, but

29:33

is instead working to grow the

29:36

geothermal industry. Geothermal

29:38

is beneath us anywhere and everywhere

29:40

in the world. And the only

29:43

difference between Iceland and

29:45

right here in Boston where I'm sitting is

29:48

the depth that you need to

29:50

drill to get to the heat.

29:52

In some places you have to

29:54

go deeper. It's not right at

29:56

the surface, but it's still there.

29:58

That's what's really important. really, really exciting about

30:00

it to me. The core of

30:03

the Earth is 6,000 degrees

30:05

Celsius. The same temperature is the

30:07

surface of the sun. But

30:09

it's not 94 million miles away.

30:12

It is right here beneath our feet.

30:15

Jamie Beard continues from the TED stage.

30:18

There are teams of innovators

30:20

that are working on figuring out

30:22

how to most efficiently and effectively

30:24

tap this enormous heat source beneath

30:26

us. But in

30:28

order to do that, we've got

30:30

to figure out how to mimic

30:32

the conditions that occur in places

30:34

like Iceland that make geothermal easy

30:36

to tap and extract and harvest.

30:39

And those conditions are hot

30:42

rocks, poor space in the

30:44

rocks, and water filling those

30:46

pores. Those conditions seem

30:48

simple, but they actually occur naturally

30:50

in very, very few places in

30:52

the world. But the

30:55

past couple of decades, there have been really

30:57

disruptive and breakthrough technological innovations

31:00

that enable us to engineer

31:02

the subsurface to mimic Mother

31:05

Nature's geothermal. So

31:07

technological innovations like directional drilling, where

31:09

no longer we can just drill

31:12

straight down, but instead we can

31:14

actually turn and steer drill bits

31:17

to reach very precise

31:19

and specific locations in

31:21

the subsurface miles underground.

31:24

And we can also fracture rock now,

31:26

which means that we can create poor

31:28

space where poor space does not exist

31:31

naturally. So

31:33

if you take these innovations that I just

31:35

listed and you put them all together,

31:37

you end up enabling an entirely new

31:40

breed of scalable geothermal

31:42

concepts. Geothermal concepts can be done

31:44

anywhere in the world. OK,

31:47

so let's talk more about how

31:49

you actually tap this geothermal energy.

31:52

Let's get a little technical. Can you

31:54

explain one of them, EGF? Sure.

31:58

So the first type of dry rock

32:00

system is engineered or enhanced

32:03

geothermal systems and in

32:05

those you drill a well and

32:08

then you fracture the rock. So

32:10

it's remember this is dry there's no

32:12

fluids down there and it may not

32:14

be porous enough so you want to

32:16

make more pores and then you send

32:19

a fluid down that well and circulating

32:21

that fluid through the rock the fluid

32:23

heats up it comes you produce it

32:25

in a well at the surface and

32:27

you run a turbine to produce electricity

32:29

so you're actually running a power plant.

32:32

So it's basically the same as geothermal

32:34

plants in Iceland or Kenya just like

32:37

much much deeper under the ground. Right

32:39

okay but you said that there's another way

32:41

to get at that energy that you're psyched

32:44

about. Yeah so the

32:46

second concept that's really interesting

32:48

is closed loop systems and

32:50

closed loop is actually it leans

32:52

really heavy on the use of

32:55

directional drilling techniques and that's

32:57

essentially the ability to turn your drill

32:59

bit and to aim for a

33:01

specific place underground that you want to go

33:04

and you don't need to use

33:06

fractures in closed loops because they're

33:09

closed right and so you have an

33:11

underground radiator that you circulate a fluid

33:13

through and that fluid

33:15

is produced at the surface and runs a

33:18

power plant just like EGS. Yes

33:21

these are not moonshots. We are

33:23

talking about making very

33:25

incremental changes to existing

33:27

technologies with an eye

33:29

on more hotter

33:31

and deeper geothermal developments.

33:34

There are teams in the field

33:36

demonstrating these concepts teams like

33:39

Sage Geosystems a team that I mentor.

33:41

This is a well and get this Texas.

33:45

This is a Texas pasture where

33:48

you would never suspect the

33:50

enormous geothermal resources that lie

33:52

below and this

33:54

well is an existing abandoned

33:56

oil and gas well that

33:59

they have repressed. purpose for this

34:01

geothermal demonstration. In

34:04

the past 18 months, more geothermal startups

34:06

have launched in the past 10 years

34:09

combined. If even

34:11

one of these startups is successful

34:13

at proving a scalable geothermal concept,

34:16

we are literally off to the races

34:18

in developing this massive, reliable,

34:20

24-7 clean energy source

34:23

anywhere in the world. So

34:27

if we've got the technology, what's

34:29

holding us back from a geothermal

34:31

power boom? Jamie

34:33

says it's politics. When

34:35

we come back, her proposal for

34:37

bringing together the fossil fuel industry

34:39

and environmentalists. I'm

34:42

Anoush Zamerodi, and you're listening to the TED

34:44

Radio Hour from NPR. Stay

34:47

with us. This

34:58

message comes from NPR sponsor,

35:00

Viore, a new perspective on

35:02

performance apparel. Clothing designed with

35:04

premium fabrics, built to move

35:06

in, styled for life. For

35:08

20% off your first purchase,

35:10

go to viore.com/ NPR. This

35:13

message comes from NPR sponsor, Teladoc

35:16

Health. There are lots of

35:18

reasons for wanting to be

35:21

healthy. Family, work, living a

35:23

fuller life. Teladoc Health understands.

35:26

Whether you have diabetes, high

35:28

blood pressure, or just need

35:31

to manage your weight,

35:33

Teladoc Health can help. Visit

35:35

teladochealth.com/whatsyourwhy for more information. That's

35:38

T-E-L-A-D-O-C health slash whatsyourwhy. This

35:41

message comes from NPR sponsor, Global

35:43

X ETFs. Looking to invest? Start

35:45

your journey by exploring exchange traded

35:47

funds with Global X ETFs. Exchange

35:50

traded funds, or ETFs for short,

35:52

create baskets of stocks, bonds, and

35:54

other assets that you can buy

35:56

in a single trade. Global X

35:58

specialize in ETFs. that track

36:01

emerging trends like the rise of

36:03

artificial intelligence as well as strategies

36:05

aimed to generate income potential. Visit

36:07

globalxetfs.com to discover how you can

36:10

get started. This

36:12

message comes from NPR sponsor Viking,

36:14

committed to exploring the world in

36:16

comfort. Journey through the

36:18

heart of Europe on an

36:20

elegant Viking longship with thoughtful

36:23

service, destination-focused dining, and cultural

36:25

enrichment, on board and onshore.

36:28

And every Viking voyage is all

36:30

inclusive with no children and no

36:32

casinos. Discover more at

36:34

viking.com. What

36:38

does it need to be Black in America? In

36:41

NPR's Black Stories Black Proof, a

36:44

collection of stories as varied, nuanced,

36:46

and dynamic as the Black experience,

36:49

you'll hear, it means everything.

36:52

Search NPR Black Stories Black Truth

36:54

wherever you get your podcasts. It's

37:02

the Ted Radio Hour from NPR.

37:04

I'm Anoush Zamorodi. On

37:07

today's episode, Repair, Repurpose,

37:09

Reimagine. And we

37:11

were just hearing from Jamie Beard,

37:14

who describes herself as a geothermal

37:16

instigator. The thing I love about

37:18

geothermal is it's clean and renewable

37:20

in that it's this naturally

37:23

occurring energy source that is

37:25

ubiquitous, near limitless. Jamie believes

37:27

that we are on the

37:29

cusp of turning geothermal energy

37:32

into a massive new source of

37:34

alternative power. So how do we

37:36

do that? Brings me my

37:38

proposition. Here she is again on the Ted

37:41

stage. To scale geothermal,

37:44

we need to efficiently, effectively, and

37:46

safely drill below the surface over

37:48

and over and over and over

37:50

again. And who does

37:52

that now? The oil and

37:54

gas industry does that now. The

37:57

oil and gas industry is

37:59

a global specialty. centralized workforce

38:01

of millions, backed by

38:03

almost 200 years

38:05

of breakthrough technological innovation,

38:08

all aimed at producing energy

38:11

from deep underground. You

38:13

flip the switch and you

38:15

have green drilling. And

38:18

oil and gas keeps its current

38:20

business model, the business model that

38:22

keeps them firmly rooted in hydrocarbons

38:24

now. They're doing what

38:26

they know how to do, which

38:29

is exploring for, drilling for,

38:31

and producing a subsurface energy

38:33

asset. So,

38:36

Jamie, you went from being an activist

38:38

who was against the fossil fuel industry

38:41

to working with that industry and

38:43

trying to get it to transition into

38:45

geothermal. Why? That doesn't sound

38:47

like a natural progression to make. I

38:51

would have agreed with you when I was 18, 19, early

38:53

20s, vehemently. In

38:57

fact, I started my career

38:59

working in renewables like solar

39:02

and wind. One

39:04

thing that I did realize though over

39:06

the past years is that, you

39:08

know, if we want to go

39:11

fast and there is an enormous

39:13

amount of climate urgency, we

39:16

literally have a Ferrari in the

39:18

driveway. You've

39:20

got millions of highly

39:22

skilled workers. You've got

39:25

a ton of relevant technologies and

39:27

a hundred years of know-how. You

39:30

have an existing global footprint with

39:32

spot-on core competencies in this area.

39:36

Why not use that? That is

39:38

a gigantic resource. So, when

39:40

you talk to people who are in the oil

39:42

and gas industry and you propose to them this

39:45

idea of turning their teams and

39:47

resources into geothermal

39:49

power plants, what's

39:51

their response? So, one

39:54

of the first individuals that I

39:56

contacted was a former chief scientist

39:58

that showed me that, named

40:00

Wamp Cook and he was

40:03

skeptical at first and we had a lot of

40:05

fights and over a

40:07

period of months he came around and

40:10

decided that he was excited enough

40:12

about geothermal and the ability to

40:14

reduce costs using oil

40:16

and gas technologies and methodologies that

40:19

he went and started a company.

40:21

But now there are more than

40:23

25 teams that I'm working with

40:25

now all pursuing

40:27

different concepts and types of projects

40:30

in geothermal. So

40:32

I need to ask fracking for

40:34

fossil fuels is very divisive. A

40:36

lot has been reported on the

40:38

pollution that fracking rock for

40:40

oil and gas can cause. My

40:43

understanding is that fracking for geothermal would

40:45

be far less dangerous but do you

40:47

think people are ever really going to

40:49

believe that? If there is

40:51

something that I lose sleep

40:53

over it's that. I mean

40:56

this is something that technologically speaking I'm

40:58

not worried. Like that is going to

41:01

be solved fast. What I'm worried about

41:03

here is the human resources problem and

41:05

it's a big one right?

41:09

How do you deal with the fact that we're

41:11

talking about essentially here green fracking right?

41:13

Is green fracking going to be

41:15

a thing and will environmental groups

41:17

and climate activists of which I'm

41:19

one you know

41:22

accept. But geothermal is

41:25

just too awesome to become this like

41:27

political football. It's a

41:29

cause that like every single one of

41:31

us could get behind but we need

41:34

to make sure that we're doing the

41:36

work in you know inclusion of voices

41:38

talking to one another compromising and that's

41:41

hard. But why

41:43

would we go read why would we

41:46

start from scratch and rebuild industries you

41:48

know or start you know start from scratch and

41:50

build new industries that are going to take us

41:52

a hundred years to power the earth that

41:55

we don't have when we've

41:57

already got one that we can just of

42:00

it toward geothermal.

42:06

That's Jamie Beard. She's the founder

42:08

of the nonprofit Project Innerspace. You

42:11

can find her full talk at

42:13

ted.com. So

42:16

on this episode, we've talked about re-imagining

42:18

what we make things with. We've

42:21

heard about why we should repair our

42:23

products and how we

42:25

could repurpose oil drilling technology

42:27

to tap into geothermal power.

42:30

But what about what we eat? Can

42:33

we remake what goes on our plates?

42:37

Yeah, so I've been working with cows for about

42:39

20 years or so. This

42:42

is biologist Ermias Kaprab. Growing

42:44

up in Eritrea, Ermias saw

42:47

how important milk and meat

42:49

were to the nutrition of

42:51

his family and his community. The

42:53

majority of people in the world

42:55

live in low-income countries where the

42:57

main source of nutrition, the good

42:59

nutrition, is animal-sourced food. I wanted

43:01

to have ample opportunity for people

43:04

to drink milk and to eat meat

43:06

and basically lead a healthy life. That's

43:08

what I wanted to do,

43:10

and that's what I studied, biology and

43:12

agriculture. I've had a relationship with cows

43:14

for quite a long time. Now,

43:19

Ermias is a professor at

43:21

UC Davis, where he studies

43:23

cows, specifically a problem with

43:25

cows, their burps. Those

43:30

burps are full of methane,

43:32

one of the greenhouse gases that

43:34

contributes to climate change. In

43:37

fact, cows account for 4% of

43:39

US greenhouse gas emissions every year.

43:42

I always thought that cows

43:45

were particularly flatulent.

43:48

Is this true? It is not. So

43:52

most of the gas is formed

43:55

in their stomach, In

43:57

their gut, particularly in the first chamber.

44:00

And so they bet you that. The.

44:02

By soon as summit between ninety five to

44:04

ninety seven percent of the methane comes from

44:06

the front end of the cap. for the

44:08

back end of the cow is really maybe

44:10

three percent or less. So

44:13

for the past several years army

44:15

As and his team has been

44:17

experimenting with how teams in a

44:19

cow's diet could safely and quickly

44:22

lower the amount of methane. In

44:24

it's Deltas here As early as

44:26

a bribe on the Penn State.

44:28

Sovereignty. Reduce this mess and bucks.

44:31

My. Colleagues and I. May. Find a

44:33

solution. Seaweed. Let.

44:36

Me explain. A. Couple of years ago. And

44:39

I think it was obvious that

44:42

showed almost complete elimination of methane

44:44

when seaweed was added. To.

44:46

Tubs grass in the last. Great.

44:50

But. As Agricultural Research or. I.

44:52

Know lots of additives work well in the

44:54

lab, but not the real animals. Are

44:56

there was something defense about seaweed in

44:59

the way in which is reduced missing.

45:01

Some. Series contain ingredients.

45:04

Does. Directly inhibits microbes in

45:07

the house got from forming methane.

45:09

Without. Interfering with with I just and.

45:12

So. We thought we should test is in

45:14

live animals. Before. The first

45:16

ever experiments and dairy cattle.

45:19

And we had no idea how much to give them.

45:22

As. See, your team starts mixing and it's

45:25

a little bit of seaweed into the cows

45:27

regular seeds and what if it's as think

45:29

like that they like it. While

45:32

they're the ones that we give too

45:34

much day he didn't know is as

45:36

much as you like them to do

45:38

it because we don't as let the

45:40

as tulsa very picky eaters. oh I

45:42

didn't know Dahlia that they sought the

45:44

A C they will. They will find

45:46

that with the bits and pieces that

45:48

be like of like my dog Css

45:50

say that they didn't get used to

45:52

it right away. Better so we we

45:54

give them for about three weeks and

45:56

then we speak them around and that

45:58

three weeks in those. Repeat them around and

46:00

I was it. And. All the while though,

46:02

you're collecting. Their. Bumps.

46:06

And. It's not a sentence I thought I

46:08

would ever say army as assess how you

46:10

do that. The. Way we do with

46:12

his we have a device called green feet

46:14

and what he does is a wall. It.

46:18

Was a would entice them to come

46:20

to this to this machine where they

46:22

feed bit to stick their head into

46:24

this machine in the seat for from

46:26

that machine so as soon as they

46:29

come in dig the grief is machine

46:31

was dropped some some what he called

46:33

cow cookie so they just seabiscuit cookie

46:35

as they're eating it will be breathing

46:37

into this machine and the machine will

46:40

take out their breasts and then right

46:42

away analyze and in their buffing how

46:44

much methane, how much carbon dioxide, how

46:46

much hydrogen address and then automatically. Sense

46:48

that you for missy where mislead and and

46:50

a com love it Avenue with see them

46:52

live up to try to get into this

46:54

Muslim. A

46:58

Great the A Very willing participants and

47:00

your study. Said

47:02

purposes or would hope would

47:05

sit well with hockey was

47:07

that though with see Ten

47:09

twenty thirty percent of our

47:11

utmost the reduction in emissions

47:13

as I would made me

47:16

very happy. but then out.

47:18

When we sat doing this and

47:20

I had getting to support for

47:22

my graduate students that some the

47:24

Destiny was quite higher at I

47:26

couldn't believe it. In

47:30

that first experiments. That. Mrs

47:32

were reduced by up to sixty

47:34

seven percent. And

47:40

I thought at first. The. Cuban

47:42

must have must sanctioned but he was real.

47:45

But we. Were less or more persons

47:47

and Isis. With. The

47:49

microbes in the guts. Gets

47:51

use weights and start producing methane over

47:54

time. With. The seaweeds disable

47:56

other a long period of time

47:58

in storage. Yeah

48:00

sexes and the cause sudden up their

48:02

noses. Are with the see

48:04

with us at the house. A house

48:07

or Me production. So.

48:09

We teamed up again and I kind of a tramp.

48:12

Over a size month period.

48:14

We. So. The. Seaweed.

48:17

Reduce emissions by over

48:19

eighty percent. Of. Our

48:25

colleagues in Australia. They. So up

48:28

to ninety eight percent reduction in

48:30

a similar fall. Does.

48:32

And of production is simply staggering.

48:35

Be. I've also seen at improvements in

48:37

Burkina. Of the beast at home.

48:40

With. No adverse health effects. So.

48:43

It's a win for the environment. It's

48:45

a win for the farmers and consumers.

48:48

A panel of one hundred and

48:51

four people got to taste steaks

48:53

made from the sea is offered

48:55

seaweed and console. And.

48:57

They did not detect any difference well

48:59

as a did it a little small

49:01

quality of the meat and be found

49:04

no difference between. And. He most

49:06

of the offered seaweed and control. Okay

49:10

so you deal of the your

49:12

first that he with town. it's

49:15

highly successful. You do another study.

49:17

it's even more successful. Eighty percent

49:19

methane reduction. Plus it doesn't seem

49:21

to affect the cows how it

49:24

makes them. Sat healthy

49:26

and still delicious. What does that

49:28

make you want to do? Sort

49:31

of. I assume this is the

49:33

researchers dream right to prove that

49:35

something works. but how do you

49:37

go from having the solution to

49:40

actually implementing the solution? What do

49:42

you deal with this knowledge? Yeah

49:45

that that that That's a good

49:47

question. So not too long ago

49:49

the California Department of Food and

49:51

Agriculture has given to get approval

49:53

that the is it be generally

49:55

recognized as safe so at certain

49:57

formulation and now be sold a

49:59

Caliphate. The As well. So it's moving

50:01

in the right direction. The. Ultimate

50:03

dream is than to get it. It's farmers

50:06

hands been be able to use it as

50:08

soon as possible and and what I'm I'm

50:10

I'm thinking is that the know? maybe they're

50:13

They're a premium product with said low emissions.

50:15

Milk or I mean as well. So. So maybe I

50:18

would go to the grocery store and I'd say you

50:20

know and I'll pay the extra twenty five cents to

50:22

get. Yeah, the. Reduced

50:25

methane. Know as absurd as a

50:27

yes we've done that with energy mean that

50:29

the number of states that they have this

50:31

initiative where you pal is be more and

50:33

he gets a renewable source of energy instead

50:35

of comfort you feel. The. Same think

50:37

without that pianist. Well. You.

50:39

Know I have to ask. I'm

50:41

sure that people were saying maybe

50:43

they're vegetarian or like me or

50:46

who are tied to eat less

50:48

meat and maybe thinking like move

50:50

very uses the listen to this

50:52

problem with thousand methane. Just don't

50:55

eat some don't drink milk, just

50:57

don't have as many cows period.

50:59

What do you think of that response?

51:01

Yeah so I think in and a

51:03

lot of a high income countries you

51:05

may be able to. Get. The

51:08

that it's senses a maximum sense of people

51:10

need to the to have lived but most

51:12

people don't even in I come from three

51:15

and the other issue is that it it

51:17

out That is this the issue of he

51:19

did hunger. Only. What is that? What is

51:21

hidden? hunger? You. Have enough calories

51:24

and maybe even protein but don't

51:26

have the system. He knows that

51:28

the a body needs to have

51:30

a properly function system. So.

51:33

Particularly for. Children to

51:35

them below five years of age and

51:38

what you see is distancing levels. Are

51:40

very much correlated with the animus has

51:43

food consumption a sense that have high

51:45

consumption of and muscles foods the something

51:47

levels are much much lower. Because

51:50

he said do not for example in

51:52

in Sudan and India and in others

51:55

the sunday levels of with the children

51:57

under five years of age as of

51:59

of. What do you prefer said the solution

52:01

is to have those those animals as foods in

52:03

a way that is a enough to be able

52:05

to get an under my like. So I think

52:08

what we can do in their west are and.

52:10

In high income countries is. Consume.

52:13

And muscles food. According to our requirements,

52:15

you get overconsuming. Then yes, you have

52:17

to reduce the intake. So

52:19

has helped reduce the and ted if we

52:21

meaning like if we live somewhere. Where.

52:24

Nutritious food is easy to get. We

52:26

still need to cut back on eating

52:28

meat that you're also saying that we

52:30

need to accept the reality. That.

52:33

We need to see the everyone in the world. As

52:35

upset as he writes yes, So

52:39

earliest you believe that if we

52:41

radically rethink the ways we've been

52:43

doing agriculture for years in this

52:46

case, the way we've been feeding

52:48

livestock, that we've got at least

52:50

one solution to help stop global

52:52

warming. Yeah, absolutely. I think

52:54

you know who would have thought as if

52:56

you were talking about the climate. Good for

52:58

livestock industry ways that has that's it. That's

53:01

the kind of the goal of is it

53:03

that we need for haven't in a good

53:05

uses the computer instead of saying stop eating

53:07

meat of do this of do that as

53:09

we have to be realistic of what this

53:11

to happen and and reality is that the

53:13

up the people are not going to stop

53:15

eating meat. And. So let's see

53:17

get out the way in which we

53:19

can help people and healthy by with

53:21

the same time. Hammond is

53:23

happening as though we can. for anybody

53:25

we have a solution that we need

53:27

to implemented because we will see the

53:30

results Said liquid methane in twelve years

53:32

the time that the ducks that sues

53:34

have now with as to be into

53:36

even at couldn't have their a climate.

53:39

Was. He that result I believe that

53:41

he can reach into a climate new

53:43

sold situation where what we eat is

53:45

actually does not have an impact on

53:47

on the warming effect. That

53:52

was army as a bad a

53:54

processor and associate dean at the

53:56

University of California. Thank.

54:04

You so much for listening to

54:06

her show. This week Repair we

54:08

Purpose reimagine. This episode was produced

54:10

by Fiona Gear and Katie Month

54:12

Leone James Della who see and

54:14

were Melwood That was edited by

54:16

Katy Simon Wait Till Faulkner. And

54:18

Move Our Ted Radio Production Staff

54:21

also include Know if You to

54:23

T A Diva, Motor Some and

54:25

Catherine Sulfur. Or Theme music

54:27

was written by Rom Keen, Arab Louis

54:29

our partner that ted are Chris Anderson

54:31

How and Helms and A Feel and

54:33

Michelle Quint, Sammy Case and Danielle up

54:35

our as else. I many

54:37

of them are Ot and you've been listening

54:39

to the Ted radio our from. Npr.

54:46

This message comes from and he

54:48

our sponsor Mintmobile. from the gas

54:50

pump to the grocery store, Inflation

54:52

is everywhere. So Mintmobile is offering

54:54

premium wireless starting at just fifteen

54:56

dollars a month. To get your

54:58

newfound plan for just fifteen dollars,

55:00

go to mintmobile.com. Slash Switch.

55:04

Support. For Npr and the following

55:06

message come from I Xl Learning.

55:08

I Xl Learning uses advanced algorithms

55:10

to give the right help to

55:12

each kid, no matter the Aids,

55:14

your personality. get an exclusive twenty

55:16

percent off I X L membership

55:18

when you sign up today at

55:20

I xl.com/npr. In

55:23

this country, some truths aren't

55:25

self evident. In Npr

55:27

Black Stories Black Truth Collection of

55:29

stories as wide ranging and real

55:32

as the people who tell them.

55:34

We celebrate the Black experience. For

55:36

all his soul and richness.

55:39

Certs Npr black stories, black

55:41

truths wherever you get. Podcasts,