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1:29

Imagine

1:30

being so gripped fear,

1:32

you don't feel safe to walk past your front gate.

1:35

You're suspicious of every stranger

1:37

that passes you on a street you've

1:39

been down a thousand times before.

1:42

Feeling on edge, you constantly

1:44

look over your shoulder. That unfamiliar

1:46

car is driving slowly down your street.

1:49

you no longer feel safe, catching

1:51

the train, you shelter in your

1:54

house. These were the words

1:56

published twenty nine years ago by

1:58

a Melbourne Australian newspaper, The

2:00

Herald Sun, because the residents

2:02

of the suburb of Frankston weren't

2:04

just imagining that they were a

2:06

living at during the dark,

2:09

drizzly and terrifying winter

2:11

of nineteen ninety three. Join

2:13

me now as we take look

2:15

at the case of the Frankston serial

2:18

killer, you'll hear how

2:20

three young women became victims of

2:22

a remorseless murderer who

2:24

chose his victims at random, striking

2:27

whenever he felt the urge to

2:29

kill again.

2:37

It was all smiles for Debbie Frame

2:39

inside the maternity ward of a Frankston

2:42

Hospital on June twenty sixth

2:45

ninety three. The twenty two

2:47

year old had just given birth to a

2:49

beautiful baby boy after a

2:51

relatively short lemur. She

2:53

named the seven pound four ounce

2:55

healthy baby Jake Daniel Blair

2:58

taking his last name Baby

3:00

Jake's father was Gary Blair, Debbie's

3:03

fiancee. And although Debbie's

3:05

pregnancy had initially been a surprise

3:07

for the couple, Both parents were overjoyed

3:09

with the news and began excitedly planning

3:12

for their little future together.

3:14

In fact, they've been so delighted

3:16

by the news of baby jake They even

3:18

started discussing the idea of having

3:20

another one. But first, they

3:22

had a wedding to plan. Before

3:25

pregnancy, Debbie had spinner

3:27

late teens and early twenties as

3:29

somewhat of a free wandering spirit.

3:32

happy, go lucky, and always on

3:34

the move. But now more

3:36

than ever, she welcomed the idea

3:38

of stability and settling down in Melbourne

3:41

with a family of her own, and she

3:43

took to motherhood like a fish to

3:45

water, with Gary diving into

3:47

fatherhood headfirst as well. even

3:49

taking over midnight bottle feeding duties

3:52

so Debbie could get some rest and

3:54

to support their growing family. Gary

3:56

returned to shifts at work with a

3:58

company called K and S freighters, the

4:01

same company Debbie worked at before taking

4:03

maternity leave. By July

4:05

eighth, Debbie had been a mother for

4:07

exactly twelve days and was

4:09

positively glowing about it, proudly

4:12

showing off baby Jake to friends and family.

4:15

That evening, Gary was working the

4:17

late chef, so Debbie decided to

4:19

catch up with one of her best friends, a

4:22

former coworker named Russell Hays.

4:24

Russell hadn't seen Debbie since she left

4:26

work on maternity leave, so he was

4:28

thrilled to accept the invitation for a

4:30

visit that night to meet the new

4:32

baby. When

4:35

Russell arrived at five forty five

4:37

PM, Debbie offered him a cup of

4:39

black coffee because she'd completely

4:41

run out of milk. One of those

4:43

small frustrations that can occur

4:45

amidst the chaos of caring for a

4:47

newborn. For dinner, Debbie

4:50

planned on making the omelettes, something

4:52

she absolutely needed milk for.

4:54

With Russell now there, she decided

4:57

to pop out and buy a jug while he watched

4:59

the baby would only take a few

5:01

minutes since there was a store just

5:03

down the street. For Debbie,

5:05

it was also a welcome chance to

5:08

enjoy just having even five

5:10

minutes to herself, even if it

5:12

was to do just a quick errand. After

5:15

driving about a mile to the store,

5:17

Debbie pulled into a parking lot and

5:19

walked inside. At the same

5:21

time, Debbie was reaching into a cooler

5:23

to grab a jug of milk A

5:25

man inside the store was reaching

5:27

through the unlocked driver's side door of

5:29

her car and opening up the

5:31

rear one. After crawling

5:33

inside Debbie's car, the

5:35

man wedged himself behind the driver's

5:37

seat next to the baby seat, keeping

5:40

his eyes fixed on Debbie as she

5:42

made her way through the store. When

5:44

Debbie got back inside the car

5:46

and pulled out of the parking lot, she

5:48

had no idea there was a man

5:50

hidden in the back seat. Once

5:53

out of the store parking lot,

5:55

Debbie began making a u-turn to

5:57

head back to her house. But before

5:59

she could realize what

5:59

was happening, the barrel

6:02

of gun was being pushed into her

6:04

side as a man told her

6:06

to shut up and keep driving. What

6:08

Debbie didn't realize at the time

6:11

was that the gun was fake. Regardless,

6:13

it probably wouldn't have mattered

6:15

if she had. It was still a

6:17

terrifying situation. Gunner,

6:20

no gun. The man

6:22

told Debbie, if she tried signaling

6:24

for help, he'd decorate the car with

6:26

her brains, even so.

6:28

Debbie courageously flipped her

6:30

headlights attempting to alert her oncoming

6:32

traffic. Although a few people

6:35

did take notice, ultimately

6:37

no one under stood the message she was

6:39

desperately trying to convey. After

6:41

passing her house, where Russell

6:43

was still watching the baby, the

6:46

man force Debbie to drive about

6:48

ten miles outside of town to

6:50

remote location near a farm on

6:52

Taylor's Road. During the

6:54

drive, Debbie tried offering the

6:56

man money, told them to take the car,

6:58

but the man wanted neither. After

7:01

being forced out of the car, Debbie

7:03

suddenly felt something being wrapped

7:05

around her neck and tightening

7:08

for five very long

7:10

terrifying and agonizing minutes.

7:12

deputy fought back against her much

7:15

larger attacker, but eventually

7:17

grew faint and collapsed. As

7:19

she fell to her knees, Debbie

7:21

began to feel a new pain,

7:24

a large knife being

7:26

repeatedly thrust into her body

7:29

Until her last breath, Debbie

7:31

never stopped fighting, fighting

7:33

for her life, fighting for the

7:35

baby she desperately wanted to get

7:37

back home to. Tragically,

7:41

she never would. The

7:43

killer left Debbie's body next to a

7:45

farmer's field breaking off

7:47

a branch from a tree to cover her

7:49

with. After

7:51

driving away in Debbie's car,

7:53

he parked along the street in front of

7:55

a church. and then simply

7:58

walked away. Back

8:00

at Debbie's home, Russell was watching

8:02

TV as baby jakes slept peacefully

8:04

in his bassinet. But thirty

8:06

minutes later, when Debbie still

8:09

hadn't returned home, Russell

8:11

became concerned and began calling

8:13

around to police departments and hospitals.

8:15

thinking she'd possibly been in an

8:17

accident, but there was no sign

8:19

of Debbie. Russell then

8:21

called Gary who immediately rushed

8:23

home from work to help look for Debbie,

8:26

but she was nowhere to be found.

8:28

By midnight, Gary filed the

8:30

missing persons report. for

8:32

an agonizing four days.

8:35

The search for Debbie continued with

8:37

police considering every

8:39

possibility. including that

8:41

perhaps she'd skipped town. Maybe

8:43

she'd been experiencing severe postpartum

8:46

depression. Anything was possible.

8:48

In the meantime, detectives

8:50

had discovered Debbie's car parked

8:52

right where the killer had left it,

8:54

and inside they found traces of

8:56

blood on the front seat. They'd

8:58

also noticed the driver's seat

9:00

had been pushed all the way back,

9:02

leading them to believe the last

9:04

person driving the car must have

9:06

been much larger than Debbie.

9:09

Clues are all pointing to foul

9:11

play. heartbreakingly,

9:14

on July twelfth, a

9:16

farmer discovered what everyone had

9:18

dreaded. Debbie deceased

9:20

in one of his fields along

9:22

Taylor's Road. Gary

9:24

Blair's worst fears had

9:26

come true. His fiancee

9:28

and mother of his child would

9:30

never be coming home, and

9:32

baby Jake would never get to know

9:34

the mother who brought him into the

9:36

world. As

9:38

detectives began working the crime

9:40

scene, they came to another

9:42

horrifying realization. Debbie

9:45

had been savagely murdered strangled

9:47

with a cord, and then

9:50

stabbed fourteen times in her neck

9:52

and chest, but no sign

9:54

of sexual assault. These

9:56

details were particularly horrifying,

9:58

not only because of the

9:59

barbaric nature of the attack,

10:02

but also because the detectives had

10:04

seen it before, only

10:06

a month earlier.

10:11

Eighteen

10:12

year old Elizabeth Stevens had

10:14

recently moved to Melbourne to live with her aunt

10:16

and uncle after finishing her final

10:18

year of school. Originally

10:20

from Hobart, Tasmania, Elizabeth's

10:23

teen years had been chaotic. After

10:25

her

10:25

parents split when she was fourteen,

10:28

she found herself forced to live in a

10:30

children's group home until her eighteenth

10:32

birthday. On the day she

10:34

turned eighteen, Elizabeth booked

10:36

a ticket for Adelaide hoping to

10:38

reconcile with her mother. However,

10:40

for various reasons, things

10:42

didn't work out. And Elizabeth

10:44

was once again In search for a home

10:46

she could call her own. Fortunately,

10:48

she found that home with her aunt

10:50

and uncle Rita and Paul Webster,

10:53

living in Melbourne. Elizabeth

10:55

had every right to be angry with the

10:57

courtship and dealt in life. Instead,

10:59

she never displayed anything but the

11:01

utmost gratitude towards

11:03

her relative taking her in.

11:05

She was appreciative, respectful,

11:07

and always reliable whenever

11:09

she left the house. Elizabeth always

11:12

left a note for Paul and Rita, letting

11:14

them know where they could find her and

11:16

when to expect her home. She

11:18

loved living with the couple so much

11:21

She told her friends' school she

11:23

might just live with Paul and Rita forever.

11:26

On

11:26

June eleven, nineteen ninety

11:28

three,

11:28

Elizabeth went to the library to work

11:31

on a research paper after

11:33

school. And like always, she

11:35

left a note saying where she'd be. And what

11:37

time she'd be home? Around eight

11:39

PM. She even left the

11:41

library's phone number just in

11:43

case. When

11:45

Elizabeth left the library to catch her

11:47

bus ride home, a torrential

11:49

rainstorm began passing through the

11:51

area, and was still pouring as

11:53

she got off at her stop just a few

11:55

minutes walk from her aunt and uncles home.

11:58

As Elizabeth made her way

12:00

drenched and cold in the dark, she was

12:02

suddenly attacked from behind.

12:04

A large man clasped her

12:06

mouth shot with one hand while

12:08

pressing the barrel of a gun into

12:10

her temple. Again, the

12:12

gun was fake, but there was

12:14

no way Elizabeth would have known.

12:16

After forcing her into some trees

12:18

surrounding Lloyd Park, the man

12:20

began choking her until she passed

12:22

out. Once on the ground,

12:25

the killer pulled out a knife

12:27

and slashed Elizabeth's throat.

12:30

For the next five minutes, he

12:32

stood in the pouring rain. watching

12:35

as the life bled completely

12:37

out of Elizabeth's body. He

12:39

then stabbed her six more

12:41

times in the chest before

12:44

slowly carving a series of lines

12:46

into her abdomen that looked

12:48

like a tic type toeboard. Next,

12:51

he dragged and tossed her body into

12:53

a ditch covering her with

12:55

a branch as the ring

12:57

continued to pour down

13:00

Elizabeth blood was washed away from

13:02

the killer's hands, face

13:04

and clothes. He then

13:06

simply turned and walked

13:08

away.

13:12

ABC, Wednesdays, Reba

13:15

McEntire joins the cast. Welcome to

13:17

Montana. Wait. Big Sky Returns. You

13:19

got a tip. I'm gonna back after he was spotted

13:21

heading up dead man's drop. With an

13:23

all new mystery, sometimes people just

13:25

wanna disappear, but then there's people who make them

13:27

disappear. Is that blood.

13:29

Oh, come

13:30

on, honey. Just nature, cycle

13:32

of life.

13:33

Big sky, deadly trails.

13:35

Oh, it's up. New

13:37

episodes, Wednesday's

13:39

ten ninth Central on ABC and stream

13:41

on Hulu.

13:43

The following

13:44

day, Elizabeth's body

13:46

was discovered, the search for

13:48

a killer would take

13:50

much longer. Exactly

13:52

one month at Pat since Elizabeth

13:54

Stevens and Debbie Frame's bodies were

13:56

discovered and detectives

13:58

couldn't ignore the similarities

13:59

between the cases. Both

14:02

attacks had occurred in Frankston,

14:05

five miles apart from each other,

14:07

neither victim appeared to have been

14:09

sexually assaulted. Both had been

14:11

strangled and stabbed multiple

14:13

times. Detectives realized

14:15

almost immediately that an

14:17

active serial killer was

14:19

possibly now operating in the quiet

14:21

Melbourne suburb. And if that was

14:23

true, that meant he was still

14:25

out there somewhere hunting for

14:27

his next victim. It

14:29

was an entire community's

14:31

worst fears come true, and

14:34

now it was a race against the

14:36

clock to catch the killer before

14:38

they could strike again. By

14:40

the time newspapers hit the

14:42

stands on July thirteenth, the

14:44

media had already begun to speculate

14:46

that the two murders were relayed Murders

14:49

that might also be connected with

14:51

several other unsolved murders of

14:53

young women in the area. Over

14:55

the couple years. The

14:57

following day, a Melbourne paper

14:59

ran a shocking headline in

15:01

bold type on its front page

15:03

serial killer on the loose.

15:06

What could be more terrifying for a

15:08

community than to read words

15:10

like that on the front page of their local

15:13

newspaper, the entire

15:15

suburb of Frankston was shaken to

15:17

its core with no one

15:19

knowing who to trust A serial

15:21

killer was hiding in plain sight,

15:23

and police were publicly warning

15:25

women not to walk anywhere alone at

15:27

night. Enrollment in

15:29

self defense classes skyrocketed, and

15:31

the area was beginning to

15:33

resemble a ghost town after

15:35

sunset. The police force

15:37

responded by putting an

15:39

army of extra officers out into the

15:41

community in an attempt to make

15:43

the public feel a little more

15:45

safe. The vast majority of

15:47

women who did need to be out after dark, were

15:49

accompanied by fathers, husbands,

15:51

boyfriends, or walk together in

15:53

groups. One

15:56

of those women who needed to be heard after

15:58

dark was Sharon

15:59

Johnson, a young woman who worked

16:02

two jobs and didn't get home

16:04

until well after dark each night.

16:06

After

16:06

Debbie Freeman's murder, Sharon's

16:09

boyfriend, twenty one year old,

16:11

pumped tenure, waited to pick her up

16:13

from the train platform after work

16:15

in his beat up yellow Toyota.

16:17

A few police officers million

16:19

about had double checked to make sure the

16:21

men who'd been waiting for was indeed

16:23

her boyfriend. One

16:25

officer commented to her She was

16:27

lucky to have someone willing to meet her at

16:29

the station and get her home

16:31

safely because one could never

16:33

be too careful during times

16:35

like these. At that

16:37

time, Sharon's boyfriend, Paul, was

16:39

unemployed, and escorting Sharon

16:42

home was really the least to get due

16:44

to help out.

16:47

Frankston police have been pouring

16:49

over every available resource

16:51

in their hunt for a serial killer.

16:53

There were extra officers on the street,

16:55

public meetings, and

16:57

extensive public appeals for

16:59

any leads or information. What

17:02

followed was a flood of tips into the

17:04

station with every leap

17:06

being pursued until a dead end

17:08

was hit. It was

17:09

a monumental undertaking with

17:11

detectives and uniformed officers working

17:14

tirelessly for weeks on end.

17:16

but after

17:17

three full weeks of investigating,

17:20

police were no closer to solving the

17:22

case. They were basically still

17:24

at square one. Without

17:26

discovering any valuable evidence from

17:28

either crime scene, all police

17:31

really had to work with was a

17:33

criminal profile created by

17:35

an officer who'd trained with the

17:37

FBI's behavioral science unit in the

17:39

United States. According to the

17:41

profile, the killer was most likely a

17:43

male between the ages of eighteen and

17:45

twenty four. The

17:47

profile theorized that the

17:49

killer was so wrapped up in his killing fantasies.

17:51

He'd have difficulty concentrating on

17:53

anything else. This led them

17:55

to the conclusion, that

17:57

the killer wouldn't be able to maintain a steady

18:00

job, perhaps was unemployed altogether,

18:03

most disturbingly for

18:05

Frankston residents. The

18:07

killer seemed to travel on

18:09

foot, which could only mean one

18:11

thing. He lived close

18:13

by, and finally, killer

18:15

would be someone who appeared

18:18

normal because he was able to walk around

18:20

freely without raising suspicions.

18:23

Police knew the serial killer could literally

18:25

be right under their noses,

18:28

possibly in the audience at one of the

18:30

community meetings. Maybe it

18:32

interacted with officers on the streets

18:34

knowing that a serial killer was

18:36

walking amongst them made it all

18:38

the more terrifying. Three

18:41

weeks have passed since Debbie frames murder

18:43

and with tensions throughout

18:45

Frankston running high,

18:48

women still mostly avoiding traveling alone

18:50

after dark. But what

18:52

good was taking precautions after

18:54

dark? If the serial killer

18:56

was willing to strike in broad

18:58

daylight, almost exactly

19:01

halfway between Lloyd Park,

19:03

where Elizabeth had been murdered. and

19:05

the convenience store where Debbie had been abducted

19:08

sits two golf courses right next

19:10

to each other along Frankston's

19:13

Sky Road The only thing

19:15

separating the courses was a

19:17

well used bike track running

19:19

the entire length between them.

19:22

The bike path itself is about a kilometer

19:24

in length, flanked on both sides

19:26

by high chain link fences,

19:30

designed to keep people from sneaking onto

19:32

the golf courses. Thick

19:34

trees and bushes line the fences from

19:36

either side. It also happened to

19:38

be a popular trail

19:39

used by students walking home

19:42

from school. Around

19:44

two PM on July thirtieth.

19:46

Paul Dennier

19:47

parked his beat up yellow Toyota on

19:49

the street next to the bike path

19:51

entrance. With his girlfriend,

19:53

Sharon Johnson, away every day

19:55

at work, he had all the time in

19:57

the world to fantasize about plan

20:00

and execute his next

20:03

murder. Paul, the

20:05

caring and concerned who'd

20:07

shown up at the train station to make sure

20:09

his girlfriend got home safely.

20:15

Earlier that day, Paul had

20:17

taken a wire cutter with him as

20:19

he scouted out the bike trail

20:22

at three locations in the fence, Hulk

20:24

cut large holes through the chain

20:26

links. He planned to hide in the

20:28

bushes behind one of the

20:30

holes. abrupt his victim,

20:32

and then carry her back through the

20:34

fence and into the bush using

20:36

one of the other holes. After

20:38

preparing his trap, all he had

20:40

left to do was wait.

20:44

Paul patiently waited thirty minutes or

20:46

so in his car, until

20:48

he spotted a girl walking

20:50

home alone, wearing a school

20:53

uniform. It was only two

20:55

thirty, the middle of the

20:57

day. she was supposed to be safe until

21:00

nightfall. Seventeen year old Natalie

21:02

Russell usually rode her bike

21:04

to and from school. but

21:06

that particular morning, she'd gotten a ride

21:08

to school from her mother. Earlier

21:11

that day, she'd mentioned

21:13

a friend's how unexpected she

21:15

was to have to walk home because she

21:17

didn't have her bike. Watching

21:19

from his car, Paul saw

21:21

Natalie cross the street and begin walking next to

21:23

the golf course. He guessed

21:26

correctly, she'd soon be taking the

21:28

bike path because there really

21:30

wasn't any other reason her

21:32

to be walking on side of the street if

21:34

she wasn't. Seeing the beginning

21:36

of his plan coming together

21:39

Paul got out of his car and raced down the track

21:41

ahead of Natalie to the first

21:43

hole he prepared in the fence.

21:46

As she walked along the path, Natalie

21:48

must have realized somebody was

21:50

behind her because she turned

21:52

her head around. to see a man

21:54

walking about thirty feet behind. The

21:57

man was large, six

21:59

feet tall, and pushing two

22:01

hundred and thirty pounds.

22:05

Trying not to raise any

22:07

alarms, Paul walked casually and

22:09

it worked as fast as she

22:11

turned her head to look behind her, Natalie turned her

22:14

head forward again and

22:16

continued walking. She had

22:18

no idea She was walking

22:20

closer and closer to the second

22:22

hole pallet cut through the chain link

22:24

fence, and he was only

22:26

biting his time. until

22:28

she arrived at it.

22:30

As Natalie continued walking

22:32

towards Paul's trap, he picked

22:34

up his pace and closed the gap

22:37

between them. walking on the grass to make as

22:39

little noise as possible. Before

22:42

Natalie knew it, Paul was

22:44

grabbing her mouth violently from

22:46

behind. tilting her head back

22:48

while holding a knife up to her throat.

22:51

At that moment, Natalie must

22:53

have known exactly who

22:55

he was and exactly what he

22:57

intended on doing. With

22:59

the knife against her neck,

23:01

Paul forced Natalie through

23:03

the hole in defense and into the bushes as

23:06

she begged for her life, offering

23:08

Paul anything she could think of

23:11

but he had only one thing on his mind.

23:13

As he began

23:15

strangling her with a leather strap,

23:17

he'd taken from a pair of binoculars

23:20

Natalie tried to fight back with everything

23:22

she had, but Paul had

23:24

the upper hand. After

23:27

knocking Natalie to the ground, he

23:29

slashed her throat with a knife. However,

23:32

this time, he'd made a crucial

23:35

mistake during the struggle,

23:37

hull accidentally sliced

23:39

off an inch long piece of skin

23:41

from the inside of his middle finger on

23:43

his left hand. the first piece

23:45

of forensic evidence, the

23:48

Frankston serial killer left

23:50

behind. Back on Sky

23:52

road just moments before Paul had

23:54

gotten out of his car and ran

23:56

down the path of postal

23:59

worker had seen him sitting parked

23:59

in his yellow Toyota. She

24:02

noticed he

24:02

was sitting low in his seat as if

24:04

he didn't want to be seen,

24:06

and when Natalie passed by,

24:09

she watched as he slumped down

24:11

even further. Normally,

24:13

such an innocent innocuous occurrence

24:15

might not have raised in the eyebrows.

24:18

However, these were anything

24:20

but normal times. Immediately,

24:22

the postal worker turned into

24:24

the next driveway, and asked the homeowner

24:26

to use their phone so she could

24:28

report them in to police.

24:33

Around the same time at two

24:35

forty in the afternoon, Natalie's

24:37

mother drove pastor's school on the

24:39

way home, hoping she might

24:42

Natalie and offer her a ride,

24:44

but Natalie had already turned off

24:46

and headed down the trail. Leaving

24:49

Natalie's body in the thick bush pushes

24:51

behind the fence, Paul

24:53

Dennier, who was now a bona fide

24:55

serial killer, crawled back through

24:57

the hole in casually walk back

24:59

toward his car. Except

25:01

now, it was surrounded

25:03

by uniform police officers in

25:05

expecting the vehicle from the outside. The

25:08

officers had arrived about fifteen

25:10

minutes after the postal worker and made

25:12

a call to police, about a suspicious character

25:14

on the bike path, but

25:16

Paul kept his cool and head down

25:18

and walked right past his

25:20

car passing the officers.

25:23

only a mile before reaching his front door.

25:27

Natalie Russell

25:31

was officially parted as a missing

25:33

person by her parents around

25:35

seven thirty that evening, and

25:37

police responded in full

25:39

force. immediately sending out

25:42

helicopters, canine units, emergency

25:45

volunteers and mounted police. looking

25:47

everywhere for the missing team.

25:49

A group of volunteers

25:51

carrying flashlights were sent

25:53

out to search the bike path and

25:55

by ten five PM, they'd found

25:58

Natalie's body. When her

26:00

identity was verified by a

26:02

police officer, call

26:04

was put out on the radio to

26:06

the rest of the search team.

26:08

Our worst fears have been realized.

26:12

Natalie saw autopsy revealed just

26:14

how hard she fought back

26:16

with excessive defense wounds to

26:18

her arms. Each of her hands

26:20

still clinging onto hair's pulp from

26:22

her killer's head. The autopsy

26:25

also revealed a surprising

26:28

discovery while examining the

26:30

brutal cuts to her neck they

26:32

found a piece of skin inside of one

26:34

of them, judging from the riches

26:36

and texture present, they

26:39

concluded it had most likely come from the

26:41

killer's hand.

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devices, as well as on PC through

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Facebook games. While police

27:39

were still processing the crime

27:41

scene on July thirty first,

27:43

detectives were made aware of the fact

27:45

that some officers had were bonded to a

27:47

call the day before and had inspected

27:49

a yellow Toyota near the scene.

27:51

If it hadn't been for the

27:53

suspicious postal worker, it was

27:55

a leap they may never have had. After

27:58

running the Toyota's temporary registration

28:01

number through their system, The

28:03

owner's name came back as Paul

28:05

Dennier. His address was also

28:07

on file. By late

28:09

afternoon, they arrived at Sharon

28:11

Johnson's in Paul Dennier's home. and

28:13

were knocking on the door. When

28:15

the door opened, Paul stood in

28:17

the doorway and politely invited

28:19

the detectives inside The large

28:21

twenty one year old had a boyish face

28:24

and came across as unassuming.

28:27

Once inside, detectives

28:29

began asking Paul about his whereabouts on

28:31

the night all three murders occurred, and

28:34

Paul had an answer for all of them. almost

28:36

as if you've been preparing for

28:38

that very moment. However,

28:40

the thing that caught detective's eyes

28:43

the most was an inch long

28:45

cut on the middle of Paul's middle

28:47

finger. It was fresh and

28:49

exactly the same size of the

28:51

piece of skin. that pathologist had

28:54

discovered during Natalie's autopsy.

28:56

Paul was then brought down to the station

28:58

for a formal interview. And

29:00

even though he tried to deny any involvement for

29:02

the better part of a day, he

29:05

finally decided to confess. a

29:08

confession that continues to haunt the

29:10

detectives to this very

29:12

day.

29:13

You told the detective Iberlikon that you were

29:16

responsible for the murders of the three the

29:18

three women. Just tell

29:20

us in your own words, Paul. What happened in

29:22

relation to the default? And

29:24

does it the students? I

29:26

walked up

29:26

behind us. I

29:28

stuck my left

29:30

turn around.

29:31

Fanded the

29:32

outside corners.

29:35

held

29:35

a gun behind the right hip.

29:37

I started tracking out the

29:40

flames. Can you

29:41

tell me why

29:43

you attacked her on that line? Just

29:46

said just said

29:48

the feeling that so With

29:50

what sort of feeling can you? personally

29:52

describe it when when you had

29:54

this feeling. Just

29:58

wanted just

29:59

wanted to

30:01

kill As

30:03

they listened to Paul describe in

30:06

painstaking detail, how he murdered

30:08

Elizabeth, Debbie and Natalie, Paul

30:10

confessed everything with the slightest

30:12

hint of remorse. His tone

30:14

was no different than if he'd been

30:16

recounting what he'd had for dinner that

30:19

night. He wasn't gloating, angry,

30:21

sorry, happy, or even scared.

30:24

And the detectives had never

30:26

seen or heard anything like it before

30:28

in their lives. When he was

30:30

asked, why he'd done it?

30:32

Paul responded simply. No.

30:35

Boys wanted to kill.

30:37

She's mad. Since I was

30:39

about forty. All three

30:41

victims have been killed at

30:44

random. simply and tragically

30:46

because they've been at the wrong place at

30:48

the wrong time. And if it

30:50

hadn't been done, it would have been someone

30:53

else.

30:58

It's difficult to overstate the amount

31:00

of relief Residents of Frankston

31:02

experienced after news of

31:04

Paul's arrest, sadly, that

31:06

relief was darkened by the

31:08

news of Natalie's murder And

31:10

the revelation that the serial

31:12

killer had been able to strike

31:14

one last time before his capture.

31:16

The sheer terror probably caused

31:18

the suburb can still be felt

31:21

today with one of Natalie's

31:23

best friends commenting earlier

31:25

this year. that even today,

31:27

there's not a woman in Frankston

31:29

that doesn't check her back seat before

31:31

getting in the car. In

31:33

December of nineteen ninety three,

31:35

Paul Dennier plead guilty to all three counts of

31:37

murder, as well as the abduction of

31:39

a woman named Rosa Toth. Only

31:42

an hour before Paul had crawled into

31:45

the back seat of Debbie Frame's car. He

31:47

detemplated to murder another woman outside

31:49

of a train station. However,

31:51

Rosa was somehow able to wrestle her

31:53

way out of Paul's clutches

31:55

then ran out onto a nearby

31:57

road where she was picked up by

31:59

a passing

31:59

motorist, but

32:01

Paul was determined to

32:03

finally turn his seven year long urge into

32:06

reality and decided to search

32:08

for another victim that very

32:10

night, Debbie. be

32:12

When it

32:15

came to Paul sentencing, many were

32:17

calling for the state of Victoria

32:19

to reinstitute the death penalty.

32:22

And although the judge may have

32:24

agreed, he was only able to

32:26

give Paul the harshest

32:28

sentence available under their

32:30

law, life imprisonment with

32:32

no minimum non parole period.

32:34

The judge ended the sentencing

32:37

by delivering some of the most chilling words

32:39

we've ever heard from a judge.

32:41

The apprehension you have caused

32:43

to thousands of women in the community

32:46

will be felt for a long time. You are

32:48

the fear that quickens their step as

32:50

they walk home or causes a

32:52

parent to look anxiously at

32:55

a clock when a child is late. And

32:57

with those words, Paul was sent

32:59

away, never to walk the

33:01

streets again. or

33:03

at least everyone hoped.

33:05

The following year, an

33:08

appeals court made a

33:10

different decision. they found that due to a

33:12

technicality, the original judge

33:14

had actually been required to set

33:16

a minimum non parole period

33:18

and so the appeals court finally

33:21

resentance Paul to a term

33:23

of life imprisonment with a

33:25

minimum non parole period of

33:27

thirty years. This now

33:29

meant Paul would be eligible for

33:31

parole after serving

33:33

thirty years. And as of

33:35

right now, it's been

33:37

twenty nine That means

33:39

that in less than a year, Paul

33:41

will be up for parole at the

33:43

age of fifty one.

33:46

families and friends of the murdered

33:48

victims are now speaking out

33:50

expressing outrage at Paul's

33:52

possible release. But in the

33:54

end, it'll be up to Australia's independent

33:56

adult parole board to make that

33:59

decision. For

34:04

nearly thirty years, criminologists,

34:07

detectives, journalists and authors have

34:09

all been trying to under Stan,

34:11

what could have possibly motivated Paul's

34:14

horrific killing spree? Where

34:16

was the malfunction in his

34:18

psyche? Or his environment

34:20

or childhood? what exactly

34:22

had me and him snap

34:24

for a long time. Paul

34:26

maintained that his violence and aggression

34:28

could be attributed to having been sexually assaulted by one of

34:30

his older brothers as a child. And

34:33

for years, that was the narrative he

34:35

used to explain his

34:38

actions In later years, it was revealed, Paul's

34:40

accusations about his brother

34:42

had been completely false with

34:45

Paul even later writing an apology to

34:48

his brother for lying.

34:50

And now here's doctor

34:52

Shahong Das, to dive

34:54

further into the mind of pulp

34:56

tenure and what may have been some

34:58

contributing factors that led him to go

35:00

on a

35:02

murder spree. Hello, cruel world. My name is doctor

35:04

Shahondas. I'm a consultant,

35:06

forensics psychiatrist, and I act as an expert

35:08

witness in criminal cases. And I'm also

35:10

the host of a YouTube

35:12

channel, a site for saw

35:14

minds. So let's look at the

35:16

psychoanalysis of

35:18

Paul Danielle. I think there are simply no easy

35:20

answers. During his trial,

35:22

Paul was diagnosed with sadistic

35:24

personality disorder.

35:27

That's a disorder defined by the

35:29

revised DSM three as a

35:31

person having a pervasive pattern

35:33

of sadistic and cruel behavior.

35:35

However, with the publishing of the DSM-four, which

35:38

only happened for the following year,

35:40

sadistic personality disorder was

35:42

removed as a

35:44

clinical diagnosis. due to this fear of it being used as a legal

35:46

excuse by dangerous criminals.

35:48

However, if we look at the modern day

35:50

framework of

35:52

diagnosed with influenza psychiatry, I would say

35:54

that he would fit in very neatly

35:56

with the diagnosis of

35:59

antisocial

35:59

personality disorder. otherwise known as

36:02

this social personality disorder.

36:04

So this is when an individual is

36:06

impulsive, they're aggressive, they

36:10

lack empathy, so they don't care about the rights and wrongs of other

36:12

people. They don't care about the law or

36:14

social barriers

36:16

or boundaries. and they tend not

36:18

to learn from their mistakes. So people with

36:20

antisocial personality disorder tend to

36:22

be repeat career criminals.

36:24

They tend to be like drug dealers or thugs

36:26

as opposed to others who might do one off acts of

36:28

violence in the heat of passion and

36:30

who might regret it afterwards. Regardless

36:33

of what the actual diagnosis was, one

36:36

thing that we can say about Paul

36:38

Denia is that as far back as

36:40

anyone can remember, there was

36:42

certainly a number of red

36:44

flags. As a child, he began

36:46

mutilating his sister's stuffed

36:48

animals. He would stab them. He would cut them.

36:50

He would pull out the stuffing. And even though he always denied it, his

36:52

mother and his siblings always knew

36:54

as him. They just couldn't prove

36:58

it. So what do I think of

37:00

this? I wonder if he developed some sort of perverse pleasure, just

37:02

being able to get away with this sadistic

37:06

behavior I wonder if it gave him a sense of

37:08

superiority and also a sense of

37:10

purpose. because for once he is the

37:12

one that

37:14

is intelligent. He is the one that's fooling and even haunting

37:16

all of those around him. And,

37:18

you know, he got away with it. He knew he

37:20

did it. They knew he did it.

37:22

he managed to hide in plain sight. But then things take an

37:25

even darker twist. Around the time that

37:27

he was twelve, Paul found a

37:29

stray kitten and cut

37:32

its throat before hanging it from a tree in his family's

37:34

backyard. Again, Paul

37:36

denied doing it that his brother found

37:40

fur and blood on one of Paul's pocket

37:42

knives. And as we all know, there's no smoke without

37:44

fire, there's no cat murdering without

37:46

blood. So moving on, the writing

37:48

joke in family was that Paul

37:50

had been dropped on his head as a

37:52

baby, in which in his case actually

37:54

happened. Throughout his childhood,

37:56

when Paul did something

37:58

inexplicable his family would usually chalk it up to the fore, always

37:59

believing the joke was all in good

38:02

fun. Now, actually, head injuries are a

38:03

complicated beast.

38:06

a very specific type of injury, so the frontal lobe and

38:08

the front of our brains. If that

38:11

very specific area is

38:14

damaged, then that can have implications on

38:16

people's aggression and on their behavior. They can become quite impulsive.

38:18

They can have a low threshold.

38:22

for violence. They can lose their inhibitions, and

38:24

also they no longer care about social

38:27

norms and boundaries. And in

38:29

extreme cases, this can actually lead to violence or

38:32

aggression, which is uncharacteristic.

38:34

So the person's personality

38:36

actually changes. is very rare, and it's a remarkable

38:39

thing to see. At school, Paul

38:41

was an unremarkable loner. He

38:43

had little interest, no friends,

38:45

zero personality. In fact. A

38:47

former teacher described him as being notable because he was so

38:50

bland. His prominent character traits was his

38:52

persistent indifference,

38:54

which would

38:56

come out when he described the details of his crimes spree to detectives

38:58

in the future. And I wonder if

39:00

this had an effect on him. So because of

39:02

his bland personality, because he just

39:05

blended into the furniture. I wonder if that

39:07

made him feel more isolated and

39:10

more marginalized. You know, he's

39:12

ignored by his peers. And

39:14

could this Maybe not

39:16

explaining the least contributed to his

39:18

obsession with violence. Maybe

39:20

now, finally, he's got a sense of

39:22

identity and purpose. What I'm saying

39:24

is after all of his years of feeling like a

39:26

nobody, now he was

39:28

somebody. At age fourteen is when

39:30

Paul claimed he first began the urge

39:32

to kill. just a year later,

39:34

he dropped out of school entirely

39:36

and began working in a string of low

39:38

pain jobs, but he never lasted for more

39:40

than a few months. Paul began walking

39:42

the street at night stalking women. He

39:44

later claimed he'd stalk the heaps of

39:46

them over the years, also while watching

39:48

through their windows, which is something eerily reminiscent of

39:51

serial killer Danny Rowling from

39:53

episode 111

39:56

the Gainesville murders, go check it out right now if you've not heard of

39:58

that episode. Unlike other serial killers

40:00

such as Darma, Paul also experimented

40:02

by killing animals before moving on

40:05

to humans. And I wonder why that was

40:07

maybe he had this certain thrill in

40:10

seeing these helpless animals

40:12

suffer, but like most kind

40:15

of carnal bloodlust urges. I wonder if over time he

40:17

built a tolerance so he needed like a

40:19

bigger target, he needed more

40:22

stimulation. to chase that initial

40:24

high and to get this this

40:26

bloody satisfaction. In early nineteen

40:28

ninety three, just months before the murders

40:30

began, Paul's slaughtered a pair goats slicing and dismembering

40:33

them in the middle of the

40:35

night. Not long after that, Paul

40:37

planned his first murder. a

40:40

woman named Donna who was one of his neighbor's sisters. Donna was

40:43

also a new mother just like

40:45

Debbie Freeman had been, and

40:48

one night She left a home taking her baby with her to time

40:50

with a friend. When she came home later

40:52

that night, she discovered that her

40:54

three house cats had been slaughtered

40:57

in horrific fashion. Why is it with this dude in

41:00

cats? On her wall, written in

41:02

cat's blood was the message Donna,

41:04

you're dead. Paul

41:06

later admitted

41:06

to being the one who'd broken into

41:08

a house that night. He also

41:10

admitted

41:10

that it wasn't the

41:12

cats he'd been he'd broken in

41:15

to murder Donna. So looking back at this

41:17

dude, the character's traits that really stand out

41:19

in Paul to me are him

41:21

being impulsive, aggressive, huge

41:24

lack of empathy and remorse, and

41:26

also a distinct pleasure in

41:28

intentionally choosing vulnerable victims

41:30

whether they be animals or humans.

41:33

So as I said before, this fits almost

41:35

perfectly. It's almost a textbook

41:37

example of antisocial personality

41:40

disorder. So that would be

41:42

my distant spot diagnosis. In nineteen

41:44

ninety three, thirty years, me

41:46

have seemed like a long way away.

41:49

an unspecified date in the

41:51

distant future. But now, all of

41:53

a sudden, thirty years is right

41:56

around the corner, And for the

41:58

residents of Frankston, anyone

42:00

who's a ramp back then still

42:02

remembers the manhunt for a

42:04

serial killer They remember the families of Elizabeth

42:06

Stevens, Debbie Frame and

42:08

Natalie Russell, and the three

42:10

young women whose lives worked viciously

42:14

stolen from them. But in nineteen ninety four,

42:16

Debbie Frame's cousin Sarah predicted

42:18

that while the community might

42:21

remember all the other details.

42:24

There's one thing she's afraid

42:26

might be forgotten. The

42:28

sheer terror Paul inflicted on

42:31

an entire community.

42:48

I'd like to thank Dr. Shaham

42:50

Doss for providing his insight on

42:52

this episode. If you wanna hear more

42:54

from him, check out his YouTube channel.

42:57

a psych for sore minds. I also want

42:59

to thank again all of our listeners

43:01

and online community that have reached out

43:03

to us with such kind

43:05

messages of support. in light of

43:07

our recent nightmare. And

43:10

finally, I wanna thank Phil from

43:12

Classic Edge shaving. His site is one

43:14

of my favorite places to order mail

43:16

grooming supplies. I made an order with

43:18

him last week and called the follow-up on

43:20

the order. And when he found out that I lost

43:22

almost everything in the flood, he

43:24

put a care package together for me. to see me through

43:26

until we get the house back together. So

43:28

even though I'm living ahead of a suitcase for the

43:30

next few months,