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extra hour of content daily It

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is Monday June

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17th 2024

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my name is Sam Cedar. This is the

0:27

five-time award-winning majority report We

0:29

are broadcasting live Steps

0:32

from the industrially ravaged Gowanus Canal

0:34

in the heartland of America downtown

0:37

Brooklyn USA on

0:41

the program today Astra Taylor writer Documentarian

0:44

co-founder of the debt collective and

0:47

Leah hunt Hendrix Co-founder

0:49

of the way to win and the philanthropy

0:51

network solidaire authors

0:56

of Solidarity the past

0:58

present and future

1:00

of a world-changing idea Also

1:04

on the program today net yahoo,

1:06

dispands his war cabinet after

1:10

last week's dual exit

1:14

That yahoo also claims no pods

1:16

in the Rafa assault which the

1:18

u.s. Says isn't happening anyways AP

1:24

documents how Israel Israel's

1:29

assault on Gaza has eliminated tens

1:32

of tens of Entire

1:36

extended Palestinian

1:38

families hundreds

1:41

of members of families US Executive

1:47

pay raises at the fastest rate

1:49

in 14 years Polls

1:53

show Trump convictions hurting him with

1:55

independence Republicans

1:59

pass a culture war-laden $895 billion

2:01

defense bill with 199 Democrats voting

2:03

against. They'll all

2:12

vote for it as soon as it's just

2:14

about spending money to kill other people and

2:17

not about silly culture war things.

2:23

Maryland governor pardons 178,000 marijuana convictions. And Bowman's

2:25

campaign is now facing

2:34

seven times more in

2:37

outside expenditures in what

2:39

is shaping up to be a $20 million dollar

2:44

primary of just outside expenditures.

2:49

Surgeon general calls on Congress

2:51

to label social media dangers

2:54

for teens, or

2:56

dangerous I should say, for teens, can

3:00

confirm. Alex Jones

3:03

must liquidate his personal assets but

3:05

is allowed to maintain info wars

3:08

extensively to pay off the

3:10

Sandy Hook families. All

3:12

this and more on today's

3:17

majority report. Welcome

3:19

ladies and gentlemen, it

3:25

is the beginning of the week. What

3:28

would you call that, Emma Vigeland? Monday

3:30

Funday. That's right. Monday Funday,

3:32

that's what we call it around here. Just

3:36

to give you a sense of where we're

3:39

at, we are 10 days away from the

3:41

first debate. We will be covering that live.

3:44

We will have to be doing a little bit of

3:47

a dance-y, some fancy

3:49

footwork because sometimes the

3:51

specific company that is

3:53

carrying this debate gets

3:57

a little proprietary. despite

4:00

the fact that a a

4:02

presidential debate should be fair use

4:05

uh... in my estimation regardless

4:07

if anything if anything and uh...

4:11

secondly as opposed to just being

4:13

uh... open-sourced the

4:16

idea that a uh... it's

4:20

not a shock every day out of this but

4:22

i mean at the idea that a corporation uh...

4:25

could could own the one

4:28

of two uh... debates

4:30

is is pretty uh... this

4:32

indicative disturbing and indicative of everything

4:34

else uh... with our political system

4:37

but i will also add we

4:40

will have a running commentary which

4:42

is known as uh... adding

4:44

value in changing the underlying

4:47

product uh... and

4:49

creating uh... a uh... wholly distinct

4:51

derivative because i can assure you

4:54

there is no where else in the world

4:58

you will find am

5:00

a big land and sam cedar talking

5:03

over the uh... and

5:05

uh... mad bradley to it's

5:07

unique talking over them that will

5:09

not happen anywhere else and

5:12

potentially with the help of some beverages

5:14

that's right that's what also the unique

5:16

nature of the product that we're putting

5:18

out there yes i mean there's probably

5:20

a lot of like commentators who will

5:22

be drunk while they comment on this

5:24

but they won't be us exactly

5:27

we will be us drunk uh...

5:29

as commentators over this uh...

5:32

will have some fun i'll see you at the trail

5:38

speaking of the trail the

5:41

campaign is uh... cranking

5:44

up uh... donald trump is out

5:46

there he's made his triumphant return

5:48

to congress where

5:50

all of the uh...

5:53

congress people who were literally

5:55

pooping their pants on

5:58

january six the

6:00

republicans who were guys

6:03

like uh... josh holly running through

6:05

the uh... the the the place

6:08

uh... republican lawmakers who

6:10

were lying on the floor

6:12

hiding under the pews of

6:15

congress calling

6:17

and saying goodbye to their families welcomed

6:21

it donald trump back as if not only

6:23

none of that happened but that he had

6:25

no partner and

6:28

so now is on the campaign trail

6:30

he's at turning points action don't

6:32

know if he followed uh... the

6:34

woman basically chastising all of these

6:36

supposed college students for thinking about

6:39

having sex or uh... or

6:42

if uh... he you know uh...

6:45

came after uh... you know

6:47

or or before someone who was uh...

6:50

looking out at the completely white audience

6:54

probably significantly male dominated in saying

6:56

that we gotta get done with

6:59

these identity politics but

7:01

here is uh... donald trump a

7:03

delivering his remarks uh...

7:05

to turning points action in

7:08

michigan the numbers

7:10

are crazy the food numbers

7:12

there energy numbers yet

7:15

joe biden has no plan second we should

7:17

just say gas

7:20

numbers are actually really down uh...

7:22

the cost of uh... of gas uh...

7:25

relatively speaking uh... and

7:29

even uh... of food prices are dropping

7:31

now even the food numbers even the

7:33

food numbers and get really is uh...

7:36

a big macs it's it's like it's

7:38

like uh... lucy obluse not knowing the

7:40

price of a banana thinking it cost

7:42

ten dollars on the food numbers yes

7:46

as if like he doesn't get all his food

7:48

whole wholesale by one of his many uh... workers

7:50

but anyway the energy

7:52

numbers yet

7:55

joe biden has no plan he's

7:57

got absolutely no plan he

7:59

doesn't even know the word inflation means i don't think

8:01

if you gave him a quiz i

8:04

think you should take a cognitive test like

8:06

i did i took a cognitive test and

8:08

i a dot karate dot

8:11

karate johnson does

8:14

everyone know ronnie johnson congressman from

8:16

texas positive one second now there

8:19

may be some confusion that

8:21

uh... the audience has about

8:24

uh... doctor ronnie johnson because

8:27

he's referring to the former uh...

8:30

white house physician uh...

8:33

and uh... so that's the doc

8:35

part in the uh... the ronnie

8:37

is his first name correct johnson

8:39

is a made-up name not the

8:41

name of doctor ronnie jackson who

8:44

uh... is uh...

8:47

and so i just wanted to to put

8:49

that in at that here is

8:54

arguing that joe biden is take cognitive

8:56

test because he doesn't even know what

8:58

the word re inflation means and

9:01

he is trumpeting proof

9:03

that he took a cognitive test from

9:05

a doctor he's just getting

9:08

the doctor's name wrong but it

9:10

happens poetic dot

9:13

karate dot

9:15

karate johnson does

9:18

everyone know ronnie johnson congressman from

9:20

texas he was the white house

9:22

doctor and he

9:24

said i was the healthiest president he feels a

9:26

history so i like to very much of the

9:29

immediately but he said if i didn't need

9:31

junk food i would live to two hundred

9:34

thousand positive something immediately wet he

9:36

needs immediately everybody

9:40

healthiest president he feels in history so i

9:42

like to very much of me immediately

9:44

but instead of i didn't eat junk food i

9:47

would live to two hundred that's what he said

9:51

but i said ronnie should i take a test he

9:53

said well you know it's waltry to sort of

9:56

a public hospital if you don't do well they're

9:59

gonna find out about it is that well you know

10:01

i like i'm a smart person uh...

10:03

how tough is that he said it gets very tough as

10:05

you get to the middle of it and

10:09

i did something that he's never seen done i'd

10:12

a state i got i

10:14

don't know okay uh...

10:18

it's quite possible that uh... uh... some

10:20

of this is true uh... but

10:23

the interesting thing about uh... taking

10:25

doctor ronnie johnson's word for this

10:28

who is now a member of

10:30

congress in fact his fellow congresspeople

10:32

are pretty pissed that he is

10:35

on the intel committee and

10:37

one of the reasons why they're pissed

10:40

days on the intel uh... committee is

10:43

because they're a little bit concerned

10:45

about his history at

10:47

the uh... white house one

10:49

of the elements of its history at the white

10:51

house was that he was running a pill mill

10:54

yeah ronnie jackson

10:57

that's his real name or maybe that was

10:59

the most forgot that that seems wrong at

11:02

under fire over white house

11:04

prescriptions uh... he was handing

11:06

out all sorts of pills

11:09

and this is i should say this is inspector general

11:11

of the department of defense uh...

11:15

the report was a result of

11:17

a multi-year investigation after the defense

11:19

department received complaints in twenty eighteen

11:22

concerning unnamed senior military medical

11:24

officer engaging in quote improper

11:26

medical practices and found the

11:29

units pharmacy operations had severe

11:31

insistemic problems he

11:33

was running a pill mill in

11:35

the white house to

11:38

be fair he

11:41

was also a recipient he wasn't

11:43

just the doctor he was a

11:45

client to ronnie

11:47

jackson on this is from cnn made

11:49

sexual comments and drank alcohol and took

11:52

ambien while working is the white house

11:54

of the nation yeah i would

11:56

say like it's one thing to take ambien

11:59

when you're going to sleep but it's

12:01

another thing to be popping these things

12:03

while you're handing out pills to everybody

12:05

else. Are you relaxed enough to give

12:07

me a cognitive test

12:09

run? Oh yeah, you're gonna live to 200.

12:13

You're gonna live to 200. I

12:17

have never seen anybody

12:19

do this on a cognitive

12:21

test. Man, you're just crushing

12:25

it bro. Now crush this

12:27

bitch. Yeah, it's physician

12:29

not priest, okay? Speaking of crushing,

12:32

this stuff is much better than you

12:34

scored it. When you crush it? Totally.

12:38

Yeah. My good... I

12:41

like this guy immediately

12:43

when I get into the White

12:45

House. Immediately. Right.

12:48

I do like the admission there where he said

12:51

that he complimented me and so I liked him

12:53

very much. It's like, yeah, that's pretty much how

12:55

it works with you. I'm smart. I said

12:57

I was the healthiest president in history.

13:00

There you go.

13:02

That does sound like a drunk guy.

13:04

It's like you're the hottest woman alive.

13:07

You're the healthiest president in history.

13:09

We should open a bar. Let's

13:11

do it man. We should also say that

13:13

he took that cognitive test like

13:16

six, seven years ago. Right.

13:21

In a moment we're gonna be talking to Astra Taylor and

13:24

Leah Hunt Hendricks. Authors

13:27

of Solidarity, the past, present, and future

13:29

of a world changing idea. First

13:32

a couple of words from our

13:35

sponsors. What's

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the best way to learn a language? I think everybody

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for many of us, we can't afford to

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the time, because of our damn kit. What was

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that? Because of our kids. where

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you don't have the cast go well move to a foreign

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i should say couple by months uh...

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however you can still learn a language

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the second best way and that's what

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battle they

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go stop and uh... espanol poor k karo

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but uh... it's

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fun yeah i know i'm

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getting like a you know and getting some

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is going to see i just don't know anybody else

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who speaks banish around me so uh... and

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they would mean i have to talk to people you

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know outside of the six people i talked to over

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the course of a week and uh... the

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if you get on now what is

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it the the walkie thing the

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what people do with the gym i don't know

15:25

if the treadmill yeah the treadmill uh...

15:27

you can i i i just

15:30

don't know i have been doing jim or so long uh...

15:33

you get on there in your you're doing probably

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thirty minutes on the treadmill you could listen to

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three different lessons definitely battles

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tips and tools are approachable accessible and

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rooted in real life situations and delivered

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with conversation-based teaching so you're a dear

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world studies from yale

15:50

michigan yes state university and others

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continue to prove that babble is better

15:55

one study found that using babble for

15:57

fifteen hours is equivalent the

30:00

necessarily although you know that

30:02

helps but it's also about

30:04

self-interest uh... that is uh...

30:07

that that that creates that

30:09

solidarity yeah we think

30:11

it's important to and to have a

30:13

sense of and how we are all

30:15

uh... really literally in

30:18

this together and found together and it's

30:20

and so there is a self-interest in

30:22

making sure that that everyone is

30:25

is surviving and doing okay uh...

30:28

and so we talk about

30:30

the semblance of solidarity like

30:32

empathy charity benevolence altruism there's

30:34

a movement recently in philanthropy

30:37

uh... called effective altruism uh...

30:40

which you know has motivated a lot of

30:42

people especially in silicon valley sam bankman freed

30:44

was one of the and

30:46

uh... leading figures uh...

30:49

and or uh... most infamous uh...

30:52

and and you know the

30:54

idea of altruism it

30:57

it asks you to kind of do

30:59

for others but it's really about your

31:02

own moral moral purity and

31:04

uh... it's a little bit out of touch with

31:07

through like the material ways that where

31:09

we're all interconnected so even

31:11

in as i work with uh...

31:13

philanthropists and donors i think it's

31:15

important for them to see that

31:17

like they would benefit from a

31:19

stronger labor movement they benefit you

31:22

know white people benefit from racial

31:25

justice policies uh... we

31:28

all we all benefit from a world

31:30

that has more public goods more say

31:33

you know it's safer for everyone uh...

31:36

and and so acting from that

31:38

place of actually like enlightened

31:41

self-interest leads

31:43

to actually potentially better outcomes astra

31:46

how do you take that i mean it's

31:48

a you know and i get the idea

31:50

that it's not uh... this isn't just about

31:52

me feeling good or being able to uh...

31:54

you know uh... uh... go to

31:57

uh... apart in say like look what i've done for

32:00

and that type of self-interest. That's

32:03

philanthropy. Well, I mean, and we'll get into

32:05

that because this

32:08

is ... There's

32:10

stuff that I had no idea

32:12

about, like these philanthropy funds that

32:14

go back and forth is sort

32:16

of fascinating to me, but we're

32:18

going to get there. But how,

32:20

from a philosophical standpoint, Astra, do

32:22

you delineate between the idea

32:24

that solidarity

32:27

is in ... That

32:29

true solidarity is in the

32:31

best material interest of

32:35

everyone engaging in that dynamic

32:39

versus the sort of libertarian notion

32:41

of like, well, if everybody acts

32:43

in their own self-interest, we

32:46

get the best outcomes from society. What's

32:51

the difference there? Right? Where

32:54

is it that the group's

32:58

interests align in a

33:00

way that acting in your own self-interest

33:02

doesn't? Yeah. I mean,

33:04

as the granddaughter

33:06

of an avid Iranian

33:08

libertarian, I'll say that

33:11

the self-interest that many

33:13

libertarians and spouses is purely economic, right?

33:16

I mean, the idea is that if

33:18

you pursue your material self-interest in terms

33:20

of capitalist thriving

33:23

and success, so trying

33:25

to make money, trying to advance

33:27

yourself in the terms set by

33:30

the market, then that will magically

33:34

lift all boats that will create the most

33:36

wealth. So I mean, our sense of the

33:38

kind of self-interest we're advocating for is much

33:40

more expansive, right? I mean, as Leah was saying,

33:43

white supremacy is not good for white people,

33:45

and there are sort of economic arguments being

33:48

made for that, right? I mean, when we

33:50

eviscerate public goods, a whole lot of white

33:52

people also suffer from

33:54

the lack of those. When we fail

33:56

to engage in, you know, climate

34:00

forward policies, you know, we all suffer as

34:03

a result of that. So I think we

34:05

are arguing for a much more expansive conception

34:07

of self interest, you know, and it's something

34:09

that I think this insight really does come

34:12

from our time, again, as organizers, you know,

34:14

organizing with the Deaf group

34:18

to hang together is, is, is by saying,

34:20

you know, there's something in it for you,

34:23

right. And, you know, at

34:25

the deck, like we're fighting both for the cancellation

34:27

of people's individual debts, but people also fight for

34:29

each other. And there's also a benefit of,

34:31

you know, there's that benefit of feeling that

34:34

you have camaraderie, that you're in community, that

34:36

you have agency. And so self interest to

34:38

us, I think is, you know, it's a

34:40

much more expansive thing. It's not just what's

34:43

in your bank account. And it's

34:45

not a competitive zero sum version

34:48

of self interest, right? That zero sum

34:50

seems to me to be the fundamental

34:52

difference, right? Because it's not exclusively

34:55

in your self interest, because within

34:57

the context of our system, exclusively

34:59

in your self interest would necessarily

35:01

mean that it is not in

35:04

the best interest of at

35:06

least a significant portion of people around you, right? You

35:08

can't become that rich. Everybody is going to be a

35:11

part of self interest. Everybody

35:13

can't become that rich, because it's

35:16

about a dynamic that

35:18

is going on where you have that wealth

35:20

inequality, that that's the

35:22

definition of rich. If we all have

35:24

a billion dollars, then

35:27

you're not necessarily working in your self interest.

35:29

If you want to be able to get

35:31

something that somebody else can't, you

35:34

know, you're not going to be able to buy your, I

35:36

don't know, your first sink or whatever it is that we

35:38

want to get. And Elon Musk

35:40

would probably disagree with us, right? Like, but

35:43

we, you know, our position is like, it

35:45

would be better for him. Like he'd be

35:47

a healthier man if he wasn't a

35:50

billionaire. But so we there

35:52

is, you know, we don't think that we can

35:54

persuade everybody to come

35:56

to this more enlightened perspective. We understand

35:58

that there's a fight, which is what we do. why there's

36:01

a lot of emphasis on building power and strategy in this

36:03

book. But nevertheless, we do think

36:05

that the zero sum game really

36:07

isn't good for anybody. Leah,

36:10

delineate for us the

36:12

difference between transformative and

36:15

reactionary solidarity. Yeah,

36:18

sure. Well, solidarity in general

36:20

is not always good. Solidarity

36:22

is sort of a neutral

36:24

concept. It just means like

36:26

group cohesion, how groups

36:29

come together and create a shared

36:31

identity. And so

36:33

this can go in a lot of different

36:35

directions. So we wanted to really distinguish sort

36:39

of the positive or in the negative formulations

36:42

of this. So we call reactionary

36:44

solidarity is when a group

36:47

comes together sort of based on

36:49

a strict division between us and them and

36:52

then they are to be annihilated. They

36:54

are a threat to our existence. And

36:58

it is back to this kind

37:00

of zero sum mentality. So white

37:02

supremacy, patriarchy, even nationalism, we

37:08

see a lot of instances of, and

37:11

ruling class solidarity is, which is

37:13

very strong. These

37:15

are all examples of reactionary

37:17

solidarity. Transformative

37:20

solidarity is when you try

37:22

to build bridges across divides.

37:26

It's less about sort of given

37:29

identities, though we actually don't think

37:31

any identity is really given, but

37:34

sort of prefabricated identities

37:38

to build bigger collectivities that

37:40

are more diverse and more

37:42

inclusive. And it's structurally different

37:44

from reactionary solidarity because the line between

37:46

us, there still is a them, but

37:49

the line between the us and them

37:51

is malleable, it's porous, the

37:53

them is not

37:55

to be annihilated, but is

37:58

potentially to be transformed. So

38:02

the ends of transformative solidarity are more inclusion.

38:04

And we actually hope that the

38:06

them, the they, whoever

38:13

we're polarized against, actually benefit

38:15

from the changes that we're trying

38:17

to pursue. So

38:19

again, we want Elon Musk to be happy.

38:23

And we think that a world

38:26

where with high taxation and

38:32

more equal wealth distribution would actually

38:34

help that. So

38:36

transformative solidarity doesn't try to

38:38

annihilate its other, but it

38:41

does still involve polarization. I

38:44

asked her, let's go into, I mean, I should also just say like,

38:48

conceptually, I get it. I don't care about the Elon Musk.

38:52

But we could, exceptionally, I get that. But

38:55

I mean, so Saul Linsky, he quotes

38:57

Saul Linsky in the book, saying

38:59

something to the effect of like, friends

39:01

aren't permanent, neither are the enemies. In

39:05

practice, like that idea that the

39:10

expansive solidarity, or I

39:12

should say transformative solidarity,

39:15

is expansive. How

39:17

do you make those, I mean,

39:20

I understand the difference too, in terms of like the

39:22

them in that instance. We're not

39:24

looking for them to suffer. We believe

39:26

that for them, it's also going

39:28

to be better. Now, you can

39:31

clearly see the distinction between white

39:33

supremacy and a notion

39:35

of like, you know, an

39:38

all exclusive type of notion

39:40

of like, when

39:43

the solution arrives, right? White

39:45

supremacy, the

39:47

end game is to have

39:49

white supreme and others

39:51

sort of suffer on some level. In

39:56

the opposite, even if those

39:58

white supremacists aren't part of the code, coalition

40:01

the solution benefits

40:03

them because we're living

40:05

in a more just society and We're

40:08

able to sort of a get more like

40:10

universal services for instance because race just in

40:12

this instance is not used as a cudgel

40:15

How do you? Each

40:19

time that it's divided 99% in them or whatever

40:21

it is How

40:25

how are those lines drawn and

40:28

Particularly in a situation where it's like we're not talking about

40:31

99% of the people for

40:33

instance like trans rights, right? Like we're actually

40:35

talking about I don't know. I mean 1%

40:37

2% the rights of those people How

40:42

do you delineate where the us and them is

40:44

in those instances with the understanding

40:46

that different times it's fluid Yeah,

40:49

I mean I think it's a really good question and something

40:51

that we try to answer in the book over the course

40:53

of 400 pages, but I

40:55

think you know one thing we're very attentive to

40:58

is the way that the right

41:00

wing uses reactionary solidarity to divide and

41:02

conquer right and so that is You

41:05

know a sort of key part of the book Solidarity

41:08

for us is not spontaneous whether it's

41:10

reactionary or transformative. It takes time. It

41:12

takes energy It takes takes resources and

41:14

a whole lot of resources have been

41:16

put into you know As you said

41:18

using race as a cudgel, you know

41:20

taking real issues like trans people's lives

41:22

and using it as a wedge I

41:24

mean, we're seeing this right now. I

41:26

think around movement

41:28

for Palestine and You

41:30

know is is using this as a

41:33

wedge issue to divide liberals divide the left and

41:37

So, you know this halloween

41:39

see quote no permanent friends. No permanent enemies.

41:41

This is the idea why we

41:44

settled on the word transformative It's the idea

41:46

that people and systems can change You

41:49

know, nothing is set in stone the identities we

41:51

use today those been Formed

41:53

over generations the political system is

41:55

an invention of human beings these

41:57

things can be changed now

42:00

Now, to do that work, we have to

42:02

be really strategic. And I do think there's

42:04

always going to be polarization, but we do have

42:07

to be careful, because as we choose our enemies,

42:09

we remake ourselves. So

42:11

it's a high stakes

42:13

process. I mean, I'll say just

42:16

in the debt collective, for example, we're fighting

42:18

for the abolition of unjust debts and

42:21

for the provision of free public

42:23

college, universal health care, so that

42:25

people do not have to take

42:27

on life destroying debts to survive.

42:31

So our target is the economic

42:33

system that allows

42:37

people to, as class of people,

42:39

to profit from poverty. So we

42:41

are polarized against creditors and

42:44

privatizers and profiteers. So

42:46

if we manage to change the system, and

42:48

let's say we win universal health care so

42:51

people don't have to take on medical debt,

42:53

well, those people then can't occupy that

42:55

position in the economy. And

42:58

so that frame allows us to then unite

43:02

people who might otherwise be divided,

43:04

to unite debtors across race, across

43:08

geography, across age, against

43:11

this structural enemy, against

43:14

their shared oppression. And

43:16

so I think each move, we go through the

43:18

history of different movements, and this is what movements

43:21

have to do. This is why we

43:23

say there does have to be some polarization. There does

43:25

have to be an us and a them. But we

43:27

want it to be one that has the capacity to

43:29

build a majority,

43:33

bring people into a

43:35

new kind of community, to bridge

43:37

across identity divides, and

43:39

hopefully find a strategic lever so they

43:42

can actually change things and make their

43:44

lives better, and set the next generation

43:46

up for a more interesting fight. And

43:50

the ideas that everybody theoretically

43:53

shares in the spoils, that

43:55

being not necessarily cash, but

43:58

a better society. and

52:00

be they labor unions, tenant

52:02

unions, debtors unions, other community

52:04

groups. But we also think

52:06

solidarity is something that can

52:09

be implemented at the level

52:11

of policy. So in this

52:13

sense, solidarity is a means and an end. So

52:15

it is the means by which ordinary

52:18

people build power together. But it's also the

52:21

end goal. We want to create a

52:23

more solidaristic society. As

52:26

a backdrop to this, so that it sounds

52:28

less, I don't know, utopian, I think it's

52:30

important to recognize how anti-solidarity

52:32

policies are built into the

52:34

law as it currently exists.

52:37

We live in a society,

52:39

capitalism is very anti-solidarity. It

52:41

encourages competition. The accumulation of

52:44

wealth and power in the hands of a few

52:47

creates a culture of

52:49

zero-sum kind of scarcity. And

52:52

of course, the tax regime that we're talking about

52:55

is one that doesn't exactly foster solidarity. But

52:57

you can also see it very

53:00

much in labor law. For

53:02

example, in the United States, we

53:05

have very regressive labor laws.

53:07

Solidarity, or what are sometimes called sympathy

53:10

strikes, are illegal, which means

53:12

that if there is a strike

53:14

at Amazon, for example, UPS workers

53:17

or FedEx workers or postal workers

53:19

cannot strike in solidarity as they

53:21

can in other countries. And

53:24

we're seeing the criminalization of protests right now. This

53:27

is part of why it's a tough moment for

53:29

the left. We're seeing the criminalization of protests

53:33

on campus. But also, in

53:35

the last few years, we've seen a lot

53:38

of laws that are anti-solidarity

53:41

paths. So for example, laws

53:43

targeting abortion providers or

53:45

making it illegal or offering bounties

53:47

for people who help others get

53:49

reproductive health care. In

53:52

Georgia, in response to the Stop Cop City

53:54

movement, it is now illegal for people

53:56

to bail out more than three folks a

53:59

year. is targeting bail funds,

54:01

which are a key form of solidarity.

54:04

Many states have passed very harsh measures saying,

54:07

it's a felony to block a sidewalk

54:09

or an intersection, or maybe it's actually

54:12

legal, or you

54:15

are protected if you ram your car into

54:17

protesters. So law

54:20

can be used in different ways. It can be

54:22

used to attack solidarity, or we are saying, to

54:24

foster solidarity. And so a

54:26

solidarity state is something we consider it

54:28

the next step beyond the welfare state.

54:32

And a solidarity state would not just

54:34

aim to redistribute wealth. Well, that's really

54:36

important. It's important to have social policies

54:38

that are more egalitarian, a more progressive

54:41

tax code, for example, better social services.

54:43

But a solidarity state would recognize that

54:46

we also need to be attentive to relationships

54:48

to help people feel themselves as

54:51

and understand

54:53

themselves as interdependent citizens. So I'll just give

54:55

an example and wrap up. The

54:58

way the welfare state works today, what we have

55:00

of one, is that wealthy affluent people get all

55:02

these invisible benefits, like the tax code we're talking

55:05

about. Yeah, put your money in a daff. Write

55:08

things off. Or in a

55:11

more banal example is, you get

55:13

a mortgage. You get your mortgage

55:15

interest deduction. That's a huge subsidy to mostly

55:18

affluent people. And people don't think of that

55:20

as welfare. They just get these benefits. If

55:23

you are working class, you're poor, you're lower,

55:25

and you seek benefits from the state,

55:28

they're stigmatized, there's all sorts of bureaucracy.

55:31

You're made to feel awful about yourself.

55:34

And both of those extremes undermine

55:36

solidarity. One part of the population

55:39

is stigmatized, made to feel like they're takers.

55:41

The other side just sees themselves as makers.

55:43

They get all these invisible benefits, but they

55:45

don't have to see that they're actually interdependent,

55:48

right? A solidarity state would

55:50

bring all of this, equalize that, bring it into

55:52

the open, and be like, actually, we're

55:56

all products of society. We

55:58

all benefit from the social. programs. And so

56:00

we are envisioning, you know, a range of policies

56:03

that would, again, you

56:05

know, be progressive in an economic sense, but

56:07

also really try to create what we call

56:09

solidaristic feedback loops that help us see ourselves

56:12

as having stakes, as benefiting

56:14

from public goods. And

56:17

we think that would go a long way in terms of creating

56:19

a different kind of consciousness that would make

56:22

it harder to roll back progressive gains.

56:25

Yeah, and I think you cite Susan

56:27

Metler and her submerged state, I

56:31

guess her book, actually. And

56:34

so the idea is to make the state, the

56:37

role of the state, less

56:39

submerged, and both

56:43

in practice and in

56:45

perception as to where

56:47

we are. I mean, you mentioned also, you know,

56:50

the student protest. And one

56:52

of the ways that solidarity was

56:54

undercut, and Reagan

56:57

had this idea in addition to wanting to,

57:02

I guess, provide tax

57:04

cuts to people, but

57:06

also saw the benefit of if

57:08

we raise tuition on university

57:13

California students, the stakes

57:17

of their protest become

57:20

a little bit more, a

57:22

little higher. And like, you're wasting all

57:24

this money. You're not,

57:26

you know, you're, talk

57:29

a little bit about that sort of dynamic

57:31

that exists, I mean, particularly in the context

57:33

of what we've just seen. But

57:35

I know also, you guys write that student

57:39

protests are super important, but they only

57:41

have so much power because they don't,

57:43

because they're students, as opposed to economic

57:47

power in their working. But talk

57:50

about both those dynamics. Yeah,

57:54

I mean, when you think back over

57:56

the past decade, students have always been

57:59

at the forefront. of peace

58:02

movements and the climate movement,

58:04

so many important movements. And

58:07

it's been interesting how their tactics

58:09

have evolved from demonstrations

58:12

to more recently encampments,

58:15

divestment strategies. They've

58:19

evolved, I think, as the left has

58:21

evolved, and even electoral strategies that

58:23

many students were involved in, the

58:25

uncommitted movement during

58:28

the democratic primaries. And so

58:31

I think all of this

58:33

is really important. But as the example

58:35

you cited, you know, Reagan

58:38

said, you know, if it becomes

58:40

too costly to go to school,

58:42

the more

58:45

expensive it costs, sorry, the more it

58:47

costs to go to

58:49

school, the less and the more

58:51

in debt, the more debt that

58:53

you're incurring, you know, the harder

58:56

it is to take that time

58:58

to protest and express your civil

59:00

liberties. And so

59:03

there was a direct correlation between the

59:05

increase in tuition costs and

59:08

student debt and

59:10

the clampdown on the anti-war protests

59:13

during that period. And so,

59:17

yeah, I mean, and we've seen, you know, it's just

59:19

been the backlash or the clampdown on students

59:22

over the past months

59:24

has just been incredible. But

59:27

I think it's also been

59:29

really inspiring that they have, that, you know, young

59:31

people continue to see the

59:33

interconnection between

59:37

issues around war and peace,

59:39

military budgets, climate

59:42

justice, racial justice, and

59:45

that they're, you know, putting their

59:47

lives on the line and incurring

59:49

really significant costs for doing that.

59:53

And I think we think that we should

59:55

all be supporting them as much as possible.

59:58

Astra, lastly, I mean, let's just focus in just

1:00:01

a little bit more on the sort of like

1:00:03

what we're seeing in the left at

1:00:06

the moment. And even also considering

1:00:08

the sort of like an

1:00:12

expansive view on that from center

1:00:15

to the left because it feels

1:00:20

like we're back into an era where

1:00:23

we were 20 years ago where

1:00:25

there was sort of like centrists really

1:00:28

making their bones, complaining

1:00:31

about the left's tactics or

1:00:33

their shrillness or whatnot in

1:00:36

part because there has been in the left,

1:00:39

I think since Sanders campaign ended

1:00:41

in 2020, a sort

1:00:43

of lack

1:00:46

of focus maybe or in some respects or

1:00:52

a less of a singularity in terms

1:00:54

of, it's

1:00:57

not 99% versus one, it's

1:01:00

maybe a bunch of different other things,

1:01:02

although obviously that those concepts still exist.

1:01:05

And in part, because there were some policy

1:01:09

victories or at least a

1:01:11

nod towards them from the Biden administration more than

1:01:13

I think a lot of people thought would be,

1:01:16

like where are we in that

1:01:19

area and how do we get out

1:01:21

of it and move into the next sort of era of

1:01:24

a more cohesive

1:01:27

left in this country? It's

1:01:30

a big question. I mean, this is something we

1:01:32

think about all the time. Yeah,

1:01:35

I mean, it's something we think about and wrestle

1:01:37

with all the time. I mean, I think we

1:01:39

wrote this book because actually we really think solidarity

1:01:41

is the key. I think the left would be

1:01:44

on stronger footing if we had a strong recognition

1:01:47

of the importance of solidarity as

1:01:50

the way by which we build a

1:01:52

bigger movement so that we have power

1:01:54

to win more. And that means building

1:01:57

coalitions, working with people who aren't one of the

1:01:59

most important. 100% on the same page

1:02:01

as you, but always trying to bring more people

1:02:04

in the door. I mean, it is a tough

1:02:06

moment. We are in a moment of backlash, which

1:02:08

is a word I don't really love, because the

1:02:10

backlash in the United States is kind of eternal.

1:02:14

I mean, wherever there

1:02:16

have been movements for

1:02:20

multiracial democratic gains,

1:02:23

there has been pushback, sometimes

1:02:26

ferocious. If you go back to

1:02:28

the violent suppression, for example, of Reconstruction after

1:02:31

the Civil War, I mean, look at backlash

1:02:33

after the Civil Rights Movement. We actually

1:02:36

opened the book with A Tale of

1:02:38

the Southern Strategy, which was a conscious

1:02:41

use of racial

1:02:43

appeals by Republicans,

1:02:46

by advisors to the Nixon campaign,

1:02:48

to divide and conquer people and

1:02:50

play up people's resentments so that

1:02:52

the plutocrats could win. And

1:02:55

so the backlash is there. But

1:02:59

we also do have to cast a critical glance at

1:03:02

our side and be like, what could we be doing

1:03:04

better? How could we be smarter? How

1:03:06

could we, again,

1:03:08

really prioritize bringing more people

1:03:10

into our movement and have a

1:03:13

long view? Because we're not going

1:03:15

to win in one election cycle. And

1:03:19

we are working with an electoral system

1:03:21

that is really tough.

1:03:24

It's a winner-take-all two-party system. And

1:03:28

that's the terrain that

1:03:30

we're fighting on. And it's

1:03:32

one that allows for massive

1:03:35

injections of dark money. And

1:03:38

so this is the terrain we're on. It's

1:03:41

not fun. But

1:03:44

we're only going to move the needle, I think,

1:03:46

if we are really, if we stay

1:03:48

on mission, if we're really dogged. And

1:03:52

I think we have to be alert to these divide

1:03:54

and conquer tactics. And right

1:03:57

now, I think there are both. There's

1:04:00

the far right attacking woke, right?

1:04:02

And trying to turn woke

1:04:04

into a slur and sort of put

1:04:07

the, you

1:04:09

know, put liberals

1:04:11

on the left on the back foot, you know, and

1:04:13

to appeal

1:04:15

to people's grievances and resentments and talk in this faux-populous

1:04:17

way. So we have to be aware of that. But

1:04:19

as you said, I think there are also a lot

1:04:22

of liberals who are also

1:04:24

seizing on this moment to attack the

1:04:26

left. And

1:04:29

ultimately they're assisting

1:04:31

an authoritarian project by

1:04:33

doing so, right? I mean, when Hillary

1:04:36

Clinton comes out and, you

1:04:38

know, endorses George Latimer against Jamal Bowman,

1:04:41

this moment, it's like you're

1:04:43

enabling authoritarianism. So we've got

1:04:46

to fight on a lot of fronts, you know,

1:04:48

it's a tough time, but I do think the

1:04:51

left is in a better place than

1:04:53

20 years ago. It's not where we wanna be. But,

1:04:55

you know, I was there too in the post 9-11 era and

1:04:58

I think there's more class consciousness.

1:05:00

I think we have a bigger strategic

1:05:02

toolkit, but let's not lose

1:05:06

out of the bigger goal, which is to build big,

1:05:09

inclusive, powerful movements, you

1:05:11

know, and, you know,

1:05:14

it takes work. And really

1:05:16

this is why the message of the book

1:05:18

is organize, organize, organize, organize, you

1:05:20

know, build solidarity. It is the only thing that

1:05:22

can save us because we're not gonna be able

1:05:24

to outspend these guys. Definitely not gonna outgun them.

1:05:28

I think we could spend an hour

1:05:30

on trying to assess Hillary

1:05:32

Clinton's endorsement of Latimer,

1:05:35

of a guy who has already come

1:05:37

out and said, I'm not even gonna

1:05:39

support Joe Biden's returning,

1:05:41

you know, raising taxes on millionaires.

1:05:43

I mean, it's pretty stunning,

1:05:48

the lengths that they'll go to just to prevent one

1:05:51

progressive voice in

1:05:53

Congress in that instance, but

1:05:56

that will have to wait for another day. The

1:05:58

book is Solidarity, The Past. present and

1:06:01

future and we

1:06:03

will put a link to that at

1:06:05

majority excuse me of a world-changing idea

1:06:07

we'll put a link to that at

1:06:09

the and our YouTube and podcast descriptions

1:06:12

and at majority.fm Astra Taylor, Leah

1:06:14

Hunt-Hendricks thank you so much for

1:06:17

your time today really appreciate it. It's

1:06:19

always a pleasure thanks for having me. Thanks

1:06:21

so much good to see you all. All

1:06:24

right folks that

1:06:26

does it for this portion of

1:06:28

the program we will head into

1:06:30

the so-called fun half wherein

1:06:36

we will have some fun

1:06:38

apparently that is the plan

1:06:40

anyways right? Absolutely absolutely we'll

1:06:42

be having some fun okay and see

1:06:44

you out the trail. Out of the trail.

1:06:48

You know it's really upsetting that Vivek

1:06:51

is not on the shortlist for

1:06:53

the VP why

1:06:55

couldn't they put him on? I

1:06:58

mean God bless you. I mean

1:07:00

honestly like they

1:07:03

could have put him on there there's nothing like they're

1:07:05

doing real vetting of other people you

1:07:07

know they're he's gonna pick JD Vance or

1:07:09

sir you know maybe burglar and they're not

1:07:11

gonna they could just say he's

1:07:13

on the shortlist but you know what I didn't

1:07:15

like how ass-kissy

1:07:18

Vivek was. He actually got a billionaire

1:07:21

to kiss my ass Doug Bergman he

1:07:23

looks the part a little bit right

1:07:25

well I mean let's be real he's putting

1:07:27

certain people on there cuz to signal to

1:07:30

constituencies like Marco Rubio is not being seriously

1:07:32

considered but he wanted a Latino guy on

1:07:34

the on like the

1:07:36

list of people that he's considering and

1:07:38

Vivek he's like the Indian people I

1:07:41

don't need him. It's I

1:07:43

mean that's I mean that's how they

1:07:45

think about what these VP picks. Did they put

1:07:47

her face? What's her face? Tellsie Gabbard did she

1:07:49

make the list? She did not. Not

1:07:52

for the official list. That was the

1:07:55

only woman if I'm not mistaken was Stefanik who made

1:07:57

like the request of documents. It's

1:07:59

too hard. the dog killer had to

1:08:01

go and brag about it. Yeah, sad. Folks,

1:08:05

just a reminder, it's your support that

1:08:07

makes this show possible. You can become

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a member at jointhemajorityreport.com. When

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you do, you not only help this show survive,

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also, by being a sustaining member,

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1:08:25

get the fun half. And

1:08:30

who knows what other magnificent

1:08:33

benefits we give? I can't remember. Who

1:08:35

knows? You probably should. Sign up

1:08:38

and find out. I'm probably the first one to know, but

1:08:40

somebody knows. Emma! Oh,

1:08:43

wait a second. Don't

1:08:45

forget JustCoffee.coop. Fair

1:08:48

Trade Coffee. Hot

1:08:50

chocolate. Majority Report

1:08:52

Blend. Soon, we're going

1:08:54

to have the new Majority Report

1:08:56

Blend logo catching up. We've

1:08:59

had the old logo on

1:09:01

about six years after we had

1:09:04

switched logos because I

1:09:07

didn't realize that we could email and say, hey, can you

1:09:09

change the logo? So

1:09:11

Julie did that, and we'll see. They'll

1:09:14

start rolling those babies out soon. JustCoffee.coop.

1:09:18

Emma. I

1:09:21

hope you're not talking about basketball until

1:09:23

after tonight. We shall. I

1:09:25

mean, look, I think tonight's the night, though. I think

1:09:27

it's going to be. I think it's going to be fine, Sam.

1:09:31

The Celtics are up 3-1,

1:09:33

as are the Florida Panthers. But

1:09:36

both of the losing teams so

1:09:38

far avoided a clean sweep over the

1:09:41

weekend, so they forced game five, the

1:09:43

Oilers and Mavericks. We'll also talk about

1:09:45

Roy McElroy having one of the most

1:09:47

historic choke jobs I've seen in

1:09:49

professional sports with his putts.

1:09:52

I'm not even a huge golf person,

1:09:54

but this was a big story over

1:09:57

the weekend. And we'll talk about WNBA

1:09:59

too, youtube.com/es. Let's also

1:10:03

be clear that probably

1:10:06

the Celtics did that on purpose as a way

1:10:08

of winning. It's like they win at home. In

1:10:10

the Garden, they've put that 18th banner up and

1:10:12

I want to applaud them. It

1:10:15

was a little bit too obvious. A little bit. A

1:10:18

little bit. And start sweating a little bit if they

1:10:20

lose tonight then. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. I

1:10:24

don't even like the look on your face. I don't even

1:10:26

think I've ever seen a look like that on your face.

1:10:29

I hope it goes seven. I

1:10:32

don't want basketball to end. I'll miss it. So

1:10:35

yeah, check it out today. youtube.com/ESPN show.

1:10:38

Matt. Left Reckoning, Thomas

1:10:41

Kennedy talked about Ron

1:10:43

DeSantis deciding to not

1:10:45

include drainage in the recent Florida

1:10:47

budget at a time where they've

1:10:49

had four straight days of massive

1:10:52

rains and severe flooding. And

1:10:54

also Joe Biden's amnesty betrayal

1:10:57

and how that is playing out.

1:11:01

So check that out. patreon.com is just Left

1:11:03

Reckoning to hear us talk about that. We'll

1:11:06

be back in just a moment in the fun half. Three

1:11:13

months from now, six months from now. Three

1:11:21

months from now, six months from now, nine months from now.

1:11:23

And I don't think it's going to be the same as

1:11:25

it looks like in six months from now. And I don't

1:11:27

know if it's necessarily going to be better six months from

1:11:29

now than it is three months from now. But

1:11:32

I think around 18 months out, we're going to look

1:11:34

back and go like, wow. But

1:11:39

what is that going on? It's

1:11:41

not. Wait

1:11:43

a second. Hold on for hold on for a second. Emma,

1:11:49

welcome to the program. Matt.

1:11:54

What is up, everyone? No,

1:11:57

me. Let's

1:12:01

go Brandon! Let's go Brandon! Bradley,

1:12:06

you wanna say hello? Sorry to

1:12:08

disappoint everyone, I'm just a random guy.

1:12:10

It's all the boys today! Fundamentally false.

1:12:13

No, I'm sorry, women's... Stop

1:12:15

talking for a second. Oh wow. Now let

1:12:17

me finish. Where is this coming from, dude? But

1:12:19

dude, you wanna smoke his... Yes.

1:12:26

Alright, me? You're safe? Yes.

1:12:29

I love you. I love you. I

1:12:31

love you. Is this me? Is

1:12:33

it me? It is you. I

1:12:35

love you. I love you. Is this me?

1:12:37

I love you. I think it

1:12:39

is you. Who is you? I love you. Fuck

1:12:42

no sound. Every single frickin' day. What's

1:12:44

on your mind? Sports. I'm

1:12:47

gonna go start like. Who libertarians? They're so

1:12:49

stupid though. Common sense says of course. Gobbledygook.

1:12:52

We fuckin' did it! I'm gonna go start

1:12:54

like. They're so stupid though. Common sense says

1:12:56

of course. Gobbledygook. We fuckin' nailed him! So

1:12:58

what's 79 plus 21? Challenge

1:13:01

met. I'm positively quivering. I believe 96

1:13:03

I wanna say. 2-1-0. One

1:13:08

half. 3-8. 911 for

1:13:10

a second. 3400 dollars. 1900 dollars. 65-4.

1:13:14

3 trillion dollars sold. It's a zero sum

1:13:16

game. Actually you're making me think less of

1:13:18

it. Wait, let

1:13:20

me say this. Poop. Call it satire.

1:13:22

Sam goes with satire. On top of it all? Yeah.

1:13:26

My favorite part about you

1:13:28

is just like every day, all

1:13:31

day, like everything you do. Without a

1:13:33

doubt. Hey buddy, we seen you. Alright

1:13:35

folks. Folks. Folks. It's

1:13:37

just the week being

1:13:39

weeded out obviously. Yeah.

1:13:44

Sun's out, guns out. I

1:13:48

don't know. But

1:13:50

you should know. People

1:13:53

just don't like to entertain

1:13:56

ideas anymore. I have a

1:13:58

question. Who cares? Our

1:14:01

chat is enabled. I love it. I

1:14:04

do love that. Gotta jump. Gotta be

1:14:06

quick. I get a jump. I'm losing

1:14:08

it, bro. Two o'clock. We're

1:14:10

already late and the guy's

1:14:12

being a dick. So

1:14:16

screw him. Sent

1:14:19

to a glove. Outrageous. What

1:14:21

is wrong with you? Love you. Bye.

1:14:25

Love you. Bye-bye. Bye-bye.