0:00

The most horrible thing is that

0:02

everyone in town knows who did it.

0:06

In twenty fourteen, two friends

0:08

named Chris in the sand hiked to the

0:10

top of a mountain in the Panamanian jungle.

0:13

They were never seen alive again.

0:15

They found the foot

0:16

inside the booth. I'm Mariana Natencio,

0:19

and I traveled to Panama to reinvestigate

0:21

this case eight years later. I

0:23

found a small town hiding a big secret.

0:25

St. says

0:28

five dead. Five people were killed

0:30

after Christmas and went missing.

0:32

I don't know how

0:34

long they're some of them.

0:35

You said because they killed the Dutch girls

0:37

not them.

0:37

when i'm at that

0:38

Because I saw them with the Dutch girls they're going

0:40

kill me. Did he hear him? They

0:43

told him to shut his mouth, put them wet

0:45

his, or you

0:46

die. From cast media,

0:49

this is lost in A

0:51

new investigative series about the

0:53

mysterious deaths of Chris Cremers

0:56

in the sand front, coming October

0:58

thirty first to wherever you get your podcasts.

1:01

These mountains hold

1:03

a lot of secrets.

1:19

Hey, Billy. What is it,

1:21

Dominic? I've not got my headphones on because There's a

1:23

mind you won't know what I'm seeing. But listen to this,

1:25

Francis.

1:25

You tell me if you can hear.

1:27

Can

1:31

you hear that? I'm a

1:32

do again.

1:33

Now

1:37

for the listeners out there, not the people

1:40

watching the show. I wonder what they would guess.

1:42

You close your you know what it is, but close your eyes.

1:44

and say your best guess of what you think

1:46

this is, but

1:47

not be the actual real thing. Very cool.

1:50

I

1:56

tell you mine. Yeah. An

1:58

old man running up

2:00

a hill in a park. Try a

2:02

chase after his old dog. Let

2:04

me hear it again.

2:05

Oh, yeah.

2:07

What

2:11

would you say? I would say it was like

2:14

a like a great

2:16

den has got has got the

2:18

scent of

2:19

a a squirrel

2:21

and behind the bush.

2:23

But he's chasing after. He's just oh, he's

2:25

gone.

2:29

How's

2:29

your dog's nose?

2:31

What do

2:31

you mean? So you

2:32

got a good sense of smell?

2:34

My dog's got no nose.

2:36

How's this now?

2:37

Awful. Hey. Hey.

2:40

No, he does.

2:41

I told you he he found the old

2:43

person Yeah. No possum. It's a horrific

2:46

story. And they they found a rat

2:48

last night. Was it in your kitchen? No.

2:50

I was I was running through the bike garden.

2:52

And my wife said, Was that a rat?

2:54

An artiste? No. It was a squirrel? No,

2:57

sir. But she'll know now. She

2:59

doesn't listen. Oh, no. Why would she?

3:02

is good

3:04

to

3:04

see. It's lovely to see what's been going

3:07

on this week. Well, this week has been

3:10

absolutely packed full. Ram Jam full.

3:13

Back up. First thing in the morning and

3:15

before I know it's last thing at night. Mhmm.

3:17

We have that conversation quite a lot. I check

3:19

him with you very often. You never check him with me, but

3:21

that's fine. I always go, hey, Billy, how is your day?

3:23

And you go, absolutely slammed.

3:26

I don't know what went on. And suddenly,

3:28

it's six o'clock. Exactly.

3:29

You got time for a little league of legends? You

3:32

say, no. I'm not the time. I'm gonna got the brain

3:34

space for you. I'm maybe putting something in

3:36

the oven. Mhmm. Was

3:38

it a help? A friend. And a friend came

3:40

around with a A friend

3:42

came around with a what'd you call that?

3:44

A pasta with a cheese?

3:47

Cheesy pasta. No. Macaroni.

3:49

Oh, macaroni. Macaroni cheese. But they ate

3:52

macaroni cheese for you? Yeah. And it piled

3:54

up so high. when

3:55

I put it in the oven, so I put it in the oven for thirty

3:58

minutes at 425 So

3:59

I dead. Next

4:00

thing, the whole house is full of smoke.

4:03

because it dripped off the sage's dome

4:05

onto the bottom of the oven.

4:08

I

4:08

never put a tree underneath the tree

4:10

underneath the tree. I know the police

4:12

was full or small. 55555

4:14

It was like backdraft. I was kept you open the door.

4:17

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You've got to feel the handle. Yeah.

4:19

Now

4:19

did you dog? No. Look. Did did Bobby come

4:21

up with nothing. Just

4:23

sleeping. Good. Love this smell of cheese in there.

4:25

Love this smell of bubbling cheese. Love this smell

4:27

of bubbling cheese. and then it sounded like this.

4:32

Whoa. Very strange. Yeah.

4:35

That Hubble, bubble, while I'm in trouble

4:37

here. Exactly. Well, what

4:39

time you've had? Mhmm. Kitchen

4:41

mishaps by Billy Boyd.

4:42

And

4:43

have you done it? this

4:45

week. Don't know. Don't know what

4:47

dogs or stuff are you not? I'm having a colonoscopy.

4:49

Now, listen, everyone out there. If you're forty

4:52

five or older, There's

4:54

no shame in it. Go get a colonoscopy. Ryan

4:57

Reynolds, one of the great modern

4:59

day movie stars, and my eyes

5:01

say, a dreamboat. A minute's friend,

5:03

Rob, is it Michael

5:04

Hamm? Michael Hamm. Michael Hamm.

5:07

They

5:08

both had a colonoscopy on

5:10

camera to try and rid us

5:12

all of the shame of a colonoscopy.

5:15

Well, she knows she shouldn't be ashamed.

5:17

It's

5:17

more of the castle, isn't it?

5:19

Yeah. So when you get news I'm

5:22

getting mine done. This

5:24

Wednesday

5:24

What were you? No. Sorry. Sorry.

5:26

Thursday. And you guys are done. Yeah.

5:29

because Wednesday, I'm doing a whole liquid

5:31

diet. Thursday morning. colonoscopy.

5:33

Onoscopy? Monday. So

5:36

when you liquid diet star? Well,

5:39

main is more intense than yours. I was

5:41

told not to have any

5:44

fiber brady Right.

5:46

Saturday, kind

5:48

of just liquid Simple for Simple

5:50

for Simple for this.

5:53

Sunday, only liquids. No

5:55

color. No color. And and

5:59

Monday and

5:59

we

5:59

go. So will that be for you on Sunday? Would

6:02

that be apple juice, grape juice? What else are

6:04

you thinking that's colorless that you can get down

6:06

tea? Apparently, you're also allowed

6:08

like him. Or is this the

6:10

day before? Yeah. Like,

6:12

would you call it, like, bone broth and all that?

6:14

Oh, right. Were you allowed that? Didn't

6:16

didn't stipulate to me whether it could have bone

6:18

broth or not. Clearly, we just have a deal of,

6:20

like, nothing. What are really?

6:23

Clear soups, juices. Well,

6:25

I look forward to hearing all about your colon.

6:27

Well, you'll be first? Yeah. Well, I

6:29

look forward to telling you.

6:31

Feeling the

6:33

eye. Hey,

6:36

we've had a riddle set in. Great. Go on. I love

6:38

riddles you know what I mean.

6:39

Hopefully, Eddie, I'm

6:41

producing those answers because we don't. Stuart.

6:44

Oh, no. This is from Calvin Drake.

6:46

Ready? Calvin Drake?

6:48

I have long been

6:51

buried. Hey there, dead body.

6:53

Let's not finish today. Carry on.

6:55

Let's start again, actually. Okay.

6:57

I have long been buried.

7:00

yet still many wished to sun

7:02

to my head and bite my

7:04

flesh. Sun

7:05

to my head.

7:07

Sandra. Sandra.

7:10

I do no harm until my skin

7:12

is pierced.

7:15

for then they who pierce

7:17

me will soon pay with their

7:19

tears. An onion. I

7:20

think it isn't onion. That's a half an onion.

7:23

I'm

7:29

what else is going Let

7:31

me think, Tom. Any legal legends this

7:33

week?

7:34

No. You want a legal legends update?

7:36

I'll give you one. I've

7:37

added

7:43

decided to try new

7:46

Champions because you tell me that I don't

7:48

play enough. Did

7:50

it? Yeah. Champions, you say all you do is,

7:52

hey, Matena. Well, there was a point where I

7:54

did say that, but now you've gone back to playing

7:56

Kaisa at quite a good level. Yeah.

7:58

So now I want to try other things. So I

8:00

tried mod Kaisa. Oh, yeah. You've been

8:02

good at Monika. I think it's

8:04

important for you to have two in each

8:06

lane. So two options in

8:08

top, two jungle, two mid, to

8:11

ADC, to support because if

8:13

you're playing high mid ing and they ban him and you're

8:15

like, well, that's all I can play in mid, then you have to dodge

8:17

and I don't wanna dodge. I've never dudged.

8:19

I dudged the other day because I

8:21

tried to play

8:22

ash support someone

8:24

picked it in the enemy team. I went

8:26

for locks In mid,

8:28

one of my team picked

8:30

rocks. I got the jungle, so I was like,

8:32

okay, I'll play Kazics. And the band Kazics, I

8:34

was like, well, I can't play. It's

8:36

a nightmare. Dom, you've done well.

8:38

You can't you can't do any more than that?

8:41

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12:08

Bill. What is it, Tom? Jeff

12:10

is here. The wonderful Jeff

12:12

Pro. How's it going? It's good see,

12:14

we've never done anything like this. No. We haven't. In

12:16

all the years, we've known it. We've spent a little bit

12:18

of time with each of the, like, off camera

12:21

and stuff, and you've been very gracious

12:23

too. invite me to some

12:25

survivor events that go on

12:27

in LA, which I've

12:29

not come to you. I'm honestly a little

12:31

intimidated by because I'm gonna meet some

12:33

surviving people there. Oh, hey. Oh, hey,

12:35

Boston Rob. I met Boston Rob at your house. Got very

12:37

freaked out. we should talk about the fact that

12:39

I'm a huge, you know, that.

12:41

Huge survivor fan. Huge.

12:43

I love it. I love it. I know. I'm embarrassed to

12:45

say that we've never met GIF

12:47

and also How I survivor

12:49

sort of passed me by somehow, but

12:52

not no, Jeff. Just

12:55

the situation. It can pass you by. It's okay.

12:57

It's not for everybody. No. You've been

12:59

in my you've been in my living room

13:01

these last few weeks and me

13:03

and my wife are loving it.

13:05

Really? Yeah. absolute I

13:07

wouldn't lie to you. I absolutely love

13:09

it. I said to you, the the week, Jeff, and we were

13:11

texting about you coming on that it find

13:14

yourself at this point in in a pretty unique

13:16

situation because you've got me

13:18

a survivor Uber fan

13:20

and Billy, a novice to the show.

13:22

Right. It's very cool. You can be

13:24

right in the middle of this conversation. It's

13:26

all, you know, COVID, Netflix

13:29

licensed a couple of seasons

13:31

during COVID and a lot of people that had never

13:33

seen survivor saw it. Right. And so

13:35

I meet people now who are new,

13:37

and it really fun to hear their

13:39

take on it, not having been on a

13:41

twenty two year journey. Yeah. They're on a

13:43

twenty two week journey. Right. And they see the

13:45

show very differently because they binge

13:47

it. So they see all the transitions,

13:49

you know, in two weeks. Right. And it's

13:51

interesting how that changes their

13:54

perception of the show. I'm assuming

13:56

that you don't personally go back and

13:58

watch previous seasons of survivor or do

14:00

you? Not really. I've tried

14:02

to go back and watch season one, but it is

14:05

so painful for me personally. Yeah.

14:07

Yeah. Just look at myself and

14:09

listen to myself. that

14:11

I can't do it even for fun. I'm like,

14:13

it's just so painful. It's just just gonna

14:15

really do some damage to myself and see. I mean,

14:17

the evolution of show is extraordinary and

14:19

something that I I definitely wanna talk to you about.

14:21

But I I agree. I mean, I'll I've seen

14:23

every single season of survivor. It

14:25

looked looks like a completely different show. It

14:27

doesn't even look like the same show. And in

14:29

season one, you guys are still figuring

14:31

out of of stuff. Right. In

14:33

season one, we had eighty crew

14:35

members. We now, including locals like

14:37

in Fiji, we are now close to

14:39

a thousand. whole way. We

14:41

had eighty people doing

14:44

everything. Mark was carrying

14:46

tripod sticks. I was everybody you were traping through the

14:48

mud for an hour to get somewhere because we

14:50

only had five boats and we lost three of them in a

14:52

storm. I mean, it was it

14:54

was real and it was also

14:56

I remember being

14:58

in a little like,

15:00

I don't know what some sort of cubicle we'd put

15:02

in the middle of borneo and I

15:04

had a whiteboard because

15:05

Regis Philbin was doing who wants to be

15:08

a millionaire and he had this line. Is that your

15:10

final answer? and I kept

15:12

saying, oh, we gotta have a line and everybody's

15:14

looking at me like, dude, you're you're overthinking

15:16

this. But my point being, we didn't even

15:18

have the tribe as spoken. Right. yet.

15:20

Right. We were still it was just

15:22

sorta coming all at once. And

15:24

Mark was such a great leader

15:26

because he was fearless.

15:28

If you had an idea, it'd say, I don't know, dumb.

15:31

That's a pretty good argument. Let's try

15:33

that. You know, if you just do it and see

15:35

if it works. Yeah. Well, let's let's talk about

15:37

the format of the show because this is something that you and

15:39

I have talked about a lot and something that I know

15:41

gets you really excited. Survival

15:43

is quite a regimented

15:46

formatted show. Right? And it's something

15:48

that you really lean into.

15:50

Is it is it the idea that you

15:52

want the to be reminded that they are

15:54

in a game show that this is a

15:56

game all the time. Is that the idea behind the phone?

15:58

Not for me. It's not that, it

15:59

might be subconsciously what you're

16:02

picking up on. But for me, it's

16:04

I am a big format

16:06

guy. When I see a good format, I

16:08

respect that somebody built that

16:10

format, and it's and it's precise.

16:13

Mhmm. And so with

16:14

survivor, the four the the

16:16

question I always have this show is done in

16:18

other countries, different producers, is

16:21

what do you think the format

16:23

is? Right. I think the format

16:26

is

16:26

philosophical. It should

16:28

take a group of people, strangers

16:30

typically. And

16:32

unless you're doing an all star

16:34

season. Yeah. And you force them to live

16:36

together where they must rely on each

16:38

other to survive while

16:40

simultaneously voting each other out. And

16:43

in the end, a group of the people that you

16:45

voted out will now decide who

16:47

wins. Who played the best game? What's the best

16:49

game? Depends on the people deciding.

16:51

For me, that's it. You

16:53

could add in there are reward challenges.

16:55

There are immunity challenges.

16:57

Maybe, Maybe

16:58

you don't have to have them. Right. We don't know.

17:00

We may get to season where we don't do that.

17:02

And people go, oh my god, you've blown it again.

17:05

Yeah. But so I just pay attention and

17:07

remind myself every

17:09

season I go back through. What does this show

17:11

about? Every episode. We just finished

17:13

episode seven. One of the things that's

17:15

really strong in episode seven is this

17:17

contrast of rely on each

17:19

other, but compete

17:20

against each other. Right. And it's subtle.

17:23

You shouldn't notice it. Yeah. But

17:25

it's always there. Yeah.

17:27

Yeah. Yeah. And, like, people

17:29

now playing survivor are

17:31

fully aware of the game that

17:33

they're walking into. And you would think

17:36

that they would be a little bit more wily about the

17:38

way that they should behave, but everyone

17:40

breaks down, everyone double

17:42

crosses, everyone makes stake,

17:45

everyone lie I mean, you have to lie in this

17:47

show. Yeah. I think about I mean,

17:49

it's my favorite show on TV, and I

17:51

think about the people in my life

17:53

playing survivor and, like, Billy, for instance,

17:56

with

17:56

respect, Billy. It's too nice to

17:58

play the game. Yeah. And that that is a

17:59

result of it. that you wouldn't, you

18:02

wouldn't be amazing. Really? You don't

18:04

backstep. You don't say to someone.

18:06

Absolutely. I'll do it, and then walk around the corner and

18:08

go, I'm gonna mess up that person's

18:10

game. You would you wouldn't have the

18:12

the you need to be a bit of an

18:14

like, getting into the needle of the game. I

18:16

just don't think you down. I

18:18

don't know you Woodbills. Physically, I think

18:20

you'd be fine. The social game, some

18:23

aspect of it, I think you'd be

18:25

great. to This is

18:25

a game. You have to be a bit of a bad person. But

18:27

this is what's great. Is Billy has

18:29

never played, nor have you? because I always

18:32

tell Tom, I think he'd be really good.

18:34

because he has great social skills. He's got great

18:36

emotional intelligence. He can read a room and go, man, I

18:38

don't know. I'm not trusting the eyes on that

18:40

one. But what Domestic wouldn't know

18:43

is what you are really thinking. Yeah.

18:45

And in an interview, you could go, it's gonna

18:47

be so hard for my

18:49

friend. when I write

18:49

his name name down tonight. Yeah. But he's

18:51

going home long before I do. And that could

18:53

happen. And then Dom was like, well, that's bullshit.

18:56

I don't know. Well, you know, I'm

18:58

a better player. I I don't know. Are

19:00

you? Yeah. Yeah. But that yeah.

19:02

Yeah. I I know exactly what you mean.

19:04

And

19:04

like I say, I'm new to it. So

19:06

I'm I'm watching so I'm watching the new one. Okay?

19:09

So I'm watching people who

19:11

are all fans of the

19:13

show -- Yeah. -- playing the show.

19:16

But

19:16

then, like you

19:17

said in in one of the meetings

19:20

in a an early episode

19:22

there that the

19:24

Why does everyone tell

19:28

everyone the truth? Right. And

19:30

you're trying to figure out even

19:32

at this level And

19:34

they're saying Well, sorry. And and

19:36

they're saying because all

19:38

all the only thing you have to bargain

19:40

with is your honesty.

19:43

trust. Your trust. If they trust

19:45

you -- Yeah. -- then that is such a huge

19:47

thing. So if you find something

19:49

and you go and you tell everyone

19:51

that you've found it, then everyone goes,

19:53

oh, I'll trust him.

19:55

Right. So then you've you've

19:57

you've got a little score there. I

19:59

mean,

19:59

maybe. You know, it always

20:02

changes. It's always changing and it depends

20:04

on the group. Yeah. The group dynamic,

20:06

we're always surprised. This season

20:09

survivor forty three is very different

20:11

from survivor forty four, but it's the

20:13

same game. Yeah. Yeah. It's But

20:14

it's it's the different players. Yeah. Yeah. And

20:17

also, That's

20:18

such a great show. It changes

20:20

each week because that dynamic shift

20:22

because that person's gone and maybe they had a connection

20:24

with that person or maybe they learned to trust that

20:26

person. what I found over over the as

20:28

a general rule with survivor over the years, it's

20:30

it's obviously not an exact science, is

20:33

if you

20:33

can convince people that they can

20:35

trust you, even though you're

20:38

going to stab them in the back, those people

20:40

seem to go a long way. It's not

20:42

the out and out trustworthy people

20:44

like whatever Rupert's not gonna lie. You

20:46

think, oh, that's someone I can bring on to. It

20:48

is Boston Rob where you're like, I

20:51

really want to trust you. But I

20:53

kinda

20:53

know that you're gonna

20:54

scream at some point. Those people seem to

20:56

go. That's a great observation. You're

20:58

a lot like that, I think. Yeah. I can't

21:01

belabor that. No. That's true.

21:03

I wanted to ask you, like we talked

21:05

about the format, one of the things that I know has

21:07

changed, which was

21:08

which is something

21:09

just to talk about in terms of where we're at

21:11

right now with society. You drop the word

21:13

guys -- Yeah. -- from comment come

21:15

on in guys. So every time AAAAA

21:20

challenge starts, Jeff, there'll

21:22

be no one on the beach, and Jeff will say, come on in

21:24

guys. Yeah. They'll come in. at one point was it last

21:26

season? It was forty one. Forty

21:28

one. When we came back after COVID,

21:30

after Black Lives Matter, me

21:32

to all of this stuff

21:34

was happening in our culture, all this great

21:36

movement. Yeah. But you you so

21:38

you brought them all together, and

21:40

you had said, as you guys know or as as you

21:42

all know. Exactly. I usually say,

21:45

guys, let's open up the forum

21:47

here to see what you thought

21:49

about what I love about that because I this to you recently, as

21:51

well, is there's little moments where where I see

21:53

you at the end of the show say, you know,

21:55

you say, okay, you guys get together and

21:57

then we'll we'll we'll start the challenge. You have like

21:59

a couple of seconds now of you going. Alright.

22:02

Yeah. And I love seeing the little behind

22:04

the scenes bit. that was a great

22:06

thing that featured in the show where you say to

22:08

the contestants, you're gonna decide. It's not gonna be

22:10

an audience thing. It's not gonna be be a

22:13

producerial thing. you guys are gonna decide. And they

22:15

decide to drop the guys. So from now,

22:17

and you just say, coming in. Right. Yeah. And you've

22:19

said guys, like, five times a night. I

22:21

mean, that's problem with it. I I'm glad you asked me because I

22:23

have not had a chance to

22:25

comment on this since it happened.

22:28

I

22:29

learned from from

22:31

someone who told me we were talking about

22:33

it. And I said,

22:35

you know, people have criticized,

22:37

like, were too woke. Like, you should never do that. And I

22:39

said, well, I don't know. I have two kids. I have a boy

22:41

and a girl. Mhmm. And had I said twenty years ago

22:43

come on in ladies, everybody

22:46

would have thought that was weird. I want my daughter

22:48

to know if you think that's a weird word

22:50

gender wise, I got you. I I don't

22:52

wanna be that guy, that person, that

22:54

guy. But what somebody

22:56

pointed out to me was

22:58

the mistake

22:59

I made was I made

23:01

it I made it a moment.

23:03

And

23:03

in that way, I made it about

23:06

me. And he

23:06

and he said, you know, if you just didn't

23:08

wanna do it, stop doing it.

23:11

And I really appreciated that because I

23:13

was uncomfortable with making it such

23:15

a big deal. But one

23:17

of

23:17

the things about survivor It's

23:19

like if you're a Howard Stern fan, you listened to thirty

23:21

years of Stern. The shows from twenty five

23:23

years ago, he might not do today. Yeah. He'd

23:25

be canceled. Right? Right. So I have

23:27

made lots of of decisions

23:30

creatively or my grammar or

23:32

whatever that I wish I could change, but

23:34

I try to treat

23:36

myself the same way as we treat players. That's what

23:38

I said. Yep. That's in the show.

23:40

We were in my defense.

23:43

it was so top of mind everything,

23:46

our language, how we were treating each

23:48

other. I mean, you know,

23:51

unconscious bias, which I'm still trying to learn

23:53

about my own. Yeah. So I was

23:55

really concerned that I don't want this

23:57

is my one opportunity. We've been off

23:59

the air COVID happen. So I made that decision.

24:02

If I could do it again, I would do what this

24:04

guy suggested. And he's a

24:06

big movie producer, a very

24:08

smart guy and I would have just done it and

24:10

said this was for me. Yeah. I don't have to

24:12

explain it. I understand. I I

24:14

personally love the moment. It's one of the one of the

24:16

things that I love about you the most when I've

24:18

spent time at your house, having a

24:20

party, you and your wife will be like,

24:22

hey, we're gonna have this conversation. We're

24:24

gonna talk about this thing that might be a little big thing.

24:26

We're gonna dive in. We're here. No

24:28

one's moving. I love friends like

24:30

that. I love people that just kind of say,

24:31

let's talk about something that's gonna be a

24:33

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24:33

Let's talk about something a little bit delicate.

24:35

Hey,

24:36

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twenty twenty two. Let

27:39

me ask about the baths since I'm wearing a bath right now.

27:41

Yeah. One of my one of my favorite things.

27:43

what are the rules with the buffs? Is the

27:46

rule that you have to wear it

27:48

as some in some part of your

27:50

body all hands down? Yes.

27:51

anywhere. Yeah. Anywhere. And it's

27:54

really just it goes back to the very

27:56

beginning when we were trying to

27:58

figure out how do you let the

28:00

audience identify that

28:02

that's one tribe and that's the other tribe.

28:04

And the easiest way is just

28:06

color. We're not gonna give them uniforms. Like

28:08

at one I remember somebody saying, well, they all wear shirts. We're like,

28:10

no. No. No. They're gonna wear their clothes.

28:12

So we try to get we

28:14

know who's gonna be on which a

28:16

tribe. We'll say, hey, Dom, you're gonna be on a tribe. Could you

28:18

look in the blues and the purples?

28:20

Yeah. And the same with the buffs. And it's

28:22

just so that when you're in a shot,

28:24

you you're reminded oh, that's right. Dom is

28:27

not on Billy's tribe. Billy has a

28:29

blue buff. Right. It's it's again, it

28:31

goes back you're picking up on the

28:33

little tiny things of the fabric

28:35

of the tapestry. Yeah. If you lost the

28:37

buffs with the show change, No.

28:39

But it wouldn't be the same. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You

28:41

know, I think still the most popular item at

28:43

CBS dot com is a survivor buff.

28:45

I love the buff. It's what is a what is

28:48

a buff? these things. Why is it called

28:49

a buff? Well, that's just the name of the thing.

28:51

Right? But it's a buff. Yeah. So very often,

28:53

you will see -- Yeah. --

28:55

ladies wearing them kind of, you know,

28:57

like a little bikini kind of top thing.

29:00

Guys wear them around the wrist, maybe use them

29:02

as a headband. But

29:04

so if Let's say the camera crew are

29:06

shooting a scene and they noticed that

29:08

someone is not wearing the above, will

29:10

they stop down for

29:10

a second and say, hey, could you

29:12

just put your buffers? Will they have those moments with them? Yeah. I mean,

29:14

it wouldn't be a camera operator. They don't really

29:17

talk to the players, but one

29:19

of our producers or a second producer. It's very I

29:21

can't imagine that really happens. Yeah. Okay.

29:23

Very rare. And our players, we

29:26

treat our players, you know, with love

29:28

and respect, at least, you know, that's what

29:30

I we feel. So it's

29:33

never contentious or add the cereal. It'd be, hey,

29:35

Dom. I know you went into the ocean

29:37

to to wash off your feet. Could you put your

29:39

buff back on? Right. Right. It'd be very casual.

29:41

That's not a big deal. Right. Honestly, we

29:43

don't really have any issues with

29:45

the players. The one thing we

29:47

ask them, you have to be honest

29:49

with us in your interview. you

29:52

cannot lie. Right. because that's how we tell

29:54

the story. Right. We don't have

29:56

people lying. Occasionally, like

29:58

once every five years, there'll be a player in

30:00

their first interview saying, So

30:02

you promise you're not gonna use this information,

30:04

and then go tell Billy what

30:06

Dom said. No. Our entire

30:08

foundation is built on this trust.

30:11

So I think one of the biggest misunderstandings with

30:13

me and players is because I'm

30:15

sort of adversarial at

30:17

times that I don't like

30:19

players or I don't like specific players or

30:21

I'm hard on a player. I have

30:24

respect for everyone with a couple

30:26

of exceptions over six hundred people.

30:28

Johnny No. It's a fair place, not

30:30

on that list. Okay. Good. No. But

30:32

I just have tremendous respect

30:34

because they're outfitted doing it. Yeah. Yeah.

30:36

It's a tough game. one

30:38

of my favorite things about you as

30:40

as the host is that you have to consistently

30:43

wear different hats. So

30:45

there are times where you will kind of metaphorically

30:48

put your arm around a contestant to

30:50

get that reaction. There are times in a challenge where

30:52

you'll be pointing at someone saying,

30:54

Let's go. You're gonna lose this challenge if

30:56

you don't pick up the baby. My

30:59

favorite version of of the

31:01

Jeff, the host character, is a

31:03

tribal because you and you

31:05

had told me years ago that

31:07

the way that a

31:10

contestant is able to navigate

31:12

their own way through tribal is by

31:14

answering a question honestly. And if you

31:16

see that someone is dodging, or

31:18

maybe not telling you the exact truth, you'll zero in

31:20

on them and keep going after them until they're

31:22

honest. Well, I I remember

31:24

this conversation. It it

31:26

It's not honest. It's

31:29

it has to move. It has to

31:31

have Like, I

31:32

always tell the players actually the contrary.

31:34

I say, you don't ever have to tell me the truth.

31:36

because they could be playing the game. Yes. Right. But you have to

31:38

give me an answer because

31:41

what people would love to say is, I

31:43

don't know. Like, Dom, what do you think

31:45

is happening right now? We've got seven people,

31:47

which is a, you know, kind of an unusual

31:49

number. It's an odd number. avi,

31:51

he's I don't know, Jeff. Mhmm. Then I say,

31:53

again, that's not gonna Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We're

31:55

gonna talk. But we don't also have that issue.

31:57

We put people on the show. But

32:00

years ago, when we are still kind of

32:02

figuring out casting, there would

32:04

be people who would say, it's just

32:06

strategy. And then I think, okay,

32:08

we can do this the easy way or

32:10

the hard way. Right. But

32:12

now, you know, you're really also

32:15

making me realize my own

32:17

growth I'm

32:17

not that same. I'm not interested in that same

32:20

story as a human. Yeah. You know,

32:22

like, it

32:22

used to be red

32:24

tribe versus blue tribe. Yeah. And we might call

32:26

it something, you know, brains, brown

32:28

and beauty, whatever it is. For me

32:31

now, even though there are

32:33

still tribes, I see this as an

32:35

individual pursuit -- Mhmm. -- because that's

32:37

where I'm at in my life. Right. So

32:39

you are on a tribe with other

32:41

people and

32:41

you do wanna beat Billy's

32:43

tried because he's on the other tribe. Mhmm. But all

32:45

I'm seeing is eighteen people, seventeen

32:48

people, sixteen people. Mhmm. Fifteen

32:50

people. Mhmm. So my spiritual place

32:52

in the world is, why are

32:54

you here? Right. Right. What do you

32:56

want from this? Yeah. Yeah. Is it

32:58

really just a million dollars Probably not.

33:01

No. because you'll find that

33:03

almost every single player across

33:05

the board when they leave will say, I

33:07

had an amazing time. This is an

33:09

incredible experience. best thing I've ever done in my

33:11

life. They've not won the millions of

33:13

millions. Right. It's

33:15

it's getting through those thunderstorms

33:18

at night It's lightened the fire for the

33:20

first time. It's winning a challenge, you

33:22

know. I remember seeing Surrey

33:24

really struggled with the physical challenges.

33:26

and then there's a point where she actually is like,

33:28

okay, you know what? I'm gonna do something here. And

33:30

that's

33:30

an amazing moment in her life to

33:32

realize, okay, one of the best

33:35

moments maybe the singular best

33:37

moment that represents survivor

33:39

is Suri in I

33:41

think it was game

33:43

changers. And,

33:44

Serena, this woman, Billy, who was

33:46

the first person that ever said

33:48

I was watching survivor and I

33:50

decided to get up off the couch and apply.

33:53

And she represented the every

33:55

person because she didn't look like she

33:57

belonged in a jungle. She was a nurse,

33:59

a caregiver, she didn't live out in

34:02

the, you know, weeds, but

34:04

she came and she played and people

34:06

fell in love with her. She's still -- Yeah. -- one of

34:08

the most eleven people of all

34:10

time, humans and everything. But there

34:12

was a

34:12

challenge where they had to cross a balance beam in

34:14

the middle of the ocean. She couldn't do it. Yeah.

34:16

And there's a point in the

34:18

story of that where the challenge is clearly gonna be won

34:20

by the other tribe. But that's not what's interesting.

34:23

What's interesting is you. Yeah.

34:26

Serena, that person. You're sitting here right

34:28

now. Are you gonna try to pull yourself

34:30

up on this platform and try to cross

34:32

that beam? Or are you just gonna say,

34:34

I'm done? Yeah. And all the attention turned to Serene.

34:36

Yeah. And I remember saying, we're not going

34:38

anywhere. We got nothing to do -- Yeah. --

34:40

but help

34:42

you. and

34:42

she got across. Mhmm. And it was this incredible moment.

34:44

And then she ends up getting voted out, you

34:46

know, again, because that's how survivor works.

34:48

I say what? Yeah. Yeah. That's

34:51

the stuff that gives you the goosebumps on your arms. Absolutely. You can see that

34:53

already and come back to the tribal thing.

34:55

Something I was thinking watching it the other day

34:57

and this might be very

35:00

obvious. but you being

35:01

there. And it seemed like

35:03

everyone

35:03

had made their mind up, you

35:05

know. Okay. We're at to

35:07

we are a Jew, and we are a Jew, and we

35:09

are gonna you know, it's all what type

35:12

before they got there. And then when you

35:14

started talking to them, I

35:16

felt like I think a couple

35:18

of these guys are changing their mind, sitting there and the tribal

35:21

thing,

35:21

whereas, I would have thought,

35:23

well, once you've made

35:26

mean domicones more him out than that set. Right.

35:28

But it felt like just set and

35:30

have in that chat, I could

35:33

see people like change

35:35

does that happen? Well, you're

35:37

very perceptive. Perceptive because in

35:40

the early years, it didn't change very

35:42

often. Yeah. People were petrified, and they would just

35:44

let's stick We've done it. Yeah. We're good. It's not that way anymore. Yeah.

35:46

And if if you say something a

35:49

tribal that does not jive

35:51

with what Dom thought you

35:54

told him earlier, he now starts to think, wait

35:56

a minute, is Billy lying to me? Mhmm.

35:58

I may go to plan b, so they

36:01

have all kinds signals, you know, tug on an ear, they say a

36:03

weird word. I don't even know what they are, but I know enough

36:05

to know that everybody's

36:08

playing. Yep. and the

36:10

vote does change and they, you

36:12

know, there's this phrase, live

36:14

tribal, which drives some

36:15

people crazy, but it

36:17

really just speaks to the idea that if you think it's over just because

36:19

you're sitting a tribal, it's probably you. Yeah.

36:22

Yeah. Sure. Yeah. The the live tribal thing

36:24

is much more of

36:26

a modern society -- Yes. -- survivor thing. And I love how

36:28

perceptive the camera crew

36:30

are in the live tribal

36:32

because if

36:34

you if one of the contestants kinda does a little,

36:36

they're on it. Oh, man. They've got

36:38

that lovely close-up and then they'll cut

36:40

to you and you'll be like, Okay.

36:42

I'm just gonna sit back and watch it. Tom, I love you. You

36:45

said that because sometimes

36:47

a

36:47

survivor scene

36:50

like a reality scene where there's three people talking

36:52

and they're conspiring about what they're gonna

36:54

do. It will be,

36:56

when

36:56

you see it, it's so

37:00

good that you just think, well, that's what

37:02

television shows look like. Because there's a

37:04

like, you you all, as actors

37:06

and producers know, be three shot. There's an over

37:09

the shoulder. There's a tilt up from the hand

37:11

to the face. Boom over to here.

37:14

But often, it's one

37:16

camera operator -- Mhmm. -- in the field

37:18

who got stuck alone -- Mhmm. -- three people.

37:20

He doesn't have a meter. She doesn't have anybody.

37:22

Yeah. So he's got to get the three shot, the

37:24

the two the relationship shots. Get wider. Get us

37:26

behind. And you look at one

37:28

disc and you're like,

37:30

one person. shot all of

37:32

this. Yeah, man. And as you said,

37:34

had the instinct to know, Billy's

37:36

about to say something. I'm gonna pull over to

37:38

Billy. Boom. I

37:40

got it. It blows me away. It's I often say when

37:42

I'm watching early cuts, I'll be out.

37:44

It cut you would think this was a

37:46

scripted show where we had all day to shoot

37:48

this scene. but it happened in

37:50

four minutes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It can't be

37:52

scripted because of all of the different human

37:54

dynamics going on. I I think probably

37:56

must've been ten years ago, Billy, that

37:58

I was try and get you to watch

37:59

the vybe. Do you remember? Yeah.

38:01

Billy was wearing more than that. She was still in

38:04

Scotland. You went back to Scotland at that point. So

38:06

it's probably closer

38:06

to fourteen, fifteen years

38:08

ago. been a survivor fan since he came on. I

38:11

said to Billy at one point, he's with his wife.

38:13

I said, what what are you doing? He said, well,

38:15

we're gonna go home. Jet lagged and

38:17

stuff. I said, take Heroes and film You're so good.

38:19

Yeah. I was just take this. It is my all time

38:21

favorite season of survivor. Take

38:23

these DVDs. Watch

38:26

it. Then you've got season after season after season that you keep

38:28

watching. It lost that team. I

38:30

lost the

38:30

TV. It lost the team. Oh, my

38:32

favorite seasonal survivorry lost. Yeah.

38:36

It wasn't pleased and No. I not only did you not watch it, but you lost

38:38

it. But the the pitch the pitch

38:40

that I'd always said to Billy and the pitch that I always say to

38:42

my friends who, you know, Jeff, I'm sure you have

38:44

it nowadays

38:46

after forty two, forty three season seven, forty three.

38:48

You must have people kind of

38:49

saying, wow. Okay. You know,

38:52

that show's still on and how do you how do you make it

38:54

fresh and how do you

38:56

make it Current. I say it's then to to my friends, I'm

38:58

like, it is constantly

39:00

evolving the show, but it

39:02

doesn't necessarily need to,

39:04

although I appreciate

39:06

why it happens because the bones,

39:08

the foundation of that show, is

39:11

so

39:11

strong. You

39:13

know, the physical challenges mixed with the

39:15

mental endurance mixed with the the life

39:17

at camp, then all the contestants

39:19

eating each other and

39:21

backstabbing each other. And then that final thing of all

39:23

of these people that you've

39:24

betrayed are now gonna decide who wins. Like,

39:26

we're I'm gonna come and watch the

39:29

finale with you guys. and you're

39:31

gonna you're not in vegas. Yeah. Oh, man. Yeah. You're gonna

39:33

be so confused because you're gonna be like, wait,

39:35

all these people probably kind of

39:38

dislike the person that they're giving a million dollars to,

39:40

but that what they have to do. So gonna

39:43

this is the the biggest question

39:45

around survivor.

39:45

I hear all the time. You don't really need

39:47

all the twists. And

39:50

you know, Well, we'll never know because we we're that's what

39:52

we're doing. But here's my

39:54

argument from a game

39:56

design standpoint. what I'm doing

39:58

when we're not shooting is I'm just

39:59

designing the game.

40:01

And

40:02

uncertainty

40:04

is what compelled somebody at tribal to

40:06

do what we just talked about, which is, wait,

40:08

why did Billy why did Billy say

40:11

that? That sounded weird. does

40:13

he have blank, an advantage, a relationship, uncertainty?

40:16

Right. So I felt

40:18

like watching the

40:20

early seasons when they were playing

40:22

out thinking, this idea

40:24

that if there are twelve people and

40:26

seven are together, they can

40:28

dominate the five. Yep. is disastrous.

40:30

Yeah. You have to make it

40:32

very difficult. So you start interjecting

40:34

things into the show, injecting things

40:36

that makes somebody on the seven realize

40:39

I think I'm seven. Yeah. I could be six if I

40:41

went to the five. Yeah. So

40:43

that's, you know,

40:44

I've been trying to scream from

40:46

the top of rooftops at today's

40:49

players who get frustrated with

40:50

all the twists. It's almost

40:52

like I'm a parent saying, I'm gonna

40:55

that which you resist will

40:57

persist, I'm going to push more and

40:59

more until you realize this is not

41:02

what the game's about. Mhmm. The game is

41:04

about adaptation. Mhmm.

41:06

Should happen. You wake up in the morning. You got a weird feeling. You go to the

41:08

doctor. You're sick. Shit happens.

41:10

Survival. You wake up. You find it be

41:12

wear advantage.

41:14

Do you open it or not? Yep. Be aware. Mhmm.

41:16

Also, not the future players. Be aware

41:18

advantages are not going away, and they're

41:20

not gonna get less scary. Yeah.

41:23

Yeah. So I feel like you

41:25

do need that and the mistake

41:27

players make is they get caught up

41:29

in it, you know, like the

41:31

change history twist we did. Yeah.

41:34

There was a guy Danny on that

41:36

season who I think could have won

41:38

the game. I mean, he's just a,

41:40

you know, he's a really smart --

41:42

Yeah. -- super clever, very

41:44

likable and physical he

41:46

could win. it got so mad for forty eight hours that he took his eyes off

41:48

the prize. And I still think back and

41:50

think, did that just did

41:52

that little

41:52

course correction hurt you versus

41:56

Dude, it is. Mhmm. You can be mad at me later.

41:58

Yeah. Yeah. But don't mess up your

41:59

game. Yeah. You're mad. Yeah. It is

42:02

just minus things that can

42:04

change the course of a contestant

42:06

in in survivor. Well, let

42:06

me ask you about the the

42:10

beware advantage. the legalities of that. Okay? Let's say

42:12

billionaire plane survivor, and and we're

42:14

walking on the beach. And I see the

42:16

beware advantage, but I

42:18

personally think I'm not gonna go

42:20

anywhere near that. I know what that means.

42:22

If I could Joel, Billy, into

42:24

opening it, that's fucking it. Oh,

42:25

yeah. I keep waiting for that

42:27

to happen because you

42:30

know,

42:30

know so far

42:32

that beware Advantage hasn't really burned

42:34

anybody. Mhmm. But you do have to

42:36

do things. Like, it's gonna make you now go get

42:39

beads to be in, you know, to

42:41

form your necklace, which at home

42:43

can sometimes seem easy. it's not.

42:45

No. No. That is dicey because if you you can't

42:47

give it away and you can't be

42:49

too aggressive, so yeah, I think one day

42:51

somebody's gonna probably do what

42:54

you just said -- Yeah. -- and get lucky, and it burns the person who

42:56

picked it up. And it will say, this is

42:58

why it says, be aware.

43:00

Yeah. Yeah. I like is it

43:01

Colby? Is it the is that one of the

43:04

contestants this year? Cody. Cody.

43:06

Cody. So Cody

43:08

picked up the beware advantage. And

43:10

I like the fact that someone at that point, maybe it

43:12

was Cody, explained that if with

43:14

these guys all being super fans, giving

43:18

away beads or the bag is something that you would want to take

43:20

home at the end of the game. And so so

43:22

when they're done, when they get when they get

43:24

kicked out of the game, Do

43:26

you guys from a courtesy point of view say, you can keep your bag, you keep your

43:28

buff, you what what kind of bag you can

43:30

keep, your personal bag, and your buff?

43:33

to let you like, if you say had an

43:36

idol and you didn't use it, you

43:38

could keep it as a souvenir. We don't do

43:40

that anymore either because now

43:42

we we think of everything

43:44

as future like,

43:46

you know, this knowledge is power

43:49

advantage idea is

43:51

fascinating because it's such a

43:53

simple idea.

43:55

If you know the information.

43:56

With this little piece of paper, you can

43:58

change the game. Mhmm. The

43:59

question is, who knows you have this little

44:02

piece of back to what Billy said

44:04

because I told my best friend that I have the knowledge of

44:06

power. I didn't realize he isn't my best friend. He

44:08

told his best friend and she told

44:10

everybody something like that knowledge is power,

44:12

a piece of paper. one

44:13

season is gonna go from one player to the

44:15

next to the next the same piece of

44:17

paper. Mhmm. And it'll be cursed. And then in

44:19

a future season, we'll bring it back and say,

44:21

this same piece of paper has burned

44:23

four people. So we try to keep all

44:25

of that and keep it in a locker. You know,

44:27

keep it dry in case we wanna use it

44:29

I would imagine that the the contracts for the contestants are

44:32

relatively thick. Right? Relatively

44:34

big. Yes. Yes. If you make

44:36

it to from the

44:38

start to the end, how long are you

44:40

there? Twenty six days. It used to be

44:42

thirty nine. Wow. Billy, it's

44:44

another bone of contention for some

44:46

people because Some

44:47

people feel like, well, if it's not thirty

44:49

nine days, it's not survivor. I don't feel

44:51

that way. Like, the old school people have one,

44:53

you mean? Yeah. They're like, well, you didn't play the way I played. And

44:55

I'm not taking anything away from them. Thirty nine

44:58

days is a long time. There's no reason to argue

45:00

about this. I'm just

45:02

merely saying we spent a lot

45:04

of time redesigning the

45:06

game, like the fact that there

45:08

is no food -- Mhmm. --

45:10

at all. for those first sixteen, seventeen, eighteen days. People are

45:12

seeing that by day three -- By day three. -- you're

45:14

just like -- Yeah. I am from Hungary. --

45:16

and I wanna be clear,

45:18

I'm not It's apples and

45:20

bananas. Yeah. They're

45:21

different games. Yeah. But this is the

45:23

game. And we like it, and we think there's

45:25

a lot of runway to play.

45:27

So at what point and I'm sure you've had it during the

45:29

run of the show, at what point does a

45:32

medic step in in terms of

45:34

food? There's always fresh water.

45:36

Right? Right. So there's a well or somewhere -- Right. -- you can get fresh

45:38

water. And that water

45:40

has been cleaned by -- Right. --

45:42

professionally. Right? So there's

45:44

always water Correct. In terms of food, when

45:46

does the medex step in and say, you know what, guys, this

45:48

person needs a bowl of rice or this person needs something?

45:50

Well, we do, you know, we

45:52

discussed it beforehand when

45:54

we knew how many days we were planning to

45:56

go in this new era, and

45:57

our medical team was fine with

45:59

it.

45:59

You know, said they'll be fine. They'll be hungry. They'll be fine. And they can catch

46:02

fish, and sometimes they do, and they get a little

46:04

bit of meat. But

46:06

if we if

46:07

something happened and our design was

46:10

off, and they said, you know, they're

46:12

in trouble, then we would introduce

46:14

a reward into the

46:16

game. You'd still have to earn it. Right. Or

46:18

we would say, hey, if you're really

46:20

hungry, give me your tarp. We would do

46:22

something. We would never just give it. It would

46:24

still be in the game, but our job is to make

46:26

sure that we're we've

46:27

laid it out in a way that that doesn't

46:30

happen. Yeah. And you have done that in in the show quite a few times

46:32

where you'll say, I'll give you this for your

46:34

time. Yeah. Well, usually,

46:36

it's when in past

46:38

seasons in the thirty nine day version, they would

46:40

have a bunch of rice and they would eat all of it.

46:42

Right. And in that case, our

46:43

medical team would say, hey,

46:45

they're just eating too much. Right. Right. Right. And

46:47

so that's why there was an invoice. It would

46:49

be, yeah, if you want another bag of rice, I

46:52

want everything. Right. Right.

46:54

Because we design this to work in that

46:56

other tribe, they still have rice. Right. So

46:58

you can't say it's not enough. Yeah. It's

47:00

not as much as you want. Yeah. Yeah. It

47:02

never is. but it's enough. I have to say over the

47:04

over the Is it It's forty two seasons

47:06

then? This is our forty third. So

47:08

over the

47:09

over the forty three seasons,

47:11

I'm still astounded that less people have chopped their thumb off

47:13

trying to overcome that because

47:16

those things

47:18

the other day. You know what? Most most people You're right. Playing

47:20

the game have never opened a coconut before.

47:22

You're right. And almost all of them

47:24

give it a go during that

47:26

time. And you will see people just hacking at it

47:28

from that thumb here. And I just

47:30

think someone's gonna lose a thumb at. So it's not

47:32

happening yet. It hasn't now, but you're I

47:35

think the same thing we want to. When we

47:38

do challenges where

47:40

there

47:40

when we have one,

47:41

I maybe even this season where you have

47:43

to take a machete in chopper

47:45

rope to get something to drop. Yeah.

47:47

We put the dullest machete we can

47:49

-- Yeah. -- because of me, because I'm always saying to

47:51

the art department, please tell me that

47:53

that they they're frenetic. You're frenetic? Yes.

47:56

Yeah. Yeah. I've since I became

47:58

a dad, I see challenges so differently

48:00

now.

48:02

I'm the worst for the art department and challenged department because

48:04

I am now the guy going, oh,

48:07

it might be too

48:10

big. That might be too high of a jump.

48:12

Do you really think couldn't it be just as

48:14

cool and we shoot a little lower? And they're like, who

48:16

are you? Yeah. Yeah. That'd be

48:18

so responsible. Yeah. The

48:20

water challenges are probably my favorite because it's

48:22

usually not strictly a water challenge. There'll be

48:24

a water challenge that might involve the little bit of land.

48:26

anything that has some element of watering I love. Let let

48:28

me ask you this, yeah.

48:30

What do you

48:32

personally

48:32

think

48:34

would you would be the best in in any of the physical challenges.

48:36

If they were if you had to

48:38

run one of

48:39

those to save your life, where where's

48:41

your strong suit? That's

48:43

so good.

48:45

I cannot believe I've

48:47

actually not contemplated what elements that I

48:49

would be good at. that's funny. They always say

48:51

would you be good at challenges, but you'd be good at challenges. You're

48:53

a very physically fit guy and you know your

48:55

way around them by

48:58

now. what you where are you feeling

49:00

great balance beams? I think I'd be good at, like

49:02

like I've learned enough over the years about

49:06

balance beams. that you look ahead and you just go for it.

49:08

Go. Right.

49:08

Right. You don't look down. You don't take

49:10

your time. You just and if you fall okay. You

49:12

fall -- Yeah. -- I can get up walls. I

49:16

untie ropes. I think water, I can swim,

49:18

but I'm not fast. Yeah. And about puzzles

49:20

where you went. Well, I was gonna say and going

49:23

underwater. one time you just I don't know. In the last ten

49:26

years, we started a season the way we're

49:28

gonna start it, we were on a boat, and you were

49:30

gonna have

49:32

to get applies, and then one person from a try about to jump off the boat,

49:34

swim out, and there was one big giant reward. So

49:36

the fastest swimmer would get it. Yeah. And we

49:38

were out

49:40

testing it. And they weren't sure, like, is it too deep? And I go, let me

49:42

go. because I'm average. Yeah.

49:44

Yeah. So I swim

49:46

out. I'm not kidding. Maybe

49:48

fifteen feet. Maybe from here to the edge of this studio. Yeah. And

49:50

then I have to dive down only like

49:52

four feet. Right. I couldn't do it. Go

49:54

to breath. The ocean is just Yeah.

49:57

You were wondering. And it was so

49:59

good for me to do it because it

50:02

reminded me on TV, you're

50:04

like, just once you

50:04

see somebody do it and it looks

50:07

easy, They're a stud. They're pretty good

50:09

because it's really hard. So if it was

50:11

that kind of stuff, I'd still be

50:13

underwater struggling. Yeah. Yeah. And you'd be back on top of

50:15

me going pro. Who's good?

50:20

No. I mean, you you must have those challenges a

50:22

lot when people say, when

50:23

they're watching survivor, Man, you could,

50:25

you know, could that little Easier, Aussie seems to be just flying through it, and you're

50:27

like Aussie is a one in a million.

50:30

Exactly. Yes.

50:33

Yeah.

50:33

In

50:34

fact, our art department to try

50:36

to to your point,

50:38

this year this year Usually,

50:40

you go underwater and you'd have to unclip something. And

50:42

it's hard because you can't see. It's

50:44

the ocean. It's not a swimming pool.

50:48

You know? and you're not gonna wear

50:50

a mask probably sometimes.

50:52

Yeah. Our art department is so

50:54

cool. A guy made a mechanism where

50:56

instead of having it unclipped, you just squeeze

50:58

a handle. and it

51:00

releases. And what it did was because the

51:02

test wasn't can you unclip, the

51:04

test was to see you go

51:06

underwater and pop this buoy. And in that

51:08

one little stroke of genius

51:10

from somebody in our art

51:12

department, you now have people who

51:14

can be a rock star. they can dive

51:16

down, get to the buoy, and instead of

51:18

panicking with a clip. Mhmm. Pull the lever.

51:20

Boom. It pops because they've done the thing

51:22

that they've pulled it.

51:24

Exactly going. don't feel on yeah. I think I got it.

51:26

Yes. And so now it's a rock star

51:28

moment that you wanna do because it's cool.

51:30

And we got a camera right there. Yeah. You know

51:32

it's a

51:34

great physical one this year I thought was brilliant. Was

51:36

the big snake or the snake? Because

51:38

if you've got to really

51:41

strong guys. It doesn't mar. because that's what

51:44

was that? It's, like, four hundred or four hundred.

51:46

And it was long so two guys

51:48

wouldn't be Not enough.

51:50

You need And it gets wet as well. Yeah. That was exactly

51:52

the snare. What's the snare? What's the snare? Yeah. Sand sand sand. And

51:54

then it takes on water. They looked

51:56

heavy -- Super happy. -- people

51:58

hanging

51:59

off it. Well, I believe that's where you're watching like, I'm on the beach

52:02

going, oh, I hope they they can

52:03

do this. Yeah. We've tested it, but you never

52:05

know. Yeah. And then slowly,

52:08

but surely they get the

52:10

last bit of the tail. No. But not

52:12

everyone. You need everyone because

52:14

it and that was

52:16

good. Okay. this goes back to the format. Those

52:18

first five or

52:18

six episodes where you're a tribe,

52:20

you were forced

52:21

to rely on

52:24

each other. So if you have somebody that's really great in the water and

52:26

really strong, you need

52:28

to keep them

52:28

-- Yeah. -- to get the snake up. Yeah.

52:30

But then you have to vote people out

52:33

and that person's not in your alliance. So you

52:35

wanna vote them out. But if you vote them out, your

52:37

tribe's weak, you might lose and go. It's that's

52:39

the problem with the day.

52:42

Yeah. it it all starts to, like, collapse in on itself -- Yeah. --

52:44

to really be already talking about,

52:46

and they're like, we need to keep him

52:48

because he's so strong. He

52:50

can keep his own the tray booth thing.

52:52

Yeah. But we're also scared

52:54

of him because he's gonna win his He's so

52:56

strong. Yeah. Yeah. Well, at the moment, we're obviously we're

52:58

we're not too far into survival. There's a new episode tonight. But

53:00

at the moment, Cody is like the

53:02

the one runner. Full of Careersma is

53:04

a good looking man. He seems to be

53:07

playing his game. Very honestly, he was great in that physical challenge.

53:10

He's the guy that goes over the other side

53:12

and basically uses his body weight just

53:14

to try old is a guy

53:16

who's often his own thing. He's a surfer dude. But you see, dog.

53:18

He's already he's already

53:22

lied. Yeah. Yeah. because he's a salesman.

53:24

Yeah. And he's not told everybody. He's

53:26

a salesman. Yeah. I love it. You're

53:28

right. They don't like salesman out. led

53:30

by him. Let me ask his idea. Yeah. He's calling people

53:32

sales women. He's like, now she's a sales woman. You

53:35

know what I mean? Yeah. Don't trust your will. But that's gonna

53:37

come You know what else's really

53:39

interesting is you never know we never

53:42

know who the audience will like. We know who

53:44

we liked. We were out there. Yeah. Cody was

53:46

charming from the minute we

53:48

met you. but that doesn't mean the audience. You could have

53:50

a they

53:50

could have vibed on him and went, I don't know

53:52

the surfer dude. Yeah. But instead, everywhere

53:54

I go -- Yeah. -- to, like,

53:57

Cody. Yeah. Love that. He just pops. He

53:59

pops. But it

53:59

then there's a young guy as well. He's

54:02

good. He's like nineteen, but he's tall

54:04

Yeah. He's twenty three. Oh, yeah. because, like, no one's gonna respect so much.

54:06

Which is funny. Did he go he said twenty

54:08

two, I think, different. Twenty

54:12

two. Yeah. Yeah. But it's enough just to get that little bit of

54:14

excitement. That's true. That is just

54:16

slight mirror images of each other. Yeah.

54:18

Those two, both kind of

54:20

appleti, both you know,

54:22

slightly masculine, dominant, energies,

54:24

those two. A question from

54:26

away from this season. Waha,

54:29

to the girls Chen. Yeah. She

54:32

just scraped up. Was that when she was

54:34

trying to dig the hole under the I

54:36

don't remember. because --

54:38

Yeah. -- it's pretty it's pretty It's a

54:40

it's a bonus I mean, she seems okay

54:42

with it. She's just got rolling with

54:44

it.

54:45

been Yep. There's been a

54:46

lot of very physical

54:47

challenges on the show. And then every so

54:49

often, you'll have a physical challenge where you'll

54:51

put humans against humans, you know,

54:53

the the kind

54:56

of two two netball nets and you have to put the ball. Yeah.

54:58

Obviously, in the stuff that

54:59

we've seen, it can get a little

55:01

rambunctious. Yeah. Are there are

55:04

there moments that don't get filmed where you've had to step in and say,

55:06

guys, you can't throw punches. You

55:08

can't be drowning people. But

55:10

there's a reason we're

55:12

not really doing him anymore. Oh, is that? Just it just got him it

55:14

just gotten too a bit

55:16

rough. Why? Yeah. But, no, I I gotta

55:18

say again to

55:20

the players you know, on that those

55:22

challenges in particular, I would say, look,

55:24

obviously, this would be the speeches.

55:26

You can't throw a punch. If

55:28

you do, you're out of here. don't

55:30

hold. Which has never happened yet. No. Don't hold somebody underwater.

55:32

Right. That's just not cool. But then the

55:34

thing that really gets them is when you remind

55:37

them, if you get to

55:40

the end, some of these people, maybe all of them, maybe

55:42

on your jury. Yeah. So

55:44

you play the game the way you wanna play. It's

55:46

okay to play hard. Yeah.

55:48

But just I've

55:50

gotten

55:50

less comfortable with it. Yeah. And maybe

55:52

that's because I'm more woke. Mhmm. I don't

55:54

know. But there's no need.

55:56

We our challenges are bigger

55:59

than ever --

55:59

Yeah. -- this year and next season. This season and the

56:02

next season. They're tougher than ever. They

56:04

are they are tough, but

56:06

they're achievable. you just gotta

56:08

work together. They're like you'll see a lot more

56:10

walls that you have to get up, that you can't get

56:12

up without somebody. Right. Right. It's

56:14

impossible. Right. So You gotta rely --

56:16

Right. -- you gotta belly belly

56:18

mentality, and then you gotta vote that person then.

56:20

Exactly.

56:22

In those kind of intimate moments that you guys build into the

56:24

show. Someone's found a hidden item

56:26

or they need to have a talk in heads moment with the

56:28

camera crew.

56:30

someone's having an intimate moment with the camera crew where they're talking about a a

56:32

loved one that they're missing or can they

56:34

get through this next tribal? What's

56:38

to stop one of the other

56:40

fellow contestants just to walk down the beach

56:42

at that point and completely ruin that We

56:44

protect him. If someone was doing interviews So

56:46

do you say to the contestants,

56:48

hey, guys, We're taking ten minutes over here, staying the camp.

56:50

No. We don't say that.

56:51

We just take we say, you know,

56:53

if we were taking you for an interview, we

56:55

take you somewhere private. and

56:57

we have some a second producer who's

57:00

watching to make sure that nobody

57:02

would try if they were

57:04

so inclined. to get within earshot of the -- Okay. -- of the

57:06

interview. That doesn't happen. It

57:08

just it just doesn't. People don't do

57:10

that. We wouldn't

57:12

tolerate it. we're really clear that we don't ask for much. Right.

57:14

Right. But but you got it. But that's the cool

57:16

The the only things we ask, like I said, we're be

57:20

honest, and you have to respect our crew. Right. Right. Because if

57:22

anybody did say something,

57:24

you know, whatever, like, I don't know, say

57:26

something to a camera operator or a second

57:28

producer or

57:30

anybody we would definitely pull them aside and say,

57:32

that will not fly. Yeah. Everybody out here is

57:34

busting their ass. But again, Dom, I know it sounds

57:36

like a broken record. Most

57:39

people are really good to work with. Yeah. Of course, they get tired

57:41

and irritable and all that, but we

57:43

understand that. Yeah. But we

57:45

don't really have Like,

57:47

I'm telling this

57:48

group, they're as likable as they

57:50

seem. Yeah. And we've just started. Yeah. So

57:52

pretty much to get to know about

57:54

them. How how close are

57:57

the camps? Well,

57:58

not close enough to They

57:59

they they couldn't get to the other.

58:02

No. Right. I mean, I suppose you could if you got

58:04

in the boat and started paddling. That was your

58:06

thing, but How how what is

58:08

a normal day?

58:09

Like like,

58:11

cameraman and as

58:13

as there always someone in the camp

58:15

-- Always. -- how many a couple of

58:17

cameras, several crews during the day. And

58:20

usually at night, often

58:22

it's one

58:24

segment producer, who's

58:25

getting there. It's often their

58:28

first

58:28

real responsibility. And it's a

58:30

big one because the good news is

58:32

they'll probably sleep all night. Right.

58:35

The bad news is someone might get up. And if or good news, I

58:37

guess, depending on how you look at it. But if

58:39

they do, it's on you. You're

58:42

the camera operator. You're the producer. Doing some many lessons.

58:44

You gotta get the coverage. And it's

58:46

a real you know, it's often

58:48

seen as, oh, I got nights. But

58:51

for us, it's This is how much

58:54

faith we have in you and your future on the

58:56

show is we're putting you. We're giving

58:58

you nights. Right. Okay. Where

59:00

you're alone. And Billy, they'll the producer

59:02

will have to sit out there in the rain.

59:04

Yeah. The survivors might have a

59:06

shelter. It might keep them dry. They're not in

59:08

the shelter. They're out there. And every so often in the middle of the night, I

59:10

will call at the beach just to see how they're

59:12

doing. It's three AM probes

59:14

for TC1.

59:18

Yeah. how you doing? It's it's pretty

59:20

wet.

59:20

You're loving

59:22

it? Absolutely. Alright. Later.

59:25

Good night. Yeah. Okay. Good night.

59:28

You know, I'm not sleeping, Jeff. Right? You're going to

59:30

sleep. I'm not. Yeah. They were expecting you were

59:32

gonna bring, like, chicken wings -- Yeah. -- right now.

59:34

So That happened. I love it.

59:36

They they all said, basically, after one day, they're like, you'll never dry

59:38

here. You just never

59:40

dry. Yeah. Yeah. Humidity

59:42

in the air. Yeah. and

59:45

then cold at night. Really? Yeah. And then your fire is always burning, which that little

59:47

thing of that penalty of taking their flint

59:49

if they lose a

59:52

challenge, you know, we we

59:54

have only so much time in an episode,

59:56

but, you know,

59:57

we could do a minute

59:59

on

59:59

people trying to get their fire

1:00:02

going. Yeah. you know, you guys you

1:00:04

too appreciate this. We're still a linear show. We're on

1:00:07

CBS network, even though you can

1:00:09

see it on Paramount plus. Yeah.

1:00:12

And CBS is still limited to forty two minutes, forty three seconds.

1:00:14

Yeah. If we were on a streamer,

1:00:16

one episode could be fifty one minutes

1:00:18

-- Yeah. -- and it it wouldn't matter.

1:00:21

What's been the scariest

1:00:23

moment as a

1:00:26

producer of the show? What's that

1:00:28

moment where you're either in the field

1:00:30

or you get a phone call that means you go, this is a big problem

1:00:32

now. I think

1:00:33

the scariest one was

1:00:36

this

1:00:36

season when we had

1:00:38

a guy, we had three people go down at

1:00:40

once in a challenge. They were digging

1:00:42

at

1:00:43

roast in Haute Yeah. and

1:00:45

they

1:00:45

were digging that hole. And and the

1:00:48

flag was there. They just it was one of those

1:00:50

inexplicable. They just kept missing

1:00:52

it.

1:00:54

And one

1:00:54

woman one woman had sort of just little high

1:00:57

little dehydration, a little heat. She

1:00:59

was okay. The

1:00:59

other woman was

1:01:01

pretty bad,

1:01:02

and the guy was really bad.

1:01:04

And I knew it was bad when

1:01:06

the woman was vomiting.

1:01:10

and our doctor said she'll be okay. Wow. That's how

1:01:12

bad he was.

1:01:12

And I I was holding his

1:01:15

head and and

1:01:17

there was just a moment there where III wasn't

1:01:19

sure. He everything was okay and he's he's all

1:01:21

good. But you brought in a helicopter for the Oh,

1:01:23

yeah. Yeah. That was a big evacuation, and that's

1:01:25

when you really see how

1:01:27

good our

1:01:29

safety and -- Yeah. -- teams are. I mean,

1:01:32

we have, you know, this guy, Greg

1:01:34

Blandy. He he's our safety guy. And a lot of the times, he's to make

1:01:36

sure that you put a railing

1:01:38

on something if it's really high. You know,

1:01:40

stuff that you could

1:01:42

say, okay. But when

1:01:44

Blandy needs to be on because something's

1:01:46

happening or like somebody in the water is in

1:01:48

trouble, he's an expert swimmer. All of a sudden,

1:01:50

you go, That's why he's here.

1:01:52

Yeah. So and then we have a

1:01:54

helicopter pilot, Ken Gray. That's the guy

1:01:56

that knows how to transport quickly can do that.

1:01:58

If he has to fly at night,

1:02:00

he will. you know, all those things you don't want them to ever have to

1:02:02

do anything. And our

1:02:04

medical

1:02:04

decisions are made by our

1:02:06

doctors. we don't have any

1:02:08

say on that. Yep. So the deal is

1:02:10

if they can stay, let them stay. Yeah.

1:02:12

If they can't stay, pull them. Yeah. It's up to

1:02:14

you and it's heartbreaking. And you've seen it when

1:02:17

they pull somebody. they don't wanna do it, but they never wanted

1:02:19

it. But they don't even hesitate because

1:02:21

it's not worth it. Yeah. Yeah. I don't

1:02:23

think I want to do this, Jeff, because

1:02:25

I'm I'm loving I'm

1:02:27

loving watching this, and I'm loving that

1:02:30

it's a weekly thing that I

1:02:32

can't binge it, that I I haven't. it's

1:02:34

the best. Come on. Come on.

1:02:36

But

1:02:36

if a dead want to binge Whaler watch

1:02:38

the new one, or what

1:02:40

season should have binge? man.

1:02:43

It's a good one. Well, heroes versus villains is a

1:02:46

good one. It's a great one. David

1:02:48

Goliath is a good one. Millennials versus

1:02:50

Gen x. is a good one. Pearl Islands is a good one. China

1:02:52

is a good one. Philippines,

1:02:54

Cambodia. Honestly, I know I'm I

1:02:56

sound like a guy selling, you know,

1:03:00

brushes. But Under

1:03:01

Australian Outback's fantastic. Yeah. You've got Basically,

1:03:03

that's crazy long with school. No. You you

1:03:05

can't really. There's you're

1:03:07

I would I would probably say, and you you alluded

1:03:10

to it at the start of us,

1:03:12

Jane. I don't think you should

1:03:13

start with Season one. No.

1:03:15

Because it's not the show that you

1:03:17

guys never envisaged. You could go back after watching a

1:03:19

few seasons and go, ah, here's the

1:03:22

genesis. Yeah. But it really starts

1:03:24

to catch fire,

1:03:26

I think, roundabout season three or four, and then it's just it's

1:03:28

it's getting better and better. I I

1:03:31

it's hard for me to

1:03:33

answer

1:03:33

it because I'm aware of

1:03:36

I'm aware that

1:03:37

I'm talking about the show I work on.

1:03:39

Yeah. Yeah. I think our storytelling is as good

1:03:41

as it's ever been. Yes. really Art

1:03:43

is as is what Dom says, he

1:03:45

he says when you meet him,

1:03:46

he says he's he's he loves this

1:03:49

show. He really loves it. in a

1:03:51

way that I drink my own tooling. Which is a

1:03:53

great thing, you know, to to be involved and

1:03:55

assured that you love so

1:03:57

much. Yeah. You you're so

1:04:00

passionate about it. You're so positive about

1:04:02

it. There's

1:04:02

you've always been such a positive

1:04:05

person, but there's there's nothing

1:04:07

jaded about having done forty three seasons

1:04:09

in the same show. You still love that. Well, I'll

1:04:11

tell you what, really feels good.

1:04:13

This is the truth.

1:04:15

when performers,

1:04:16

other storytellers like you.

1:04:18

I have a group of

1:04:20

writer friends who've written gigantic

1:04:22

stuff big time movies

1:04:24

we've all seen. And when

1:04:26

they write and say, last night's episode

1:04:29

or that scene sequence where this

1:04:31

this and this happens, it's

1:04:33

so gratifying because that's

1:04:36

what

1:04:36

that's what we feel we're doing is

1:04:38

we're telling a story it's

1:04:40

built inside a game and it's players living on an

1:04:42

island. These are all the facts and the the the

1:04:44

players, the characters, whatever you wanna call them.

1:04:46

But what we're seeing is this epic individual

1:04:50

adventure of people overcoming odds

1:04:52

to see what they're capable of achieving.

1:04:54

Mhmm. And sometimes it is

1:04:56

mind blowing and sometimes

1:04:58

it's tiny. Like, we have an episode coming

1:05:00

up this season with

1:05:02

somebody. I won't say man or woman or

1:05:04

anyone, but somebody a

1:05:06

very small moment involving

1:05:09

a puzzle that they

1:05:12

solve. And in an interview,

1:05:14

they say, despite

1:05:16

having all these degrees and all this

1:05:18

education, they say, you know,

1:05:20

I never

1:05:21

I was always kind of told that I wasn't

1:05:23

good at this stuff.

1:05:25

I

1:05:25

am. I am.

1:05:28

I just did that. And I saw that interview

1:05:30

went, wow, you've lived all

1:05:32

these years. And that tiny little silly puzzle

1:05:35

-- Mhmm. -- in the bowl

1:05:37

of Fiji actually was meaningful

1:05:38

to you. Yeah. Maybe

1:05:40

that's why you came out here. Maybe you will never

1:05:43

again doubt that you are good at that

1:05:45

stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I love that too.

1:05:47

I'm always surprised at the end of

1:05:49

the challenges I don't think seen it yet. But a

1:05:51

losing team, excuse me, a

1:05:53

losing team has not said to you.

1:05:55

Hey, Jeff, can we just

1:05:58

finish it? Yeah.

1:05:58

Never happened to us. Yeah. I thought the week before last

1:06:01

when Cody's team lost

1:06:02

the the puzzle challenge and they

1:06:06

were close, I I genuinely thought they were gonna

1:06:08

say, could you give us ten minutes and let us

1:06:10

just finish just for our own sense of

1:06:12

satisfaction, but I guess they're also beat

1:06:14

at that I think

1:06:16

that's a big part of it, and demoralized,

1:06:18

and immediately thinking about

1:06:20

tribal. Right. Right. I mean, you immediately

1:06:22

see people go, yeah,

1:06:24

we lost. Who's it gonna be? That's me. And I think if it

1:06:26

was really a big time suck,

1:06:28

you know, we also have the confines

1:06:30

of Sun.

1:06:32

Like,

1:06:32

we have to get you back to camp so that we can let you decide who

1:06:34

you're gonna vote out tonight. So we we also have

1:06:36

a ticking clock. We gotta get you in the

1:06:39

boat. get you back to camp, give you time to strategize and

1:06:41

do what you want. because once the sun goes

1:06:43

down, we're going to tribal. Yeah.

1:06:46

Yeah. If you

1:06:46

you've probably been asked this question a million times

1:06:49

before, if you were able to Frankenstein

1:06:52

the perfect

1:06:53

survivor contestant to win the game -- Wow. -- out

1:06:56

of out of people that have come

1:06:58

and gone. What

1:06:59

would you ask a great question? It's really that's

1:07:01

a great question. Especially lately

1:07:04

because we've

1:07:06

worked really hard to put on likable, rotable people.

1:07:08

Mhmm. You know, I love everybody that's

1:07:10

if if we don't have unanimous consent by

1:07:13

our producing team, you're not

1:07:15

gonna get on. So you know if you're on, we want you here.

1:07:17

So how many producers have to say, yes.

1:07:20

Quite a few. I'd have to count, but I

1:07:22

mean, it's a it's a handful.

1:07:24

Right.

1:07:26

And And on the flip

1:07:27

side, if one person only

1:07:29

one person really wanted somebody and nobody else

1:07:31

did, I don't think they I don't think you get

1:07:33

to play that chip. We

1:07:36

used to talk about. You can you can have one player who you want, but it's now

1:07:38

it's gotten to where if we're not

1:07:40

all seeing it, then let's just

1:07:42

wait and bring them back next year and talk

1:07:44

to, you know, talk to us. So I

1:07:46

think what I'm getting at is

1:07:48

the hall of fame of

1:07:50

survivor is full of great

1:07:52

players who will

1:07:54

never win. because it's impossible to win. Yeah. It's

1:07:56

impossible. So I think

1:07:58

the

1:07:59

skills are,

1:07:59

you know, you you

1:08:02

obviously have to be a good read. You have

1:08:04

to have emotional intelligence. If you don't

1:08:06

understand when something's sideways -- Mhmm.

1:08:08

-- you're in trouble. but you also

1:08:10

have to be able to be duplicitous with the right people and

1:08:13

be loyal to the right people. Sometimes

1:08:15

the right move is is

1:08:17

telling the truth -- Mhmm. -- because Billy is gonna be loyal -- Mhmm. -- and we're both gonna

1:08:19

go to the end and one of us will win, but

1:08:22

we're gonna get there.

1:08:24

you and me might play and and you

1:08:27

might be an interview going, I can't believe propels. He's gonna believe me. All the times talked about this,

1:08:29

but I'm taking him out

1:08:31

tonight. Yeah. So

1:08:34

I don't know, but I I try to

1:08:36

say even though I know it's easy to say

1:08:38

and hard to do to play the first

1:08:40

time as though you're playing the second time.

1:08:42

because that's a great point. What what people that

1:08:45

are in the survivor hall of fame have never

1:08:47

said is, what a good

1:08:49

a

1:08:49

Shutter? Really? They might say, played the adult. I didn't need to.

1:08:51

That cost me. But they don't say, I was afraid

1:08:54

to play. No. No. And but it's

1:08:56

easy to say because you

1:08:58

only get to play once probably. Mhmm.

1:09:00

And you want it you

1:09:02

want every minute. But if you wanna win, you have

1:09:06

to play to win because I'm watching too. And if you get to

1:09:08

the end and I think you weren't playing to win,

1:09:10

I'll never give you my vote. Yeah. Because I

1:09:13

played to win. Yeah. And I'm out. I'm gonna give it to the other dude or

1:09:15

the other woman who played hard and beat me.

1:09:18

Yeah. Yeah. But that's easy to say.

1:09:20

It's like, are you gonna go for

1:09:22

a home run knowing you may strike

1:09:24

out? you're just gonna try to get your

1:09:26

bat on the ball. Right. Two different outcomes. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it feels like the people with the

1:09:28

biggest

1:09:28

swings, the most bombastic

1:09:30

kind of plays. They obviously stick

1:09:34

their neck out, but they usually go pretty in the game. the contestants

1:09:35

it twice is

1:09:36

extraordinary.

1:09:40

Right. You're right. dropped

1:09:42

one twice. No. No. Only twice. Sandra and Tony. Sandra and Tony. Oh,

1:09:48

you'd like Tony. Yeah. Tony's are really interested in New

1:09:50

York fine and So so the thing that Tony did spying at the

1:09:52

well. Right? That's within

1:09:54

the rules of the game.

1:09:56

So toach more people than it. So he was flying

1:09:58

a little while. So when they go to pick up the fresh water, you know, Tony,

1:10:01

like, erected a

1:10:04

little hide and

1:10:06

would like the spy shak. The spy shak. Nice

1:10:08

to listen in to what people were saying, and it

1:10:10

it paid off for him a couple of years. He

1:10:13

works. so hard out there. That's He's

1:10:15

interested. So he built a little thing that he could hide them. And imagine you gotta do that

1:10:17

while

1:10:17

other people Yeah.

1:10:19

You gotta be really clever.

1:10:23

because if you leave, they think you're doing a spooning. You're

1:10:25

looking for another He was always leaving.

1:10:27

He was always coming

1:10:29

in and in and out. What's his name? The, you know,

1:10:32

the kind of the little the little

1:10:34

Hobbie guy that that was with Bobby that

1:10:37

no one really Russell. him and Russell will always

1:10:39

-- Right. -- leave it. -- and it's a different

1:10:42

game now. Russell would have to adapt his game.

1:10:44

Yeah. Even though if he listens

1:10:46

to this, he'll say, no, I wouldn't. the greatest of all time, but he would have to adapt.

1:10:48

But he might be able to. Right. You

1:10:50

can't play that game today. Right. But now

1:10:52

you play a different game. She

1:10:54

genuinely looks like an evil hub Billy.

1:10:56

If you can picture an

1:10:59

evil rabbit, I can. I wanted

1:11:01

to ask you, Jeff,

1:11:03

because I very I I

1:11:05

don't have seen you bristle too many times. The only time I ever see you bristle on

1:11:08

the the only time i ever

1:11:10

see you bristle on the show show

1:11:12

It's in the finale where we're

1:11:14

finding out who's winning. And someone out

1:11:16

of the contestants that have

1:11:19

been brought back for a finale,

1:11:21

we'll mention the editing. Yeah. And you'll go. Here we

1:11:23

go. Yeah. And I want we

1:11:27

all know to be choices to be made,

1:11:29

but I wanted you to respond because you

1:11:31

never respond. You just kinda

1:11:33

go, okay, okay, we're moving

1:11:36

untapped thing. Well, I'd like to

1:11:38

hear you respond to the fact that, of course, this is an entertainment show. You have to make

1:11:40

editorial decisions. Yeah.

1:11:43

And it's not You're

1:11:45

not telling a story

1:11:46

that didn't happen. These stories that happened. So could you just spell that for a second? In the

1:11:49

editing days, they're probably

1:11:51

not posted anymore, but as

1:11:54

annoying as this will sound. Kind of early

1:11:57

on

1:11:57

when I sort of took on the

1:11:59

show running, I wrote this,

1:12:01

you know, man of this Jerry McGuire

1:12:03

moment, which is basically, here's what our moments have to be. And it was, they

1:12:06

have to be honest.

1:12:09

they can be funny, they can be

1:12:11

advers, they can be visceral, but they have to have happened, which means when you're editing,

1:12:13

if we do an interview

1:12:16

with you, on

1:12:18

day one, and you talk about the

1:12:20

marooning. And we do an interview with

1:12:22

you on day three, and you talk

1:12:25

about the marooning. We might marry those

1:12:27

two interviews. They're both about the same marooning. That's exactly what

1:12:29

happened. So that kind of

1:12:32

structuring

1:12:32

of a scene

1:12:34

is completely realistic and normal.

1:12:37

what wouldn't be okay would be to take what you said on

1:12:39

day one and pull out a few words

1:12:41

so that you actually are saying

1:12:44

something different. So

1:12:47

we would never do that. Right. So that's our fundamental

1:12:49

thing. Then you get

1:12:51

into players

1:12:52

feel like you didn't show

1:12:54

my the time I told all those jokes, I was like,

1:12:57

good side. And they're

1:12:59

right. Right. There's

1:13:01

so much great material

1:13:03

But we have a show to tell, and our thing is this is

1:13:05

a murder mystery. If you structure it like

1:13:07

a murder mystery, who

1:13:10

will be killed tonight? that's what we're looking at. So your

1:13:12

funny stories, they just didn't fit. Right.

1:13:14

Sometimes they do when you get

1:13:18

in. Yeah. Or Most commonly, as hard as it

1:13:20

is to hear for former

1:13:22

players, you're not exactly who

1:13:24

you think you are Right. When you

1:13:26

look in the mirror, you are sometimes more annoying.

1:13:29

Maybe it's because you're not eating. You're

1:13:31

not quite as funny. And all

1:13:33

those interviews about you, I

1:13:34

mean, they're telling you the same thing. So

1:13:36

I always feel bad because I get

1:13:38

it. I mean, look at me, I've

1:13:41

been doing this twenty years. I could

1:13:43

point to hundred things that I wish weren't on the show --

1:13:45

Yeah. -- that people mock me about. Yeah.

1:13:47

I'm I'm evolving too. Yeah.

1:13:49

But the biggest

1:13:51

thing I hear is the

1:13:52

winners at it. That's the one that gets me. Right. Right. Oh, he's

1:13:54

getting the winners at it. She's getting the winners at it.

1:13:58

I'm here to tell you There is no such thing as winners at Yeah. There's nobody in

1:14:00

our team that would say, well, probably we do

1:14:02

have a winners at it. Right. Right. We

1:14:05

look at the show. We know

1:14:07

now. We're we're writing it just

1:14:10

in a different way.

1:14:11

When in your in, you know, Lord of the Rings, somebody

1:14:12

wrote

1:14:16

all these scenes and all these

1:14:18

words. And then they hire you to come in and bring this thing to life and bring whatever

1:14:20

you are and make it and that's now

1:14:22

what it is and then somebody edits it

1:14:24

and they

1:14:27

twist a lot. Somebody puts music to it. The only difference is

1:14:29

we don't write anything. We structure a game

1:14:31

and the specifics of what's

1:14:33

gonna happen. The players

1:14:35

write it. Right. And then we go back and say,

1:14:37

now treat it like a mystery. Pull out that clue because that'll give it away. Leave that clue in because

1:14:39

that's fun to nibble on. And now at

1:14:42

the end, you're like, who's it gonna

1:14:44

be? and sometimes

1:14:46

you're right and sometimes you're wrong. Right. I

1:14:48

mean, it's always the sour person in the finale that says,

1:14:50

well, you know you edited and you're like, well, that's

1:14:54

because you didn't win. It's never the winner that goes, wow, you

1:14:56

should Exactly. They were perfect. It's a

1:14:58

little bit of sour grapes for

1:15:01

those guys. I

1:15:02

think my all time favorite

1:15:04

episodes

1:15:04

in survivor are

1:15:06

the merging of

1:15:07

the tribes in the

1:15:10

feast. because very shrewdly, you will

1:15:12

often have alcohol at

1:15:14

that feast. Little wine. Little

1:15:16

wine. Nothing too crazy, but they've not

1:15:18

drank for a couple of weeks. They haven't eaten much either. They all get a little loose. They all get a

1:15:21

little light headed. And just as

1:15:23

you said there, they're not quite

1:15:26

as funny as they think they're they're not quite

1:15:28

as dynamic. You'll get someone that's had

1:15:31

three or four glasses or two

1:15:33

or three glasses and they let rip

1:15:35

and then they'll probably get voted off that day.

1:15:36

It often happens. Yeah. Yeah.

1:15:38

And and you're reminding me that

1:15:40

a lot of

1:15:42

times players will say they

1:15:44

didn't show that I was in

1:15:46

charge of that vote. Yeah. They made it seem like Billy was the mastermind. Right. Yeah.

1:15:49

And that that

1:15:52

is subjective. You know, we

1:15:54

have all the information. We have what they don't have. We have every single person telling us. So

1:15:56

we're gonna go with

1:15:58

what we're told.

1:15:59

Right. But

1:16:00

what we're told It's

1:16:03

possible that you really believe you were the one that influenced

1:16:05

it and what you did was gave Billy the

1:16:07

agency to believe it was

1:16:09

his. Yeah. So that's stuff is a little sticky

1:16:11

because if there's never a an objective

1:16:13

answer -- Yeah. -- to who

1:16:16

was in control -- Yeah. Yeah. -- because

1:16:18

everybody is the hero. Yeah. Of their stores. Sure. Sure. Sure. Sure.

1:16:20

Yeah. Yeah. Well, should we eat the world? Well,

1:16:22

I think so. I'm starting to feel like

1:16:26

one of the survivors. I'm starving. the

1:16:28

world. Every every week on the

1:16:30

podcast we ask people to bring

1:16:34

in something that has an in And you brought something I as

1:16:36

well? Yeah. These are boring, but I know you I

1:16:38

think you like this flavor. That's my favorite. The

1:16:40

black one. You have a choice? I'll

1:16:42

go that one. Okay. Peanut butter. Now

1:16:46

you said you live on these. Well, I'm okay. private. What's the other one? Blueberry. this

1:16:48

one? Yes. Well, what was the

1:16:50

brown thing that you

1:16:51

didn't like, Bill? peanut

1:16:55

butter. I peanut butter, but I don't

1:16:58

like peanut

1:16:58

butter flavored things. I

1:17:00

like eating

1:17:01

peanut butter. He's a

1:17:03

strange man, Jeff. Well, these are

1:17:05

just these aren't peanut butter. See, that's what these bars are. So let's talk about the -- Okay. -- this

1:17:07

bar. This is what's

1:17:10

in your peanut butter

1:17:12

chocolate. three egg whites,

1:17:14

fourteen peanuts, two dates, and no b s. They keep it simple,

1:17:17

fourteen

1:17:20

peanuts. No. Fourteen days. Isn't

1:17:22

this it? No. Fourteen -- Two days. -- fourteen peanuts. Fourteen peanuts and chocolate. Wow.

1:17:25

So so tell you

1:17:27

what's in Main Zone. Three

1:17:30

egg white. Mhmm. I need that because

1:17:32

I'm bulking just now. Okay. Sorry

1:17:34

about that. I've I've started I've

1:17:37

started about six months ago I thought I

1:17:39

wanna get I wanna see how strong I can get

1:17:41

really. Honestly -- Wow. -- and I

1:17:43

started bulking and

1:17:46

I love I love eating. It's really you seen

1:17:48

Game of Thrones, Jeff? Yes. Do you remember the mountain

1:17:50

in Game of Thrones? Yes. So Bill is, like,

1:17:52

I'm trying to reach mountain states, and

1:17:54

I was like, I fully support movement.

1:17:57

I love it. You're doing well. I tell I tell you what, I

1:17:59

love raymond Stone, what I've left

1:17:59

it, and

1:18:02

then, you know,

1:18:04

adding

1:18:05

ten pounds and then adding ten pounds and then

1:18:07

looking back and saying, I am a monster. No. You

1:18:10

are. And now so Yeah.

1:18:12

Just for the audience that may not be watching this, but

1:18:14

just listening. Mhmm. You don't appear to be quite as big as the

1:18:16

monster. Well, I'm getting there again.

1:18:19

You should've seen all six months

1:18:21

ago -- Goony. -- to doony. Well, you're you're obviously in great shape, Jeff. In

1:18:23

that time that you're away making

1:18:28

survival, Is there a gym? Is

1:18:30

there access to a gym for you? Obviously,

1:18:32

not like a gym or building a gym probably

1:18:34

early on. We'd like just a little piece

1:18:37

gear and that's really all I have

1:18:39

is a few pieces of gear,

1:18:40

but I need it because anybody that works out and feels this

1:18:43

way will understand it. I get energy from

1:18:46

doing

1:18:47

a workout. Oh, absolutely. Yeah. I'm not tired

1:18:49

afterwards, but I can get really the lethargic

1:18:51

if I'm not doing it.

1:18:53

So you're the same. Yeah. So I really

1:18:55

do. I only care about survivor when I'm

1:18:57

on location. We're isolated from the

1:18:59

world. Mhmm. I can call my

1:19:01

wife and kids and you know, with the time difference,

1:19:03

we talk for a little bit. Mostly, all I

1:19:05

care about, what's happening on the beach? Yeah. What's

1:19:08

happening? And then I just wanna try

1:19:10

to be my best version of myself.

1:19:12

Yep. And so having

1:19:13

these bars, I will eat easily four bars

1:19:15

a day. No problem. Mhmm. And

1:19:18

I could eat more than that.

1:19:20

Mhmm. So

1:19:22

when you you've been packing a bag to go away for survivor, right, for decades now.

1:19:28

So

1:19:28

though the

1:19:29

these you ship. Right? They're not part of these shit guys. So what are

1:19:31

the essentials? What are the essentials that people wouldn't expect when you're going to

1:19:33

survivor for you? Where you're like Well,

1:19:35

it's changed because in

1:19:39

the beginning state, early days, we lived in the

1:19:41

weirdest place. We lived in tents. Then we

1:19:43

would live in these little tiny,modularly

1:19:45

sort of homes where you

1:19:47

didn't have showers. So you brought all

1:19:49

kinds of stuff. No. Sure. But now we've kind of got it refined even though we're

1:19:51

not on a an amazing resort.

1:19:54

This place in Fiji Mona gives

1:19:56

us everything

1:19:58

we need. So we have our own rooms, we have our

1:19:59

own bathrooms, we have our own showers. I

1:20:02

don't really take much. Right. I mean, I've

1:20:04

had the same

1:20:06

t shirts on location. at

1:20:07

least I have a shirt from

1:20:08

Ethan Dunn who was in survivor Africa,

1:20:10

his grass roots soccer organization. Oh,

1:20:12

yeah. That he gave me

1:20:15

in probably season five. that I've had on

1:20:17

location every single season that I wear when I so if you

1:20:19

saw me on location, I look

1:20:22

like I'm an unhouse person

1:20:24

who's been away for a

1:20:26

while. Yeah. So I really don't

1:20:27

so mostly, you would see

1:20:30

these bars, coffee,

1:20:32

like little

1:20:33

pods. It was obsessed with coffee. KII

1:20:35

didn't find coffee till,

1:20:35

like, six years ago.

1:20:36

Oh, no. I started drinking during

1:20:38

COVID and I have now quit.

1:20:41

You started drinking it six years

1:20:43

ago and you're still going. I quit. I reached I

1:20:45

reached a limit where so it's true. During COVID, I

1:20:47

said to Billy, these

1:20:51

days are so long, like I'm waking up at five in

1:20:53

the morning because I'm not doing anything, and I'm

1:20:55

not feeling tired to go about

1:20:57

until ten o'clock a night. And

1:21:00

Billy said, in in his morning. He said, I have

1:21:02

a little practice that goes on for an hour. I, you know, work out what coffee beans

1:21:04

I'm gonna grind and then I grind

1:21:06

them and I warm up the milk

1:21:09

get everything going. And he said, it takes, you

1:21:11

know, forty minutes to an hour or so. It's a nice little process. You should try it. He sent link to this

1:21:13

Italian little Cartier thing.

1:21:15

I did it. yeah think

1:21:17

i did it first

1:21:18

week, I was

1:21:20

I loved it. The little buzzy feeling wasn't

1:21:22

over the moon about the text, but I was

1:21:24

okay with it. But the buzzy feeling

1:21:26

of -- I mean, spring clean my house.

1:21:28

I don't get the buzzy feeling anymore. So I

1:21:30

sat down and I was like, if you don't get the buzzy feeling, you don't really like the taste. All you're

1:21:33

doing is spiking

1:21:35

your adrenal glands and

1:21:36

he's not doing anything for you. I hate

1:21:39

hearing this. I know I've not drank coffee for probably three months. Yeah. I've I've always drunk

1:21:41

it. I always

1:21:43

will drink it. I'll drink all

1:21:45

eggs. My baby is stubborn now. I'll drink all eggs. I'll wait nobody

1:21:47

telling you you can't. There's no

1:21:50

more to drink. We'll we'll go

1:21:52

for together

1:21:54

and he'll order a latte when we're getting the check.

1:21:56

I'm like, what are you doing? He's like, no, it doesn't keep

1:21:58

me awake. Yeah. It doesn't keep me awake

1:21:59

either. No. But I like that I'm going to sleep right

1:22:02

after espresso, it doesn't bother me. I love it. Yeah. I love the taste of it. I love just having it in my

1:22:04

hand. Do you know what else?

1:22:07

talking about coffee. Yeah. Yeah. You

1:22:10

know what else I learned to love

1:22:12

during COVID? Potato chips. Oh. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

1:22:14

because it was a new one for me.

1:22:16

And now I I will send from Amazon

1:22:19

you know,

1:22:19

the little packs that have, like, six potato chips in them.

1:22:21

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, my cupboard is full of those.

1:22:23

And I find when I

1:22:25

come home in the afternoon, I'm

1:22:27

craving that salt. Yeah. What what's

1:22:29

your favorite flavor? Hawaiian potato

1:22:32

chips. Oh, we were gonna do Who are the

1:22:34

potato chips? I love that. So that's just simple

1:22:36

salt. Nothing else. I'm pretty

1:22:38

sure. Okay. Not enough left. Who does the Narek spa? I'm asking here

1:22:41

if Sandu

1:22:44

doesn't know. that's got egg whites,

1:22:46

almonds, cashews, and dates become that texture. They must whip it.

1:22:50

Do they

1:22:50

whip it? Do you know how to make it? Yes. why not? No. There's

1:22:52

doesn't tell us in one notes. I can tell

1:22:54

you a few things about them if you

1:22:57

want to know. Sure. Yeah. But,

1:22:59

Billy, just to clarify, Jeff does not make

1:23:01

the RXBAR. No. Just like Yeah. No. But I just thought I'd

1:23:03

give you some facts about it. Absolutely. Because I wake

1:23:05

them and all, no.

1:23:07

That's lovely enough. Did

1:23:09

you know that the founders,

1:23:11

Peter Rahel and Jared Smith, started our ex bios and

1:23:16

the kitchen Nope. That sounds like a

1:23:18

good place. No ventricle. No ventricle. k. No consultants.

1:23:20

No Office.

1:23:23

No. All best friends eager

1:23:25

and brogue. They wanted everything about the beginnings upfront

1:23:27

and in the open just like the

1:23:29

ingredients of the

1:23:32

protein bars. isn't

1:23:33

that good? I like that. I've tried

1:23:35

to them to stay

1:23:39

together like this that's the hard

1:23:41

part. Mhmm. Think about it using a sugar or, you know That must be the dish. That must be the

1:23:43

day. Yeah. Let me pick it with

1:23:46

the egg white because that's quite

1:23:48

sticky. I

1:23:50

love the texture of it. And

1:23:52

if you like the texture of a food,

1:23:54

I think you're halfway there. Yeah. Yeah. Such as

1:23:56

a haribo or a Nava's got that

1:23:58

sort of I only black ones. I've tried the blueberry ones. I've tried

1:24:00

the peanut butter ones. They're okay. I keep

1:24:02

the black ones in my fridge. It's

1:24:05

dark chocolate sea

1:24:08

salt almonds. really good.

1:24:10

It's really good. Yeah. That's good stuff. That's Yeah. It's it's a of type

1:24:12

of bars out there on the market,

1:24:14

which I will not mention any names.

1:24:19

where after

1:24:19

the gym, I used to eat them. And then when

1:24:21

I looked at the ingredients, I was like, this

1:24:23

is all

1:24:24

sugar. Yeah.

1:24:26

Just sugar out. makes you feel crappy. These never made me

1:24:28

feel crappy. Same. A great snack. Same.

1:24:30

I'm not ditching these. I just found

1:24:33

eleven ten. I

1:24:34

never feel bad after eating them. But

1:24:36

they will if you're hungry, they

1:24:38

will definitely stop that craving for a

1:24:41

second until you can you know. Then

1:24:43

twelve grams of protein. Yeah. That's pretty good.

1:24:45

Works for somebody who's bulking, like, myself. Right.

1:24:47

Yeah. You're basing it up. Yep. No.

1:24:49

Like, what we do, Jeff, on the friendship onion, is

1:24:51

we score out of ten. Oh, okay.

1:24:53

And and a few

1:24:56

different things. the

1:24:58

first one being flavor. And you can have Ortaste? Yeah. Ortaste. Flavor we had on this.

1:25:00

Well, for me and

1:25:02

you can use decimal points.

1:25:04

me and you can use decimal points

1:25:07

I'm gonna give that a nine point

1:25:09

five below. Wow. You found

1:25:12

something new. Wow.

1:25:14

I think as a bar to

1:25:16

keep you going and it's good for you.

1:25:18

That I don't think you could get much better and you're bulking.

1:25:20

And and bulking is

1:25:22

pretty good. I think

1:25:24

that's I'm gonna buy them for

1:25:26

They're easy to buy, easy to get -- Yep. -- they're everywhere. I love these things too. They're always on my shopping

1:25:28

list. They're always

1:25:31

in my fridge. especially the dark

1:25:33

chocolate one. I can't fault this for taste and or flavor. It's getting there till that turn. What's going

1:25:35

on, Bill? Matt, it's just my

1:25:38

watch. She's talking to me.

1:25:41

I think it's Adi, Eric, powers

1:25:43

to my shop hours. Oh, nice. Well, you'll you'll think that later. Jeff, out of ten?

1:25:48

Yeah. I'm right there. I I

1:25:50

like them. Blueberry is actually my favorite. Blueberry at ten. Ten not ten? Yeah. So

1:25:52

I had to that one for a while.

1:25:54

Sorry. I brought it for you. That's delicious.

1:25:58

If I was

1:25:59

stuck in the desert island, I would Well,

1:26:02

the other thing that I'm out in the RXBAR

1:26:04

is if you

1:26:06

like that really sweet protein bar.

1:26:09

This isn't it. It's not but it's got enough, satisfies it. Well,

1:26:11

I know what you mean. Some of them are so

1:26:13

good. Yeah. When

1:26:15

you eat them. Yeah. And then you're

1:26:17

over and you're like, oh, no. chocolate, which is not good for you. We'll still talk

1:26:19

about the RX bars, but

1:26:21

while we do that, the

1:26:23

next category is aesthetics. The

1:26:25

way that it looks which will also include the, like, labeling of the I like the labeling of

1:26:27

the I like the labeling. I I

1:26:31

will say it's shame

1:26:34

that it's made of plastic. You would think these guys

1:26:36

would be like, you know what? We're cool and groovy. We're

1:26:38

gonna make the packaging out something that that you can

1:26:40

by a degraded little easier. Or it's

1:26:43

edible? Or it's edible. You know, there's a little pachy nowadays that, like, turns into

1:26:48

seeds plantsies have you seen that? Uh-huh. No. So there'll

1:26:50

be something made out of a type of paper and then it says just just put this

1:26:52

in the ground. Yeah. And

1:26:54

encased in the paper are flower

1:26:57

seeds. Amazing. But it's a good design. It's a seven point

1:26:59

six for me

1:27:00

for design. I'll

1:27:01

let I'll let the look

1:27:03

at the bar and

1:27:06

I'm gonna take into the texture even though it's

1:27:09

not aesthetics because I love the texture.

1:27:11

I think the packaging is

1:27:13

fantastic. Tell me what's in it. big

1:27:15

on the front. I'm gonna give that a

1:27:18

nine

1:27:18

point five Oh, you're loving

1:27:20

it. I love

1:27:22

an area. Yeah. I'm right they're with

1:27:24

you. I appreciate this because I feel the message

1:27:26

that that they're sending is -- Mhmm. -- what

1:27:29

they write on

1:27:30

there, which is no BS. Mhmm.

1:27:32

I probably would have I probably would

1:27:34

have experimented with it just to hint more of life, like a little bit more

1:27:40

pop. Mhmm. But

1:27:40

if I were going with the no BSI

1:27:42

might have ended up right back here, which is no simple color scheme. This is brown and orange is the offset,

1:27:45

and that's it. Minimal

1:27:47

white lettering. Yep. Here's a

1:27:49

little bit of trivia for you because I've

1:27:51

been eating RXBARs for years and this happens every time. Every time

1:27:53

I eat an RXBAR, I will eventually turn it into the map

1:27:56

of

1:27:56

Spain. Always

1:27:58

every single

1:27:59

time. So if you hold the corner and you

1:28:02

keep beating, there's Spain. That's funny. You guys

1:28:04

do that? Yeah. Thanks. Snaps. That's where

1:28:06

my mom and dad live. just on the Here's another

1:28:08

little fact. In two thousand and seventeen,

1:28:10

those two guys that I mentioned to

1:28:13

you, Peter Rahal

1:28:15

and Jared Smith, sold it to

1:28:18

catalogs for six hundred million dollars. They were in the

1:28:20

kitchen with three egg

1:28:22

whites and a couple of

1:28:24

nuts. Next thing in

1:28:26

order to get three hundred million dollars each. Hey, Billy. That's three hundred million dollars each.

1:28:28

Well, we need to

1:28:31

think of something. Yeah. Yeah.

1:28:34

Well, how's it going on the on the

1:28:36

what? I'll look up to the invention. Well, that's going okay.

1:28:38

And the time machine's coming on or no? Okay.

1:28:40

Wait,

1:28:42

have we done the last

1:28:44