0:01

RadioTopia from

0:03

PRX I

0:30

know Mama thought when we got to California, her and her kids would

0:32

be fine. But

0:58

that wasn't true. Limited

1:47

by State Law. Oh,

2:00

well, I definitely think about being a teenager, um,

2:03

with, uh, no plans to do anything,

2:05

uh, being a little depressed about it.

2:08

Because if I'm hearing that song, it

2:10

means I'm yet again home alone on

2:12

a Friday night watching a sitcom that

2:15

was meant for kids that were definitely

2:18

younger than I was. Because of course

2:20

that is the theme to full house, which

2:22

was one of the biggest sitcoms of the

2:24

nineties. It was giant. Yeah. It was huge.

2:26

It was like, that is not

2:28

the show that I would have thought would

2:31

have like surpassed the Cosby show or whatever

2:33

was right before it in terms of like

2:35

big hit shows. I mean, I feel

2:38

like that show was a dividing line

2:40

between kids who are still watching Nickelodeon

2:42

and kids were getting into MTV. Like

2:45

if you were old enough that you

2:47

were into MTV, you were probably not

2:49

that into full house anymore. But if

2:51

you watch Nickelodeon, you loved full house.

2:53

I always felt like I was born

2:56

a little too early to be super

2:58

into full house. I

3:00

appreciated it. And I definitely,

3:02

definitely had a crush on Lori Laughlin, even

3:04

though she was like 20 or

3:07

30 years older than I was. But she was

3:09

in the coolest, you know, BMX bike movie and

3:11

of all times. So, so

3:13

that makes sense that you would have that crush.

3:15

Fair. Of course. I'm, I'm speaking of rad. Well,

3:20

we mentioned all this because, you know,

3:22

like you and I are both Gen X and

3:24

as you pointed out, that show had a little

3:26

bit more of a millennial appeal. But

3:28

one of the things that we've learned over the years

3:31

of doing mortified is honestly how

3:33

important full house

3:35

was to just so many people. August

3:38

17th, Dear Journal, Josh's

3:41

dad got his fingers cut off and his

3:43

cousin and aunt have Lyme's disease. Well,

3:48

I got to go watch full house. January

3:53

22nd. I wish mom

3:55

would leave me alone. She's acting like

3:57

Danny Tanner on full house. Giving

4:02

everyone love and hugs. Shit,

4:04

who cares? So

4:07

needless to say, we were shocked

4:09

but also really delighted to discover

4:11

that Jodi Sweetin, aka Stephanie Tanner

4:13

from Full House, was apparently a

4:16

big fan of Mortified. And

4:18

frustratingly, it took us 20 years

4:20

of doing the show to find that

4:22

out. All I have to say

4:24

is, how rude! Which is

4:27

incredible to think about because what

4:29

that means is that just as

4:31

you, the Mortified community, loved watching her

4:33

grow up on TV, she has

4:35

actually loved hearing how you grew

4:37

up through the diaries, letters,

4:39

and poems in Mortified. So

4:41

today on the show, we're continuing our

4:43

celebration of Mortified's 20th anniversary

4:46

with a very special episode

4:48

featuring a fascinating conversation with

4:50

Jodi Sweetin. Actor, author, podcaster,

4:53

and stand-up comedian. What? Yep,

4:56

it's true. And as you're about to hear,

4:58

it turns out that Jodi's childhood was quite

5:00

different from the one that she portrayed as

5:02

Stephanie Tanner. So

5:05

the stuff that you have, how old were you when you

5:07

wrote it? So I was 15. And

5:11

I now have a daughter who is 15 turning

5:13

16 in April. So like

5:15

reading this, I'm just like, oh my god. Has

5:17

she read any of this? No, I have never ever read any

5:19

of this to anyone. These

5:27

words have never left my mouth. So.

5:30

Well, I have a great idea. You should share

5:32

it on a podcast. Right. Again,

5:34

scare yourself. You know what

5:37

I mean? Just extremes. Were

5:39

you precious about picking out the notebook? Can

5:41

you show it to us? Oh yeah, yes. No,

5:43

no, no, no, no. It's got a little cherub and a sun.

5:49

It almost sort of reminds me of... Smashing

5:53

Pumpkins. I was going to say of the

5:55

Smashing Pumpkins album cover. So you can see

5:57

at Smashing Pumpkins, I was also very into.

6:00

I'm down with the freaks and you. Just

6:05

to give us a little context, what was

6:07

going on at that time that you were deciding

6:09

to sit down and write in a notebook about

6:11

it? So, you know, Full House

6:13

ended for me when I was 13 and

6:18

going into high school. So

6:20

this was my junior year of high school

6:22

and I was

6:24

really struggling to figure out

6:26

who I was, like

6:29

most of us are at 15 or 16, but

6:32

I had kind of this added

6:34

layer of this expectation from

6:36

people and from peers who, you know,

6:38

quote unquote, grew up with me, but

6:40

didn't know me. But

6:43

I walked into it with people having

6:45

this preconceived notion kind

6:47

of of who I was. And I

6:49

still didn't know who I was. So

6:51

I think a lot of this writing

6:53

was me figuring out who

6:56

I am and feeling really

6:58

lonely. And it's one of

7:00

the reasons that I fell in love with Mortified

7:02

is because that feeling of like being so alone

7:05

and then being able to read it back

7:07

and know that you weren't

7:10

and that it didn't happen that way, those

7:13

were the things I was looking for at that time was

7:15

how do I not feel alone? How do I figure myself

7:17

out? And I was also, I was

7:21

adopted at an early age. So I had

7:24

also that layer of like, I didn't

7:26

know my biological parents

7:28

or birth family. I

7:31

just knew that addiction was something that

7:34

they both suffered from. And

7:36

so I had this weird

7:38

piece of me that was also trying to figure

7:40

out like where I came from and who

7:43

was I like? Who was I, who

7:45

did I look like? Who did I laugh like? Who,

7:47

you know, all those things that you're

7:50

trying to figure out for yourself as

7:52

a teenager. And so I think a lot of the feelings

7:55

I had were also things

7:58

that I didn't feel like anyone else understood. stood. None

8:01

of my close friends at that time

8:03

were adopted. None of, you

8:06

know, none of the friends that I went to school with

8:09

had been on a TV series for

8:11

eight years that was immensely popular with

8:13

everyone at school. Hey,

8:16

let's see some smiles. Everything

8:18

is going to work out super great. And

8:20

then you just lost your family, essentially your

8:22

TV family. Right, exactly. So you had that.

8:25

Really grieving that. And I have never,

8:27

until I got a little older, really

8:30

pieced together just how much grief

8:32

I think there was in that. And

8:35

reading back through these poems, I

8:37

see how I was kind

8:40

of pouring that out onto the

8:42

page. But I also

8:45

like, in

8:47

reading this, I'm actually really proud of like

8:49

15 year old me and being like, you

8:52

were just trying to get

8:54

it out any way you could to not judge

8:56

it, to write like no one's going to ever read

8:58

it unless I decide to read it on a podcast

9:00

at some point in 20 years in the future. Is

9:05

there a dedication at the beginning of the notebook,

9:07

like a keep out kind of thing? Oh,

9:09

just wait. Let's

9:12

hear it. It just says Jodi's

9:15

writing book and I

9:17

kissed the front of it

9:20

with my lipstick. With a little smudge. With a little smudge. I'm

9:24

pretty sure that color was was

9:27

Mac. Oh gosh, spice.

9:29

Yep. That was the lipstick color

9:31

I wore in high school. And

9:33

I can absolutely. It looks a

9:35

little clairdane-sy in its color. Very much.

9:37

Like my so-called life color. Yeah. Obsessed.

9:40

That's where it started. My so-called life. Drama.

9:43

Rayan, I'm not nervous. No,

9:45

just listen. Jordan Catalano was having

9:47

a conversation with me like on

9:50

purpose, like a really

9:52

nice conversation. Don't hate

9:55

me. What? That show came out, I think,

9:57

when I was in eighth grade. So, So

10:00

it really just teed it up for like,

10:03

here's what your high school experience is,

10:05

like pain and heartbreak.

10:07

And just to give us a

10:09

visual of like what was 15 year

10:12

old Jodie dressing like? Were you trying to

10:14

fit into a certain style or group? Yes,

10:18

I definitely, I spent

10:20

far longer getting ready in

10:22

high school than I do at any point

10:24

today. I was pretty mainstream

10:28

on the outside. I mean, it wasn't going

10:30

to be goth or anything, nobody would

10:32

buy it. So I

10:34

was like, cute 90s styles. Clueless

10:37

was big. So

10:40

I know there were definitely some like plaid

10:42

skirts and like the knee high socks and

10:45

the like that kind of 90s

10:47

Cher-esque vibe. My room

10:49

at home, my mom, it

10:52

was, my room was done beautifully. It was

10:54

all like floral. It was

10:56

like Laura Ashley puked everywhere. Just

10:59

flowers and

11:01

ruffles and all that. And it was

11:03

lovely. It was gorgeous. My mom, but

11:05

it was decidedly my mom's

11:08

taste, which I thought

11:10

that was my taste for a very long time. I

11:12

was curious, what would you say would

11:14

be something that your character listened to

11:17

in her bedroom alone? And what did

11:19

real life Jodie Sweeten listen to in

11:22

her bedroom while writing in diary entries?

11:26

Well, I'll tell you what I actually

11:29

wrote too, which was like Tori Amos,

11:32

Fiona Apple, all the 90s

11:35

like girl sort of, you know,

11:37

feelings. Yeah, feelings. Yeah,

11:39

yeah, yeah. There was some Ani DeFranco thrown in

11:41

there. I was very into Tracy Chapman for a

11:43

while. Just cut

11:45

me open and pour my heart out sort

11:47

of music. But that was what I

11:49

would write poetry to. What would Steph write poetry to?

11:52

I feel like Steph might be

11:54

a little more like hop

11:57

friendly, like some slower.

12:00

pop of the era. So like early 90s R&B

12:03

kind of thing. So

12:10

I would sit and write this

12:12

really depressing poetry in

12:15

the window seat of my

12:17

bedroom that overlooked the front yard and we

12:19

had these big like beautiful trees in the

12:21

front. So it was you know the perfect

12:23

place and the sun set on the it

12:25

was you know facing the west. So it

12:27

was a great spot to sit and like

12:29

look for Lornley out the window and you

12:32

know just rest your head against the pain

12:34

of glass and you know. But

12:37

it was also a perfect spot to

12:39

write poetry because it was like being kind of

12:42

in the trees and the sun or the moon depending

12:44

on how late I was writing. So

12:47

from like all outward appearances you probably

12:49

seemed like you had it all together.

12:51

Life seemed great to

12:53

anybody who was looking in from the outside. Yeah

12:55

yeah yeah yeah the loneliness and

12:57

grief and all of those things

13:00

and just the not

13:02

knowing who you are at 15

13:04

was definitely there underneath but

13:07

on the surface you wouldn't have known

13:09

it. Well why don't we have you share

13:11

as long as it's something

13:13

that gives you a visceral reaction of discomfort.

13:18

I mean all of this

13:20

gives me a physical sense

13:22

of discomfort. I'll start

13:24

off with this one's like a

13:27

page of the journal. I also

13:29

will say I really enjoyed using

13:31

very strong juxtaposition of things. That

13:34

was a big theme in my writing and

13:36

it's interesting that we're sort of talking about

13:39

the outside versus the inside and it's a

13:41

lot of that comes through kind of in

13:43

my writing. Alright here

13:45

we go. Exciting. Bear

13:48

with me everyone okay. She

13:52

walks as graceful as a ballerina but

13:54

cannot dance. She buys

13:56

books of Shakespeare and plays of Pinter

13:58

but cannot read. She

14:01

writes novels and poems but cannot spell.

14:04

She sleeps but cannot dream. She

14:06

is in all of us pretending to be something

14:08

we aren't. A dancer, a

14:11

painter, a writer, a dreamer, a lover.

14:14

For life is all lies. Wow.

14:19

For life is all lies and the only truth

14:21

is night and day. And even then

14:23

it's not the same everywhere. We

14:25

all think we hide her but anyone

14:27

can see through transparency if you look

14:29

hard enough. Dun

14:32

dun dun. That's

14:38

pretty good actually. I mean, maybe

14:41

I was a liar. I don't know. It's

14:46

very Lydia Deets. I

14:49

am alone. No, I

14:51

am utterly alone. Live

14:54

people ignore the strange and

14:57

unusual. I

14:59

myself am strange and

15:01

unusual. It's just so funny

15:03

to read that too because that

15:07

sense of

15:09

loneliness and despair

15:11

and all of that isn't... Like

15:15

I can look back on this and be like, oh

15:17

wow. Hey, you've made

15:19

it through that. It

15:21

didn't swallow you up. Do

15:24

you remember where you were when you wrote that? In

15:26

my window seat for sure. That was my

15:29

poetry writing spot. Often when I wrote

15:31

poetry it would be when I couldn't

15:33

sleep. And

15:36

I'd like wake up kind of randomly in the

15:38

middle of the night and I would just go

15:40

sit and write in my window seat.

15:43

Like by candlelight alone because

15:45

you know, yeah, just really leaning into it. Yeah,

15:48

yeah, yeah, yeah. And probably do some, I don't

15:50

know, burn something or like summon something with it.

15:52

You know, who isn't a witch at 15. But

15:55

yeah, it was definitely the

15:57

window seat was the spot. Okay,

16:01

here's this fabulous poem. Little

16:04

by little, we open as

16:06

a rose. But like

16:08

a rose, by the time we are

16:10

open, we die and

16:13

are never free for long. I

16:17

mean, just a lot of like, you almost get

16:19

it, and then you're dead. Yeah, you're just really

16:21

like, hey, things are gonna, nope, yeah, and you're

16:23

gonna die. I

16:26

like the juxtaposition of this like

16:28

beautiful rose, and then just depression

16:30

and death underneath. Right,

16:32

I mean, it's very goth, very,

16:35

very goth. I do share

16:37

a birthday with Edgar Allan Poe, and I

16:39

am a big fan of his work. You

16:41

can tell. Yeah, it's kinda coming through, little

16:43

bit, little bit. Yeah. Is

16:46

there anybody buried under the floorboards by you?

16:49

Nevermore. No, I, Yeah,

16:52

no, not to, Lenora's not here.

16:54

No, she is not under the floorboards. Okay.

16:59

I found a letter that

17:01

we had to write my senior

17:03

year. We had

17:05

to write something

17:08

about the essence of ourselves. And

17:12

it really, really, it was, it's interesting

17:14

because it really had nothing to do with

17:16

me. And I

17:19

really wrote more about like all of my friends

17:21

and the people that I connected with. It was

17:23

at my Orange County High School for the Arts,

17:25

which is where I went to high school. I

17:27

was in the musical theater program, and apparently

17:30

we had to write a whole little like goodbye letter

17:33

to our class and read it out loud. So shall

17:35

we? Do you wanna read this? The

17:37

essence of me. What

17:39

is that? And could I explain it in

17:42

two minutes? Probably not. But

17:44

right now, as we sit here, I look

17:46

back on the past four years and remember

17:48

how we went from the class from hell,

17:51

which was our class's nickname, to such a

17:53

group of people filled with talent and potential.

17:56

I remember all of our silly little inside

17:58

jokes, the fun we had in our school. shows

18:00

and everything. You have all been

18:02

my family. You have been there for me and I for

18:04

you, at least I hope. At times

18:06

you were the only ones who could understand

18:08

me or who wanted to listen. Maybe

18:11

you don't like me or maybe I'm one of your

18:13

best friends, but I mean this from

18:15

the bottom of my heart. Thank you. My

18:17

life has been richer, funner, funnier, sweeter,

18:20

and much more interesting because of all

18:22

of you. So as we

18:24

all graduate and go our separate ways, let

18:27

us not forget the moments. No

18:29

matter how much we all bitch and complain

18:31

about people or school, we did

18:33

have a good time. Also,

18:35

remember the last day in Stevie's class.

18:39

Stevie was my high school

18:41

drama teacher and also my

18:44

mom's best friend and she passed a

18:46

few years ago during COVID. So it's

18:49

also neat to read this. Also

18:51

remember the last day in Stevie's class with the

18:53

breaking of our glasses. As

18:55

a class, we did like this whole little ceremony

18:57

where we all like broke glasses together and then

18:59

it was like all of the pieces of our

19:01

individual glasses were all mixed up together and there'll

19:03

always be pieces of you that are together. We

19:06

are a class, a group of close

19:08

friends joined together by secrets, love, and

19:10

joy. Thank you. I love you all.

19:13

That is the essence of me. What

19:15

came up for you when you were reading that? Reading

19:17

that reminds me so

19:19

much of the same feelings that

19:21

I had in leaving

19:23

Full House when I was a kid

19:25

and all of those same exact things

19:27

could be almost applicable to

19:29

that group of people too. So it's

19:32

kind of an interesting thing to see

19:34

this constant through line, I

19:36

guess, in my life of families

19:39

coming and going and

19:41

kind of the process of getting

19:43

to know people and then letting them go again. Your

19:46

Uncle Jesse's moving in, my best

19:48

friend Joey is moving in, and you know what?

19:51

That means that you too are going to get

19:53

to be roommates. Isn't that exciting? I

19:56

can wear all DJ's clothes.

20:00

You know what I found interesting was that in

20:03

that letter you didn't get

20:05

to specifics. And

20:07

so the letter then feels general and then

20:09

could be sort of assigned to any situation

20:11

in your life in a way. Right. It

20:14

is interesting because nothing gets too

20:17

personal, but I know that each

20:19

thing that I wrote came from

20:21

a very specific interaction.

20:25

But I would often write like that if I

20:28

was going to be saying something so that I

20:30

wouldn't reveal mine or anyone else's secrets

20:32

or feelings or anything. You know, easier

20:35

to keep it a little at arm's length, I guess.

20:40

Would you characterize this specific class like

20:43

another group of people where you

20:45

had this very intense connection with

20:47

and then it ended? Like

20:50

are you connecting with the grief of it ending or

20:52

are you connecting with the feeling

20:55

of family? Being an

20:57

actor my entire life and sort of

20:59

always having different groups of friends and

21:01

rotating through different people that

21:04

I'm close to. I think

21:06

I've in a way

21:08

learned that you can kind of

21:11

connect with a family over and over again, even

21:13

if it's different and let it go and that

21:16

that grief isn't going to break you. And that

21:18

actually it's a really great thing to get to

21:20

know people and then move on

21:22

and more new people. And

21:24

I think like that's

21:27

kind of what I feel in this is

21:29

that it

21:31

was the grief of moving on

21:33

and the

21:36

fear of the unknown. It was

21:38

the same group of us that went through all

21:40

four years of this performing arts program. But it

21:43

wasn't it wasn't quite like the

21:46

full house family because in that sense,

21:48

the adults I think really had an

21:50

impact and there was a sense of

21:52

attachment that I got to them.

21:56

At the time, it feels huge and big,

21:58

but it doesn't feel As

22:02

isolating as that grief did

22:05

when I was like

22:08

going through the process of losing kind of the full

22:10

house family. You know, when the show

22:13

ended, it was a very lonely experience.

22:15

And as much as you're, you know, kind

22:17

of, you know, it's not going to last

22:19

forever as a kid, it's

22:21

always a surprise. And I think with high school,

22:23

you're kind of like counting down to till it

22:25

ends. So you have this sense of preparation the

22:28

entire time you're there. Well,

22:30

I was just going to say, like, there's a criticism

22:32

people often throw at sitcoms. And

22:36

especially like the type of sitcom that

22:38

Full House is where it's like it's

22:40

this thing with like a 30 minute

22:42

hug and like stories end. It's comfort

22:44

food. It's nothing to challenge you.

22:47

It's to make you feel like a hug, you know? And

22:50

so that criticism has always kind of

22:52

lived in me. But in

22:54

hearing you talk about this, it's making me

22:56

realize like, oh, you know, you

22:59

got to have an experience where

23:01

there were like forced endings. Like

23:03

where it's like there's this, oh, we're

23:05

all going to go our separate ways. But you had had that

23:08

a couple of years before. But then

23:10

within that, literally every time

23:12

you make an episode, it's like a

23:15

store, a thing just arbitrarily ends. But

23:18

I wonder if that prepared you. Like, did sitcom

23:20

life prepare you for real life in some

23:22

bizarre manner? I think the way my

23:24

ADHD brain works is great sometimes because

23:26

I'll just sort of forget that I'm

23:28

upset about something. I'll be like,

23:30

oh, yeah, I was kind of bummed about that. I'm fine now. But

23:34

I think it definitely taught me the value

23:37

of appreciating the moment while

23:39

you're in it and that

23:42

while endings do come, it doesn't

23:44

always mean that they're permanent. And

23:47

that was one of the really great things

23:49

about coming back and doing Fuller House is

23:52

that when I walked away from that at

23:54

13, I thought that

23:56

was it, that I would never get

23:58

to have that experience. again and that was what

24:01

broke my heart because I loved it and I

24:03

loved those people. And

24:05

so getting to come back and do

24:07

that again on the

24:09

same exact stage with the same

24:11

people and some of the same

24:13

producers and directors, that was a

24:16

huge healing moment I think and I'm

24:19

so grateful for it both professionally

24:21

but personally too. I

24:23

really think it

24:26

was able to kind of heal something

24:28

in me and was that

24:30

great reminder that life circles

24:32

back around sometimes in ways that you

24:35

will never know or expect or see

24:37

coming. And it

24:40

has made all of the hellos and

24:42

goodbyes a little bit easier I think.

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26:01

do have a deep question. Maybe I'll come back to it later. Ooh,

26:03

a deep question. Let's

26:05

hear the gam. Like when you can't just tease us with a

26:07

deep question and then we'll come back to it. You can't

26:09

dangle that character. Well, I'm sorry.

26:12

I apologize. I just wonder,

26:15

you know, having the

26:17

experience of having been adopted at a very

26:19

young age. I was about 14

26:21

months old, yeah. Yeah, so very, very

26:23

young. I've heard a lot of times when

26:25

you're adopted that you can have issues of

26:27

abandonment. Indeed, yes, a lot. I

26:30

just wonder if that feeling

26:32

of like when Full House ended,

26:35

looking back perhaps, would feelings of

26:37

like abandonment like come up?

26:39

There's a lot of that

26:41

writing in here about being

26:43

abandoned, about being abandoned by

26:45

your mother. I definitely knew

26:47

that was part of it. I

26:50

was very aware that that was

26:53

a very complicated

26:55

sense of loss for me. And

26:58

so I knew that those two things

27:00

were connected, that that sense of losing

27:02

one family absolutely was pushing the button

27:05

of that sense of abandonment and loss

27:08

in other areas of my life. I

27:11

didn't know how to fix it or make

27:13

it better or make it not hurt. But

27:17

I knew that they were deeply connected. You

27:21

were adopted by, correct me if I'm wrong,

27:23

an uncle, right? Well,

27:26

sort of kind of. It's

27:29

complicated and usually requires some sort of a

27:31

whiteboard and a map. But my

27:33

dad, my adopted dad, but I

27:36

call him my dad, Sam, his

27:39

ex-wife, who he was

27:41

not married to anymore, but she was

27:44

my biological dad's

27:47

aunt. And

27:49

because both of my parents were incarcerated

27:52

when I was born, my

27:57

dad, Sam, adopted dad's ex-wife,

28:00

wife and his kids who were my

28:02

cousins actually took me home from the

28:04

hospital and were some of

28:06

the people that were looking after me. I kind of got

28:08

passed around everywhere. My mom was in and out of jail

28:10

and I kind of would wind up with her for a

28:12

little bit and then not and then get left places and

28:15

kind of all over. It wasn't really

28:17

my uncle through any sort

28:20

of way. It wasn't by marriage

28:22

anymore but it's a strange overlap

28:24

so it was sort of an inner family

28:26

adoption and my parents always told me that

28:29

I was adopted so it was close

28:32

enough that I sort of knew some things

28:34

and knew little bits and pieces enough to

28:37

make me ask more questions but

28:40

not really get any answers. Were

28:42

you born then in a like

28:44

a prison hospital? I was born at, yeah I was born

28:47

at U.C. County Medical Center in

28:49

downtown LA where they

28:51

take inmates, women prisoners who

28:53

are in jail at times. She was

28:56

in LA County. My biological dad was

28:58

in Soledad, California

29:01

state prison and was stabbed

29:04

in the heart there and killed when I was about nine months old.

29:09

I'm sorry to hear that. Thank you. But

29:12

again those were all, and I've talked about

29:14

some of this in my book, but

29:16

I know that these were all things

29:18

that deeply affected me

29:21

and deeply affected my

29:24

sense of self and then

29:26

you know constantly feeling like okay well who am I?

29:29

I'm not this

29:32

Stephanie girl. I don't know where my smile comes from

29:34

or who I look like or what you know but

29:36

I know it's not necessarily my parents. I have some

29:39

things that I share with them but

29:41

I'm not of them. That

29:43

was sort of my thinking at 13 you know. And

29:45

at the time of writing all this you knew the

29:50

truth? Yeah yeah yeah I knew the

29:52

truth. I knew, I was probably about 11

29:54

or 12 when my parents kind

29:57

of told me everything. I always knew that.

29:59

that I was adopted and it

30:02

was a special family and things like that, but it

30:04

was also something that I was told not to talk

30:06

about and was kind of kept very

30:08

quiet because my

30:11

mom was afraid of people's judgment because

30:13

I was on TV and lived a

30:15

public life and she was afraid of

30:18

people judging where I came from. And

30:21

so this was also something that I didn't

30:23

talk about and I, up until

30:25

this time had kept pretty

30:28

secret. And so a lot of these

30:30

poems and stories coming out were the

30:32

only place that I was really

30:35

getting any of these thoughts out and even

30:38

acknowledging them. What I

30:40

find really interesting is that if

30:43

someone was just hearing your poetry and

30:45

some of the themes in there about like, you don't really

30:48

know what's going on underneath the hood, they

30:50

might assume it's just related to you're

30:54

reacting to how people saw you on

30:56

Full House. But it seems

30:58

like that theme was happening

31:00

from a much younger age. Yeah,

31:02

it has always been a theme,

31:04

I think, in my life. And

31:06

it's been something that

31:09

I have done

31:11

a lot of work on on how to

31:13

reconcile the inner and the outer

31:15

worlds and how to

31:19

walk through discomfort and things like

31:21

that, but also be

31:23

able to share it. And that was, I

31:25

think, something I didn't like doing for

31:28

most of my life. I was very afraid

31:30

of sharing all of this kind of stuff.

31:32

And then after I wrote my

31:34

book in 2009 and

31:37

talked about being adopted and about

31:40

struggling with some of my addiction issues and things like that, all

31:43

of a sudden, all of those feelings,

31:45

when you shine the light on and

31:47

they become smaller and less monstrous. And

31:49

it really has been something that I've

31:51

kind of always come back to in

31:53

my life is this idea of who

31:56

am I putting out into the world? Who

31:58

am I putting forward? And it's... Is that who

32:00

I am and how do I line those two

32:03

things up? Because I don't like

32:05

being one person on the outside and

32:07

another on the inside. I like to

32:09

have those two people be synced

32:11

up and match and be

32:13

able to be as honest and truthful as I can

32:16

in all areas of my life. I

32:18

can see why something like

32:21

mortified or things in that world

32:23

would be something you might connect

32:25

to because that is such an

32:28

intense relationship with shame for a

32:30

child to develop of hide

32:33

this super important thing

32:35

about my life and

32:38

for presumably well-meaning protective

32:41

reasons. Absolutely, my mom and I

32:43

have obviously talked about it now and

32:45

of course she was like, I wanted

32:47

to protect you. I didn't want these

32:50

things to come back and haunt you. And

32:52

I love her for that but I definitely

32:56

grew up thinking this was something I

32:58

had to not talk about. The

33:02

addiction that you were experiencing, that you

33:04

wrote about in your book, you've talked

33:06

about in the past, was that already

33:09

going on? I believe

33:11

I read that you had started that at age

33:13

13 but I could be wrong

33:15

about that. Was that going on while you were

33:17

writing this? I'm sure that there's a couple in

33:19

here that I wrote on some stolen wine coolers

33:22

or something that I had sconded to my room

33:24

with. But

33:26

I was already struggling

33:29

with drinking and with knowing

33:31

that I already

33:33

didn't drink like other people that

33:36

I already, I was already the one that was

33:38

being an idiot right out of the gate. And

33:41

it was also this weird sense of

33:43

connection, right? Because all I really knew

33:45

other than sort of a few stories

33:47

about both of my biological parents

33:49

was that they struggled with addiction issues. So

33:51

it was also something that

33:53

I've picked apart over the years where it was

33:55

this weird sense of connection to

33:58

people that I didn't know thing I

34:00

did know about them was that and so

34:02

when I picked up a drink and it

34:05

felt like it made everything

34:07

better like it does for

34:09

you know the alcoholic brain it was

34:11

like oh okay well here's something

34:13

that I'm like them you

34:16

know here's a way that I can identify with

34:18

them but it was also then this huge resentment

34:20

of like oh now am I you

34:23

know am I a fuckup because of

34:25

you and this is your fault and you

34:28

know so there was a lot of complicated emotions I

34:30

think with that does your

34:32

mom or dad to the best of

34:34

your knowledge write did they write poetry

34:36

my biological parents you mean um I

34:39

don't know I don't know I have I

34:42

have one letter from my

34:44

biological dad that he wrote to

34:49

his aunt Rose the one that was that was taking care

34:51

of me I have one letter from him that he wrote

34:53

from jail talking about that

34:56

he regretted you know what he'd done and

34:58

it was like bad checks and and drugs

35:00

nothing there's no I don't think anything violent

35:03

but he was

35:05

you know talking about how disappointed he was and

35:07

how he couldn't wait to come home and see

35:09

me and all this you know and and it

35:11

was I have that one letter I have

35:15

one little shred of writing let's

35:20

hear some more writing okay let's

35:22

see by the way did

35:25

any of the things you wrote were any of them songs

35:27

no no I

35:29

didn't you know I sing and I

35:32

write poetry but I never I I guess I

35:34

never thought about writing songs and combining the two

35:36

what would Tory think I know

35:38

right well that was the thing too is I I

35:40

was like when you write songs they have to rhyme

35:42

and I was like Tory Amos

35:44

doesn't this you know you don't have to

35:47

I guess I sold myself short on that

35:49

one here we go this one is about

35:51

endings this was very specifically about endings so

35:54

it's ending the life I knew is just

35:56

beginning and the one yet to come is

35:58

ending I'll never know them again The

36:00

time for this is gone. I can't

36:03

say goodbye, but I don't want to say hello. Because

36:06

it all will end eventually. And as

36:08

the sun sets in the sky, with it sets

36:10

the old me. The me

36:12

of last year. The me that could never

36:14

be hurt. The me that

36:16

had no doubts, no worries, no pain.

36:19

But that was not life. On the

36:21

way down, life went out and I came

36:23

in. I don't know where I... Wow,

36:26

that's the most profound one. This

36:28

one actually is... This one is

36:30

not terribly

36:33

morbid and depressing.

36:38

You know what I keep imagining in my mind? I

36:41

keep imagining that the show continued for a

36:43

few more years. But that

36:45

you were writing stuff like this in your journals and

36:48

then one day you walked into the offices and you're

36:50

like, I have

36:52

to read this on the show as Stephanie Tanner. And

36:55

we have to do this dark episode with my poetry

36:57

in it and then watching

36:59

the writers ripping their hair out. Just be like,

37:01

how do we make this funny? I don't know.

37:04

Stephanie's having a dramatic moment. Just

37:07

you demanding it. I need to

37:09

read my poetry. If

37:12

window sales could talk. Truly. You

37:14

know, it's funny, I actually just last

37:17

week, I drove by the old

37:20

house that we lived in with the window seat where

37:22

I used to sit and write

37:24

poetry. And I drove by there

37:26

with my younger daughter,

37:29

who's 13, and my mom, we

37:31

had been out getting lunch, visiting

37:33

my parents. And I asked my

37:35

younger one, I said, have you... did you ever see

37:37

the house that I grew up in from middle

37:39

school and high school? She was like, I don't

37:42

think so. So we drove by it and

37:44

she was like, that's where you were. I was like, yep, there

37:46

was my window and my window seat. I'm

37:48

just remembering there was a show... I think it might have been a

37:51

TGIF show. There was

37:53

a show called the Torkel Sins. Yes. Where like

37:55

the main teenage girl in the show, she sat

37:58

in a window sill and... and

38:00

wrote poetry. Oh my gosh, that's right. I just

38:02

remember. I loved the Torquelson's. You were on the wrong

38:04

show. Yeah, actually, and I loved that show.

38:06

Maybe I was inspired by it. I don't know. I'm

38:09

the lost Torquelson. Here's

38:12

one that I wrote to

38:14

myself. I remember writing this

38:16

at a time when I, again,

38:19

was really struggling with who I was.

38:21

And I remember,

38:24

oh God, sitting in

38:27

my room and staring in the mirror,

38:30

as you do with a candle, and you're like,

38:32

who am I? Who

38:34

am I really? As I look

38:36

through you, I see more

38:38

than you know that you reveal. So

38:40

clear to me, which puzzles me

38:42

even more. Is that about you? Yeah,

38:45

I guess I'm looking at myself. I

38:48

know that there's more than whatever this is,

38:52

but I don't know what that is yet. Did

38:54

you try on a bunch of identities for a while ever?

38:57

I didn't because I was still

38:59

auditioning here and there and working so it

39:01

was like, I never went for cutting

39:05

my hair and dying it black, but

39:07

I also had, I think, these other

39:09

little inner personalities. My inner goth, which

39:12

is very evident here, I

39:14

had my inner

39:16

riot girl who just, screw

39:19

authority and did everything that you weren't

39:21

supposed to do. But then there was

39:23

the me that was great with teachers

39:25

and could cover everything up. So

39:27

it was all of these different personas, I think,

39:29

that I had inside. That's the half that lives

39:32

up to your last name. Yes, exactly, yeah, that's

39:34

the half that really, it's the

39:36

sweetened part. Can

39:39

I just pose this as an idea? Yeah. If

39:41

you're interested, you

39:44

have a singing voice. You've

39:47

written things that could be Toriyemos

39:49

lyrics. Oh, that's true. If

39:52

you're interested as an improvisational

39:54

exercise, it would be interesting to hear

39:56

any of these if they

39:58

were songs because Yeah,

42:00

you can't go! Sweetie,

42:02

it's only for a couple hours. Steph,

42:05

we'll be here with you. Yeah, we'll play any

42:07

game you want. No, I want my

42:09

daddy! You can't go.

42:11

Don't leave me. Don't leave me.

42:14

It's OK. It's OK. I won't go. I'll

42:16

stay here with you. OK? Everything's all right.

42:21

And to always kind of be available

42:25

and allowing what's next in

42:28

that never-ending series of hellos and goodbyes that

42:30

sort of make up all of our lives,

42:33

right? And so now the goodbyes

42:35

are a lot less scary. I've

42:38

been able to change my perspective and

42:40

my relationship with endings.

42:43

And instead of being sad

42:45

for them, I actually get to

42:47

celebrate when something

42:50

wonderful has ended that I'm so attached to that

42:52

I don't want it to. And

42:54

I know that there will be something else that

42:56

will give me that same feeling at some point

42:59

in the future. But

43:01

at 13, I didn't

43:04

have any of that perspective. She said you

43:06

hadn't gone fully back and read

43:08

all this. Do you think you learned anything

43:11

new or different that surprised you about who

43:13

you were through your words? Having

43:15

not read these poems and

43:17

these letters and things for 30 years

43:20

almost, it's

43:23

nice to see that

43:26

young girl again and not

43:30

feel so

43:33

sad for her when I read

43:36

this. I

43:38

can read it and what I

43:40

feel now is more the sense

43:42

of like, oh, honey, it's going to

43:44

be OK. And

43:47

that sense of kind of comforting that

43:50

inner child, I guess, that

43:52

inner teen that I think still pops up

43:55

for a lot of us, it's nice to

43:57

go back and revisit her and...