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for themselves And we

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all have a lot of fun listen to comedy bang

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bang wherever you listen to your podcasts Welcome

1:18

to the Peter King podcast down

1:21

the stretch of the NFL season podcast

1:25

With many things to discuss With

1:28

my good friend miles Simmons from NBC

1:30

quick. Look at our rundown. We're gonna

1:32

be joined by Kirk Herb Street recorded

1:35

an interview with him on

1:37

Monday and one

1:40

of the things I really like about Kirk Herb Street

1:43

is that I think of

1:45

things I want to talk to him about and then

1:47

I Don't get

1:49

to even a third of them because he's

1:51

so interesting and leads it in so many

1:54

different Directions, so

1:57

I think you'll really enjoy this one of my conversations

2:00

I've had with someone this

2:03

year for the podcast. So we'll

2:05

hear from Kirk Herb Street in a few minutes and

2:09

in the meantime we're going to talk

2:11

about the Drew Locke miracle in

2:14

Seattle on Monday night where

2:16

it leaves the Philadelphia Eagles and

2:19

I don't think either

2:22

Miles or me would

2:26

have thought at the beginning of

2:28

this of this run you know

2:31

mid-season late season struggle

2:33

of the Philadelphia Eagles that

2:36

they might be looking at playing the

2:38

postseason all on the

2:40

road it's kind of crazy but it could happen.

2:43

We'll also discuss the resurgent

2:46

Buffalo Bills, the

2:50

non-resurgent Dallas Cowboys, the

2:53

guy who right now both Miles

2:56

and me is or both

2:58

Miles and I. I'm getting

3:01

the pronouns totally

3:03

screwed up but the

3:06

guy who we think should be in the

3:08

lead for coach of the year at this

3:10

point and you know

3:13

just a couple of other notes as

3:16

we go down the stretch of this NFL

3:18

season. Miles Simmons welcome

3:20

and what goes through your

3:22

mind when you see Drew Locke drive

3:25

the Seattle Seahawks and Drew Locke

3:27

who hadn't played great up

3:29

to that point. Drew Locke

3:31

who drives the Seattle Seahawks

3:34

downfield huge completion to

3:37

DK Metcalf and then obviously a

3:39

great throw to win the

3:42

game and put a dagger in the

3:44

Philadelphia Eagles to Jackson Smith and Jigba.

3:46

What are you thinking? Well

3:48

I'll tell you here yeah I

3:50

was covering the Raiders in 2019

3:52

for the Las Vegas Review Journal

3:54

and in week 17 the Raiders

3:56

went to Denver played the Broncos

3:58

and Drew Locke played a solid

4:00

game, right? It was one of those where he was

4:03

still a rookie at the time and you're like, hey

4:05

man, he played well enough for

4:07

the Broncos to win. And there's obviously

4:09

the now famous shot of him wrapping

4:11

GZ on the sideline. And I

4:14

thought, A, that's some stuff that I would do if

4:16

I were a quarterback and that's pretty cool. And B,

4:18

this guy has some traits. And I

4:20

don't know if they're really gonna translate to him being

4:22

a good quarterback or not, but at that time, I

4:24

was like, you know what, he's got something to him.

4:27

And I think a lot of that

4:29

stuff came back in that game

4:31

that he had on Monday night where he's making

4:33

the throws that he had to make at the

4:35

time that he had to make them. And

4:38

it's tough for a guy, which we saw

4:40

in that interview that he did with Lisa

4:42

Salters after the game, where it's, you know,

4:44

A, you don't necessarily know if you're playing

4:46

B, it's been an emotion since he's been

4:48

a starter, yeah. And I think what's good

4:51

reason, you know, when you've been through the

4:53

kinds of things that he's been through over

4:55

the course of his football life and of

4:57

course, over the course of his NFL career,

4:59

when you have a moment like

5:01

that, where your back's against the wall and

5:03

you've got to drive down 92 yards to

5:06

effectively save the Seahawks season, I

5:09

mean, that is a really, really

5:11

big moment. And it's one

5:13

of those games, man, where I'm just like,

5:15

gosh, I love football. I just love it

5:18

so much because you never know what you're

5:20

going to see. And when you can see

5:22

what it means to someone in that kind

5:24

of moment, it just makes you love it

5:26

even more. So I was

5:28

really happy for Drew Locke and the success that he

5:30

was able to have last night. Look,

5:34

you know, Miles, I found myself thinking,

5:36

I'll confess, I went to bed at

5:38

halftime, I was a wreck, kind

5:41

of a travel nightmare coming back to

5:43

home to New York after being

5:46

in Foxborough on Sunday, Providence,

5:48

Sunday night. And, you

5:51

know, we had these, you know, biblical

5:53

reigns in New England and in New

5:55

York. So it

5:58

was interesting getting home. But anyway. But

6:01

be that as it may I was

6:03

exhausted I went to bed at halftime

6:05

and I got up watch the highlights

6:07

and what really impressed me down

6:10

the stretch is That

6:13

on this 92-yard drive Drew

6:17

lock was Basically

6:19

put up against the wall twice

6:23

two third and tens

6:26

The first one with oh, I

6:29

don't know like a minute to go in

6:32

his own territory literally

6:34

season on the line He

6:37

indeed DK Metcalf combined for a

6:39

34 yard, you

6:41

know catch and run and so

6:45

that basically gave Seattle

6:48

life and then obviously on the

6:51

pass to Smith and jig but a win the

6:53

game with 25

6:56

seconds left what really interested me

6:59

about that pass is The

7:02

confidence that a guy like drew lock has

7:04

to have even when the game has not

7:06

really gone the way He would want it

7:08

to go against a good defense

7:10

and But

7:13

he knew Shane Walter

7:15

in the offensive coordinator also

7:17

knew that the looks that

7:19

they were getting From

7:21

the Philadelphia Eagles. He thought there was

7:24

a very good chance That

7:27

one of his receivers was gonna have single

7:29

coverage without safety

7:31

help and As

7:34

soon as he looked over the

7:36

Philadelphia defense he saw that hey

7:38

I think there's a good chance

7:41

that James Bradbury is

7:43

gonna be singled on Jackson Smith and

7:45

jig, but now Assuming

7:49

Smith and jig, but doesn't get erased at the line

7:52

You know and and really hurt by

7:54

by you know a

7:56

physical play at the line

7:58

of scrimmage I know

8:01

he can beat James Bradbury and

8:04

hand it to Drew Locke at

8:07

this moment, at this very moment.

8:09

He had to know, absolutely

8:12

had to know, our season

8:14

is on the line and

8:17

I need to make a throw

8:20

right here. Now you

8:23

might say, Miles Simmons, well

8:25

wait a second, wait a second. They

8:28

have a good kicker and

8:31

even if this is incomplete, they're

8:34

still gonna go to overtime and

8:37

here would be my rejoinder to that.

8:40

That I do

8:42

not want my season

8:45

coming down to a 47-yard field

8:48

goal attempt and

8:52

then hopefully stopping,

8:55

you know, a last

8:58

gas drive of the

9:00

Eagles who have one of

9:02

the best deep clutch kickers

9:06

in football. So I

9:08

don't want to rely on giving the

9:10

Eagles four plays to

9:12

get into field goal range to beat

9:14

me at home. That's number one and

9:17

I don't want to rely on maybe a

9:19

coin flip or whatever to have

9:21

to win the game in overtime. There

9:23

are so many things that could go

9:25

wrong if that

9:28

pass to Smith and Jigba falls

9:30

incomplete. So I think

9:33

as I look at it, I love

9:35

the chance that Seattle took on

9:37

this play. I absolutely love

9:40

it and the biggest

9:42

throw of Droulac's life was

9:44

made and look, I

9:47

love when guys like

9:49

Droulac who nobody really has

9:51

faith in is gonna

9:53

be a franchise quarterback. Nobody. But

9:56

I love when they say, okay, I'm

9:59

gonna show it. everybody and he just did at

10:01

that moment. He did at

10:04

that moment and you know, they did need

10:06

that touchdown. You know, I think that when

10:08

you're Drew Locke and when you're Seattle and

10:10

when you're Smith and Jigba and I loved

10:13

the way Drew Locke put it after

10:15

the game, the Lisa Salters was like,

10:17

Hey man, if you're one-on-one, I'm firing

10:19

you that pill and he did, and

10:21

you know, he did it with confidence.

10:23

And he also talked about in the

10:25

post-game press conference, um, about

10:27

how Geno Smith was talking him up

10:30

on the sideline. And that's something that

10:32

you don't always see. Yeah.

10:35

You really don't always see it from

10:37

a quarterback and his backup. And sometimes,

10:39

you know, when quarterback get to the

10:41

podium and they start talking about stuff

10:43

like that, but kind of fish tails,

10:45

because, you know, yeah, you can give

10:47

credit to guys and you know, you,

10:49

you say things that sound nice, but

10:51

I think that that is some of the

10:53

most genuine praise that I've ever heard from

10:55

a backup to the starter when

10:57

you look at the reaction that

11:00

they showed on the ESPN broadcast

11:02

of Drew Locke and Geno Smith celebrating

11:05

that pass together. And Geno Smith is

11:07

doing the same backpack celebration that Drew

11:09

Locke is doing on the field. You

11:11

can tell that there is that genuine

11:14

connection and that genuine feeling of, Hey,

11:16

I'm trying to get you to play

11:18

at your, at your absolute best so

11:20

that our team can succeed. That's, that's

11:22

something that's pretty special from Geno Smith.

11:25

And I thought that, you know, that

11:27

relationship between him and Drew Locke really

11:29

was something that absolutely benefited the Seahawks

11:31

in that situation. So you don't

11:33

always see that from a quarterback,

11:35

especially one who, you know,

11:38

look, Geno Smith football

11:40

future with the Seattle Seahawks

11:42

is not necessarily guaranteed. And so,

11:44

yeah, Geno Smith is still slated to be the starter

11:46

when he comes back. And I think he is the

11:48

best option for Seattle for the rest of the season.

11:51

But at the same time, like I

11:53

said, you just don't always see something

11:55

like that in that moment for

11:58

a quarterback who is injured. And

12:00

in the backup who was in there and they just

12:02

had a quarterback competition to see who was going to

12:04

be the starter last year. So

12:08

Seattle right now, if

12:11

they went out and their

12:13

three opponents are

12:15

combined 15 and 27

12:18

Tennessee, Pittsburgh, Arizona, you

12:21

could see them winning out, even though they

12:23

have not played well, I could also see

12:25

them losing one of those games. But

12:27

if they went out, it's very likely

12:29

that they will be the six or

12:32

seven seed in the NFC. And

12:35

let's talk for a minute about the Philadelphia

12:37

Eagles. So not a

12:40

good week for the Eagles. I

12:43

mean, not a good week at all.

12:46

Um, let's, let's just put the

12:48

cards on the table. Not

12:50

a good last 14 days for

12:53

the Philadelphia Eagles. They get

12:55

creamed by San Francisco

12:58

at home. They get creamed

13:00

by Dallas on the road.

13:02

They lose a game. They had

13:04

no business losing at Seattle,

13:08

which had been on a four game losing street.

13:12

And so where are the

13:14

Eagles right now? And I'll just say two things. They

13:17

appear to be, although it's not

13:20

exactly correct. They appear to be

13:22

a little panicky right now, changing

13:25

defensive coordinators. So late in the

13:27

season and not

13:31

playing well on offense, really not playing

13:33

well on defense until Monday night, then

13:35

they played a pretty good game, but

13:37

that all goes a wall when

13:41

you allow a 92 yard drive in about 92

13:43

seconds to lose a game. You

13:49

absolutely had to have. And

13:52

so Miles, where do

13:54

you think right now this leaves the

13:56

Eagles? I don't

13:58

think it leaves them in a good spot. And

14:00

you're not in a good spot if you're

14:03

changing defensive play callers because of course Sean

14:05

this I still officially I guess Has the

14:07

defensive coordinator title? La la la but if

14:09

you're changing defensive play callers then you know

14:11

you're not in a good spot when it's

14:14

this late in the season and They

14:16

needed to do something because their third down defense

14:18

and I'm talking about scatter right there Excuse me,

14:21

Philadelphia right now their third down defense was awful

14:23

Right there when you're last in the league and

14:25

you've got those kinds of pass rushers up front.

14:28

There's something wrong So they did

14:30

need to do something you already have Matt

14:32

Patricia in your building I understand why you

14:34

would do that now going into that last

14:36

drive Seattle was four

14:38

of twelve on third down and then

14:40

they gave up two big big third

14:42

down conversions to end up at six

14:44

of 14 so you

14:46

can see that yes There was some improvement on

14:49

third down over the course of the game But

14:51

I don't know when you're leaving guys one-on-one for

14:53

deep shots toward the end there And

14:55

you're daring true lock to to make those throws

14:57

and to make those plays I there's a part

14:59

of me that understands it but at the same

15:01

time man I mean, is that

15:03

really the best play on defense clearly? It

15:06

wasn't if we're going with the result here

15:08

because that's what happened, right? You see that

15:10

touchdown get made So those are things that

15:12

Seattle's got to deal with. Excuse me, Philadelphia's

15:14

got to deal with going forward The

15:17

other thing to Peter is

15:19

that Jalen Hurts is talking about

15:21

guys being committed right in

15:23

commitment and you could tell that

15:25

he was very frustrated after the loss and

15:28

Talking about these different kinds of things

15:30

when he was asked about two-minute situations

15:33

and then goes into you know Making

15:35

it a broader thing about commitment there

15:38

That's not good when your

15:40

quarterback who right is a sensibly an

15:43

MVP candidate every year at this point

15:46

When he's talking about that at this

15:48

point in the season late December, that

15:50

means you've got a disconnect And I don't know if it's

15:52

just coaching and Quarterback or

15:54

quarterback and the rest of the personnel

15:57

on the offense. That's a

15:59

problem and they've to get that right.

16:01

They obviously have a chance to

16:03

get that right with Giants Cardinals Giants

16:05

over the last three games of the

16:08

season, but when you're talking about divisional

16:10

matchups and the Giants have played good

16:12

games this year, there's a chance that Philadelphia

16:14

could lose one of those. So this

16:17

is going to be a really interesting stretch for the Eagles.

16:19

Can they get right and get that

16:22

the thing started back on an upward

16:24

trajectory headed into the postseason because I

16:26

frankly did not expect them to lose

16:28

three in a row, especially at this

16:30

time of year. Yeah,

16:34

and I think there's two

16:36

other things about the Eagles that would

16:39

trouble me right now. Look, not the schedule.

16:42

You know, they have three winnable games. You

16:44

know, even the Giants with some of that

16:47

Tommy DeVito magic, you've

16:50

got to think that the Giants

16:53

are going to at least be competitive in

16:55

one of those games. But if you look

16:57

at the Eagles right now, you

17:00

still think, even though you

17:03

say they're not playing well, Giants,

17:05

Arizona both at home and then at

17:08

the Giants to finish, you

17:10

like their chances to run the table.

17:12

But it's kind

17:14

of funny. I was thinking about this this morning.

17:16

If Philadelphia finishes 13 and

17:19

four, whether they win the

17:21

division or not, crazy thing is they

17:23

could finish 13 and four and

17:26

be pretty shaky going into the playoffs. So

17:28

I think they have not just

17:31

to steady the ship, but

17:34

I think they need to play well and

17:37

in a dominant fashion down

17:39

the stretch to knock

17:41

out even a bunch of personal doubts that

17:44

they have coming into

17:47

what certainly is going to be the

17:49

postseason, but coming into feeling decent about

17:52

themselves in the postseason. Miles,

17:55

we're going to take a quick break and then on

17:57

the other side. We

18:00

will be joined by, or I will

18:02

be joined by, Kirk Herbstreet, the

18:05

Amazon Prime Video color

18:08

analyst for NFL Thursday Night

18:10

Football. I just wanted to

18:12

check in with him, see how he's doing,

18:14

see how he likes the NFL. And

18:16

we had one of the most wide ranging

18:19

conversations. It was fun. Talked a lot about

18:21

dogs. You get a good view,

18:23

if you watch this on

18:25

the NBC Sports YouTube channel, you get a

18:27

good view of Ben, the

18:29

Golden Retriever, who now, I think, might

18:31

be the most famous Golden Retriever in

18:34

the United States. You get a

18:36

really good view of him taking a nap. So

18:39

at the feet of Kirk Herbstreet. And

18:43

we talk about a lot of things, and I think you'll be

18:46

surprised and educated by

18:49

what he finds to be

18:51

the thing that has really hit

18:53

him the most about doing

18:56

two years of pro football. And

18:58

the difference maybe between pro football and

19:00

college football as he sees it right

19:02

now. I think he makes some good

19:05

points. So on the

19:07

other side of our break, you'll listen to

19:09

Kirk Herbstreet, and then Miles and I will

19:11

be back for part two of

19:15

our review of week

19:17

15 and preview of week 16.

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code WELCOME. So

20:28

happy to be joined this week by Kirk Hurte

20:31

Street on the podcast and Kirk we've

20:33

got a thousand things to

20:35

get to in 20 minutes to

20:37

get to them but there's something

20:39

very very personal that

20:41

I wanted to ask you about. Number one as

20:44

you can see hold on one second I

20:46

am an Ohio Bobcat so

20:49

I don't really follow

20:52

college football very

20:54

closely and I look

20:56

in the online every Saturday or the

20:59

paper on Sunday to see how

21:02

did the Bobcats do yesterday but I'm not

21:05

close to the program or anything like that.

21:08

So I said hey Bobcats

21:11

are in the Myrtle Beach Bowl on

21:14

Saturday and I'm

21:17

gonna watch part of the game. I'm

21:20

working here at home and so

21:22

I'm gonna watch part of the game so I turned on the

21:24

game and I said hey wait

21:26

a second where's our

21:28

quarterback where's our where's

21:30

our our running back who rushed

21:32

for a jillion yards where's our receivers

21:35

where where's our all

21:37

Mac I think linebacker there

21:40

and so during early in the telecast

21:42

they say they don't

21:45

went into the transfer portal including

21:48

the freaking starting quarterback

21:51

and we really don't have to the

21:53

I didn't think we had another

21:56

quarterback who was competitive because this

21:58

guy Curtis Rourke played But

22:01

you know, I just I just

22:03

said okay look nobody

22:05

cares really about Mac football.

22:07

It's not gonna, it's

22:10

not the biggest event, it's not anything but

22:12

I mean I just thought

22:14

to myself isn't there a time and place

22:16

for everything? Can't

22:19

players who

22:21

committed to their team finish

22:23

one season before they

22:25

you know abdicate the throne

22:28

and I just I just

22:30

wanted to hear your thoughts about what has happened

22:32

in this whole transfer portal business. We

22:38

only have 20 minutes so this

22:41

is a tough answer. You

22:44

know college football

22:47

has probably endured more

22:49

change in the last

22:51

two years than

22:53

the previous 50 years

22:58

and I think part of what you're describing is

23:00

I think part of

23:02

you know the part of the madness of what's

23:04

happening if you throw in on top of that

23:07

the NIL it typically lures players

23:09

from those those mid-tier programs if you have

23:11

a great quarterback if you have a great

23:13

running back and you're out of

23:15

Mac school or a Mountain

23:18

West school chances are if he's

23:20

an underclassman he's gonna get basically

23:22

recruited up to one of the bigger schools

23:24

which I'm not a fan of I'm just

23:26

telling you that's that's kind of where it

23:29

is currently anyway and

23:31

then you have guys that opt out you know

23:33

even if they're done playing college they think they're

23:35

gonna go to the NFL they'll opt

23:38

out of the bowl game so

23:40

I lived in an era where the bowl

23:42

games were it was a

23:45

celebration of the season you had it was kind

23:47

of a big deal you know you you really

23:49

look forward to going and playing in a bowl

23:51

game you get a little bit of freedom which

23:53

you never had as a player because every every

23:55

minute of every day you live

23:57

a very regimented life and so you go

24:00

to a bowl game, you'd practice in the

24:02

morning, you'd be done with working out by

24:04

around noon and you'd have

24:06

four or five six hours in Orlando,

24:08

Florida or Dallas, Texas or Pasadena wherever

24:10

you were and your buddies could go

24:13

out and enjoy yourself you know for

24:15

about four or five days and

24:17

it was it was and then there was

24:20

pride on the line when you played in the bowl game

24:22

and it's just nowadays

24:24

that's that's just not a thing

24:26

it's it's all about the transfer

24:28

portal it's all about NIL it's

24:31

all about creating basically

24:34

money and leverage for yourself and

24:38

I hate that it's doing that to the

24:40

game I really do because I miss

24:42

I miss those postseason

24:45

games being

24:47

a part of a team and playing

24:49

one more time together I used to

24:51

really love that aspect of the college

24:54

game. I

24:56

guess as far as

24:58

the transfer portal goes so I see Curtis

25:00

Rirk went to Indiana I have

25:02

no no problem with a guy better

25:04

himself it

25:07

absolutely fine and

25:09

plus you should be able to go play where

25:11

you want I get that yeah I

25:13

guess the timing of it just yeah I'm

25:15

with I think I think coaches feel that

25:17

to all this happening in

25:20

December you know you're trying to

25:22

prepare for a bowl game your

25:24

party rosters leaving you're

25:26

trying to recruit by the way that the high

25:28

school recruiting signing periods up in another week or

25:31

so or another few days so you're think

25:33

about that I mean you're trying to close

25:35

on a recruiting class you're having players go

25:37

on visits that are currently on your roster

25:40

they're leaving all this is happening you're preparing

25:42

for a bowl game you don't know who's

25:44

on your roster they

25:46

definitely gonna have to reevaluate

25:49

the timing of this because it's

25:51

tough on the players it's tough on the coaches

25:53

it doesn't make

25:56

a lot of sense with why they have it

25:58

the way it is right now but Again,

26:01

I really feel like we're a year or two

26:03

away from this whole thing just

26:06

blowing up. And probably

26:08

that this new, they're going to a 12

26:10

team playoff next year. I wouldn't be surprised

26:12

if we live in this new world of

26:15

like 50 or 60 teams. And

26:17

they almost branch away from the NCAA,

26:20

kind of create their new own governing

26:22

body and come

26:26

up with a CBA with the players like they

26:28

do in the NFL, negotiate

26:30

with the players, NIL, Transfer Portal,

26:32

put some rules and regulation around

26:34

it. Because right now there

26:36

are no rules. Do whatever you want to do. Boosters

26:39

can get involved. People can pay people. It's

26:42

just really chaotic right now. And

26:45

I think until they get their arms around it,

26:47

it'll continue to be that way. But my guess

26:49

is another year or two until this

26:51

thing, this thing will blow up on its

26:53

own. One

26:58

other kind of semi-college football

27:00

question. Got into this debate

27:02

with Mike Florio the other day about

27:08

Jim Harbaugh as an NFL coach.

27:10

And now, so now that

27:12

you've had a chance to

27:14

be knee deep in the NFL

27:16

for two years, doing the Thursday

27:18

night games, being around all these

27:20

teams, being around coaches, players, everything

27:22

like that, I'm curious.

27:25

You think Jim Harbaugh's

27:27

game, or Jim

27:30

Harbaugh's a coach, is

27:32

better suited in college football

27:35

or pro football? And

27:38

do you think he might jump if he got

27:40

the right offer? I

27:43

personally think his game and his style fits, obviously

27:45

in college, emperor. I mean, it wasn't like he

27:47

struggled when he was in the pro game. I

27:49

mean, he had a lot of success. I

27:52

think he's a good coach. I know people like

27:54

to have fun with him and talk about the

27:57

way he is when he's in the pro game.

28:00

in front of the media and some of the things

28:02

he says, and how he's a little bit unusual

28:04

with a character that he kind of has created.

28:07

But I talked to his players a lot,

28:09

and man, they'd run through a wall for

28:11

him. So he's doing something

28:13

right. And I think

28:15

he, in the college game, I think he

28:18

really enjoys trying to fight, as he says,

28:20

for the student athlete. He

28:23

feels that the student athletes deserve, as he

28:25

says it, they deserve revenue sharing, which means

28:27

not just NIL, but he's going to bat

28:29

for him to try to get some of

28:32

the TV money that's in the billions of

28:34

dollars. So I think there's part

28:36

of him that really enjoys that

28:40

the little guy taking on the big bully, so

28:42

to speak. And

28:45

I think that he really engages with the 18

28:47

to 22-year-old, and I

28:49

think he has their best interest in his

28:51

heart. So I think that's real for him.

28:54

I think he enjoys that part of it. I

28:56

know every single off-season, his name comes

28:58

up, and it's because he was successful

29:00

with the 49ers and what

29:03

he was able to do. So Peter, it's hard for me

29:05

to say that he fit better in

29:07

pros or college, because I think his

29:09

style of football and what he does, I

29:12

think it fits in both. And I've

29:14

really enjoyed these last two years doing the

29:16

NFL, because 10 or

29:19

15 years ago or even further back, the

29:22

college game was always trying to come up to

29:24

the NFL game, and it would filter its way

29:26

down to the college game. And the really good

29:28

college programs, you would see Nick Saban running some

29:31

of the stuff that Bill Belichick ran, or you

29:33

might see some offensive coordinators running

29:35

kind of the West Coast offense, the digit

29:37

system, or whatever it might be. And

29:40

now, as you know, the college game

29:42

has gone full circle. And I

29:45

think once Andy Reid had success

29:47

with Patrick Mahomes, and

29:49

I think when Lamar Jackson, who Dave,

29:52

who's drafted, it's like, you're a running

29:54

back, you know, Jalen Hurts,

29:56

what are you doing? You can't be a

29:58

pro quarterback. And once these guys... and

30:00

not only became NFL quarterbacks,

30:02

but became very successful. I

30:05

think we're in the midst right now

30:07

of offensive coordinators trying to figure

30:10

out how to run like a new

30:12

style of offensive football taking advantage of

30:14

the legs and the arms of these

30:16

quarterbacks, which is so different from Phillip

30:18

Rivers, Drew Brees, Peyton Manning,

30:20

Tom Brady, all those, that

30:23

generation quarterback. It's almost

30:25

like Aaron Rodgers is the last of

30:27

that generation quarterback. And now we're

30:29

going into the Patrick Mahomes era where it's

30:31

like you better be able to move, or

30:34

I don't know if you can play quarterback in today's game.

30:37

So I think

30:39

Harbaugh can coach that at the college

30:41

level, but I understand why there's

30:43

a lure every single off season.

30:45

It's almost like he's already, everyone's

30:48

just assuming he's gonna be an NFL coach. Where

30:50

that'll be, I have no idea, but I

30:54

love his personality. He's a character in the

30:56

college game. So I

30:58

hope he stays at Michigan, but I get

31:00

it if he goes on to the NFL. The

31:04

reason why I ask honestly

31:06

is that, what was it

31:08

a year or two ago? I forget when, I

31:11

think two years ago, that he

31:13

was interviewing for the Vikings job on National

31:15

Signing Day. And I said,

31:18

anybody who does that at some point,

31:20

the guy's going back to the NFL. I'm

31:24

not saying that National Signing

31:26

Day is some sacrilegious date.

31:29

That if you're not sitting in your office, getting

31:32

the faxes or emails or whatever, you're

31:35

not doing your job. I

31:37

don't really know how it works, but I

31:40

just thought that says to me that

31:42

Jim Harbaugh, at one point, is probably

31:45

gonna coach in the NFL, but we'll see. So

31:50

we've gotta talk about Golden

31:52

Retrievers. I

31:56

Read with great interest the story in the

31:59

athletic about you. And your

32:01

dog Ben. And ah,

32:04

I. Get the you know obviously a follow

32:06

you on social media and I see Ben

32:08

all the time and I said. Nobody.

32:10

I mean bends a good that all. Day.

32:13

But. Ben is your and correct me

32:15

if I'm wrong. Your ten year old

32:17

golden? Yeah. Badminton. There's. Not a

32:20

lot a golden to fly on

32:22

private planes taking off and who

32:24

should go to all the biggest

32:26

sports events and go to cool

32:28

hotels and an offer of but.

32:31

How did it start? Kirk that

32:33

you started taking your dog on

32:35

the road with you. Will.

32:38

We had. We had a tough a

32:40

tough year on a personal problem with

32:42

my family of four signs and my

32:44

my guy identical twins are twenty three

32:46

and my my twenty year old who

32:48

just turned twenty one sack is in

32:50

Ohio State as a as a I

32:52

preferred walk on he plays tied in

32:54

there and ah around the early part

32:56

of June. He was coughing

32:58

rule badly and. Are got

33:00

diagnosed with quarter mile pussy and large

33:03

left hard left and troubles hard. It

33:05

was really really severe and dumb as

33:07

if one side you know it

33:09

he may need a heart transplant and

33:12

so to this point it's It's holding

33:14

steady is not improving, it's not getting

33:16

any worse. Puts put it on

33:18

of stress on my wife and and

33:21

myself just being concerned about him and

33:23

and right we've done arms around you

33:25

His diagnosis the season started off and

33:28

as I twentieth year doing this. You

33:30

know traveling and and and being away from

33:32

her family but this was at this was

33:34

a tough does the tough thing and so

33:36

run the middle of the year. After

33:40

my dog man would replace my son

33:42

was just about taking him on the

33:44

road. just made me feel ah I'm.

33:48

Gonna. Like it was part a homecoming with

33:50

me And he is the most laid

33:52

back. Showed. companion you can

33:54

ever hope for ah in fact as we'd

33:56

sit here and talk like this is if

33:59

i'm if you traveling with me.

34:02

He's right there sleeping. Hey,

34:04

Ben, wake up. It's not really

34:06

interesting. Yeah,

34:09

he's always with me and anybody who

34:12

has a dog, especially a retriever or

34:14

a lab, probably can relate to that.

34:17

And so he's my buddy and I traveled

34:19

with him one time just as a one-off

34:22

and it went so

34:24

smoothly, you know, as far as the logistics

34:27

of the hotel and getting him around

34:31

that I just inquired about

34:34

making him an emotional support animal and

34:36

went through three or

34:38

four weeks of an evaluation, you know,

34:40

and a Zoom call like this and

34:44

then they gave him a certificate. And so

34:46

once they did that, I just started traveling

34:48

with him. So he's been on the road

34:50

with me now probably. So that allows him

34:52

to go into every hotel and all the

34:54

buildings that normally a dog would be able

34:56

to go into. That's very interesting. Yeah,

34:59

yeah, and so he travels with me

35:01

and, you know, we've got our own

35:03

routine now and, you know, he's been

35:05

to Chicago, New York City, Las Vegas,

35:07

I mean Athens, Georgia, I mean all

35:10

these different places. And the pro stadiums,

35:12

a lot of them, they have a

35:14

rule the dog can't come into the

35:16

pro stadium, the college stadiums. He comes out in

35:18

the pre-game warm-ups. He's just

35:21

walking around. The players are, you know,

35:23

in their warm-ups and they see my

35:25

golden retriever just hanging around. They're full

35:27

uniform. They come over and pet him,

35:29

you know, and the hotels, it's the

35:32

craziest thing. We were just in Las Vegas at

35:34

our hotel and at first you're

35:36

worried about it and then they realize how

35:38

friendly he is and the people

35:41

that work at the hotel, they're coming over to him

35:43

and he'll go on his own, you know, he'll leave

35:45

me and just if people are being nice to him

35:47

and I just go about my business and I'm like

35:51

the hotel, you should buy a

35:53

dog like this and just let him hang out in the lobby because

35:56

yes, they're all over him. I mean everybody because he

35:58

just has, he just his

36:00

tail's wagging and he's just kind of sitting there.

36:02

So he's had a great time. It's been unbelievable

36:06

experience for me

36:08

and I can't imagine. I'm going to LA

36:11

this week for the Saints Rams game on

36:13

Thursday and then the following week we'll have

36:15

the Jets and the Browns on Thursday and

36:18

then I'll fly to LA for

36:20

the Rose Bowl and the Rose Bowls, I'm

36:22

going into their Hall of Fame this year and they're

36:24

like, you know, make sure you tell Kirk Ben has

36:27

a credential, he's welcome here and he'll

36:29

be at the Rose Bowl and be on the field before

36:31

the game and he'll probably be in the

36:33

booth while I'm calling the game. So yeah, it's been

36:36

a lot of fun but the reaction on social

36:38

media has been bizarre. I didn't even expect

36:41

that but clearly there's a

36:43

bunch of dog fans out there because

36:45

anything you put out on Ben, people

36:48

love to see. They just eat it up. I'm

36:51

really curious about one kind of serious part

36:53

of it, you know, the fact that

36:55

he's an emotional support animal. You

36:58

feel with a hardship in your

37:00

family that you really

37:02

needed a touch of home with

37:04

you that you

37:06

really feel like he's

37:08

helped you mentally this

37:10

year? No question. You

37:14

know, and you can relate to this as much as you

37:16

travel. I think just, I

37:18

mean, my son and what he's dealing with

37:20

right now, what we've dealt with as a

37:22

family is one thing but honestly Peter, just

37:25

being on the road a lot, you know,

37:27

and people can talk about private planes and

37:29

all that. It's still, you still are on

37:31

the road and away from, you

37:34

know, your family and you're talking about

37:36

for me, I equate it to like

37:38

from August to January 9th, I'm

37:41

on a treadmill at about 15 miles an

37:43

hour, not 789, I

37:47

just feel like it's 15 miles an hour for four

37:49

and a half months. I'm not complaining. I'm not saying

37:51

woe is me. I'm just saying it's

37:54

a pretty good grind and when you're away from

37:56

your family, it's

37:59

challenging, you know. And not to mention you

38:01

live in the public eye and people, you know,

38:03

have strong opinions about what you

38:06

say or do and and it's

38:09

just something about having him with me. It

38:12

does give me peace of mind and as much

38:14

as people have fun with it on social media

38:16

and love watching him for me when it's just

38:18

me and him and it's quiet. Yeah,

38:21

it gives me, you know, it gives

38:23

me a, I think a calming presence

38:26

around me and I just love having

38:28

him with me and he's, you

38:30

know, I've had a lot of dogs. I

38:32

have four dogs actually right now and he

38:34

of all my dogs. He's just. He's

38:37

just different, you know, I don't know

38:40

what it is about him. My dogs are

38:42

wonderful, but Ben is just a. He's

38:45

part human like he understands me. I

38:47

could, you know, he can relate to

38:50

everything I'm experiencing. And

38:52

if you're a dog person, maybe you get that. But

38:55

for me, he's he's just my companion

38:57

and and I'm I look at it like

38:59

he's a blessing. Honestly, in my life. Tell

39:05

me a little bit about Zach now. How's

39:07

he doing? How's his physical condition right now?

39:10

He just had a test yesterday on

39:12

his on his to find out what

39:15

if he's improved and he's he had

39:17

some improvement, which was great is ejection

39:19

fraction. Which which

39:21

really looks at the heart and its

39:24

function. It's very, very low at this

39:26

point. The size of the heart is very,

39:29

very large, but it has come down a

39:31

little bit, which is good. At least it's

39:33

heading in the right direction. He's

39:35

on about five or six different meds

39:37

and has been now for for about

39:39

four months. And so we're just

39:41

going to continue the same process

39:43

for as long as

39:45

it takes. We hope we there's really no

39:47

way other than we know. It's hereditary

39:51

the gene that he has.

39:54

It's on my side of the family. Other than

39:56

knowing that we don't know because we

39:58

didn't have a prior diagnosis. We don't know

40:00

if he's had this for a few years

40:03

or if he had it after around COVID. We have

40:05

no idea except the size of

40:07

it would tell you that it didn't happen within,

40:09

you know, the previous months. I

40:11

think it's been that way for a long

40:13

time. So it's going to, for

40:16

it to heal, if it does, it will

40:18

take, you know, a substantial amount of time.

40:20

But it's not getting

40:22

worse. They did put a defibrillator in

40:24

him just a few weeks ago.

40:27

And because up to that point, he had a portable, like, I

40:29

call it a life vest that he had on 24-7. So

40:33

he had to wear it everywhere under his

40:35

clothes. Now he actually, they inserted one underneath

40:37

his left side of his arm. And

40:40

so, you know, he's got a

40:43

very positive attitude. You

40:45

know, he's kind of that

40:47

way. He's a glass half full guy. I'm a

40:49

glass half empty guy. But

40:51

he is a glass half full guy. So

40:54

he's remaining positive. And I'll tell you, being

40:56

a part of the Ohio State football program

40:58

with Ryan Day, they let him travel

41:00

this year. The Big Ten gave him a waiver to allow

41:02

him to be a part of it.

41:04

So he's been to all the games and they've given

41:06

him a job to be, just feel like he's still

41:09

part of it because his career is over. But,

41:12

yeah, it's, all things

41:14

considered, it's, you know, he's

41:17

hanging in there. Peanut Tooming, by the

41:19

way, bumped into me in Chicago. And he

41:21

told me about his daughter, who is now

41:23

I think 15 or 16. But she had

41:25

a heart transplant as an infant. And

41:28

he just, he sought me out on the

41:30

field before a game that I and

41:32

I were there on a Thursday night. Just could not have

41:35

been a nicer guy. This blew me away. I've known about

41:37

him as a player. But, man,

41:39

as just a gentleman and as

41:41

a guy, you know, when you're going

41:43

through something like this, just little pieces of, hey,

41:45

I knew somebody that went through this or my

41:48

daughter went through this. We're just going to give

41:50

you something to hang on to for

41:52

hope. And so that's been bumping into

41:54

people like that. Greg Olson, another

41:57

guy that's been through a lot. So, so.

42:00

That that part really helped a lot

42:02

in around this you realize you realize

42:04

that this this week is the five-year

42:06

anniversary That Matt

42:08

millen had a heart transplant. I Didn't

42:11

know the five-year Wow and he's really doing

42:13

well. That's awesome I thought so my remember

42:16

when he got diagnosed and at the time

42:18

I know we were all You

42:21

know worried that You

42:23

do and before I knew about her transplants when

42:25

I heard when I hear her transplant I think

42:28

oh no, you know and and now that you

42:30

know now that you research it a little bit you realize Incredible

42:33

work that these doctors do and the technology

42:36

and how far it's advanced So that's that's

42:38

great to hear about Matt off to reach

42:40

out to him. I

42:42

got one more dog related question I

42:45

think you can now tell America that

42:47

you named your new puppy after me

42:51

after you That's

42:53

right. It's a good call little little

42:55

Peter. Yeah, it is after you. I

42:57

like your pick the name That's it.

42:59

I mean look our dog's name is

43:01

Chuck Which is kind

43:03

of a dog name? Yeah, that is a good

43:06

dog name. Yeah. Yeah, my wife and my kids

43:08

We I think we just get a kick out

43:10

of you know,

43:12

we have been we have CEO we

43:15

have Mitch and You

43:18

know and now we have Pete Peter or Pete I

43:22

Don't know. I don't like my kids and I we

43:24

all just kind of bounced it was it was close

43:26

to being Jeff and I forget

43:29

the names that they were they were talking about Kevin

43:31

I think was a name and I Only

43:34

settled settled on on

43:36

Peter Peter. Yes All

43:38

right. So Kirk we gotta ask I gotta ask

43:40

you two things about the NFL now, so you've

43:43

had two years in it Tell

43:45

me what if anything has surprised

43:48

you probably it's probably

43:50

not anything that's a huge shock But

43:52

what surprised you over the last couple

43:55

of years now that you

43:57

have been totally? kind

43:59

of inculcated with

44:01

NFL-ness. What hits

44:03

you? I think the

44:06

thing that really stands out

44:08

to me, and I've been an NFL

44:10

fan my whole life, but now when

44:12

you prepare, like right now, I've

44:14

got my boards in front of me, I've

44:17

got my own routine that I do

44:19

every week to prepare. The

44:22

thing that stands out to me, I think, is

44:24

where we are as a sport with,

44:27

a lot of tension goes on the backup quarterbacks.

44:30

I think what I've been blown away

44:32

by is the discrepancy between the offensive

44:34

line play and the injuries that are

44:37

inevitable and the jump to

44:39

the defensive line and how

44:41

dominant the defensive line

44:43

is and versus the

44:45

offensive line. With the exception of, I mean, you

44:47

could go down, the Cowboys and the 49ers and

44:49

the Eagles. I mean, there's a few that are

44:52

healthy and they're really talented. But

44:55

while everybody wants to talk about these

44:57

backup quarterbacks, every single week,

44:59

it seems like Al and I are talking about,

45:01

okay, the left guard is out, so they had

45:03

to move the right guard over to left guard,

45:05

the center went over to this. They found a

45:08

right tackle who retired and they brought him back

45:10

to play. It's just, I'm

45:12

really amazed with the lack of availability

45:18

of competent offensive linemen and

45:21

how rare it is to find six

45:24

or seven guys on

45:26

a roster that can

45:29

remain healthy and they can

45:31

give you a cohesion front to

45:34

give the quarterbacks and these

45:36

offensive coordinators who get ripped from limb

45:38

to limb. What's wrong with this quarterback?

45:40

What's wrong with this coordinator when

45:43

all you really have to do is look

45:45

what's happening in front of them. And the

45:47

Saints who I have this week are really

45:49

good example. Derek Carr, he's terrible. What happened

45:51

to Derek Carr? It's like, well, they

45:53

can't run the ball. The offensive line has really struggled

45:55

and all of a sudden these last two or four

45:58

weeks. It gets a little bit better. up

46:00

front, getting better play, becoming a little more

46:02

of a solid unit, and all of

46:04

a sudden, their cars playing better football.

46:06

So I think that's the thing that's really stood

46:08

out to me is how

46:12

pedestrian the offensive line play is

46:14

because of injuries and the lack

46:17

of depth. And then

46:19

they're going up against, to me, the most gifted

46:22

and most athletic position in

46:24

the game that, again, often gets overlooked, which

46:26

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47:35

right, my loves, we are back. And of course,

47:37

before we end the show, we each like to

47:39

share something that's helping us keep our vibes right

47:41

this week. Sam, what's your recommendation? Yeah.

47:44

So I told you last week that

47:46

my rec was family meal by Brian

47:48

Washington. Beautiful novel. I just

47:50

finished it. When

47:53

you watch tape on them and what you thought

47:55

when you watched them play. of

48:00

the 49ers and he's going to become light

48:02

it up. Yeah, what he is. But I

48:04

would tell you, I do tell you this,

48:07

that he played for a head coach

48:09

that a lot of people in the

48:11

college game have a ton of respect

48:13

for Matt Campbell, Campbell, he played in

48:15

a system that I don't

48:17

think he had to change much of

48:19

the way they ran

48:21

their operation for four

48:23

years, freshman year, think about being

48:26

a freshman. And you're playing Oklahoma

48:28

in Texas and all these big

48:30

programs. And as a 19 year old and a 20 year old

48:34

and 21 and 22, he was the face of

48:37

a perennial loser in the big

48:39

12 that he led

48:41

to becoming a winner. And

48:44

he was along for the entire ride of some

48:46

ups and some downs. So I think his experience

48:49

and the way they

48:51

ran their strength and conditioning program and you got

48:53

to go to class and you need to be

48:56

on time very efficient

48:58

operation. And I

49:00

think when he luck would have

49:02

it, he ends up falling into

49:04

Kyle Shanahan system and john

49:07

lynch's system. And I think it was almost

49:09

like, okay, four years of college, probably

49:12

felt like he still to a certain

49:14

degree and aims Iowa based on how

49:16

they run their operation. It was an

49:18

extension of what he did

49:21

in Iowa State. He was

49:23

undersized athletic. ball

49:27

was out. He was a guy that had

49:29

the ability to process the ball

49:31

would get out quickly. He

49:34

played so many games like, you know,

49:36

and in some big time atmospheres in

49:38

college football where there's 80,000 100,000 people

49:40

there on national

49:43

TV. So I think when he got

49:45

to the NFL, the one question was, could

49:47

he learn Kyle Shanahan system? And

49:51

could he process the complexity

49:54

of NFL defenses and

49:56

how much there is because that was a

49:58

strength of his in college And

50:00

it's impossible to predict if

50:03

a college quarterback will be able to jump

50:05

to the NFL, learn that

50:07

new system, and then react as

50:09

quickly and as efficiently as

50:11

he did in college. That's why a lot of

50:14

guys miss on trying to find that quarterback. And

50:16

this guy is Mr. Irrelevant. You just never know.

50:18

But this kid's mind and

50:20

the system that he's in, I think he

50:23

understands it, he sees it, and then he

50:25

brings some intangibles. He's not a rah-rah guy,

50:27

but he's got enough edge to him and a

50:30

chip on his shoulder. And I

50:32

think his teammates seem to really be rallying around

50:34

in the NFL, because I certainly know they did

50:36

when he was in college. It's

50:39

interesting. I covered the

50:41

game that was sort of his coming

50:43

out party when Jimmy Garoppolo broke his

50:46

foot against Miami in

50:48

that big game early December

50:51

a year ago. And

50:53

he came in, he widened the

50:55

lead, and the 49ers won that

50:57

game going away. It was a

51:00

shock to everybody. And

51:02

after the game, I said to him, Brock,

51:05

big day for you, but a

51:08

bigger day is coming. Next

51:10

week, your first start in

51:12

the NFL here at Levi's

51:14

Stadium, you'll

51:16

be playing Tom Brady. He

51:19

said, how do you feel about that? He said, in

51:22

a voice I can best describe

51:24

as flatline. Oh,

51:27

cool. He's been playing football longer

51:30

than I've been alive. And

51:33

it was like, you

51:35

know, it reminds me a little bit of

51:38

the way Tommy DeVito is with the Giants

51:40

now. We can all sit

51:43

here and say, oh my God, it's ridiculous

51:45

what he did and won three starts and

51:48

beat the Packers on Monday night football. But

51:50

Tommy DeVito's whole point is, hey, I've

51:53

been playing football since I was five years old. I

51:57

belong. It's not a shock to

51:59

me. And I

52:02

want to end this, Kirk, and I

52:04

want to ask you this one thing.

52:08

For those who don't know this, who

52:10

only know Kirk Herb Street

52:13

as a TV guy, you

52:16

know, I distinctly remember this because

52:18

I, you know, going

52:20

to Ohio University in the late 70s,

52:23

I became kind

52:25

of a big fan of the Ohio

52:28

State Michigan rivalry. And

52:30

I remember the game you played, I

52:32

think it was, in about 92. If

52:35

I'm not mistaken, it was a

52:38

tie, one of the few ties at all. Was

52:40

that a tie game you played against Michigan?

52:42

Yeah. Right. So

52:47

anyway, but I remember because I

52:49

knew we were

52:51

going to talk today and I was racking my

52:53

brain. And anyway, and

52:56

I wrote this note in my column,

52:58

and it's going to be a weird

53:00

thing to end on because it's not

53:02

about you, but it's about expertise that

53:04

you have. Okay.

53:06

It's a note for my column

53:08

this week about Justin Herbert, and

53:10

here's the note. In

53:13

four years of college football at Oregon, Justin

53:15

Herbert had three head coaches, three

53:18

offensive coordinators, two

53:21

guys shared the job one season, and

53:23

two quarterback coaches. In

53:25

four years of pro football with the Chargers,

53:28

Herbert's had three head coaches, three

53:31

offensive coordinators, and

53:33

three quarterback coaches, which

53:35

all means that Herbert,

53:37

who will be 26 years old

53:40

in 2024, his ninth

53:42

season in college and pro

53:45

football, he's very likely

53:47

to have his seventh head

53:49

coach, his seventh

53:52

offensive coordinator, and

53:54

sixth quarterback coach. And

53:57

I just sort of shake my head and say,

54:00

You talk about, and again, it's

54:02

too strong to say, you're ruining

54:04

this poor guy. But

54:06

for somebody who was in the belly of

54:08

the beast, who had to

54:10

learn this very, very, a very,

54:13

very complex offense, I'm sure. Okay.

54:16

Imagine learning that seven

54:19

times in nine years. And

54:22

I just want to ask you what

54:25

you think when you hear that, what

54:28

you think for Justin Herbert. Well,

54:31

I don't think it's an accident when you look

54:33

at the quarterbacks and you look at the people

54:35

who stand on the podium at the end of

54:37

the year and the confetti is coming down and

54:39

they've won a championship. The

54:42

continuity at some

54:44

point has got to be a factor. And

54:47

whether it's the defensive side of the ball, the

54:49

way the Ravens did way back with Ray Lewis

54:51

and they had a lot of pieces that have

54:53

been around and knew each other, they knew the

54:56

intangibles, they knew the checks without even having to

54:58

say the checks. The same thing

55:00

could be said for, for what Tom Brady

55:02

has done or go back to John Elway,

55:04

I mean, you name a quarterback very

55:06

often it's because the system that

55:09

they understood almost

55:11

like they're taking a breath. That's how

55:13

quickly they understand where, what they do

55:15

with the football. And

55:17

Justin Herbert to me is overly talented. I can't

55:19

tell you how many games that I called in

55:21

his years and he was in Eugene. And

55:25

we always walk away from him, walking away

55:27

from a game from him, just talking about

55:29

his physical skillset. But another guy that I

55:31

probably would not have said when he was

55:33

done playing in Eugene, he's going

55:36

to go to the NFL and he's going

55:38

to take that, you know, that position by

55:40

storm and let people know how, how dominant

55:42

he can be. He was a good player,

55:45

but there was just something there that, that

55:47

you wondered, did he have it? Like

55:50

when I watched Tom Brady, I'm Brady.

55:53

Had it, you could see it at Michigan. You

55:56

may not say he could go win seven Super

55:58

Bowls, but there was just something that like drew.

56:00

breeze, games on the line. I want

56:03

him, I want him in charge. I

56:05

want him to find a way to win the game.

56:07

Like you just knew, may not do

56:09

it all the time, but I want him to

56:11

have the ball. Herbert in college, I never really

56:14

felt like that. He just kind of had a,

56:16

I don't want to say

56:18

lazy, fair attitude, but he just... A passive guy in

56:20

some ways, yeah. Yeah, just kind of like, you know,

56:22

if it's there, I'll find a way. And if it's

56:24

not, you know, we'll get him next time kind of

56:26

thing. And I don't mean to be critical of him.

56:29

It's just that was his personality. So I'm

56:31

wondering if he could do it in the NFL and early in

56:33

his career. Wow. He definitely showed

56:35

me and everybody that he had that.

56:38

But my concern for him, what you're describing

56:40

at some point, I just

56:42

had the charges at some point, you

56:44

have to realize that the

56:47

pieces around him are going to be

56:49

everything. You know, like you look at

56:51

Keenan Allen, he's like 31 or 32.

56:53

You know, and you look at Eclure,

56:55

you just, they've got some big decisions

56:58

to make, mainly who their coach is

57:00

going to be. What's the nucleus going

57:02

to look like around him so he can

57:04

grow? One thing I love Jacksonville, what they

57:06

did with Trevor Lawrence, once they realized we

57:09

got something that's unique at the quarterback position,

57:12

they went out and got guys like Christian Kirk

57:14

and Evan Ingram. And they decided, we're going to

57:16

load this while we have him, we're

57:19

going to load these positions around him and we're going

57:21

to shoot for the stars. They

57:23

got to do that with Herbert, you know. So they've

57:25

got to find a coordinator, you got to find a

57:28

head coach. And I know

57:30

you always want to find that, but can

57:32

you imagine what Herbert could do if he

57:34

had the same running back, the same four

57:37

receivers and the same system to grow for

57:39

the next four, five, six years? And

57:41

that's how you become exceptional. And then that's how

57:43

you become a threat every single year to be

57:46

a team that can make a run in the postseason. And

57:49

you know what you mentioned too in there

57:51

that I think is so vitally important. I

57:54

covered the Patriots in

57:57

Kansas City on Sunday in Foxborough.

58:00

And after the game,

58:02

I'm sitting there talking to Andy

58:04

Reed. And

58:07

we were talking about this play that

58:10

they scored on in a

58:12

scoreless game late in the first quarter. Matt

58:15

and Eggie brought it to Reed. They

58:18

called it Heisman. It's an old Columbia

58:21

Penn play with

58:23

all this different motion and everything. So

58:26

anyway, but it was a cool play. And

58:29

it was totally different. And

58:33

I've talked to Mahomes a lot over the years.

58:36

And he has told me one of the things I

58:38

love about playing for Andy Reed

58:41

is that if you bring an idea to

58:44

him and he thinks it can

58:46

work, he's going to not

58:48

only embrace it. He's going to use it at

58:50

a big point in a game. And

58:53

when you play the Patriots,

58:56

Andy Reed is like a fanboy when

58:58

he talks about Belichick. He really is.

59:01

And Andy Reed was, they

59:03

are not getting anything done on offense

59:06

and struggling a little bit. So hey,

59:08

let's call Heisman. That's what they called

59:10

the play. And they run

59:12

it and they score. And so I find

59:15

out later, Andy gave me

59:19

a couple of little breadcrumbs to look

59:22

into in his locker room and

59:24

to call a couple of people.

59:26

And I ended up texting with

59:28

Matt Nagy. And

59:30

Matt Nagy basically said, hey,

59:32

listen, the

59:34

center on this play was Joe Tuni.

59:38

And Joe Tuni, who had not played

59:40

any center in four

59:42

years or three years, one

59:45

of the reasons was Patrick Mahomes

59:47

said, hey, this guy's

59:49

going home. He played for New England for

59:51

five years. Let's

59:53

feature him. Let's give him a little

59:55

shine here. Let's do something. So

59:58

he practices snapping. Nagy

1:00:01

goes to Andy Reid and

1:00:03

says let's have let's have Tuni

1:00:06

snap the ball you know five years

1:00:08

with the Patriots and so Tuni's excited

1:00:10

about it and he made

1:00:12

a perfect snap they scored a touchdown

1:00:15

and nobody really knew it because it

1:00:17

just it just totally came out of

1:00:19

the blue but my point is my

1:00:21

point is Patrick

1:00:23

Mahomes has a

1:00:26

comfort level with his

1:00:28

coaches now Nagy's

1:00:30

his offensive coordinator and obviously before

1:00:32

it was Eric B enemy he

1:00:35

could say anything to those guys

1:00:38

at any time he can say

1:00:40

anything to Andy Reid at any

1:00:42

time and there is this comfort

1:00:44

level and that when

1:00:47

I was putting this note together

1:00:49

about Justin Herbert I just

1:00:51

kept thinking to myself he can't

1:00:53

have that just got to

1:00:55

know his new coaches 10 minutes ago

1:00:58

I mean telling more he just gets

1:01:00

to know this offseason and now Kellen

1:01:02

Moore is probably gonna get whacked you

1:01:04

know it's whoever the new coach is and

1:01:07

it's just I just keep thinking

1:01:09

of myself I hate to say it

1:01:11

because you know she's got a 261 million dollar

1:01:15

contract but to a guy like Justin Herbert as

1:01:17

you know and I know him a little bit

1:01:20

he could give a flying squirrel about

1:01:22

all this money you know he really

1:01:24

wants to be good at his job

1:01:26

and man it's been real

1:01:28

tough so I don't know I just figured

1:01:31

because you were there you were in these

1:01:33

shoes you would know what it's like to

1:01:36

have seven different offensive systems yeah

1:01:38

yeah and you know what honestly

1:01:40

I'm just be honest with you

1:01:42

that's what makes you who you are and

1:01:44

what you've created in your brand individually is

1:01:47

see I'm a football guy I

1:01:49

find what you just described to me fascinating

1:01:51

so like when I'm reading through your notes

1:01:53

I I love

1:01:55

because it takes it

1:01:58

takes an individual I'm

1:02:00

going to go back to Kansas City, behind

1:02:03

the curtain to a certain degree

1:02:06

about what makes Andy Reid Andy Reid because

1:02:08

it's not just, he's got great players, he's

1:02:10

calling great players. You

1:02:13

just touched on something about the culture

1:02:15

there and Matt Nagy could be,

1:02:17

it used to be Eric Bienemey, it could

1:02:19

be the receiver coach maybe looked at some

1:02:21

film on something from Anybody

1:02:25

can bring anything in and they

1:02:28

don't feel like there's no way Andy won't go there.

1:02:30

He won't care about it. He's just got a way

1:02:32

about him and he shared some of that with Al

1:02:34

and I when we had Kansas City because we were

1:02:36

all saying what do you have up your sleeve and

1:02:38

he started to talk a little bit about how he

1:02:41

lets guys bring stuff in and we kind of

1:02:43

mess around with it and if it works we end up

1:02:46

using it and I just thought wow, that's

1:02:48

pretty cool and the fact that he gets Joe excited

1:02:50

and Patrick's excited, they're all

1:02:52

bought into him going back

1:02:55

to New England. I just, I

1:02:57

think that's, I know you were

1:02:59

talking about Herbert, I just love that you were able

1:03:01

to tell those kind of stories because guys like you

1:03:04

and I get a chance to talk to these people

1:03:06

and get to hear it but I

1:03:08

think it's cool to be able to express

1:03:10

that and tell people that there's

1:03:12

more to Kansas City than just

1:03:14

having a great quarterback and

1:03:16

Andy Reid calling these great plays. It's

1:03:20

pretty fascinating when you can get

1:03:22

NFL players who make millions and tens

1:03:24

of millions of dollars, you

1:03:27

can still get them excited about one of

1:03:29

their teammates getting a snap of football on

1:03:32

a play called Heisman and they buy in.

1:03:34

You know, it's cool, I love that. You

1:03:36

know, the other thing, I'm walking out of

1:03:38

the stadium last night and I

1:03:40

just said to myself, man,

1:03:43

I don't get this great

1:03:45

feel about the Chiefs this year, I just

1:03:47

don't, you know, there are things, you

1:03:50

know, when you're really relying on

1:03:52

Caderius Tony, I'd be a little

1:03:54

bit worried but anyway, the reason

1:03:56

that I brought that up is I just

1:03:59

thought to Well, you

1:04:02

know, any other team right now is on the way

1:04:04

to being six and 11 or whatever with

1:04:07

all these issues. But you

1:04:10

got this great quarterback, you've

1:04:12

got a coach who really gets

1:04:15

people to feel like, hey, listen, it's

1:04:17

all of us. We all have

1:04:20

a hand in this. And

1:04:22

I just said, you know, if

1:04:25

anybody, if any team in the

1:04:27

NFL this year can come out

1:04:29

of this funk, I

1:04:31

think it's Kansas City. Do I think they will?

1:04:35

Probably not. But if they do,

1:04:37

I don't think anybody should be all that

1:04:39

surprised. I'm with you. The

1:04:42

fact that you have Patrick Mahomes and

1:04:44

these receivers, it's become an issue. But

1:04:46

you and I both know at any

1:04:49

moment, Kelsey can become Kelsey. Well, Mahomes

1:04:51

can become Mahomes. And they're

1:04:53

an upset or two away in the first

1:04:55

round of the playoffs. They're in the AFC

1:04:57

Championship on the road at Miami or Baltimore

1:04:59

or wherever they are. Been

1:05:01

there and done that. And just, I'm not

1:05:03

saying I'm with you. I'm not saying they're

1:05:05

going to do it. But if they did,

1:05:08

you'd sit there and say, only Andy

1:05:10

Reid and only Patrick Mahomes can do that.

1:05:12

Somebody with the Chiefs made this point

1:05:15

to me because I was asking about

1:05:17

the circus with Taylor Swift and all

1:05:19

that other stuff. And he goes, well, he

1:05:22

said, honestly, it's really not a bad thing

1:05:24

for us because there's

1:05:27

so many people who are now like at

1:05:29

the press conference yesterday with Andy Reid after

1:05:32

the game, there's a reporter

1:05:34

from I don't know where I'm

1:05:36

maybe people, maybe entertainment tonight who

1:05:39

said to Andy, what

1:05:41

is it like to have Taylor

1:05:43

Swift around your team and all

1:05:45

that? And you know, I

1:05:47

mean, Andy Reid is not the best one

1:05:50

to answer a question about Taylor Swift, but

1:05:52

he actually likes Taylor Swift. He

1:05:55

loves Kelsey. But anyway, I

1:05:57

don't know. It's sort of a fun time. dangerous

1:10:00

team, you know, and when Josh Allen is

1:10:02

playing in the way where he's unleashed, you

1:10:04

know, and he's not really turning the ball

1:10:06

over, he's playing clean football. These are the

1:10:08

types of things that you like to see

1:10:10

from him. This is the kind of potential

1:10:13

that I think we all know that he

1:10:15

has, even when they're just running the crap

1:10:17

out of the football. Josh Allen

1:10:19

still making good decisions, you know, he's still

1:10:21

making checks in the run game. And those

1:10:23

are the things you need from your quarterback.

1:10:25

So yeah, I also don't think that any

1:10:27

AFC team would want to see them in

1:10:29

January, but at the same time, as I

1:10:31

have been telling my buddy who's from Buffalo,

1:10:34

it's still an uphill climb. You know,

1:10:36

there are a lot of teams that they're apt

1:10:38

to jump and whether it's Miami in that division,

1:10:40

yeah, Miami could lose one of these next two

1:10:42

and make that week 18 game for

1:10:45

the division or Buffalo could trip up in

1:10:47

one of their next few games. I mean,

1:10:49

there's no guarantees there, but they

1:10:51

are playing great football right now. There's

1:10:53

no denying that. It's just kind of

1:10:56

a shame that their wall throughout the

1:10:58

year has put them in this position

1:11:00

where they could end up on the

1:11:02

outside looking in at the playoff picture.

1:11:06

I said to somebody

1:11:08

from Cincinnati over

1:11:11

the weekend after what I

1:11:13

thought was a really, really

1:11:15

impressive win for

1:11:17

the Bengals against Minnesota coming back from

1:11:19

down 17 to three, where

1:11:23

at that moment they're down 17 to three

1:11:26

and Brian Flores defense with

1:11:29

Minnesota has gone 29 series

1:11:33

in a row without allowing a

1:11:35

touchdown. What does Jake

1:11:37

Browning do? He goes touchdown, touchdown,

1:11:39

touchdown, and then they win

1:11:41

the game in overtime. Tremendous job, all

1:11:44

the respect in the world for

1:11:47

last week's podcast guest,

1:11:49

Jake Browning, and for

1:11:52

the coach of the Bengals and

1:11:54

the coaching staff, quite honestly, Zach

1:11:57

Taylor, Brian Callahan, quarterback coach, Dan

1:11:59

Pitcher, Doing a great job. But

1:12:01

my point that I was gonna make is every

1:12:05

week counts And

1:12:08

I just want you to just want to kind

1:12:11

of remind you a little

1:12:13

bit when Probably a month ago.

1:12:15

We were all saying well Bengals

1:12:17

are done you know, they

1:12:19

lost three in a row they lost Joe

1:12:22

burrow and all that and Now

1:12:25

obviously they've beaten three

1:12:27

strong playoff contenders Jacksonville,

1:12:29

Indianapolis and Minnesota and

1:12:33

to those who would say Bengals

1:12:36

are a fluky Playoff

1:12:38

contender right now. I'm not convinced. I

1:12:41

don't love them. I'm just gonna say

1:12:43

one thing Every

1:12:45

week counts and do you realize

1:12:47

do you remember? the

1:12:50

consecutive weeks About

1:12:52

five six weeks ago when

1:12:55

the Cincinnati Bengals went to

1:12:57

Santa Clara and beat the 49ers went

1:13:00

back home and beat the Buffalo

1:13:03

Bills on national TV

1:13:05

and I

1:13:07

realized Joe burrow is gone. But you know

1:13:09

what it is just

1:13:11

the lesson every

1:13:14

game counts You're

1:13:17

the Buffalo Bills and you say oh my god They're

1:13:19

one of the best teams in football.

1:13:22

They got to make it. Here's what I

1:13:24

would say to Buffalo Bills fans. Yes You

1:13:27

are one of the best teams in football but

1:13:30

You lost to the Jets You

1:13:34

lost to the Patriots you

1:13:38

handed handed a Primetime

1:13:42

game to the Denver Broncos.

1:13:44

Yep, so I don't want to

1:13:46

hear any whining at the end of the year If

1:13:49

you're a Buffalo Bills fan, yes, you're one

1:13:51

of the best teams in football right now

1:13:54

But your performance in a two or three

1:13:56

week period is not and should

1:13:59

not be What determines

1:14:01

it? This is not the college football

1:14:03

playoffs where you have

1:14:05

people voting for who the best

1:14:07

teams are. You know this in

1:14:10

the NFL Florida State would be

1:14:12

in the playoffs Miles Simmons. So

1:14:14

I just wanted to get all that out of

1:14:16

the way. So three

1:14:18

other quick things. I'm

1:14:23

tired of the Dallas Cowboys. Just

1:14:26

really tired of the Dallas

1:14:28

Cowboys. And I thought

1:14:30

a week ago probably like everyone that

1:14:33

that was a statement win for

1:14:35

the Cowboys over the Philadelphia Eagles. And

1:14:38

I thought okay they're

1:14:40

gonna win they're gonna be really competitive down

1:14:42

the stretch. They'll win one of these two

1:14:45

road games at Buffalo at Miami and

1:14:47

they'll be in good shape because

1:14:50

then you know their schedule

1:14:52

evens out a bit. Detroit at

1:14:54

home where they play really well

1:14:57

and then they play Washington to end

1:14:59

the season. So I

1:15:01

just thought to myself okay Cowboys

1:15:03

are gonna be on the right path.

1:15:07

Well then you

1:15:09

watch the Dallas Cowboys and

1:15:12

in a game in Buffalo with

1:15:14

their whole season on the line the first 50

1:15:16

minutes of this game. I'm

1:15:19

gonna tell you about the Dallas Cowboys.

1:15:21

In a game they absolutely unequivocally

1:15:24

had to have. They

1:15:27

go punt punt field goal,

1:15:30

punt punt punt interception.

1:15:33

Down 31 to 3 ballgame

1:15:36

over, slink back to

1:15:38

the team plane, go

1:15:40

home and feel about

1:15:42

as dejected as you had to feel

1:15:45

slinking back home after

1:15:47

the game against San Francisco in week

1:15:49

five where you lose by 32. This loss was

1:15:52

just as bad and

1:15:55

perhaps even more important. I

1:15:58

think it's a worse loss frankly. Peter

1:16:00

because at some point over the

1:16:03

last few weeks, I can't remember quite what

1:16:05

it when it was that Prescott had said

1:16:07

That that loss to San Francisco that they

1:16:10

had You know It was one of those

1:16:12

games where you got the wake-up call and

1:16:14

you felt like you never wanted to get

1:16:16

that feeling Again over the course of the

1:16:19

season and look what they do. They go

1:16:21

to Buffalo. It's December football All right, you're

1:16:23

gonna have to win at some point on

1:16:25

the road You know it and you have

1:16:28

an opportunity to solidify

1:16:30

yourself as one of the top teams in

1:16:32

football going against one of the hottest Teams

1:16:34

in football and they just were not ready

1:16:36

for the moment You know, I don't understand

1:16:38

why you have such a discrepancy in the

1:16:41

way that the Cowboys play on home at

1:16:43

home versus when they're On the road, but

1:16:45

that's something that they needed to solve weeks

1:16:47

ago And now they've got to solve it

1:16:49

immediately because if they can't play on the

1:16:51

road Then they're gonna have a really big

1:16:53

problem trying to make things happen in the

1:16:56

postseason It's just the way it's gonna be

1:16:58

they ain't gonna win home field advantage So

1:17:00

at some point you're either gonna have to go

1:17:02

to Philadelphia You're gonna have to go to Santa

1:17:04

Clara again And I don't know

1:17:06

how they're gonna react to that because

1:17:08

of the way they played against Buffalo

1:17:10

And this is a huge matchup now

1:17:13

with Miami on the road, right? Are

1:17:15

you gonna be able to cover Tyreek Hill if

1:17:17

he's back or just Jalen Waddle? I don't know

1:17:20

I mean, how are you going to be able

1:17:22

to stop that run game? You couldn't stop a

1:17:24

team that's really not run the ball well historically,

1:17:27

you know with Josh Allen Yeah, I know he's the

1:17:29

battering ram, but you got cook and you let him

1:17:31

go for as many as he went for How are

1:17:33

you going to react to that? I'm really

1:17:35

interested to see how the Cowboys react here because

1:17:38

This is a team that we know is

1:17:40

actually good, right? That Prescott

1:17:42

has played great football at

1:17:45

home So how do you

1:17:47

then take that on the road? How do

1:17:49

you react these last three games? How do

1:17:51

you improve yourself and actually make sure that

1:17:53

something like that debacle in Buffalo doesn't happen

1:17:55

again? They've got to be able to do

1:17:57

it. I mean otherwise it's Like,

1:18:00

you know, you're saying in our text, you got

1:18:02

to use the restroom or just get off

1:18:04

the pot. Because at this point,

1:18:06

you are able to do it or

1:18:08

you're not. I'm sorry. Like, I

1:18:11

think that the Cowboys should be better than they are.

1:18:13

And there's no excuse at this point. Miles

1:18:18

Simmons, as of this moment

1:18:20

today, I'm totally

1:18:22

befuddled about the MVP. I

1:18:25

truly don't know who I would vote for right

1:18:28

now. And that's why I love this is an

1:18:30

18 week award, not a 15 week

1:18:32

award. So let's leave the

1:18:34

MVP discussion for down the road a bit.

1:18:37

But to me, I've started to get some

1:18:39

clarity about Coach of the Year. I'll

1:18:42

give you my top three right now. Number

1:18:44

one, Kevin Stavansky Cleveland. Number

1:18:47

two, D'Amico Ryan Houston. Number

1:18:49

three, Dan Campbell, Detroit. And

1:18:51

look, there's 10 other guys

1:18:54

who deserve some credit, deserve praise.

1:18:58

But right now, Kevin Stavansky with,

1:19:01

by the way, his

1:19:03

lookalike, Joe Flacco. I

1:19:05

mean, if they sit in a

1:19:07

team meeting, I have a question. They sit next

1:19:09

to each other. You walk

1:19:12

in there. How do you know which one is the

1:19:14

coach and which one is the starting quarterback? To

1:19:17

me, the facial hair just totally

1:19:20

makes it impossible because the facial

1:19:22

hair is exactly the same. But

1:19:26

I just really applaud Stavansky's won

1:19:28

this year with four different starting

1:19:30

quarterbacks, four different winning

1:19:33

starting quarterbacks. They're nine and

1:19:35

five with an incredible amount

1:19:38

of anxiety and difficulties. And

1:19:40

look, Miles, as

1:19:43

of now, you and

1:19:45

I still don't know if 40% into

1:19:48

the contractual term of

1:19:53

Deshaun Watson, whether the

1:19:55

Cleveland Browns actually have their quarterback in

1:19:57

the future when they step on the

1:19:59

field. field for opening day of training

1:20:01

camp 2024. I have

1:20:03

no idea if he's done

1:20:06

enough to assuage any of the

1:20:08

doubters or whatever. I

1:20:10

still think there's an open question about it,

1:20:12

but that's a question for

1:20:14

another day. Right now, to me, if

1:20:17

you're a Cleveland Browns fan, you got

1:20:19

to be really, really happy with what

1:20:21

your team has shown under

1:20:23

this coach who just doesn't

1:20:25

let anything really bug him. Yeah.

1:20:28

It's been unbelievable what Kevin Safanski has

1:20:30

been able to do. I was talking

1:20:32

to my mom who's still in Cleveland

1:20:34

and she likened him to MacGyver with

1:20:36

the way that he was able to

1:20:39

get through that game against the Chicago

1:20:41

Bears. Because look, I mean, they were

1:20:43

playing without four or five starting offensive

1:20:45

linemen. You have an incredible amount

1:20:47

of the salary cap that is tied up in

1:20:49

some of these players that are on injured reserve.

1:20:52

And you've got Joe Flacco throwing absolute

1:20:54

dimes in the fourth quarter to guys

1:20:56

like Amari Cooper and Marquis Goodwin. I

1:20:59

mean, it was kind of ridiculous what

1:21:01

Joe Flacco was able to do in

1:21:03

that final period of that game against

1:21:06

the Bears to win it. So yeah,

1:21:08

you know, it's the first time that

1:21:10

a coach for the Cleveland Browns has

1:21:12

had multiple winning seasons since Marty Schottenheimer

1:21:15

in the eighties. That's before I was

1:21:17

even born. So that

1:21:19

tells you the kind of job Kevin Safanski

1:21:21

has done for that franchise. You know, going

1:21:23

into this year, you talk about the Deshaun Watson

1:21:25

contract, it was kind of an open question, right?

1:21:28

If this thing doesn't start taking off, well,

1:21:30

is Kevin Safanski going to be the coach

1:21:32

of the Cleveland Browns going forward because you're

1:21:35

not really going to get rid of Deshaun

1:21:37

Watson. But I think right now we know

1:21:39

that Kevin Safanski should be the head coach

1:21:41

of the Cleveland Browns going forward because of

1:21:44

what he has done and what he's been

1:21:46

able to do with that team as a

1:21:48

whole. Just keeping them competitive and having them

1:21:50

in position, not just to compete for a

1:21:53

playoff spot, but potentially of Baltimore slips, they

1:21:55

could be competing for that division title in

1:21:57

the last couple of weeks. You

1:22:02

know, I want to end

1:22:05

with, and again, there's a lot of

1:22:07

things we could talk about this

1:22:09

week. I mean, an amazing matchup coming

1:22:11

up with San

1:22:14

Francisco hosting Baltimore on

1:22:16

Christmas night. But

1:22:19

I wanted to leave you,

1:22:21

Miles, with one thought after

1:22:26

covering Kansas City at

1:22:28

New England, just about one

1:22:31

of the reasons why even

1:22:33

though Kansas City looks incredibly

1:22:35

flawed right now, their

1:22:38

receivers, Patrick Mahomes' receivers,

1:22:42

have dropped seven more

1:22:44

balls than

1:22:46

any other quarterback has been victimized

1:22:49

by his receiver group this year. And

1:22:54

so there's a lot of reasons to

1:22:56

not like Kansas City.

1:22:58

But one of the

1:23:00

things that I walk away from

1:23:03

there really thinking is not only

1:23:05

that, hey, never doubt Patrick Mahomes,

1:23:07

obviously, but the

1:23:10

way they actually won this game, they

1:23:13

won this game when they were really

1:23:15

scratching and clawing and struggling a

1:23:17

little bit late in the first quarter.

1:23:20

Scoreless game. And

1:23:22

Andy Reid calls a play that

1:23:24

Matt Negi, the offensive coordinator, had

1:23:26

brought to him from

1:23:29

the 1940s. It's

1:23:31

a total misdirection, weird play.

1:23:34

When you look at even the way

1:23:36

that the players were lined up, if

1:23:38

you look at Patrick Mahomes in a

1:23:40

three-point stance, quite literally, for the first

1:23:42

time since he ran the 40 at

1:23:45

the scouting combine. But

1:23:48

if you look at the kind

1:23:50

of three-point stance, it's an ancient

1:23:52

NFL three-point stance. The

1:23:55

players on this team basically

1:23:57

imitated a play from a

1:23:59

Penn Columbiade. game back

1:24:01

in the World War II era

1:24:03

of football, basically 80 years

1:24:05

ago. And the only reason

1:24:07

I bring this up is

1:24:10

that the Kansas

1:24:12

City Chiefs are

1:24:14

a smart, imaginative

1:24:17

team and the players

1:24:20

on that team love

1:24:22

the imagination, the

1:24:25

fact that even when we're

1:24:27

struggling, we can pull something

1:24:29

out that will totally confound

1:24:32

the great Belichick. And

1:24:35

I'm going to say this right now, I think

1:24:37

that is a great defense in New

1:24:40

England. That is a hard to

1:24:42

figure defense. And

1:24:45

so the

1:24:47

Kansas City Chiefs did something

1:24:50

with basically their season on the

1:24:52

line and imagination

1:24:54

won that game. And

1:24:57

I just really think that it says

1:24:59

a lot about the state of this

1:25:01

team, the state of

1:25:03

this quarterback, the state of this coaching staff,

1:25:06

just a lot to like. And look, I'm

1:25:09

not blind to the problems. They

1:25:11

have big problems. But

1:25:14

they pulled out a bizarro

1:25:17

play with Mahomes

1:25:19

and Jarek McKinnon doing

1:25:22

crazy misdirection stuff

1:25:25

and McKinnon, an option quarterback in

1:25:27

college, throwing a touchdown

1:25:29

pass, just a touchdown toss to

1:25:32

basically start them on

1:25:35

this win that they had to have. Miles,

1:25:37

I just wanted to throw

1:25:39

out that observation that I

1:25:42

don't know what's going to happen to Kansas City, but

1:25:45

if they lose, it's not because

1:25:47

they're not trying to pull everything

1:25:49

out to try

1:25:51

to do everything humanly possible to win

1:25:54

games. Absolutely. And

1:25:56

look, when you've got a quarterback like

1:25:58

Patrick Mahomes, anything is possible. You know,

1:26:00

once you get to the postseason, and a

1:26:02

guy with that kind of experience, and that

1:26:04

kind of skill, it's

1:26:07

hard to bet against Patrick Mahalman, but

1:26:09

the thing that has been his letdown,

1:26:12

as you mentioned, is the unreliable receiving

1:26:14

core that he has. And so I

1:26:16

think that there's got to be some

1:26:18

level of frustration with that, and I

1:26:20

think that that's very understandable. But when

1:26:22

you look at Kansas City, they

1:26:25

don't have the toughest schedule going

1:26:27

down the stretch, which is good.

1:26:30

They will have to play the Bengals,

1:26:32

and we've seen Jake Browning pull out

1:26:34

victories, so that's not something that you

1:26:36

can completely discount. But

1:26:38

I do think that once they get to

1:26:40

the postseason, and I think we all anticipate

1:26:42

them winning the vision, that they're

1:26:45

going to be dangerous because they have Patrick

1:26:47

Mahalman. But I'll throw it back to you

1:26:49

with this, Peter. What would you do with

1:26:51

Caderias, Tony? Well,

1:26:55

I asked Andy Reid about that. I said,

1:26:57

how can you continue to stick with him? And

1:27:00

he said, he's a young guy with great talent. Miles,

1:27:03

in an average year, I

1:27:07

think Caderias, Tony, for at least

1:27:10

a week or two, would

1:27:12

be deactivated by Andy Reid. But

1:27:16

you tell me, you

1:27:19

tell me, what other

1:27:22

receiver on this team can

1:27:25

stretch the field and sort of

1:27:27

put the fear in defenses? There

1:27:29

really isn't one. This is

1:27:31

a 4-3-9-40 guy, and

1:27:36

right now, today, with

1:27:39

a bunch of other mediocre weapons

1:27:41

at wide receiver, this is still

1:27:43

a guy who, if

1:27:47

he can simply stop

1:27:50

making these big errors, could

1:27:52

be a really vital piece. I

1:27:54

get it. I have had

1:27:56

enough of Caderias, Tony. I would

1:27:59

try to win. Dea Pacheco probably comes

1:28:01

back this week for the last

1:28:03

three weeks of this year. I just try

1:28:05

to run the crap out of the ball. That's

1:28:07

what I would do. But Andy

1:28:10

Reid understands that at some point you're

1:28:12

going to need deep speed. He's

1:28:15

the only guy they got. So

1:28:17

I think that is what they're going to

1:28:19

do. As for what I would do, he'd

1:28:22

be deactivated this week at the very

1:28:24

least. Yeah. I mean, that's

1:28:26

what I would do too. I think

1:28:28

at a certain point you're too unreliable

1:28:31

to be out there. If

1:28:33

Mahomes can't trust you to catch the ball and

1:28:35

he can't even trust you to line up in

1:28:37

the right spot, I mean, at a certain

1:28:39

point, what are we doing? I mean, they've

1:28:42

got guys in Richie James and Watson's

1:28:44

made a couple plays. He's also not the

1:28:46

most reliable. Justin Ross

1:28:48

may be coming back, may not be. We'll

1:28:50

see what they can do with Nicole Hardman

1:28:53

at some point. But it's

1:28:55

just, and Skymore goes to IR now with

1:28:57

knee swelling. So it's tough. You

1:28:59

don't have that many options. I wonder

1:29:01

if with Pacheco coming back, if Clyde

1:29:03

Edwards-Dolaire maybe starts becoming more like a

1:29:05

Christian McCaffrey and he plays in the

1:29:07

slot. Because, hey, he made a darn

1:29:09

good leap and catch in the end

1:29:12

zone. And so, hey, if you've got

1:29:14

hands, somebody's got to be out there.

1:29:16

I totally agree. There

1:29:18

was some talk about that after the

1:29:20

game that they're going to need to

1:29:22

get, even if Pacheco comes back, they're

1:29:24

going to need to keep Clyde

1:29:27

Edwards-Dolaire on the field because right now he's

1:29:29

one of their best playmakers. So

1:29:31

anyway, we shall see. Miles Simmons, thanks

1:29:33

a lot for the conversation this week.

1:29:35

We had some fun. We solved a

1:29:37

lot of the world's problems and

1:29:40

I'm much appreciative of

1:29:43

your help all the time. I

1:29:45

want to wish you a Merry Cleveland Christmas. I

1:29:48

will be having a Merry Christmas

1:29:50

in Berkeley, California, taking the weekend

1:29:52

off from writing this column for

1:29:55

the first time in 26 years. So

1:30:01

anyway, it's going to be interesting. I wonder

1:30:04

if I'll get pangs of withdrawal. I don't

1:30:06

know, but we will see you right back

1:30:08

here for the podcast again next week. Enjoy

1:30:12

Christmas and everybody out there,

1:30:14

please enjoy your holidays. Watch

1:30:17

some football, have some fun. R

1:30:19

E L A X. Relax.

1:30:23

Enjoy your family. Thanks a

1:30:25

lot for joining us on the Peter King.

1:30:34

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