1:04

Ladies and gentlemen , welcome to the Nightmare Engine

1:06

podcast . It is November 19th

1:09

, so I'm going to give the data away . This time we're looking at

1:11

episode number three of season

1:13

two . I think that's

1:15

right . It's

1:17

a cool show today . It's a really cool show . It's Sunday

1:19

afternoon , it's , and it

1:21

feels good to be on again so

1:23

quickly , without massive delays

1:25

, so we've got a full stacked house today

1:27

. My co-host is quiet over there

1:30

. Jay Bauer , how are you ? I'm

1:32

doing good , man . How are you doing today ? Pretty

1:34

good . So what is on the chopping block

1:36

for you ? What do you got ? What do you got for me ?

1:40

Oh , he froze up on us .

1:42

Yeah .

1:43

Of the three of us , it was David . Oh

1:45

, I froze , yeah , yeah .

1:47

Oh , that's weird . Oh , okay

1:50

, let me ask again . So what's on the chopping block for you

1:52

? What do you ?

1:52

got Just

1:54

working on a couple new projects Working

1:58

on our project Big

2:00

Fricking Spider , and also working

2:03

on an iBiter story which kind

2:05

of ties in a little bit with our guest

2:07

today . But yeah

2:10

, just working on that and getting my

2:12

new , my little Christmas

2:15

chat book out in the wild . It's been

2:17

pretty cool to see the reaction

2:19

to that too .

2:21

That's awesome , and so that iBiter

2:23

story that is from your conservators'

2:25

collective story , that

2:27

three way written right .

2:30

I wouldn't say three way , but yeah , it's

2:34

the book that I wrote with

2:36

John Lynch and John Durgan . We

2:38

each have three brand new novellas

2:41

, kind of based on a certain theme , and this , the

2:43

theme of this one , was derelict and

2:46

we all kind of took it in our own direction and really

2:49

enjoyed my character and I had a lot of super

2:52

positive feedback and I was like you know what , let's

2:54

do more . And so I'm working

2:56

on doing one , maybe two

2:59

, maybe even three books . It

3:01

depends on how this all shakes out . But yeah

3:04

, you enjoyed the threesome . Yeah

3:07

, it was a lot of fun . It was John

3:09

, john and Jay . I mean . You know why not

3:11

?

3:16

Yeah , so we . At

3:18

this point , it would be . I would be remiss if I didn't introduce

3:21

our guest here . So anyways

3:23

, I don't know , jay gave it away , but we've got Mr

3:25

John Lynch on the side . How are you , sir

3:27

?

3:28

I'm doing good . How are you guys doing ?

3:31

Good , good man , good . So your folks

3:33

can't see it , but you're calling in from your vehicle

3:36

outside of work . Yes

3:38

, where is that ? What side of the country

3:40

are you in ?

3:41

I'm on the East Coast , I'm in Rhode Island .

3:44

Rhode Island that's a state .

3:46

Yes , Very small one . I

3:48

don't know , I don't know .

3:50

Between Massachusetts and Connecticut . And

3:55

so what are you doing for a living man ?

3:59

I work at a prison . It's

4:01

my day job , and then writing is my

4:04

hobby . Hopefully

4:07

one day I can make it a living , but right now it's just kind

4:09

of like something I'm doing and I really enjoy doing it

4:11

.

4:11

But I didn't know they let you have electronics

4:14

and laptops in prison .

4:15

No , they don't . I keep it in my car , oh okay

4:18

.

4:19

Yeah , no , no yeah .

4:20

This can't go in there . I'm all done . If I go to

4:22

America , I leave it all in my car and then

4:24

I just come on break . You know , I grab it and I write

4:26

on my break .

4:28

Oh , that's cool . So how long , how long , you been

4:31

in prison ? Business , corrections

4:34

, corrections , business .

4:35

I mean corrections .

4:36

Yeah .

4:36

For about 10 years

4:38

. Oh , my 11th year .

4:40

This is actually my 11th year now Same

4:43

prison , or a couple of different ones

4:45

, or same prison .

4:47

Yeah , the same one , yep .

4:50

That's awesome . So do you have ? I

4:53

mean , I assume you've established some

4:55

relationships with the people that you are in

4:57

charge of there . I mean , you've seen a lot of the same

4:59

folks . You know people aren't going anywhere . It's not like

5:01

county jail , right , so it's people

5:04

who have extended sentences . I

5:06

mean , do you feel like you've maybe established

5:09

some relationships with them ?

5:11

Yeah , it's , um , I'm

5:13

in a medium security prison , so

5:15

their sentence guys here , um , everybody

5:18

that's here sentenced , you know , and it could be anything

5:20

from . It could be anything from under a

5:22

year to life , depending on the

5:25

circumstances and stuff like that . It just really

5:27

kind of depends on the depends

5:30

on what they've got going on and how there

5:32

are , but there's , you know , there's people that you see

5:34

once and you never see them again , and

5:36

if they're doing a short time , and then there's guys who it's kind

5:38

of sometimes it's like a revolving

5:41

door , you know just kind of prison goes . Some guys

5:43

come go once and they never come back , and other

5:45

guys it's kind of a all

5:47

the time thing with them .

5:50

Yeah and um , and so you

5:52

said you've got some time to write . Um , I

5:56

guess on break you come out to the car and get some words in

5:58

, or something .

5:59

Yeah , because , um , I usually end up work

6:01

on the days that I work I usually pull

6:03

doubles , Um , so I don't . So

6:05

by the time I get home I'm burnt out . So I leave

6:07

my , um , all my writing stuff I just leave in my

6:10

car and then , you know , I go on break . I'm

6:12

, I go on break , I sit in the car and I have a . You

6:14

can't see , you can't see it right now in the video , but

6:16

I have one of those little steering wheel

6:18

Um , oh , yeah , tests , you

6:21

know the little train that attaches to your steering wheel and

6:23

my laptop's propped up on that , and that's , that's

6:25

how I write .

6:28

You don't look like a writer .

6:31

Yeah , I know , I don't .

6:34

Is there a look ?

6:34

I didn't realize there was a look , I

6:37

know , but put 1800 , put 1800

6:39

of them together like we went to 20 books

6:41

. I just got back from 20 books . Uh , vegas put 1800

6:44

of them together and there there there is a general

6:46

look , I think , for writers . So

6:48

yeah , I don't know until

6:51

that . Look Well , that's awesome

6:53

man . So , um , if it's

6:55

no surprise to anybody listening

6:57

, I mean we tend to interview horror authors

7:00

or those who align themselves strictly

7:02

in horror . Um , we , if people

7:04

tell us that it has horror elements and we don't really

7:06

think that that's what we're looking

7:08

for . So , um , you write horror . What

7:11

was your ? What was your first ? What was it ? The warrior retreat . I think

7:13

that's right .

7:14

Yes , um , the warrior retreat was my first

7:16

release . I actually had finished my

7:18

short story collection prior to releasing

7:20

that Um , but

7:23

I had talked to a lot of authors and publishers and

7:25

most of them had told me um , you

7:27

know , collections don't typically do well

7:30

, you're better off sitting on

7:32

that until you get a book out there so

7:34

people can know you first . So I

7:36

had it finished , I had a cover , it was almost ready

7:38

to go pretty much , and then I decided to write the

7:40

warrior retreat , um , and that was

7:42

something I had been writing for like two years

7:44

. Um , the first draft

7:46

of it was horrible . I mean , first drafts are always

7:48

bad . But I look , I look back at this thing and like there

7:50

were three chapter threes back to back and

7:53

the story was like all over the place and it

7:55

was like completely different than it is now . Um

7:57

, and I talked to the side just

7:59

to work on short stories

8:01

and other things and kind of just learn like the

8:03

craft of writing . Um , because

8:05

I had started writing , I tried

8:08

it a couple of times , you know , like a decade

8:10

ago , and I just got a couple of rejections

8:12

and I was like , well , I guess I'm not a writer . And

8:15

then I started really getting into like the car and

8:17

seeing how many people were writers , I was like , well , why

8:19

not , you know , if I keep getting better , if I

8:21

keep trying ? And then I started

8:23

to pick up a little traction with short stories and then

8:25

I realized , you know , like you know , I can

8:27

do this as long as I keep learning and improving

8:30

. Um , and

8:32

that's kind of how the warrior retreat came about , and so

8:34

, yeah , so yeah , there's one roundabout way

8:36

of saying yeah , the warrior retreat was

8:38

my debut .

8:40

Yeah , you know , that's awesome To hear you say

8:43

about um . You know your

8:45

first draft and how it came about , because you

8:47

know I've been behind the scenes with you since

8:49

like April , something like May

8:51

, something like that , you know , and kind of seeing

8:54

how your process goes with our book

8:56

that we did . And you know hearing

8:58

um , you know hearing what you say about

9:01

, you know your drafts and things like that . You know

9:03

we see all that stuff and and

9:05

um , hearing what you say about that , I could

9:07

absolutely see you saying like this sucked

9:10

and I had three firsts , you know three

9:12

chapters . Um , because I , you know

9:14

, we've , we've been through all of this , which is kind of

9:16

a cool . But you know , that

9:18

was my intro to you was the warrior retreat

9:21

, and I've read everything that you've

9:23

written so far , um , almost except

9:25

for the one year you're currently

9:27

working on . But um , and

9:30

I've loved every bit of it . You know

9:32

, and I know you've got I had a lot of military

9:34

themes to it , which I'm not military

9:37

, you know , but I absolutely relate

9:39

to the story , absolutely relate to your characters

9:41

and you brought so much life to them . You

9:43

know , because of um , because

9:45

of your experience and it

9:48

, it goes beyond just military

9:50

. Right , you know you , I know you've got

9:52

some amazing fans that um

9:54

aren't military , that will , will

9:57

, uh , promote your stuff to the ends of the

9:59

earth . You know , I know you've got some huge , huge

10:01

fans , which is great . You know , and just

10:03

kind of hearing all this backstory is kind of cool

10:05

yeah

10:09

.

10:09

Um , I'm sorry , Go ahead , go ahead . Yeah

10:11

, I was going to say yeah , my , um , my readers

10:13

are great because you know it's , you know

10:15

, I'm sorry , I think the warrior retreats

10:18

a hard . It's a hard pitch for me . It's

10:20

not hard for readers to pitch it because they pick

10:22

up on the stuff that they really like

10:24

about it , you know , and they'll sell that

10:26

to other readers by doing it . But for me

10:28

it's a hard pitch because I'm thinking about it . Well , it's

10:30

like it's part war action

10:33

novel , part like PTSD

10:35

exploration , part slasher

10:37

. And if you don't like extreme , it's not

10:40

extreme hard , but if you don't like extreme hard , you're

10:42

probably not going to like it . Just

10:44

because my writing style is , you know , I will

10:46

get graphic and violent and explicit

10:48

. It's not wall to wall . You

10:50

know cover to cover that . But if you don't like

10:53

those things in your books , then you're not going to write it . I

10:55

mean , enjoy it . But my readers , you

10:57

know , those are the ones who , like we'll

11:00

talk to you about how they picked

11:02

up on the PTSD and they can relate with it , even

11:04

if it wasn't like their PTSD is not

11:07

war related , just to the feelings of it and things

11:09

like that . So you know , my readers are great

11:11

and they're always helping

11:13

me promote where I'm not doing a very good

11:15

job at it , they're doing a great job at it .

11:18

Yeah , I think horror is

11:21

very unique and it

11:24

immediately gives you grounds to connect to

11:26

a reader versus other genres

11:28

which kind of have to force it through the characters . So

11:31

by just labeling your book horror

11:33

, you have made that connection immediately

11:35

with them and you can tell them exactly what they should experience through the book . I

11:40

mean , that's the same thing with romance . So romance

11:42

of close cousin to horror , because of that is

11:44

, you know , the genre , is the emotion

11:46

, which is really just kind of cool . It's also

11:48

very difficult . I think readers have a higher expectation of

11:50

what to present to them . I

11:54

think a lot of readers are getting used to the idea that there are

11:56

no jump scares in horror books . You can't make

11:58

something pop out of them and so , you

12:00

know , maybe they become . I thought at first it would become a little

12:03

disappointed when they read a horror book and they're like I'm not scared . Well

12:08

then I think then I

12:11

don't know what to say in that regard , because it's like what

12:14

might be incredibly terrifying

12:17

to somebody may not be , to somebody else it's

12:19

so , it's so unique , so , depending

12:21

what broad strokes can be useful in that , in that regard . But a lot of times too , it's like , hey

12:23

, I wasn't really scared during this one . It's

12:28

like , well , how did it make you feel ? You know it's

12:30

being scared and being forced

12:32

to feel something from horror , I think , is where things get

12:34

a little bit , you know , a little bit more unique . I guess you could say I don't know , I don't

12:36

know if you've experienced that . I

12:41

know one of my first books . I tried to write a

12:44

jump scare into a book and I was like this didn't

12:46

work . You know , it's like and then this big scary

12:48

thing . I just kind of felt like I was deflated . I was like , oh

12:50

, I've right , here's the big scary thing . Now , what

12:52

you know , it's like what are we going to do ? It's like , what am I

12:54

left with ? I'm left with an action scene , pretty

12:56

much a survival scene or something like that , or survival

12:59

. For the rest of the book . There's scary

13:01

things there . So I mean

13:03

, when you were talking about your types of horror that you write

13:05

, you know you say it's part slash or part

13:08

adventure . I mean , would you say

13:10

it falls in the psychological aspect , would you

13:12

say it falls into the supernatural , like where

13:14

do you think you fall ?

13:15

in line yeah

13:17

, so the warrior retreat is definitely it's

13:20

more , it's more psychological because

13:23

it's kind of , without giving it away , it's

13:26

exactly what's going on . It's kind of like

13:28

Chris Kyle type of thing , the American

13:30

sniper . So

13:33

it's definitely it's not supernatural

13:36

, it's real , it's something that could happen

13:38

. And I kind of feel

13:40

like the same way with with

13:42

you do about the jumpscares , because

13:44

once there's a reveal , there's a reveal

13:46

. You know you can't , you can't reveal

13:48

that . And I ran into the same thing when

13:51

I was like , Well , once this first kill

13:53

happens , you know I can't . There's

13:55

not really a way for me to drag this on for another

13:57

100 pages and

13:59

have this . You know , this terrible thing

14:01

. It's kind of it's got to go Now

14:04

. It's going to go balls to the wall for you

14:06

know the last 40 or so pages , because

14:08

I've already had all this lead up to this

14:11

and you know we're ready

14:13

to go now . I can't just keep trying to have

14:15

a guy pop out of nowhere and it

14:17

kind of really didn't fit . You know , it didn't make sense . Plus

14:19

, like you said , it just it kind of didn't work . It's , it's you

14:23

, probably . I mean , I'm sure somebody's done a jump

14:25

scare a good way in a horror book , but it's

14:27

probably , you know it's not hard

14:29

, it's not easy , I mean it's you really

14:31

can't jump scares more of a visual

14:33

, visual thing and auditory thing . So

14:36

I can , I can make things described

14:38

well and put you in a setting , but I

14:40

can't , you know , I can't actually make auditory

14:43

noises that are going to usually be associated

14:45

with something like a jump scare .

14:50

Yeah , and I know Jay and I were kind

14:52

of discussing about our latest book

14:54

, big Fucking Spider , which is kind

14:56

of a really clever title . I don't think people

14:59

understand what's going to be about about

15:02

you know when , when do

15:04

we show the big , the

15:06

big spider ? You know ? Because it's ? I mean , that's the whole

15:09

point of the book and

15:11

we've kind of talked about it a

15:13

little bit and said you know what it ? Maybe

15:15

it needs to be on the nose , maybe it

15:17

needs to be right there in front of us the whole time and it

15:19

just becomes one of those survival type

15:21

stories , not necessarily like grab a flamethrower , run

15:23

around you know , less , less

15:25

eight legged freaks , more arachnophobia , if

15:28

that makes sense . Yes , if

15:30

you're going to compare it to movies , which I don't think it's a good

15:32

, but those two movies are , I mean , they stand on two

15:34

different lines of horror , I think , and it's kind of fun

15:36

to think about . And

15:39

so , where you retreat , jay

15:41

said you got something else besides the conservators

15:44

derelict that you're working on right now . What , what , what book

15:46

is that ? Okay so if

15:48

you can talk about it .

15:50

I can talk a little bit about it . I haven't done a cover

15:52

reveal and I haven't named it or

15:54

anybody , but it will say it is

15:56

a Christmas horror book . I

15:58

will say that and it's

16:00

kind of it's

16:03

just me having fun with

16:06

kind of like a . It's

16:10

like a slasher , you know , but it's like I

16:12

would say it's more . Again , it's not extreme

16:14

hard , but if you don't , if you don't care for that stuff , you're

16:16

not going to like it . It's more

16:18

of like a gory 8090s

16:20

, 8080s , early 90s kind

16:23

of cheesy slasher .

16:25

I believe we described yesterday

16:28

is a Hallmark Christmas classic

16:30

.

16:33

Yeah , it's going to go right there , right there on your shelves

16:35

, with all the you know , the elf

16:37

on the shelf book that you read your kid every Christmas

16:39

. It's going to be right there along to it . But

16:43

yeah , that one is . So it's almost finished

16:46

it's . I

16:48

plan on doing like the pre-orders the very beginning of

16:50

December , because I do . I

16:53

know that Releasing a Christmas book

16:55

without promotion is I'm almost

16:57

sending it out to die basically . So

16:59

I have to hit really hard on the pre-orders and I

17:02

think you know very early December

17:04

to give that lead up , especially because it's not coming out

17:06

until the end of the month , like

17:09

December 22nd . So I'm barely gonna hit Christmas

17:11

.

17:13

Yeah , this would be a great get . It sound like to

17:15

me . You just need to have it as part of a

17:17

stocking stuffer for children under 10 .

17:20

Yeah , yeah , you man

17:22

, you would get a lot of great reviews on that

17:25

, oh yeah .

17:27

I'll select the age . You know the

17:29

children's age on KDP when I upload

17:31

it .

17:33

Yeah , so we ? This reminds me of when

17:35

our writing group so we've been Jane , I've

17:37

been part of the same writing group for about probably going

17:40

on four years now and

17:42

we were joking because

17:44

it's romance author she just like , out

17:47

of nowhere , published her first book and made like

17:49

six figures on one book , just just

17:51

threw it out into the ether and made stupid

17:53

money off of it . And I looked at

17:55

Jay and I was like I guess you're writing romance now

17:57

, dude , and we're just gonna call it , we're

18:00

gonna write it , we're gonna call it written

18:02

by five guys . And so that was gonna Answer

18:05

like yeah , this is gonna go over . Really , really well , we

18:07

know it's gonna turn and we know we

18:09

didn't know anything about it , about writing romance

18:11

. But it's like when you're starting to see numbers like that , we're like , okay

18:13

, maybe , maybe I need to . You know , maybe there's a

18:15

point to this . But Taking

18:18

that little box that says , you know , written for

18:20

children , it's the same thing as us saying like

18:22

, written by five dudes , yes

18:24

, this is exactly , this is exactly

18:27

what these romance readers want .

18:29

Yeah , I've seen like I'm in groups

18:31

like the 20 books to 50k

18:33

and wide for the win and stuff like that

18:35

, because I like to try and Learn

18:38

about the business from other authors as much as I can

18:40

Because I do know , like

18:42

I've seen , I've seen like Andrew Van way Show

18:46

business stuff where he was showing , like you know

18:48

, the breakdown of spending . My genre and

18:50

horror was like the lowest and the

18:53

next lowest , I think was like sci-fi

18:55

and that like is like double the

18:57

revenue of horror books yearly

19:00

. So I try to learn the business

19:02

as much as I can to set myself up for it . And yeah

19:04

, when I see that about the romance and I see

19:06

authors being talking about like they have like

19:08

10,000 pre-orders or like

19:10

or 5,000 pre-orders on their Book

19:13

and it's not even like it's the first book they've ever written

19:15

. They don't have any short stories out and

19:17

I'm like how did you even find

19:19

10,000 people to like To

19:22

take that jump and pre-order your book when you don't have a word

19:24

written and you have like somehow they

19:27

have a newsletter with like 50,000

19:29

subscribers and it's like I don't know , I don't

19:31

understand how they . I know I wish I knew how

19:33

they were doing it . But you know , horror is

19:35

just a different beast , I guess it's . There

19:37

are a lot of people who what kind of pioneered

19:40

, like being on ebooks and stuff like

19:42

that for a while , but I don't think the

19:44

readership has caught on To

19:48

be as big yet . It's still kind of a niche genre

19:50

. You know us being horror

19:52

authors and horror readers , we don't

19:54

see it as a niche genre but

19:56

in comparison to other , to other

19:58

readerships , you know there's just not as

20:00

many readers out there yet . But I think that's changing

20:02

with groups of like book , of books , of horror on

20:05

Facebook and tick tock

20:07

. I think it's bringing in a lot of people into

20:10

horror readership . That we haven't and I do

20:12

think that it's gonna start catching

20:14

on Sooner

20:16

rather than later , as far as you

20:18

know how many people are reading it . It's

20:21

just a matter of time . It's . I think people have just long

20:24

neglected the horror genre .

20:28

Yeah , and I see that you know you're setting

20:30

yourself up for that eventual

20:33

success . Right , you know for when , when

20:35

those folks start coming to us , you

20:37

know start looking at horror , and you

20:39

know you building that foundation , building

20:42

it the right way . Right , you know putting out quality

20:44

books , quality stories , Making

20:47

those connections with other authors , with

20:49

the readers . You know building those things up

20:51

and and . So when that time

20:54

comes , when you know when they start coming

20:56

this way , you know they're like oh

20:58

yeah , John Lynch , like yeah , he's . You know definitely

21:00

read his stuff . You know he's got great

21:02

work , you know he's super nice guy

21:04

, all that stuff You're just building on the right things

21:06

and that's all

21:08

you know . That's all you can do .

21:10

You know , and and I've been seeing you doing that

21:12

Kind of pretty much every

21:14

step of this way- you

21:18

know , one of the things that we talked to , one of the other Kind

21:22

of big names in the horror community . So we talked

21:24

to both Tim Wagner and we talked to Jonathan

21:27

Mayberry , and Both of them

21:29

come from a traditional side but they do a little

21:31

bit on their own kind of indie style , I

21:33

guess you could say . I guess that's what that means

21:35

is roll out , you know , having to be self-sufficient

21:37

and doing a lot of the legwork yourself

21:39

to promote your books and stuff so they

21:42

can commiserate to a point with it . And one of the things that they

21:44

said was horrors making resurgence . It's

21:46

coming back , it's seeing it's

21:48

being both desired in the trad industry as

21:50

well as it is in the independent industry . And and

21:53

horror has long survived on the independent

21:55

side , both in the small

21:57

press and an independent horror authors

21:59

, for a very , very long time because they could not find

22:01

a place in the mainstream . And what

22:03

we are experiencing is a is a

22:05

real . Is a real is these relationships

22:08

with readers , horror readers , that

22:10

they are just Waiting

22:12

for the next book . They're just . They just their

22:15

issues always been discovering it . It's never

22:17

been do I buy it . It's always been discovering

22:19

it . And so one of the

22:21

things that I've , you know , really focused on the last few years

22:24

is just making myself more available

22:26

. That's why we started this podcast was just

22:28

so we could have that more connection

22:30

with other horror readers and be like , look , we're here

22:33

, we , we want you to read our stuff . We

22:35

write good stuff , I think you know , we think you'd enjoy

22:37

it and we'll write the stuff that you want . If you communicate

22:39

with us , tell us what you want , we'll write , we'll

22:41

give you exactly what you're looking for , you know ? Yep

22:43

, so I

22:45

know that some folks like to . There's

22:47

some folks that are kind of naysayers about you know . There

22:49

are this horse , the smallest market and

22:51

and whatnot is like . Well , there's an article

22:54

called a thousand true fans and , to be honest

22:56

, that's that's all you need . A thousand people out of this entire

22:58

world . And it's not difficult

23:00

when you start looking at those types of numbers . You know

23:02

, one of the things that I've experienced is that I

23:05

don't get a whole lot of love from Amazon

23:07

for my books ever . They don't ever show

23:09

my books to anybody . I don't get anything organically through

23:11

Amazon . So I tell everybody said , go to my website

23:13

. You know , if I , if I'm gonna , if , if

23:16

I , if Amazon's not gonna help me , then I I'm

23:18

not gonna feed Amazon , I'll feed , I'll feed

23:20

myself , and so what

23:22

readers are starting to be more interested in

23:24

is buying directly from the authors that they like , and so

23:27

the connections with horror readers Are very

23:29

tight . They want paperbacks , they want signed

23:31

paperbacks , they love them , they collect them . I

23:34

mean , I saw this girl . She had a coffin

23:36

shaped I bookshelf

23:39

was the coolest thing in the world . I was

23:41

like I'm not a , I'm not a , you

23:43

know , I'm not like any kind of devil worship or

23:45

anything like that , but I'm like a coffin shaped bookshelf . That's

23:48

so cool . Like you know , if

23:50

I could get away with painting my house dark black

23:52

on the inside , I would , but I'm not really , you know . This

23:54

just makes the house really dark . So , but I like

23:56

the idea of kind of like a Gothic , you know style

23:59

house that just horror images will

24:01

like that , though , and I don't know if your experience has been the same

24:03

way , but they're just when you meet

24:05

them , they're die hard , and

24:07

they love to connect with us .

24:10

Yeah , that's been my experience . So

24:13

I mean , as you guys both know , I've

24:15

only just been published . You

24:17

know , a novel for the warrior

24:20

treat is a little bit over a year old . It

24:22

came out on Veterans Day last

24:25

year . But I went to

24:27

author con and that was part of the reason why I put

24:29

my collection out so fast is

24:31

because I wanted to have at least two books out

24:33

before I went to author con and I

24:35

got a table and it was dude , it was crazy . There's

24:38

readers there with gigantic

24:41

like trays , like pull

24:43

trays , like something you would see in an airport , somebody pulling

24:45

their luggage just stacked with books and

24:47

books and books . And I heard readers

24:49

telling me like they came

24:51

over with just like vacuum sealed bags for their

24:53

clothes so that they could bring all their books

24:55

back in their luggage and stuff and they just like

24:58

shipped the clothes back or they were . Some

25:00

people were saying they spent tons of money like

25:02

shipping their books back . And yeah , they're

25:05

great there's . The readers are out there , it's just

25:07

a matter of finding them . Discoverability

25:10

, and discoverability is getting easier

25:12

and easier by the day with

25:16

places like the like . I

25:18

bring it up again the books of horror group on Facebook the

25:21

last time I looked there was like 40,000 , 43,000

25:24

people in that group . That's a lot of people

25:26

just waiting to read horror book and

25:28

even a lot of times still

25:30

, you know , everybody's just discovering like

25:32

, oh , it's not just Stephen King

25:34

, it's not just Joe Hill and Dean

25:36

Coots and Anne Rice , there's

25:38

all these authors out here and they're

25:40

telling their friends about it and their

25:43

friends are joining the groups and

25:45

telling other readers about it . And it's

25:48

just discoverability is getting easier and easier

25:50

. It's just , you know , making yourself available . We

25:53

do because we still are , you know , into your , whether

25:55

self-published or small press , you

25:59

have to make yourself available and put yourself out

26:01

there to find readers , because

26:03

you know the publisher usually can't do that for you

26:05

, either won't or

26:07

can't , just because of the nature

26:09

of promotion and what it costs . So

26:12

you know there's

26:14

a lot of readers out there and , like you said the article

26:16

about , you know a

26:19

thousand will do you . If you get

26:21

a thousand people who want to read every

26:23

one of your books , man , that's

26:26

a lot of people buying your books .

26:28

I've got like 10 , so I'm

26:30

on my way .

26:34

Yeah , we've mentioned short stories a lot

26:36

here and so one of the

26:38

things I set out this year was I wanted to write a short

26:40

story a month . And so I have

26:42

a subscription where my readers get to kind

26:44

of vote and stuff and I write a short story a month . It kind

26:46

of forces me to write a short story a month . I

26:49

figured I could dedicate myself

26:51

to that and you know , over the course

26:54

of the next three years it starts to add up . You know

26:56

of how many short stories you really you start getting

26:58

really good at them . I think horror short stories

27:00

is . You know that's really

27:02

big and hard . You know you gotta publish

27:04

your own collection . I mean , if you're a horror writer , you gotta publish

27:07

your own collection . At some point you gotta write a vampire of

27:09

some sort and you gotta write a zombie of some sort . I mean , that's

27:11

just write a passage , right .

27:13

Yeah .

27:15

And so you got your first collection . Did you publish

27:17

that already , or are you still working on it ?

27:19

Yeah , so I published that . I

27:22

published it like two months after the Warrior Treaty

27:24

, which was kind of like that

27:26

was a bad idea too , because

27:28

it was so soon after the Warrior Treaty , like

27:30

people hadn't even started finding that yet

27:32

, and I had already had the second book come out . But

27:37

, like I had said , I did that specifically because

27:39

I felt I needed to have

27:41

at least two books out before AuthorCon

27:43

last year . Otherwise I'm just kind of like wasting

27:45

money on a table and

27:47

not really giving readers options so

27:50

and so

27:52

well . Sorry

27:54

.

27:55

No , no , go ahead .

27:55

Sorry , that came out . I believe it was like January

27:58

of 2020 . Yeah , January of this year

28:00

, I really used that .

28:03

And so I was gonna say AuthorCon is

28:05

where you and I kind of really met

28:08

. Originally you were in the

28:10

very , very back room with

28:13

Ronald Kelly , lucas

28:16

Miller and a few others , just

28:18

like but way back there . And

28:20

then eventually you got moved out and you were kind

28:22

of just like right outside the door

28:25

from where I was at and I know

28:27

we talked a lot that weekend . But

28:29

it was cool to see the

28:31

readers that were getting your stuff that were like oh

28:33

yeah , I'm familiar with this Cause

28:37

. That's an awesome feeling . I saw

28:39

it , I saw it happen with you quite a bit , which is really

28:41

exciting . And

28:44

I understand why you would want to get that collection

28:46

. I would have done the same thing , man , like I

28:49

absolutely would have done that . And

28:51

, as we all three know , short

28:53

story collections often aren't the biggest

28:56

sellers for horror authors . But it is kind of a rite

28:58

of passage in horror . It's like you have

29:00

to have a collection , so

29:03

it . But it is good and I have read it

29:05

and I

29:07

loved it . And from

29:09

your feedback , from your readers , what story

29:11

of that is the one that

29:14

they bring up the most ? I think I know , and

29:16

that's why you're smiling .

29:18

One that everybody brings up the most is a

29:21

cock meat sandwich .

29:24

So cock meat sandwich .

29:25

Yes .

29:27

Okay , let me . Let me just make sure I get that with my clear mic Cock

29:29

meat sandwich . That is the title of the

29:31

story .

29:32

Yes it is .

29:33

Yes , that's the title of the story and , believe

29:35

it or not , that is usually the one that people liked

29:38

it the most . I

29:40

wrote that one originally for DNT's

29:43

ABCs of Terror , volume 4 . And

29:46

the idea was that the

29:50

theme behind it was like

29:52

lousy neighbors and then you

29:54

each get a letter . So that's where the ABCs

29:56

of Terror came in , because each author got randomly assigned

29:59

a letter or you could choose it . If you were

30:01

fast enough , you could , you know , state claim on a letter

30:03

. And originally

30:05

the story was titled because I had always

30:07

wanted to call it cockmeat sandwich

30:09

and like I pitched it like

30:12

the first paragraph of it . It

30:14

was my first time trying to write something that

30:16

was like kind of gross or extreme , so

30:19

I wanted to just see if I could do it and it

30:22

used . It was originally published under G is for

30:24

Gary Gilroy , because every

30:27

title was like A is for this , b is for that and mine

30:29

was G is for Gary Gilroy , but

30:31

in my head the title was always cockmeat

30:33

sandwich . So when I republished it it had

30:36

to go under that one .

30:38

And what's the story about ? The

30:41

story about me .

30:43

About a man who was by himself . His

30:47

wife and kids are gone , he's

30:49

by himself and

30:51

he's just got this awful , awful , terrible neighbor

30:53

. They're always loud . The

30:55

place is like , you know , the neighbor's yard is like a

30:57

junk yard . There's like animal

31:00

shit on the yard , the grass is like waist

31:02

high because he doesn't mow it and

31:04

it's just kind of like a not

31:08

not quite , but the closest thing will

31:10

be , if you think of like hillbilly horror type thing and

31:13

the neighbor and you know he goes over there and

31:15

they get into it a little bit and

31:18

the neighbor is just being gross . And

31:20

then you know he wakes up one day

31:22

and he's washing , washing dishes and over

31:24

his kitchen sink and he looks out the window and the

31:27

neighbor is barbecuing his own penis

31:29

and then it just goes and then

31:32

it's kind of like a home invasion thing from

31:34

there .

31:36

But you know , and I think the reason why a story

31:38

like that has resonated with your readers , you know , other

31:41

than you've got this fantastic title for it right . It's

31:45

just it is . It's a disturbing thing , like

31:48

you know , having read that , you know it's . You

31:50

have these disturbing visuals that you just like you

31:53

, can't get rid of . You know , and it's like , and that

31:56

that sits with readers , and the

32:00

way you write it , you know , with your style and the flow you're writing and

32:02

just everything , it

32:06

takes something that's called cockmeat sandwich

32:08

but it turns it into something that's super entertaining , something

32:10

that lasts with the readers and something that

32:12

they want more of . And

32:15

I know we've talked about that . You know , and I think

32:17

that's that's a testament to your skill and to your writing , and

32:21

I think that's that's awesome that you can go for

32:24

something gross and and disturbing and yet it really resonates

32:27

with readers . You

32:29

know .

32:33

Yeah , and I've , and people have asked me like , like you

32:35

said , like about you know , continuing and people actually believe it or not want

32:37

me to write a book based off of this . I've

32:40

had more than a few people ask me about

32:42

it and I want to do it . But

32:47

, like Jay said , it's

32:49

just for me , it's not just about wanting

32:51

to do something that's only gross or only gory . I do want there to

32:53

be somewhat of a story to . It doesn't

32:55

have to be anything crazy , you know what I mean . It

32:58

doesn't have to be the next great American novel

33:00

. But

33:05

that's why I said with my story , why I it's

33:08

kind of like I want to have story

33:11

and fun stuff in there , along with the gory and splatter and gross , and I'm

33:13

going to do it eventually , but it's I want to . I want

33:15

to have a story that's worth doing . That's

33:19

the thing for me is that I want to have a story that's worth doing

33:21

. That's the thing for me is

33:23

I'll go to the crazy places and the gross

33:25

stuff , but I want to . I want

33:27

to have at least , like you know , kind of like a decent

33:29

story to tell with it to or otherwise

33:31

. It's just more the same . You

33:33

know there's I want

33:36

somebody to know if they , if they're reading my stuff . I

33:38

want them to know they're at least . You know , I took

33:40

the effort to try to make like a really good story

33:42

and not not just gross or

33:45

gory , but you know what there's . But

33:47

I want to just like stress I don't think there's anything wrong

33:49

with books that are like that too , because I read a lot of books

33:51

that are just gross out stuff or

33:54

just just wall to wall

33:56

gore . It's fun , sometimes it's

33:58

. I don't want everything to be

34:00

like like a very heavy book

34:02

. Sometimes I want that and then other times

34:04

, as a reader , I just I'm just looking for some fun

34:06

.

34:07

So you

34:10

know , I think I think horror has a place in

34:12

that . Where it can ? You know , tim Wagner

34:14

and I sat on this for a while . I

34:16

wasn't sure how I felt about it , but a while there . You

34:18

know , tim , when we asked him you know why horror ? He

34:21

said because horror is fun . You

34:23

know he didn't want to believe he didn't . He didn't agree with

34:25

some people think . You know , horror allows you

34:27

to visit these traumas , you know , from a safe

34:29

place , that sort of thing . Or allows you to

34:31

reconcile with past differences

34:33

. Or , you know , to approach your fears in

34:35

a safe way . He didn't believe they was like it's just fun

34:37

, it's just fun , it's fun to be scared

34:39

. And you know , I think there was another

34:41

, there's another additional on that . You

34:43

know which he didn't say , which was Horror

34:46

is it is fun to be afraid when it's

34:49

safe . You know like it's not fun

34:51

when you're in a , you know , in a bad spot , you

34:53

know when in . You know you've been

34:55

in prison and in prison garden

34:57

and then me being law enforcement . There

35:01

are times when you're scared and it's not fun , I

35:03

mean , it's just the reality of it . But

35:06

then you go into a book you're like , okay , you know the same

35:08

type of escapism that we

35:10

get from any other type of book . It's just different

35:12

and horror . And that it's fear that we're going to be scared , it's fear

35:14

that we're playing with , not just the escapism

35:16

. And so you know , I think that I think

35:18

there is a , I think you seem like you're the type

35:20

who believes to that . You know horror can be

35:22

fun . You know it's not just as

35:25

you said . So you know serious

35:27

and , and you know emotional

35:30

and connective . It's , sometimes it's just

35:32

fun . I mean , that's my mind , that's what Krampus

35:35

is . You turn . I mean you turn Krampus into . You

35:37

know that's fun . To horror . You know

35:39

it's Christmas horror . I mean how , how terrifying

35:42

and scary can it really be , you know ?

35:44

Krampus is a perfect example . There's

35:47

nothing scary about it . You know , those gingerbread

35:49

cookies , like coming down the chimney

35:51

, like it's not scary but it's fun and

35:53

it , you know it's . It's kind of like a

35:55

modern Christmas classic . Now it's

35:58

not very old but I would say it's . You

36:01

know , if I'm going to pick horror movies to watch every

36:03

season , you know Krampus is going to

36:05

be one of those ones that don't , that don't watch every season

36:07

, because it's fun . And

36:10

I think stuff like that is also good because it's kind of like

36:12

it's it's . It's like

36:14

a gateway movie too . You know you could

36:16

, you could get your kids into that . They don't have to be

36:18

and you don't have to be worried about what they might

36:20

see in there because it's not , it's nothing like too crazy

36:23

, you know , provided they're not like you

36:25

know , five , I wouldn't show , like my five by four year old

36:27

Krampus . But you

36:29

know my 12 year old I would show Krampus . It's

36:31

not . I don't think it's too bad for

36:34

a 12 year old . But yeah , you're right , I do

36:36

, I do . I do think that horror

36:38

is fun and I think you hit that nail in the head

36:40

. It's , it's . It's fun because

36:42

you can be in a safe space where you're doing it . You

36:45

know , because being scared is fun . When you're

36:47

scared in a safe way , like you said . You know

36:49

the driving like down the road in

36:51

Iraq and not knowing if you're going about to run over

36:54

a bomb that's not fun . You can have fun

36:56

with your friends , like you know the conversations

36:58

you're talking about and things like that . You can have

37:00

fun with each other , but like that's

37:02

, that's a different kind of scary and I think horror

37:05

books there , you said . They allow

37:07

you to experience the fear

37:09

and have fun doing it

37:11

, because you know that that book is not going to hurt you

37:13

. At the end of the day , where's

37:16

she going to get hurt from a book You're going ?

37:17

to get paper cut . Yeah , absolutely , hey , john . So okay

37:20

, now you're back . You froze for a second there . You

37:22

got your , we got your audio . So that's good . Okay

37:24

, but just

37:27

to the folks listening , let

37:29

me reiterate John is in a parking lot

37:31

from , I'm assuming , a Wi-Fi .

37:33

Yeah , actually . So not even Wi-Fi

37:36

is on my phone . That is incredible

37:39

the quality .

37:41

The quality you were getting out of this . Like people

37:43

can't see it , but the visual quality

37:45

is absolutely incredible for that connection

37:47

. So we'll we'll forgive the slight

37:49

delays that we're boasting to be having . It's not a big deal at all .

37:52

The the T-Mobile Tower is like I

37:55

could . If I had a strong

37:57

arm , I could probably hit it with a rock .

38:00

So that's probably what's doing it , but

38:02

you have absolutely a phenomenal connection

38:04

.

38:07

So let's so . We won't hold it against you . Shout out the T-Mobile . We are

38:09

not sponsored . However , if you want

38:11

to sponsor a T-Mobile , we would absolutely love

38:13

it .

38:16

Yeah , we'd love to see some return from

38:18

this podcast , but

38:22

yeah , that's awesome man and

38:26

we like to say it and we say it pretty often

38:28

, at least every couple of shows that , like horror writers are some of the coolest

38:30

people we ever meet . Yeah , you

38:32

know , they're just , they're just average

38:35

people , normal people , who

38:37

, who , who enjoy a scary

38:39

movie , who aren't , you know , who aren't

38:41

afraid to to read a scary book , who

38:44

aren't afraid to , you know , or who are , maybe

38:46

who are afraid , but they're okay with facing

38:48

that over and over again because they're like you know what it's , it's

38:50

fun , that's what it's supposed to be . You

38:52

know , like there's certain types of fears that we're , like

38:54

, totally fine with and other types are like , no

38:56

, I could really do without . You know , like when

38:58

I'm , when I'm on the streets , like there's certain type of fear

39:01

when someone's , like you know , rummaging around in their car

39:03

and I'm fixing to approach it and I can't see

39:05

their hands , like that's a different type of fear I don't really

39:07

want to approach all the time . Versus

39:09

, you know , I pop open . You know , friday

39:12

the 13th , and I'm watching something . You

39:14

know , something happen there , I mean on a movie , I think

39:16

. I think there's different types of fear and

39:18

I think that's really cool to see that

39:20

. Just another horror author . That's just

39:22

totally normal , just like the rest of us . Now

39:25

, jay said that you were in the service . What

39:27

did you do in the military ? What branch ?

39:30

I was in the Marine Corps Um 2007

39:32

to 2011, . I was a mortarman

39:34

, so I was in the infantry and then my

39:37

MOS was a mortarman .

39:39

Oh , during the invasion , cool , so

39:43

I'm a rack , or Afghanistan .

39:45

I went to Iraq in 2008 and

39:47

then I went to Afghanistan in 2009 . So

39:49

I've been to both .

39:50

Wow . Well , I appreciate your service man . I

39:54

didn't get the opportunity to deploy . I did four years

39:56

in the Army and that was the end of my contract

39:58

, so they didn't . I was in

40:00

a unit that wasn't deploying but I definitely appreciated everyone

40:03

who did and I mean I

40:05

remember our unit . There's a lot of our unit who's like I'll

40:07

re-up right now . If you'll deploy me , can I sign

40:09

up for deployment Because everyone else is going . You know

40:11

we all want to go and support and be a part

40:14

of that and you know

40:16

you come back and you're like . You know at

40:18

least I did what my job was . I did what the Army told

40:20

me to do . I did what the Marines told me to do . You know

40:22

, regardless if it was going to , you know

40:24

, but I do have a level of appreciation for folks

40:27

who got to , got to , had or had

40:29

to experience that . So thank you for that . Thank

40:31

you , when were you in the Army ? 2009

40:33

to 2012 . Okay , and

40:37

, and I got out right

40:40

at the end of 2012 . I was medically

40:42

discharged . I got hurt . So it's

40:44

, you know . I think

40:46

I think there are some influences . You know I

40:50

wrote I didn't realize how big mental health

40:52

was a part of my stories until I

40:54

wrote one that was like strictly 100%

40:56

. nothing supernatural about it , just

40:59

want mental health and based off the

41:01

stuff I'd seen , you know , in law enforcement and

41:03

you got to a point , like some of our readers

41:06

were , like you need to put some mental health resources in the back

41:08

, because this is too intense , this is too

41:10

real and I'm like that's what I want . Yes

41:12

, and you know , you

41:14

want that . You , you want that connection , but at the same time

41:16

you're like oh , man like sorry , you

41:18

know , but yeah

41:21

, man , so that's , that's really cool . So you said you had

41:23

some influences from PTSD

41:25

and stuff like that in in the warrior retreat

41:27

. I mean , it's in the title , right ? Yes

41:30

, so that's . And

41:32

? And how would you say ? You

41:34

know , some people can't really relate

41:37

to PTSD , you know

41:39

. So how did you make it so that people

41:41

who may not have PTSD could

41:43

? They don't understand

41:46

. You know what that was like .

41:48

So what I tried to do is is , after

41:50

we have , you know , the the war stuff , at the

41:52

beginning I tried to give you a little bit

41:54

kind of almost like vignette chapters with

41:57

each of the main characters so you could see what

41:59

they're doing after the fact , now that

42:01

they've come home , and

42:03

how they were dealing with it in different ways . Like , for

42:06

some guys it was just kind of partying

42:08

. Still , you know , they're just , they haven't

42:11

. It's like they never left Hawaii

42:13

. They're just kind of like going to like the strip clubs every

42:15

night . And other guys are just , you know , they're

42:17

finding it in medication and

42:20

other guys are dealing with it in the

42:22

bottom of a bottle . And then there's then there's other

42:24

guys who have kind of

42:26

battled those demons and

42:28

and came out the other side and now they're

42:30

trying to help people , you know , like a

42:32

social worker or things like that . I just tried to show

42:34

how each guy was dealing

42:37

with the after effects

42:39

of it and what it was doing , because everybody does

42:41

, you know , copes a different way . You know

42:44

, we all know people who have

42:46

been . We're all of the age where we know people

42:48

who have been in the military , or we know

42:50

people who have PTSD from other things

42:53

, and it's something that everybody

42:55

deals with in a different way . So

42:59

it's sometimes it might be

43:01

like it sounds like it's a cliche , like you

43:03

know they're just drinking because the things

43:05

bother them , but you know , but that's how some people deal with

43:08

it . And some people deal with it through

43:10

drug abuse and some people deal with it

43:12

, just , you know , by taking

43:14

medications that they get from their prescriptions

43:16

from their doctors . And other people just deal

43:18

with it by not dealing with it and

43:21

they don't realize that it's just completely , you know

43:23

, destroying their physical and mental well-being because

43:25

they don't think that they have a problem with

43:28

anything and they don't realize that they need help . And

43:31

then other people recognize it and you know they're , and they're

43:33

able to go and get help and kind

43:35

of push past that , and

43:38

so it's different for everybody . So I think that's why and

43:40

I think you

43:42

know now that we know more about PTSD

43:44

and we know that it's not only something

43:46

that people in military or

43:48

law enforcement experience , it's something that anybody

43:50

can experience . You know , I could get into a car accident

43:53

and that could be a traumatic experience for me

43:55

, if , if , if you know , depending

43:58

on what happened and what's all , that could be so traumatic

44:00

. I might never be able to drive in a car again

44:02

, or I might not want to drive on a

44:04

highway again . So I think that's why

44:06

it resonates with people , is because they

44:08

see that it's not , it's not just . You know , once

44:10

they get past the more part of the story , that

44:12

they see a little bit of themselves

44:15

and some of these characters , absolutely

44:18

.

44:18

Yeah .

44:21

And as someone who's read it , I absolutely

44:23

like what you said about the vignettes , about the characters

44:25

. That's exactly it . You know , all of those

44:27

little snapshots

44:29

of the behind the scenes of those particular

44:31

characters drew me as a non

44:34

military individual that

44:36

hasn't experienced that , drew me right into

44:38

it and I could connect with them right away .

44:43

That's awesome , man . So that's a great little homage

44:45

to you know , to to your service

44:47

and to to those you recognize

44:49

. You know , I would say it's probably you

44:52

know , influential , you

44:54

know you can , and people appreciate that

44:56

for its authenticity . You know , and horror authors

44:58

, we , we try to be as authentic as we

45:00

can , you know . We try to write about the things that scare us

45:02

, you know , and that that becomes

45:05

a fear that we could pass on to somebody else , and

45:07

so that that seems like a great , a

45:10

great place to stop this . You know , I know you're short

45:12

on time . We definitely appreciate you coming out for

45:14

during your break and and and

45:16

making this happen with us , and it's been an absolute

45:19

pleasure , man , so I appreciate

45:21

you guys having me . Absolutely , we'll

45:23

definitely plan to do it again . Like I said , this is season two

45:26

and there's not many horror authors , so we try to have you know

45:28

. We're trying to figure out , or maybe a rotation

45:30

, or just bring the same guys on . So , don't

45:32

expect this to be the last time we get ahold of you , but

45:34

before we go , can you tell people where you want people

45:37

to find your books ? Man , tell them where they can keep up to date

45:39

with you and where you want them to go .

45:41

Okay , yeah , so if you go to my website

45:44

johnlunchbookscom I said

45:46

John Lunch because I had talked with John

45:48

Lynch L-I-N-C-H bookscom

45:50

If you go there

45:52

that's kind of like the hub you could get to my online

45:55

shop from there , you could get to

45:57

my newsletter from there and

45:59

then it will also link you to like Amazon from there

46:01

. So if you like signed copies , you can get to

46:03

signed copies from there . The

46:06

best way to know everything that's going on kind of what my writing

46:08

would be is to subscribe to the newsletter . If

46:11

you subscribe to my newsletter , you

46:13

know you can have links to my socials from there . You'll

46:15

be able to get to everything and everything

46:17

that's me from there or my website

46:19

, and kind of find out what I'm up to .

46:23

That's awesome , man . We appreciate you coming

46:25

on , we appreciate your service and we appreciate your time

46:27

today . So , Jay

46:30

, do you got anything else man ?

46:32

No , just it was awesome to have you on here , john . I know we

46:34

, you know we've been talking a lot and we

46:36

worked pretty closely together on

46:38

our book and it's awesome

46:41

to finally get you on the podcast .

46:43

That's good . I'm glad to be here

46:46

and I'm looking forward to actually get slaughtered late coming into

46:48

mail . So I'm going

46:50

to read that one . It should be here any

46:52

day now , probably , and then I'm looking forward to

46:54

big fucking spider too . I keep pounding

46:56

Jay about it . I'm like this book is going to come out in time

46:58

, right , because I need this

47:00

book . I don't know . I saw the cover and I was like this sounds great

47:02

. It sounds like it sounds like a fun

47:05

, fun book . So I'm really looking forward to that .

47:09

Yeah , I think we'll make our deadline . We're doing pretty good

47:11

. We set it far enough in advance

47:13

so that all the delaying that we did it

47:15

was okay yeah .

47:18

But I think I pre-order the day

47:20

you put it up , the day that I saw you want that , you want to

47:22

pre-order is like I'm getting that yeah .

47:26

And I've got people that , that message being

47:28

said , I'll buy anything but this .

47:31

I don't do spiders and I'm like that's exactly why

47:33

you read .

47:34

You need to read this . But

47:37

anyway , folks , so let's let

47:39

me wrap it up here . So this , ladies and gentlemen , you've been

47:41

listening to the Night Marriage and Podcasts , episode three

47:43

of season two , with our

47:45

wonderful guess

47:48

, what we so much appreciate , mr John Lynch . Thank

47:51

you , folks , for your time . John

47:53

, thank you . And Jay , you got anything else for

47:55

us , man ?

47:56

No , we're good to go , man All

47:59

right , Y'all folks have a good night .