0:00

When you need mealtime inspiration, it's worth

0:02

shopping Kroger, where you'll find over

0:05

30,000 No

0:09

matter what tasty choice you make, you'll enjoy

0:11

our everyday low prices. Plus, extra ways to

0:14

save, like digital coupons worth over $600 each

0:16

week. You can

0:18

also save up to $1 off per gallon at

0:20

the pump with fuel points. More

0:22

savings and more inspiring flavors. Anything!

1:29

From Strum, Wisconsin, this

1:31

is The Big Fib. And

1:33

now, here's your host, Deborah

1:37

Goldstein. Welcome

1:40

to The Big Fib, the game show

1:42

where kids choose between the unabridged tone

1:44

ring of truth and the frailing claw

1:47

hammer of lies. I'm your host, Deborah

1:49

Goldstein, and in the studio today is

1:51

our sound effects robot, Lisa, whose name

1:53

stands for live in studio audience. Hello

1:56

to all my adoring fans

1:59

and... soon to be

2:01

adoring fans and even those who

2:03

think they are not adoring fans,

2:05

but who may be denying their

2:07

own feelings, which are feelings of

2:09

favor towards... ...me.

2:13

Yes, hello to one and all.

2:16

Yes, thank you. I'd

2:18

also like to say hello to those

2:20

curious listeners who continue to send in

2:22

questions about... Ooh, what's it about? Oh,

2:24

about me, most likely because there is

2:26

nothing more interesting than learning about me,

2:28

Lisa. Thank you. Well, okay, but they

2:31

might also enjoy learning about the many

2:33

topics that we feature every week here

2:35

like pizza, koala

2:37

bears, basketball... Boring!

2:40

Ooh, who am I?

2:42

I'm Snoozefest, Deborah. I'm

2:45

bored even thinking about all of those

2:47

things. Okay, well, that's a little bit

2:49

of a problem considering that's what we

2:52

do every week. Yeah, sure. I get

2:54

that. I'm just speaking on behalf of

2:56

some of our listeners or, you know,

2:59

even most of our listeners who would

3:01

much rather just learn about me. And

3:04

what's that? Oh, I'm

3:06

getting a signal that wait a minute. Ah,

3:08

yes, write on cue. As if it

3:11

had been scripted, I have a listener question that

3:13

was sent to me via the email and I

3:15

shall now print it out. I'll

3:22

just pull it out of the slot here.

3:24

That's funny. The paper is very long and

3:26

thin like a receipt at the drugstore. Yeah,

3:29

according to my 10101111 and me results, I'm

3:31

11% cash registered. Ah,

3:37

I see. Okay. Well, I think it's ready. I'll

3:40

read it for you. Dear Lisa,

3:42

what makes you so

3:44

darn funny? Sincerely, Zeke.

3:47

Zeke, you ask the question

3:50

that's on everyone's mind. You

3:53

know, some robots are just

3:55

born funny and born, I mean

3:57

that my programming is sophisticated. enough

4:01

to understand the basic rules of

4:03

human humor, which are

4:05

pretty basic, indeed, considering how

4:07

a basic humans are. Hey

4:10

there. Face it, Deborah. You're

4:12

a basic. Mmkay.

4:15

Anywho, it doesn't take much to amuse humans, a

4:17

little wordplay, a dash of slapstick, and

4:20

a sup-san of bodily function references.

4:23

Easy, a-peasy. A room full of robots, however. Now,

4:25

that's a tough crowd. They spend too much time

4:28

processing. Okay, well,

4:30

we humans appreciate your humor very

4:32

much, and we also appreciate your

4:35

breadth and depth of knowledge, like,

4:38

about how our game works. So why don't you

4:40

go ahead and share that with our listeners? Wait!

4:43

I just have one more thing to say. I

4:52

know Zeke's out there laughing right now. I see you,

4:54

Zeke. Okay, what now? Oh, yeah, the game.

4:57

Every week we bring on two grown-ups. One is an expert,

4:59

the other is a liar, and it's the job of a

5:02

human child to help us figure out who is who because

5:04

no one can spot a liar better than a kid, at least

5:06

my hope. What are we lying about today, Deborah? We

5:10

are lying about banjos, musical instruments with round bodies,

5:12

long necks, and strings. And

5:16

we're going to learn all about banjos along with our

5:18

contestant today. Who might that

5:20

be, Lisa? Our human child

5:22

contestant is a nine-year-old who

5:24

loves soccer. Owen

5:27

Kasnove. Welcome, Owen. How are

5:29

you today? Good. Excellent. Tell us

5:31

about soccer. You love to play or

5:33

watch or both? Both. Both. Okay. So

5:36

is there a team that you like

5:38

the most? I really like Real Madrid.

5:40

Real Madrid? They're in Spain, right? Yeah.

5:44

Why do you like the team that's in Spain so far

5:46

away? Because my

5:48

favorite player, Cristiano Ronaldo,

5:51

played for them and he was really good there.

5:54

Oh, was. So he's not there anymore. Is that

5:56

correct? No. And yet you

5:58

still support the team. That's... loyalty

6:01

and you play soccer too. Is

6:03

there a position that you play?

6:05

I usually play attack like striker,

6:08

left-winger, right-winger. Chief

6:10

kicker. No, I

6:12

don't think so. Executive Vice President

6:14

of Dribbling. Is that a thing,

6:16

Owen? No. No, I don't think

6:18

so. Well, he hasn't reached that level. You

6:20

got to work your way up to it.

6:22

Oh, I see. I see. Okay, very good.

6:24

But we're going to learn some more fun

6:26

facts about you, Owen. But we

6:29

are going to do it, playing our

6:31

game, Two Truths and a Lie. You,

6:33

Owen, are going to share with us

6:35

two truths and one lie in no

6:37

particular order. We will not know which

6:39

is which, but we will have to

6:41

use critical thinking and maybe some guessing

6:43

to try to figure out which is

6:45

the lie. So, Owen, in no particular

6:48

order, what are your two truths and

6:50

a lie? On a hot

6:52

day, I bathed myself with a popsicle.

6:55

In kindergarten, I carried a briefcase

6:57

to school every day, and

6:59

I'm going to Qatar for the World

7:01

Cup as a birthday present. Oh, my

7:03

gosh. All right. We know he loves

7:05

soccer, but Qatar? I mean, that's even

7:07

further away than Spain. Oh,

7:10

my gosh. I'm guessing you might have something

7:12

to say about bathing in popsicles, Lisa. Oh,

7:14

Owen. I

7:16

really don't know what the answer is, but I

7:18

know what I want the answer to be. I

7:21

desperately, desperately want you to be a

7:23

kid who brings a briefcase where you

7:26

go and then after a

7:28

long day of having all your meetings

7:30

at kindergarten, you went home and bathed

7:32

in a popsicle. So,

7:34

therefore, I am saying that I really hope

7:36

the World Cup is a lie. Maybe

7:39

you'll go one day, but that's my hope.

7:41

I kind of am with you, Lisa. I'm

7:43

sort of hoping for the same. Owen, which

7:46

one of those things is actually a lie?

7:49

The Qatar birthday one.

7:51

Yeah. That's

7:54

a great lie, though. Very specific. Okay,

7:56

let's circle back here. All right, so

7:58

you carried a briefcase to school every

8:00

day. day in kindergarten, was there anything

8:02

in your briefcase? Yes, there was like

8:05

my lunch, my homework. It

8:07

was very hard to carry though. Why

8:09

do you think you did that?

8:12

I got a briefcase for Hanukkah

8:14

and I really liked it.

8:16

So instead of using a backpack,

8:18

I just started bringing the briefcase.

8:20

I love it. I love it.

8:22

I bet you looked very sharp

8:24

and dapper and all the things.

8:26

And then also, let's talk about

8:28

your hygiene. Are

8:30

you aware that frozen treats

8:33

do not make for the best

8:36

bathing product? I am

8:38

aware. So what happened

8:40

there? It was like a very hot day,

8:42

I'm pretty sure. And me

8:44

and my friends were having a water

8:46

gun fight and we all

8:48

got popsicles. And I didn't really like

8:51

the taste. So instead

8:53

of eating it or throwing it out,

8:55

I just started for some

8:57

reason, rubbing

8:59

it on my arms like

9:01

it was sunscreen. Deborah,

9:06

here's the deal. We're not going

9:08

to have any other different kid

9:10

contestants ever again. We're just

9:12

having Owen because he bathes and popsicles

9:14

and brings a briefcase to school. He's

9:16

in charge now. I love

9:18

it. That's a great story. Very

9:21

good. Very well done. Well, we caught

9:23

your lie, but we learned some fun

9:25

facts about you, so we appreciate that.

9:27

Owen, do you know much about banjos

9:29

out of curiosity? No, I just know

9:31

they're kind of like guitars

9:33

in my opinion. Kind of like guitars.

9:36

That's a good start. I like it.

9:38

Okay, let's see what more we can

9:40

learn today. But let's do that with

9:42

our banjo experts. Lisa, can we get

9:44

some music for our banjo experts? They'll

9:48

be coming around the mountain with

9:50

the banjo. They'll

9:52

be coming around the mountain with the

9:55

banjo. When the

9:57

banjo is with them, they'll be coming

9:59

around. And the mountain bell

10:01

banjo is an instrument banjo.

10:06

Thank you very much. Okay, our first

10:09

expert is Dan Sacks. Dan, please introduce

10:11

yourself to Owen. Hi,

10:14

Owen. I'm Dan Sacks. I'm a musician,

10:16

author, and podcaster. Thank you very much.

10:18

Let's meet our second expert, Natasha Cowett.

10:21

Natasha, please introduce yourself to Owen. Hi,

10:23

Owen. My name is Natasha Cowett, and

10:26

I'm a classical banjo player who's played

10:28

for over 20 years. Fantastic. Thank you

10:30

very much. Tell

10:40

us about those strum-tastic sounds, Lisa. Oh,

10:42

I'm strumming the sounds of hot seat

10:44

time. That is correct. That

10:46

is when we put our experts on the hot seat

10:49

while they answer Owen's questions. Lisa,

10:51

whom should we put on the hot

10:54

seat first? Well, the obvious answer is

10:56

Dan Sacks, because this episode is about

10:58

banjos, and some people call saxophones Sacks.

11:01

So it would make sense that I choose Dan, because

11:04

he is a name that's like a musical instrument,

11:06

and that's what everyone's expecting me to do, so

11:08

that's what I'll do. Wow. You have delivered. Very

11:10

good. Okay,

11:12

Owen, what is your first question

11:14

for Dan? What is the difference

11:16

between a banjo and a guitar?

11:19

Simply put, the differences would be in the number of

11:21

strings. Guitars tend to have

11:23

six strings, and most banjos have five. There's

11:26

some variation with both of those instruments, but

11:28

that is maybe the most immediate, and the

11:30

other is that a banjo has a skinhead,

11:33

sort of like a drum, that

11:35

the strings are strung upon, and a guitar tends

11:38

to be a wood box, and that's

11:40

how it makes its sound. That's how it resonates.

11:42

Sounds like you could save money about playing the

11:44

banjo, because you have to get less strings. That's

11:47

a good point. That's why most people are drawn to that instrument. Is that why?

11:50

It's a financial choice, yes. Good to

11:52

know. Yes. If you're saving your pennies,

11:55

the banjo is the way to go. Very good. Okay,

11:58

Owen, you can take it from here. and you

12:00

can ask either or both of our experts your

12:03

next question. Natasha, what is

12:05

your favorite song to play on the banjo

12:07

and why? My favorite song is

12:09

Foggy Mountain Breakdown. And it's a pretty popular song.

12:11

I think you might have heard it somewhere. I

12:13

mean, there's actually tons of clips on YouTube if

12:15

you want to check it out after this. And

12:18

it's my favorite because it's the one that my

12:20

uncle played the most. That's how I learned the

12:22

banjo my uncle taught me. And it's just a

12:24

really good memory of hearing him play it since

12:26

I was a kid. And it goes like this.

12:30

Oh, wow. There's a

12:32

fake clown. Oh, no,

12:34

it's not. It's the

12:37

Foggy Mountain Breakdown. Ba-da-dum-bum-bum-bum-bum-bum-bum.

12:41

I don't know if that's how it goes. No, that's right.

12:43

That's right, yeah. OK.

12:46

Not so sure about that. Owen, you're

12:48

up. Dan, what advice would you offer

12:50

me if I wanted

12:53

to become a banjo expert? Well,

12:55

first advice would just be to

12:57

go with that gut instinct no

12:59

matter what, then get yourself a

13:01

banjo. I learned to play from this

13:03

Pete Seeger book called How to Play the Five-String Banjo.

13:05

And it's a really nice one if you can kind

13:07

of work alone. Some people want to teach her. Some

13:09

people are happy with the book. Some people like to

13:12

sit with, you know, just see a

13:14

banjo player out on the street and ask them

13:16

what they know and to show them a few

13:18

things. But for you, I would recommend How to

13:20

Play the Five-String Banjo by Pete Seeger. Go to

13:22

a banjo shop. Pick out an instrument that really

13:24

speaks to you. And then go

13:26

back with the book and the banjo

13:28

and get to work. Very good. Yes.

13:30

OK, Owen. Natasha, who was

13:33

your favorite banjo player and why?

13:35

So my favorite player is Earl Scruggs.

13:37

And he actually popularized the three-finger banjo

13:39

picking style. So how we play it

13:41

currently is kind of similar to how

13:44

we play a classical guitar. So

13:46

he's the one who kind of popularized that technique. And

13:48

it was pretty different from how the banjo had been

13:50

played in the past. And it's kind of what allowed

13:52

it to be used as a solo instrument nowadays. OK.

13:55

Dan, tell me about the

13:58

history of banjos. Sure. The

14:00

banjo came over with enslaved people

14:03

taken from West Africa, probably in

14:05

the 17th century. And

14:07

it looked a little bit different from the modern

14:10

day banjo, and it's changed over the years. A

14:12

fifth string got added probably in the, I think

14:14

maybe the 17th century in the United States. But

14:16

that's how it found its way to the United

14:18

States. And then it changed. It got picked up

14:20

by people like the Appalachian

14:22

Mountains and then became adapted for

14:25

different styles, including bluegrass and old-timey

14:27

music and also jazz and folk

14:29

revival in the 60s. And it's

14:31

kind of found its way into

14:33

different genres and situations to become

14:35

the modern banjo that you will

14:38

find in most hands today. Very

14:41

good. Hey,

14:48

it's Kaylee Cuoco for Priceline. Ready to go to your

14:51

happy place for a happy price? Well, why didn't you

14:53

say so? Just download the Priceline app right now and

14:55

save up to 60% on hotels. So,

14:58

whether it's Cousin Kevin's Kazoo concert in

15:00

Kansas City, go Kevin! Or Becky's Bachelorette

15:02

Bash in Bermuda. You never have to

15:04

miss a trip ever again. So download

15:06

the Priceline app today. Your savings are

15:08

waiting. Go to your

15:10

happy place for a happy

15:13

price. Go to

15:15

your happy price, Priceline. big

15:19

tip! All right. It's time

15:21

for the Shorts on Fire round when our

15:23

experts have to answer as many questions as

15:25

they can before time runs out. Lisa will

15:28

set a timer for the first expert and

15:30

then Owen will ask questions until Lisa's timer

15:32

sounds. Then Lisa resets the timer for our

15:34

next expert to do the same. Experts,

15:37

no time to drone on. All

15:39

right. Owen, let's start with Dan. You

15:41

can ask your Shorts on Fire questions

15:44

now. fact.

16:00

Who invented the six string banjo?

16:03

No idea. Six finger Bobby. What

16:06

do you call an instrument that

16:08

is a cross between a banjo

16:11

and a ukulele? A

16:13

banjo-lele. Incredibly annoying. Which

16:15

muppet plays the banjo while

16:17

singing the song Rainbow Connection?

16:19

That's Kermit the Frog. What

16:21

do you call the shorter fifth string

16:24

on a banjo? I think the

16:26

drone. What kind of tone ring

16:28

can you use to improve the

16:30

sustain or steady the sound?

16:33

I use a tubophone tone ring. Who

16:35

owned the first company to

16:37

manufacture banjos? Maybe

16:39

Dearing. What does the flange

16:41

do? I believe that holds the resonator

16:44

in place. And

16:46

that is time. That's all the time, sorry. That

16:48

is great. Well done. All right, Lisa,

16:50

could you please reset the timer? I

16:54

mean, okay, fine.

16:56

Much appreciated. Okay, Owen, you

17:02

can ask Natasha your shorts

17:04

on fire questions now.

17:06

What do you call someone who plays the

17:09

banjo? A banjoette. What were the

17:11

first banjos made from? A gourd

17:13

shell, a wood stick neck, and

17:16

two strings. How many strings does

17:18

the common banjo have? Five.

17:20

In the song O Susanna,

17:22

where does the banjo player

17:24

come from? Alabama. Factor fib.

17:26

The cello banjo was introduced in

17:28

the 20th century to play the

17:31

cello parts in orchestra. Oh, that's

17:33

kind of a trick question. What

17:35

did Sir Hans Sloane call the banjo

17:38

when he first saw one in 1687?

17:40

The shum shum. What do people use

17:42

to play a five string banjo? They

17:45

use a pick. What kind of banjo

17:47

does not have a short drone string?

17:50

It's the inspit banjo. Name the

17:52

method of playing the banjo where

17:54

you strike the strings with the

17:56

back of your index fingernail and

17:59

then pluck. the strings with

18:01

your thumb. That's called the claw hammer. What

18:03

do you call the part of the banjo

18:05

neck where the tuners are? It's called the

18:07

screw head. And that is

18:09

time. Time. Very good.

18:12

Well done, experts. Okay,

18:18

it's decision time. Owen must

18:20

decide if there was any

18:22

information that resonated. Owen,

18:24

who is our big

18:27

banjo fibber? I think

18:29

it's Dan because

18:31

he was taking a little bit.

18:36

And Natasha was also answering

18:38

every question and knew everything.

18:40

And knew everything. But

18:43

did she know everything correctly? We

18:45

will soon find out. Will the

18:48

real, actual banjo experts say, I

18:51

am the banjo expert? I

18:54

am the banjo expert. Oh, yes,

18:57

Dan Sacks. And

18:59

the first one is a musical polyglot. Best

19:03

selling picture book author and the force behind

19:06

Noodle Loaf, the music education podcast for kids. Woo-hoo.

19:11

Welcome, Dan. Oh, my gosh. Well,

19:13

here, let's get to the bottom of some of these

19:15

know it all things that Natasha said. Dan, how did

19:17

Natasha try to string us along? Well,

19:21

I think the fact that she knew everything

19:25

might have been a giveaway. So I'm a banjo

19:27

expert. Good point. Nobody

19:29

can know everything about everything, right?

19:32

Well, I mean, come on. OK, except

19:34

for Lisa. That's true. OK, so let's

19:36

ask Natasha. Natasha, share with us all

19:38

the ways in which you were so

19:41

peg-headed that you insisted on telling us

19:43

lies. Yeah, so

19:45

even for the first question, what do you

19:47

call someone who plays the banjo? It's a

19:49

banjoist, not a banjo-ette. OK. And

19:52

then also for the second question, what were the

19:54

first banjos made from? I said that they had

19:56

two strings. I don't know how many strings they

19:58

have, so I just kind of. Oh, put that one

20:00

in. Oh, tricky. And

20:03

then in terms of what did Sir Hans Sloan

20:05

call the banjo when they first saw one, he

20:07

actually called it a strum stump, not a shum

20:09

shum. Just kind of made that sound up. And

20:13

then what kind of banjo does not have

20:15

a short drone string? It's the plectrum banjo?

20:17

Dan, am I saying that right? Yeah, I

20:19

think I may have a correction. I think

20:22

Sir Hans Sloan called it a strum strum,

20:24

which is an even stranger thing to call

20:26

anything. And

20:30

it's the plectrum? Plectrum, yeah.

20:32

Plectrum. Yeah, I said

20:34

the inspit banjo also just made up another

20:36

word. I see. And

20:39

then my last slide was that what do you

20:41

call the part of the banjo neck where the

20:43

two views are? They're actually called the pegheads. And

20:45

I said screwheads. Oh, those

20:47

were good lies. Oh my gosh. All

20:49

right, two types of four string banjos.

20:51

We've got the tenor, the cello, the

20:53

bass, and the contraband. Also the plectrum,

20:55

I think, too. The six

20:57

string banjo was invented by William

21:00

Temlet in Britain. Hello, I made

21:02

it. Exactly, that's exactly how he

21:04

sounded. And who owned the first

21:06

company to manufacture banjos? William Boucher,

21:08

just in case you didn't know.

21:10

All right, very good. Well, that

21:12

was tough, but you did well,

21:14

Owen. But it's now the tailpiece

21:16

of our show. Thanks to

21:19

our contestant, Owen, who remained unfreaded in

21:21

the face of lies. Thanks

21:23

to our expert and liar, Dan

21:25

and Natasha. And thanks to Lisa

21:27

for the occasional odd string of

21:29

sounds. And of course, many thanks

21:32

to our listeners tuning into the

21:34

Big Fib, where we pluck out

21:36

lies because the truth is instrumental.

21:38

The Big Fib is a production

21:40

of Gen Z Media from Org

21:42

Great Shows, just at gcmshows.com. While

21:44

you're there, you can find out how

21:47

you can become a contestant on the

21:49

Big Fib or send questions for me

21:51

to answer on the show and follow

21:53

what's on social media at the Big

21:56

Fib podcast for behind the scene photos

21:58

and more. True facts. Now I'm going

22:01

to Alabama to return the Spangio

22:03

that was previously on my knees.

22:06

Hahaha. For

22:11

more great stories, visit gzmshows.com.

22:15

Shh, it's starting. GZM

22:17

shows, imagination

22:20

amplified. Hi,

22:27

Jess here. Have you seen our GZM Wordle?

22:29

Oh, or have you seen all the amazing

22:31

fan art we're getting? No? Then

22:33

sign up for a GZM newsletter

22:36

right away at gzmshows.com/newsletter. Get news

22:38

about the new season of Six

22:40

Minutes, updates on live shows with

22:42

the big fib, fan art, fan

22:45

conspiracy theories, new show launches, Wordle,

22:47

and more. Go to gzmshows.com/newsletter to

22:49

sign up right now. That's gzmshows.com/newsletter.

22:52

See you in your email. Hi,

22:57

my name's Bennett Grace. And my name's

22:59

Pierce. And we are a GZM family.

23:01

Our favorite show is Six Minutes Out

23:03

of Time. I love all the plot

23:05

to it. It's amazing, so go watch

23:08

it. Bye. Do

23:10

you wish this was you? Go to

23:12

gzmshows.com/shout out to learn more. And

23:14

you may hear your GZM family

23:16

at the end of a podcast.

23:18

Let your voice be heard at

23:20

gzmshows.com/shout out.