0:00

Welcome to the piked In Massacre, a production

0:02

of iHeartRadio and Katie Studios.

0:06

Nine nine

0:10

one.

0:12

Okay harn Hongstead.

0:15

It was an unimaginable crimes

0:18

all over the house. It

0:20

was the second biggest mass murder in twenty

0:22

sixteen, behind the Pulse night Club shooting.

0:25

Eight people dead, all from

0:27

the same family.

0:28

It would become the largest criminal investigation

0:31

in Ohio's history.

0:32

Pike County Sheriff's requested state help

0:35

immediately after they got word.

0:37

In the early morning of April twenty second, twenty

0:40

sixteen, eight members of the Rodent

0:42

family were brutally murdered, shot

0:44

to death execution style in their homes.

0:48

Eight victims, thirty two

0:50

gunshot wounds, three

0:52

children left alive. At the scenes in

0:56

This Is the piked In Massacre.

0:59

Believed there was a shooter or shooters

1:01

out there somewhereever they are.

1:03

They were trying to possibly white out something.

1:05

Family episode

1:08

one Daddy's Playing Zombie.

1:13

Piked In, Ohio is a rural town located

1:15

on the Seyota River just sixty miles

1:17

south of Columbus. It's home to twenty

1:19

two hundred residents and the people

1:21

of piked And say that because the town is so small,

1:24

neighbors really look out for each other and treat

1:26

each other like family.

1:33

It was just it was a

1:35

good, wonderful area to

1:37

grow up in. It was we lived

1:39

in the country, and you know,

1:41

we rode horses on the

1:43

road, We rode bikes to each

1:46

other's houses, and we played.

1:48

You know, the kids in the neighborhood played together

1:50

all the time.

1:51

I slept the whole time I was a kid with

1:53

my window wide open. There's

1:56

no way you could do that now, there's

1:58

no way. This place was one wonderful everybody

2:02

took care of everybody, and

2:04

now it's like a

2:06

whole different place.

2:12

The Roden family lived in piped In for generations.

2:14

In fact, this close knit family all lived

2:16

within miles of each other and were a beloved fixture

2:19

in the community. It's part of what makes this

2:21

story so heartbreaking and disturbing. Eight

2:24

members of the Rodent family, ranging

2:26

in age from sixteen to forty four, were

2:28

murdered, each

2:30

killed execution style over one night

2:33

in four different locations. The

2:35

only known witnesses the three small children

2:38

left alive at the scenes, the

2:41

Rodent family was literally being hunted.

2:47

I'm Courtney Armstrong, a television producer

2:49

who helped make a documentary about the case

2:51

for NBC Universal's Oxygen Network

2:53

in twenty nineteen. Since it aired,

2:55

the team and I at Kat's Studios haven't stopped

2:57

thinking about the case. With trials

3:00

on the horizon, there are new details and theories

3:02

to explore. By

3:05

all accounts, April twenty second, twenty sixteen,

3:07

was an ordinary spring day in rural Pike

3:09

County, but that would be far from

3:12

the truth. Here's

3:14

Barbara longtime picked in resident.

3:16

I'll never forget that day. I'll

3:19

never forget that day. I had gone into

3:21

the office at the high school to pick

3:24

Brittany up for an appointment.

3:27

And when I walked in, they had a TV

3:29

on and everyone in there

3:32

was sitting with their mouths hanging open,

3:34

and I was like, what's going on in

3:37

here? And the secretaries

3:40

said, my god, there's been a shooting.

3:43

They said six people were killed,

3:45

and she said, we are very worried because

3:47

little Chris Rodent didn't show up today

3:50

and we think he might be one

3:53

of them. Everyone was

3:55

just in shock.

3:58

So little Chris law enforcement because

4:00

I couldn't find him. There was some speculation

4:02

early on that he might have been involved.

4:08

For the residents of piked In there was little more than

4:10

confusion. At this point. People knew there

4:12

was a shooting and that Chris Roden Junior,

4:15

the sixteen year old freshman at Piketon High

4:17

was missing. Where was the team.

4:21

It was at the home of Chris Roden Senior that

4:24

the nightmare began. Chris

4:27

Rodin Senior was known to be a strong, hard working

4:29

family man.

4:30

He was, you know, a great father.

4:33

He was a good man, just like the rest of the guys

4:35

you know in that family. He would do

4:37

anything for anybody.

4:40

He and Dana Roden were married for twenty two

4:43

years, and although they divorced, they remained

4:45

close, so close that Chris

4:47

Senior had recently bought Dana a home on the

4:49

same road he lived on Union Hill

4:51

Road. He did it so they could stay close

4:53

to their children. Chris

4:57

Senior's cousin, Gary Roden, was more like a

4:59

brother to him and often stated his place

5:02

little. Chris's aunt Bobby Joe, who also

5:04

lived nearby, was the first to make the gruesome

5:06

discovery at seven forty nine am when

5:09

she came to feed the dogs at Chris Senior's house.

5:13

Yes, yes,

5:17

over, we

5:24

walked to the no, boll Okay,

5:27

my brother Hall's dead, Yes,

5:30

fly all over the house. Okay,

5:32

my brother, look like I'll

5:35

beat the hell out of them.

5:39

Patriarch of the family, Chris Rodin was dead.

5:42

He looked like he'd been beaten to death. His

5:44

cousin Gary, who was staying with Chris, was also

5:46

dead.

5:47

Madam, Yeah, what's

5:49

her name?

5:50

Chris Rodan gry Rode and Roman

5:55

first und and it looks like a dad. Think

5:57

you're both dead, I think, the boy

5:59

said. If I told her speak to stalk out of them.

6:02

Okay, did there anybody else in the house?

6:05

I don't know us Okay.

6:06

So dor when was on here? But I

6:08

hope he found went in

6:11

and then Leney on the floor.

6:13

Bobby, I needed to get out of the house.

6:15

And the way he done the house now.

6:18

Okay, just stay out of the house. So why anybody

6:20

going in there? Okay? Yeah, all right,

6:22

we don't take any on the way. Okay, I

6:25

thank you here, mother, Yeah,

6:43

suspatch.

6:44

This forty year old Christopher Roden was the

6:46

only one of the eight family members who

6:48

was shot somewhere other than they had.

6:50

He had multiple.

6:51

Gunshot ones to the head, torso

6:53

and extrumins.

6:54

We found out. You know that the news broke over

6:57

night and saw

6:59

the email. I saw the alerts, you

7:02

know, the initial news coverage, and I knew this

7:04

was We all knew this was a big deal.

7:07

James Pilcher as an investigative reporter

7:09

who was assigned to cover this story.

7:11

Chris Roden may

7:13

have been awake when the intruders

7:15

came in, at least there's

7:18

some indication of that. He

7:20

was shot nine times, but he

7:22

was shot in the forearm, which means

7:25

which seems to mean that he

7:28

may have raised his arm in defense. His

7:30

cousin Gary got shot

7:33

twice in the head and once in the face, and

7:36

one was execution style, and I had a muzzle

7:38

stain. It was that close to his temple.

7:42

Even for a multiple murder scene, this stood

7:44

out as being particularly violent. Wood

7:46

fragments found on Chris's body indicate

7:48

he was dragged through the house. Blood

7:50

was everywhere. Was it a robbery,

7:53

a serial killer, a random thrill kill?

7:56

And if it wasn't random, why were these two men

7:58

targeted? I

8:02

spoke with Mike Allen, criminal defense attorney

8:04

from Ohio. Are you familiar? Are

8:07

you able to talk about the

8:09

scenes themselves?

8:10

You know, if you look at it, and it's all

8:13

from the autopsy reports. Chris

8:15

Senior's autopsy report

8:17

says that they believe that he was awake when he

8:19

was confronted by at least one person

8:21

with a gun. He got nine

8:24

gun shot wounds, and

8:26

one of them apparently was a defensive

8:28

wound to his right forearm that shattered

8:30

the bone. He was also shot

8:33

in the torso and cheek, according

8:35

to that report. Then

8:38

Chris Senior's cousin Gary,

8:40

and they're all kind of related here. He was

8:42

shot twice in the head and once in the face.

8:45

One of the shots. The reports indicate

8:48

that the gun was pressed to the

8:50

side of his head, leaving

8:53

a gunpowder mark that's called

8:55

a muzzle stain. I mean, those

8:58

kind of injuries leaves

9:00

no doubt that this was an

9:02

intentional or these all were intentional

9:05

killings, kind of designed to send

9:07

a message to someone.

9:08

The muzzle mark sticks in my mind.

9:11

You have to be obviously arms

9:13

reach, I mean, you are locking eyes with

9:15

the victim, it would seem Does that paint

9:18

any kind of picture to or indicate

9:20

to officers or attorneys anything?

9:23

Sure it does, and maybe even

9:25

closer than arm's length, I mean, maybe just

9:28

inches. That indicates that

9:31

the shot was fired right on top

9:34

of the person, and it indicates

9:36

to me, at least, especially when you have the

9:38

number of shots like that here, that

9:40

somebody was trying to send a message. I

9:43

don't think there can be any doubt about that. It's

9:45

personal. I mean, it was personal, and I

9:48

think that's what that demonstrates.

9:54

We're going to take a quick break here. We'll be back

9:57

in a moment. At

10:06

this point, Bobby Chose sees two people are dead

10:08

by twelve gunshot wounds. While

10:10

waiting desperately for police to arrive, she

10:12

makes her way over to her nephew, Frankie's

10:15

house. She

10:17

wanted to get some help and to tell him what had

10:19

happened to his father and uncle whose body

10:21

she had just found. Frankie

10:26

Rodin was Chris Senior and Dana's oldest

10:28

son. The twenty year old was a

10:30

father to two boys, three year old

10:32

and six month old. Like

10:35

his parents, Frankie was a hard worker.

10:38

He loved fishing, hunting, and demolition derby,

10:41

but nothing so much as his family

10:43

and his fiance, nineteen year old Hannah Gilly.

10:46

Hannah Gilly was on the homecoming court in high

10:48

school, and at that time she told friends

10:51

she planned to go to college, get a business degree, and

10:53

open a daycare.

10:54

Frankie and Hannah wanted a lot

10:56

of kids. They had a bright future.

11:00

The young family lived together just up the street

11:02

from Chris Senior, also on Union Hill

11:04

Road. They were looking forward to getting

11:06

married soon. Here's

11:08

reporter Jeff Winkler recounting the details

11:10

of what happened that night based on his reporting.

11:13

So, after Bobby Joe made

11:15

the call to nine one one, she

11:18

went to Frankie's house

11:20

near right nearby, and the person

11:22

who came to the door was Frankly's three year old son

11:25

and was as

11:27

the police reports and newspaper reports

11:31

showed, he was, you know, covered in blood,

11:34

and he, like any

11:36

three year old, he sort of didn't fully understand

11:38

what was going on. And he told his aunt that, you

11:41

know, his father was playing

11:43

zombie in the bedroom, and that's

11:45

because the family were fans

11:47

of The Walking Dead, so you know, was

11:51

in there with his father playing zombie,

11:56

which is, you know, absolutely

11:58

heartbreaking.

12:01

Bobby picked up her nephew and made her way inside.

12:04

She finds two more victims.

12:09

Frankie was shot three times in the head. His

12:11

fiancee, Hannah Gilly, was shot five times

12:13

in total, with one shot to her left eye.

12:16

They were both in bed with their six month old baby.

12:19

Thankfully the infant was spared. Meanwhile,

12:27

and this is all happening. Around eight am on

12:29

April twenty second, Bobby Joe

12:31

calls their brother James. She's in hysterics.

12:35

There's now two murder scenes, four

12:37

people dead, twenty gunshot wounds,

12:40

two children left alive. At the scenes,

12:48

James immediately goes over to his sister Dana's

12:50

house to check on her and the remaining kids.

12:57

Dana Rudin was a nurse known for her gregarious

12:59

nature and loving smile. She'd met

13:01

Chris Rhadin Senior when she was just in high

13:03

school and it was love at first sight. Even

13:07

though they divorced twenty two years later, they

13:09

remained very close together.

13:12

The pair had three beautiful children, twenty

13:14

year old Frankie, Hannah May and

13:16

little Chris.

13:18

Good hearted, a lot of fun, you

13:20

know, always laughing, cracking up.

13:23

She was a very very good person.

13:25

She sent me a text she said,

13:28

my grandbabies here and

13:30

I said, well, congratulations, I said,

13:32

she's beautiful. What did hanname

13:35

name her? She said, Caylie

13:37

May, and I said, that's

13:40

so pretty. And that was the last, you

13:42

know, the last thing I ever

13:44

heard from Dana.

13:46

This particular April seemed extra special

13:48

because Hannah Ma had just given birth to her second

13:50

daughter five days prior. Just weeks

13:52

before that, Dana threw Hannah May a big

13:54

baby shower at their new house. The

13:56

pictures from the shower show what a happy celebration

13:59

it was. Sadly, James,

14:01

Dana's brother, was about to enter yet one

14:04

more unimaginable scene. Dana

14:07

and her nineteen year old daughter, Hannah May were

14:09

both dead. Like

14:13

the rest of the family. They were shot execution

14:15

style, Dana three times

14:17

in the right side of her head and once under her chin.

14:21

Hannah was shot twice in the head, lying in bed

14:23

with her new born daughter, just five

14:25

days old. The infant

14:27

was spared alive, and thankfully, Hannah's

14:29

older daughter, Sophia, just two years old

14:32

at the time, was not at the house at

14:34

the time of the murderers. This

14:37

brings us back to when Dana's son, the high school

14:40

freshman Chris Junior, was nowhere to be found.

14:43

It took detectives several hours to locate

14:45

him, but Finally, little Chris was found

14:48

in the home with his mother, Dana and his sister

14:50

Hannah May. He'd been shot four

14:52

times in the head. There's

14:58

now seven people dead, thirty

15:00

one gunshot wounds, and three

15:02

children left alive. At the scenes, the

15:05

once small and sleepy town became the epicenter

15:08

for grizzly crime and the subsequent

15:10

complex murder investigation. When

15:13

it was all said and done, two families would be

15:15

destroyed and the town would never be the same. Here's

15:21

Jeff Winkler. It was a long form article

15:24

he'd written on the case that originally piqued

15:26

our interest.

15:27

I'm a writer and journalist based

15:29

in Flyover, so I cover a lot of stuff

15:32

that happens away from the coasts. The

15:35

Rodent case. I remember seeing

15:38

coverage of it in twenty sixteen

15:41

as it was happening on live TV,

15:43

and there was a helicopter flying

15:45

over the property, and it

15:47

was just one of those things that seemed like it was straight

15:49

out of southern noir. The

15:52

crime is as complex as it

15:54

is gruesome, because all the victims

15:56

except for one, were found on the same sort

15:59

of back road and piked him,

16:01

and they were all found gunned down

16:03

on the same night and all

16:05

had gunshots to the head. This

16:08

was an incredibly well executed

16:12

execution of several people.

16:15

Here again is criminal defense attorney, former

16:17

prosecutor and judge Mike Allen.

16:20

Did this area like a ton of bricks. I mean,

16:22

with the local media down here, we're

16:24

all over this thing. I mean, like white

16:26

on Rice. So yeah, it's a big deal.

16:28

Do you have any theories, because I've spoken to people

16:30

and they're all, I guess, just theories. But why

16:33

do you spare the children? Is that some

16:35

line a killer won't cross or

16:38

what does that tell you?

16:39

Yeah, and it's a really good question.

16:42

I guess it shows that I don't

16:44

know, the killers wanted

16:46

to demonstrate that they

16:48

have some humanity left

16:51

in and just would

16:53

not kill infants. I

16:56

guess that's small consolation, but I

16:59

don't know. It probably is some kind of code

17:01

thing. But they did find

17:03

it within their hearts to spare the

17:05

the infants and the children. You know, as

17:07

brazen and as violent as these killings

17:09

were, I guess they just couldn't

17:12

bring themselves to do it to

17:14

small children and an infant.

17:17

Yeah, a five day old, I mean that's yeah,

17:20

that's crazy. For

17:28

the quiet town. The scene was unreal.

17:31

Nearly seven hours after the first bodies

17:34

were found, at one twenty six pm on

17:36

April twenty second, a final fatal

17:38

discovery.

17:41

Yeah, I need they as come out

17:43

to blast of seven ninety nine Black

17:45

Force.

17:46

Okay, it's

17:49

all this stuff.

17:49

It's on the news. I just

17:52

found just found my cousins with against

17:54

yet one.

17:56

Okay,

18:02

I'll be saying out by the very white Donaldson,

18:07

Donald Stone, Dolph Stone.

18:11

Yeah, I'm gonna what's his name,

18:14

Kenneth.

18:15

Roden, Kenneth Roden dear.

18:20

Okay, sir, are you out of the house.

18:23

I'm out of the house right now. I just

18:25

went in horr nighty and

18:28

chick right up, and

18:30

I was saying he had a gun shot win.

18:32

Okay, Sure we're gonna get repubing down thirteen.

18:34

Okay, all

18:37

right, sick mare.

18:43

A few miles down Union Hill Road was Chris

18:45

Roden Senior's brother Kenneth. The

18:48

forty four year old was shot once through his

18:50

right eye. Kenneth's

18:54

cousin, Donald Stone, went to check

18:56

on Kenneth after hearing about the murderers

18:59

of their six other family members. He'd

19:01

failed to hear from Kenneth that day here's

19:04

Jeff Winkler.

19:05

There were a lot of breaking news

19:07

moments during the first day, and

19:11

the details just kept piling up and piling

19:14

up, and more police, more law

19:16

enforcement would show up, and the

19:18

body count got

19:21

larger and larger. And then I think

19:23

the real sort of twist and the real

19:26

sort of what the heck has happened

19:28

in a moment was when, you know, nearly

19:30

seven.

19:31

Hours after the first bodies are found, at

19:33

around one point thirty pm, there

19:36

is finally another body

19:38

of Kenneth and he was found as

19:41

well as the others, as you know, shot execution

19:44

style, and in this case,

19:46

he was.

19:47

Covered with dollar bills that were strewn about

19:49

his body.

19:50

And it's just sort of he just got

19:53

it.

19:53

I mean, you can't, you can't make

19:55

this up.

20:03

Let's stop here for another quick break. We'll

20:05

be back in a moment. By

20:15

the time officials released the names of the eight victims

20:17

piked in residence were reeling.

20:19

You know, they had snuck in in the night

20:22

and committed this these murders,

20:24

and nobody had

20:26

a clue.

20:27

About you know.

20:30

Who or why, and

20:34

that's really scary.

20:35

There were rumors about who had

20:38

done the crime everywhere online

20:41

in the coffee shops. You know,

20:43

amongst the police, I mean everyone was

20:45

talking about who could have done it and why they

20:48

would have done it.

20:52

Within two days of the murder, officials

20:54

make another shocking announcement.

20:56

I'm all, let

20:57

sure, thank

20:59

you very much.

21:00

This is Mike DeWine, then Attorney General

21:02

of Ohio, at a news conference on April

21:05

twenty fourth, twenty sixteen.

21:07

Let me go ahead, and I think it's okay

21:09

for us to confirm that

21:11

we did find marijuana in

21:14

three three locations.

21:16

Well, there's a grow operations.

21:22

Here's Jeff Shane. We worked together on the case,

21:24

and he reached out to Jody Barr, an investigative

21:27

reporter who was working in Cincinnati at the time

21:29

of the murders.

21:30

Let's like run through some of the theories,

21:32

like what people were saying might have happened.

21:35

So there were a.

21:36

Lot of theories.

21:37

Jody has followed the crime and investigation

21:40

for years.

21:41

We got all of these tips in and we're trying

21:43

to make sense of these tips, vet them see

21:45

if there's anything that could indicate who did

21:47

it, why they did it, what caused

21:49

someone to kill eight people of the same family.

21:52

So, you know, the one theory that sort

21:54

of became the prevailing

21:57

idea of what might have happened. Here was

21:59

the drug cartail theory, and that

22:02

came about because, you know, hours after the murders,

22:05

Attorney General Mike DeWine and Pike

22:07

County Sheriff Charlie Readers standing at a

22:09

press conference and the Wine tells the

22:11

public that they found commercial

22:14

grow operations at three of the four crime

22:16

scenes.

22:17

Another theory was that the murders could

22:19

have been the result of a dispute with another family

22:21

in the area. Here's Jodi Barr again.

22:23

We had gotten word that apparently Chris

22:26

Junior had some sort of road

22:28

rage or some sort of incident with

22:30

another family in the area some

22:33

days before this, and there were

22:35

some messages, social

22:37

media messages exchanged that could

22:40

have indicated a possible motive.

22:42

So that was one theory. As I

22:44

got on the ground over there and you started

22:47

talking to some of these family members, and you talk

22:49

to some of the neighbors, some of the people who knew the Rodents,

22:52

it became clear that either

22:55

people knew or had a very

22:57

good idea about what happened, but they

22:59

absolutely would never say

23:02

it because I think they

23:04

were they were afraid because at that

23:06

point in time, whoever did this had

23:08

not been arrested. There have been no persons

23:11

of interest named. So you

23:13

know, if you lived in that area, man, it was hush hush,

23:15

you were just kind of walking around

23:17

looking over your shoulder. It's seeing with

23:19

some of these people not knowing, you

23:22

know, who could be next? Who did it?

23:27

This is again Jeff Winkler.

23:29

The majority of those theories rested on, you

23:31

know, as a cartel. It was a cartel hit

23:34

because the family was growing marijuana

23:36

on their property. You know, was it a rifle

23:39

marijuana farm?

23:40

The area?

23:41

Was it where the killings related to

23:44

the family disputes

23:46

that were going on with various members of

23:49

adjacent families and no

23:52

one, no one quite knew, but they all had

23:54

a bunch of theories.

23:59

With the town living in fear, investigators worked

24:01

around the clock to bring the killers to justice.

24:03

Mike Dwine is and again

24:06

I know him, but he's not a friend or anything,

24:08

but he really is

24:10

a professional and he was a professional

24:12

prosecutor. I mean that's

24:14

how he started his political

24:16

life. And he ran

24:18

this thing like a prosecutor or

24:21

a law enforcement officer would. And

24:23

I'll tell you what there is just no

24:25

way that the sheriff's

24:30

office or the prosecutor's

24:32

office up there could have handled this thing

24:35

by themselves. And that's no knock on

24:37

them, It's just that they don't have the

24:39

resources for something like this.

24:41

There were in some of the

24:43

news conferences sheriff

24:45

reader without telling people

24:48

to arm themselves as a precaution.

24:51

In a small county like that, and

24:54

just the horrific

24:56

nature of these things, I don't

24:59

know that that would have not been good

25:02

advice. I mean obviously, and they'd have to

25:04

do it legally with a concealed carry

25:06

license and the legal

25:08

right to carry a firearm. But people

25:11

just didn't know what the heck was going on up

25:13

there. I mean, you know, you had all the different

25:15

theories bouncing around, and it's

25:18

a rural county up there. So

25:20

if I were living out there and I

25:23

was legally able to carry a firearm,

25:25

I think I would.

25:32

For two years, not a single arrest was made.

25:38

How could the largest massacre in Ohio's history,

25:40

with so much blood, so many bullets,

25:43

and so many victims still be unsolved.

25:46

The questions abound, Who's doing this?

25:48

Is it many people? Is it won? How did they

25:50

get away with it If the scene was so messy,

25:53

how did they clean up? The

25:55

four crime scenes all had dead bodies, but the

25:57

ms were different. Chris and Gary

26:00

is the most violent and bloody. Two of the

26:02

other ones had children left alive.

26:04

And in the fourth, Kenneth was found with dollar bills

26:07

all over him, with the victims all

26:09

being shot at close range. We know that the killers

26:11

and victims were eye to eye. How

26:13

did nobody hear anything? Could

26:16

it be a cover up? And would another

26:18

family be next? And

26:21

then on November thirteenth, twenty

26:23

eighteen, well, good afternoon,

26:26

we finally got an update on the case.

26:28

We promised that the day would come when

26:30

the rest would be made in the

26:33

Pike County massacred.

26:34

This is Mike DeWine, the state's then attorney

26:36

general. He's at a press conference

26:39

yesterday.

26:40

A Pike County grand jury and

26:42

died four individuals for aggravated

26:45

murder with death

26:47

penalty specifications for

26:50

leglarly committing this

26:53

heartless, ruthless, cold

26:55

blood and.

26:55

Murder for

27:00

the town of piked In with the alleged killers

27:03

behind bars, the nightmare may

27:05

have been over, but the mystery

27:08

has just begun. Who

27:13

is this family of alleged killers

27:19

next time on the Piked In Massacre. Piked

27:24

In Massacre is executive produced by Stephanie

27:26

Leidecker and me Courtney Armstrong. Editing

27:29

and sound designed by executive producer Jared

27:31

Aston. Additional producing by

27:33

Jeff Shane and Andrew Becker. The

27:35

Piked In Massacre is a production of iHeartRadio

27:38

and Kati Studios. For more

27:40

podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio

27:42

app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen

27:45

to your favorite shows.