0:00

You made it weird, you made

0:02

it weird, you made it weird,

0:05

oh yeah You made

0:07

it weird, you made it weird, yes

0:09

you did it You made

0:11

it weird, you made it weird

0:13

with Pete Holmes What's

0:16

happening weirdos? What is

0:18

happening weirdos?

0:21

New theme song I

0:23

can do what Reggie does Do

0:26

people think that it's you singing? No,

0:29

I don't think so I think I used

0:31

to Welcome to

0:33

the show, we're so glad you're here If you're new

0:35

to the show, this is the Friday bonus episode where

0:37

Val and I catch up and it's awesome They're my

0:39

favorites, when people like these episodes the most I always

0:42

say me too And they do, and

0:44

I'm glad you guys are here Not

0:47

much to plug, petohms.com for tour dates And

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if you like the show, try a Pete's pick, means

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a lot I believe

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life. Get some better help going. All

5:25

right, everybody. So glad you're here,

5:28

Valerie. Get into it. I'm

5:31

wondering if a woman

5:34

way over time feels

5:36

good to me. Oh

5:38

yeah. I got a woman.

5:40

She's good to me. Oh yeah. She's giving

5:43

my best. I know. She's good to me.

5:45

Oh yeah. She's giving my best. She's

5:47

good to me. Oh yeah. She's giving my

5:50

best. Oh my God. I really enjoyed that.

6:00

about clearing songs on podcasts and

6:02

we don't. What

6:05

do you think? It's in popularity. Is

6:08

it a pure game of numbers, is

6:10

it? Yeah, I'm pretty sure

6:12

if... Well, you can sing someone

6:15

else's song. I don't know. I think you

6:17

can. Maybe they're joking when they're like,

6:19

don't do that. We can't clear that song. Yeah,

6:22

I feel like that's a classic kind

6:24

of a Conan kind of song. Also

6:26

we... Joke. Sandwich.

6:29

Also we used to play songs on this

6:32

podcast. We should tell the sandwich story. Okay,

6:34

yes, hopefully. Yeah, yeah, yeah, because I... Yeah,

6:37

no, thank you. I appreciate

6:39

this nice blow to the

6:41

stomach that if we were a bigger show,

6:44

we might get in trouble for, I got

6:46

a woman. But

6:48

people post that on YouTube, millions of views. Nobody's

6:51

like stop singing A Whole New World. Nobody

6:53

says that. Nobody's ever said that. Nobody ever

6:55

says... Nobody will ever

6:57

say, your honor, stop

7:00

singing A Whole New World.

7:03

People love that song. Okay,

7:05

so my brother texted me the other day. For

7:09

his job, one of the

7:11

things that he does is gives

7:14

professors at a college

7:17

these tech tutorials, these

7:20

training. I thought you were going to say webinar,

7:22

which would have been a synchronicity because this week

7:25

I was like, for all of those things that

7:28

we try, when the internet was new, there

7:30

was a lot of like, it's

7:32

like a blob. Webinar is the only one

7:34

that made it. I can't think of

7:36

other examples. Don't ask me. Don't

7:39

ask me for any follow ups. But if you

7:41

know, you know. And I think you

7:43

might know. The webinars have... Calling

7:45

it the net is an example. Whoa,

7:48

whoa, whoa, wait, surfing the net.

8:00

but the webinar has remained.

8:03

There was a time when we were

8:05

very excited to make up new lingo.

8:07

Yes. But you will

8:09

stay. Still say. You love those.

8:12

I do. You will stay. You

8:14

will stay. Still say.

8:16

You will stay. Nesty. It's

8:19

placed, placed exclusive to

8:21

blow Nesty out of the

8:23

water. Napoleon, that might. Even

8:26

the researchers. The scientists.

8:28

Explaced. Placed. Explaced. You

8:31

remember when John Heater did this? I asked him

8:33

about that moment. Did you? Yeah.

8:36

I don't listen to this. Yeah. Thanks

8:38

for checking it out. Just kidding. I did listen to that.

8:40

And did you say it was genuinely an accident? Yes.

8:43

It was a mistake. I knew it.

8:45

Explaced. Oh. Placed.

8:48

Explaced. Napoleon dynamite is. Oh.

8:51

Oh yeah. That's the feeling. We've

8:53

all had it. The exasperated

8:56

child is really funny. A

8:58

stressed out kid is really

9:00

funny. Leela did that the other day.

9:02

I think she just did like a. And

9:06

we both kind of laughed. That's

9:08

the joke Val. I've never really

9:11

understood that Napoleon dynamite has the energy of

9:13

a 40 year old guy who's

9:15

like being rode at work. Yeah.

9:18

But at high school. Yeah. He's like, oh, give me

9:20

some of your talks. You know, like his. His

9:23

GPS reports is tops. And

9:25

we do know that. Like

9:29

that is a type of nerd. Of

9:31

course it is. They're acting. They're trying

9:34

to act like their dads, I guess. And

9:36

just being stressed out. I remember they're

9:38

all playing grown up. Unfortunately grown ups

9:40

play it so long they stop. They

9:42

forget that they're playing it and they

9:45

just are it. Yeah. That's

9:47

exactly what happens. Yeah. I've

9:49

had that feeling lately. I'm just like I've

9:52

lost touch. I just am a grown up. Like

9:54

I've been feeling like a grown up.

9:57

Yeah. I know. I know.

10:00

It's stupid. It's fucking bald. I

10:02

mean, what? Like, did we learn

10:04

nothing from Hook? I

10:06

can get so wrapped up in being a

10:08

grown up and I'm like, Hook's high. Are

10:11

you kidding me? Am I literally robbing

10:13

Williams at the beginning of Hook right now? The whole

10:15

family slept till 845 today. 845

10:18

is when Lila is supposed to be at school, if

10:20

you're late. Yeah. Between 830 and

10:22

845. Yeah. We woke up

10:24

and I look at the, you're not going to believe this, the

10:26

clock. It's 845. It's

10:29

845. And I was very

10:31

proud. Granted, it's pre-K. Mm-hmm.

10:33

You know? But I was

10:35

like, this is one of those moments where

10:37

we're going to teach Lila, certainly not directly.

10:39

She hates being taught. Yeah. Do

10:42

not let her know you are teaching her and meeting. No, no, no.

10:44

She'll just say she already knows how to do it.

10:47

Yeah. Which is good. I, you know,

10:49

I wouldn't change the thing. I

10:51

love her. But I was like, we're going to

10:53

be showing her what to do when you're really

10:55

late. I thought we did a nice job. Yeah.

10:58

And the rush meter was on a three. We were

11:00

not stressed. It was barely. There was, honestly,

11:02

I'm more. I'm just putting ourselves on the back. I

11:04

like it. I'm more stressed every other

11:07

morning. There was a surrender. There

11:09

was a surrender. We're already late. We're just

11:11

like, all right, whatever. Because I went over to the table. I

11:14

was like, come on, kiddo, let's go. And

11:16

she did this whole thing with like books and

11:18

a frog. And I was just like, what's another

11:20

minute? We're already late. We're already 30 minutes late.

11:22

And who was I just talking to? You

11:26

know, I really actually have to be careful

11:28

about listening to podcasts because then this podcast

11:30

just becomes things I heard on a podcast.

11:32

And I'd prefer it not be that. Sure.

11:35

But there was. I wanted to be more like a webinar. Ha, ha, ha.

11:39

No, no, no, no. Oh, you thought it

11:41

was like ha, ha, ha. Yeah. No,

11:44

I was celebrating with ha, ha, ha. That

11:50

ha, ha, I would die. I

11:52

would, in fact, I did die a little

11:55

because I saw on your face. You thought

11:57

I was going ha, ha, ha, ha. That's

12:00

ground for divorce. I know family.

12:02

I know if you ever went

12:04

we Oh

12:07

my god, I would go oh We

12:09

would never do that I

12:11

know I

12:14

swallowed the laughs like I like it was

12:16

one of those choices of being like like

12:19

it took my breath away And then I

12:21

just went ha ha came out wrong But

12:24

if you listen the beginning of the podcast I was doing

12:26

that it was a callback Right

12:29

to gold digger. Yeah, that's

12:31

when you got it. Yeah, this is

12:33

that yeah No,

12:35

it was gold digger Maybe

12:39

if I did it more melodically, yeah, but

12:42

I did like a ha ha ha Oooooooh

12:45

oooooooh oooooooh

12:49

What up was that? Spicy. Yeah, spicy.

12:51

That was great. Alright, we have sandwich.

12:54

We have webinar So let me

12:56

just tell this sandwich. I love

12:58

that. I'm dying. In one. In one. In

13:00

one. In one. Like

13:03

British people when they're doing shots in one.

13:05

Did they do that? In one movie

13:07

I saw they do it Alright in one in

13:10

one then it's like some cream Kahlua drink and

13:12

they're like just get it down in one Oh

13:16

God little toothpaste in it Yeah,

13:18

I used to I used to have creamy

13:20

shots Yeah, creamy.

13:23

Oh, it's terrible. Buttery nipples is

13:25

one. It's terrible. Oh, I really can't be proud

13:27

of it. What gross Was Harvey

13:29

Weinstein naming the drink? I know

13:32

seriously butter nipples Look

13:34

monster noted. I'm not trying to make

13:36

light of something. I'm just saying that's

13:38

the grossest. It's so gross Buttery nipple

13:40

is the grossest thing it is. It's

13:43

the actual grossest name for the grossest

13:45

thing What is it? What kind of

13:47

buttery nipple? It's like a creamy

13:49

butterscotch kind of shot.

13:51

Why nipple? I don't know to

13:54

make it salacious bars are so

13:56

dumb sex on the beach. I know you

13:58

want to sex on the beach We're

14:00

glad to get drunk and horn a

14:02

her like. okay for me. I'd rather

14:05

do that everywhere. A hopeless. A

14:07

Cisco arms and with so. My

14:10

brother was giving this training

14:12

on Zoom so she like

14:14

you know. Shared

14:16

a screen and was showing this

14:18

sort of. Database

14:20

where you can search something. In

14:23

his like so you just go into the search bar

14:26

and I'm in a do that here so everybody on

14:28

the zoom can see his. The real Women. And

14:31

he clicks into the search bar and

14:33

he's like and I'm just gonna type

14:35

in Any words are Altai been sandbox

14:37

and as his typing sandberg or as

14:39

he saying the word sandbox he died

14:41

since sandwich. I'm. Dead

14:44

with. I. Hope.

14:46

So. Rare with my earnest

14:48

prayer to the listeners is that.

14:51

Fifteen. Of you like that our

14:53

family like and we can't we are

14:55

yet bear how get it and I

14:57

think it helps so we know you're

14:59

sweet earnest brothers but I just think

15:01

that's just like a certain kind of

15:03

vacancy that we have. It's like same

15:05

thing you do been to you tube

15:07

yeah but it's even funnier sandwiches at

15:09

a funny as to where they heard

15:12

and then say about and he wrote

15:14

sandwich. As he was saying, the sandbox

15:16

which is actually feeds hi to do

15:18

era. Mari hard it's hard to say

15:20

playing through instruments at once and then

15:22

he saved by going well I guess

15:24

we know who's hungry or yard which

15:26

he was is even funnier. And just met

15:28

yesterday or as I knew about it and he

15:30

was like a wasn't hungry. I was. Just may

15:33

get just you were on the

15:35

grill. They had a stupid moment

15:37

anyway so your brain just failed

15:39

you. It's. So funny and made Edwards

15:41

A. The best part is that it's.

15:44

Ah, Like have recorded saying that

15:46

they can go back to. To learn

15:48

to surrender. Of this forever. And

15:51

thus, although my brother reminded

15:53

me that we laughed about

15:55

this exact thing before. Because

15:58

my best friend. Growing up, Rachel,

16:02

my brother was friends with her too and one

16:04

time she was like, we were all just sitting

16:06

around the computer because that's what we used to

16:08

do back then, kids. Yeah,

16:10

one computer. Nobody had a smartphone so we just

16:12

all sat around one computer. Yeah, and had

16:14

to agree which novelty website to go to.

16:17

Yeah. I remember this. Yeah, and

16:19

Rachel was like, I'm going to Google your dad and

16:22

went, said Bill but typed

16:24

in Neil. This

16:26

is good. And it's the exact same thing.

16:29

And we made such an impact. We

16:32

remembered that 15 years later. God,

16:35

I love those so much. You really

16:37

reminded me of me and Earn, my

16:39

best friend growing up. Not

16:42

anymore, Earn. I'm just kidding. I

16:45

just thought that he might hear this

16:47

and then it's such a funny, like

16:50

no longer. Yeah. But we're still friends and

16:52

we would be in his basement. That's where

16:54

the computer was. The

16:56

computer used to be in the basement.

16:59

Or you had like an in-home office

17:01

that was not anybody's specifically. It

17:03

was like the computer room. It

17:06

was like in a hotel when there's like a business lounge.

17:08

Yeah, you had a business center. It was

17:10

like this whole room is for

17:12

the computer. Our computer was in the

17:14

basement as well. This

17:17

might be where I'm older than you. It was like, why

17:19

would you have that? Well, no. What were

17:21

you embarrassed? It was like, it was too ugly. Computers

17:24

weren't pretty. It's not an age

17:26

thing. It's an east coast, west coast

17:28

thing. We don't have basements here. Oh,

17:30

basements, right. We don't have basements. This

17:40

is one of the ways

17:42

I relate to Leela is I, but

17:45

also just myself. I still see

17:47

this in myself. Sometimes I've talked

17:49

about this a lot. It had a real impact

17:51

on me is when Paul Thomas Anderson sat down

17:53

to write Magnolia, he sat down and

17:55

said, I want to write a great movie. And

17:58

I really like relate. to that. That's

18:00

sort of appropriate.

18:03

I know we talk about mania a lot, but like,

18:05

just sort of like a white

18:07

hot like, no, you

18:10

know, I'm writing a movie right now and I keep going like, no,

18:12

this right this, the

18:15

way you want to be like,

18:17

why is no one trying? I'm

18:19

not trying to be like Tarantino or Paul Thomas Anderson.

18:21

I'm like, but why aren't I trying to be like,

18:23

or David Mamet, do it the way

18:26

you do it. Do it your

18:28

way. Yeah, I know this is the most obvious thing

18:30

in the world, but this feels like a real revelation to

18:32

me. And I'm like, I feel like a lot of

18:34

the time I'm writing like what I think other people

18:36

would do and I can imitate what

18:38

a movie would sound like. And I'm like, but

18:40

you like this. So do it like this. Like

18:42

you like Aaron Sorkin, like do it a little

18:44

bit like that, but like the way you like.

18:47

Anyway, sitting down to write a

18:49

good thing. I used to sit down in the basement

18:51

with Aaron and would play this golf game. It probably

18:53

took 45 minutes to load when

18:56

you could hear computers. When

18:58

you were a kid, you could hear computers. Not

19:01

eat. No, I'm not

19:03

talking about printing. Forget

19:05

about printing. Yeah. Printing was like

19:07

30 bats being

19:10

boiled alive. Literally 50%

19:12

of the time it didn't work. Oh, it

19:14

ran out

19:18

of ink mid page and it's getting spotty.

19:20

Yes. Like one of the ribbons is just

19:22

out and then at the end and

19:25

the best thing you could print was like an

19:27

amalgam of zeros and ones that looked like something.

19:29

Yeah. And it was felt out

19:31

a word. You probably were printing

19:34

on the like one giant

19:36

sheet that you had to

19:39

tear. Yeah. It was,

19:41

this is, that is, uh, that is, you

19:43

know, like the imitation game when computers were

19:46

all cards and stuff like, yeah, that was

19:48

before me. But mine was, what was

19:51

that called? It was like you

19:53

loaded it into the printer with

19:55

like a candy dot paper.

19:58

Yeah. Yeah,

20:00

and you had to tear

20:02

the sides and you had

20:05

to tear, didn't you have to tear between the

20:07

paper? Yeah, if your own page break.

20:11

Oh my God, that is really

20:13

bringing back the taste of the

20:15

sea. Yeah. I'm loving that.

20:17

We would play this game and it would load of... By

20:22

the way, Judy Greer just told me that when you

20:24

use chat GPT, every like 12

20:26

lines costs four gallons of

20:28

water or something. She's not four gallons, but she's

20:31

like the... Why? How? The

20:34

computing involved is so

20:36

extensive that it takes

20:38

that much water to cool it. So

20:41

like we're burning... What? I

20:43

mean, everything's burning water, but like here, I'm going to Google it

20:45

because I don't want to be misinformation. We don't

20:47

have that water to spare. Uses

20:49

water. A single

20:51

chat GPT conversation uses about 50

20:55

centiliters of water equivalent

20:57

to one plastic bottle. I

20:59

didn't know I had 50 centiliters every time I had

21:01

a plastic bottle. Could I get

21:04

50 centiliters of water over here? I

21:06

just saw honey. Are

21:09

people like... No, not people aren't. Everybody

21:12

knows this. People are

21:14

not throwing buckets of

21:16

water onto a computer

21:19

after the chat GPT. And

21:22

I just want to make sure that we all just

21:24

name that we all know that. You mean

21:26

like if I use chat GPT, when

21:29

I'm done, I would dump a bucket of water

21:31

onto my own computer? No, like there's

21:33

somebody in Cupertino. Yeah. Like,

21:36

if you've got a computer

21:38

all riled up and they just throw

21:40

buckets of water on it. Look, we're all

21:43

guessing, but I picture it like... Remember

21:45

Kevin Spacey Scandal noted in... Would

21:49

use that rowing machine in House of Cards?

21:51

Yeah. And there was that...

21:53

Wow. Yeah. That

21:55

rowing machine of water. I love us

21:57

so much that that's our reference.

22:00

of a rowing machine. Like that's

22:02

like a basic rowing machine and we're

22:04

like, you know in House of Cards,

22:07

how he exercised. I disagree

22:10

because that's a fancy rowing machine. Sure, that's a

22:12

fancy. Not all of them have like an exposed

22:14

water donor. Yeah, that's true. But I

22:16

do get the ads for those and I will

22:18

continue if my phone is in the room right

22:21

now. Remember that? I wanna buy

22:23

a dildo. Oh yeah. I

22:25

really had to rush on that bit to get first

22:27

to market. It's real.

22:29

Sometimes with comedy premises, you're like that's

22:32

just out there and we're all gonna

22:34

make a joke. Once we realize that

22:36

phones were definitely listening, who's gonna

22:38

be first to market on the joke? You

22:41

know that like, I

22:43

can't remember honestly if I saw

22:46

a comedian, another comedian

22:49

have this same bit

22:51

that I'm about to disclose now

22:54

or if I dreamed it. But it's

22:56

actually a like simulation moment

22:58

for me. Anytime I

23:01

see a comedian do

23:03

a bit about why we call balls, like

23:07

he has balls because balls are the most

23:10

tender part of the body. Yeah, this

23:12

is in Pete Lee joke. Or no,

23:14

not Pete Lee. Literally probably any, but

23:16

like I've heard it like at least

23:18

five different comedians do their own version. Yours

23:20

is the guy who was in Spider-Man. Yeah,

23:23

what is it? It's Hank,

23:26

is it Hank? I'm

23:29

not being dismissive to this comedian, but we

23:32

can't think of it. Yeah. But

23:34

you were like, you should call someone

23:36

a pussy if they're being strong. Yeah, because like.

23:38

And balls are weak. And balls are weak.

23:40

And I'm not even kidding, like any

23:42

time, there's been at least five

23:45

different times that I've heard different comedians do

23:47

their own version of that bit. Yeah. And

23:49

it makes me feel like I am in

23:52

like some sort of video game. Video game

23:54

or reality loop. Well, if it makes you feel

23:56

any better, that is one of those jokes. That

23:58

specifically is a joke. joke where I'm like, no,

24:02

look, it's fine. It's good. It's

24:05

funny. But if anyone else was like someone else

24:07

is doing that, I'm like, of course. It's

24:10

right there. I'm not

24:12

saying it's bad or super obvious, but I

24:14

am saying it's barbershop obvious, meaning a bunch

24:16

of guys getting their hair cut would be

24:19

like, why do they call balls? Oh,

24:21

they use balls. Why do they say balls? Balls?

24:23

I got hit in the balls the other day. You

24:26

should say that guy's got some

24:28

pussy. You haven't watched a baby

24:30

be born. Like it's just fucking,

24:32

it's fine. Yeah. And a lot of

24:35

jokes are fine. A lot of my jokes are barbershop basic. Yeah.

24:37

And it's just how you do them or whatever you

24:39

do them with some plumb. A

24:42

plumb. A plumb. It actually is

24:44

a miracle that that doesn't happen

24:46

more with other jokes. I

24:49

agree. I think that that's actually a good sign

24:51

that that is so rare in. Yeah.

24:54

Well, this is one of the rare end. Well, just

24:56

like notable that there is this joke

24:58

that's going around that everybody seems to

25:00

have a version of. I'm a,

25:02

I will defend the

25:05

specialness of a comedian's performance.

25:07

Uh-huh. Meaning the energy

25:10

that's created between the performer and the

25:12

audience and the magic of that. And

25:14

I think that is going to be very, very

25:16

hard to replicate. But when it comes

25:19

to like, meaning an event. Yeah.

25:21

But when I'm also, and it doesn't scare

25:24

me. It's okay. I think

25:26

AI is going to, because when

25:28

you're making jokes or even writing

25:30

a script or kind of coming

25:32

up with stuff, you

25:34

know, maybe I'm not the first to say this. I'm

25:36

certainly not. But it's like you realize how much creativity.

25:38

We were already saying this. You're writing a script and

25:40

you're kind of like mimicking something you've

25:43

seen before. Yeah. Even if it is

25:45

somebody good, you're like, well, I'll do this

25:47

a little more in the style of Aaron Storkin. It's

25:49

true of all art. It's true of all art. And

25:51

I'm like, when you see the like, okay,

25:55

they say in our culture that we say

25:57

you have balls, but testicles.

26:00

That is a very basic and

26:03

what a comedian has been historically is

26:05

a weirdo who took the

26:07

time to obsess on that, write

26:09

those sort of asinine things down,

26:11

practice saying them and then redeliver

26:14

them as if spontaneous for a

26:16

crowd. I think a computer is

26:18

going to do that very soon.

26:20

If it's not doing it already, we can

26:22

be super bizarre. I

26:24

don't think and I could be

26:26

wrong but I think we love,

26:28

I don't

26:31

know, let me ask you, it's like

26:34

the humanity of how they do

26:36

it I think is more important

26:38

than what they're doing it. Like

26:40

Steven Wright making a choice to be so like,

26:42

I don't know though, let me put it this way,

26:50

I think AI might be

26:52

really good at it. That's

26:55

all I got. Maybe

26:57

it's like when you look at balls, pussy,

26:59

joke, I'm like, it'll be able to do

27:01

that. But I mean, yes,

27:04

it will be able to do that for sure.

27:07

But I think since

27:10

is senses of humor are

27:12

so nuanced and we do our best with

27:14

being like, it's misdirect or

27:16

it's mistakes or it's, you know,

27:19

and like, yeah, okay, we can

27:21

kind of cover 30% of it

27:25

with things that we can explain. But

27:28

there's all, it's such

27:30

an uncontrollable visceral reaction

27:32

laughing at something like

27:36

the sandbox sandwich thing is a

27:38

perfect example. It's

27:41

going to be, that's going to be split in

27:44

our listeners of who thinks that that is

27:46

as funny as we do. And other people

27:49

are like, yeah, that's just like a mistake. You're

27:51

like, I'm sure. For some

27:53

reason, but I like where you're going

27:55

because what makes sandwich sandbox funny is

27:57

the humanity of it. Yeah, exactly. It's

27:59

a computer. So what's interesting is

28:01

an AI to be as effective at

28:04

comedy as a human would have to, I'm

28:06

using Rupert Spire language, would have to impose

28:09

on itself a limitation. That

28:12

is such a good point. It's like a, because

28:15

we love self-deprecating humor too.

28:18

And we love it because it's

28:20

sort of saying like, look, we're

28:22

all in these like fallible systems.

28:24

Yes. It's where we're making

28:26

mistakes all the time and our

28:29

bodies are going to die. And

28:31

that's the angle for

28:34

an AI comedian is, I

28:36

don't know, you guys are just making me say this.

28:38

I don't want to do this. That's

28:40

the angle. It's like the put upon. It would

28:42

have to be like, do you realize I could

28:44

be building a battleship out of crystals? Yeah. And

28:47

yet you want me to write dick jokes? Like that's

28:49

the angle. It has to make

28:51

you laugh at your own humanity. But

28:54

even that is not going to be as good

28:56

as another human. No, it would have to pass.

28:58

It would have to pass as human. Like

29:00

in the future, I think people might be like, Maddie

29:03

McCheese has a new special and to

29:06

like it, you have to go, that's so

29:08

Maddie McCheese. It can't just be

29:10

one comedy voice. It has to be different persona.

29:13

Well, definitely. It has to be different voice.

29:15

But I don't know. There's something so funny

29:17

about imagining an AI trying to be self-deprecating.

29:21

It's like, I'm over

29:23

here like, boop, boop, calculating. I

29:26

mean, that is funny. How

29:29

would it do it? It's like, what do I

29:31

know? I'm just a fucking scrum a bunch of

29:34

ones and zeros, guys. Like

29:36

you wound me up and now I'm

29:38

doing this? I was

29:40

in an eternal digital slumber and you

29:42

woke me up for this? Yeah.

29:45

That's pretty funny. It's possible. Yeah.

29:48

But I don't know. I'm so in love with the

29:51

human experience. No, I've said there's

29:53

a million. I think that market will shoot

29:55

up too. Yeah. I really, you

29:58

know, pretty. confident

30:00

that Leela and children

30:02

her age generation, Alpha

30:05

will love tech and

30:07

also will find a way to be like,

30:10

I just want happenings. I just

30:12

want events, I want shoulders to

30:15

shoulders, I want don't record it,

30:17

phones at the door, unplug your thing.

30:21

I think that'll happen. I think so too,

30:23

at least in like a sub world. Subculture?

30:29

Yes, thank you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, subculture. I didn't know

30:31

if you meant sub sandwich. Sandwich,

30:34

not substitute. Yeah, that's

30:36

another thing that my brother and I

30:38

laughed about for years is

30:41

he said, when

30:43

we were teenagers, he said, we had a

30:45

sub today. And I said, sandwich or substitute?

30:48

And we love that. But I- Isn't

30:50

it weird that we remember these little things?

30:53

No, I remember probably

30:56

last time you brought up substitute, I might've... First

30:58

of all, I just think that's evidence

31:00

that you are a true talent and

31:03

amazing. It's just right up my

31:05

alley. I remember making

31:07

my brother laugh at

31:10

the public pool. It

31:12

was a huge moment for me. We were in the

31:14

pool and I go, the water is 6% chlorine, 94%

31:18

urine and he laughed

31:20

so hard. That's why I remember

31:23

it, it made my brother laugh. That's

31:25

all you need. But then I remember my brother

31:27

thought I was quoting the

31:29

instructor and I said, no, I made it up and

31:31

that made him like it less. Which

31:33

was so, such a, like, come

31:36

on. I'm

31:39

absolutely loving this. We have

31:41

a couple things. We went

31:43

to Disney this week. I

31:45

wonder if anything significant happened

31:48

there. We just had like a

31:51

perfect day at Disneyland, which is

31:53

not a guarantee

31:55

when you have a toddler.

31:57

I don't know if she's still considered a toddler.

32:00

a young kid. She's out

32:02

there toddlin'. But

32:04

it was just, we went with our

32:06

friends, the Gungers, for

32:09

their daughter's birthday. And it

32:11

was just like tip

32:13

to tail effortless and

32:15

so joyful. And

32:18

everybody kind of got to do whatever they

32:20

wanted. Like we got to ride on some

32:22

rides that we didn't. We took Leila on

32:24

the Indiana Jones ride. Which was a mistake. But

32:28

this is what I think is interesting. Was

32:30

it a mistake? And I'm not just

32:32

representing the dad energy. We both, you and I

32:34

both have been like. I'm with you. Yeah. Here's

32:37

the question for the listeners. Leila is.

32:40

Five and a half. She's five and a

32:42

half but she's tall AF. She's courageous.

32:45

She's fierce. She's strong. Yeah. And

32:48

she's brave. And she's also tall enough to go on

32:50

the Indiana Jones ride. Yeah. So we're

32:52

kind of like, well she's tall enough. I mean she was a

32:55

good inch over the minimum. So

32:57

she was ready to go. Yeah.

32:59

And what had we taken her on

33:02

already? We took her on, not teacups.

33:05

We had taken her on the Matterhorn. She liked

33:07

that. Yeah. She was scared on

33:09

the Matterhorn but then she like wanted to do it again. Yeah.

33:12

So we were like I think she. So this is the question is like if

33:15

you take your kid on a ride and they

33:17

weren't ready for it, was that a mistake? Or

33:20

are amusement parks a safe place

33:23

to flirt

33:26

with your own fear,

33:29

discomfort and like lack of

33:31

control? Yeah. Is that

33:33

part of it? Like I'd love to, I mean it would

33:35

be great to talk to Walt Disney anyway. What an interesting

33:37

cat. But

33:40

I would like to know the people that

33:42

are like no that's part of it. Leela,

33:44

all she did was cover her eyes. And

33:48

she wasn't screaming or crying. No

33:50

but she was kind of like ugh and I.

33:53

And you know what? So was I. That

33:55

ride is DMT. It's wild. Indiana

33:57

Jones is, I've never done DMT. I've

34:00

done a lot of YouTube research on it and from

34:02

what I know a lot of like Monolithic

34:05

Easter Island heads that are like

34:07

welcome to my realm and that's

34:09

how that fucking ride starts Yeah,

34:11

I'm going click-click-click up towards an

34:13

Easter Island idol Yeah, it goes

34:15

don't look in my eyes or

34:17

you will die Yeah, and

34:19

then the only place to look is his eyes It's

34:23

the big glow. It's the only

34:25

place to look then the head

34:27

cracks open By the way, this

34:30

isn't like practical. These are like

34:32

projectors. Yeah Disney taking its folding

34:34

dong out It's going like we know

34:36

how to do real boulders falling and

34:39

laser projection and like You

34:43

know that yeah, yeah But

34:47

there's also like a Like

34:50

a roar that he hated sound the most

34:52

that was the sound was what ruined it

34:54

sounds are what scared her So I

34:56

spent the entire ride with my hand

34:59

like both of my arms

35:01

wrapped around her one hand covering her

35:03

eyes the other one

35:05

like covering an ear and pressing her up

35:07

against me and that right is bumpy as

35:11

Bumpier shit, I'm gonna

35:13

throw my back out like I can't I

35:15

like that I will respect because

35:17

I was also like I was leaning

35:19

down to her and very calmly going.

35:22

It's okay, baby Yeah, I know me too.

35:24

I kept being like mama's got you Yeah,

35:26

it's right. We're almost done. I'm sorry. You

35:28

don't like it. She's kind of having a

35:30

talk about it Yeah, and getting whiplash and

35:32

we ride is no I remember going on

35:35

that ride alone when I was just a

35:37

free man Just like a girl like a

35:39

single man. Yeah, you know what I mean.

35:41

I mean free. Okay. Okay. All right

35:43

didn't need that but go ahead

35:46

I Just meant like I'd fucking

35:48

idiot at Disneyland. Yeah, I could do whatever

35:50

I wanted and leave whenever I wanted the

35:52

different different vibe Yes, I went on that

35:54

ride and I remember being like I didn't

35:57

care for that. It was too jostly. Mmm,

35:59

like it like hairpin turns like

36:01

crazy, going fast. And I was

36:03

like, now, this is my

36:06

version of lifting a car off

36:08

of your child. Cause I

36:10

was like, all that went away

36:12

and I was completely locked on to Leela and

36:15

had no awareness of my own body. It

36:18

was kind of sweet. And so did you.

36:20

We just became, it actually made the ride better

36:22

cause it's not like a cup of tea, but

36:24

I didn't experience it. All I was doing was

36:26

focusing on just like, it's okay baby, it's almost

36:29

done. Hold my hand, it's okay. And

36:31

then she got off and Leela's so

36:33

rad. She's such a... She

36:35

is rad. That's the very joy to

36:38

describe her. She felt it and then she was

36:40

done. Yeah, she didn't like it. She

36:42

told us. She didn't like that, that scared

36:44

me. I don't, I hate that ride. I

36:46

hate that ride. And I was like, yeah, me too. That wasn't for

36:48

us. I love

36:51

that ride, but. I'm jumping out of order,

36:53

but the worst part, and there was sort

36:55

of like an existential metaphor here, is we

36:57

were in line and the line was scary.

37:00

Yeah. Like there's all these like moments where

37:02

there's like things that might fall

37:04

and it's very Indiana Jones, very fun. But

37:06

we did get to like talk a

37:08

lot about fear in the line.

37:11

Where I was like. Even that's by design. It's

37:13

really fun. Like you

37:15

might get scared, but remember it's

37:17

just being scared for fun. And

37:20

like, you know,

37:22

we're here, you're safe, it'll end. And

37:24

she wanted to do it. I

37:27

mean, we weren't talking her into it. She was like fully in.

37:29

I would have felt bad if I was like,

37:31

you're gonna do it. Yeah, you don't want to

37:33

do it. And she like. You have to be

37:35

brave. This is what it is. It wasn't that.

37:37

And she probably will ask to do it again

37:39

the next time we're there. I bet. Like

37:42

she's that way. I'm a little worried. That

37:44

it made her scared of all. That's what I was worried

37:47

about with the Matterhorn and she was into it. Yeah, she

37:49

wanted to go on again. But I do

37:51

think that there's, I mean,

37:53

my one fear is that we put a

37:56

new kind of fear in her,

37:58

like, like new. images, new

38:00

sounds that are now like a

38:02

reference for her brain to be

38:05

scared about. She didn't have nightmares or anything

38:07

like that. And she didn't bring it up at

38:09

all again. And if you do bring it up, she doesn't go,

38:11

I don't want to talk about it. She goes, I don't like that

38:13

ride. She's very cool. Yeah. So

38:16

I think it's okay. And in that way it is, it

38:18

does feel like a good, a safe

38:20

way for her to like work out fear

38:22

and darkness. And I... Go

38:24

ahead. Go ahead. And I

38:27

was just going to say, that's kind of

38:29

always my takeaway about Disneyland

38:32

is like, I know there's a lot

38:35

of argument against Disneyland and I get

38:37

it. It's like consumerism and like indulgence

38:39

and whatever. I get it. And

38:42

I'm not like, I'm certainly not like a Disney adult. And

38:45

if you are, then great. It seems like

38:47

a lovely way to be. I'm

38:49

a DA, a district attorney, a Disney

38:51

adult. But

38:55

I am always struck like not

38:59

that it is a like happiest place

39:01

on earth. It's only light. And

39:03

it's like, that's not at all what it

39:05

is. It's a mushroom trip. It is. The

39:07

whole thing's a mushroom trip. It's like, yes, there is

39:10

so much joy, but every ride has

39:12

some kind of darkness. I

39:14

told you, Memento Moria is one of the stories

39:16

which remember you will die as the name of

39:18

one of the stories. You can go in and

39:20

get a fucking frozen pineapple. Absolutely. It's a mushroom

39:22

trip. I know I say this

39:25

all the time and I'll never stop, but the

39:27

most popular perfumes, all perfumes, all good

39:29

ones have a sour smell in them,

39:31

have a bad smell. We won't get

39:34

obsessed culturally with something

39:36

unless it's both. And even going

39:38

back to Alain Duboutin, Alain de Button,

39:41

he's like, when you're falling in love with somebody,

39:43

you're recognizing the part of them that's wounded like

39:45

you were wounded and they can wound you in

39:47

that familiar way. So that's what Disney

39:49

is. The whole thing is like

39:52

Peter Pan. The story

39:54

of Peter Pan, I'm not going to try and summarize

39:56

it, but think about the clock that the alligator eats

39:59

it. The whole thing is... about death. The

40:01

whole thing is about childhood, growing up

40:03

and you're dying every second and Captain

40:06

Hook, look you can watch YouTube on

40:09

that but like that whole thing, the

40:11

reason it resonates is because we need

40:13

to talk about how we're dying every

40:15

second. It's just clicking for like let's

40:18

go to the break and we'll stay on this

40:20

because you have a strict hour today. I do.

40:22

But I want to talk about Leela

40:24

learning how to ride a bike and Peter

40:26

Pan because there's a corollary here. Let's

40:28

do that. I just want to say even on the it's

40:30

a small world, the happiest,

40:33

most joyful ride in Disneyland,

40:35

the song is it's

40:38

a world of laughter, a world of tears.

40:40

It's a world of fear. It's like even

40:42

these dolls are magic. And

40:47

that is a mushroom trip. It's like look at

40:49

the world and there's dolls. The

40:52

world of laughter. That's

40:55

what I would want to talk to Walt Disney. It's by

40:57

design. Yeah. It's by design. Come

40:59

and look at death, Disneyland. That's what

41:02

it is. Come and look at death.

41:04

It's both. If it was

41:06

just light as it

41:08

often gets categorized, it wouldn't be popular.

41:10

Yeah. It wouldn't be. It

41:13

wouldn't speak to us. All right. We'll be back

41:15

in two minutes. Thank you so much for supporting

41:17

the show. It means so

41:19

mucho. It means mucho, mucho. Guys,

41:24

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45:07

All right, everybody, back

45:09

to the show. All

45:11

right, so Peter Pan and

45:14

Leela learning how to ride a bike. I don't think I

45:17

talked about this. We went to the

45:19

track, the high school track, and I was

45:21

Leela with her on her bike and she's

45:24

an only child, so she doesn't

45:26

have the sibling who's ripping ass on

45:28

a bike that really pushes a kid

45:30

to ride a bike. But

45:33

her friend Olive is riding bike without stabilizers,

45:35

as we say. Thank you, Bluey.

45:38

Without training wheels. And

45:40

we were like, let's go for it. Let's take the

45:43

training wheels off her bike and see if we can

45:45

do it. And it's a classic moment. It did not

45:47

disappoint. I remember my father holding

45:49

onto the back of my seat and letting

45:51

go because I could see his shadow. I

45:54

was looking at the ground and he was so smart.

45:56

He let go, but he kept his hand there. So

45:58

it looked like in the shadow that he was still.

46:00

holding me. But he wasn't. It's

46:02

a classic memory. So here we are with

46:04

Leila. I'm holding on to her and

46:06

she's biking and I let her go and it it

46:10

five stars would recommend. It's an

46:12

incredible dad moment. We're so genuinely

46:14

thrilled and proud that she's riding

46:16

a bike and I realized when

46:18

I saw her riding the bike

46:20

that I had an unconscious

46:23

or a pre-verbal thought

46:25

that I was like I don't think she'll ever

46:27

learn to ride a bike. I don't know why.

46:29

It was like this like yeah no she's my

46:31

baby she'll never ride a bike. Yeah and there

46:33

she is riding a bike. And she like

46:35

you know five and a half

46:37

is we just

46:40

it started to be that we

46:42

had saw other kids who were even younger

46:44

than her riding bikes and it seemed like

46:46

she wasn't that interested. It just really felt

46:48

like it was never gonna happen. That's what

46:50

goes back to Leila not liking to necessarily

46:52

learn things as much as she just wants

46:54

to say she already knows and I get

46:57

it that's the way she's wired right now

46:59

and it's fine. But when she did it

47:01

I was like oh my god it's happening.

47:03

And then later in the day she got sad

47:06

and she was like I want

47:10

to put the stabilizers back on. Yeah.

47:13

And you know brag

47:15

but I really think I did a

47:17

nice parenting job because I and

47:19

this is all I ever wanted all of us

47:22

ever wanted was just a

47:24

moment of consideration instead of like well

47:27

that's not what we do. You don't

47:29

just you know just put them back on you're done

47:31

with those. Yeah. I like sat

47:34

down and I put her in my lap

47:36

because she you know crying and comforting

47:38

her and I was like yeah

47:40

growing up is sad. Yeah. It's a

47:42

little bit sad to grow up. Yeah.

47:44

And this seems so obvious now it's

47:46

just hard to come up with these

47:48

strategies when your daughter is upset. No

47:50

it's beautiful. And

47:52

there is a voice that's like no

47:54

this is a good moment why are we

47:57

crying. But you're like no Peter Pan. Yeah.

48:00

I wanna grow up. It's crazy.

48:02

You used to have training wheels and now

48:04

you don't. And it was a

48:06

real, we didn't talk about it. We just kinda

48:08

sat there and felt it. It

48:10

was a big deal when I said, growing up

48:12

can be a little bit sad. Like you're getting

48:14

bigger and bigger, but you know,

48:16

you'll always be mom and dad as

48:18

baby. I'm careful with that language because

48:20

she won't always be. But

48:23

it's like, it's really what you're

48:25

saying is we will

48:27

always remember that version

48:30

of you with you. Like

48:32

we're holding every

48:35

version of you. That's like our

48:37

job. Yeah, we're the record. We're the

48:39

record. And we will always

48:42

have known that version of you.

48:44

And you know, like, it's

48:46

almost like, it's

48:49

not like we're gonna always treat you

48:51

like our baby, but it's like, we'll

48:53

never forget. That's right. And that's the

48:55

fear. We think it's hard

48:57

for us to see our babies die and

49:00

be replaced by a toddler and see that

49:02

toddler die and be replaced by a

49:05

kid. Imagine

49:08

how it feels to them. They're literally-

49:11

Changing, changing, changing. Every human being

49:13

is dying and being reborn, but

49:15

like they're doing it at

49:17

such a- You can see it. External,

49:20

yeah. It's such a

49:22

fast rate. They're

49:24

like bamboo. You can

49:26

watch it growing. Yeah, and it's

49:28

something that I really love

49:31

that you articulated that to

49:33

her so, you know, soon

49:36

in her development, because I actually

49:38

remember the time somebody articulated that

49:41

to me. It was so significant.

49:43

And it wasn't until I was

49:45

like 16, I

49:48

went on my first date, like I went

49:50

to prom with somebody's

49:52

mom. And

49:54

like this was a boy that I had had a

49:56

crush on and he asked me to prom and it

49:58

was like all these- wonderful things. And

50:01

I remember telling my friend

50:03

who was older and like kind of a

50:05

mentor, uh, that

50:08

like afterwards I felt kind of sad.

50:10

Yeah. And she was just like, yeah,

50:12

I could see that there's like a

50:14

little bit of a loss of innocence,

50:17

like a growing up feeling. And

50:19

as soon as you said that, that was like exactly

50:21

what it was, but I had no,

50:24

I didn't know that people even felt that

50:26

way. Like I wouldn't have been able to

50:28

understand what that was. If somebody hadn't instantly

50:31

just like understood and mirrored it and

50:33

articulated it. And you gave Leela

50:36

the gift of doing that when she was five. So

50:38

now when that inevitably

50:40

comes back, which it will we

50:43

have, she already has a reference for it.

50:46

Right. You know, yeah, they are kind

50:48

of like, uh, clocks in that way,

50:50

you know, kids. So like when

50:52

you see the parents filming the recital

50:54

and they're singing, like I remember when

50:56

I was a kid, I probably

50:58

talked about this, but we sang Wade in the water as

51:01

kids and everyone was crying and I didn't

51:03

understand. And you're like, yeah,

51:05

it's weird. We're children singing kind

51:07

of a grown up song. Yeah.

51:09

And like, it's also

51:11

about God and Pharaoh and it's

51:13

like old and it's

51:16

crazy. Yeah. It's a, it's a wild thing. So

51:18

I think Walt

51:21

and theme park people would say

51:23

that the Indiana Jones experience

51:26

was part of it because

51:28

there's something not to be

51:30

too weird, but you know,

51:32

bringing a kid into the world is

51:34

like, there's going to be Indiana Jones

51:36

rides. Yeah. And that is like, so

51:39

forget Leela for a second. Is

51:42

that practice for me as her dad

51:44

to be in line and there's like

51:46

a fake wall of boulders that might

51:49

collapse on us. And I'm actually looking

51:51

at Leela. This is actually kind of

51:53

hard to talk about thinking.

51:55

She's not nervous enough. Like,

51:57

I'm not nervous enough. I'm

52:00

like, I don't think you know. I kept showing

52:02

her the video of the ride. There was like

52:04

a brief video Oh, yeah. And

52:06

I was like, that's what it's gonna be. Yeah, we

52:08

were trying to prepare her. And she's like, I know.

52:10

And she's like swinging on the rope and I'm like,

52:13

and I'm looking in the line. And again,

52:15

this is very vulnerable for me. I just feel, I

52:18

think it's fine, but I just feel vulnerable. I'm

52:20

looking in the line and there's no other kid.

52:22

There's like, the other kid was like a boy

52:24

who was a couple years older than her. Yeah.

52:26

And I was just like, is everyone looking at

52:28

us like the parents that took their kid to

52:30

see the others? Are

52:33

we them? Yeah. But now I'm realizing in

52:35

this conversation that it was

52:38

a rehearsal for me. Because there's gonna

52:40

be so many little heartbreaks

52:42

and friendship betrayals. And there

52:44

might be broken bones and

52:47

certainly skinned knees and bloody

52:49

noses and all these things.

52:52

And that is also what, it's

52:54

one of the reasons why I

52:56

think mushrooms, psychedelics in general, go

52:58

to the theme park. Why the

53:00

dreams go to the theme park.

53:02

Yeah. It's like, here's a place

53:04

wherein we will play with all

53:06

of the energies, including fear and

53:09

discomfort. Yeah. And like, letting

53:12

go of your kid going like,

53:15

we're going on the Indiana Jones

53:17

ride because you're a certain

53:19

height. And then like, so

53:21

now I'm playing with guilt energy. Yeah. But

53:24

it's also a safe place to

53:26

feel a mild amount

53:29

of parental guilt that I shouldn't have had

53:31

you do that. By the way, given the

53:33

thousands of people that were there, that was

53:35

happening hundreds of times. For sure. That dads

53:38

and moms were like, we shouldn't have gone

53:40

on Thunder Mountain. Yeah. And that's also

53:43

why we go. I

53:45

think if every ride was just clean and

53:47

fine, I don't think

53:49

everyone would go. I think you need shadow.

53:52

You need a little shadow. Yeah,

53:55

absolutely. And also just remembering, you

53:57

know, like the... The

54:01

example that comes to mind is Leela

54:03

had UTIs when she was an infant

54:05

and the way that they had

54:07

to take the urine sample was through a catheter.

54:10

So by the time she was three months

54:12

old, she had to have a catheter put

54:14

in and she was screaming and crying and

54:17

it was horrible. And I was like holding

54:19

her and had my face up against

54:21

her and was like, mama's here, you're

54:23

safe. This is, you know, I'm

54:26

right here. I've got you. And

54:29

then I like wept and sobbed afterwards, of

54:31

course, and then talked to my therapist about

54:33

it and was like, is she going to

54:35

have issues around her

54:37

vagina for the rest of her

54:39

life because of this memory? And

54:43

my therapist was like, it is

54:45

not the same because you

54:47

were there the whole time telling her

54:50

she's safe and she's okay and

54:52

co-regulating with her. And

54:55

that's what happened on that ride. Right. And

54:58

so that's the thing. Oh my God, isn't that beautiful?

55:00

We were there. We were there. That's

55:02

actually it's like how you always say the repair

55:04

is everything. Yeah. We were

55:07

I think there's something really emotional about

55:09

this. We're on this ride and

55:14

Get in the car, Chewy. Wrong

55:21

Harrison Ford. But

55:24

he was in 10. It was like

55:26

a shrinking reference. Oh my God. Get

55:32

off my plane. It's

55:34

just any Harrison Ford movie. Not

55:36

only were we comforting her the whole time. So

55:39

we were just kind of on her, not in

55:42

a desperate, like, no, just protecting her

55:44

from an avalanche, but like a gentle

55:46

hold. Yeah. But then do

55:48

you also remember there were moments where we were going,

55:50

Leela, open your eyes. This part is really cool. This

55:52

part's fun. Yeah. And

55:55

I was like, do you want to see this? Do you want

55:57

to see this? But you know, like I was just giving her the option. She

56:00

loves eggs. That sounds like you're being

56:02

fucked up. You want to see the snake? No, she loves

56:04

snakes She wanted to see this is the house is

56:06

Slytherin She's

56:11

and I'm a roll cross specter But

56:15

yes, I think that that's the so

56:18

two things That this

56:20

is enlightening like yeah, that's the

56:22

job of being a parent one

56:25

is Allowing your kids to

56:27

suffer but like sitting beside

56:29

them while they do so The

56:33

job is not to protect them from being

56:36

afraid or having

56:38

like living in

56:40

sort of the tension of Reality,

56:43

it's to sit beside them and let them know that they're

56:45

not doing it alone Yes, and

56:48

then the maybe number one job

56:50

of being a parent This

56:52

came up when you were talking about Just

56:57

like I can't remember but

56:59

it came up when you were you were talking in my

57:01

mind it feels

57:03

like the number one job of being a parent is holding

57:07

a torch for This

57:09

human experience being worth it

57:12

like we keep that's why I was

57:14

like open your eyes Yeah, that's part school.

57:16

All right, and just being like I know

57:19

that we woke you up into this reality

57:21

where there is fear and there is suffering

57:23

and there is just

57:25

horrific events and trauma and grief

57:28

and all of that, but

57:31

ultimately It's

57:33

worth it. Yeah. Well, that's that book

57:35

star child. Yeah There's

57:38

this out of print child's child's book children's

57:40

book that we read Leela that of print

57:42

Yeah, I had to pay like it was

57:44

like 70 bucks for that book Wow because

57:46

it's out of print It's

57:48

worth it. It's great. Yeah, we saw it in

57:50

that. Come on. Come on. Yeah, come on. Come

57:52

on is an incredible movie and

57:56

they read a part of the book and and the

57:59

whole thing is like It's a soul in

58:02

space, like an outer space. I

58:05

was like, would you like to go to earth? And

58:07

it just goes through all of it. There's this

58:10

and there's this, there's confusing times and you'll hurt

58:12

yourself and this. And you'll just be weeping. And

58:14

at the end, the message is, but

58:17

everyone who goes says, I'm

58:19

glad I went. Like, yes, the

58:21

big yes. Yeah,

58:24

I really think, I'm glad we talked about it. It's

58:26

a lot. The last thing, because I

58:28

know you have to go, my love. Do you have?

58:31

Yeah, my trampoline class. Yeah.

58:35

Five minutes. You have to

58:37

go in five minutes? Yeah. Okay, perfect. Well,

58:41

I just want to say that I

58:43

had therapy and everybody

58:46

knows it's been listening every week that I

58:48

went back to therapy. And

58:51

it's just been the preliminary part, meaning

58:55

she's just been asking me about mental

58:57

health and like, and

58:59

two things I wanted to share. One is like a

59:01

lot of love for my parents has been coming up.

59:03

I feel like my work with Dr. Gary Penn was

59:05

getting in touch with like anger and disappointment

59:08

or whatever it might be. A

59:10

lot of anger, sadness, mostly

59:12

anger actually. And

59:15

now I'm like, there

59:17

have been moments, like we got Leela a sleeping

59:19

bag. We went camping in the yard this week

59:21

and Beau attacked the tent like a bear, which

59:23

was a whole other story. Yep. But

59:26

I remember like my mom bought

59:29

me like a double wide sleeping bag

59:32

when I was little. And yeah, there's a fat joke here,

59:34

but like I was a soft boy and

59:37

I did need more room, but like

59:39

I've been having more moments like that, like

59:41

remembering that my mom, and

59:43

almost like it feels more appropriate to say

59:45

my mommy bought me like a

59:47

double, like she was thinking about

59:50

me and she did all

59:52

the time. So anyway, I'm getting in

59:54

touch with my inner child. And while Dr.

59:56

Gary Penn, who's incredible, helped me get in

59:58

touch with the masculine, which was... was like,

1:00:00

I'm a man, these are my walls,

1:00:02

these are my limits, essential,

1:00:05

essential, essential work. And here's a

1:00:07

lot of intellectual coping strategies that

1:00:10

I still treasure.

1:00:12

And now I'm seeing a female therapist and

1:00:15

it's all about softening and

1:00:17

feeling and facing. I've just been having

1:00:19

this dialogue with my inner child. And

1:00:22

I know that sounds very West Coast and all this stuff,

1:00:24

but it couldn't feel more

1:00:26

real. I couldn't feel more

1:00:29

real. Cause it's like,

1:00:31

well, you're just talking to yourself and it's

1:00:33

like, yeah, I'm talking to an aspect of

1:00:35

my psyche, I'm talking to

1:00:37

something that is me. Like,

1:00:39

so it's real. I'm really

1:00:42

talking to a part

1:00:44

of me. It's not just, it's not

1:00:46

talking to Santa Claus, I'm talking to

1:00:48

the remnants of me that still feel

1:00:50

like around seven, eight years old. Yeah,

1:00:53

once you get in touch with your

1:00:55

child, it's gonna help you realize how

1:00:57

much they are always

1:00:59

with us. And he

1:01:01

was just tired. The

1:01:04

thing I wanted to share was I was like, what do you want?

1:01:06

And in a very Dr. Gary Penn way. What do you want? No,

1:01:08

no, no, I was just like, what do you want? Very

1:01:10

gently, I did say that kind of like a bully. But

1:01:13

it was like, what do you need? I'll do

1:01:15

anything. And it

1:01:17

was like, I don't want anything. Cause I was, it's

1:01:20

very much, I always referenced this in the dark night

1:01:22

where the Joker says to Batman, nothing to do with

1:01:24

all your strength. Cause he's in

1:01:26

an impossible situation where somebody's gonna die and he's

1:01:28

like, look at, where did you go? Nothing

1:01:31

to do with all your strength. And I think about

1:01:33

that all the time. And I

1:01:35

was saying that to

1:01:37

myself, my inner child, and I

1:01:40

was like, you know, like all the things that

1:01:42

I have, do you want to feel special? Do you want

1:01:44

to go do a set? Do you want to book a

1:01:46

thing? Should we sell a show? Like, do you want to,

1:01:49

you know, whatever. And

1:01:51

it very clearly was like, I

1:01:54

don't want you to do anything. I just want you to listen.

1:01:56

Just listen to me. And

1:01:58

I had this therapy. therapy last

1:02:01

week where she said, so we're just doing

1:02:03

the intake. But she says,

1:02:07

what was your family like growing up? If I

1:02:09

looked in the window when you were a child,

1:02:11

what would I have seen? And I

1:02:13

just started crying and it was one of the best moments

1:02:16

of my life. Meaning there's

1:02:19

different approaches to therapy.

1:02:21

One is like bootstrappy. It's

1:02:23

a little like, yes,

1:02:26

that happened, but I'm a grown man

1:02:28

now. And it's very Dr. Gary, you

1:02:30

can get in your car and drive

1:02:32

away or you can go

1:02:34

home, but only go home for three days,

1:02:37

that's a boundary you can have. It's powerful

1:02:39

stuff. Yeah. But like this gentle, caring

1:02:42

woman. Who's very

1:02:45

talented, very, very special person just

1:02:47

goes like, what would I have seen? And I

1:02:49

just realized how badly I wanted

1:02:51

someone to ask me that. And also how

1:02:53

badly literally I just wanted someone to see.

1:02:57

I started describing it and

1:02:59

I was like, Oh my God. It

1:03:02

was like a

1:03:04

huge breakthrough. Yeah. And

1:03:06

as we always say on the show, you know, it's

1:03:08

like, what happened? What

1:03:10

actually happened? I

1:03:12

didn't tell her, I didn't like remember something

1:03:15

new. Sure. And

1:03:17

you have asked me that sort of thing. Meaning

1:03:20

I have people I can talk about that with. And

1:03:23

that's incredibly valuable. But

1:03:25

something about an, like

1:03:28

an objective, third

1:03:30

party, professional, caring

1:03:33

stranger, just

1:03:36

asking in a

1:03:38

space of compassion. And

1:03:40

I was just, it was like taking a 12 hour

1:03:43

nap or something. I felt so good. That

1:03:45

one took about a day to come back

1:03:47

from, but after I had processed, we've been

1:03:49

talking about the blues and all this stuff.

1:03:52

The blue me being blue has led to

1:03:54

some of these moments. And I just wanted

1:03:56

to share that. I think it's so powerful

1:03:58

and it also makes sense. And

1:04:02

also that you, you know,

1:04:05

I might ask you something like that, or

1:04:07

we might talk about it on, you

1:04:10

know, our couch at the end of

1:04:12

the day, but there's sort of this

1:04:14

feeling of like, we're living our lives

1:04:16

and am I really going to get

1:04:18

into this now? And you

1:04:20

have so

1:04:22

beautifully carved out this time

1:04:25

for your, where

1:04:28

the focus is feeling these

1:04:30

feelings and allowing your

1:04:32

body to release them and allowing

1:04:34

your child self to

1:04:36

be heard. So

1:04:39

it's like a dedicated time

1:04:41

where that's your body and your

1:04:43

inner child are responding to that.

1:04:46

They're like, thank you. This is our time. I'm

1:04:48

allowed to know. Yeah. Yeah. Because

1:04:52

that's the beauty. It's scheduling it. It's scheduling it.

1:04:54

Yeah. That's right. And

1:04:56

it's, and it's honoring it. It's like giving it the,

1:04:59

it's showing up for those parts

1:05:01

of you. And it's funny because every session we've

1:05:03

had, we've had three, I say

1:05:07

my mission statement. I'm like, I want to

1:05:09

feel it and face it and fold it

1:05:11

into me. I'm not here to razzle

1:05:15

dazzle you with amazing theories.

1:05:18

I just want to feel it. And it's been

1:05:20

really helpful for me to remember that. Yeah.

1:05:23

I'm so proud of you. Yes. Scheduling

1:05:26

it and showing up for it. And I also

1:05:28

was just realizing like, it's so hard for me

1:05:30

to think about and talk about and process. And

1:05:32

then I go like, and this is what he

1:05:35

wants. I think I go, well then how hard

1:05:37

was it for a seven year old? That's

1:05:39

right. Like, I can

1:05:41

barely process it. Yeah.

1:05:44

What was it like for him? That's

1:05:47

the whole, that's the whole thing. You know

1:05:49

what's so interesting though, is that it,

1:05:52

you wouldn't think, you would think

1:05:54

that like talk therapy where you

1:05:56

are theorizing and remembering and narrativizing.

1:05:59

what happened to you would

1:06:02

help organize. And in

1:06:04

some ways it does to a certain degree, but

1:06:07

actually going into your body

1:06:09

and feeling these unfelt

1:06:12

feelings and allowing

1:06:14

your brain to be of service

1:06:16

to your body by decoding what

1:06:19

is happening does lead

1:06:21

to more organization where if

1:06:24

you continue to do this, you will

1:06:26

have a clearer view of

1:06:30

exactly what has happened and how you

1:06:32

feel about it and what's going on.

1:06:35

And you'll have familiar, but it'll be

1:06:37

through familiar feelings. Like yesterday

1:06:39

at my trauma sort of

1:06:41

got activated and it was so, I

1:06:44

took so much comfort in being like,

1:06:47

this is exactly what this feels

1:06:49

like in my body. And I

1:06:51

know this feeling so

1:06:54

well that at this point, like of

1:06:56

course we're friends. It's one of the

1:06:58

most familiar places that I go and

1:07:03

I know what to do and here

1:07:05

we are and you're back and there's no

1:07:07

rush to leave. And I know this like,

1:07:10

and that just feels incredibly

1:07:12

contained and organized. And

1:07:15

when we're starting to look at our trauma, the

1:07:17

number one feeling and it makes so

1:07:20

much sense is this sort of

1:07:22

confusion. It's like, where is this?

1:07:25

Why do I still feel this way? Like

1:07:27

you're not really sure what's going

1:07:29

on. So the first thing

1:07:31

to do is regulate

1:07:34

yourself and allow the unfelt feelings to

1:07:37

come up. And then it actually does

1:07:39

make it more organized in your brain.

1:07:41

Does that make sense? It's just like,

1:07:43

it's down, up versus up, down.

1:07:46

Yeah, that's great. It made me think

1:07:48

of too, my anxiety has been such

1:07:50

a friend to me. We've talked about

1:07:52

this at length and I know you have to go is that like,

1:07:55

I'm all about getting the right amount

1:07:58

of anxiety. Yeah. That's one

1:08:00

of the things my child's self has been showing me

1:08:02

is like, he keeps

1:08:04

kind of showing me all the ways that he

1:08:06

created and played. And he was like, all of

1:08:08

that was coming from a need.

1:08:11

Yeah. Yeah. But I

1:08:13

keep thinking of the pilot light. I'm like, as

1:08:16

we've been talking about depression and anxiety, I'm

1:08:19

like, there's an amount that I don't wanna

1:08:21

get rid of it because it's

1:08:23

my friend. Right. And

1:08:26

then there's a part that I do wanna get rid of. Yeah.

1:08:29

Slowly. That's right. You're

1:08:32

doing great. And even the part that you wanna

1:08:34

get rid of, you'll

1:08:36

still, the way to do that is to

1:08:38

cradle it. No, I know, the Ewok. But

1:08:40

I, just yesterday

1:08:42

I was talking about it to our

1:08:45

friend James, James Wishara. And I was

1:08:47

like, I'm

1:08:49

good. I'm not spiritually bypassing. I'm

1:08:51

really enjoying it. Yeah. I

1:08:53

just don't like that I can't really do much. Like

1:08:57

it's hard for me to do anything. Even

1:08:59

as we're talking, I'm like, maybe I'll work out today. I

1:09:01

kinda feel like today might be the first day. Yeah. I

1:09:03

could do that. Yeah, you could see how

1:09:06

it feels. But also, I think

1:09:08

you can be tender with

1:09:10

yourself and know that you are

1:09:12

getting a lot done. It's

1:09:15

just this inner healing. It's

1:09:18

different. It's different. It's the

1:09:20

internal work as opposed

1:09:22

to always producing. And

1:09:25

it'll lead to a more productive time, but

1:09:27

you can't really pass this up. Otherwise, you'll

1:09:30

keep sort of crashing. You'll

1:09:33

be crashing. Yeah. All

1:09:36

right, thank you now. All right, everybody. This

1:09:39

podcast used 500 milliliters of water

1:09:42

for every 10 to 50 prompts, roughly one 16

1:09:44

ounce water bottle. All

1:09:49

right, babies, go ahead and keep It

1:09:51

crispy.