0:00

I just got a very wonderful shipment

0:02

of goodies from the folks at Reese's.

0:04

And let me tell you something, these

0:07

people remain the absolute worldwide leaders in

0:09

bringing together chocolate and peanut butter. Of

0:11

course we know that peanut butter cups

0:13

remain transcendent, but have you tried the

0:15

Reese's sticks? They're wafers with peanut butter

0:17

in between each wafer, all coated in

0:19

chocolate. I mean, the combination of sweet

0:21

chocolate and salty peanut butter just brings

0:24

people joy and the folks at Reese's

0:26

do it better than anyone. So

0:28

shop Reese's peanut butter cups now at a

0:30

store near you, found wherever candy is sold.

0:36

I feel like in my heart

0:38

of hearts I really am a

0:40

very old Italian grandmother. This

0:42

is Katie Laird, one of the recipe developers

0:45

who I collaborated with on my cookbook, Anything's

0:47

Possible. Katie's lived and cooked professionally

0:49

in Italy, which is why we nicknamed

0:51

her Supernona. And you know,

0:53

it's a little bit ironic because I'm, I

0:55

mean, I'm 40, I have little kids. So

0:58

I'm really not a grandmother at all. And

1:00

I'm Estonian. I have no

1:03

Italian blood in me. I

1:06

did use a sperm donor for

1:08

my children, TMI, but, you know,

1:10

like when- This is the moment for TMI. This

1:12

is the moment. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you guys all care.

1:17

When I used a sperm donor, you know, you

1:20

get what you pay for. And I was like, if I

1:22

can pay for my kids to be a little Italian, I

1:25

will. Yeah. You know, height

1:27

I can sacrifice, but- Right. Make

1:29

them a little Italian. So. Ha ha

1:31

ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Ha

1:33

ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha

1:35

ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Ha

1:37

ha ha ha ha ha. This is the sparkful.

1:40

It's not for foodies, it's for eaters.

1:43

I'm Lindy West. I'm Kehlani Palmosano.

1:45

I'm Ann Kim. I'm Kim Sieverson.

1:47

I'm Joanne Lee Molinaro. Each

1:49

week on this show, we obsess

1:51

about food to learn more about

1:54

people. And tonight we're coming to

1:56

you live from Chow Now in Los

1:58

Angeles. From Gramercy Theater in

2:00

New York. York City from

2:02

Swedish American Hall in San

2:04

Francisco from everybody's coffee in

2:06

Chicago from WBUR City Space

2:08

in Boston this

2:24

week we're bringing you the second half of

2:26

our best of the book tour series six

2:28

weeks ten live sporkful tapings in ten cities

2:30

all in celebration or the release of my

2:33

first cookbook anything's possible last week we brought

2:35

you some highlights from my conversations with hosts

2:37

across the tour this week we're answering your

2:39

questions you see every show had an audience

2:41

Q&A so we're going to share my answers

2:43

to the most frequently asked questions and to

2:45

some that I never saw coming we'll

2:48

also get into some behind-the-scenes stories from the making of

2:50

the book and we'll have time for plenty of hot

2:52

takes from me and a bunch of other folks but

2:55

let's start with the real stars if anything's possible

2:58

my family because as I travel the country for

3:00

these shows a lot of you wanted to hear

3:02

more about them starting with this

3:04

question from an audience member in Atlanta you

3:07

mentioned that your wife thought this was a terrible

3:09

idea how often and under

3:12

what circumstances do you bring that

3:14

up in your relationship no she's

3:17

still skeptical of me that's the

3:19

weird thing um I

3:21

should say as much as she is very skeptical of

3:23

my ideas she was skeptical this work for when it

3:26

launched she's like you know she was kept a little

3:28

Casa telly she was skeptical of the cookbook but

3:30

when it comes out she's my number one booster like

3:32

I'm kind of bash like I'm not gonna

3:34

walk into a party and be like hey I invented a

3:37

pasta shape but she will she'll be like I remember

3:39

my husband he invented a pasta shape let me tell you all about

3:41

her here's a picture and I'm like so

3:43

so I went

3:45

to the fancy food show at the Javits Center

3:47

in New York City and it's like all these

3:50

brands and whatever big thing and so it's Foligny

3:52

who make the original version my pasta they have

3:54

a booth and Janie my wife loves tabling

3:56

put her at a table in any kind

3:58

of conference any kind of gathering and she

4:00

just, she just, she'll pull people in. So

4:02

she came, she was very excited to come

4:04

to the Fancy Food Show and work at

4:06

the Svalini booth. And I

4:09

recorded audio of her hocking

4:11

Cascatelli and I recorded it

4:13

and put it in this, in an update,

4:15

Cascatelli update episode of the Sporkfall. I

4:18

hope that everybody someday has the

4:20

opportunity to not only prove

4:23

your spouse wrong, but also get them admitting

4:25

that they were wrong on tape. Nice. Cause

4:27

it's a great feeling. Nice, thank you. One

4:30

person in San Francisco had a question about

4:32

my kids. Hi Dan, this question is about

4:34

your girls. Do they like to

4:36

help you in the kitchen and are they

4:39

actually helpful? Thank

4:41

you for recognizing that those are two different questions.

4:47

Yes, they like to help me some of the time.

4:49

I try not to like pressure them to do it cause I want them

4:51

to enjoy it. My older daughter will be,

4:53

she has a couple of friends who are very into cooking

4:56

and she'd be like, Daniella roasts a whole chicken for her

4:58

family. I want to roast a chicken. Will you show me

5:00

how to roast a chicken? I'm like, yeah, sure. But then

5:02

when the time comes and I'm like, I'm about to roast

5:04

a chicken, come in the kitchen, it's your chance. She's like,

5:07

no, I'm busy. Are

5:10

they actually helpful? Like

5:14

in the sense of like, would it go faster

5:16

and easier without them there? And

5:19

if that's the definition of helpful, then no, they're

5:21

not helpful. But

5:24

I still always invite them to cook with me when

5:27

they're around. I still enjoy it, even though I know that they're

5:29

not actually making the process any easier. Because

5:32

it's fun and hopefully they'll look back on it

5:35

with happy memories and learn something along the way

5:37

and get into cooking. My older daughter

5:39

has started to ask like, how

5:42

will I know how to do this when I go to college? I

5:44

mean, she's 13, she's got time. She'll be like, can I bring the

5:46

cookbook with me to college because I want to be able to cook

5:48

these dishes when you're not there to cook them for me. But

5:51

it's kind of good, I don't want to learn too much because then you

5:53

don't have to call me. Now,

6:00

if there's one thing any sporkful live show

6:02

is likely to include, it's strong opinions and

6:04

healthy debate. Throughout the tour, people

6:06

wanted to hear my thoughts on a range

6:08

of foods. In Boston, after I complained about

6:10

how hard it is to get a good

6:12

bite of spaghetti on your fork, Dan Souza,

6:14

editor-in-chief of Cook's Illustrated magazine, asked this. Why

6:18

is easy so important to you

6:20

in food? Well, no, I...

6:23

well... Well... I

6:26

don't love foods that require... like, I don't

6:28

want my pistachios in a shell. You

6:31

know, like I... But why not? Why not? Let's

6:33

dig into that. It's just... it's

6:37

just annoying. It's an annoying process. Like, I want

6:39

to eat a mouthful of pistachios

6:41

all at once. You know, look, maybe someday

6:43

I'll have like all this leisure time in

6:45

my life and I just sit and just

6:47

crack it open with pistachios. But

6:49

to me, like... Like that's like

6:51

a retirement plan? Yes. Yeah, yeah. Then

6:55

later in that show, we open up the floor for questions

6:58

from the audience. Hi. I'm

7:00

Linda and I just want to say that your

7:02

dad has spent many hours shelling

7:04

pistachios. This is my mom, everyone. Oh! So

7:11

dad's... dad's shells protect pistachios? Just like if he

7:13

eats a whole lobster, he takes it all out

7:15

of the shell before he starts... Right. He

7:17

also unwraps gifts, like, without tearing the wrapping

7:19

paper. But I just

7:21

want you to know your future. Yeah. Well,

7:24

but do you do that? No.

7:28

Right. No. I shell and eat. But

7:31

do you, like, enjoy shelling pistachios? Yes, I

7:33

do. Have you always? It's very therapeutic.

7:36

Okay. I do. I find it... same thing with

7:38

eating a whole artichoke. Yeah. Oh.

7:41

I'm with you. Your name is... you're Linda, right? Yes, I am.

7:43

Yeah, Linda. I think you and I are on the same page.

7:46

Can I ask, did something happen with Dan as

7:48

a young... This

7:50

is, like, a perfect opportunity here. Being like I dropped him

7:53

on his head? No. Yeah.

7:55

Or like you dropped him and he landed on

7:57

spaghetti and, like, got really upset at the spaghetti.

8:00

Oh no, we have to talk about this after. Okay.

8:03

I'll book some one-on-one time. Okay. That

8:06

really was more of a comment than a question,

8:08

but thanks, Mom. I

8:13

got another question about my food preferences in

8:15

Seattle, where I was on stage with author,

8:17

podcaster, and TV writer, Lindy West. Hi

8:20

there. Hi. My name's Sam. Hey, Sam.

8:23

A question for both of you, I guess. What

8:27

is a food that you are embarrassed

8:30

to admit that you don't like? Don't

8:34

like? Don't like. Don't

8:37

like. That's tough. I mean, I'm kind of

8:39

picky about where I like nuts. I love nuts

8:41

in certain things and in more things than I used to,

8:44

but still don't love them in all things. I

8:46

struggle sometimes with the texture of okra. The

8:49

thing that is an absolute staple

8:52

ingredient that I hate is freaking

8:54

parsley. I hate the taste of

8:56

parsley. It is so

8:58

distracting to me. It's the strongest flavor. It

9:01

rips me out of any food that I'm

9:03

eating. And all I can taste

9:05

is this parsley. And I do not understand why

9:07

all y'all are gaga and act like this is

9:09

just like a nice little thing. If

9:11

there is one flake of parsley, I'm like, this

9:13

is parsley. I'm eating a bowl of

9:16

parsley. Yeah,

9:18

that's a good answer. I've warmed up to

9:20

parsley, but what I wrote for the book is if it's going

9:22

to be in the recipe, then it will

9:24

either be optional or there's going to be a lot of it.

9:26

Because what I hate is when you go, a recipe tells you

9:28

that you're going to go buy a head of parsley and

9:31

you put, you know, one tablespoon of chopped parsley

9:33

into the recipe and you put the rest of

9:35

the head of the parsley into your fridge and

9:37

you're just like, you're going to be dead soon.

9:41

I'll see, I'll throw you out in a week. You

9:44

know, like you just know what a waste it was. In

9:47

Washington, D.C., I was on stage with cookbook author

9:49

and TV host Patty Hinnich. And

9:51

when the Q&A came, I felt like I found a

9:53

kindred spirit when I got this question from one audience

9:55

member. come

10:01

from Maryland. Um,

10:04

I... One

10:07

night, I had an argument at

10:09

dinner with my sister about

10:12

what defines a condiment,

10:15

a sauce, and a dip, and

10:17

how they're different, and what different

10:19

categories. Or exactly. Thank

10:21

you. applause You

10:26

need to have him on your show. And you want me to

10:28

tell you that you're right, Nathan, is that? laughter

10:33

This is actually an issue that I've thought deeply about.

10:37

laughter So you've come to the right place. I

10:39

don't know, though, that I'm going to have the answer that you want. Because

10:42

I believe that the difference is not

10:44

in the food stuff, but in how

10:46

it's used. So

10:49

the exact same food can

10:51

be a spread, or a dip, or a

10:53

condiment, or an ingredient. I mean, look at cream cheese.

10:55

Cream cheese can be a spread. It can also be

10:57

an ingredient in a cheesecake. And

11:00

it can also be an ingredient in a dip.

11:02

So then it's a dip. So to me, it's

11:04

not about the food, it's about how it's used.

11:07

Can I just say you just taught him a lesson about

11:10

how to debate? laughter

11:13

Yeah, I do think. I

11:16

actually agree with that. Go on, yes. I actually

11:18

agree with that. My

11:22

sister was saying, what

11:24

defines a sauce is that it's

11:26

a condiment, I think.

11:29

I think she was saying, all sauces

11:32

are condiments. And I was like, that

11:34

just does not make sense. laughter Is

11:38

your sister here tonight, Nathan? No.

11:40

Okay. Well, then let's

11:42

just, among us, let's just agree that

11:44

you're right. laughter Okay, alright. applause music

11:52

Coming up after the break, I answer what was probably the single most

11:54

asked question on the tour. What's a

11:56

dish that didn't make the final cut for the

11:58

book? And a listener and it

12:00

gives me a very backhanded compliment. Stick

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years back, my friend Justin Warner from Food Network moved

14:21

out to South Dakota. He opened a ramen joint and

14:24

he is always posting pictures of all the great food

14:26

he's not only cooking, but eating all over South Dakota.

14:28

He's always telling me to come visit. And you know,

14:30

one of the best ways to experience a new place

14:32

is to eat your way through it. But it's equally

14:34

important to live your way through it too. And when

14:37

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14:39

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14:43

a hunger to do it all over again. See

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why there's so much South Dakota, so

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little time at travelsouthdakota.com. This

14:51

episode is brought to you by Merrick Petcare. We

14:54

have a dog, her name is Sasha. She's almost

14:56

four, she's a standard poodle. She's black and fluffy

14:58

and soft and very adorable. And

15:00

when we first got her, we took her to like

15:02

this puppy kindergarten training class. The whole family went and

15:04

you know, they're teaching how to use the treats and

15:06

all this. The trainer watched Sasha for a bit and

15:09

said, hmm, she's very food

15:11

motivated. And my daughter Emily

15:13

turned to me and said, she's a pashman.

15:15

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15:18

so she is food motivated and that's why we

15:20

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15:36

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ingredients shown on the bag and inside it. Welcome

15:57

back to The Sporkful. I'm Dan Pashman and hey,

15:59

if you're enjoying... listening to these live shows.

16:01

We got more events in the works. Later

16:03

this month, we have a live Sporkful taping

16:05

in Napa. Then this summer, I'll be doing

16:08

a book talk in Martha's Vineyard. And in

16:10

September, get this, we're going international. I'll be

16:12

doing a live Sporkful taping at the London

16:14

Podcast Festival where my guests will be comedian

16:17

Ed Gamble, co-host of the podcast off menu.

16:19

Details and links for all these are at

16:21

sporkful.com/events. And make sure you follow me on

16:23

Instagram. That way, you'll always know about some

16:25

new events we may be announcing soon. Follow

16:28

me there at the Sporkful. One

16:30

more quick note to please stay tuned to the

16:32

end of this episode for a special segment from

16:34

our sponsor Norwegian Cruise Line. Quick

16:37

warning that there are some curse words coming up. All

16:40

right, let's get back to it. Now, there was

16:42

one question that we didn't cover in our series about the

16:44

making of anything's possible. And it came up at a bunch

16:46

of shows. Here's audience member Jordan

16:48

in Washington, DC. So

16:51

many of the things in that cookbook were so

16:54

interesting. What got left on the cutting

16:56

room floor? Like what's the most interesting recipe that you

16:58

didn't include in the book? So

17:00

I love the Korean dish bosam. It's like

17:02

a pork belly and with the sauce

17:05

and the wrap it in a lettuce or a perilla

17:07

leaf. And it's crunchy and kimchi in there. It's just

17:09

like so many flavors. It's one of my very favorite

17:11

things. I was at a Korean restaurant.

17:13

I was eating bosam and just really

17:16

enjoying myself. So I texted James

17:18

Park, one of my recipe developers who's Korean American. And I

17:20

was like, James, do you think we

17:22

could turn bosam into a pasta dish? Not

17:25

it won't be bosam, but like inspired by like

17:27

bringing together some of the same flavors and

17:30

ingredients. And he was like, we can try. At our

17:33

New York show, James Park actually joined

17:35

me on stage himself. He explained what

17:37

happened next. I tried to incorporate all

17:39

the different elements that you get from

17:41

bosam. So like that, pork

17:43

belly, and he really loves hyuja,

17:46

which is the fermented shrimp paste.

17:48

And it's really, really funky and

17:50

salty. And we were actually

17:53

testing it together and added a

17:55

little bit of this, added a little bit of

17:58

that, and like maybe try to present pork belly.

18:00

belly on top and it was good

18:02

but it was just one of those like was

18:05

it all worth the effort for

18:07

having this dish so we

18:10

kind of tweaked and we just really

18:12

stem down to the flavor that we

18:14

enjoy from that meal which was samjang

18:17

that is the soybean like Korean

18:19

barbecue dipping sauce so we started

18:22

as like this one idea that

18:24

we really loved and wanted it

18:26

to happen but

18:29

it just didn't happen but it was a happy

18:31

accident for the really delicious recipe that ended up

18:33

becoming something else right that's the it's a samjang

18:35

aliolio yeah it was sort of like we took

18:37

what was sort of the base of the balsam

18:40

and then we just like stopped there and didn't

18:42

do all the other stuff yeah yeah just make

18:44

it easy while many of you wanted to hear

18:46

about a specific dish that didn't make the book

18:49

a listener and Philly identified

18:51

a whole category of pasta that she

18:53

thought was missing hi big

18:55

fan been listening to this work for years I

18:58

was curious if you considered

19:01

in exploring all the different things you

19:03

could do with pasta if you

19:05

thought about doing dessert pasta there's

19:08

one style of pasta dish that my wife

19:10

Jamie was pushing me to include in the

19:12

book which is sort of a central Eastern

19:14

European they do a lot of pasta

19:16

dishes that maybe have like sugar

19:19

and cinnamon and like crushed nuts maybe

19:21

cottage cheese and there

19:23

are some versions of things there are things with nuts

19:26

and cinnamon sugar in Italian cookbooks also I

19:28

just couldn't quite get it to work to my yeah

19:30

I wanted to be different and I couldn't quite figure

19:32

what that is there is

19:34

a recipe in the cookbook for Kugel which

19:37

is a Jewish baked pasta casserole dish don't

19:40

clap for Kugel it's not that great that's

19:43

the whole reason why I had to do a new recipe in

19:46

the book I'm not I'm not the biggest

19:48

fan of Kugel all right like it's

19:50

it should be a dessert pasta it's

19:52

too sweet it's always served with the

19:54

entrees it's supposed to be like

19:56

one of these sweet savory things but it's kind

19:59

of it's not savory it's just really sort of

20:01

It's mildly sweet. Certainly it has cottage cheese and

20:03

sour cream, cinnamon sugar, like an egg custard, sometimes

20:05

raisins. I don't love it. So I

20:07

set out to try to do a better Kugel. It

20:09

would be better to me, okay. So

20:13

we took all the sugar out of the

20:15

Kugel itself and made it much more savory

20:17

and tangy. So instead of cottage cheese and

20:19

sour cream, it's labna, which is like strained

20:22

yogurt, thick tangy yogurt, labna and buttermilk. And

20:25

that makes it more tangy, more savory. And

20:27

then the sweetness comes from a fruit relish

20:29

that you drizzle on top. So

20:31

that's like, instead of it being kind of like mildly

20:33

sweet, it's sort of like full

20:35

savory sweet combo. So

20:37

I think you can eat that for dessert. As

20:42

we discussed, a huge part of the making

20:44

of my cookbook was the photography. And many

20:46

of our hosts had more questions about that,

20:48

especially in San Francisco, where the book's art

20:51

director and food stylist, Gillian Knox, and photographer,

20:53

Dan Liberti joined me on stage. Our

20:55

host was Sam Sanders from the podcast Vibe

20:57

Check. And he asked Dan and Gillian this.

21:00

Pasta's been around for a long time. People

21:03

have been taking pictures of

21:05

pasta for a long time. Because

21:08

I see bad photos of other folks'

21:10

pasta on my Instagram all the time.

21:14

What was the single thing

21:16

y'all did together to

21:19

make pasta look new? You know, we didn't

21:21

want to make the Nona's, you

21:23

know, pasta book. That was like a

21:25

very, that was like the bold, italic,

21:28

like underlined, like, this is not your

21:30

Nona's pasta book. And I

21:33

really loved that challenge as an art

21:35

director, as a food stylist, as a

21:37

prop stylist, you know,

21:40

to transport people into

21:42

these cultural kitchens. Because

21:44

these recipes are multicultural.

21:47

Like they're really embracing different

21:49

flavors from all around

21:51

the world. And also I think colors

21:53

really help. I'm such a color theorist

21:55

in general. I think

21:58

using color is really important. And

22:01

so stepping outside of using red and

22:04

these like muted, like soft sepia

22:06

tones of Italy, right? Like we

22:08

should be in full color experiencing

22:11

these recipes because they're full

22:13

of flavor. And also trusting

22:16

Dan LaBerti and his

22:19

photography skills, we work

22:21

so well together. Yeah,

22:23

and it started early with Dan and our conversations

22:26

that there needed to be a

22:28

sense of reality. It had to be like you're in

22:30

somebody's kitchen or dining room

22:32

or wherever apartment. And that it's not

22:34

gonna be just a pretty

22:36

picture on a nice piece of wood. We didn't want

22:39

it to feel like Italy. And I also didn't want

22:41

it to feel aspirational. My wife and kids

22:43

had their hands in there. So it's like, I wanted you to feel

22:45

like you were with everybody. Just

22:47

cause I'm nosy, I

22:50

want one or all of you to share a

22:53

salacious, interesting, crazy BTS moment. From the

22:55

process, it could be fun. It could

22:57

be whatever. Just like you won't believe

22:59

this thing that happened. I

23:02

mean, okay, it wasn't a podcast, but

23:05

the corn was the trash corn was good. That

23:07

was like, that was my favorite moment.

23:11

Dan's like, Hey, where, you know, what are we, what

23:14

are we about to do? I'm like, Oh, you know

23:16

what? We need that corn on the cob. Where did

23:18

it, where did it go? The cobs after the corn

23:20

had been removed. And Melina's in the kitchen. Shout

23:23

out to Melina. Melina, are there super

23:25

talented food stylists? She's here. She's

23:28

here too. And she's like, it's in

23:30

the trash. I'm

23:32

like, wash it off, girl. We about to

23:34

use it. Okay, let's go. I

23:36

love it. I love it. Trash

23:38

corn. Yeah. Trash corn. Any

23:41

others? I kept cracking up cause I

23:44

have this little tiny gear closet

23:46

and Dan kept disappearing into the

23:48

gear closet. And I'm like,

23:50

what is Dan doing? And then he's like, Hey, I'm

23:52

gonna go to the closet. And just do podcast reads.

24:00

I think you were doing ad reads or something. Yeah.

24:02

Yeah. And so every once in a while, Dan, we were

24:04

like, where's Dan at? He's in his little booth in

24:06

there. I joined Reeds Making Reads. I joined Reeds

24:08

Making Reads to make it into a recording booth,

24:10

because the show must go on. Yeah.

24:13

I once recorded something for something, it's

24:15

been years, in the trunk of a rental

24:17

car. Nice. You

24:20

get it done. Is it open or closed? You

24:23

can always get out the backseat. If

24:25

you're ever kidnapped. Right. The

24:29

tea continued to be spilled when one

24:31

of my recipe developers, Asha Lupi, AKA

24:34

the Sausie Spicestress, also joined us on

24:36

stage in San Francisco. And Sam got

24:38

right to it with Asha. Yeah, Asha,

24:40

recipe developer. What was y'all's biggest

24:42

fight? Be

24:48

for real. Be for real. I

24:50

think there were several

24:52

times where a

24:54

recipe would call for half a pound of

24:56

pasta, and you would be like, there's not

24:58

enough sauce. And then we'd go back

25:00

and forth. And I was like, oh, you used a

25:02

full pound of pasta. Yeah. Uh-huh. That's

25:05

true. Yes. Asha had a couple recipes

25:07

that called for eight ounces, which is

25:09

a half a pound, a half a

25:11

package. And every single time I misread

25:13

the recipe and put a whole

25:15

pound in, and then got to the

25:17

end and was like flummoxed by the results. And every

25:19

single time was just because I didn't read it

25:21

correctly. Which I insisted, despite the objections of I think

25:23

Asha, our recipe editor, Rebecca Marshers, and the book's editor,

25:26

Cassie, who all objected. I was like, no. We're going

25:28

to put every single time that we're only calling for

25:30

half of a package of pasta, in

25:32

the instructions, we're going to put a parenthetical that's going to

25:34

say, make sure you only use half

25:37

the package. Because

25:39

I felt like I can't possibly be the only idiot out

25:41

there who's going to misread this. Yeah. That's

25:44

what counts as a fight when you're making a cookbook.

25:47

Back in Boston, we got some more dirt from one

25:49

of my other recipe developers, Katie Laird, AKA Super Nona.

25:51

She's the one you heard at the start of this

25:53

episode, who wanted her kids to have an Italian sperm

25:55

donor. But while Katie was sure about

25:57

that, she actually had mixed feelings about

25:59

working. with me on this book. I

26:02

mean I just grew up loving pasta

26:04

but I really fell

26:07

into love with it and you

26:09

know wanted to make it my

26:11

career and significant other from from

26:15

the angle of the handmade aspect

26:17

of it. So a very different

26:19

angle from from Dan who wanted

26:22

to make it you know accessible

26:24

to everybody and available and mass-produced.

26:27

I really just fell so hard for

26:29

the shapes that are made literally

26:31

by two hands and nothing

26:34

else. And so it was

26:36

really funny when Dan first contacted me I was

26:38

so psyched you know to work on this book

26:40

with him and he's like yeah and so we're

26:42

gonna use all box pastas that you can find

26:44

at every grocery store. And I was like

26:47

okay yeah I mean I haven't bought a

26:49

box of pasta in like a really long

26:51

time. I actually told my my toddler at

26:54

the time I was like we're gonna go

26:56

to the grocery store to get some pasta

26:58

for mommy's work and she was mom they

27:01

don't sell pasta at the grocery store.

27:10

Across this whole tour one of my favorite

27:12

things about it was that it gave me

27:15

a chance to reflect on Cascatelli, anything's possible

27:17

and really my whole 14-year journey of the

27:19

Spork Bowl. Often it was

27:21

your questions that prompted these reflections and got

27:23

some of our hosts to reflect too. In

27:25

LA I was on stage with Evan Kliman

27:27

who you know as my pasta fairy godmother

27:30

and comedian Andy Richter who was Conan

27:32

O'Brien's late night sidekick. We

27:34

got a question that made all of us think about what

27:36

it means to lead a creative life. Hi

27:39

I'm Sam this is my actual

27:42

first experience ever with the Spork

27:44

full podcast. I didn't know this

27:46

existed before... Did you just wander

27:48

in? So

27:51

this is actually a question for all three of you Andy,

27:53

Evan, Dan. So

27:56

I really appreciate how all three of you are

27:58

like experts at the thing that you do. you're

28:00

experts about. And so like what I'd be curious

28:02

about to hear is just like how do you

28:05

obsessionally chase down an idea? I mean

28:07

I'm a little bit different in terms

28:09

of like a lot of people that

28:11

are in comedy and show business and

28:14

because I am a

28:16

collaborator. I'm an improviser. I

28:19

got involved with groups of

28:21

people who are available

28:23

to each other for inspiration.

28:26

And so that's really kind of more

28:29

the way that I work. Sometimes

28:32

to my own detriment. Like I could use

28:34

a little fire under my ass now and

28:36

then. But I'm sort of more like I'm

28:38

gonna remain in fruitful

28:41

situations and remain open to opportunity.

28:43

And I think that that probably

28:45

applies to a more directed sort

28:47

of course too. Your thoughts

28:49

Evan? I mean

28:51

it's so interesting that you say that because that's

28:53

certainly the hallmark of

28:55

what I do now with Good Food. I

28:58

mean there are four of us on the

29:00

team. We pitch to each other constantly much

29:02

like you would pitch idea joke ideas or

29:05

ideas for a scene. That is where the fun is.

29:07

Because when you collaborate

29:10

like that you always end up farther

29:12

down the road than when you're alone.

29:14

Yeah I mean I

29:16

guess I would just add that I think that I recognized myself

29:21

early on that I was a person who like had

29:23

a tendency to get obsessed

29:25

with things and get really

29:27

excited about things. Like I started writing an underground

29:29

newsletter in high school and I would like be

29:32

writing and writing on Microsoft Word up you know in

29:34

upstairs and my mom would be calling me to dinner.

29:36

It was the only time that I ever didn't come

29:39

running for dinner. I was working on this newsletter. I

29:41

was like wow like I'm really into this. And I

29:43

realized I was like oh like whatever I'm gonna do

29:45

in life like I wanted to feel like this. And

29:48

kind of what we're all talking about it's like there's

29:50

a certain sort of creative spark that

29:52

is very exciting. It's a certain type of high

29:55

I think when you find it. I

29:57

sort of said this at the end of the Anything's Possible series

29:59

but like As I've gotten older

30:01

and more experienced, my ideas get more and more

30:03

ambitious because you're just kind of like you need

30:06

a bigger high. You need to

30:08

conquer something that seems more difficult. And

30:11

then ideas have never been hard

30:13

for me. Execution is always the hard part. But if

30:16

you can hold on

30:18

to that feeling of that initial

30:20

spark and the

30:22

excitement of the idea, then

30:25

for me at least, that's what pulls me through

30:27

when it gets hard. So

30:29

I've developed strategies for dealing with the tougher parts

30:31

of the creative process. But that doesn't mean I

30:33

always succeed. As a listener in the Twin Cities

30:35

was happy to point out. Here's what she had

30:37

to say to me and Chef Ann Kim. Hi,

30:40

my name is Laura. And something I've

30:42

appreciated about following both of you is

30:45

that you both are so willing to

30:47

try, even when unsure,

30:49

even when there's failure.

30:52

And I'm wondering, Dan, from listening to you,

30:55

you seem to do public failure

30:57

so well. I

31:00

think that was a compliment. Yeah, well, I'll go

31:02

ahead and take it that way. Truly, I mean,

31:05

your children let you have it. Like, I don't

31:07

know, was he from Long Island, the pasta dye

31:09

maker? He's from Staten Island. Staten Island, who scuased

31:11

me. Which is like Long Island on steroids. And

31:14

he just thought you were an idiot at

31:16

first. He was the

31:18

only one. Yeah, right, and

31:20

yet you keep putting that out there publicly.

31:23

What is that actually like behind the scenes for you?

31:26

Have you always been good at failure

31:29

or comfortable with it? Or what's

31:31

that like? Yeah. It's really, it's

31:34

kind of admirable, really. Well, thank

31:36

you, I think. No, thank

31:38

you. You

31:41

know, I think you have to have a certain amount

31:43

of confidence to take it with a grain of salt when

31:46

people tell you that your ideas are

31:48

bad. But I've also, you know, like, I've

31:51

been working in creative fields for 25 years. All

31:55

right, the spork flow has been out for 14 years. And

31:57

not all my ideas work out, but as you

31:59

get older and more mature and more

32:01

experienced, I think that I'm

32:04

better now at kind of seeing around the corner.

32:06

If I really, really know deep in my

32:09

soul that this is a good idea, then

32:11

I have the experience to back it up.

32:14

And when I was starting the Sporkful, like I

32:16

did the Sporkful in 2010, I

32:18

launched it after getting laid off from six radio jobs in

32:20

eight years. And the first two years

32:22

I made no money doing it. And it was not easy, because

32:24

my wife, we just had our first child and she had to

32:26

go back to work so we could have health insurance. And she's

32:29

sort of like, it kind of sucks

32:31

that I'm working and being away from our daughter so that

32:33

you can follow your dream. And

32:36

I was like, but you know, I really think I'm

32:38

onto something here. Like I really, really feel it. Like

32:40

this is a good idea, this show is a good

32:42

idea. I just need some more time. And then

32:45

I got my first book deal two years in that made it

32:47

like half a job. And four years in I got picked up

32:49

at the New York Public Radio station. That's when it became a

32:51

real job. And then like 2017, we

32:53

won our first James Beard Award. And that was

32:55

the first time after seven years, I

32:58

tell the story now in 45 seconds, but like

33:00

it was seven years. That's a long ass

33:02

time. And that was, I

33:04

was like, oh, maybe this isn't about to all

33:07

fall apart. But like the producer and me,

33:10

because I was a producer for 10 years before I

33:12

started hosting my show, I'm more

33:15

so than probably than some other hosts, I'm able to

33:17

listen back to the tape of myself and my own

33:20

recordings and analyze it with distance

33:22

and be like, oh, that part, what I would just

33:24

drone down for so long about the creative process, that was too

33:27

long. Like everything I just said, we should

33:29

cut that down. So

33:32

when my wife and my kids give me

33:34

a hard time, part of

33:36

me is like, that was great tape. That's gonna be so funny

33:38

in the show. So, you know, the

33:40

producer and me all along is like, this is

33:42

gonna make for such a fun show. Even if

33:44

it means that they think my idea sucks. What's

33:46

your mantra and fuck fear? Can I say that?

33:48

Yeah, fuck fear, right? Fuck fear.

33:52

I mean, honestly, because I think when you

33:54

think about what you're really afraid of, it's

33:57

usually just your inner voice telling you that,

33:59

oh, my idea is not good enough, it's

34:01

not valuable enough, I'm going to be judged

34:04

for this. I think that is one of

34:06

the number one fears that people have, that

34:08

what are people going to think of me?

34:11

But when you can get over that, and

34:13

it comes with maturity and age and experience,

34:15

that you really don't give a fuck about

34:17

what people think, and you just go for

34:19

it. I

34:31

think we have time for one more question. Hi,

34:34

I'm Katie. So,

34:36

safe to say you've covered a lot

34:38

of pasta. Have you thought

34:41

about what other food might be next? I

34:43

actually got lots of versions of this question, and

34:45

my answer was always the same. I eat a

34:47

lot of tortilla chips. That being said, I have

34:49

a lot of opinions about tortilla chips. They're too

34:51

pointy, if they're too big, you can't get

34:54

them in your mouth. And if anyone out there works with

34:56

a tortilla chip company, I want you to contact me, because

34:58

I asked them ideas. I want tortilla chips all

35:00

the time. Anyway, tortilla chips. When

35:05

Cascatelli went viral, I really thought that I'm

35:07

going to get big corporations that are

35:09

going to come to me now, and they're going to say,

35:11

we want you to design a new X for us.

35:15

This is going to be great. My whole job, I'll

35:17

just make a podcast, and then I'll just eat things

35:19

and have opinions about them. I'm

35:21

already doing it. Now

35:24

I'm going to get paid. It's going to be great.

35:26

And so far, that has not happened. But

35:28

I would love to design a tortilla chip

35:30

for any company that makes tortilla chips out

35:33

there. And then, wait,

35:36

sorry, what was the rest of the question? I

35:39

like blacked out talking about tortilla chips. That

35:47

is a wrap on our best of the book tour

35:49

episodes. If you made it out to one of our

35:51

live shows, again, thank you so much for coming. I

35:53

hope you had as much fun as I did. If

35:55

you want to see videos and photos from the tour

35:57

and much more, follow me on Instagram at The Sport.

36:01

And if you didn't make it out to any of our

36:03

shows, I hope to see you at one of the ones

36:05

that are upcoming in Napa, Martha's Vineyard, London, and more to

36:07

come. Man, we're covering

36:09

a lot of ground. For all

36:11

the details, go to sporkful.com/events. Before

36:15

we get to the credits, I want to share

36:17

this special segment sponsored by Norwegian Cruise Line. There's

36:23

nothing like a cruise to bring people together. And

36:25

where does a lot of that together time happen?

36:28

At mealtime. And Norwegian Cruise Line keeps

36:30

raising the standards of cruising with award-winning

36:32

specialty restaurants and a variety of food

36:34

and drink options for every taste. In

36:37

fact, next year, they're launching a brand new

36:39

ship called Norwegian Aqua with a brand new

36:41

restaurant on board. For the new ship coming

36:43

out for Aqua, we have a new concept

36:46

coming out that we never did before. It's

36:48

a Thai restaurant, a Thai concept. This is

36:50

Chef Eric Bilodeau, director of culinary development and

36:52

operations for Norwegian Cruise Line. He says this

36:55

new Thai restaurant has been years in the

36:57

making. We have to make a lot of

36:59

research to develop a menu. It

37:01

takes a little while because it's

37:04

a lot of research. When they're getting ready to

37:06

open a new restaurant on one of their ships,

37:08

Chef Eric and his team do a lot of

37:10

brainstorming and then a lot of eating. It all

37:12

happens at the NCL Test Kitchen in Miami. We're

37:14

not making A plus right away

37:16

the first day. It's constant repetition. We

37:19

try, we try. And

37:22

then once we have something that is more or less solid,

37:25

then we start to create the menu and

37:27

then we start to invite

37:29

other people for feedback. Yeah,

37:34

those are good days at work, right? When you get to

37:36

eat well. Correct. So,

37:39

when we talk about the process of

37:42

developing a new menu or revamping a

37:44

menu, the testing and the retesting, what

37:47

do you enjoy about that process? The

37:49

testing and the retesting.